PDA

View Full Version : Founding Fathers Appalled At Attacks On Public Education



nic34
06-21-2013, 09:26 AM
In April 1776, John Adams put his Thoughts on Government in writing in response to a resolution by the North Carolina Provincial Congress. He begins by making a case for the purpose of government, writing "the happiness of society is the end of all government" which naturally follows his belief that "the happiness of the individual is the end of man." Using these as guiding principles, Adams then sketches an outline of what he believes good government should be.

After outlining a legislative framework, Adams moves on to specifics. After a well-armed militia, Adams wrote, "Laws for the liberal education of youth, especially of the lower class of people, are so extremely wise and useful, that, to a human and generous mind, no expense for this purpose would be thought extravagant."

John Adams wasn't alone in this belief. Thomas Jefferson was so committed to his belief that self-government was doomed to fail without an educated electorate that in his 1806 State of the Union address, he called for federally funded public education, saying "An amendment to our constitution must here come in the aid of public education. The influence over government must be shared among all people." When he could not garner support for a constitutional amendment, he set about to create a framework for his vision for public education, which ultimately failed to pass the Congress. In the end, Jefferson settled for the establishment of the College of William and Mary, now the University of Virginia*, as a legacy to his undying belief in public education.

http://www.winningwordsproject.com/founding_fathers_appalled_at_attacks_on_public_edu cation


Public educaton's purpose is to inform and enlighten a nation's citzens. As Adams believed, self-government would be doomed to fail w/o it. There would be no other way to educate the masses, and only the wealthy and privileged would be able to afford it.

We may not always agree with everything that is taught beyond the 3 R's, but education has evolved since it's early beginnings. I certainly wouldn't have agreed with government teaching that blacks were 3/5's of a human, Indians were savages to be assimilated, women could not be treated as equals. We as a people changed and so did what we teach. The poster sums up well here:

It is time to reclaim our Founders' values. It must once again become an imperative in this country to educate our youth without asking them to take on ridiculous levels of debt before they've even begun to use that education for the betterment of our country. We must affirm that education and the attendant intellectual curiosity it fosters is not a privilege of a free society, but a duty of that free society to foster. It is time to reject the frames foisted on us by the right wing about what a failure public education is and instead embrace it as the single most important right—yes, right—afforded to all citizens in order to secure a more perfect union.

Taxcutter
06-21-2013, 09:32 AM
Public education as Adams and others envisioned it is one thing. What passes for "public education" today is entirely another.

Mainecoons
06-21-2013, 09:32 AM
:rofl:

From the grave, no less. As if what they thought public education was and what the liberals have turned it into today.

Nic, you really have an "interesting" mind.

:rofl:

Chris
06-21-2013, 09:48 AM
Nic, can you give a brief summary of the sort of public school system Adams and Jefferson advocated?

nic34
06-21-2013, 09:50 AM
It wasn't "liberals" that took the concept of free or nearly free education and turned it into the for profit scam it is today.

Chris
06-21-2013, 09:53 AM
It wasn't "liberals" that took the concept of free or nearly free education and turned it into the for profit scam it is today.

Adams and Jefferson didn't advocate free education, nic. They knew well there's no free lunch. What did they advocate?

nic34
06-21-2013, 09:56 AM
Thomas Jefferson State of the Union Address December 2 1806 Every government degenerates when trusted to the rulers of the people alone. The people themselves are its only safe depositories. And to render even them safe, their minds must be improved to a certain degree. . . . An amendment to our constitution must here come in aid of the public education. The influence over government must be shared among all people.

John Adams, in 1785: “The whole people must take upon themselves the education of the whole people and be willing to bear the expenses of it. There should not be a district of one mile square, without a school in it, not founded by a charitable individual, but maintained at the public expense of the people themselves.”

Think that sums it up.

Chris
06-21-2013, 11:59 AM
Thomas Jefferson State of the Union Address December 2 1806 Every government degenerates when trusted to the rulers of the people alone. The people themselves are its only safe depositories. And to render even them safe, their minds must be improved to a certain degree. . . . An amendment to our constitution must here come in aid of the public education. The influence over government must be shared among all people.

John Adams, in 1785: “The whole people must take upon themselves the education of the whole people and be willing to bear the expenses of it. There should not be a district of one mile square, without a school in it, not founded by a charitable individual, but maintained at the public expense of the people themselves.”

Think that sums it up.

Yes, it does. Investigate Jefferson further and you will see his vision like Adams' for public education lie almost entirely at the district level. Each district should pool its funds and build and maintain a school. Only the best and brightest would move up to country level schools, and only the best and brightest of those up to state colleges. Period. No federal funding, no federal control.

And that was pretty much how schools were organized, you still see that in the use of local property taxes and bonds used for schools at least in Texas--until the likes of Dewey and then Eisenhower who saw an opportunity to indoctrinate kids against socialism/communism. Ironic how that backfired and now schools are institutions for learning socialism from leftwing professors.

Mister D
06-21-2013, 12:20 PM
I'd imagine he believed in local autonomy as well. That would drive a guy like nic completely out of his mind.

nic34
06-21-2013, 01:22 PM
Yes, it does. Investigate Jefferson further and you will see his vision like Adams' for public education lie almost entirely at the district level. Each district should pool its funds and build and maintain a school. Only the best and brightest would move up to country level schools, and only the best and brightest of those up to state colleges. Period. No federal funding, no federal control.

And that was pretty much how schools were organized, you still see that in the use of local property taxes and bonds used for schools at least in Texas--until the likes of Dewey and then Eisenhower who saw an opportunity to indoctrinate kids against socialism/communism. Ironic how that backfired and now schools are institutions for learning socialism from leftwing professors.

The difference today is that there are over 50 million school age children in the US. And more at at the college level. How do you think they would handle the education of that many Americans?

Indoctrination has been happening since the beginning. We don't always agree with it, but it's what nations and those in power do, and it evolves as we do.

Mainecoons
06-21-2013, 01:35 PM
That is exactly why your OP is silly. You are trying to equate a time when everything was different, including size, philosophy, funding, etc. to today.

A mind is a terrible thing to waste. Stop wasting yours on meaningless comparisons like this.

Chris
06-21-2013, 01:39 PM
The difference today is that there are over 50 million school age children in the US. And more at at the college level. How do you think they would handle the education of that many Americans?

Indoctrination has been happening since the beginning. We don't always agree with it, but it's what nations and those in power do, and it evolves as we do.

Why does that make a difference? From so many, federal government solution is a non sequitur. You need to show they couldn't handle it as they had before school became an institution of indoctrination.

nic34
06-21-2013, 01:41 PM
That is exactly why your OP is silly. You are trying to equate a time when everything was different, including size, philosophy, funding, etc. to today.

A mind is a terrible thing to waste. Stop wasting yours on meaningless comparisons like this.

The only thing silly is you and your silly kicking-smily, coonzie.

Report back when you can contribute with something besides your attack shtick.

Mainecoons
06-21-2013, 01:42 PM
In other words, you are so clueless you don't understand the concept of comparing apples and oranges.

OK. :rofl: