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Libhater
10-01-2013, 05:39 PM
Obamacare is like the early stages of Communism. Oh, how nice! :evil:

http://godfatherpolitics.com/12723/bill-clinton-says-americans-will-get-use-communism/

fyrenza
10-01-2013, 05:51 PM
Sort of like how a frog will "get used to" boiling water ... http://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=images&cd=&docid=n9-792YJDPlP2M&tbnid=CleWieUzuqTCSM:&ved=0CAUQjBwwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.retrojunkie.com%2Fgif%2Ffacep alm.gif&ei=0VFLUrjfFceayQHgrYGwDA&psig=AFQjCNE6rQP7B_spHR0SX_ngekQCyqpw2A&ust=1380754257403834

kilgram
10-01-2013, 05:56 PM
ROFLM and LOL

Cthulhu
10-01-2013, 05:56 PM
Obamacare is like the early stages of Communism. Oh, how nice! :evil:

http://godfatherpolitics.com/12723/bill-clinton-says-americans-will-get-use-communism/

Misleading title.

Don't get me wrong, Clinton is a scumbag, and obamacare is a monster. But Clinton didn't say that.

Telling lies and getting caught does not further the cause of truth, justice, and the American way.

Shame.

Axiomatic
10-01-2013, 06:05 PM
He's right.

Singularity
10-01-2013, 06:45 PM
The central problem Republicans face is that the line between random firebrands on the Internet and what they tend to say is too heavily blurred for most Americans to care. That's a situation entirely of their own making. For a party that's gotta win at least something close to more than half of the electorate... or face the doldrums of being a permanent minority... that's not a good situation.

Mainecoons
10-01-2013, 06:46 PM
But of course the Democrats don't have the same firebrands and problems.

As usual, your bias is showing.

FAIL

zelmo1234
10-01-2013, 07:04 PM
Here is the funny part. The Democrats are saying the will not negotiate, and will not compromise, they are calling for the Republicans to compromise!

They say they are willing to have the debate on cutting spending and restrictions on the ACA, but not during the CR or the Debt ceiling increase those need to be all their way with the republicans giving in!

So they will talk about it, but only after they have all the money they need and they have the CR (remember we do not have a budget) approved so they get to spend it their way?

Does anyone think that they will be willing to compromise if the only consequence is they get everything their way? NO! of course not.

The problem is they are having to openly say that they are not willing to compromise on anything and thus are having to defend the Waivers that allow them to receive a subsidy, even those they all make over 140K per year. and they have to defend all the waivers that they gave to special interests and business but are not giving to the America people!

And they have to do this by saying that they are not even willing to talk to the republicans.

They have better hope that the dumbing down educational system that they have been working on for the last few decades worked, because this is really easy for people to see through!

Green Arrow
10-01-2013, 07:22 PM
I don't care for Clinton, but lying about something he said is just plain dishonest.

Codename Section
10-01-2013, 07:25 PM
The central problem Republicans face is that the line between random firebrands on the Internet and what they tend to say is too heavily blurred for most Americans to care. That's a situation entirely of their own making. For a party that's gotta win at least something close to more than half of the electorate... or face the doldrums of being a permanent minority... that's not a good situation.

Well, that's not really true. My generation hates both parties and swings libertarian. Rand Paul, not Obama, is the most popular political figure with the 18-30 crowd.

He's a Republican last I heard.

jillian
10-01-2013, 08:53 PM
Obamacare is like the early stages of Communism. Oh, how nice! :evil:

http://godfatherpolitics.com/12723/bill-clinton-says-americans-will-get-use-communism/

too bad he never said anything like that.

wingnuts are.... wacked.

sky dancer
10-01-2013, 08:54 PM
Well, that's not really true. My generation hates both parties and swings libertarian. Rand Paul, not Obama, is the most popular political figure with the 18-30 crowd.

He's a Republican last I heard.
What is your generation and why is it you think you speak for it?

jillian
10-01-2013, 08:57 PM
Well, that's not really true. My generation hates both parties and swings libertarian. Rand Paul, not Obama, is the most popular political figure with the 18-30 crowd.

He's a Republican last I heard.

not your "generation".. .some.

you really should start fact checking rand... he doesn't get a lot right.

although ted cruz actually managed to make him look good this past week.

sorry, hon. i'm on a mission to bring you to the light. no insult intended.

the president got at least 60% of voters between 18 and 29.... twice

those people aren't voting for someone who opposes the civil rights act and is anti-choice.

Codename Section
10-01-2013, 09:00 PM
not your "generation".. .some.

you really should start fact checking rand... he doesn't get a lot right.

although ted cruz actually managed to make him look good this past week.

sorry, hon. i'm on a mission to bring you to the light. no insult intended.

I'm on the same mission with you. :) But only cuz you're my favorite.

