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Mainecoons
02-13-2013, 08:35 AM
I think the best description I've seen of the SOTU is "doubling down on failure."

Simply reconfirms what we are all learning about liberals: They have a near-total lack of common sense and an ability to learn from their mistakes, from things that do not work.

With a 40 percent fail rate on Obamaphones, no doubt they'll seek to double the size of the program next.

Just another "King of Hearts" moment.

BTW, I see that the Greek state appears to be in its final death spiral. The people have stopped paying their taxes. There's a lesson here--perhaps the right non-violent way to kill this cancer is stop feeding it.

Cigar
02-13-2013, 08:43 AM
You know what's funny ... when over 80% polled in your own state thinks better legislation on back ground checks is a good idea, and Mitch McConnell vote against it, that's called voting against your own constituency and putting party over country.

Bottom line, when did Good Old Conservative Values, Constitution Preaching, Flag Waving Republicans start thinking that putting Ideas to a Vote was a bad thing?

Hummm .... exactly what are they afraid of ... Democracy?

Mainecoons
02-13-2013, 08:46 AM
And that has what to do with the topic, nitwit?

Chris
02-13-2013, 08:52 AM
You know what's funny ... when over 80% polled in your own state thinks better legislation on back ground checks is a good idea, and Mitch McConnell vote against it, that's called voting against your own constituency and putting party over country.

Bottom line, when did Good Old Conservative Values, Constitution Preaching, Flag Waving Republicans start thinking that putting Ideas to a Vote was a bad thing?

Hummm .... exactly what are they afraid of ... Democracy?

Off topic and an extended logical fallacy that this country is a democracy run by majority popular opinion.

Cigar
02-13-2013, 08:52 AM
And that has what to do with the topic, nitwit?

First of all your topic is devoid of specifics and is just bitching as usual.

Second, we've already determined that trickle down fails and history has proven beyond a doubt that as strong middle class make this country work better. Now if you want to discuss this, fine or would your rather just name call?

Chris
02-13-2013, 08:53 AM
I think the best description I've seen of the SOTU is "doubling down on failure."

Simply reconfirms what we are all learning about liberals: They have a near-total lack of common sense and an ability to learn from their mistakes, from things that do not work.

With a 40 percent fail rate on Obamaphones, no doubt they'll seek to double the size of the program next.

Just another "King of Hearts" moment.

BTW, I see that the Greek state appears to be in its final death spiral. The people have stopped paying their taxes. There's a lesson here--perhaps the right non-violent way to kill this cancer is stop feeding it.

Too many apathetics and too many who support the kind of statism Obama seeks.

I didn't listen to the SOTU because it was too predictable.

GrassrootsConservative
02-13-2013, 08:54 AM
You know what's funny ... when over 80% polled in your own state thinks better legislation on back ground checks is a good idea, and Mitch McConnell vote against it, that's called voting against your own constituency and putting party over country.

Bottom line, when did Good Old Conservative Values, Constitution Preaching, Flag Waving Republicans start thinking that putting Ideas to a Vote was a bad thing?

Hummm .... exactly what are they afraid of ... Democracy?

Democracy is exactly what is driving this whole nation down the sewer, goober.

People like you are voting for the party that will give them the most money so you can sit on your ass and be a lazy mooch.

It's pathetic.



"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." -- Winston Churchill


"Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide." -- John Adams

Cigar
02-13-2013, 08:55 AM
Too many apathetics and too many who support the kind of statism Obama seeks.

I didn't listen to the SOTU because it was too predictable.

Well then you have no credible opinion on the SOTU, because you chose to stick your fingers in your ears.

Cigar
02-13-2013, 08:56 AM
Democracy is exactly what is driving this whole nation down the sewer, goober.

People like you are voting for the party that will give them the most money so you can sit on your ass and be a lazy mooch.

It's pathetic.



"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." -- Winston Churchill


"Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide." -- John Adams

... and with that statement, we don't need to hear any more bitching about The Constitution.

Enough said ...

patrickt
02-13-2013, 08:59 AM
The SOTU speech was completely predictable as is President Obama's plan for the destruction of the people and the country he hates.

GrassrootsConservative
02-13-2013, 09:00 AM
... and with that statement, we don't need to hear any more bitching about The Constitution.

Enough said ...


Contrary to what you think, the Constitution needs to be respected. I'm sorry you don't like America, the door is wide open if you want to leave.

Cigar
02-13-2013, 09:03 AM
The SOTU speech was completely predictable as is President Obama's plan for the destruction of the people and the country he hates.

You know what ... you're correct.

