Rand Paul bringing his message to Howard University

[Mister D]

Does Rand Paul "deserve credit for trying"? I'm curious as to what the libertarians think.

____

On Wednesday morning, the conservative Kentucky Republican and tea party favorite will take his message of freedom and economic opportunity to the campus of Howard University in Washington. This will be Paul’s first visit to a historically black college or university, the senator told me in an interview today.

Paul said he wanted to get the ball rolling on a conversation that the GOP needs to have with African Americans. He said he also is “looking forward to hearing” from the audience as well.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2013/04/08/rand-paul-bringing-his-message-to-howard-university/

[Mister D]

Howard is historically black.

[Common]

Howard is historically black.


Yes and Rand Paul stammered and erred and was called on it by the students. Whatever he tried to accomplish not only didnt work, but made him look even worse.
Rand Paul is trying to garner votes from traditionally non republican voters, for himself and his ambitions of course.
Rand Paul didnt break new ground here many republicans in the past addressed all black audiences and more hostile than this student body which wasnt at all hostile towards Paul he amused them

[Chris]

From article: "As his party dithers, Rand Paul deserves credit for trying."

Seems to me a typically partisan Democrat/liberal view of Republicans.

As a libertarian that about sums it up, partisanship on the part of the author.

[Chris]

Yes and Rand Paul stammered and erred and was called on it by the students. Whatever he tried to accomplish not only didnt work, but made him look even worse.
Rand Paul is trying to garner votes from traditionally non republican voters, for himself and his ambitions of course.
Rand Paul didnt break new ground here many republicans in the past addressed all black audiences and more hostile than this student body which wasnt at all hostile towards Paul he amused them

Here's some opf what he said:


"The Democrats promised equalizing outcomes through unlimited federal assistance while Republicans offered something that seemed less tangible-the promise of equalizing opportunity through free markets," Paul said. "Now Republicans face a daunting task. Several generations of black voters have never voted Republican and are not very open to even considering the option."

"The Democrat promise is tangible and puts food on the table, but too often doesn't lead to jobs or meaningful success," he continued, adding later, "I would argue that the objective evidence shows that big government is not a friend to African Americans."

@ 'Big Government Is Not A Friend To African Americans' (http://www.businessinsider.com/rand-paul-howard-black-voters-2013-4#ixzz2Q7l7f6yR)

Do you think big government is a friend to anyone?

[Common]

Chris its blatantly clear to all that Rand Paul is trying to get votes and nothing else, there lies the problem. When you reach out if to whom your trying to woo knows fully your intentions are self serving, then you get what Paul got at Howard. He would deserve credit if he was reaching out to genuinely mend bridges.

[Chris]

Chris its blatantly clear to all that Rand Paul is trying to get votes and nothing else, there lies the problem. When you reach out if to whom your trying to woo knows fully your intentions are self serving, then you get what Paul got at Howard. He would deserve credit if he was reaching out to genuinely mend bridges.

Getting votes is what all politicians do, common.

So no comment on what he said just an attack on him?

[Common]

Getting votes is what all politicians do, common.

So no comment on what he said just an attack on him?

Wasnt intended as an attack on him just a reflection of what hes doing. I read the article it doesnt appear to me he broke any new ground. He stumbled a few times and what he stumbled on did make him appear a bit disengenuous. I mean heres a guy coming to impress he should have been better prepared.

[zelmo1234]

Well I see that they are really trying to say that he does not support the civil rights movement! (racist)

But he is right it is a tuff sell to people that hear we have free stuff for you, to tell them that they don't want it because if you work hard under our system you can be so much better off!

When you have decades of democrats doing everything that they can to keep the black community suppressed and dependend to secure their voting base! that is a tough nut to crack!

[jillian]

Does Rand Paul "deserve credit for trying"? I'm curious as to what the libertarians think.

____

On Wednesday morning, the conservative Kentucky Republican and tea party favorite will take his message of freedom and economic opportunity to the campus of Howard University in Washington. This will be Paul’s first visit to a historically black college or university, the senator told me in an interview today.

Paul said he wanted to get the ball rolling on a conversation that the GOP needs to have with African Americans. He said he also is “looking forward to hearing” from the audience as well.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2013/04/08/rand-paul-bringing-his-message-to-howard-university/


rand paul isn't a "libertarian".

here's a hint. if you believe government should interfere in a woman's reproductive rights, you aren't a libertarian either.

[Ravi]

He really put his foot in his mouth condescending to his black audience. Republicans, gotta love them.

[Alif Qadr]

An excerpt from the article.

Overall, however, the event went surprising well, with several audience members conceding that they appreciated Paul's effort, even if they didn't agree with his message. And that was really what Paul had set out to do.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/rand-paul-howard-black-voters-2013-4#ixzz2Q9MpuLXd



Part of the problem is listening and not assuming. If the student body was well-versed in the political history of this nation, they would know that the Democrats have done very little in the way of progress among Black folks, especially in recent decades. For people who are independently minded, it is self-evident that the DNC and the Democratic politicians are not advocates of such things as freedom, justice, equality and independence in the real and true definitions of the words. Welfare, Affirmative Action, Section Eight Housing, Public Housing and other government programs have not made inroads towards these ends nor are they assigned to do as much. To make it clear and plain, without economic independence which is based in land ownership, there is no freedom, justice nor equality. Being a dependent on other people is not being equal nor does it express freedom, independence and neither will you experience justice through it (dependency on others) as well.
It is time for people to mature in thinking, stand up and be men and women, if they seek to be respected by others. "Likability" has nothing to do with economics nor independence., it is one of the ties that bind as well as blind.

[Cigar]

It was truly inspirational to see and hear, yet another White Person's opinions and expertise on Black People.

It should do wonders for the Republican Party, and I'm just dieing to see the results in 2016 :biglaugh:

By all means .... please please please please ... keep doing what you're doing and don't ever change. :yo:

[jillian]

He really put his foot in his mouth condescending to his black audience. Republicans, gotta love them.

the funny part is they don't realize how bad they sound.

[Cigar]

the funny part is they don't realize how bad they sound.


... and I hope they never do realize. :laugh:

[jillian]

... and I hope they never do realize. :laugh:

i think some do.

then the nutters call them RINO's when they speak out.

[Cigar]

i think some do.

then the nutters call them RINO's when they speak out.

I'm one of the few Black Americans who stands up and cheer each every time some ignorant politician insults Black Americans, because I know they're own words will keep them from the White House.

