What does backgrounding really amount to?

[Awryly]

I see people on this forum I would let only on the business end of a gun. Many of them seem to have regicidal tendencies.

Which begs the question: are background checks, if they have been done at all, adequate for the safe regulation of firearms in a population where 1 in 4 people are known to be mentally estranged from reality at any one time? God only knows how many others have such extremely weird ideas about how to run a sane society that they would be regarded as a danger to others in most countries like Afghanistan, Syria, the Congo and Mali and be taken out by international forces rushed to the scene.

My take is that extensive political, social, mental, criminal and driving tests should be run on every American with a gun every 2 years. That would be consistent with the constant surveillance people with officially odd ideas get from government agencies already.

I have spotted at least a dozen gun rights loons on Piers Morgan alone that I would urgently run through the mill I am proposing. They all seem to own small arsenals and are desirous of adding tanks to them. Any ambition to own a tank for the purposes of self-defence must, in and of itself, be taken as a sign of madness.

I would expect that, with properly designed tests, all would fail.

[Chris]

Backgrounding is an intermediate stage sometimes used in cattle production which begins after weaning and ends upon placement in a feedlot. Background feeding relies more heavily on forage (e.g., pasture, hay) in combination with grains to increase a calf’s weight by several hundred pounds and to build up immunity to diseases before it enters a feedlot. Some cattle operations specialize in backgrounding.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backgrounding

[hanger4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backgrounding

I laughed.

[BooHoo]

Sorry had to post this LOL!!!!!!

1261

[Awryly]

Sorry had to post this LOL!!!!!!

1261

And, even funnier, you don't background check them. :vrolijk_26::vrolijk_26::f_zen:

[Carygrant]

You are absolutely right ,Mister Riley ( any relation to the legend Bill Riley? ) ,
Unfortunately , there is such a high state of denial in America that those with closed minds , Chrismess for example , will be unable to reply sanely .
Minds need changing and this rightly means finding what sort of minds we are dealing with ---- the irrationals who spend their spare time target shooting , the contemptibles who kill animals for blood lust , and the morons who twist increased murder potential into protection .
America is indeed a very sick society and this specific area contribution lies at the root of matters .
Surely there is a case for appointing an International Review body to examine the broader picture as allowing patients to act as their own Doctors has a tragic history . As a permanent member of the United Nations Security Council , Team GB should perhaps be asked to produce a working paper plus specific proposals for discussion and implementation .

[zelmo1234]

You are absolutely right ,Mister Riley ( any relation to the legend Bill Riley? ) ,
Unfortunately , there is such a high state of denial in America that those with closed minds , Chrismess for example , will be unable to reply sanely .
Minds need changing and this rightly means finding what sort of minds we are dealing with ---- the irrationals who spend their spare time target shooting , the contemptibles who kill animals for blood lust , and the morons who twist increased murder potential into protection .
America is indeed a very sick society and this specific area contribution lies at the root of matters .
Surely there is a case for appointing an International Review body to examine the broader picture as allowing patients to act as their own Doctors has a tragic history . As a permanent member of the United Nations Security Council , Team GB should perhaps be asked to produce a working paper plus specific proposals for discussion and implementation .

So let me get this straight, you are proposing that Team GB propose actions that could be taken, I am assuming that you mean actions that have already been taken in your country.

So that we here in the USA could achieve the same results that you have in the UK which is the 2nd highest violent crime rate in the wealthy world?

So you do not think we have enough violence of our own?

[Chris]

And, even funnier, you don't background check them. :vrolijk_26::vrolijk_26::f_zen:


Concurrent with the expiration of the five-day waiting period was the launch of the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS). This criminal records database is administered by the FBI. Licensed firearms dealers are still required to wait up to three days for notice from the NICS regarding handgun purchases, but if no such notice is received, they are authorized to proceed with the sale. This is a significant difference from the original Brady Law, since if no notice had been received after five days the sale was blocked by default.

Also:


Legal ownership of automatic weapons has been regulated since the passage of the National Firearms Act (NFA) in 1934. Since 1986, transfer and sale of these legal automatic weapons requires registration with the ATF and an extensive background check.

Read more @ Gun Background Check Laws (http://www.ehow.com/about_4799052_gun-background-check-laws.html#ixzz2IKrmMn4R)

[Awryly]

Also:



Read more @ Gun Background Check Laws (http://www.ehow.com/about_4799052_gun-background-check-laws.html#ixzz2IKrmMn4R)

You really are a dimwit, aren't you?