4 more years of Republican Obstruction
4 more years of Republican Partisanship
4 more years of Republican Childlike behavior

... that's why President Obama will move forward without their help.
... that's why Republicans are looking at the White House for the outside.

Have fun ... see you in the next Primaries. :thumbsup:

Cigar
02-13-2013, 09:05 AM
Contrary to what you think, the Constitution needs to be respected. I'm sorry you don't like America, the door is wide open if you want to leave.

Just because your party didn't win ... twice, doesn't mean the other party hates anything.

Your party just lost and fail to convince Voters that your ideas were better for the country.

Time to grow up or continue losing ... you're choice.

Chris
02-13-2013, 09:18 AM
Well then you have no credible opinion on the SOTU, because you chose to stick your fingers in your ears.

From you posts it doesn't strike me that you listened to it either.

Mainecoons
02-13-2013, 09:18 AM
Contrary to what you think, the Constitution needs to be respected. I'm sorry you don't like America, the door is wide open if you want to leave.

He loves America as he and his ilk have recreated it. Until they run out of funny money and the ObamaPhones go silent.

Chris
02-13-2013, 09:19 AM
They'd love to destroy it, to level it.

Chris
02-13-2013, 09:25 AM
Let's look at specifics of what Obama said then, cigar:


It is difficult to say with certainly which of the many whoppers President Obama told tonight took the most crust to utter, but my money is going on this assertion, made a few minutes into the speech: “Already, the Affordable Care Act is helping to slow the growth of health care costs.” I know “Orwellian” has now become rather hackneyed, but there is simply no other adjective that better describes this statement. It is not merely a lie. It is the precise opposite of the truth. It is just as absurd as “war is peace” or “freedom is slavery.”

...

Listening to Obama’s address on Tuesday night, I was reminded of something I read last week from Dietrich Bonhoeffer’s Letters and Papers from Prison. Bonhoeffer was, of course, a German theologian who lived during the Hitler era. Unlike today’s progressive poseurs, he spoke truth to power when it cost something. While sitting in a cell, awaiting death for that crime, he wrote: “For evil to appear disguised as light, charity, historical necessity, or social justice is quite bewildering to anyone brought up on our traditional ethical concepts.”
No, I’m not comparing Obama to Hitler. But I am saying that the never-ending stream of prevarication that emanates from the White House and its media toadies is indeed bewildering to anyone who tries to live honestly. And most of the propaganda is specifically designed to camouflage crimes against democracy like Obamacare. That abomination is not helping to slow the growth of health care costs. It is driving them through the roof. Obama lied yet again.

@ Obama’s Most Audacious SOTU Lie (http://spectator.org/archives/2013/02/13/obamas-most-audacious-sotu-lie)

Cigar
02-13-2013, 09:26 AM
Well I can see that this day is going to be like ...

So much for reasonable debate ...

Hope you boys stop crying sometime soon ...

:rollseyes:

Chris
02-13-2013, 09:33 AM
Well I can see that this day is going to be like ...

So much for reasonable debate ...

Hope you boys stop crying sometime soon ...

:rollseyes:

Right, Obama lies and you blame us. In a reasonable debate you would try to show he didn't lie. Apparently you can't.

Mainecoons
02-13-2013, 09:49 AM
You'll notice he attempts to distract from the point made:


But I am saying that the never-ending stream of prevarication that emanates from the White House and its media toadies is indeed bewildering to anyone who tries to live honestly. And most of the propaganda is specifically designed to camouflage crimes against democracy like Obamacare. That abomination is not helping to slow the growth of health care costs. It is driving them through the roof. Obama lied yet again.

Actually, it is quite fair and accurate to compare Obama and the shills around him to Hitler when it comes to constant, blatant and deliberate lying.

Cigar
02-13-2013, 12:04 PM
Right, Obama lies and you blame us. In a reasonable debate you would try to show he didn't lie. Apparently you can't.

Care to share anything specific ... ?

Or are you just going to scream ...

http://earthzebra.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/liar-liar-pants-on-fire.jpg?w=490

Chris
02-13-2013, 12:28 PM
Care to share anything specific ... ?

Or are you just going to scream ...



Already posted the lie, cigar. Post #17 above. So far you've said absolutely nothing to defend Obama other than to distract from his lie.

Cigar
02-13-2013, 12:31 PM
Already posted the lie, cigar. Post #17 above. So far you've said absolutely nothing to defend Obama other than to distract from his lie.

Considering it just went into law ... I'll withhold my opinion until if or when it impacts "me".

