The Unholy Obama

[TheDictator]

The unholy alliance between Obama, Democrats and Planned ParenthoodBy Cal Thomas (http://www.foxnews.com/archive/author/cal-thomas/index.html)
Published April 30, 2013
FoxNews.com



Addressing a meeting of Planned Parenthood last Friday, President Obama accused pro-lifers of wanting to "turn back the clock to policies more suited to the 1950s than the 21st century."
Like any decade, the '50s had its problems -- racism, discrimination, sexism -- but I'll defend the '50s on other grounds, if the president will defend the decade that followed.
In the '50s, for much of mainstream America drugs were something you bought at a pharmacy with a prescription; living together meant getting married first, then having babies; abortion was not legal; our culture wasn't the enemy; metal detectors were instruments one took to the beach to find loose change and schools and the streets were mostly safe.

It's "Ozzie and Harriet" vs. Woodstock.
Dr. Kermit Gosnell is on trial now in a Philadelphia courtroom indicted on charges that he performed late-term abortions and killed babies born alive during the procedures.
Is this the 21 century the president prefers?
It is actions like this -- not the policies of the '50s -- that have weakened America and harmed the women the president claims to be defending.
How many women has the president talked to who lament their abortions and say they would have made another choice, if they had been shown alternatives?
Does the president champion the rights of these women?
According to FactCheck.org, as an Illinois state senator, Obama twice voted against the so-called "born-alive" bills that would have "defined any aborted fetus that showed signs of life as a 'born alive infant' entitled to legal protection."
He opposed the bills, he said, "as backdoor attacks on a woman's legal right to abortion." He chose politics, not lives.
In his speech to Planned Parenthood, the president never mentioned the word "abortion," preferring to talk instead about "women's health."
Could it be because 40 years after the historic Roe v. Wade decision, public opinion on abortion has changed very little? For the most part, those who favor it, favor it; those who do not, do not.
The president and Planned Parenthood's other defenders claim that if the organization were to be denied tax dollars, there would be fewer mammograms, cancer screenings and other services available, especially to poor women. Is this anything more than a distraction from Planned Parenthood's real purpose -- providing abortions?
According to analysis from the Chiaroscuro Foundation, a not-for-profit organization seeking to reduce the number of abortions in New York, Planned Parenthood "provides more abortions than any other organization in the United States, about one of every four U.S. abortions."
"Planned Parenthood's bottom line is numbers," according to a 2011 op-ed for The Hill newspaper written by former clinic director Abby Johnson, "And, with abortion as its primary money-maker, that means implementing a quota. ... I was directed to double the numbers of abortions our clinic performed in order to drive up revenue."
Planned Parenthood spends a lot on electing liberal Democrats to office. It can afford to.
According to its 2011-2012 annual report, the organization reported more than $1.2 billion in net assets and received a record $542 million in taxpayer funding. The pro-life Susan B. Anthony. Read it.
Planned Parenthood and the left are inextricably linked. The organization works to elect Democratic candidates who will defend their mission and those candidates, once elected, fuel Planned Parenthood's agenda by funneling tax dollars their way and trumpeting their "good works" in the name of women's health. And millions of American children are aborted.
This is what the 21st century has to offer us? This is what we should prefer over the '50s?
A 1962 hit song looked back on the stability of the '50s and the values that shaped the decade. It was called "That's Old Fashioned." The Everly Brothers sang it. One of the verses goes:
"It's a modern changing world
Everything is moving fast
But when it comes to love I like
What they did in the past."
That beats some of the lyrics from the psychedelic '60s. By comparison, the'50s look pretty good to me.

[jillian]

may G-d bless and keep the radical religious right...

far away from us.

[Cigar]

http://blog.timesunion.com/opinion/files/2012/02/0223_WVideological.jpg

[TheDictator]

Thank God for people like Texas Governor Rick Perry for cutting all government funds going to Planned Parenthood in Texas. Texas what a great place to live.

