View Full Version : U.S. Law Enforcement failed to see the Threat of White Nationalism
exotix
11-05-2018, 07:55 AM
Today
U.S. Law Enforcement Failed to See the Threat of White Nationalism.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/03/magazine/FBI-charlottesville-white-nationalism-far-right.html
Now They Don’t Know How to Stop It.
For two decades, domestic counterterrorism strategy has ignored the rising danger of far-right extremism.
In the atmosphere of willful indifference, a virulent movement has grown and metastasized.
The first indication to Lt. Dan Stout that law enforcement’s handling of white supremacy was broken came in September 2017, as he was sitting in an emergency-operations center in Gainesville, Fla., preparing for the onslaught of Hurricane Irma and watching what felt like his thousandth YouTube video of the recent violence in Charlottesville, Va.
Jesus Christ, he thought, studying the footage in which crowds of angry men, who had gathered to attend or protest the Unite the Right rally, set upon one another with sticks and flagpole spears and flame throwers and God knows what else.
Before that August, Stout, a 24-year veteran of the Gainesville police force, had never heard of Richard Spencer and knew next to nothing about his self-declared alt-right movement, or of their “anti-fascist” archnemesis known as Antifa.
Then, on the Monday after deadly violence in Charlottesville, in which a protester was killed when a driver plowed his car into the crowd, Stout learned to his horror that Spencer was planning a speech at the University of Florida.
He spent weeks frantically trying to get up to speed, scouring far-right and anti-fascist websites and videos, each click driving him further into despair.
Aside from the few white nationalists who had been identified by the media or on Twitter, Stout had no clue who most of these people were, and neither, it seemed, did anyone else in law enforcement.
There were no current intelligence reports he could find on the alt-right, the sometimes-violent fringe movement that embraces white nationalism and a range of racist positions.
The state police couldn’t offer much insight.
Things were equally bleak at the federal level.
Whatever the F.B.I. knew (which wasn’t a lot, Stout suspected), they weren’t sharing.
The Department of Homeland Security, which produced regular intelligence and threat assessments for local law enforcement, had only scant material on white supremacists, all of it vague and ultimately not much help. Local politicians, including the governor, were also in the dark.
This is like a Bermuda Triangle of intelligence, Stout thought, incredulous.
He reached out to their state partners.
“So you’re telling us that there’s nothing?
No names we can plug into the automatic license-plate readers?
No players with a propensity for violence?
No one you have in the system?
https://static01.nyt.com/images/2018/11/04/magazine/04mag-alt-right-gif/04mag-alt-right-gif-superJumbo-v2.gif
DGUtley
11-05-2018, 08:02 AM
I'm troubled by White Nationalism. I'm not troubled by level-the-playing-field nationalism. We've seen these white nationalists my entire life. They're a fringe part of society that nobody's given a hoot or two cents about. The media's tried to tie Trump's desire to level the playing field in terms of Tariffs and protect our borders etc to white supremacy rather than to national security and self-interest. I think that it's political. I'm in a gun club a county below where I live. The White Supremacists are somewhat rife down there. When you join you have to undergo a background check b/c the last thing we want is white supremacists in the club - they will rip it apart with their ideology.
Maybe I'm wrong but I don't think the white nationalists are anything other than a tiny tiny tiny fringe group that the D's and Media are trying to tie to the R's for their identity politics.
Cannons Front
11-05-2018, 08:36 AM
"Before that August, Stout, a 24-year veteran of the Gainesville police force, had never heard of Richard Spencer and knew next to nothing about his self-declared alt-right movement, or of their “anti-fascist” archnemesis known as Antifa."
So the truth of this story is that LEO had no knowledge of either side here not just the alt-right. I guess when they were putting this article together they didn't bother to read what they wrote as they put together their headline. NY Times..... Why am I not surprised.