Carygrant
02-13-2013, 01:27 PM
To call a great speech that could positively transform a nation , predictable , is a strange use of language .
Polly has fairly summarised it elsewhere and the rather weak replies to it , and provided videos to support her presentation .
I think Extremist Republicans would be smart at this point to button their lips , as presently they only appear very bitter , small minded and in fact distinctly anti American .I suspect they are harming their tired and out dated party even further with the man in the street -- future voters .

Chris
02-13-2013, 01:30 PM
To call a great speech that could positively transform a nation , predictable , is a strange use of language .
Polly has fairly summarised it elsewhere and the rather weak replies to it , and provided videos to support her presentation .
I think Extremist Republicans would be smart at this point to button their lips , as presently they only appear very bitter , small minded and in fact distinctly anti American .I suspect they are harming their tired and out dated party even further with the man in the street -- future voters .

No one in this thread so far is a Republican. You got the rest wrong as well.

Captain Obvious
02-13-2013, 05:00 PM
I didn't watch it nor did I read any of the follow-up articles. It's all hogwash.

I understand the focus is on strengthening the middle class. Ironically, the Obama administration's policies are designed to cripple the middle class.

Getting caught up in the SOTU circus act is a waste of time.

Carygrant
02-14-2013, 01:56 AM
No one in this thread so far is a Republican. You got the rest wrong as well.


What makes you think that I do not appreciate how many here live in a dream land ?
You are the most clear cut example of an Extremist Republican imaginable . The fact that you cannot see it or even entertain the idea is totally predictable .

zelmo1234
02-14-2013, 02:55 AM
First of all your topic is devoid of specifics and is just bitching as usual.

Second, we've already determined that trickle down fails and history has proven beyond a doubt that as strong middle class make this country work better. Now if you want to discuss this, fine or would your rather just name call?

I am looking at the President's that used Trickle Reagan, Bush@ and Clinton. See link below, we have a pretty darn good economy. 2005 and 2006 were snoking hot, and if it was not for the Democratic policies of forcing banks to make mortgages to people that would not be able to pay the loans back it is highly likely we would still have a robust economy. But when GWB tried to change it he was a racist!

http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2008/03/tax-cuts-not-the-clinton-tax-hike-produced-the-1990s-boom

http://townhall.com/columnists/donaldlambro/2010/10/26/clinton,_bush_prove_cutting_capital_gains_rate_wor ks/page/full/

zelmo1234
02-14-2013, 03:11 AM
Care to share anything specific ... ?

Or are you just going to scream ...

http://earthzebra.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/liar-liar-pants-on-fire.jpg?w=490

Yes because Democrats would neve accuse a President of lying? Right?

http://www.cafepress.com/irregulargoods.6316654

zelmo1234
02-14-2013, 03:13 AM
What makes you think that I do not appreciate how many here live in a dream land ?
You are the most clear cut example of an Extremist Republican imaginable . The fact that you cannot see it or even entertain the idea is totally predictable .

Much like the fact atha you can't see that you are a waste of air?

Alif Qadr
02-14-2013, 06:03 AM
Yes because Democrats would neve accuse a President of lying? Right?

http://www.cafepress.com/irregulargoods.6316654

Accurate statement from Rep. Joe Wilson in regards to President Barack Hussein Obama, the Marxist-n-Thief: "YOU LIE!"

Chris
02-14-2013, 06:10 AM
What makes you think that I do not appreciate how many here live in a dream land ?
You are the most clear cut example of an Extremist Republican imaginable . The fact that you cannot see it or even entertain the idea is totally predictable .

And there you go making things up again. Are you wholly incapable of distinguishing your imagination from reality?

Cigar
02-14-2013, 09:10 AM
Accurate statement from Rep. Joe Wilson in regards to President Barack Hussein Obama, the Marxist-n-Thief: "YOU LIE!"


Speaking of Lies ... there's none bigger in the History of The United States of America

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/3036750/

http://media3.s-nbcnews.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Video/130207/x_30_promo_hubris2_130207.grid-3x2.jpg

I'm going to kick his sorry motherfucking ass all over the Mideast.

-President George W. Bush

A total of 4,486 U.S. soldiers were killed in Iraq between 2003 and 2012

Chris
02-14-2013, 09:30 AM
So what you're saying, cigar, is, because you think Bush lied, it's OK for Obama to lie?

Cigar
02-14-2013, 09:47 AM
So what you're saying, cigar, is, because you think Bush lied, it's OK for Obama to lie?



Nope ... just putting things into their proper perspective

Chris
02-14-2013, 09:59 AM
Nope ... just putting things into their proper perspective

Obama is a liar and you think Bush was, I understand.