[jillian]

I'm one of the few Black Americans who stands up and cheer each every time some ignorant politician insults Black Americans, because I know they're own words will keep them from the White House.

but if they weren't locked in the 1950's, you wouldn't be as troubled if they got the white house. the funny thing is, if they actually had any understanding of the black community, they'd understand that blacks are, generally, very socially conservative... especially the black baptists. they like school vouchers. they aren't offended by churches having a prominent political role. the right could take a huge portion of the black vote if they stopped the nonsense.

[Cigar]

but if they weren't locked in the 1950's, you wouldn't be as troubled if they got the white house. the funny thing is, if they actually had any understanding of the black community, they'd understand that blacks are, generally, very socially conservative... especially the black baptists. they like school vouchers. they aren't offended by churches having a prominent political role. the right could take a huge portion of the black vote if they stopped the nonsense.

They are getting all their knowledge from people like Sarah Palin and Mr. "X" :)

Brilliant :laugh:

[Mister D]

rand paul isn't a "libertarian".

here's a hint. if you believe government should interfere in a woman's reproductive rights, you aren't a libertarian either.

I'm not a libertarian, sweetie pie, and much of the population would obviously argue that the rights of the unborn are being violatd. In any case, it's off topic.

[Mister D]

He really put his foot in his mouth condescending to his black audience. Republicans, gotta love them.

Did he say they were gonna put y'all back in chains mmmm yessuh. Black audiences seem to take that in stride when a democrat does it. :smiley:

[Chris]

Well I see that they are really trying to say that he does not support the civil rights movement! (racist)

But he is right it is a tuff sell to people that hear we have free stuff for you, to tell them that they don't want it because if you work hard under our system you can be so much better off!

When you have decades of democrats doing everything that they can to keep the black community suppressed and dependend to secure their voting base! that is a tough nut to crack!

Exactly. It's not like he was pandering.

[Chris]

rand paul isn't a "libertarian".

here's a hint. if you believe government should interfere in a woman's reproductive rights, you aren't a libertarian either.

Define libertarian. I'm libertarian and accept the unborn's right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

[Chris]

He really put his foot in his mouth condescending to his black audience. Republicans, gotta love them.

In what way? Explain both comments.

[Mister D]

but if they weren't locked in the 1950's, you wouldn't be as troubled if they got the white house. the funny thing is, if they actually had any understanding of the black community, they'd understand that blacks are, generally, very socially conservative... especially the black baptists. they like school vouchers. they aren't offended by churches having a prominent political role. the right could take a huge portion of the black vote if they stopped the nonsense.

Black Churches continue to have a political role principally because white liberals, like you, don't call them on it. Anyway, no, blacks aren't as socially conservative as you might believe. No population with a 70% illegitimacy rate and a disproportionate share of abortions possibly could be.

[Chris]

It was truly inspirational to see and hear, yet another White Person's opinions and expertise on Black People.

It should do wonders for the Republican Party, and I'm just dieing to see the results in 2016 :biglaugh:

By all means .... please please please please ... keep doing what you're doing and don't ever change. :yo:

What I saw of his speech commented on the DNC not blacks.

[Cigar]

The White House Service Entrance ... get use to it. :)

http://redcarpetconciergeofchicago.com/images/Entrance_to_West_Wing_Event1.JPG

[Mister D]

The White House Service Entrance ... get use to it. :)

http://redcarpetconciergeofchicago.com/images/Entrance_to_West_Wing_Event1.JPG

Another nonsensical comment from the golf caddy.

[Cigar]

Keep working on the Branding thang :)

[Chris]

Keep working on the Branding thang :)

Did you even listen to the speech? Do you have a comment on that? Or should we settle for standard partisan talking points?

[Cigar]

Did you even listen to the speech? Do you have a comment on that? Or should we settle for standard partisan talking points?

Oh ... so now the standard partition talking points bothers you, what century did that start?

[Chris]

Oh ... so now the standard partition talking points bothers you, what century did that start?

Last century.

My point is you seem to have a lot to say but nothing about what he actually said. I'd be interested in what he said bothered you. Of course you can freely continue to off-topic attack Republicans.

[Alif Qadr]

I'm one of the few Black Americans who stands up and cheer each every time some ignorant politician insults Black Americans, because I know they're own words will keep them from the White House.

You mean like when Joseph Biden said that Obama is clean and articulate? Do you also laugh when certain Negro politicians scared the Hell out of some Black folks when they tell them, "republicans are going to cut YOUR food stamps, welfare and other government programs"? That in and of itself is insulting, but little do people like you take offense to such flabbergasting foolishness. By resigning to such thoughts, you are in fact stating that Black people are content with dependency on government aid and refuse to attempt to work together and build industries like other people.
By you and your Liberal friends approach to Black folks, you both say that we, Black people are inferior, lazy, shiftless, worthless, etc. That is the same as Klan members, Neo-Nazis and the like saying that we are nothing more than mud-people and that we were content and docile while being chattel slaves. You all are going to have to make up your minds, either you are worth more than the mediocre position that most of us find ourselves in, or we are a people who will rise to the challenges that we face and overcome them.
It is time to make the decision either way. Either we are going to remain the tail, or we are going to become the head of our affairs and become more than just doorstops.
To mock Rand Paul for his attempts to address long standing problems only shows that you and those like you are comfortable at being the tail and it is shameful.
At least Rand is attempting to establish meaningful dialogue with us and not approaching us as though we are children who need to be coddled and pampered, unlike people such as those who continually support programs and agendas that have nothing but cause rapid deterioration, amorality, immorality, crime and other ills that are taking us under, and everyone else along with us. How long are you going to need "training wheels", a "walker", a "bib", a "pacifier" and "diapers" before you have outgrown them?

Why is it that None of the Democrats, be they Black or Caucasian have decided to deal with Black folks in manners that are suitable for people seeking independence, economically and otherwise? I do not read any posts of your nor any other Liberal/Progressive addressing any of the important issues or freedom, justice, equality and independence. Instead, all I read are posts ridiculing people such as Rand Paul who are seeking to approach the multiple problems that Black folks face with solutions, other than government handouts, that everyone has to pay for.