Chris
11-05-2018, 08:45 AM
I'm troubled by White Nationalism. I'm not troubled by level-the-playing-field nationalism. We've seen these white nationalists my entire life. They're a fringe part of society that nobody's given a hoot or two cents about. The media's tried to tie Trump's desire to level the playing field in terms of Tariffs and protect our borders etc to white supremacy rather than to national security and self-interest. I think that it's political. I'm in a gun club a county below where I live. The White Supremacists are somewhat rife down there. When you join you have to undergo a background check b/c the last thing we want is white supremacists in the club - they will rip it apart with their ideology.
Maybe I'm wrong but I don't think the white nationalists are anything other than a tiny tiny tiny fringe group that the D's and Media are trying to tie to the R's for their identity politics.
The media and many a liberal tries ot conflate nationalism with white nationalism with white suprmacy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_nationalism
White nationalism is a type of nationalism or pan-nationalism which espouses the belief that white people are a race[1] and seeks to develop and maintain a white national identity....
White nationalism is sometimes described as a euphemism for, or subset of, white supremacy, and the two have been used interchangeably by journalists and other analysts....
Let's note as well how white nationalists together with white supremacists employ liberal identity politics.
Nationlaim does not but is akin to patriotism plus an element of a nation being better or more important than other nations.
Safety
11-05-2018, 08:48 AM
I'm troubled by White Nationalism. I'm not troubled by level-the-playing-field nationalism. We've seen these white nationalists my entire life. They're a fringe part of society that nobody's given a hoot or two cents about. The media's tried to tie Trump's desire to level the playing field in terms of Tariffs and protect our borders etc to white supremacy rather than to national security and self-interest. I think that it's political. I'm in a gun club a county below where I live. The White Supremacists are somewhat rife down there. When you join you have to undergo a background check b/c the last thing we want is white supremacists in the club - they will rip it apart with their ideology.
Maybe I'm wrong but I don't think the white nationalists are anything other than a tiny tiny tiny fringe group that the D's and Media are trying to tie to the R's for their identity politics.
There are more white nationalists in this country then there are muslim extremists. Now, how do you feel about the muslim ban?
Hoosier8
11-05-2018, 08:50 AM
The latest when from the left. Good God they need racism more than anyone else wants.
Chris
11-05-2018, 08:57 AM
There are more white nationalists in this country then there are muslim extremists. Now, how do you feel about the muslim ban?
Link?
Safety
11-05-2018, 09:08 AM
Link?
LoL....
https://www.vox.com/2018/8/10/17670992/study-white-americans-alt-right-racism-white-nationalists
According to a Pew Forum estimate, in 2017 there were 3.45 million Muslims, constituting about 1.1% of the total U.S. population. A Pew Forum report on American religion found that Muslims accounted for 0.9% of American adults in 2014, up from 0.4% in 2007, due largely to immigration.
If every Muslim counted in the estimate was extremist, which is impossible, then it still would only come to about 27% of the number of white nationalists.
Need a link on the prediction that the sun will rise and set tomorrow?
exotix
11-05-2018, 09:11 AM
LOL
Take the rally in Macon on Sunday afternoon, ostensibly held to support the Republican nominee for governor of Georgia, Brian Kemp.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/04/us/politics/midterm-elections-update.html
For one stretch, Mr. Trump veered into questioning why his own supporters, law enforcement officials and immigration officers were not doing more to curtail antifa protesters on the left.
Mr. Trump first mocked members of antifa as having “little arms” as he tried to entertain the crowd.
He said they reach for weapons like clubs because of that.
“Where are the Bikers for Trump?
Where are the police?
Where are the military?
Where are ICE?
Where are the Border Patrol?”
President Trump SLAMS Antifa: "They're So Lucky That We're Peaceful"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tj7C5mMrvs0
Common
11-05-2018, 09:12 AM
Law enforcement did it on purpose because they are all white and racists, and they wanted you to have something to post
Safety
11-05-2018, 09:21 AM
Law enforcement did it on purpose because they are all white and racists, and they wanted you to have something to post
Weren't you a cop? Speaking from policy?
