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View Full Version : Court: Okla. ban on Islamic law unconstitutional



roadmaster
01-11-2012, 12:14 AM
http://hosted2.ap.org/ALDEC/TDNational/Article_2012-01-10-Islamic%20Law-Lawsuit/id-b988c3da919145b4bb6c8250a3654e09

Awad argued that the ban on Islamic law would likely affect every aspect of his life as well as the execution of his will after his death. The appeals court pointed out that Awad made a "strong showing" of potential harm.
"When the law that voters wish to enact is likely unconstitutional, their interests do not outweigh Mr. Awad's in having his constitutional rights protected," the court said.

They are still trying to get there own laws here.

Conley
01-11-2012, 12:17 AM
What's to keep people from making up their own religion to avoid laws they don't like? Once that happens, how does the government decide which religions to accept and which to reject? It's a slippery slope.

roadmaster
01-11-2012, 12:21 AM
We don't have in courts what we call Christian laws, everyone goes by the same. They want their own counts like they have in other countries. I believe Canada gave them some. We should not bend to these people.

wingrider
01-11-2012, 04:33 AM
you all are right on the money

what this will lead to in my opinion is muslims will be able to follow their own sharia law and not be held accountable in our court system,

honor killings and mutilations of women , murder of gays etc will all get a pass because it is a part of their religion.

MMC
01-11-2012, 05:14 AM
It is already started to happen here in this Country. Comes with a Gated Community, with their own Security Guards and or Community Police. The Community's Association Charter and or membership. Just like retired senior communities. 55 and older to live in such a community. Like Sun City Arizona. They have a few communities like this all around Chicago or In the City.

How would any know what takes place in such a community if they hold their own court? Have their own jail cell. Whom in the Muslim Community will go outside their Religious Elders and those they themselves choose to govern over themselves? Specifically speaking of Arab Communities and not other Muslims.

CoLibertarian
02-10-2012, 09:36 PM
I wonder what people would think if a law was passed to prevent the court system from using Leviticus as a reference.


BTW for those trying to suggest that honor killings (etc etc) will now be allowed, um... Really?!? Before I slam on you, do you really believe that?

CoLibertarian
02-10-2012, 09:38 PM
It is already started to happen here in this Country. Comes with a Gated Community, with their own Security Guards and or Community Police. The Community's Association Charter and or membership. Just like retired senior communities. 55 and older to live in such a community. Like Sun City Arizona. They have a few communities like this all around Chicago or In the City.

How would any know what takes place in such a community if they hold their own court? Have their own jail cell. Whom in the Muslim Community will go outside their Religious Elders and those they themselves choose to govern over themselves? Specifically speaking of Arab Communities and not other Muslims.

Now this is much more likely - although probably not with imprisonment. Much more likely with fines.

MMC
02-10-2012, 09:53 PM
Now this is much more likely - although probably not with imprisonment. Much more likely with fines.

Yeah, I wouldnt really think they would imprison. Yet we have seen these guys kill their own kids and women. So beatings and their punishments would be known amongst their religious caste.

CoLibertarian
02-10-2012, 09:57 PM
Yeah, I wouldnt really think they would imprison. Yet we have seen these guys kill their own kids and women. So beatings and their punishments would be known amongst their religious caste.

There are those that argue for the right to beat their own children that are not among the Muslims. How do you feel about that?

MMC
02-10-2012, 10:13 PM
Such may be the case but are those that do looking to set up gated communites and proceed to live life by their own set of laws? IMO no one has the right to beat their Children. But they do have the right to correct their children and or discipline them.

CoLibertarian
02-10-2012, 10:23 PM
Such may be the case but are those that do looking to set up gated communites and proceed to live life by their own set of laws? IMO no one has the right to beat their Children. But they do have the right to correct their children and or discipline them.

What is wrong with setting up a community to live by their own rules (so long as freedom to live within that community is voluntary)? Are you not suggesting that you support the way the 14th amendment is currently being applied - ie that the beliefs of the majority are more important than private property right?

As far as "beating" and "correcting" or "disciplining" goes, those are up for interpretation. What is discipline for one person might indeed be abuse to another. Why should the communities people live in not be the best judge of what is what?

MMC
02-10-2012, 10:36 PM
Is that there Freedom for those women and children to come and go in a Muslim Community? To do as they please? To be able to try and follow the laws of the country they are living in as a Citizen of that country. Only to live as second class citizens in their communities. That they should not hold any prominent positions and must accept the law of their religious elders over the laws of their state and or country?