Codename Section
10-01-2013, 09:00 PM
What is your generation and why is it you think you speak for it?

Gen Y. They voted me Speaker of the Generation cuz I'm so good looking and charismatic.

Cthulhu
10-01-2013, 09:04 PM
sorry, hon. i'm on a mission to bring you to the light. no insult intended.

Get in line. Not done yet.


Gen Y. They voted me Speaker of the Generation cuz I'm so good looking and charismatic.

Still working on that humility aspect though. But if its true...well, it's true I guess.

fyrenza
10-01-2013, 09:07 PM
Sounds more like Generation Duh! to me ...

just sayin'

Codename Section
10-01-2013, 09:10 PM
Get in line. Not done yet.


I'm a work in progress.





Still working on that humility aspect though. But if its true...well, it's true I guess.


Yeh, I have a hard time with that humility thing.

Codename Section
10-01-2013, 09:10 PM
Sounds more like Generation Duh! to me ...

just sayin'

google: Rand Paul popularity with millennials

Libhater
10-01-2013, 10:34 PM
I know that Bill Clinton's suggestion that obamacare will in time be accepted as a normal part of life similar to Medicare and Medicaid isn't something the leftists on this forum would admit to being an early stage of communism. I get that, for that is part and parcel to the spin and deception attributed to leftist ideology.


But obamacare like communism are ideologies based on an idea to 'equalize' the masses. Just like in early 20th century Russia as with early 21st century obamacare/obamunism--everybody had and or will have the same medical care, living space, food, and nutrition needs. They were and or will be in fact all "equally" malnourished and woefully poor.

So whether Bill Clinton says Americans will get used to Obama's brand of communism or Obama himself saying "I actually believe in redistribution" and an equalizing of the masses, there is no mistaken Obama's communist plan for America. So go ahead lefties....SPIN DEM FACTS!!!!!!!!

Mr Happy
10-01-2013, 10:37 PM
I don't care for Clinton, but lying about something he said is just plain dishonest.

He's called Libhater for a reason y'know...just sayin'...

Mr Happy
10-01-2013, 10:41 PM
But obamacare like communism are ideologies based on an idea to 'equalize' the masses

You say that like it's a bad thing...

Green Arrow
10-01-2013, 10:41 PM
He's called Libhater for a reason y'know...just sayin'...

Yes, because he's a hateful ass who has a penchant for lies and ignorance. I know him well. I've been on two other forums with him before this one.

Mr Happy
10-01-2013, 10:49 PM
Oh right. Didn't know he got around that much. Good to know..

fyrenza
10-01-2013, 10:59 PM
What other sites do y'all visit?

I "straddle" a couple of smaller forums, and here,
but I don't like huge places,

and when you try to search, it's just this mish-mash of crap.

And no one has a social forum, for folks to just go and shoot the breeze?

Amazing. In a horrible sort of way, but still ...

Agravan
10-01-2013, 11:35 PM
http://ul.to/x29zr7mr
I'm a work in progress.




Yeh, I have a hard time with that humility thing.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCsNunGnqE0

peoshi
10-02-2013, 02:24 AM
You say that like it's a bad thing...It is a bad thing, unless your willing to let others dictate your life.

Are you comfortable with the government making all your decisions for you?

Do you think I am somehow obligated to subsidize others who are too lazy to support themselves? Do you think anyone is?

Do you do anything to support these people in the US,happy...other than telling me I should?

Libhater
10-02-2013, 06:48 AM
You say that like it's a bad thing...


Well yeah, I have yet to hear from any of you leftists to the positive tenets of communism. I'm sure you don't need me to tell you of the mass slaughter of Christians at the hands of Communists in the 20th century. So again, communism and obamunism/obamacare are identical ideologies in their attempt to equalize the people(s) via centralized government. What part of this don't you understand? The only thing left for us here to see is for you and that green arrow chap to admit that you favor a full fledged communist takeover of America and that the two of you are indeed 100% Marxist commies yourself.

Green Arrow
10-02-2013, 06:51 AM
Well yeah, I have yet to hear from any of you leftists to the positive tenets of communism. I'm sure you don't need me to tell you of the mass slaughter of Christians at the hands of Communists in the 20th century. So again, communism and obamunism/obamacare are identical ideologies in their attempt to equalize the people(s) via centralized government. What part of this don't you understand? The only thing left for us here to see is for you and that green arrow chap to admit that you favor a full fledged communist takeover of America and that the two of you are indeed 100% Marxist commies yourself.

You will never hear me admit that, because it's not true. I'm a socialist, not a Marxist or a communist. I think communism is too extreme and Marx was an authoritarian. I am anti-authoritarian.

kilgram
10-02-2013, 06:56 AM
You will never hear me admit that, because it's not true. I'm a socialist, not a Marxist or a communist. I think communism is too extreme and Marx was an authoritarian. I am anti-authoritarian.
For you what is the difference between Socialism and Communism?