[nic34]

Maddow to Rand Paul: You’re lying to our faces and we know it

Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY)’s contention during a speech at historically African-American Howard University that he has “never wavered” in his support of Civil Rights and of the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

Except he said in an interview:

“Would you have voted for the Civil Rights act of 1964?” she finally asked him, to which Paul replied that he would have been completely in favor of the integration of public places, but not so much for private businesses.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/04/11/maddow-to-rand-paul-youre-lying-to-our-faces-and-we-know-it/

No wonder he was jeered, the students at Howard weren't as ignorant as he assumed....

[Chris]

Maddow to Rand Paul: You’re lying to our faces and we know it

Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY)’s contention during a speech at historically African-American Howard University that he has “never wavered” in his support of Civil Rights and of the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

Except he said in an interview:

“Would you have voted for the Civil Rights act of 1964?” she finally asked him, to which Paul replied that he would have been completely in favor of the integration of public places, but not so much for private businesses.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/04/11/maddow-to-rand-paul-youre-lying-to-our-faces-and-we-know-it/

No wonder he was jeered, the students at Howard weren't as ignorant as he assumed....

Maddow sounds like truthmatters, everything she distorts and then disagrees with is a lie!

Rand has always held that position. He abhors discrimination. He agrees government should be restricted to treating all equal before the law. He disagrees that government can dictate that to private citizens, consistent with the Bill of Rights.

Why do some buy Maddow's spin?

[KC]

Rand Paul is an adult in a city dominated by children.

To answer the question in the OP yes, I give him credit, even if it was totally futile.

[Mister D]

Rand Paul is an adult in a city dominated by children.

To answer the question in the OP yes, I give him credit, even if it was totally futile.

I somewhat agree with Common. I'm not sure why conservatives and libertarians subject themselves to that.

[nic34]

Maddow sounds like truthmatters, everything she distorts and then disagrees with is a lie!

Rand has always held that position. He abhors discrimination. He agrees government should be restricted to treating all equal before the law. He disagrees that government can dictate that to private citizens, consistent with the Bill of Rights.

Why do some buy Maddow's spin?

What spin? Attacking the messenger is ok now?

He lied at Howard by saying he “never wavered” in his support of Civil Rights and of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, but didn't mention the not so much for private businesses part.

If you want the video of him saying that, just say so.

[Chris]

What spin? Attacking the messenger is ok now?

He lied at Howard by saying he “never wavered” in his support of Civil Rights and of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, but didn't mention the not so much for private businesses part.

If you want the video of him saying that, just say so.

Spin is a comment on what Maddow said, nic. He didn't lie at all. I have the video, thank you. Government is not empowered to dictate to private citizens on such matters. Why do you avoid discussion of that point?

[Chris]

Rand Paul is an adult in a city dominated by children.

To answer the question in the OP yes, I give him credit, even if it was totally futile.

I don't see it as futile, why would partisan Dems be making such a big deal of it, attacking his person, if he hadn't succeeded in delivering his message?

[Mainecoons]

Does Rand Paul "deserve credit for trying"? I'm curious as to what the libertarians think.

____

On Wednesday morning, the conservative Kentucky Republican and tea party favorite will take his message of freedom and economic opportunity to the campus of Howard University in Washington. This will be Paul’s first visit to a historically black college or university, the senator told me in an interview today.

Paul said he wanted to get the ball rolling on a conversation that the GOP needs to have with African Americans. He said he also is “looking forward to hearing” from the audience as well.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2013/04/08/rand-paul-bringing-his-message-to-howard-university/


Let's face it, the average black just wants to know what handouts or reverse discrimination he can get from the government. That's Lyndon Johnson's legacy.

[nic34]

Spin is a comment on what Maddow said, nic. He didn't lie at all. I have the video, thank you. Government is not empowered to dictate to private citizens on such matters. Why do you avoid discussion of that point?

I know his position. But he lied about it at Howard. Why do you avoid that?

Here's another source:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/rand-pauls-rewriting-of-his-own-remarks-on-the-civil-rights-act/2013/04/10/5b8d91c4-a235-11e2-82bc-511538ae90a4_blog.html

[Greenridgeman]

Let's face it, the average black just wants to know what handouts or reverse discrimination he can get from the government. That's Lyndon Johnson's legacy.


The average white guy is catching on to how to ride the gravy train too; this welfare state is "beyond race".

[Chris]

I know his position. But he lied about it at Howard. Why do you avoid that?

Here's another source:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/rand-pauls-rewriting-of-his-own-remarks-on-the-civil-rights-act/2013/04/10/5b8d91c4-a235-11e2-82bc-511538ae90a4_blog.html

If you accuse him of lying then you do not know his position.

[KC]

I somewhat agree with Common. I'm not sure why conservatives and libertarians subject themselves to that.

I think things like this, though futile and not likely to win any votes, give cons/libertarians a defense against all the charges of racism from the left. It's political, for sure, but you can't knock him for trying.

[KC]

I don't see it as futile, why would partisan Dems be making such a big deal of it, attacking his person, if he hadn't succeeded in delivering his message?

Because they don't want to give him any ground. Republicans taking their message to all black audiences gives them a defense against charges of racism from the left.

[Chris]

Let's face it, the average black just wants to know what handouts or reverse discrimination he can get from the government. That's Lyndon Johnson's legacy.

Right, but who benefits, really, from the welfare state? I mean besides the state. Certainly not the poor, poverty has only increased since the War of Poverty, their more dependent on government than ever. The recipients of all the taxpayer money thrown at welfare checks, food stamps, medicaid, housing are the rich, all that taxpayer money goes to purchase their products and services, shore up their industries, create bubbles they're bailed out from. What better crony capitalist scheme could someone invent?

[Chris]

Because they don't want to give him any ground. Republicans taking their message to all black audiences gives them a defense against charges of racism from the left.

I doubt he takes seriously such bogus charges.

[KC]

Right, but who benefits, really, from the welfare state? I mean besides the state. Certainly not the poor, poverty has only increased since the War of Poverty, their more dependent on government than ever. The recipients of all the taxpayer money thrown at welfare checks, food stamps, medicaid, housing are the rich, all that taxpayer money goes to purchase their products and services, shore up their industries, create bubbles they're bailed out from. What better crony capitalist scheme could someone invent?

Some of the children of the poor benefit.

[KC]

I doubt he takes seriously such bogus charges.

No, but some voters do, and that's the important part, especially if Paul plans to run nationally. He has to look inclusive. That was Goldwater's mistake. He thought he could win based on his principles, which were sound, while isolating most minority voters. I hope Paul learns from this mistake, under-emphasizing these issues so he concentrate on broader issues where a majority of Americans favor liberty over crony capitalism.