[jillian]

Thank God for people like Texas Governor Rick Perry for cutting all government funds going to Planned Parenthood in Texas. Texas what a great place to live.

yes...screw women.

yay...

[TheDictator]

No save children from murdering woman.

[Greenridgeman]

yes...screw women.

yay...


Have you ever been denied all the abortions you wanted for lack of federal, state or local funds?

[Cigar]

Thank God for people like Texas Governor Rick Perry for cutting all government funds going to Planned Parenthood in Texas. Texas what a great place to live.


If at first you don't succeed ... fail fail again ...

http://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth11825/m1/1/med_res/
http://www.wired.com/images/article/full/2009/04/texas_city_1947.jpg

http://img.ibtimes.com/www/data/videos/full/2013/01/11/9644_explosion-flattens-texas-building.jpg

[TheDictator]

Yes, cigar Obama's OSHA is responsible for all those deaths. Obama failed us again.

[Cigar]

Yes, cigar Obama's OSHA is responsible for all those deaths. Obama failed us again.



So let me get this straight ... after each and every Presidential Election, in Texas; all Federal Government Service Employees are removed and the new Administration rehires New Federal Government Service Employees for the State of Texas.

Did I understand you correctly on this?

[Cigar]

Texas ... :smiley_ROFLMAO:

http://editorialcartoonists.com/cartoons/SorenJ/2013/SorenJ20130430_low.jpg
http://editorialcartoonists.com/cartoons/RogerR/2013/RogerR20130430_low.jpg

[TheDictator]

So let me get this straight ... after each and every Presidential Election, in Texas; all Federal Government Service Employees are removed and the new Administration rehires New Federal Government Service Employees for the State of Texas.

Did I understand you correctly on this?

They are under the control of The President not the Governor of Texas, This happen under Obama's watch, Obama has the blood of those people on his hands.

[Ransom]

The 'screw women' tactic gets tried even when defending 3rd trimester or partial birth abortions. Pro-life advocates have been successful in rolling Roe V Wade back, many states now permitted to set their own laws regarding 3rd trimester and partial birth abortions.

Many more constituents beginning to understand that the 'screw women' defense is more agenda driven and political than genuine and are coming to their senses...and morals concerning abortion. Observers such as we have here who support and even encourage the death of millions of unborn children have their own conscience to deal with. Mine is clear.

[Cigar]

They are under the control of The President not the Governor of Texas, This happen under Obama's watch, Obama has the blood of those people on his hands.


Sure ... whatever you say, well unless we're talking about September 11, 2001

http://www.michaelbrowntoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/93814-september-11-2001.jpg

[Ransom]

Sure ... whatever you say, well unless we're talking about September 11, 2001


C i g a r.

Just adding to the list of those "who have no idea why Osama Bin Laden attacked us."

You join Jillian and many other uninformed observers.

Moving on.

[TheDictator]

Sure ... whatever you say, well unless we're talking about September 11, 2001



President BJ Bill weaken the CIA so much that they could see what was coming.

[Cigar]

President BJ Bill weaken the CIA so much that they could see what was coming.


Yea ... right, thanks for playing.

[Cigar]

C i g a r.

Just adding to the list of those "who have no idea why Osama Bin Laden attacked us."

You join Jillian and many other uninformed observers.

Moving on.

Make me :grin:

[jillian]

C i g a r.

Just adding to the list of those "who have no idea why Osama Bin Laden attacked us."

You join Jillian and many other uninformed observers.

Moving on.

your self-importance is exceeded only by your ignorance.

you give new meaning to the term 'dumb as toast'.

but please...regale us with the reasons you have deluded yourself into believing we were attacked.... as opposed, of course, to what he actually SAID.

[Ivan88]

Did the mothers of Jillian and Cigar make the right choice?

[Cigar]

You can always tell when they are defeated ...

Just give me the OK from the Forum Authorities and I will unleash the some ...

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_SRtKyT1Yb9A/S-9ALhwYIoI/AAAAAAAAAQk/Q62uJ8K-Lkc/s1600/whoop-ass.jpg

[TheDictator]

Your nothing but a big joke, just like Obama.