Beginning in the early 2000s, gun shows became controversial in the United States.[4] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_shows_in_the_United_States#cite_note-4)[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_shows_in_the_United_States#cite_note-5) Those concerned about these events claim that American gun shows are a primary source of illegally trafficked firearms, both within the United States and abroad.[6] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_shows_in_the_United_States#cite_note-6)[7] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_shows_in_the_United_States#cite_note-fas.org-7) Those supporting gun shows include gun clubs and their membership, especially the National Rifle Association, and their response has been massive because they feel their Second Amendment rights (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution ) are being jeopardized.[8] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_shows_in_the_United_States#cite_note-isbn1-55553-592-5-8)[9] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_shows_in_the_United_States#cite_note-urlVPC_-_Gun_Shows_in_America-9)

Those seeking to close the "Gun Show Loophole" argue that it provides convicted felons and other prohibited purchasers (i.e., domestic abusers, substance abusers, those who have been adjudicated as "mental defectives," etc.) with opportunities to evade background checks, as they can easily buy firearms from private sellers with no accountability or oversight.

Presently, 17 states regulate private firearm sales at gun shows. Seven states require background checks on all gun sales at gun shows (California, Rhode Island, Connecticut, Oregon, New York, Illinois and Colorado). Four states (Hawaii, Maryland, New Jersey, and Pennsylvania) require background checks on all handgun, but not long gun, purchasers at gun shows. Six states require individuals to obtain a permit to purchase handguns that involves a background check (Massachusetts, Michigan, North Carolina, Iowa, Nebraska). Certain counties in Florida require background checks on all private sales of handguns at gun shows.

The remaining 33 states do not restrict private, intrastate sales of firearms at gun shows in any manner.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_shows_in_the_United_States


So I guess even you could buy a gun.


Mayor Michael Bloomberg says 40 percent of guns are sold without a background check ... through gun shows or the Internet.



And that, apparently, doesn't count private transfers.

[Chris]

You really are a dimwit, aren't you?


So I guess even you could buy a gun.

So the best you got is ad hom and Bloomberg?

[Awryly]

So the best you got is ad hom and Bloomberg?

Give it a go. Try to dispute the facts.

It'll do you good. Or something.:weedsmoking::weedsmoking:

[Carygrant]

So let me get this straight, you are proposing that Team GB propose actions that could be taken, I am assuming that you mean actions that have already been taken in your country.

So that we here in the USA could achieve the same results that you have in the UK which is the 2nd highest violent crime rate in the wealthy world?So you do not think we have enough violence of our own?


You are like Chris . You don't read what is in front of you and lack General Comprehension skills.
Your stats re violence are not worth paper to repeat them .
You have been given the best measures of violence when trying to compare on a country basis .The stats are clear and your repeated stat is literally garbage .
CAN'T YOU READ AND ABSORB ?

[Private Pickle]

Give it a go. Try to dispute the facts.

It'll do you good. Or something.:weedsmoking::weedsmoking:

Question for you. Do you or the Mayor have any way to tell how many private sales are going on? I mean, by definition, they are private...

[Chris]

Give it a go. Try to dispute the facts.

It'll do you good. Or something.:weedsmoking::weedsmoking:

Already did. It's to you to counterargue what I posted.

[Mister D]

:smiley_ROFLMAO:Awryly has been having a rough time.

[Chris]

Here is my challenge to you again, awryly.



And, even funnier, you don't background check them. :vrolijk_26::vrolijk_26::f_zen:


Concurrent with the expiration of the five-day waiting period was the launch of the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS). This criminal records database is administered by the FBI. Licensed firearms dealers are still required to wait up to three days for notice from the NICS regarding handgun purchases, but if no such notice is received, they are authorized to proceed with the sale. This is a significant difference from the original Brady Law, since if no notice had been received after five days the sale was blocked by default.

Also:


Legal ownership of automatic weapons has been regulated since the passage of the National Firearms Act (NFA) in 1934. Since 1986, transfer and sale of these legal automatic weapons requires registration with the ATF and an extensive background check.

Read more @ Gun Background Check Laws (http://www.ehow.com/about_4799052_gun-background-check-laws.html#ixzz2IKrmMn4R)

Mistake you made was to claim an absolute, that there are no background checks. I've demonstrated with facts that there are. Are there loopholes, yes, do states vary, yes, but there are background checks. To say, as you did, that there are none, is to make a false statement.