DGUtley
11-05-2018, 09:31 AM
There are more white nationalists in this country then there are muslim extremists. Now, how do you feel about the muslim ban?
There is no Muslim Ban, we've been over this. I've already said what I feel about White Nationalists. Nobody has the right to come to this country, so the treatment of someone that's a citizen necessarily is different than someone that is not a citizen and isn't on our soil. As an aside, though, are you advocating that we take away someone's constitutional right because of their political beliefs?
I take it from your response that you agree with me that there's a difference between White Nationalist and Nationalist. Thank you.
LoL.... https://www.vox.com/2018/8/10/17670992/study-white-americans-alt-right-racism-white-nationalists If every Muslim counted in the estimate was extremist, which is impossible, then it still would only come to about 27% of the number of white nationalists. Need a link on the prediction that the sun will rise and set tomorrow?
I don't believe that there are 14,000,000 white nationalists in this country.
Mister D
11-05-2018, 09:40 AM
14,000,000!?
:laugh:
Anyway, we shouldn't act to protect the US from Muslim fanaticism because...white nationalism. Makes perfect sense.
Safety
11-05-2018, 09:44 AM
There is no Muslim Ban, we've been over this. I've already said what I feel about White Nationalists. Nobody has the right to come to this country, so the treatment of someone that's a citizen necessarily is different than someone that is not a citizen and isn't on our soil. As an aside, though, are you advocating that we take away someone's constitutional right because of their political beliefs?
The POTUS called it a muslim ban when he was running for office. It is apropos.
I take it from your response that you agree with me that there's a difference between White Nationalist and Nationalist. Thank you.
I always knew there was a difference between white nationalist and nationalist. I have the nationalist label under my avatar....
I don't believe that there are 14,000,000 white nationalists in this country.
The link estimated around 11 million, but I believe there are more than that. Then again, we are talking about two distinct perspectives, a white nationalist/extremist/supremacist/alt-right individual is someone that targets me, not you. A muslim extremist targets Americans, and more white people will be affected by them because there are more white Americans. So, I understand your underestimating of white nationalists, it is not something that should cause you harm.
Chris
11-05-2018, 09:45 AM
LoL....
https://www.vox.com/2018/8/10/17670992/study-white-americans-alt-right-racism-white-nationalists
If every Muslim counted in the estimate was extremist, which is impossible, then it still would only come to about 27% of the number of white nationalists.
Need a link on the prediction that the sun will rise and set tomorrow?
LOL is right.
The link goes to an estimate of the number of people with views similar to the alt-right, not even alt-righters let alone white nationalists.
Chris
11-05-2018, 09:46 AM
There is no Muslim Ban, we've been over this. I've already said what I feel about White Nationalists. Nobody has the right to come to this country, so the treatment of someone that's a citizen necessarily is different than someone that is not a citizen and isn't on our soil. As an aside, though, are you advocating that we take away someone's constitutional right because of their political beliefs?
I take it from your response that you agree with me that there's a difference between White Nationalist and Nationalist. Thank you.
I don't believe that there are 14,000,000 white nationalists in this country.
And you'd be correct. Safety's link doesn't say what he thinks it does. Well, the title suggests it, but if you read the rest it doesn't support his belief at all.
Safety
11-05-2018, 09:46 AM
LOL is right.
The link goes to an estimate of the number of people with views similar to the alt-right, not even alt-righters let alone white nationalists.
Asked and answered. Go throw your little tantrum somewhere else.
Safety
11-05-2018, 09:48 AM
And you'd be correct. Safety's link doesn't say what he thinks it does. Well, the title suggests it, but if you read the rest it doesn't support his belief at all.
It had a cute picture of white nationalists carrying tiki torches, I immediately thought of you when I saw it.
)))Marc(((
11-05-2018, 09:48 AM
There are more white nationalists in this country then there are muslim extremists. Now, how do you feel about the muslim ban?