[Cigar]

your self-importance is exceeded only by your ignorance.

you give new meaning to the term 'dumb as toast'.

but please...regale us with the reasons you have deluded yourself into believing we were attacked.... as opposed, of course, to what he actually SAID.



Looks like they are really frustrated today ... whining, scratching and name calling.

This is place is starting to resemble a girly pillow fight.

One of them even started talking about Forum Members Mothers.

I'm game ... :wink:

[patrickt]

may G-d bless and keep the radical religious right...

far away from us.

Murderers hate interference. And Cigar loves girly pillow fights. It makes him feel manly.

[KC]

Did the mothers of Jillian and Cigar make the right choice?

Please stick to the topic and avoid further personal attacks.

[Chloe]

I don't think there is anything necessarily unholy or murderous about having an abortion, primarily if it is before it is truly viable. I'm pretty sure that no religious book mentions or gives a definitive definition as to when "life" begins or when a baby's life is viable. Science gives us an idea when a baby's life is viable and so that's what a lot of people go by. I'm sure that for most women the decision to have an abortion is not an easy one but sometimes it truly truly is the best thing for her and her family and that's why it is good that she isn't forced into it in my opinion.

I think that the real concern regarding abortion should be with late term abortions and botched late term abortions. I think that if anti-abortion activists truly wanted to focus on something that they could possibly win on it would be late term abortions and the time frame after a true definition of viability is established, but focusing on like the first and second trimester and so on is a losing battle in my opinion since to a lot of people, including myself, it's just not murder if it's not even viable...but again that's just my opinion.

[Cigar]

I don't think there is anything necessarily unholy or murderous about having an abortion, primarily if it is before it is truly viable. I'm pretty sure that no religious book mentions or gives a definitive definition as to when "life" begins or when a baby's life is viable. Science gives us an idea when a baby's life is viable and so that's what a lot of people go by. I'm sure that for most women the decision to have an abortion is not an easy one but sometimes it truly truly is the best thing for her and her family and that's why it is good that she isn't forced into it in my opinion.

I think that the real concern regarding abortion should be with late term abortions and botched late term abortions. I think that if anti-abortion activists truly wanted to focus on something that they could possibly win on it would be late term abortions and the time frame after a true definition of viability is established, but focusing on like the first and second trimester and so on is a losing battle in my opinion since to a lot of people, including myself, it's just not murder if it's not even viable...but again that's just my opinion.


Here's an undeniable "fact", Abortions will happen, have always happened and will continue to happen.

The only difference will be, if we go back to the dark-ages of back-ally abortions or safe abortions.

Period.

[TheDictator]

I don't think there is anything necessarily unholy or murderous about having an abortion, primarily if it is before it is truly viable. I'm pretty sure that no religious book mentions or gives a definitive definition as to when "life" begins or when a baby's life is viable. Science gives us an idea when a baby's life is viable and so that's what a lot of people go by. I'm sure that for most women the decision to have an abortion is not an easy one but sometimes it truly truly is the best thing for her and her family and that's why it is good that she isn't forced into it in my opinion.

I think that the real concern regarding abortion should be with late term abortions and botched late term abortions. I think that if anti-abortion activists truly wanted to focus on something that they could possibly win on it would be late term abortions and the time frame after a true definition of viability is established, but focusing on like the first and second trimester and so on is a losing battle in my opinion since to a lot of people, including myself, it's just not murder if it's not even viable...but again that's just my opinion.

Well there are people who believe that killing a Jew is not "necessarily unholy or murderous act". The Bible does have things to say about abortion. Here is one.

Psalm 139.

13 For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother’s womb. (http://bible.cc/psalms/139-13.htm)
14 I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. (http://bible.cc/psalms/139-14.htm)
15 My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth; (http://bible.cc/psalms/139-15.htm)
16 Your eyes have seen my unformed substance; And in Your book were all written The days that were ordained for me, When as yet there was not one of them. (http://bible.cc/psalms/139-16.htm)

[Chloe]

Well there are people who believe that killing a Jew is not "necessarily unholy or murderous act". The Bible does have things to say about abortion. Here is one.