Cigar
02-14-2013, 09:59 AM
The Real Obama

Is this the real Barack Obama? I hope so. I like this one.

The president used Tuesday’s State of the Union address to detail a vision of America’s future, and his second term, in which the country is not in perpetual war, government plays an expansive role, Congressional obstruction is named and shamed and he is bold and unapologetically progressive.



The speech was a full-throated rebuke and disavowal of the conservative argument that government must shrink and cower. It was a rebuke of the economic theory that a government’s role in revival is to retreat and lift regulations. It was an embrace of the country’s growth and diversity and an elevation of those down on their luck. And it was a bring-it-on gesture to the gun lobby...He aimed much of the speech at a still-struggling middle class, but it was also an open appeal to the poor — those with jobs and without.

He proposed an increase in the federal minimum wage — from $7.25 an hour to $9 — and to “tie the minimum wage to the cost of living, so that it finally becomes a wage you can live on.”

And in what I thought was commendable for a president who has taken some knocks — including from me — for not focusing enough on the poor, he said:


“Tonight, let’s also recognize that there are communities in this country where no matter how hard you work, it is virtually impossible to get ahead. Factory towns decimated from years of plants packing up. Inescapable pockets of poverty, urban and rural, where young adults are still fighting for their first job. America is not a place where chance of birth or circumstance should decide our destiny. And that is why we need to build new ladders of opportunity into the middle class for all who are willing to climb them.”


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/14/opinion/blow-the-real-obama.html

:f_applause::f_applause::f_applause::f_applause::f _applause:

Cigar
02-14-2013, 10:09 AM
Obama is a liar and you think Bush was, I understand.


Well there's Astronauts .... and then there's Astronauts

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2010/5/17/1274113078256/Buzz-Lightyear-001.jpg
http://californiaexaminer.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/number_astronauts_decreasing_rapidly_nasa.jpg

Chris
02-14-2013, 10:15 AM
The Real Obama

Is this the real Barack Obama? I hope so. I like this one.

The president used Tuesday’s State of the Union address to detail a vision of America’s future, and his second term, in which the country is not in perpetual war, government plays an expansive role, Congressional obstruction is named and shamed and he is bold and unapologetically progressive.



The speech was a full-throated rebuke and disavowal of the conservative argument that government must shrink and cower. It was a rebuke of the economic theory that a government’s role in revival is to retreat and lift regulations. It was an embrace of the country’s growth and diversity and an elevation of those down on their luck. And it was a bring-it-on gesture to the gun lobby...He aimed much of the speech at a still-struggling middle class, but it was also an open appeal to the poor — those with jobs and without.

He proposed an increase in the federal minimum wage — from $7.25 an hour to $9 — and to “tie the minimum wage to the cost of living, so that it finally becomes a wage you can live on.”

And in what I thought was commendable for a president who has taken some knocks — including from me — for not focusing enough on the poor, he said:


“Tonight, let’s also recognize that there are communities in this country where no matter how hard you work, it is virtually impossible to get ahead. Factory towns decimated from years of plants packing up. Inescapable pockets of poverty, urban and rural, where young adults are still fighting for their first job. America is not a place where chance of birth or circumstance should decide our destiny. And that is why we need to build new ladders of opportunity into the middle class for all who are willing to climb them.”


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/14/opinion/blow-the-real-obama.html

:f_applause::f_applause::f_applause::f_applause::f _applause:

All hail the Socialist in Chief!!

Socialism has such a winning track record!

Cigar
02-14-2013, 10:20 AM
All hail the Socialist in Chief!!

Socialism has such a winning track record!


Time to get on board or get left behind, because this train is never coming back.

Chris
02-14-2013, 10:25 AM
Time to get on board or get left behind, because this train is never coming back.

You sound like Casey Jones roaring down the track to a train wreck. Pass me by, pass me by.

Cigar
02-14-2013, 10:27 AM
You sound like Casey Jones roaring down the track to a train wreck. Pass me by, pass me by.



At the rate the GOP is going, we may never see another Republican in The White House in our lifetime.

Chris
02-14-2013, 10:30 AM
At the rate the GOP is going, we may never see another Republican in The White House in our lifetime.

Beside the point, cigar, at the rate the country is going we'll be flat broke before long--that's the train wreck, and it's bipartisan.

nic34
02-14-2013, 10:33 AM
We're not going broke chris...

http://werenotbrokemovie.com/

Chris
02-14-2013, 10:38 AM
We're not going broke chris...

http://werenotbrokemovie.com/


WE’RE NOT BROKE tells the story of U.S. corporations dodging billions of dollars in income tax, and how seven fed-up Americans take their frustration to the streets…and vow to make the corporations pay their fair share.

