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Adelaide
07-25-2013, 04:11 PM
Do you think sex addiction is a real thing, yes or no? Also - do you think, regardless, that it is often used as an excuse for bad behaviour?

From the Daily Beast (which inspired my question):



To start with, sex addiction, formerly known as hypersexual disorder, is not labeled as a disorder in the American Psychiatric Association’s mental health handbook, the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, or the DSM. The phrase “sexual addiction” first showed up in the DSM in 1980 but was removed in 1994 due to lack of research (http://nymag.com/thecut/2013/05/too-much-or-too-little-dsm-vs-gray-area-on-sex.html). The phrase makes an appearance in the DSM-V (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/04/11/dsm-v-hoarding-binge-eating-more-new-mental-disorder-diagnoses.html), the edition released in 2012, but gets this description: “research suggests that sexual response is not always linear; uniform process and that distinction between certain phases (e.g. desire and arousal) may be artificial.”

Last week, scientists from the University of California Los Angeles published a study (http://www.socioaffectiveneuroscipsychol.net/index.php/snp/article/view/20770/28995) positing that sex addiction may not be similar to alcohol and drug addiction. Using 52 adults (13 women, 39 men), the scientists used electroencephalography (EEG) to measure the participants’ brain responses. Addicts have been found to have an increase in their P300 responses, or the brain waves in the first 300 milliseconds, when shown an image of their drug of choice. P300 has generally been used as a marker of addiction in the brain, so the UCLA scientists showed the participants pornographic images and measured their P300 responses—and the response found was related to high how their level of desire was but not the three measures of hypersexuality.

“This suggests that their brains aren’t responding to the brains of other addicts, or cues of other addiction,” one of the study’s authors, UCLA scientist Nicole Prause, told The Daily Beast. “It’s mostly questioning the addiction model.”

Is Anthony Weiner a Sex Addict, or Is There No Such Thing? - Daily Beast (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/07/24/is-anthony-weiner-a-sex-addict-or-is-there-no-such-thing.html)



So, I'm wondering what the members here think.

KC
07-25-2013, 04:14 PM
I'm not sure from a strictly medical perspective, but I think when you have sex your brain releases chemicals that can become addictive. Because of that I think it's definitely possible to be addicted to sex in the same way you can be addicted to any other substance that can cause these neuro chemical reactions.

GrassrootsConservative
07-25-2013, 04:15 PM
Near EVERYTHING can become an addiction.

Adelaide
07-25-2013, 04:32 PM
I'm not sure from a strictly medical perspective, but I think when you have sex your brain releases chemicals that can become addictive. Because of that I think it's definitely possible to be addicted to sex in the same way you can be addicted to any other substance that can cause these neuro chemical reactions.

According to a study done by Rutgers University, when someone is having sex 95% of the brain looks the same as someone who has injected heroin. It's much more complicated than that physiologically, but it's an interesting outcome of one research study.

Chris
07-25-2013, 04:35 PM
Sure, if your brain's pleasure pathway/reward system gets wired with that as solution to problems.

KC
07-25-2013, 04:38 PM
According to a study done by Rutgers University, when someone is having sex 95% of the brain looks the same as someone who has injected heroin. It's much more complicated than that physiologically, but it's an interesting outcome of one research study.


But I mean, you still get all that dopamine, which is addictive, isn't it?

Adelaide
07-25-2013, 04:47 PM
But I mean, you still get all that dopamine, which is addictive, isn't it?

It's involved in addiction, yeah, and sex also involves serotonin, oxytocin and adrenaline.

Mister D
07-25-2013, 04:47 PM
I've taken heroin (powder) and the obliviousness I felt I simply can't compare to anything.

I voted no.

KC
07-25-2013, 06:34 PM
I've taken heroin (powder) and the obliviousness I felt I simply can't compare to anything.

I voted no.

Right, it''s nothing like that, but you could still get addicted to sex, although it would be much better for you than the heroin would be.