Psalm 139.

13 For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother’s womb. (http://bible.cc/psalms/139-13.htm)
14 I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; Wonderful are Your works, And my soul knows it very well. (http://bible.cc/psalms/139-14.htm)
15 My frame was not hidden from You, When I was made in secret, And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth; (http://bible.cc/psalms/139-15.htm)
16 Your eyes have seen my unformed substance; And in Your book were all written The days that were ordained for me, When as yet there was not one of them. (http://bible.cc/psalms/139-16.htm)

I'm not really sure how those really explain abortion or right and wrong around abortion but ok. Obviously we are going to get nowhere close to agreeing on whether or not abortion is right or wrong, but what do you think about focusing more on late term abortions instead of say like first trimester? I could see your point of view actually making ground on that argument nationwide a whole lot easier than a few week after conception.

[zelmo1234]

[QUOTE=jillian;278394]yes...screw women.

yay...[/QUOTE

i would think that being a compasionate liberal you would want to donate to Planed Parent Hood so they can stay in business if it is that important to you!

You see I like my Church and I give very Generiously to it! hey do not get to use your tax dollars for their outreach!

There are lots of rich libs they should be able to help!

[TheDictator]

I'm not really sure how those really explain abortion or right and wrong around abortion but ok. Obviously we are going to get nowhere close to agreeing on whether or not abortion is right or wrong, but what do you think about focusing more on late term abortions instead of say like first trimester? I could see your point of view actually making ground on that argument nationwide a whole lot easier than a few week after conception.

I Agree, I work with a State Rep. here in Texas on just those issues.

[Micketto]

yes...screw women.

yay...


i would think that being a compasionate liberal you would want to donate to Planed Parent Hood so they can stay in business if it is that important to you!

You see I like my Church and I give very Generiously to it! hey do not get to use your tax dollars for their outreach!

There are lots of rich libs they should be able to help!

Why, when it's easier to just sit there and complain...?

[Ransom]

your self-importance is exceeded only by your ignorance.

you give new meaning to the term 'dumb as toast'.

but please...regale us with the reasons you have deluded yourself into believing we were attacked.... as opposed, of course, to what he actually SAID.

I was waiting first on another forum for you to provide your sources Jillian, you disappeared....again. You now ask for mine?

You put 4 reasons, I believe, and 'told me' it was what Bin Laden "stated" yet never sourced your work. And you'll disappear here as well. You give talking points, insult me, and then leave when asked to link your sources. Link me your sources first, I'll then show you what he truly and actually stated.

See ya

[simpsonofpg]

may G-d bless and keep the radical religious right...

far away from us.
It works for me, we are not interested in getting that close to ignorance so please keep your distance. This issue is about killing babies not about God but I am sure he doesn't like it either.

[jillian]

It works for me, we are not interested in getting that close to ignorance so please keep your distance. This issue is about killing babies not about God but I am sure he doesn't like it either.

no... the issue is about you trying to impose your version of morality on others.

please keep your warped morality to yourself.

[TheDictator]

no... the issue is about you trying to impose your version of morality on others.

please keep your warped morality to yourself.

That's Right, Only Liberals can impose their version of morality on others. We all know that 32 oz drinks are wrong.

[Chris]

As a general warning, please stick to the topic and avoid further personal attacks.

[Ransom]

I don't know if Obama is "unholy", that's probably a relative term in this modern confused culture of America.

But I'm amazed at how he's never held to account. He mentioned the Gitmo prison at his presser yesterday and blamed Republicans. Again.

His budgets not even accepted by his own Party. This economy stagnant at best. Unemployment especially amongst minority Americans off the chart unacceptable. No movement on immigration issues. Border security issues. Energy policy issues. His gun control efforts failed. The implementation of Obamacare an absolute train wreck, no one moving to these exchanges, the government spending millions to "persuade" the public and small business(some observers actually support the government spending millions to make consumers behave in a certain manner)...and look what is going on abroad.