[Awryly]

Question for you. Do you or the Mayor have any way to tell how many private sales are going on? I mean, by definition, they are private...

So what percentage is it when 33 states and the internet are unregulated?

D'ya think?

[Private Pickle]

So what percentage is it when 33 states and the internet are unregulated?

D'ya think?

Hmmm tough to call given there is no reporting on private sales. You know, cause they're private...

[Awryly]

Here is my challenge to you again, awryly.



Mistake you made was to claim an absolute, that there are no background checks. I've demonstrated with facts that there are. Are there loopholes, yes, do states vary, yes, but there are background checks. To say, as you did, that there are none, is to make a false statement.

Don't you feel embarrassed at what you post?

I was referring to the criminals BooHoo or whoever claimed didn't register their guns.

[Private Pickle]

Don't you feel embarrassed at what you post?

I was referring to the criminals BooHoo or whoever claimed didn't register their guns.

Well it's a good thing we have Obama to give all those criminals more laws that they won't follow...

[Awryly]

Hmmm tough to call given there is no reporting on private sales. You know, cause they're private...

So no-one keeps count of gun show sales? 'Cos "they're private"?

[Private Pickle]

So no-one keeps count of gun show sales? 'Cos "they're private"?

The private sales at gun shows are indeed private and thus not reported to anyone... Hence the word "private".

Individuals who buy firearms from FFL dealers go through their State's backround check as well as fill out Federal Form 4473 which is then kept at a Federal level.

If you need further explanation on the definition of private please let me know and I'll try and find someone with a backround in teaching special ed to help.

[Chris]

Don't you feel embarrassed at what you post?

I was referring to the criminals BooHoo or whoever claimed didn't register their guns.

We do background checks, awryly.

[Awryly]

The private sales at gun shows are indeed private and thus not reported to anyone... Hence the word "private".

Individuals who buy firearms from FFL dealers go through their State's backround check as well as fill out Federal Form 4473 which is then kept at a Federal level.

If you need further explanation on the definition of private please let me know and I'll try and find someone with a backround in teaching special ed to help.

Well, so what's your number, teach?

[Mister D]

The private sales at gun shows are indeed private and thus not reported to anyone... Hence the word "private".

Individuals who buy firearms from FFL dealers go through their State's backround check as well as fill out Federal Form 4473 which is then kept at a Federal level.

If you need further explanation on the definition of private please let me know and I'll try and find someone with a backround in teaching special ed to help.

:laugh:

[Awryly]

We do background checks, awryly.

But not enough, it seems.



"We don't need more laws. We need a couple of fixes," Bloomberg said. "There's a loophole where you can sell guns without a background check at a gun show, 40 percent of guns are sold that way, same thing on the Internet. … The NRA has opposed anything."
This is what Politifact presents for fact-checking. This seems like a simple enough claim; 40%. What evidence did they evaluate?
Bloomberg’s office pointed us to a 1997 study by the National Institute of Justice on who owns guns and how they use them.The researchers estimated that about 40 percent of all firearm sales took place through people other than licensed dealers. They based their conclusion on a random survey of more than 2,500 households.
All right then, and for the Internet?
The City of New York commissioned an investigation of Internet gun sales. The report said on 10 websites, it found over 25,000 weapons for sale.The report said that over 60 percent of sellers allowed a purchase to move forward even when the alleged buyer said he didn’t believe he would pass a background check. Sellers who used Craigslist were most likely to violate the law, the report said.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/01/15/1179210/-Busting-myths-about-the-private-gun-sale-aka-gun-show-loophole

Feel free to blow the research apart with your homespun
insights.

[Mister D]

"We don't need more laws. We need a couple of fixes," Bloomberg said. "There's a loophole where you can sell guns without a background check at a gun show, 40 percent of guns are sold that way, same thing on the Internet. … The NRA has opposed anything."
This is what Politifact presents for fact-checking. This seems like a simple enough claim; 40%. What evidence did they evaluate?
Bloomberg’s office pointed us to a 1997 study by the National Institute of Justice on who owns guns and how they use them.The researchers estimated that about 40 percent of all firearm sales took place through people other than licensed dealers. They based their conclusion on a random survey of more than 2,500 households.
All right then, and for the Internet?
The City of New York commissioned an investigation of Internet gun sales. The report said on 10 websites, it found over 25,000 weapons for sale.The report said that over 60 percent of sellers allowed a purchase to move forward even when the alleged buyer said he didn’t believe he would pass a background check. Sellers who used Craigslist were most likely to violate the law, the report said.