Mister D
07-25-2013, 06:40 PM
Right, it''s nothing like that, but you could still get addicted to sex, although it would be much better for you than the heroin would be.

If you can it's only better in physical terms assuming you don't get STDs. It could still ruin your life, marriage, job etc.

metheron
07-25-2013, 06:43 PM
So, I'm wondering what the members here think.

Ha ha.....I am sorry, but I think if you polled the 'members', it would be a unanimous vote FOR addiction!

KC
07-25-2013, 06:47 PM
Ha ha.....I am sorry, but I think if you polled the 'members', it would be a unanimous vote FOR addiction!

3349

Adelaide
07-25-2013, 07:09 PM
Alright, so regardless of opinions on whether it's a real addiction or not; is it abused as an excuse?

Beevee
07-25-2013, 07:40 PM
Weiner, like many others, has been drawn into this type of behavior because he found something that was exciting without, (as he probably thought) causing any damage because it was being practiced between consenting adults. It probably works quite well for people outside of the entertainment industry because nobody knows who they are, and if they are not a celebrity (for want of a better world) nobody really cares.

Weiner on the other hand is an incredibly stupid person because once his actions became generally known, he then offered an apology which goes down quite well with many Americans because they all crave a second chance. I'm not claiming that is wrong but I'm not the forgiving type in situations such as this but I don't have a stake in it either.

He now wants a third chance because although he didn't reveal that he continued (after his apology) where he had left off, it didn't seem to matter until it mattered. He then got the support of his wife, whom it would appear did not support him to that extent after the first episode.

Weiner is a lucky man, as far as his marriage goes. He should quit while he is ahead in the marriage stakes because a man who wants a second chance and then a third chance will later want a fourth chance.

New Yorkers need a champion. He is far from that.

Chris
07-25-2013, 08:23 PM
Alright, so regardless of opinions on whether it's a real addiction or not; is it abused as an excuse?

You mean abused to use it as an excuse from responsibility?

That's a difficult question. Saying you're addicted as a disease you can't control could be argued, but, to me, to argue it, rationally, implies the capability to take the responsibility to seek psychiatric and/or other help.

Peter1469
07-25-2013, 08:55 PM
Alright, so regardless of opinions on whether it's a real addiction or not; is it abused as an excuse?



It is both. Real for some. And an excuse for others

TheInternet
07-25-2013, 09:01 PM
According to a study done by Rutgers University, when someone is having sex 95% of the brain looks the same as someone who has injected heroin. It's much more complicated than that physiologically, but it's an interesting outcome of one research study.

This statement on its own is not enough to draw any conclusions from.

Chris
07-25-2013, 09:05 PM
Right, it''s nothing like that, but you could still get addicted to sex, although it would be much better for you than the heroin would be.

Are you implying Mr D has never had sex? :grin20:

roadmaster
07-25-2013, 09:12 PM
It is both. Real for some. And an excuse for others I think it's more of an excuse for most but some do have problems.

KC
07-25-2013, 10:43 PM
Are you implying Mr D has never had sex? :grin20:

Lol no.

Adelaide
07-26-2013, 12:56 PM
You mean abused to use it as an excuse from responsibility?

That's a difficult question. Saying you're addicted as a disease you can't control could be argued, but, to me, to argue it, rationally, implies the capability to take the responsibility to seek psychiatric and/or other help.

I mean do you think, for example, that famous men who get caught up in sex scandals - do they abuse the term/idea/concept of sex addiction for PR purposes.

Chris
07-26-2013, 12:59 PM
I mean do you think, for example, that famous men who get caught up in sex scandals - do they abuse the term/idea/concept of sex addiction for PR purposes.

Some, yes. With Weiner it almost seems like he's not using it as an excuse but to his advantage. Warped, yes.

fyrenza
07-26-2013, 06:56 PM
I mean do you think, for example, that famous men who get caught up in sex scandals - do they abuse the term/idea/concept of sex addiction for PR purposes.