Correct. Hopefully. A White Nation will emerge ; we encourage the negro to do the same. This is organically currently under construction despite the current multicultural scam. Blacks are heading to the deep south ; Whites to the mountainous upper south. Separation ; the perfect solution. Peace. Finally.
Safety
11-05-2018, 09:53 AM
Correct. Hopefully. A White Nation will emerge ; we encourage the negro to do the same. This is organically currently under construction despite the current multicultural scam. Blacks are heading to the deep south ; Whites to the mountainous upper south. Separation ; the perfect solution. Peace. Finally.
DGUtley
See, that number is believable.
DGUtley
11-05-2018, 09:57 AM
@DGUtley (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=2019) See, that number is believable.
Outliers. Tiny tiny tiny tiny percentage of people that if folks ignored would just disappear.
DGUtley
11-05-2018, 10:02 AM
The POTUS called it a muslim ban when he was running for office. It is apropos.
It is not appropriate.
I always knew there was a difference between white nationalist and nationalist. I have the nationalist label under my avatar....
We agree. Too bad the media doesn't.
The link estimated around 11 million, but I believe there are more than that. Then again, we are talking about two distinct perspectives, a white nationalist/extremist/supremacist/alt-right individual is someone that targets me, not you. A muslim extremist targets Americans, and more white people will be affected by them because there are more white Americans. So, I understand your underestimating of white nationalists, it is not something that should cause you harm.
Where I come from, if they target you, they also target me.
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:15 AM
It is not appropriate.
We agree. Too bad the media doesn't.
Where I come from, if they target you, they also target me.
Well, it does make one feel warm and fuzzy inside, but I've noticed the lack of support with the fights I have to battle here, so color me skeptical. But appreciate it nonetheless.
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:17 AM
Outliers. Tiny tiny tiny tiny percentage of people that if folks ignored would just disappear.
Every mass shooting/murder/bomb event we've had was done by an outlier. I would not expect anyone to ignore Farrakhan, so the same benefit should be afforded to me, no?
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:21 AM
Asked and answered. Go throw your little tantrum somewhere else.
Nice attempt at deflection.
You claimed one thing and linked to something else.
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:23 AM
It had a cute picture of white nationalists carrying tiki torches, I immediately thought of you when I saw it.
Again, nice attempt at deflection.
You made a claim about the number of white nationalists and to support it provided a link to data about people who share some views with the alt-right.
Fail.
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:25 AM
Outliers. Tiny tiny tiny tiny percentage of people that if folks ignored would just disappear.
Actual white nationalist, yes, outliers. Rejected by the right. And would fade away if liberals and the media would get into a confusing, conflating frenzy. But they won't because it's all about political power, if you can associate the right with outlier supremacists, you demonize the right. Doesn't matter that it's fake.
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:27 AM
Well, it does make one feel warm and fuzzy inside, but I've noticed the lack of support with the fights I have to battle here, so color me skeptical. But appreciate it nonetheless.
Your fights are mostly in your head. You see racism everywhere you look...but yourself.
DGUtley
11-05-2018, 10:27 AM
Well, it does make one feel warm and fuzzy inside, but I've noticed the lack of support with the fights I have to battle here, so color me skeptical. But appreciate it nonetheless.
A lot of your fights are merely crying wolf, to make your point. You know that. Your appreciation is irrelevant to me.
DGUtley
11-05-2018, 10:29 AM
Every mass shooting/murder/bomb event we've had was done by an outlier. I would not expect anyone to ignore Farrakhan, so the same benefit should be afforded to me, no?
You can highlight anyone you want. I went to DC and the Constitution is still there.
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:29 AM
Nice attempt at deflection.
You claimed one thing and linked to something else.
Again, nice attempt at deflection.
You made a claim about the number of white nationalists and to support it provided a link to data about people who share some views with the alt-right.
Fail.
You having a sad, chris?
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:30 AM
You having a sad, chris?
Deflects again.