We do background checks, Awryly.

[Chris]

But not enough, it seems.



Feel free to blow the research apart with your homespun
insights.


But not enough

And how, pray tell, do you determine that? Bloomberg is a politician voicing an opinion and buying feel good votes, not an expert to appeal illogically to.

[Private Pickle]

Well, so what's your number, teach?

My number? Sorry, I don't give my number out to fruits who try and pick up guys on the Internet.

If you're asking the percentage of private sales there are lots of guesstimates but no one knows for sure given they are private.

[Taxcutter]

"...with properly designed tests, all would fail."

Taxcutter says:
Exactly what Hussein Obama has in mind.

The tyrants of the old Soviet Union often cast their opponents as mentally ill before consigning them to the gulag.

[zelmo1234]

You are like Chris . You don't read what is in front of you and lack General Comprehension skills.
Your stats re violence are not worth paper to repeat them .
You have been given the best measures of violence when trying to compare on a country basis .The stats are clear and your repeated stat is literally garbage .
CAN'T YOU READ AND ABSORB ?

I know that what your govenment issue is not worth the paper it was written on, but I thought that using the states compiled by your governmet.

You keep telling us that it is wrong. Is there anything that you can point to that would dispute this, other than your educated opinion?

Do they actually publish anything in irony and imagination land?

[Awryly]

My number? Sorry, I don't give my number out to fruits who try and pick up guys on the Internet.

If you're asking the percentage of private sales there are lots of guesstimates but no one knows for sure given they are private.

It's no wonder Yanks are looked on by the rest of the world as country bumpkins. There are four here who have (a) no idea of the number of gun sales with no background checks; (b) could not hazard even a guess,when research had been done by reputable public organisations to provide an estimate; (c) preferring instead to present a picture at odds - yet again - with the facts, but in keeping with the fantasy that all is rosy when you cuddle an illegal AR 15.

They have no ideas, no argument that would stand scrutiny by a deranged lemming, and argue that black is whatever colour they choose it to be; and when it suits them that it is actually white.

I can get "thinking" of this quality from my canary.

I would be very upset if I were paying them for this tripe.

I assume they represent less the core of what Americans have been saying in polls about gun reform and are much more hard-core NRA-type nut-jobs who failed their checks.

[Mister D]

It's no wonder Yanks are looked on by the rest of the world as country bumpkins. There are four here who have (a) no idea of the number of gun sales with no background checks; (b) could not hazard even a guess,when research had been done by reputable public organisations to provide an estimate; (c) preferring instead to present a picture at odds - yet again - with the facts, but in keeping with the fantasy that all is rosy when you cuddle an illegal AR 15.

They have no ideas, no argument that would stand scrutiny by a deranged lemming, and argue that black is whatever colour they choose it to be; and when it suits them that it is actually white.

I can get "thinking" of this quality from my canary.

I would be very upset if I were paying them for this tripe.

I assume they represent less the core of what Americans have been saying in polls about gun reform and are much more hard-core NRA-type nut-jobs who failed their checks.

:smiley_ROFLMAO:

[GrumpyDog]

The use of a gun, or any other weapon, to commit mass murder, is only a symptom of something else in the society. IMO, it is at least in part, due to an unnecessarily high level of anxiety in adolescents, caused by a media culture which promotes anomalous, absurd behavior, and encourages violence as some kind of a normal American cultural form of conflict resolution.

[zelmo1234]

AW you will be glad to hear that since Obama issued his excutive orders the NRA has picked up 250,000 members.

And there site has crashed twice because it can not handle the volumn. It has Democrats running from the Presidents policies. Even Dingy Harry Reid the democratic leader of the Senate has said he will not introduce legislation in the Senate.

[Awryly]

The use of a gun, or any other weapon, to commit mass murder, is only a symptom of something else in the society. IMO, it is at least in part, due to an unnecessarily high level of anxiety in adolescents, caused by a media culture which promotes anomalous, absurd behavior, and encourages violence as some kind of a normal American cultural form of conflict resolution.

Heaven help us. You're not going to try to educate your kids ?! I thought you were going to give them all AR 15s?

[Awryly]

AW you will be glad to hear that since Obama issued his excutive orders the NRA has picked up 250,000 members.