And that says we're not going broke how?

http://i.snag.gy/2teqF.jpg

birddog
02-14-2013, 11:58 AM
Whatever the reasoning, Obama is a lying, unpatriotic scumbucket, and anyone supporting him and his policies is not much better!

nic34
02-14-2013, 11:59 AM
You need to view the movie. Not everyone's cup of "tea" but it does bring to light some indisputable facts about how much multinationals like Exxon, Google and Bank of America pay in federal income taxes each year: nothing. Google, Oracle, Cisco, Microsoft, Adobe, Pfizer and Duke Energy have stashed a combined trillion dollars offshore in low-taxing countries, and want a special tax deal from the U.S. government before they'll bring the money back.

One thing you are right about, we are not a democracy..... we are a Corporatocracy.

Cigar
02-14-2013, 12:00 PM
Whatever the reasoning, Obama is a lying, unpatriotic scumbucket, and anyone supporting him and his policies is not much better!

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Imhgcz8jn10/Swp6HLubrVI/AAAAAAAAAWY/NCjL1gA-weQ/s1600/Cry_Baby_by_buttonnose.jpg

Chris
02-14-2013, 12:02 PM
Aw, cigar, don't cry now, there, there. How about a sucker?

birddog
02-14-2013, 12:05 PM
Aw, cigar, don't cry now, there, there. How about a sucker?

He's got Obama. He sucks, probably in more ways than one. Just ask the guys at the Chicago bathhouse. :wink:

Chris
02-14-2013, 12:07 PM
You need to view the movie. Not everyone's cup of "tea" but it does bring to light some indisputable facts about how much multinationals like Exxon, Google and Bank of America pay in federal income taxes each year: nothing. Google, Oracle, Cisco, Microsoft, Adobe, Pfizer and Duke Energy have stashed a combined trillion dollars offshore in low-taxing countries, and want a special tax deal from the U.S. government before they'll bring the money back.

One thing you are right about, we are not a democracy..... we are a Corporatocracy.

"Corporatocracy is a term used to suggest an economic and political system controlled by corporations or corporate interests." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatocracy

I'd accept that, though the more proper term, economically, I think, is corporatism.

"Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini -- from Corporatocracy, Corporatism, Fascism (http://rense.com/general62/corporatocracy.htm).

Or the even older term, mercantilism.


The question is how did this happen? Is it the greed for wealth of big business or the greed for power of the government? A combination, but which is the sufficient cause and which the necessary?

Mister D
02-14-2013, 12:14 PM
I'm not sure Musslini meant it that way. Labor, for example, would be a corporate entity. Business owners another. I think this refers to social groups which would make sense because that jives with the original meaning of corporatism. Medieval society was a corporate society, for example.

Chris
02-14-2013, 12:18 PM
Right, not exactly the same. Labor unions have lost much power but are still a strong lobbying force. Gun lobby. So many other lobbies representing social groups. All seek political means to attain what they want. Big business is not alone.

Mainecoons
02-14-2013, 03:15 PM
You need to view the movie. Not everyone's cup of "tea" but it does bring to light some indisputable facts about how much multinationals like Exxon, Google and Bank of America pay in federal income taxes each year: nothing. Google, Oracle, Cisco, Microsoft, Adobe, Pfizer and Duke Energy have stashed a combined trillion dollars offshore in low-taxing countries, and want a special tax deal from the U.S. government before they'll bring the money back.

One thing you are right about, we are not a democracy..... we are a Corporatocracy.

Hey genius, I see you still haven't figured out WHO ACTUALLY PAYS BUSINESS TAXES.

It's the customer, stupid.

nic34
02-14-2013, 03:30 PM
That's right, so where's the JOBS BILLS, Mr. Boehner.....?

Chris
02-14-2013, 05:36 PM
Government doesn't create jobs, nic.

Mainecoons
02-14-2013, 06:34 PM
Sure they do. They print money and they hire people with it to harass and get the people with real jobs moved to the unemployment lines and onto food stamps.

That the new Obama Jobs Plan.

Chris
02-14-2013, 06:39 PM
OK, jobs that generate wealth.

Mainecoons
02-14-2013, 06:43 PM
I'd say that today's Federal parasites have generated quite a lot of wealth for themselves.

Keep trying.

:rofl:

Chris
02-14-2013, 08:58 PM
Sure, they may enrich themselves, but it's at others'--our expense. No wealth generated. There is no multiplier effect.