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View Full Version : The Dubious Scandal of Chris Culliver



Mister D
02-06-2013, 04:00 PM
For those not following the hype and hullaballoo surrounding the most overhyped and hyper-hullaballooed event in the history of the world, it seems that in the run-up to Super Bowl XLVII, a professional football player has expressed the simply unacceptable sentiment that he actually finds it quite undesirable to take showers and walk around naked in the company of gay men.

Snip

Presumably, Chris Culliver ought to be perfectly fine with the notion of being in intimate quarters with men who embrace the love that, until recently, dared not speak its name (and now apparently won’t ever shut the hell up). He shouldn’t fret about being ogled, or fear being subjected to frisky, freaky episodes of frottage by fellow athletes who happen to be light in the cleats (not that there’s everything wrong with that). And if he’s afraid of dropping the soap in the shower, well, that’s just cuz he’s a reprehensible bigot. Once Culliver is properly sensitivity-trained, he’ll come to know that gay men don’t really like to look at naked men’s pecs, penises, and posteriors…

Oh wait; they do? Uh…

http://www.alternativeright.com/main/blogs/zeitgeist/never-be-rude-to-a-faggot/

KC
02-06-2013, 05:02 PM
He should be allowed to take a shower in a separate facility. You wouldn't expect him to take showers in the presence of female athletes (although I would expect many male athletes would be fine with that). Seems like a double standard.

Mister D
02-06-2013, 05:13 PM
Are we really at the point where being uncomfortable showering with gays is considered a sign of bigotry?

KC
02-06-2013, 05:23 PM
Are we really at the point where being uncomfortable showering with gays is considered a sign of bigotry?

I can't really speak much to this. I've never been an athlete and I can count the number of times I've showered among other guys on one hand. Personally I would be uncomfortable showering with someone who was openly gay.

Two of my close friends in high school were a gay guy and a transvestite. I had a lot of fun hanging with those guys, but I wouldn't feel comfortable showering with them if we were in sports.

Mister D
02-06-2013, 05:32 PM
I can't really speak much to this. I've never been an athlete and I can count the number of times I've showered among other guys on one hand. Personally I would be uncomfortable showering with someone who was openly gay.

Two of my close friends in high school were a gay guy and a transvestite. I had a lot of fun hanging with those guys, but I wouldn't feel comfortable showering with them if we were in sports.

I've always enjoyed intensive physical training but after CYO basketball I never played sports again so even showering with a bunch of heterosexual men would feel awkward. I wouldn't blame anyone for speaking out about the situation described.

KC
02-06-2013, 05:34 PM
I've always enjoyed intensive physical training but after CYO basketball I never played sports again so even showering with a bunch of heterosexual men would feel awkward. I wouldn't blame anyone for speaking out about the situation described.


I think that's how a lot of people feel but are afraid that the political correctness of our current environment will shun them if they're public about it. Like what seems to have happened to poor Chris here.

Mister D
02-06-2013, 05:38 PM
I think that's how a lot of people feel but are afraid that the political correctness of our current environment will shun them if they're public about it. Like what seems to have happened to poor Chris here.

That's kind of disturbing. I think you're right. It's true of a lot of things, actually.

KC
02-06-2013, 05:45 PM
That's kind of disturbing. I think you're right. It's true of a lot of things, actually.

The University libertarian organization Young Americans for Liberty put up three huge posters which they called the "wall of free speech." It was interesting to see what people wrote on it. Of course, a few wrote down obscenities, "Go [sports team]" or some quote or song lyric they like, but it would be interesting to see that again and see if anyone expressed any controversial opinion.

As for me I couldn't think of anything, I just decided to remind everyone that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice.

Mister D
02-06-2013, 05:55 PM
The University libertarian organization Young Americans for Liberty put up three huge posters which they called the "wall of free speech." It was interesting to see what people wrote on it. Of course, a few wrote down obscenities, "Go [sports team]" or some quote or song lyric they like, but it would be interesting to see that again and see if anyone expressed any controversial opinion.

As for me I couldn't think of anything, I just decided to remind everyone that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice.

I speak my mind on certain topics, have no fear of doing so, and accept the consequences. Free speech is one of this country's greatest traditions.

KC
02-06-2013, 05:59 PM
I speak my mind on certain topics, have no fear of doing so, and accept the consequences. Free speech is one of this country's greatest traditions.