In ^this^ context, my vote would have been a resounding "YES;"

however, I took it as a general statement regarding the addiction being a "disease,"

and voted "No."

In order to consummate the addiction,
I believe that you have to CONCENTRATE on the object of desire,
and (sorry to be so crass) anyone could "take care of themselves,"
without ever involving another person.

IOW, it if was JUST an "addiction," you'd satisfy it as quickly and easily as possible.

Ever heard of an addict that said No to a lesser quality of product? ...

jillian
07-26-2013, 07:15 PM
I mean do you think, for example, that famous men who get caught up in sex scandals - do they abuse the term/idea/concept of sex addiction for PR purposes.

i don't think people play up being sex addicts. i can't see where it would help them.

Mister D
07-26-2013, 08:17 PM
It could be (it is) that famous men feel entitled to do as they please. Such me are made.

Dr. Who
07-27-2013, 12:53 AM
While there may be a brain chemistry aspect to it, I view it as a compulsion, something similar to OCD. Compulsive behaviors can be treated.

Chris
07-27-2013, 08:27 AM
While there may be a brain chemistry aspect to it, I view it as a compulsion, something similar to OCD. Compulsive behaviors can be treated.

The compulsion is brain chemistry, as you call it. "Problems with the serotonin pathway can cause obsessive-compulsive disorder, anxiety disorders, and depression. Most of the drugs used to treat depression today work by increasing serotonin levels in the brain." @ http://learn.genetics.utah.edu/content/addiction/reward/pathways.html

Common
07-27-2013, 08:28 AM
Do you think sex addiction is a real thing, yes or no? Also - do you think, regardless, that it is often used as an excuse for bad behaviour?

From the Daily Beast (which inspired my question):



Is Anthony Weiner a Sex Addict, or Is There No Such Thing? - Daily Beast (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/07/24/is-anthony-weiner-a-sex-addict-or-is-there-no-such-thing.html)



So, I'm wondering what the members here think.


You have pedophilia which you can say is a compulsion. Why isnt a sex addict someone who cannot control their urges, like a pedophile in the same category psychologically.
There is a sexual syndrome where a person masturbates continually all day long, they cant function, they cant work they cant go out.
Recently there was a woman that allowed an interview about it and said she wanted to commit suicide over it. My point is there are all kinds of compulsions and they all have to have some kind of psychological component I would think.

jillian
07-27-2013, 10:18 AM
You have pedophilia which you can say is a compulsion. Why isnt a sex addict someone who cannot control their urges, like a pedophile in the same category psychologically.
There is a sexual syndrome where a person masturbates continually all day long, they cant function, they cant work they cant go out.
Recently there was a woman that allowed an interview about it and said she wanted to commit suicide over it. My point is there are all kinds of compulsions and they all have to have some kind of psychological component I would think.

well, i think part of it is that a sex addict is still dealing with other consensual adults.... a pedophile is a criminal, so the former wouldn't seem as pressing....

unless, of course, you happen to be married to the sex addict

Common
07-27-2013, 06:03 PM
well, i think part of it is that a sex addict is still dealing with other consensual adults.... a pedophile is a criminal, so the former wouldn't seem as pressing....

unless, of course, you happen to be married to the sex addict

I wasnt talking crime I was talking mental illness or psychological aspect

jillian
07-27-2013, 06:04 PM
I wasnt talking crime I was talking mental illness or psychological aspect

would depend on how damaging to the sex addict's life his addiction is...

or maybe people don't discuss it.

Sytha
07-27-2013, 09:51 PM
Do you think sex addiction is a real thing, yes or no? Also - do you think, regardless, that it is often used as an excuse for bad behaviour?

From the Daily Beast (which inspired my question):



Is Anthony Weiner a Sex Addict, or Is There No Such Thing? - Daily Beast (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/07/24/is-anthony-weiner-a-sex-addict-or-is-there-no-such-thing.html)



So, I'm wondering what the members here think.


all addictions are used as an excuse....