[nic34]

Government is not empowered to dictate to private citizens on such matters.

Yes it is:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_of_Atlanta_Motel_v._United_States

[Chris]

Some of the children of the poor benefit.

Given the great amount of socioeconomic mobility in the US who's to say they rose because of the artificial welfare state or the natural free market--now we get into what Thatcher was about in her defense in Parliament against the false claims of liberals about an increasing income gap increasing poverty. Poppycock!

[nic34]

If you accuse him of lying then you do not know his position.

Which is it?

[KC]

Given the great amount of socioeconomic mobility in the US who's to say they rose because of the artificial welfare state or the natural free market--now we get into what Thatcher was about in her defense in Parliament against the false claims of liberals about an increasing income gap increasing poverty. Poppycock!

I mean as children. When parents use food stamps responsibly rather than selling them for pot (I know some that do), those children get to at least grow up being fed.

I don't think welfare helps anyone in the long run.

[Mister D]

Let's face it, the average black just wants to know what handouts or reverse discrimination he can get from the government. That's Lyndon Johnson's legacy.

Blacks are simply looking out for their perceived group interests which are obviously not those of white conservatives and libertarians. Sorry, just being frank about it.

[Chris]

Government is not empowered to dictate to private citizens on such matters.


Yes it is:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_of_Atlanta_Motel_v._United_States

SCOTUS is not the Constitution. Cite the Constitution. And no the commerce clause says nothing about this.

[Chris]

I mean as children. When parents use food stamps responsibly rather than selling them for pot (I know some that do), those children get to at least grow up being fed.

I don't think welfare helps anyone in the long run.

But keeping parents of welfare and getting them into jobs works much better. Welfare reform of the 1990s demonstrated that.

[Mister D]

I think things like this, though futile and not likely to win any votes, give cons/libertarians a defense against all the charges of racism from the left. It's political, for sure, but you can't knock him for trying.

Perhaps Rand and co. should stop dancing to the left's tune.

[KC]

But keeping parents of welfare and getting them into jobs works much better. Welfare reform of the 1990s demonstrated that.

Ideally yes. Think of it as economic profit vs. accounting profit, where getting off welfare and getting and earning an honest living represents economic profit, and receiving welfare represents a simple accounting profit. Receiving welfare is not the highest valued alternative (which would be earning a living that puts you above the poverty level), but it's still benefits them.

[KC]

Perhaps Rand and co. should stop dancing to the left's tune.

It would be nice, sure, but I prefer to have good policy outcomes even if it means dealing with our system's political realities.

[nic34]

SCOTUS is not the Constitution. Cite the Constitution. And no the commerce clause says nothing about this.

What are you talking about? When the SCOTUS rules on a constitutional issue, that judgment is final.

[KC]

What are you talking about? When the SCOTUS rules on a constitutional issue, that judgment is final.

Yes, even if they are wrong, which they often are.

[Chris]

Ideally yes. Think of it as economic profit vs. accounting profit, where getting off welfare and getting and earning an honest living represents economic profit, and receiving welfare represents a simple accounting profit. Receiving welfare is not the highest valued alternative (which would be earning a living that puts you above the poverty level), but it's still benefits them.

But it has no value, personal or economic. It feeds for a day, not a lifetime.

[KC]

But it has no value, personal or economic. It feeds for a day, not a lifetime.

Of course it doesn't feed for a lifetime, but from the perspective of the children, who are being fed, it has value. Children of welfare recipients after all don't have a higher valued alternative, they do not have the means of earning any income sufficient to feed themselves, and society expects them not to.

[Greenridgeman]

What are you talking about? When the SCOTUS rules on a constitutional issue, that judgment is final.


That is not true at all.

Court rulings can be overturned and have been.

[Chris]

What are you talking about? When the SCOTUS rules on a constitutional issue, that judgment is final.

ALways love it when political discussion of what ought to be is ended with it is what it is. The old naturalistic fallacy.

Nic, all SCOTUS does is set precedent.

[nic34]

ALways love it when political discussion of what ought to be is ended with it is what it is. The old naturalistic fallacy.

Nic, all SCOTUS does is set precedent.


Then what are you arguing? Or is it just more obfuscation....?

I merely cited for you the SCOTUS decision (which IS current law) in response to:

Government is not empowered to dictate to private citizens on such matters.

http://thepoliticalforums.com/threads/12232-Rand-Paul-bringing-his-message-to-Howard-University?p=265972&viewfull=1#post265972

Where it clearly says it can and does.

[Chris]

Then what are you arguing? Or is it just more obfuscation....?

I merely cited for you the SCOTUS decision (which IS current law) in response to:

Government is not empowered to dictate to private citizens on such matters.

http://thepoliticalforums.com/threads/12232-Rand-Paul-bringing-his-message-to-Howard-University?p=265972&viewfull=1#post265972

Where it clearly says it can and does.

What I'm arguing is very simple and clear, the Constitution does not empower government to control private business in this way. That, btw, is also Paul's argument.

Now someone like Maddow may opinion she disagrees, but that's what we call a disagreement, not a lie.

And no SCOTUS decision set precedent. Nor that SCOTUS opinion and disagreement imply Rand is lying.

[nic34]

Ooohhhh, a disagreement.... OK.... whatever you say.

And the 1964 Civil Rights Act is just so much fairy dust, because I "disagree".....

Sure.

[Chris]

Ooohhhh, a disagreement.... OK.... whatever you say.

And the 1964 Civil Rights Act is just so much fairy dust, because I "disagree".....

Sure.

No need to misrepresent what Paul or I said, nic. Both of us a for it as it applies publicly to government action, all men are created equal before the law.

And the point about disagreement, nic, and you surely can understand, is disagreement is not a lie.

[Kalkin]

the funny part is they don't realize how bad they sound.
The truth always sounds bad to liberals.

[Kalkin]

That is not true at all.

Court rulings can be overturned and have been.
I'll drink to that.

[Chris]

I'll drink to that.

Oh, yea, the twenty-first amendment!

[Alif Qadr]

Rand Paul is an adult in a city dominated by children.

To answer the question in the OP yes, I give him credit, even if it was totally futile.

An emphatically truthful statement.
Believe it or not, I too agree with Rand's view on so-called Civil Rights. Once government crosses the line and starts to dictate who businesses can cater to, said businesses have lost their freedom of choice.

[Alif Qadr]

The truth always sounds bad to liberals.