And there site has crashed twice because it can not handle the volumn. It has Democrats running from the Presidents policies. Even Dingy Harry Reid the democratic leader of the Senate has said he will not introduce legislation in the Senate.

Another quarter of a million terrified Yanks.

Keep them away from the Middle East, will ya.

[GrumpyDog]

Heaven helps. You're not going to try to educate your kids ?! I thought you were going to give them all AR 15s?

I grew up on Looney Tunes (the original and best series) and watched the rabbit drop ping pong balls on Captain Kangeroo.

Somewhere along my development, AR-15s became an intregal part. It may have been that Combat indoctrination received while serving the country as an expendable human in the Cold War chess game created for the profiteering of the wealthy elite.

[Awryly]

I grew up on Looney Tunes (the original and best series) and watched the rabbit drop ping pong balls on Captain Kangeroo.

Somewhere along my development, AR-15s became an intregal part. It may have been that Combat indoctrination received while serving the country as an expendable human in the Cold War chess game created for the profiteering of the wealthy elite.

So it really doesn't matter how many of you get mowed down?

Can't say I'm bothered, either.

[GrumpyDog]

So it really doesn't matter how many of you get mowed down?

Can't say I'm bothered, either.

I promise, that I will explore all other options first, including an actual lawn mower, before using any gun, to persuade an intruder to reconsider his original plan.

[Awryly]

I promise, that I will explore all other options first, including an actual lawn mower, before using any gun, to persuade an intruder to reconsider his original plan.

All I ask is that you have your massacres in private, and try to keep them out of the "news".

There are many more important things going on which do not get attention because you people like to play with guns.

[GrumpyDog]

All I ask is that you have your massacres in private, and try to keep them out of the "news".

There are many more important things going on which do not get attention because you people like to play with guns.


You mean like the way we do with Predators flying overhead in the terrorist regions of the world?

[Carygrant]

" Extremist Enhancers " as they get rid of so many Terrorist Women , and nasty Terrorist children and vile Terrorist babies .
Makes you proud to be a Hilly Billy Child murderer

[GrumpyDog]

All I ask is that you have your massacres in private, and try to keep them out of the "news".

There are many more important things going on which do not get attention because you people like to play with guns.

Estimating from your signature, that there are 4 of you, but have not figured out which of you is working for the government, and which is working for the private sector.

[GrumpyDog]

The AI automated "thanks" is interesting. CIA program is it?

[Awryly]

You mean like the way we do with Predators flying overhead in the terrorist regions of the world?

That's the ticket.

On second thoughts, report the military casualties. Ignore the innocent civilians caught in the cross-fire.

[Awryly]

Estimating from your signature, that there are 4 of you, but have not figured out which of you is working for the government, and which is working for the private sector.

You got 4 out of it?

Interesting. :rollseyes:

[zelmo1234]

" Extremist Enhancers " as they get rid of so many Terrorist Women , and nasty Terrorist children and vile Terrorist babies .
Makes you proud to be a Hilly Billy Child murderer


Yes we know that the religion of peace has such high morals

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,62151,00.html

And in your peaceful country?

http://www.bnp.org.uk/news/ba-muslim-terror-plot-how-many-times-does-have-happen

Yes they hate you too! But it is good that you are still in Imagination land

[Carygrant]

Don't project one or two arrests into a conspiracy plot .
99.9% of Moslems are law abiding , OK people , living peacefully alongside Brits .
God knows where you got that undated link from --- this century ? Moslems over here love our country which is hardly surprising . What is there here to not like ?

[Chris]

" Extremist Enhancers " as they get rid of so many Terrorist Women , and nasty Terrorist children and vile Terrorist babies .
Makes you proud to be a Hilly Billy Child murderer

When is this action flick coming out?

[Private Pickle]

Don't project one or two arrests into a conspiracy plot .
99.9% of Moslems are law abiding , OK people , living peacefully alongside Brits .
God knows where you got that undated link from --- this century ? Moslems over here love our country which is hardly surprising . What is there here to not like ?

Do you actually believe what you type?