Adelaide
07-28-2013, 12:08 AM
all addictions are used as an excuse....

How do you mean?

I would agree that usually before someone gets treatment for any addiction, people will often use it as an excuse for poor behaviour. Sometimes it is legitimate.

With individuals like Tiger Woods and Weiner, I have to wonder if they're using the idea/concept of sex addiction as an excuse, and perhaps don't have the addictions.

fyrenza
07-28-2013, 12:15 AM
Doesn't everyone that is addicted to something put the blame on IT for "making them DO these terrible things"?

What's also known as "using, as an excuse, to excuse bad behavior"?

Sytha
07-28-2013, 12:58 PM
How do you mean?

I would agree that usually before someone gets treatment for any addiction, people will often use it as an excuse for poor behaviour. Sometimes it is legitimate.

With individuals like Tiger Woods and Weiner, I have to wonder if they're using the idea/concept of sex addiction as an excuse, and perhaps don't have the addictions.

its pretty self explanatory... all addicts use their addiction as and excuse for what ever bad behavior they decide to get themselves into.

it is sad that others with any real addiction will claim one as and excuse for bad behavior..... rather like a murder claiming insanity as a way out.

Chris
07-28-2013, 01:02 PM
Sometimes, it seems anyway, addictions use addicts. Addiction can cause all sorts of problem the addict's brain has been wired to resolve with the addiction, endless feedback loop.

Max Rockatansky
07-28-2013, 03:09 PM
Do you think sex addiction is a real thing, yes or no? Also - do you think, regardless, that it is often used as an excuse for bad behaviour?

Yes to both. In Weiner's case, I think he is addicted which makes him totally unfit for office even if he attends rehab. Addictive personalities can be treated, but they'll always be addictive personalities. There is treatment, but there isn't a cure.

Once an addict, always an addict. Some are just strong enough to be recovering, but they're still addicts.

Max Rockatansky
07-28-2013, 03:18 PM
Sometimes, it seems anyway, addictions use addicts. Addiction can cause all sorts of problem the addict's brain has been wired to resolve with the addiction, endless feedback loop.

Agreed. It's a problem, but not an excuse. Addicts who use their addiction as an excuse aren't interested in recovery and, IMO, shouldn't be trusted.

chris123678
08-11-2013, 08:05 PM
I think that anything that brings pleasure can lead to an addiction if it's abused.

Chris
08-11-2013, 08:09 PM
I think that anything that brings pleasure can lead to an addiction if it's abused.

Think you're right. 60 minutes just did a piece on gambling addiction and how withdrawal results in the same symptoms as heroin addiction.

chris123678
08-11-2013, 08:12 PM
Think you're right. 60 minutes just did a piece on gambling addiction and how withdrawal results in the same symptoms as heroin addiction.

I did indeed see that broadcast. Now days, it's becoming easier for sex addicts, drug addicts, addicts of any kind to feed into their addictions, in my opinion.

Chris
08-11-2013, 08:22 PM
I did indeed see that broadcast. Now days, it's becoming easier for sex addicts, drug addicts, addicts of any kind to feed into their addictions, in my opinion.

Addiction is recursive in that sense. In order to avoid problems, anxiety, say, people use drugs, but using drugs often causes anxiety, if only the anxiety to get more. Like feedback between guitar and amp it escalates out of control. Your pleasure pathways get hardwired.

chris123678
08-11-2013, 08:32 PM
Addiction is recursive in that sense. In order to avoid problems, anxiety, say, people use drugs, but using drugs often causes anxiety, if only the anxiety to get more. Like feedback between guitar and amp it escalates out of control. Your pleasure pathways get hardwired.

What a good point. It always makes me wonder how people become sex addicts, I' would think people would be more mindful of their habits and sex partners.

jillian
08-11-2013, 08:38 PM
I did indeed see that broadcast. Now days, it's becoming easier for sex addicts, drug addicts, addicts of any kind to feed into their addictions, in my opinion.

so you think regulating things ends addiction?

chris123678
08-11-2013, 10:11 PM
so you think regulating things ends addiction?