CoLibertarian
02-10-2012, 10:48 PM
Is that there Freedom for those women and children to come and go in a Muslim Community? To do as they please? To be able to try and follow the laws of the country they are living in as a Citizen of that country. Only to live as second class citizens in their communities. That they should not hold any prominent positions and must accept the law of their religious elders over the laws of their state and or country?

Take the word Muslim out of your question and replace that with some other word such as Quaker, or Mormon, or Fundamentalist. Then answer your own question.

MMC
02-10-2012, 11:00 PM
Oh I am sure I can throw out some Occult groups as well. Perhaps some Militant Communities as well. I take it you have been overseas to understand what it is to live in a Arab Muslim Community? Where when you want to go and pray freely to Christ, that you may do so Freely. Would you happen to know life lived under Sharia law?

CoLibertarian
02-10-2012, 11:06 PM
Oh I am sure I can throw out some Occult groups as well. Perhaps some Militant Communities as well. I take it you have been overseas to understand what it is to live in a Arab Muslim Community? Where when you want to go and pray freely to Christ, that you may do so Freely. Would you happen to know life lived under Sharia law?

Not only have I been overseas to the Middle East (which I detest BTW), but I live with an Iranian exchange student, and my mother is a converted Muslim. Not all Muslims believe in the same Sharia Law that is portrayed by Faux News.

The point is that I believe in personal choice. Too many people in this country (both from the left and right) want to use the force of government to force other people to live under their rules. I disagree with that practice.

MMC
02-10-2012, 11:30 PM
Not only have I been overseas to the Middle East (which I detest BTW), but I live with an Iranian exchange student, and my mother is a converted Muslim. Not all Muslims believe in the same Sharia Law that is portrayed by Faux News.

The point is that I believe in personal choice. Too many people in this country (both from the left and right) want to use the force of government to force other people to live under their rules. I disagree with that practice.

Course they don't. Moreover I doubt they would know anything about Fox News, especially all those overseas. So that perception is only one from the 21st Century, and can only be played upon by those in this Country.

I can agree on that people want to use the force of government. Yet when one accept those laws and government. Then thats what they should use. The process within the law.

I to have lived with Muslims, including militant muslims. Yet within the Arab Muslim Community are women and children allowed to live by personal choice?

CoLibertarian
02-11-2012, 08:46 AM
Course they don't. Moreover I doubt they would know anything about Fox News, especially all those overseas. So that perception is only one from the 21st Century, and can only be played upon by those in this Country.

I can agree on that people want to use the force of government. Yet when one accept those laws and government. Then thats what they should use. The process within the law.

I to have lived with Muslims, including militant muslims. Yet within the Arab Muslim Community are women and children allowed to live by personal choice?

Within most communities, children are not allow to live by personal choice. What is the difference between what you are suggesting about what the government should do about how children are raised within Muslim communities and what lefty socialists suggest the government should do with children in Christian communities?

Yes there is a social contract that all people (regardless of religion) must follow if they choose to be part of that society. However, our society is supposed to allow for a wide variety of personal liberty and choice. We have the right of contract and the right of private property. We should have the right to contract within this society to formulate communities we wish to belong to. If you choose to ignore those rights (with Muslims) what is to prevent some other majority from ignoring your right to do the same?

Getting back to the original question, what if the law passed had been about not using Leviticus as a reference for rules of law? Leviticus is far worse than Sharia Law and only an insane person would suggest it should ever be considered. However, imagine what the outcry would be if Leviticus was the target and not Sharia. Thus, to me, the law in question is nothing more than prejudice being written into law and is an abuse of the majority over a minority.

MMC
02-11-2012, 09:01 AM
Do you think Romans, Chinese, American Indians, Mezo American Indians, and the Hindus were using Leviticus? Or were you acquainting all with Sharia with what has been stated for the last 30 yrs?

CoLibertarian
02-11-2012, 09:04 AM
Do you think Romans, Chinese, American Indians, Mezo American Indians, and the Hindus were using Leviticus? Or were you acquainting all with Sharia with what has been stated for the last 30 yrs?

I don't think anyone (other than a maniac - ala Dr Laura) tries to use Leviticus as an indicator of what law should be. The point is more about what would happen if instead of Sharia, Leviticus was the aim of the law.