I commend you for that, but as JS Mill points out, we only have free speech at face value as long as it is socially regulated. Right now, our speech is socially regulated to higher degree than it once was, or maybe just in different ways. Sure we are expected to be politically correct, but it was once commonly held that one should watch their language in the presence of a lady. We've changed a lot.

Mister D
02-06-2013, 06:07 PM
I commend you for that, but as JS Mill points out, we only have free speech at face value as long as it is socially regulated. Right now, our speech is socially regulated to higher degree than it once was, or maybe just in different ways. Sure we are expected to be politically correct, but it was once commonly held that one should watch their language in the presence of a lady. We've changed a lot.

To give pointless offense is poor manners and reveals poor character. Similarly, crude and profane speech reflects poorly on the speaker and should be discouraged. Our coarseness is yet another gift from the 60s generation. What I'm talking about is when ideas become verboten.

KC
02-06-2013, 06:22 PM
To give pointless offense is poor manners and reveals poor character. Similarly, crude and profane speech reflects poorly on the speaker and should be discouraged. Our coarseness is yet another gift from the 60s generation. What I'm talking about is when ideas become verboten.

Yes, this is true. To a some extent we still do impose limits on ourselves, such as when my friends and I are hanging out in the presence of a younger sibling. We will always be fluent in more than one dialect.

Yes, ideas need to be able to spread freely. In academics, it's a problem of misaligned incentives. In daily life, we're just worried about being labeled a racist, sexist, etc., in short a bigot.

Mister D
02-06-2013, 07:15 PM
Yes, this is true. To a some extent we still do impose limits on ourselves, such as when my friends and I are hanging out in the presence of a younger sibling. We will always be fluent in more than one dialect.

Yes, ideas need to be able to spread freely. In academics, it's a problem of misaligned incentives. In daily life, we're just worried about being labeled a racist, sexist, etc., in short a bigot.

I rather enjoy it at times. :grin:

KC
02-06-2013, 07:17 PM
I rather enjoy it at times. :grin:

Well then at least you won't let it bother you! Although I'm sure the merits of self censorship are more obvious in certain neighborhoods.

Mister D
02-06-2013, 07:20 PM
Well then at least you won't let it bother you! Although I'm sure the merits of self censorship are more obvious in certain neighborhoods.

That's certainly true. There are also times when it's just not appropriate.

KC
02-06-2013, 07:25 PM
That's certainly true. There are also times when it's just not appropriate.

Right. I'm extremely open about my views with my friends or my girlfriend, but when it comes to my family or hers, I have to sort of keep quiet. My family is pretty far left, her's is pretty far right.

I usually feel like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DohRa9lsx0Q

Mister D
02-06-2013, 07:26 PM
Your family is far left? That's interesting. I wouldn't have thought so.

KC
02-06-2013, 07:30 PM
Your family is far left? That's interesting. I wouldn't have thought so.

In my opinion anyway. Most people where I'm from have at some point been part of the United Auto Workers union, which tends to have a pretty big influence on our politics. I'm different in that I only worked in a factory one summer, then left since I decided to go to college anyhow.

Mister D
02-06-2013, 07:39 PM
In my opinion anyway. Most people where I'm from have at some point been part of the United Auto Workers union, which tends to have a pretty big influence on our politics. I'm different in that I only worked in a factory one summer, then left since I decided to go to college anyhow.

Oh OK. I have a different vision of this now. Union family. That I can see. When you say "far left" i was thinking upper middle class radicals.

KC
02-06-2013, 07:45 PM
Oh OK. I have a different vision of this now. Union family. That I can see. When you say "far left" i was thinking upper middle class radicals.

Maybe "far left" isn't fair. We're certainly more of a liberal bunch, but in more of a working class, buy-things-union-made way.

Mister D
02-06-2013, 07:49 PM
Maybe "far left" isn't fair. We're certainly more of a liberal bunch, but in more of a working class, buy-things-union-made way.

I've grown more sympathetic to that culture. My mother and father are from Jersey City and Bayonne NJ respectively. Working class white neighborhoods when they were kids.

KC
02-06-2013, 07:54 PM
I've grown more sympathetic to that culture. My mother and father are from Jersey City and Bayonne NJ respectively. Working class white neighborhoods when they were kids.

It's really not too bad. We're a pretty easy going bunch, just be careful if you start to get too critical of President Obama. In a weird way libertarians are sort of in the middle of the political spectrum though, so most of the time I can find at least one thing I agree with others about.