No but doing things in moderation stops addiction before it even begins.

jillian
08-11-2013, 10:24 PM
No but doing things in moderation stops addiction before it even begins.

addictive personalities can't do things in moderation and being addicted would make it impossible to be moderate. if it didn't, addiction treatment would be more effective, i'd think.

chris123678
08-11-2013, 11:09 PM
addictive personalities can't do things in moderation and being addicted would make it impossible to be moderate. if it didn't, addiction treatment would be more effective, i'd think.

I'm saying that they should regulate and do things in moderation before getting addicted.

Chris
08-12-2013, 07:46 AM
addictive personalities can't do things in moderation and being addicted would make it impossible to be moderate. if it didn't, addiction treatment would be more effective, i'd think.

And you'd be wrong. Having an addictive personality doesn't mean you will be an addict or that once one you cannot moderate or recover from it. All it means is you have a predisposition to addiction. And scientists are not even sure about that.


Alan R. Lang, a psychology professor at Florida State University, wrote in a study that the continuing search for the personality traits that play a part in the development of addictions are important for the broader fight against addiction.[1] Identifying the different personality traits will help in the long term when it comes to the treatment of addiction, the strategies to intervene, and how to break the pattern of addiction.[21] With addictive tragedies becoming prevalent in communities around the nation, scientists are asking questions about the aspects of psychological makeup and how they contribute to addiction.[1] They also want to know if there are common threads that are in all addictions, from hard drugs to cigarettes and from gambling to overeating.[1] Through the information that already exists on the personality's role in addictions, with a lot of emphasis on drugs and alcohol, a study from the National Academy of Sciences says that there is no single set of psychological characteristics that pertain to all addictions.[1] The study did show, however, that there are common elements between all addictions.[1]

@ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Addictive_personality

Chris
08-12-2013, 07:50 AM
I'm saying that they should regulate and do things in moderation before getting addicted.

IOW, preempt addiction. That's interesting. I used to work for a biomedical company and what we did was R&D genetic tests for predisposition to disease--periodontitis, heart disease, diabetes, osteoporosis. If there are addictive personalities, a disposition to addiction, then that too could be detected early, as in other diseases, to begin early preventative treatment.

bladimz
08-12-2013, 07:57 AM
You have pedophilia which you can say is a compulsion. Why isnt a sex addict someone who cannot control their urges, like a pedophile in the same category psychologically.
I think a sex addict is usually not interested in controlling their urges...

bladimz
08-12-2013, 08:10 AM
I'm saying that they should regulate and do things in moderation before getting addicted.Of course they should do things in moderation. Everyone should refrain from eating too much. People should only watch television in moderation (i believe), and swear (if they feel compelled) in moderation. But "should" isn't a reflection of what happens in the real world.

bladimz
08-12-2013, 08:27 AM
My Son-in-law posted this on facebook:

http://www.cnn.com/2013/08/09/opinion/samuels-pot-addiction/index.html?eref=mrss_igoogle_cnn


Legalizing pot isn't about medicine, it's about getting high

The very idea [of legalization of marijuana] of that sickens me. I know what marijuana does to the human mind because I started smoking weed when I was 15 years old. It literally robbed me of my motivation to participate in my own life. I was absolutely OK with sitting around all day eating cookies and watching television and getting high with my friends. But, to go out and earn a living and do something with my life? That was all stuff that I was going to do later after I came down off of the marijuana. But, then I'd smoke some more and think, "Why bother?" . . . and, eventually, I started shooting heroin. If my family had not intervened and sought professional help, I would probably still be wandering aimlessly through the streets today; searching for that elusive "perfect high."

