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And this from CNN Lefties read it and weep. https://www.cnn.com/2017/09/25/opinions/single-payer-failure-opinion-atlas/index.html
Why single payer health care is a terrible option
Almost inexplicably, even more top-down control -- single-payer health care, a system in which the government provides nationalized health insurance, sets all fees for medical care and pays those fees to doctors and hospitals -- has found new support from the left. And this despite its decades of documented failures in other countries to provide timely, quality medical care, and in the face of similar problems in our own single-payer Veterans Affairs system.
Massive waiting lists and dangerous delays for medical appointments.
Life-threatening delays for treatment, even for patients requiring urgent cancer treatment or critical brain surgery
Delayed availability of life-saving drugs
Worse availability of screening tests
Significantly worse outcomes from serious diseases
Common Sense
09-14-2018, 09:57 AM
That's not a report. It's an opinion piece.
Either way, I thought CNN was fake news?
This constant comparison of single payer to the VA indicates the author is ignorant of what single payer actually is. The VA is completely government run. In single payer countries like Canada, the government doesn't run hospitals, clinics or doctors offices. It acts as the insurer and hospitals/clinics/doctors offices are privately owned and operated.
That's not a report. It's an opinion piece.
Either way, I thought CNN was fake news?
This constant comparison of single payer to the VA indicates the author is ignorant of what single payer actually is. The VA is completely government run. In single payer countries like Canada, the government doesn't run hospitals, clinics or doctors offices. It acts as the insurer and hospitals/clinics/doctors offices are privately owned and operated.
Actually both are "SOCIALIZED MEDICINE." China is a SOCIALIZED country, it allows "GOVERNMENT CONTROLLED CAPITALISM. Like America it has NO truly free markets. The issue here is how far should America "SOCIALIZE?"
Government is socialism by definition. The BIGGER the government the BIGGER the socialism.
Mini Me
09-14-2018, 10:45 AM
Government is socialism by definition. The BIGGER the government the BIGGER the socialism.
So lets get gov.t small enough to "drown it in a bathtub" eh?
I'm for a more efficient gov.t!
Let's not even mention "Sochulism" because no one here ever gets it right what it is. Its just a "shock word" for the dumbass illiteratti!
So lets get gov.t small enough to "drown it in a bathtub" eh?
I'm for a more efficient gov.t!
Let's not even mention "Sochulism" because no one here ever gets it right what it is. Its just a "shock word" for the dumbass illiteratti!
More government = More efficient government? Really? I'll never agree with that.
You do know that you can always instruct we "dumbasses" the true definitions of socialism, don't you? I like to learn things every day.
Common Sense
09-14-2018, 11:36 AM
Actually both are "SOCIALIZED MEDICINE." China is a SOCIALIZED country, it allows "GOVERNMENT CONTROLLED CAPITALISM. Like America it has NO truly free markets. The issue here is how far should America "SOCIALIZE?"
There is a fundamental difference between single payer like the system in Canada and the VA. Drawing comparisons or implying they are similar is dishonest or ignorant.
There is a fundamental difference between single payer like the system in Canada and the VA. Drawing comparisons or implying they are similar is dishonest or ignorant.
Why don't you post the "differences" and actually make a case for your simplistic statement and allow us to post our "differences" with you? If you can.
Beevee
09-14-2018, 02:15 PM
Why don't you post the "differences" and actually make a case for your simplistic statement and allow us to post our "differences" with you? If you can.
Canadians don't have to take the risk that a policy might not cover a pre existing condition as a prerequisite before treatment.
How about you?
ripmeister
09-14-2018, 03:16 PM
Remember back during the last election..... "Keep your hands off my Medicare!". LOL!
Common Sense
09-14-2018, 03:19 PM
Why don't you post the "differences" and actually make a case for your simplistic statement and allow us to post our "differences" with you? If you can.
I've already explained the difference. You must have missed it.
With the VA, the government owns and operates the hospitals. In a single payer system like here in Canada, the hospitals, clinics and doctors offices are privately owned and operated. The government (the province) acts as the insurer.
Common
09-14-2018, 04:19 PM
There is a fundamental difference between single payer like the system in Canada and the VA. Drawing comparisons or implying they are similar is dishonest or ignorant.
Nothing about canada can compare to the USA and you cannot assume anything canada does can possibly work here.
Canadas population in 2018 is 37,019,712
Just two states in the USA have more people than that, Florida and California.
The US Population in 2018 327,231,032
Common Sense
09-14-2018, 04:42 PM
Nothing about canada can compare to the USA and you cannot assume anything canada does can possibly work here.
Canadas population in 2018 is 37,019,712
Just two states in the USA have more people than that, Florida and California.
The US Population in 2018 327,231,032
Why? The two societies are more similar than they are different.
The provinces manage the insurance and a province like Ontario with over 10 million people is comparable to many states.
The programs are scalable. I've heard this argument that it can't work in the US before. I haven't really heard any specific reasons other than population differences. How exactly are Canadian provinces able to do it but US states are unable?
zachroidott
09-14-2018, 05:42 PM
Canadians don't have to take the risk that a policy might not cover a pre existing condition as a prerequisite before treatment.
How about you?
How long do you have to wait before it's treated?
zachroidott
09-14-2018, 05:44 PM
Why? The two societies are more similar than they are different.
The provinces manage the insurance and a province like Ontario with over 10 million people is comparable to many states.
The programs are scalable. I've heard this argument that it can't work in the US before. I haven't really heard any specific reasons other than population differences. How exactly are Canadian provinces able to do it but US states are unable?
How well are Canadian Provinces able to do it? You're not a utopia. You don't have the answers, but by all means, keep licking the glass.
ripmeister
09-14-2018, 06:35 PM
It is. Always has been and will always be an insurance issue.
I've already explained the difference. You must have missed it.
With the VA, the government owns and operates the hospitals. In a single payer system like here in Canada, the hospitals, clinics and doctors offices are privately owned and operated. The government (the province) acts as the insurer.
And with that control of just being the insurer, the government decides who gets care and how much the provider can charge. Any way you cut it the government has control. I submit that's what's wrong with the system.
Canadians don't have to take the risk that a policy might not cover a pre existing condition as a prerequisite before treatment.
How about you?
What's the BIG difference between not having a preexisting condition covered or not being able to get care because the waiting list is months long?
I think the facts actually show that there is no such animal as a perfect healthcare system. And America can't afford a single payer system because we're the self-designated "Military Protector Of The Globe." Our great WEALTHY NATION, with a 21trillion $ debt has to be the worlds police force and spend our GDP on military equipment and operations world wide so that the rest of our so-called allies can provide government health insurance for their folks.
"The truth shall set ye free!"
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