The Israeli-Palestinian issue the same. Al-Qaeda still hates us, still attacks us, Iraq becoming unstable, North Africa a hotbed of extremism, North Korean leader new and unpredicatble as are many in that military, we don't even want to speak to Syria in flames, we don't want to speak about Benghazi, we don't want to speak what's happened in Egypt and Libya after we helped unseat decades long rulers, we drone strike in Yemen, the Sudan, Pakistan, and Afghanistan, we continue to occupy Afghanistan, we continue to steam up and down the Iranian Straits, we are building forward bases and imprisoning people without due process....we have absolutely no foreign policy....at all, noe one anywhere can tell you today what America is, how she's defined. We don't show a unified front.

This is simply and matter of factly the most incompetent individual to ever sit in the chair. Unqualified, over his head, he's not a leader. Never was one.

He could speal via a teleprompter and tell you everything you wanted to hear....and America elected and re-elected him. Telling that our culture has decayed to this point. Sad...but more telling than sad.

[jillian]

That's Right, Only Liberals can impose their version of morality on others. We all know that 32 oz drinks are wrong.

the republican/independent mayor of new york is not a liberal.

but thanks for the hyperbole.

i know how burdensome it must be for the fat slugs who cost us a fortune in health care costs to have to make two trips to the soda fountain.

p.s. it is not our government's job to proselytize your religious beliefs or enforce them.

[TheDictator]

the republican/independent mayor of new york is not a liberal.

but thanks for the hyperbole.

i know how burdensome it must be for the fat slugs who cost us a fortune in health care costs to have to make two trips to the soda fountain.

p.s. it is not our government's job to proselytize your religious beliefs or enforce them.

The Mayor is a Liberal, regardless of party. ALL OF OUR LAWS ARE BASED ON SOMEONE'S MORAL CODE. You don't care if Liberals force their morals on the American people. The Dodd/Frank Act is a good example of liberals forcing morals on people. The EPA sure like proselytize and force their morals on the people of Texas costing 10,000's of poor and middle class people to lose their jobs.

Just what Religious beliefs are being forced on people?

[TheDictator]

Oh, by the way, if it was not for Religious people forcing their beliefs on the nation in the 1860's. Obama would not be President today, he would be a slave in the south. Mayby the government should not have past all those religious laws on slavery and forcing it's morality on the south.

[Ransom]

the republican/independent mayor of new york is not a liberal.

but thanks for the hyperbole.

i know how burdensome it must be for the fat slugs who cost us a fortune in health care costs to have to make two trips to the soda fountain.

p.s. it is not our government's job to proselytize your religious beliefs or enforce them.

Universal heath care means universal. Whether asking for you to pay for voter's birth control or voter's third plate at the buffet, please make your pro-choice idealism consistent. Voters are free and clear to smoke, eat too much, drink alcohol, use drugs(over the counter or illegal), what the voter does.......risky sexual behaviors such as engaging in anal sex included for example....is frankly Jillain, none of your business. And you'll pay for their health care.

Sit back down and open your wallet. You voted for him, you pay first.

Pro Obamacare and she's already witching about paying for someone else. We're all paying for other's bad health behaviors and have been. It;s your idea to pay for everyones.....you sleep in the bed you make, quit f'n whining about it.

[Chris]

"Just what Religious beliefs are being forced on people?"

Absolutely none. That would be unconstitutional.

[Chris]

Oh, by the way, if it was not for Religious people forcing their beliefs on the nation in the 1860's. Obama would not be President today, he would be a slave in the south. Mayby the government should not have past all those religious laws on slavery and forcing it's morality on the south.
Thomas Paine was one of the original abolitionist s.

[TheDictator]

"Just what Religious beliefs are being forced on people?"

Absolutely none. That would be unconstitutional.

I would agree, You really can't force someone to believe anything. If there was law that said you must believe that Jesus is God, That would be unconstitutional.
I do not see anyone doing that.

The only one's I see trying to force people to believe something are Liberals with their PC and speech police.