If a person or a group of people stand in opposition to truth, no matter how "painful" or "hurtful" it is, than what and who are said persons?
There is none who stands in opposition to truth but liars, deceivers and wicked people; mujrimun.

[Alif Qadr]

ALways love it when political discussion of what ought to be is ended with it is what it is. The old naturalistic fallacy.

Nic, all SCOTUS does is set precedent.
All the SCOTUS does is issue opinions that only have validity within the court systems of the United States and the several states that constitute said entity or union. Outside of that, the SCOTUS OPINIONS are just that, O-P-I-N-I-O-N-S.
All courts within the United States and the several states that she is comprised of, are forbidden to write laws that are legislatively binding from the bench. This is why there are supposed to be three branches of government within the United States and the several states that she is comprised of. It is called or referred to as "The balance of power", for those who ignored what was taught in U.S. Government class in high school and college.

[Kalkin]

All the SCOTUS does is issue opinions that only have validity within the court systems of the United States and the several states that constitute said entity or union. Outside of that, the SCOTUS OPINIONS are just that, O-P-I-N-I-O-N-S.
Indeed. If it weren't so, why all the fuss over who gets nominated and confirmed?

[truthmatters]

the soctus is the final arbitor of what the constitution says in this nation.

If you do not like how this nation is governed then you can leave

[Mister D]

the soctus is the final arbitor of what the constitution says in this nation.

If you do not like how this nation is governed then you can leave

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dred_Scott_v._Sanford

:laugh: :afro:

[nic34]

The point I made still stands.

Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY)’s contention during a speech at historically African-American Howard University that he has “never wavered” in his support of Civil Rights and of the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

Except he said in an interview:

“Would you have voted for the Civil Rights act of 1964?” to which Paul replied that he would have been completely in favor of the integration of public places, but not so much for private businesses.

[truthmatters]

they dont have any message that isnt about trashing people for not being rich

[Chris]

The point I made still stands.

Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY)’s contention during a speech at historically African-American Howard University that he has “never wavered” in his support of Civil Rights and of the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

Except he said in an interview:

“Would you have voted for the Civil Rights act of 1964?” to which Paul replied that he would have been completely in favor of the integration of public places, but not so much for private businesses.





Which is no point at all, he's saying the same thing there as he had previously, drawing a distinction between public and private reach of government.

[truthmatters]

anyone who says the scotus does not set legal presidence in this country is a lair

[Mister D]

Rand is obviously referring to the spirit of the law when he said he has never wavered in his support of Civil Rights.

[nic34]

It's called revising your message for the audience.... please grow up folks.....

[Mister D]

It's called revising your message for the audience.... please grow up folks.....

What was the revision?

[truthmatters]

rand paul is a clown and will be a laughing stock just like palin

[truthmatters]

ran paul is the latest republican clown car dirver

[Chris]

anyone who says the scotus does not set legal presidence in this country is a lair

That's what people are saying, matters. Stop poisoning the well.

[Mainecoons]

A "lair"?

:rofl:

[Kalkin]

A "dirver"?

Someone is losing it over Rand Paul, apparently.

[Private Pickle]

A "lair"?

:rofl:

Yeah man! And there are dragons in it that consume the poor with fire! And that dragon is on a leash with Rand Paul holding the reigns and laughing maniacally!

I totally saw it on MSNBC so I know it's trOOth!

[Chris]

And he drives a car, dammit.

[Chris]

At least, matters, those who comment in the video are articulate:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BzMIblb-oNE

[Peter1469]

Rand Paul does not believe in cradle to grave government programs to care for people, so the hard left hates him. It is that simple.

[Chris]

http://i.snag.gy/F6m2T.jpg

[nic34]

http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/wp-content/uploads/Ron-Paul.jpg

[Chris]

http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/wp-content/uploads/Ron-Paul.jpg

And Obamacare is an empty jar, just like his empty suit, or empty chair.

[Kalkin]

http://www.tikkun.org/tikkundaily/wp-content/uploads/Ron-Paul.jpg
2338

[Alif Qadr]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dred_Scott_v._Sanford

:laugh: :afro:

OUCH!!! LOL Mister D:rofl:

[Alif Qadr]

A "dirver"?

Someone is losing it over Rand Paul, apparently.

apparently so. . .

[Alif Qadr]

Rand Paul does not believe in cradle to grave government programs to care for people, so the hard left hates him. It is that simple.

You hit the nail squarely on its head, Peter. Those who believe in and support foolishness are just lazy.

[Alif Qadr]

Yeah man! And there are dragons in it that consume the poor with fire! And that dragon is on a leash with Rand Paul holding the reigns and laughing maniacally!

I totally saw it on MSNBC so I know it's trOOth!

Don't you mean TROOF! :rofl: :rofl:

[Common]

Rand Paul does not believe in cradle to grave government programs to care for people, so the hard left hates him. It is that simple.

Its not only that, if Rand Paul wasnt born a privledged kid with a gold spoon sticking out of his arse then he would have more credibility first of all, second Rand Paul like his father has a couple of great ideas and many INSANE ideas for example legalize ALL DRUGS, not just weed ALL OF THEM the govt should be out of drug enforcement and you have a right to have these drugs and govt doesnt have the right to tell you that you cant.
Rand takes anti govt to the very extreme and he alienates not only the left but just as many in the right.
Dont just accuse the Left of criticizing rand paul the right is just as vocal about it.

I disregard people who have always been of privledge and never had a bad day or a worry in their lives trying to tell america that its the poor thats whats wrong with the country because of entitlements.
Whats really wrong with the country is the rich and powerful have run it into the ground.

[hanger4]

Its not only that, if Rand Paul wasnt born a privledged kid with a gold spoon sticking out of his arse then he would have more credibility first of all, second Rand Paul like his father has a couple of great ideas and many INSANE ideas for example legalize ALL DRUGS, not just weed ALL OF THEM the govt should be out of drug enforcement and you have a right to have these drugs and govt doesnt have the right to tell you that you cant.
Rand takes anti govt to the very extreme and he alienates not only the left but just as many in the right.
Dont just accuse the Left of criticizing rand paul the right is just as vocal about it.

I disregard people who have always been of privledge and never had a bad day or a worry in their lives trying to tell america that its the poor thats whats wrong with the country because of entitlements.
Whats really wrong with the country is the rich and powerful have run it into the ground.

Just a question Common ??

Where do you draw the line at rich and privileged ??