Libhater
10-02-2013, 06:57 AM
You will never hear me admit that, because it's not true. I'm a socialist, not a Marxist or a communist. I think communism is too extreme and Marx was an authoritarian. I am anti-authoritarian.

There isn't a penny's worth of difference between communism, marxism, progressivism and socialism, for they are all authoritarian in the fact that they all have a centralized government calling the shots. There is no freedom or no liberty for the people who unfortunately live under any or all of those ideologies.....NONE!!!!!!!

Green Arrow
10-02-2013, 06:58 AM
There isn't a penny's worth of difference between communism, marxism, progressivism and socialism, for they are all authoritarian in the fact that they all have a centralized government calling the shots. There is no freedom or no liberty for the people who unfortunately live under any or all of those ideologies.....NONE!!!!!!!

I'm well aware that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Green Arrow
10-02-2013, 06:59 AM
For you what is the difference between Socialism and Communism?

The same as the difference between capitalism and corporatism. One is a more extreme form of the other. Communists demand the forcible seizing of the means of production. Socialists do not (unless they are authoritarian, but that's a totally different animal).

Libhater
10-02-2013, 07:05 AM
I'm well aware that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Seems to me that 'YOU' just can't admit that you're anti capitalism and anti American at the same time, and that you favor a centralized government that prevents people from enjoying or having their freedoms.

Alyosha
10-02-2013, 07:07 AM
Here's my problem with communism kilgram and Green Arrow and this is from someone who lived under an alleged "vanguard state" and that is that when you give any group of people the type of control that enables them to collectivize and centralize the economic system of the country, you also give it the power to control everything and when people have that power they've yet to use it for good.

None of the progressives or even neocons want to acknowledge that the US government is out of control because both sides of the aisle believe to an extent "for the greater good" and allows that to cloud their judgment.

Someone nice like jillian will look to the end of Jim Crow laws and believe that the greater good was performed with the civil rights act by government. I'm sure we'd all agree, but we have to remember that it was government that wrote those laws to begin with.

Fixing what you broke in the first place is not praise worthy.

Conservatives were okay when Bush rolled out the Patriot Act never believing that they would see an ultra fake liberal wield that power, and progressives believe the Republicans will never get into high office or own the Senate again so they wield their "greater good" power like a huge fist.

Their lack of foresight and acknowledgment of history is the country's undoing. We're already in danger and we haven't given government the power it would take to collectivize yet.

I'm all for sharing. I'm all for community cooperatives. I'm not for force.

Cigar
10-02-2013, 07:07 AM
Obamacare is like the early stages of Communism. Oh, how nice! :evil:

http://godfatherpolitics.com/12723/bill-clinton-says-americans-will-get-use-communism/

Didn't we hear this like 30 years ago ... ? :rollseyes:

Mainecoons
10-02-2013, 07:07 AM
Socialism always ends up being authoritarian. It has to be because people do not want to give the fruits of their labor to others who don't labor.

Socialist countries always have big bureaucracies to enforce that voluntarism.

There really is no such thing as voluntary socialism. It is pie in the sky.

Green Arrow
10-02-2013, 07:10 AM
Seems to me that 'YOU' just can't admit that you're anti capitalism and anti American at the same time, and that you favor a centralized government that prevents people from enjoying or having their freedoms.

Oh, I have no problem admitting I'm anti-capitalist, although my an-cap friends like Alyosha have convinced me to at least give their form a try.

But I am absolutely NOT anti-America and I hate centralized government. I'm so pro-America that if you cut me, I bleed red, white, and blue.

Green Arrow
10-02-2013, 07:12 AM
Socialism always ends up being authoritarian.

Except for when it doesn't.


It has to be because people do not want to give the fruits of their labor to others who don't labor.

And that's not socialism.


Socialist countries always have big bureaucracies to enforce that voluntarism.

You can't enforce voluntarism. Enforcing voluntarism makes it stop being voluntarism. Regardless, there's no socialist countries. There are social democracies, but no socialist countries. The closest you get is Norway, and Norway still has a thriving capitalist economy. Thus, not socialist.


There really is no such thing as voluntary socialism. It is pie in the sky.

False, actually.

Alyosha
10-02-2013, 07:12 AM
Oh, I have no problem admitting I'm anti-capitalist, although my an-cap friends like @Alyosha (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=863) have convinced me to at least give their form a try.

But I am absolutely NOT anti-America and I hate centralized government. I'm so pro-America that if you cut me, I bleed red, white, and blue.

I'm like the worst ana-cap tho because I hate big business! :)

All the people who think I'm some rabid business lover has never seen Ethereal and I argue over Wal-Mart in person like you have.

