B’nei Mitzvah?

[Adelaide]

Miriam said: “I was quite concerned because if something is important in your coming of age, it should reflect who you are in a person and not squeeze you into the traditional two genders that we happen to have just because of history,”

The mother had previously faced fears of acceptance within their Jewish community as a different child had recently come out as gay...

Webber came to the decision to name the gender-neutral ceremony a “B’nei Mitzvah” because “b’nei” is a plural term which could refer to a mixed-gender group of people.

Other options had included “ban”, which combines the Hebrew for boy and girl, as well as “sera”, which means offspring or seed.



Non-binary teen celebrates "B'nei Mitvah" (https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2018/03/02/a-bnei-mitzvah-was-held-for-this-non-binary-teenager/?fbclid=IwAR0eXcAIxSrwdrkjMHMDtQhUUaiVPFcd96arRNGM dMAK4Q6QLCW9hUQCd6k)

This is interesting. Not sure how I feel about it, especially since I do not fully understand the "non-binary" thing, but kind of glad that a Rabbi was able to come up with an inclusive idea. I would rather this type of creative solution than seeing teens abandon a religion they feel connected to because that religion won't acknowledge them.

[Cletus]

I have a better idea. Simply tell them they are either boys or girls and stop feeding this delusional gender nonsense.

[Adelaide]

I have a better idea. Simply tell them they are either boys or girls and stop feeding this delusional gender nonsense.

Yeah, yeah - and it is a mental illness, blah blah blah.

But I would rather see a religion keep them engaged and involved than shun them or exclude them. I think religion can offer a lot to people, including guidance on issues. It may make a difference in the long run on how likely this teen is to commit suicide, for example, because the teen is at a higher risk because of their sexual orientation and non-binary identification.

[Cletus]

Yeah, yeah - and it is a mental illness, blah blah blah.

That's real helpful.

Yes, for some it is a mental illness. For others, it is a fad.

If you would rather make a mockery of a thousand years of tradition than tell some kid to get his (or her) head out of his ass, that is up to you. Just don't pretend it is a good thing.

[Common]

Theres some confusion in this thread and I admit when I first read Adelaides thread I thought it was about transgenderism, but it was about a gay kid.

I am totally against this gender neutral crap and there is no gender crap. There most certainly are genders and NO one can change that.

However, a gay kid being accepted by the rabbi is something totally different, the gay kid is different not trying to change the world.

[Green Arrow]

Non-binary teen celebrates "B'nei Mitvah" (https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2018/03/02/a-bnei-mitzvah-was-held-for-this-non-binary-teenager/?fbclid=IwAR0eXcAIxSrwdrkjMHMDtQhUUaiVPFcd96arRNGM dMAK4Q6QLCW9hUQCd6k)

This is interesting. Not sure how I feel about it, especially since I do not fully understand the "non-binary" thing, but kind of glad that a Rabbi was able to come up with an inclusive idea. I would rather this type of creative solution than seeing teens abandon a religion they feel connected to because that religion won't acknowledge them.

I think it’s a good thing. As you said, it can make a huge difference and help keep people tied to their faith in an age where politics take over our religious practices to the point that we as a people become more interested in exclusion rather than inclusion. Nothing about the actual ceremony or the theology is changing.

[Mister D]

That's real helpful.

Yes, for some it is a mental illness. For others, it is a fad.

If you would rather make a mockery of a thousand years of tradition than tell some kid to get his (or her) head out of his ass, that is up to you. Just don't pretend it is a good thing.
Reform Judaism discards tradition. It's more of a progressive political ideology than a faith. If this Rabbi is a member of that sect it makes perfect sense.

[CCitizen]

I am a Conservodox Jew -- I keep some Laws.

For instance I do not use electricity or Internet on Sabbath and Holidays.

I am not going to judge Reform Jews -- different people have different traditions.

[nathanbforrest45]

Yeah, yeah - and it is a mental illness, blah blah blah.