I mean my kids grew up MUCH better off than I, but I/we're far from rich.

[Common]

Just a question Common ??

Where do you draw the line at rich and privileged ??

I mean my kids grew up MUCH better off than I, but I/we're far from rich.

Did they have health insurance and want to take a shot at answering the question

[Chris]

Its not only that, if Rand Paul wasnt born a privledged kid with a gold spoon sticking out of his arse then he would have more credibility first of all, second Rand Paul like his father has a couple of great ideas and many INSANE ideas for example legalize ALL DRUGS, not just weed ALL OF THEM the govt should be out of drug enforcement and you have a right to have these drugs and govt doesnt have the right to tell you that you cant.
Rand takes anti govt to the very extreme and he alienates not only the left but just as many in the right.
Dont just accuse the Left of criticizing rand paul the right is just as vocal about it.

I disregard people who have always been of privledge and never had a bad day or a worry in their lives trying to tell america that its the poor thats whats wrong with the country because of entitlements.
Whats really wrong with the country is the rich and powerful have run it into the ground.

So mixed in with your usual ad hom, you offer two criticisms of what he stands for!!


Rand Paul like his father has a couple of great ideas and many INSANE ideas for example legalize ALL DRUGS, not just weed ALL OF THEM

False. Only marijuana. http://www.ontheissues.org/domestic/Rand_Paul_Drugs.htm


Rand takes anti govt to the very extreme and he alienates not only the left but just as many in the right.

False. Even in his speech, Rand Paul Pitches GOP Version of Minimalist Government to African-Americans (http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/04/10/rand-paul-pitches-gop-version-of-minimalist-government-to-african-americans), he said:


"...it's not that I believe in no government, I believe in a government that spends what comes in and that's not unreasonable. I think 'leave me alone' is a good mantra for government, because government has to be involved in certain things, but there are many things we can leave government out of."

Try and criticize what he actually stands for.

[truthmatters]

rand paul displayed exactly why black American people hate the republican party and its fools like paul

[Chris]

rand paul displayed exactly why black American people hate the republican party and its fools like paul

Not the actual reactions of all people who heard the speech:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BzMIblb-oNE

[truthmatters]

did you even listen to it?

[Chris]

did you even listen to it?

Yes, did you?

You made a universal statement implying all "black American people hate the republican party and its fools like paul".

The video demonstrates some do and some don't.

You were wrong.

[truthmatters]

they were being nice.

they were praising him for at least coming and talking to them.

Now the crap he did about "do you know who was a republican decades ago?" crap is what they hate about your party and its brain dead minions like rand.

Hes a clown and so is the rest of your troops

[Chris]

they were being nice.

they were praising him for at least coming and talking to them.

Now the crap he did about "do you know who was a republican decades ago?" crap is what they hate about your party and its brain dead minions like rand.

Hes a clown and so is the rest of your troops

Shown you're wrong, you resort to straw man "they were being nice" before returning to your SOP ad hom.

[truthmatters]

dude yiou posted a tape you forgot to listen to first lying asbout what the tape says just makes you a liar too

[hanger4]

Did they have health insurance and want to take a shot at answering the question

Yes they did and still do (grown and gone), so that's your line ??

If one grows up with insurance you're considered rich and privileged

and you consider them un-credible.

You must have a problem relating to anybody.

[Greenridgeman]

dude yiou posted a tape you forgot to listen to first lying asbout what the tape says just makes you a liar too


Your incoherent babblings; due to childhood neglect of your education by your parents, or failure of the federal government to intervene in your life and demand you get some education?

[hanger4]

they were being nice.

they were praising him for at least coming and talking to them.

Now the crap he did about "do you know who was a republican decades ago?" crap is what they hate about your party and its brain dead minions like rand.

Hes a clown and so is the rest of your troops

Cool, you're a mind reader too.

[truthmatters]

if you grow up with it and then claim those that cant afford it are bad peopel then yes your opinion is worthless

[truthmatters]

Your incoherent babblings; due to childhood neglect of your education by your parents, or failure of the federal government to intervene in your life and demand you get some education?

conversational posting dude

get used to it and unwad your wonderroos

[Greenridgeman]

Yes they did and still do (grown and gone), so that's your line ??

If one grows up with insurance you're considered rich and privileged

and you consider them un-credible.

You must have a problem relating to anybody.



In American Idol Nation, personal responsibility is no longer a badge of honor.

The dependent class has been taught that nobody can succeed unless they had an unfair advantage and then proceeded to screw people.

To the dependent class, anything you have, that they want, you stole from them, and owe them.

It is a mentality fostered since before "Head Start", which is a propaganda statement in itself.

Ever wonder why after years of federal interference like "Head Start", and "No Child Allowed Ahead" our students are the laughing stock of the world.

[truthmatters]

oh really?


when did you begin to hate your fellow Americans weith such zeal?

[Greenridgeman]

conversational posting dude

get used to it and unwad your wonderroos

"conversational posting"


Ok, I can buy that as a style for casual posting, but it is hardly inappropriate in screeds where you complain about how unfair the US is to you, while you demonstrate you did not bother to take advantage of the free public education that was offered to you.

Until you demonstrate otherwise, how should anyone consider you anything but an uneducated, whiny loser in search of an excuse for your own failure to prepare yourself for life?

[Chris]

"conversational posting"


Ok, I can buy that as a style for casual posting, but it is hardly inappropriate in screeds where you complain about how unfair the US is to you, while you demonstrate you did not bother to take advantage of the free public education that was offered to you.

Until you demonstrate otherwise, how should anyone consider you anything but an uneducated, whiny loser in search of an excuse for your own failure to prepare yourself for life?

"conversational posting" still implies conversation, communication. Incoherent ranting doesn't do that.

[hanger4]

if you grow up with it and then claim those that cant afford it are bad peopel then yes your opinion is worthless

Who claims that truthy ??

Not I nor anyone I know.

[truthmatters]

the right demonizes the poor all the time.

Pretending they dont is a stupid lie

[truthmatters]

"conversational posting" still implies conversation, communication. Incoherent ranting doesn't do that.


bite the back end of a moose clown

Infraction issued for multiple personal attacks and disruption of threads in OtSS

[Greenridgeman]

bite the back end of a moose clown


Profound example of the depth of leftist thought when challenged.

[hanger4]

the right demonizes the poor all the time.

Pretending they dont is a stupid lie

Telling the poor to avail themselves of the FREE educational opportunities is demonizing ??