• 47% of Britons see Muslims as a threat (http://www.ifop.fr/media/pressdocument/410-1-document_file.pdf).
• Only 28% of Britons believe Muslims want to integrate (http://pewglobal.org/files/2011/07/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Western-Relations-FINAL-FOR-PRINT-July-21-2011.pdf) into British society.
• 52% of Britons believe that Muslims create problems (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/feb/27/support-poll-support-far-right?INTCMP=SRCH).
• 45% of Britons admit that they think there are too many (http://library.fes.de/pdf-files/do/07908-20110311.pdf)Muslims in Britain.
• 55% of Britons would be concerned (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1242048/Almost-half-Britons-oppose-mosque-built-area-finds-study.html) if a mosque was built in their area.
• 58% of Britons associate Islam with extremism (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10251827).


http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/belief/2012/jul/03/muslims-integrated-britain

[Mister D]

Do you actually believe what you type?

• 47% of Britons see Muslims as a threat (http://www.ifop.fr/media/pressdocument/410-1-document_file.pdf).
• Only 28% of Britons believe Muslims want to integrate (http://pewglobal.org/files/2011/07/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Western-Relations-FINAL-FOR-PRINT-July-21-2011.pdf) into British society.
• 52% of Britons believe that Muslims create problems (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/feb/27/support-poll-support-far-right?INTCMP=SRCH).
• 45% of Britons admit that they think there are too many (http://library.fes.de/pdf-files/do/07908-20110311.pdf)Muslims in Britain.
• 55% of Britons would be concerned (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1242048/Almost-half-Britons-oppose-mosque-built-area-finds-study.html) if a mosque was built in their area.
• 58% of Britons associate Islam with extremism (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10251827).


http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/belief/2012/jul/03/muslims-integrated-britain

Private, Cary refuses to acknowledge the failure of multiculturalism in his country. He is so out of step with British public opinion it's hard to believe he's really British. Cary is a parrot. He parrots the official lies his government has fed him for decades. What's funny is that even his government has acknowledged this failure.

[zelmo1234]

Don't project one or two arrests into a conspiracy plot .
99.9% of Moslems are law abiding , OK people , living peacefully alongside Brits .
God knows where you got that undated link from --- this century ? Moslems over here love our country which is hardly surprising . What is there here to not like ?

I didn/t there was 3000 arrests th is just 2998 more than one or 2

Or is mathmatics different in Irony and imagination land?

[GrumpyDog]

" Extremist Enhancers " as they get rid of so many Terrorist Women , and nasty Terrorist children and vile Terrorist babies .
Makes you proud to be a Hilly Billy Child murderer

The horribly wonderful thing about an army of Predator drones, is that they do not require an army of human operators to fly them. They can all be flown by a central main computer, simultaneously, with each Predator having its own protocol.

A perfect killing machine for any would be future dictator, or Corporate Oligarchy.

A better assassination machine than the former CIA covert human operative teams, like Alpha 66 or Mujahadeen.

Combine this technology, with the sophisticated psychology that has Americans buying AR-15s for christmas gifts and pass legislation like NDAA 2012 fully nullifying the 4th amendment by the use of the word "terrorist" and the Corporate Oligarch dream of world domination is complete.

And should there be need, there is the newly mutated Bird Flu Virus, in the vault of some Billionaire Bilderberger.

So no need for Nuclear weapons of mass destruction anymore, and besides, those weapons destroy the land and water permanently. Now, its a much better end game plan. Kill all the peasants, or get them to kill themselves, using psychology, fear, and religion. Take out any future resistance leaders by using Predators. And kill off the rest with Bird Flu virus, which, after a month or so, dissipates. Then divide up all the land and resources among the few Corporate oligarchs, and control population growth afterwards. Utopia established.

[GrumpyDog]

And background checks will have little to no effect, on the outcome.

[Captain Obvious]

And background checks will have little to no effect, on the outcome.

No, they won't by themselves.

And this is the biggest problem I have with all of the discussion of "gun control" - it's all non-cohesive.

All brainstormed ideas based on feel-good qualities, none of them having any consideration to statistical effectiveness.

[Awryly]

No, they won't by themselves.

And this is the biggest problem I have with all of the discussion of "gun control" - it's all non-cohesive.

All brainstormed ideas based on feel-good qualities, none of them having any consideration to statistical effectiveness.

What do you think would achieve your "statistical effectiveness"?

And what statistics do you consider "effective"?

[zelmo1234]

What would achieve an improvement in the rates of Gun violence?

Here is my 8 step program.

#1 all illegal use of a Firearm is a federal offence. And what I mean by this is if a person has a firearm illegally and is carring said firearm illegally, So the wilful illegal use of a firearm. these should be prosicuted each and every time no exceptions, with the same 10 20 life rules that Florida has adopted. 20 years for having the illegal fire arm, 20 years if you use it in a crime, and life if you dischare the weapon in a crime.