[TheDictator]

Thomas Paine was one of the original abolitionist s.

Ok, what is your point, I don't get it?

[jillian]

"Just what Religious beliefs are being forced on people?"

Absolutely none. That would be unconstitutional.

really? i don't believe two cells are a baby.

shall we go on from there?

i don't want anyone preaching christianity to my son.

and yes, those things ARE unconstitutional.

you might want to tell that to the o/p who wants our president to be "holy" . nuts, i know.

and the BS about two cells being a baby? that's a RELIGIOUS determination. and it isn't something i believe. and it isn't something most people believe.

which is why it's a matter of conscience and why a bunch of old white christian men who form 80% of anti-choice activists, need to stay out of the laws that protect women and allow us to control our own bodies.

you know, just to get back to the o/p

tell me again how that has nothing to do with imposing religious beliefs on people who don't want anything to do with the religious right.

[jillian]

Oh, by the way, if it was not for Religious people forcing their beliefs on the nation in the 1860's. Obama would not be President today, he would be a slave in the south. Mayby the government should not have past all those religious laws on slavery and forcing it's morality on the south.

*yawn*

[BillyBob]

and yes, those things ARE unconstitutional.

You have previously demonstrated that you have absolutely no understanding of the Constitution. Besides, nobody wants to force your imaginary children to be Christians.

[Chris]

Ok, what is your point, I don't get it?

Minor thing. You'd said "if it was not for Religious people" but he wasn't religious as per his Rights of man.

[Chris]

really? i don't believe two cells are a baby.

shall we go on from there?

i don't want anyone preaching christianity to my son.

and yes, those things ARE unconstitutional.

you might want to tell that to the o/p who wants our president to be "holy" . nuts, i know.

and the BS about two cells being a baby? that's a RELIGIOUS determination. and it isn't something i believe. and it isn't something most people believe.

which is why it's a matter of conscience and why a bunch of old white christian men who form 80% of anti-choice activists, need to stay out of the laws that protect women and allow us to control our own bodies.

you know, just to get back to the o/p

tell me again how that has nothing to do with imposing religious beliefs on people who don't want anything to do with the religious right.


i don't believe two cells are a baby.

Where are you forced to believe this?


i don't want anyone preaching christianity to my son.

Where do you see this done unconstitutionally?

Cite specific examples of such laws, please.





and the BS about two cells being a baby? that's a RELIGIOUS determination

While there are religious arguments to that effect, there are also arguments from medical science to the sane effect.

[TheDictator]

Minor thing. You'd said "if it was not for Religious people" but he wasn't religious as per his Rights of man.

He was religious, he was not a Christian, but he believed in a natural God, and the rights of man was a very religious idea at that time based on Christian belief.

[Chris]

He was religious, he was not a Christian, but he believed in a natural God, and the rights of man was a very religious idea at that time based on Christian belief.

A Deist, yes, Laws of Nature and Nature's God. Rights of Man was not based on Christianity.


We also need to acknowledge many a religious person justified slavery based on the same Bible other condemned it.

[TheDictator]

really? i don't believe two cells are a baby.

shall we go on from there?

i don't want anyone preaching christianity to my son.

and yes, those things ARE unconstitutional.

you might want to tell that to the o/p who wants our president to be "holy" . nuts, i know.

and the BS about two cells being a baby? that's a RELIGIOUS determination. and it isn't something i believe. and it isn't something most people believe.

which is why it's a matter of conscience and why a bunch of old white christian men who form 80% of anti-choice activists, need to stay out of the laws that protect women and allow us to control our own bodies.

you know, just to get back to the o/p

tell me again how that has nothing to do with imposing religious beliefs on people who don't want anything to do with the religious right.

Sorry, but your belief of two cells is not supported by medical science. Medical Science states that at the time of the vast majority of abortions the human baby has all of their organs, a beating heart, facial features like eyes, arms and legs, all their bones, has sex organs, fingers prints, a brain that dreams, and fills pain, can hiccup. It's DNA says it a human being. Medical Science is on my side not yours. All you have is a religious belief that it is not human. Murdering children is wrong regardless of Religion.