But I would rather see a religion keep them engaged and involved than shun them or exclude them. I think religion can offer a lot to people, including guidance on issues. It may make a difference in the long run on how likely this teen is to commit suicide, for example, because the teen is at a higher risk because of their sexual orientation and non-binary identification.

No, of course we can't call a spade a spade and say someone born one gender and thinks they are another gender is anything but a loony toon. This Rabbi is an abomination unto the Lord and will answer for his heresy one day.

[donttread]

Non-binary teen celebrates "B'nei Mitvah" (https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2018/03/02/a-bnei-mitzvah-was-held-for-this-non-binary-teenager/?fbclid=IwAR0eXcAIxSrwdrkjMHMDtQhUUaiVPFcd96arRNGM dMAK4Q6QLCW9hUQCd6k)

This is interesting. Not sure how I feel about it, especially since I do not fully understand the "non-binary" thing, but kind of glad that a Rabbi was able to come up with an inclusive idea. I would rather this type of creative solution than seeing teens abandon a religion they feel connected to because that religion won't acknowledge them.


I don't know what "non binary " means . But after I write this I will reluctantly attempt to find out. But I know a gay boy is still a boy so there is probably transgenderism involved. And unless that is medically supported by hormone levels, dual genitalia or something it is probably a mental illness being enabled by the parents.

Something about non-enabling you'll never hear in therapy though is this.
Non-enabled people die to. I don't think we even have any evidence that they die LESS often. It may be better for the family not to enable but we should sell it for what it is.

[Captdon]

I wouldn't be a Catholic if we allowed it. I don't care what others do. It's stupid though.

[Standing Wolf]

No, of course we can't call a spade a spade and say someone born one gender and thinks they are another gender is anything but a loony toon. This Rabbi is an abomination unto the Lord and will answer for his heresy one day.

The religion which teaches that an eternal, all-powerful creator of the universe is vitally concerned with what a ceremony is called or with who is romantically involved or sexually intimate with whom is simply begging to be mocked or ignored.

Except for those parts relating to The Golden Rule and loving your neighbor, most of the "great religions" seem to consist primarily of rules about one's life choices and assurances that "God" likes and hates the same things you do. Religion is a tool for societal cohesion and social control; its content and practice have changed only incidentally since the days when our pre-human ancestors thought the thunder and lightning meant something big and dangerous might be mad at them.

If you honestly believe that some omniscient being is waiting to judge each person according to how closely she or he followed the precepts and rules of some man-made institution based on superstition and ghost stories, the 'delusional nonsense" prize goes to you.

[Captdon]

The religion which teaches that an eternal, all-powerful creator of the universe is vitally concerned with what a ceremony is called or with who is romantically involved or sexually intimate with whom is simply begging to be mocked or ignored.

Except for those parts relating to The Golden Rule and loving your neighbor, most of the "great religions" seem to consist primarily of rules about one's life choices and assurances that "God" likes and hates the same things you do. Religion is a tool for societal cohesion and social control; its content and practice have changed only incidentally since the days when our pre-human ancestors thought the thunder and lightning meant something big and dangerous might be mad at them.

If you honestly believe that some omniscient being is waiting to judge each person according to how closely she or he followed the precepts and rules of some man-made institution based on superstition and ghost stories, the 'delusional nonsense" prize goes to you.

Mock as you will. Atheism doesn't mean anything. If you're right nothing matters. If i'm right you are not going to like the outcome.

It's not the selling point as you might think. It is simply the outcome. It doesn't matter to us what your outcome is.

[Standing Wolf]

...It doesn't matter to us what your outcome is.

I was a practicing Christian - at one time a licensed Southern Baptist preacher, in fact - to know that the fate and disposition of the souls of others is very much a concern of the Church. Someone needs to study their own Faith a bit more avidly.

[Adelaide]

Mock as you will. Atheism doesn't mean anything. If you're right nothing matters. If i'm right you are not going to like the outcome.

It's not the selling point as you might think. It is simply the outcome. It doesn't matter to us what your outcome is.