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:31 AM
A lot of your fights are merely crying wolf, to make your point. You know that. Your appreciation is irrelevant to me.
Ouch, I stand corrected. I totally misunderstood your intent.
DGUtley
11-05-2018, 10:33 AM
Ouch, I stand corrected. I totally misunderstood your intent.
No, I think you got my point.
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:33 AM
Your fights are mostly in your head. You see racism everywhere you look...but yourself.
I don't expect anyone that has been proven, not just by me, to support racist comments, the ability to see racism directed at anyone non-white.
#tiki
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:35 AM
I don't expect anyone that has been proven, not just by me, to support racist comments, the ability to see racism directed at anyone non-white.
#tiki
More deflection with made up trolling nonsense.
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:35 AM
No, I think you got my point.
In actuality, I think we both see why I was skeptical in the first place. Oh well.
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:35 AM
Looks like another thread safety is taking down the bickerhole.
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:36 AM
More deflection with made up trolling nonsense.
Things are not made up, if there is proof of it occurring. Fake news and alternative facts are not allowed.
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:38 AM
Looks like another thread safety is taking down the bickerhole.
You're free to leave it at any time. Members can look at the posts and see I provided links and a source for my position, you provided nothing but indications of being butt-hurt, in which that is a personal issue.
DGUtley
11-05-2018, 10:39 AM
In actuality, I think we both see why I was skeptical in the first place. Oh well.
No, we don't both see it. You don't really see it but it wouldn't fit your narrative so you say you do.
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:45 AM
No, we don't both see it. You don't really see it but it wouldn't fit your narrative so you say you do.
Dave, I both see and understand. You think it's crying wolf, I see it as my perspective of society. All that was needed to be said was said, so it is done.
Narrative?...ok.
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:49 AM
You're free to leave it at any time. Members can look at the posts and see I provided links and a source for my position, you provided nothing but indications of being butt-hurt, in which that is a personal issue.
Your free to join the discussion at any time, instead you deflect and insult your way out of it.
I agree, members can follow your link and see it doesn't say what you claimed it did.
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:50 AM
Dave, I both see and understand. You think it's crying wolf, I see it as my perspective of society. All that was needed to be said was said, so it is done.
Narrative?...ok.
That's probably the most honest post of your time here, the admission that fact that it is just your view: "I see it as my perspective of society."
Safety
11-05-2018, 10:53 AM
Your free to join the discussion at any time, instead you deflect and insult your way out of it.
I agree, members can follow your link and see it doesn't say what you claimed it did.
I've been in this discussion, discussing it, long before you attempted to enter and show the board your disdain for the facts.
That's probably the most honest post of your time here, the admission that fact that it is just your view: "I see it as my perspective of society."
I couldn't care less what your unsolicited advice is about any of my posts. It's ironic you have the audacity to comment on any post's truthfulness.
Chris
11-05-2018, 10:54 AM
I've been in this discussion, discussing it, long before you attempted to enter and show the board your disdain for the facts.
I couldn't care less what your unsolicited advice is about any of my posts. It's ironic you have the audacity to comment on any post's truthfulness.
I didn't advise you, Safety. Stop making things up.
Captdon
11-05-2018, 11:41 AM
LoL....
https://www.vox.com/2018/8/10/17670992/study-white-americans-alt-right-racism-white-nationalists
If every Muslim counted in the estimate was extremist, which is impossible, then it still would only come to about 27% of the number of white nationalists.
Need a link on the prediction that the sun will rise and set tomorrow?
Prove how many white nationalists there are. You can't.
The Xl
11-05-2018, 11:42 AM
White nationalism does nothing for me and most of them are clowns, but I'm still not sold that their silly ideology is inherently physically dangerous on any sort of significant scale
Tahuyaman
11-05-2018, 11:45 AM
"Before that August, Stout, a 24-year veteran of the Gainesville police force, had never heard of Richard Spencer and knew next to nothing about his self-declared alt-right movement, or of their “anti-fascist” archnemesis known as Antifa."