[Greenridgeman]

really? i don't believe two cells are a baby.

shall we go on from there?

i don't want anyone preaching christianity to my son.

and yes, those things ARE unconstitutional.

you might want to tell that to the o/p who wants our president to be "holy" . nuts, i know.

and the BS about two cells being a baby? that's a RELIGIOUS determination. and it isn't something i believe. and it isn't something most people believe.

which is why it's a matter of conscience and why a bunch of old white christian men who form 80% of anti-choice activists, need to stay out of the laws that protect women and allow us to control our own bodies.

you know, just to get back to the o/p

tell me again how that has nothing to do with imposing religious beliefs on people who don't want anything to do with the religious right.



Were any of your abortions performed at the two-cell stage?

[TheDictator]

A Deist, yes, Laws of Nature and Nature's God. Rights of Man was not based on Christianity.


We also need to acknowledge many a religious person justified slavery based on the same Bible other condemned it.

The idea that All men have rights and value comes from Christianity 2000 years ago. He got his ideas of the rights of man from Christianity. Your right both sides used religion, but one side won. Most of the secular Whigs where not going to do anything about slavery, It took radical religious Republicans deal with the issue.

[Chris]

The idea that All men have rights and value comes from Christianity 2000 years ago. He got his ideas of the rights of man from Christianity. Your right both sides used religion, but one side won. Most of the secular Whigs where not going to do anything about slavery, It took radical religious Republicans deal with the issue.

Sorry, but that idea comes from Judaism who subjected kings to the same laws as the people. And natural law, from which natural rights are derived, is at least as old as the Greeks. These ideas weren't adopted by Christians till Roger William's Bloody Tenet influenced people, including Jefferson who cribbed his idea of a wall of separation.

It took Republicans almost a century to defeat Democrat bigotry.

Religious people were involved but there weren't primarily religious matters.

[Ransom]

really? i don't believe two cells are a baby.


What are "two cells then" if not a baby?

[Greenridgeman]

What are "two cells then" if not a baby?


The "two cell" stage lasts what, a few minutes or hours.

No, nobody is doing "two cell" abortions.

Why do you think psychiatrists are getting rich of off post-abortion counseling.

When the reality sinks in, well, you've seen the bitter, hate consumed women.

[TheDictator]

Just like the Nazis, in the 1940's they were self-delusional in their thinking that Jews were not human beings so their genocide was not wrong or illegal. When you classify someone as non or sub human you can commit all kinds of atrocities. Medical Science has proved that they are a human child, but like most delusional people they do not want to see the truth. America's genocide is 20 years old and going.

[Greenridgeman]

Just like the Nazis, in the 1940's they were self-delusional in their thinking that Jews were not human beings so their genocide was not wrong or illegal. When you classify someone as non or sub human you can commit all kinds of atrocities. Medical Science has proved that they are a human child, but like most delusional people they do not want to see the truth. America's genocide is 20 years old and going.



Lots of people have been deluded into thinking there are no consequences to abortion.

[junie]

Lots of people have been deluded into thinking there are no consequences to abortion.



lots of people have been deluded into thinking there are no consequences to anti-abortion LAWS...

[junie]

Were any of your abortions performed at the two-cell stage?



what a disgusting implication...

[BillyBob]

lots of people have been deluded into thinking there are no consequences to anti-abortion LAWS...


lots of people have been deluded into thinking there are no consequences to murder....

[Greenridgeman]

what a disgusting implication...

What is disgusting about disposing of a clump of cells?

[junie]

lots of people have been deluded into thinking there are no consequences to murder....



that's nice bob. some people have deluded themselves into thinking that using multiple internet sockpuppets makes them wicked smart.

[junie]

What is disgusting about disposing of a clump of cells?



what's disgusting is your implication that pro-choice women must have had abortions..as if that changes anything involving the issue at hand?


do you reply to pro-choice men in that same manner?