I am a big believer that everyone who has tried to be good and has had largely good intentions (even with bad outcomes) will likely be treated well when they die regardless of whether they followed religious rules or believed in God. The nice thing about simply thinking that people who try to be good will be rewarded is that I do not feel any animosity or superiority when I think about other religions or agnostics or atheists.

I do start to get offended or reactive when people use their religion to judge other people or in ways that are completely hypocritical and actually in total contradiction to the teachings of whatever their religion is.

[jimmyz]

Societal judgement should end at the doorway to the church, synagogue or mosque. Any tradition offered should be offered without judgement to the faithful.

[Captdon]

I was a practicing Christian - at one time a licensed Southern Baptist preacher, in fact - to know that the fate and disposition of the souls of others is very much a concern of the Church. Someone needs to study their own Faith a bit more avidly.

Someone needs to stop thinking he knows my church better than I do. I take the word of a Baptist about my Church the way I take the word of any atheist.

I have never been taught that the reason to be Catholic is to keep from going to Hell. I'm Catholic to believe that Jesus died on the cross to allow me to have my soul saved. Saved from Hell to be sure, but that's still only an outcome. I rarely heard of Hell in catechism or Nueman Club. <- I don't think it was called that except by us>. It was for h.s .kids.

I don't know what Southern Baptist believe except what my wife tells me.


Let see, I wasn't a priest or a member of the Knights of Columbus. I was an altar boy because I had memorized the Latin mass at age 8. It's been 50+ years and i don't remember all the terms. Buy, I do remember the Latin Mass.

[Mister D]

Someone needs to stop thinking he knows my church better than I do. I take the word of a Baptist about my Church the way I take the word of any atheist.

I have never been taught that the reason to be Catholic is to keep from going to Hell. I'm Catholic to believe that Jesus died on the cross to allow me to have my soul saved. Saved from Hell to be sure, but that's still only an outcome. I rarely heard of Hell in catechism or Nueman Club. <- I don't think it was called that except by us. It was for h.s .kids.

I don't know what Southern Baptist believe except what my wife tells me.


Let see, I wasn't a priest or a member of the Knights of Columbus. I was an altar boy because I had memorized the Latin mass at age 8.

Standing Wolf has the unfortunate habit of criticizing the beliefs of other people while considering a critique of his own off limits.

[Captdon]

I am a big believer that everyone who has tried to be good and has had largely good intentions (even with bad outcomes) will likely be treated well when they die regardless of whether they followed religious rules or believed in God. The nice thing about simply thinking that people who try to be good will be rewarded is that I do not feel any animosity or superiority when I think about other religions or agnostics or atheists.

I do start to get offended or reactive when people use their religion to judge other people or in ways that are completely hypocritical and actually in total contradiction to the teachings of whatever their religion is.

I do disagree with a lot of people by what they believe. Yet, I don't care either. Jesus said to spread the Gospel. Everyone I have ever known knows the gospel. If they choose not to believe it that's on them not on me.

[Tahuyaman]

Miriam said: “I was quite concerned because if something is important in your coming of age, it should reflect who you are in a person and not squeeze you into the traditional two genders that we happen to have just because of history,”

The mother had previously faced fears of acceptance within their Jewish community as a different child had recently come out as gay...

Webber came to the decision to name the gender-neutral ceremony a “B’nei Mitzvah” because “b’nei” is a plural term which could refer to a mixed-gender group of people.

Other options had included “ban”, which combines the Hebrew for boy and girl, as well as “sera”, which means offspring or seed.


This insanity is infecting every element of modern society. They aren't going to be happy until they ruin everything for everyone but them.

[Tahuyaman]

I am a big believer that everyone who has tried to be good and has had largely good intentions (even with bad outcomes) will likely be treated well when they die regardless of whether they followed religious rules or believed in God. The nice thing about simply thinking that people who try to be good will be rewarded is that I do not feel any animosity or superiority when I think about other religions or agnostics or atheists.

I do start to get offended or reactive when people use their religion to judge other people or in ways that are completely hypocritical and actually in total contradiction to the teachings of whatever their religion is.

That's not how the reality of salvation works.