So the truth of this story is that LEO had no knowledge of either side here not just the alt-right. I guess when they were putting this article together they didn't bother to read what they wrote as they put together their headline. NY Times..... Why am I not surprised.
The media continually paints one side. The side which meshes with their agenda.
MisterVeritis
11-05-2018, 11:48 AM
There are more white nationalists in this country then there are muslim extremists. Now, how do you feel about the muslim ban?
I love a Muslim ban. When do you think we will see it?
Tahuyaman
11-05-2018, 11:57 AM
Prove how many white nationalists there are. You can't.
I remember a "white nationalist" protest event held either late last year or earlier this year. I think it was in DC. About a dozen showed up, but the media tried to present it it as a rapidly building and extremely troubling movement in America.
Toober
11-05-2018, 12:03 PM
white nationalist.
a caucasian that puts its own country before others.
its not complicated.
like native American.
anyone born in America, is native to America, thus they are indeed native Americans.
example:
people born in germany are native germans, italy, native italians and the same with every other country on the globe.
you are native to the country of your birth.
Safety
11-05-2018, 12:46 PM
I love a Muslim ban. When do you think we will see it?
I'm sure you do. Maybe we'll see after tomorrow.
)))Marc(((
11-06-2018, 12:36 PM
I'm sure you do. Maybe we'll see after tomorrow.
Or , perhaps, an enclave of UN controlled multi cult enclaves will develop. Socialist in nature , where race , assets and culture are equally mixed. No rich. No poor. No Black or White. All for one , one for all (((lol))). Urban america.
As the country splits to various Nations and mixed countries a venue will be made for all. A place for every race and a place for those entrenched in universalism. Finally , a role for chicago.
Grokmaster
11-06-2018, 04:11 PM
There are more white nationalists in this country then there are muslim extremists. Now, how do you feel about the muslim ban?
Bulshit. And let us know when "White nationalists" take out 3,000 Americans in a single attack, or match ONE YEAR of Chicago's almost EXCLUSIVELY BLACK on BLACK murders count, in the entire history of "White nationalism".
Mister D
11-06-2018, 04:47 PM
Several of you have touched on a serious problem. What exactly is a white nationalist?
Safety
11-06-2018, 04:59 PM
Bulshit. And let us know when "White nationalists" take out 3,000 Americans in a single attack, or match ONE YEAR of Chicago's almost EXCLUSIVELY BLACK on BLACK murders count, in the entire history of "White nationalism".
You brought your truck, hooked up a chain, and pulled the hell out of those goalposts, then erected a platoon full of strawmen in its’ place.
Captdon
11-06-2018, 05:00 PM
Several of you have touched on a serious problem. What exactly is a white nationalist?
A white nationalist is a white person who is not a globalist.
A White Nationalist is a hate-filled loon. It's the same as, say, BLM except for race.
Captain Obvious
11-06-2018, 05:01 PM
Several of you have touched on a serious problem. What exactly is a white nationalist?
Any of you Trump voting racist Nazis
)))Marc(((
11-06-2018, 05:06 PM
Several of you have touched on a serious problem. What exactly is a white nationalist?
One wishing to live with other Whites in a self contained land mass.
Mini Me
11-06-2018, 05:28 PM
This is the Trump voter getting brainwashed watching Fox Gnus!
https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/45639785_10214555843307144_1763175854164148224_n.j pg?_nc_cat=109&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=5fb0b3402a534b2408809492240cfeee&oe=5C88B510
Tahuyaman
11-06-2018, 05:30 PM
This is the Trump voter getting brainwashed watching Fox Gnus!
https://scontent-sjc3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/45639785_10214555843307144_1763175854164148224_n.j pg?_nc_cat=109&_nc_ht=scontent-sjc3-1.xx&oh=5fb0b3402a534b2408809492240cfeee&oe=5C88B510
How many liberals here claim this guy as one of their own?
Anyone?
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