[Greenridgeman]

what's disgusting is your implication that pro-choice women must have had abortions..as if that changes anything involving the issue at hand?


do you reply to pro-choice men in that same manner?


What's the deal, if nothing is wrong with abortion why the sensitivity?

I am pro-choice myself.

I have chosen to be a father to all the children I ever conceived.

We have a real disconnect here on abortion it seems, great thing, just don't tag any woman with ever having had one.

[TheDictator]

lots of people have been deluded into thinking there are no consequences to murder....

That is true, some believe that if you can murder before birth then you can do it after birth, like some mothers who have taken their 3 month old and drowned them. Just a post birth Abortion.

[junie]

Sorry, but your belief of two cells is not supported by medical science. Medical Science states that at the time of the vast majority of abortions the human baby has all of their organs, a beating heart, facial features like eyes, arms and legs, all their bones, has sex organs, fingers prints, a brain that dreams, and fills pain, can hiccup. It's DNA says it a human being. Medical Science is on my side not yours. All you have is a religious belief that it is not human. Murdering children is wrong regardless of Religion.



in roe v wade the court ruled that states were forbidden from outlawing or regulating any aspect of abortion performed during the first trimester of pregnancy. period.

the issue is not whether or not the fetus is a baby. the issue is PRIVACY.

[Greenridgeman]

in roe v wade the court ruled that states were forbidden from outlawing or regulating any aspect of abortion performed during the first trimester of pregnancy. period.

the issue is not whether or not the fetus is a baby. the issue is PRIVACY.



Roe v Wade was also based on a lie.

[BillyBob]

that's nice bob. some people have deluded themselves into thinking that using multiple internet sockpuppets makes them wicked smart.


Nice deflection. Did you learn that from Cigar?

[Chris]

in roe v wade the court ruled that states were forbidden from outlawing or regulating any aspect of abortion performed during the first trimester of pregnancy. period.

the issue is not whether or not the fetus is a baby. the issue is PRIVACY.

A penumbra right the justices like magicians pulled out from under their robes.

[Greenridgeman]

A penumbra right the justices like magicians pulled out from under their robes.



Like the right to redefine the basic terminology of HCR to make it pass constitutional muster.


The SCOTUS has the credibility of the Nobel Prize Committee, IMNSHO.

[junie]

A penumbra right the justices like magicians pulled out from under their robes.



not exactly...



In a 7-2 decision written by Justice Harry Blackmun (http://www.pbs.org/wnet/supremecourt/rights/robes_blackmun.html) (who was chosen because of his prior experience as counsel to the Mayo Clinic), the Court ruled that the Texas statute violated Jane Roe's constitutional right to privacy. The Court argued that the Constitution's First, Fourth, Ninth, and Fourteenth Amendments protect an individual's "zone of privacy" against state laws and cited past cases ruling that marriage, contraception, and child rearing are activities covered in this "zone of privacy." The Court then argued that the "zone of privacy" was "broad enough to encompass a woman's decision whether or not to terminate her pregnancy." This decision involved myriad physical, psychological, and economic stresses a pregnant woman must face.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/supremecourt/rights/landmark_roe.html

[jillian]

Where are you forced to believe this?



Where do you see this done unconstitutionally?

Cite specific examples of such laws, please.






While there are religious arguments to that effect, there are also arguments from medical science to the sane effect.

it's not about what people are being forced to "believe"... it's about the laws the right keeps trying to pass to enforce THEIR belief.

[BillyBob]

it's not about what people are being forced to "believe"... it's about the laws the right keeps trying to pass to enforce THEIR belief.

Such as?

[Chris]

it's not about what people are being forced to "believe"... it's about the laws the right keeps trying to pass to enforce THEIR belief.

What law has passed that is religious?

To me it's surprising a generally religious society thrives under so secular a nation.

"And I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in showing that religion and Government will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together."

-James Madison

[TheDictator]

it's not about what people are being forced to "believe"... it's about the laws the right keeps trying to pass to enforce THEIR belief.

The same thing that Liberals are doing.