#2 turn prisons back into work camps and Prisons not caged country clubs. Prison should not be a nice place to be. they should be turned into farms and the in mates should have to work for there keep, raising and preserving and preparing most of there food. non violent offenders can be put back on chain gangs and used on public workds programs. No cable TV limited programming. They should be work camps not day camps.

#3 an all aout assualt on gang crimes and violence. Gangs by nature are involved in illegal activity, the money saved by having prisioners raise and prepare there own foods can be put into inforcement and preventong of these crimes. many gang members when cought will be in possession of a firearm the the 10 20 life comes into effect. And if prisond get over crowded, well that is just to darn bad. get the loosers off the street.

#4 illiminate the failed public education model. In Washington DC they had a vouchr program and it was working poor children that wanted to learn and had parents that care weregoing to charted and private schools using vouchers to pay there way. success was tremendous. but Obama killed that program to protect the unions. this model should be developed nation wide to end the failure of our inner city puvlic school children

#5 many young men and criminals just have too much time on there hands. changing welfare into workfare will not only provide needed state and local services but will in fact save the tax payers money as they are currently paying for someone to do the job and payuing for the welfare check as well. by putting these people to work to receive this assistance it not only fills there day but will build there pride as they are no longer paricites on the system. This also give less time for drug and alcohol abuse, and thus less crime.

#6 There is no reason that there can ont be a 100% background check system closing the private sale and gun show loop holes. this could be implimented on a national level and would prevent some people from purchasing guns that they are not allowed to have.

#7 increae training and expand concel carry programs and decreae the gun free zones. Letting criminals know that there may be armed and trained opposition around every corner.

#8 reduce income corporat and property taxes for manufacturing and service based businesses that locate in high unemployment inner cities and hire people from the area.

there I took 8 steps instead of 23 that Obama took I could get mine passed through congress, mine would save the governemnts money, and the big part.

MINE WOULD ACTUALLY REDUCE CRIME. while protecting and ecpanding the law abiding citizens right to keep and bear arms.

And I reduce poverty as a by product of these steps

[Chris]

What do you think would achieve your "statistical effectiveness"?

And what statistics do you consider "effective"?

I think he's talking about statistics showing the effectiveness of the gun control you and others advocate. Thus "what statistics do you consider "effective"?" is the question you need to answer.

[JackRuby]

You are absolutely right ,Mister Riley ( any relation to the legend Bill Riley? ) ,
Unfortunately , there is such a high state of denial in America that those with closed minds , Chrismess for example , will be unable to reply sanely .
Minds need changing and this rightly means finding what sort of minds we are dealing with ---- the irrationals who spend their spare time target shooting , the contemptibles who kill animals for blood lust , and the morons who twist increased murder potential into protection .
America is indeed a very sick society and this specific area contribution lies at the root of matters .
Surely there is a case for appointing an International Review body to examine the broader picture as allowing patients to act as their own Doctors has a tragic history . As a permanent member of the United Nations Security Council , Team GB should perhaps be asked to produce a working paper plus specific proposals for discussion and implementation .

Observing via the Witness Protection Program for the past 40 some years and having lived out of the country for my own protection when the occasion arises, I do not believe our country is a sick society as you say. But it is incredibly stupid and naive Look to what's popular in entertainment as one barometer. Look to a statistic I once read a few years ago that over 70% of recent high school graduates can't pass the GED test. Look at our news for a dreadful indicator of our diminishing collective IQ. We're victims of Madison Avenue manipulation and in need for things we don't even need. We are not trained properly in our upbringing. We are intellectually lazy. Most people I observe, because I have little contact in the WPP with people anymore, are good people and mean well. Just not too bright. We are pushovers for our politicians, media and corporate manipulators.

[Peter1469]

Observing via the Witness Protection Program for the past 40 some years and having lived out of the country for my own protection when the occasion arises, I do not believe our country is a sick society as you say. But it is incredibly stupid and naive Look to what's popular in entertainment as one barometer. Look to a statistic I once read a few years ago that over 70% of recent high school graduates can't pass the GED test. Look at our news for a dreadful indicator of our diminishing collective IQ. We're victims of Madison Avenue manipulation and in need for things we don't even need. We are not trained properly in our upbringing. We are intellectually lazy. Most people I observe, because I have little contact in the WPP with people anymore, are good people and mean well. Just not too bright. We are pushovers for our politicians, media and corporate manipulators.