Maybe in your delusional mind, but not in reality.

[Alif Qadr]

if you grow up with it and then claim those that cant afford it are bad people then yes your opinion is worthless

I have never heard Rand nor his father explicitly nor implicitly imply that people who cannot afford health insurance are "bad" people. Besides, what Rand was going to address is how we Black people can overcome poverty and substandard living. This is exactly what many many many Black people have not only taught but demonstrated as well. Still in all, many busy themselves with foolishness such as partying, the latest fashions, the latest movie, sports, other types of sport and play, etc instead of attempting to work together in order to come out of the miserable condition that many of us find ourselves.
To cut the chase and get to the point, our condition is a result of our own failures. This has been gone over for far too long and still, many CHOOSE to blithely follow behind irrelevant matters while working towards the goal of changing our own condition. Because of this deliberate course of action, many are more reliant upon government hand-outs meanwhile complaining when the behaviors are criticized by others. Guess what? It is too darned bad.

[truthmatters]

yes the right everywhere I go on the internets and even on TV ta;lk trash about the poor.


Its about the only thing left you people agree on as a whole.

the poor are hated and trashed by you people for being born poor.


Paris Hiltons are automatic heros

[Common]

I have never heard Rand nor his father explicitly nor implicitly imply that people who cannot afford health insurance are "bad" people. Besides, what Rand was going to address is how we Black people can overcome poverty and substandard living. This is exactly what many many many Black people have not only taught but demonstrated as well. Still in all, many busy themselves with foolishness such as partying, the latest fashions, the latest movie, sports, other types of sport and play, etc instead of attempting to work together in order to come out of the miserable condition that many of us find ourselves.
To cut the chase and get to the point, our condition is a result of our own failures. This has been gone over for far too long and still, many CHOOSE to blithely follow behind irrelevant matters while working towards the goal of changing our own condition. Because of this deliberate course of action, many are more reliant upon government hand-outs meanwhile complaining when the behaviors are criticized by others. Guess what? It is too darned bad.

Sounds good, except you neglected to differentiate between, bums, skids, lowlifes, junkies, pimps, gangstas and playa's and the real poor.

[Chris]

yes the right everywhere I go on the internets and even on TV ta;lk trash about the poor.


Its about the only thing left you people agree on as a whole.

the poor are hated and trashed by you people for being born poor.


Paris Hiltons are automatic heros

The challenge to you was not to come up with straw men but to demonstrate that either of the Paul trash talk the poor. Paris doesn't cit it.

[truthmatters]

saying the poor are coddled is demeaning the poor

[Chris]

saying the poor are coddled is demeaning the poor

Citation in context of one of the Pauls saying that please.

[Greenridgeman]

saying the poor are coddled is demeaning the poor


YOU defending "the poor" with your semi-literate rants and condescening attitude that "the poor" cannot take care of themselves, and are so stupid government must protect and feed them, is what is demeaning to "the poor".

Don't like being poor; get a job.

Too uneducated to get a job; get into any number of free GED programs.

Or, whinge and pule.

[truthmatters]

http://www.sodahead.com/united-states/rand-paul-the-poor-are-getting-rich/question-2158171/?link=ibaf&q=rand+paul+quotes+on+the+poor





September 13, 2011



Census data revealed today that a record 46.2 million Americans were living in poverty in 2010. But in an aptly-timed hearing entitled “Is Poverty A Death Sentence,” Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) flat out rejected the idea that poverty in the U.S is worrisome. As the Ranking Member of the Senate Health subcommittee, Paul offered a dissertation-length statement on how the correlation between poverty and death is only found in the Third World and to claim such a connection within the U.S. is nothing more than “socialism” and “tyranny.”

[hanger4]

yes the right everywhere I go on the internets and even on TV ta;lk trash about the poor.


Its about the only thing left you people agree on as a whole.

the poor are hated and trashed by you people for being born poor.


Paris Hiltons are automatic heros

Hey you got a list of all the "code words" you see ??

It's apparent you subscribe to the "code word" conspiracy theories.

[truthmatters]

so how did Obama hget so many votes according to you people in the right?

[Greenridgeman]

so how did Obama hget so many votes according to you people in the right?


Literacy tests and property requirements were dropped as qualifications for voting.

[truthmatters]

so you want fewer Americans voting?

you hate democracy?

[Mainecoons]

Lucky for you, tatters. There's no way in hell you could pass a real literacy test.

:rofl:

[Greenridgeman]

so you want fewer Americans voting?

you hate democracy?



We do not have a democracy, we have a rebublic.


The history of republics shows that when the illiterate masses are able to vote themselves into the treasury, republics become dictatorships.

[truthmatters]

we are a democracy and lying about that facts makes you a person who agrues against every dictionary and encyclopedia in the world

[truthmatters]

should I go get websters?

[Greenridgeman]

should I go get websters?


You should get an education and some skills. Join the army if you need to.

If you are educated and skilled, and avoid drugs and alcohol, you are virtually assured of never being poor.

Of course, if you show up to work late all the time, stinking and unwashed, and with a toxic personality that is always negative, all the skills and education in the world will not help you.

[truthmatters]

a democracy is what the dictionary says it is right?

[truthmatters]

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/democracy


de·moc·ra·cy

noun \di-ˈmä-krə-sē\
pluralde·moc·ra·cies




Definition of DEMOCRACY

1
a: government by the people; especially: rule of the majority
b: a government in which the supreme power is vested (http://thepoliticalforums.com/vest[1]) in the people and exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections (http://thepoliticalforums.com/election)

2
: a political unit that has a democratic (http://thepoliticalforums.com/democratic) government

3
capitalized: the principles and policies of the Democratic party in the United States <from emancipation Republicanism to New Deal Democracy— C. M. Roberts>

4
: the common (http://thepoliticalforums.com/common[1]) people especially when constituting the source of political authority

5
: the absence of hereditary (http://thepoliticalforums.com/hereditary) or arbitrary (http://thepoliticalforums.com/arbitrary) class distinctions or privileges

[Greenridgeman]

a democracy is what the dictionary says it is right?


There are a multitude of free, online courses in history and government available for free.

Question, if we are a democracy, who did you vote for for President?

[Mainecoons]

And here we have a demonstration of what happens when the illiterate are just literate enough to post on the internet.

But the real demonstration of this is going on over on the "Inchoate rage" thread. Have a look see and get a good laugh to start your week.