Even if you only stay with marijuana in your repertoire of illicit drugs to abuse, it will never yield positive results. Ever.
And, I posit this to marijuana abusers everywhere: Are you really that weak? Are you really that uncomfortable in your own skin that you can't handle living your life or having real experiences without being high? Is it really impossible for you to live life without a drug? Because, if it is, it breaks my heart and I feel sorry for you. Because that's no way to live.The whole article is incredibly inane. He tries to sell the idea that everyone who uses will respond to marijuana in the same manner as he did as a 15 year old kid.

I especially liked one of the reader responses at the end of the article:


1CPBMichigan62
...As someone who was court ordered into treatment and watched how the program was tailored to suck me and my insurance company for every dime they could claim I know exactly what you what you mean. When I actually walked in on my own after 6 court ordered failures, they wanted nothing to do with me. I was thrown out within a month because I wanted to finally straighten myself out and they could not hold the threat of a jail sentence over my head anymore. The author is a co-founder of a clinic that would lose a considerable amount of money if pot were legalized. The guy is looking out for his business, using fear tactics in the process.

jillian
08-12-2013, 08:41 AM
I'm saying that they should regulate and do things in moderation before getting addicted.

it doesn't work that way. there are addictions (e.g. heroin, cocaine, cigarettes) which kick in almost immediately. also, addiction is a medical issue and there are people who can have a drink every night ... no problem. others can't have even one.

addiction is not an issue of "choice" or being immoderate.

jillian
08-12-2013, 08:45 AM
And you'd be wrong. Having an addictive personality doesn't mean you will be an addict or that once one you cannot moderate or recover from it. All it means is you have a predisposition to addiction. And scientists are not even sure about that.



@ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Addictive_personality

thanks for the "opinion" and for omitting this part of the link which refers to physical causes of addiction.


While there is debate over whether this is one “addictive personality,” there seem to be people who are particularly vulnerable to develop an addiction to certain substances or behaviors. The causes of this addiction proneness, or addictive personality, are best examined through looking at biological, psychological, and environmental (social) factors.

additionally, your wikipedia link indicates there is no set cause for addiction.

thanks for relying on your usual confirmation bias.

Chris
08-12-2013, 09:05 AM
it doesn't work that way. there are addictions (e.g. heroin, cocaine, cigarettes) which kick in almost immediately. also, addiction is a medical issue and there are people who can have a drink every night ... no problem. others can't have even one.

addiction is not an issue of "choice" or being immoderate.


Addiction itself may not be but the addicted do have a choice. If not then there is no hope of recovery.

Chris
08-12-2013, 09:12 AM
thanks for the "opinion" and for omitting this part of the link which refers to physical causes of addiction.



additionally, your wikipedia link indicates there is no set cause for addiction.

thanks for relying on your usual confirmation bias.



Of course it's an opinion, but at least I backed it up with sources from psychology, unlike you who merely posts opinion.


The additional material you cited from my link only serves to further support my opinion.

Your opinion, unsupported, was "addictive personalities can't do things in moderation".

What you cite:


While there is debate over whether this is one “addictive personality,” there seem to be people who are particularly vulnerable to develop an addiction to certain substances or behaviors. The causes of this addiction proneness, or addictive personality, are best examined through looking at biological, psychological, and environmental (social) factors.

Adds to my point about disposition with "vulnerable", "proness", synonyms for disposition.

Thanks.

Moreover “addictive personality” is not the fact you claimed it was in your opinion, but is something debated over. Science, junie, is tentative, incomplete and probabilistic. It is not as certain as your opinions.

Thanks, again.




your wikipedia link indicates there is no set cause for addiction

Who argued there was? That's just another counter to your certain but erroneous opinion.




thanks for relying on your usual confirmation bias

Rather it is confirmation bias that allows you to read things counter to your opinion and claim they support your opinion.




I think what this is is just another case of you engaging in another personal pissing context with no concern for exchanging opinions and ideas. Seems to me you just can't bear disagreement, you take it personal, and then use that misjudgment as justification to get personal.