So you turn 102 on March 25th? Happy Birth Day.

[JackRuby]

So you turn 102 on March 25th? Happy Birth Day.

Pretty tough but really it's the first 100 years that are the hardest. Once you get those in, the rest is down hill. Hey dick on the government all you guys want but I thank you all for the great food and medical care I get in the Witness Protection Program. You taxpayers rock!

Jack

[Peter1469]

Pretty tough but really it's the first 100 years that are the hardest. Once you get those in, the rest is down hill. Hey dick on the government all you guys want but I thank you all for the great food and medical care I get in the Witness Protection Program. You taxpayers rock!

Jack

No, it is my pleasure.

[Chris]

Observing via the Witness Protection Program for the past 40 some years and having lived out of the country for my own protection when the occasion arises, I do not believe our country is a sick society as you say. But it is incredibly stupid and naive Look to what's popular in entertainment as one barometer. Look to a statistic I once read a few years ago that over 70% of recent high school graduates can't pass the GED test. Look at our news for a dreadful indicator of our diminishing collective IQ. We're victims of Madison Avenue manipulation and in need for things we don't even need. We are not trained properly in our upbringing. We are intellectually lazy. Most people I observe, because I have little contact in the WPP with people anymore, are good people and mean well. Just not too bright. We are pushovers for our politicians, media and corporate manipulators.

The sickness of society is the liberal disease. It is apathy of social responsibility and dependence on government to more and more make our choices. If not apathy then advocacy of even greater government control: "Surely there is a case for appointing an International Review body to examine...." blah blah blah.

[JackRuby]

The sickness of society is the liberal disease. It is apathy of social responsibility and dependence on government to more and more make our choices. If not apathy then advocacy of even greater government control: "Surely there is a case for appointing an International Review body to examine...." blah blah blah.

That's incorrect. Take it from someone who is about to turn 102 on the government dole.

Jack

[Awryly]

Observing via the Witness Protection Program for the past 40 some years and having lived out of the country for my own protection when the occasion arises, I do not believe our country is a sick society as you say. But it is incredibly stupid and naive Look to what's popular in entertainment as one barometer. Look to a statistic I once read a few years ago that over 70% of recent high school graduates can't pass the GED test. Look at our news for a dreadful indicator of our diminishing collective IQ. We're victims of Madison Avenue manipulation and in need for things we don't even need. We are not trained properly in our upbringing. We are intellectually lazy. Most people I observe, because I have little contact in the WPP with people anymore, are good people and mean well. Just not too bright. We are pushovers for our politicians, media and corporate manipulators.

Correct. And you are armed to the teeth.

Have you had a background check for all those guns?

[Awryly]

Pretty tough but really it's the first 100 years that are the hardest. Once you get those in, the rest is down hill. Hey dick on the government all you guys want but I thank you all for the great food and medical care I get in the Witness Protection Program. You taxpayers rock!

Jack

Some of these people would have you in Guantanamo Bay eating your socks.

BTW, who did you snitch on? Al Capone?

[Chris]

That's incorrect. Take it from someone who is about to turn 102 on the government dole.

Jack

Nice opinion, Ruby, put some meat on it. How's it incorrect and what is correct? Unless you can't come out of the witness protection program to do it.

[Chris]

Some of these people would have you in Guantanamo Bay eating your socks.

BTW, who did you snitch on? Al Capone?

:smiley_ROFLMAO::smiley_ROFLMAO::smiley_ROFLMAO:

Another foreigner who knows nothing of American culture. Jack Ruby, Al Capone, oy vey!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Bb4DpejUUA

[Awryly]

I see the squirrels are up and about munching on their favourite acorns.

[Captain Obvious]

And the pygmies are digging for grubs.

[Awryly]

And the pygmies are digging for grubs.

Gonna answer the question or just witter on about pygmies?



http://thepoliticalforums.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Captain Obvious http://thepoliticalforums.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://thepoliticalforums.com/showthread.php?p=219089#post219089)
No, they won't by themselves.

And this is the biggest problem I have with all of the discussion of "gun control" - it's all non-cohesive.

All brainstormed ideas based on feel-good qualities, none of them having any consideration to statistical effectiveness.

What do you think would achieve your "statistical effectiveness"?

And what statistics do you consider "effective"?

[Chris]

And the pygmies are digging for grubs.

From the rotting flesh of a week long dead hippopotamus.

[Awryly]

Speaking of witterers.