:rofl:

[truthmatters]

http://www.democracy-building.info/systems-democracy.html

[truthmatters]

here is an example of the right denying the very definitions of words.



how do you debate the facts when the right denys facts to their face?

[Alif Qadr]

yes the right everywhere I go on the internets and even on TV ta;lk trash about the poor.


Its about the only thing left you people agree on as a whole.

the poor are hated and trashed by you people for being born poor.


Paris Hiltons are automatic heros

truthmatters, in saying that everywhere you turn the "right" talk thrash about the poor my be the reality in you scope but it is not the same with everyone. You are gaining your perspective from television which is nothing more than a production of false parameters or paradymns. This means that you, as so many iothers, gain your views from people who represent falsehood, vanality and negative ego. In order to change your eality, you have to change yopur behavioral patterns which begins with changing your perception of the world around you. In order to change perception, new ideas and perspectives that are in fact reality must be allowed to settle into your psyche. This is where the addage of "free your mind and the rest will follow" comes from. I will give you a for instance: those who were raised in slavery that one day decided that they were not going to accept their position or station in life, did so because they began to have new ideas introduced into their "normal" routines or speres of action. The same can be said about others instances in history were a person started to rebel against the accepted "orders" of their times. This is the real revolution and this is what those who have perched themselves in positions of influence fear. They fear new ideas which is why, if you pay attention, the same ideas are regurgitated times and again. This is the real reason why "history repeats itself:. Where there is lack of new ideas that maintain people's focus on reality, the people become mired in repetition and thus eventually target and destroy one another, thusly becoming each other or warring factions.
To continually look to media, appointed "leaders" and government representatives as trust-worthy will only lead a worsening condition being that those who have the mainstay spotlight among the poor, are the main bloodsuckers of the poor. Do you really think that they want their livestock to be set free from them? It is tiem to evaluate, critique and weight everything because we are all at a critical point of swim or sink and drown.

[Chris]

saying the poor are coddled is demeaning the poor


http://www.sodahead.com/united-states/rand-paul-the-poor-are-getting-rich/question-2158171/?link=ibaf&q=rand+paul+quotes+on+the+poor





September 13, 2011



Census data revealed today that a record 46.2 million Americans were living in poverty in 2010. But in an aptly-timed hearing entitled “Is Poverty A Death Sentence,” Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) flat out rejected the idea that poverty in the U.S is worrisome. As the Ranking Member of the Senate Health subcommittee, Paul offered a dissertation-length statement on how the correlation between poverty and death is only found in the Third World and to claim such a connection within the U.S. is nothing more than “socialism” and “tyranny.”

That does not support your claim, matters. Where does Rand say anything about coddling, where does he demeans the poor?

Are you just making it up?

Isn't it closer to the truth that your promoting government dependency demeans the poor with perpetual poverty?

[truthmatters]

he denied their exsistance in the US

[Mainecoons]

I never thought I'd be wanting Cigar to start flooding us with posts again but after a morning of Truthtatters, it would be a relief.

:rofl:

[Chris]

he denied their exsistance in the US

Citation in context please.

[truthmatters]

already done.

read the link igven

[truthmatters]

http://www.sodahead.com/united-states/rand-paul-the-poor-are-getting-rich/question-2158171/?link=ibaf&q=rand+paul+quotes+on+the+poor


remember you quoted this post

[truthmatters]

http://www.sodahead.com/united-states/rand-paul-the-poor-are-getting-rich/question-2158171/?link=ibaf&q=rand+paul+quotes+on+the+poor





September 13, 2011



Census data revealed today that a record 46.2 million Americans were living in poverty in 2010. But in an aptly-timed hearing entitled “Is Poverty A Death Sentence,” Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) flat out rejected the idea that poverty in the U.S is worrisome. As the Ranking Member of the Senate Health subcommittee, Paul offered a dissertation-length statement on how the correlation between poverty and death is only found in the Third World and to claim such a connection within the U.S. is nothing more than “socialism” and “tyranny.”




post 136

[truthmatters]

There are poor people in this country.

They have the right to vote in our system.

denying they even exsist is not nice

[nic34]

I never thought I'd be wanting Cigar to start flooding us with posts again but after a morning of Truthtatters, it would be a relief.

:rofl:

Can't handle debate on a forum?

Maybe switch to decaf......

[truthmatters]

doesnt have any facts at hand to debate his or her positions with it seems

[Chris]

Can't handle debate on a forum?

Maybe switch to decaf......

What debate, nic?

[Chris]

post 136

Your citation doesn't support your claim.

[Chris]

doesnt have any facts at hand to debate his or her positions with it seems

I've been asking you to provide facts to support your claim.

[truthmatters]

Your citation doesn't support your claim.

can you demonstrate how it does not?

[Chris]

can you demonstrate how it does not?

Nice attempt at passing the buck, matters.

[truthmatters]

You made the claim it yours to prove

[Chris]

You made the claim it yours to prove

, matters, you made the claim about Rand Paul, not me.

[truthmatters]

No I proved the claim with his own words

[Chris]

No I proved the claim with his own words

you h a ve not. But I can wait, I have lots of time.

[Mainecoons]

Glad to see you're having fun with TT over here. I'm having fun with him on my thread too.

Where is Cigar?

[Mister D]

Glad to see you're having fun with TT over here. I'm having fun with him on my thread too.

Where is Cigar?

I've had TM on ignore for months now. Now you see why. Why anyone is attempting to have a serious discussion with him is beyond me. Cigar is kind of a dumbass. TM is mentally ill.

[truthmatters]

off subject guys


I hear you can get banned for that

[nic34]

That's called debate in their world....

[Chris]

That's called debate in their world....

What claiming you've proven something when you haven't?

[Chris]

off subject guys


I hear you can get banned for that

Have to agree, while some chippiness is expected under Politics, matters is not the topic.

[truthmatters]

You want me to leave this thread too?

or can I stay?

[nic34]

What claiming you've proven something when you haven't?

Just responding to the usual "dumbass" and "mentally ill" comments a couple of the regulars like to use....

[truthmatters]

I cant understand why others can insult me but im not allowed to do it to others

[Chris]

You want me to leave this thread too?

or can I stay?

I asked them to stop picking on you and this is how you show appreciation?

After this report problems with the report button.

[Chris]

Just responding to the usual "dumbass" and "mentally ill" comments a couple of the regulars like to use....

The rules allow for a certain amount of chippiness but if it gets out of hand and disrupts discussion, why then just use the report button.