Green Arrow
10-02-2013, 07:15 AM
I'm like the worst ana-cap tho because I hate big business! :)

All the people who think I'm some rabid business lover has never seen Ethereal and I argue over Wal-Mart in person like you have.

Eh, I think you can still be an an-cap and hate big business. Big business is like big government.

kilgram
10-02-2013, 07:46 AM
Socialism always ends up being authoritarian. It has to be because people do not want to give the fruits of their labor to others who don't labor.

Socialist countries always have big bureaucracies to enforce that voluntarism.

There really is no such thing as voluntary socialism. It is pie in the sky.
The same I believe with capitalism.

Peter1469
10-02-2013, 07:46 AM
I'm like the worst ana-cap tho because I hate big business! :)

All the people who think I'm some rabid business lover has never seen Ethereal and I argue over Wal-Mart in person like you have.

I don't think that hating big business is anti-capitalist. I think it is pro-capitalist. Large corporations distort the market- they are not creatures of the free market.

kilgram
10-02-2013, 07:47 AM
I'm like the worst ana-cap tho because I hate big business! :)

All the people who think I'm some rabid business lover has never seen Ethereal and I argue over Wal-Mart in person like you have.
It is true. For me you are really close to Socialist Libertarian ideas, maybe influenced for your "pure" anarchism (primitivism).

kilgram
10-02-2013, 07:49 AM
The same as the difference between capitalism and corporatism. One is a more extreme form of the other. Communists demand the forcible seizing of the means of production. Socialists do not (unless they are authoritarian, but that's a totally different animal).
I don't understand your difference, maybe because for education.

And probably we agree with the ideas, but we don't agree with the use of the ideas.

Green Arrow
10-02-2013, 08:23 AM
I don't understand your difference, maybe because for education.

And probably we agree with the ideas, but we don't agree with the use of the ideas.

It's a difference of degrees. Communism is still based in socialism, just like corporatism is still based in capitalists. However, not all capitalists like corporatism, and not all socialists like communism. There are only two types of communists I've come across: authoritarians, and anarchists who want to forcibly take the means of production. While there are socialists like both groups, socialism itself is more in favor of creating the means of production yourself and making them socially owned, rather than taking the existing means by force.

Alyosha
10-02-2013, 08:24 AM
It is true. For me you are really close to Socialist Libertarian ideas, maybe influenced for your "pure" anarchism (primitivism).

I do border on it, this is true.

patrickt
10-02-2013, 10:00 AM
We got used to Social Security. We got used to Medicare. We got used to the IRS targeting liberals and the NSA snooping on Americans. We got used to people dying at Waco and a government sniper having total immunity for killing the wrong person at Ruby Ridge. We even got used to President's committing perjury and government workers pleading the fifth. Maybe President Clinton is right.

Libhater
10-02-2013, 01:08 PM
We got used to Social Security. We got used to Medicare. We got used to the IRS targeting liberals and the NSA snooping on Americans. We got used to people dying at Waco and a government sniper having total immunity for killing the wrong person at Ruby Ridge. We even got used to President's committing perjury and government workers pleading the fifth. Maybe President Clinton is right.

Clinton was right--creeping socialism/progressivism/Marxism/communism or whatever leftist ideology you want to call them is a slow process with the upshot being people totally controlled by a centralized government.

Chloe
10-02-2013, 01:26 PM
Clinton was right--creeping socialism/progressivism/Marxism/communism or whatever leftist ideology you want to call them is a slow process with the upshot being people totally controlled by a centralized government.

not all "leftist ideologies" want people totally controlled by a centralized government. I think you are over simplifying it a little bit.

Cthulhu
10-02-2013, 01:28 PM
not all "leftist ideologies" want people totally controlled by a centralized government. I think you are over simplifying it a little bit.

Not really, it isn't that complex of a problem. Tough to over simplify an already simple process.

Libhater
10-02-2013, 02:02 PM
Big business is like big government.

I don't see where big business (capitalism) is anything like big government (socialism); in fact, I see the both of them as being polar opposites. If you had to choose between one or the other in which to fuel an economy...which one would you choose and why?

Cthulhu
10-02-2013, 02:07 PM
I don't see where big business (capitalism) is anything like big government (socialism); in fact, I see the both of them as being polar opposites. If you had to choose between one or the other in which to fuel an economy...which one would you choose and why?



Big Business runs Big Government

Alyosha
10-02-2013, 02:16 PM
I don't see where big business (capitalism) is anything like big government (socialism); in fact, I see the both of them as being polar opposites. If you had to choose between one or the other in which to fuel an economy...which one would you choose and why?


Big business today is corporatist not capitalist and I would choose neither.

Green Arrow
10-02-2013, 06:58 PM
I don't see where big business (capitalism) is anything like big government (socialism); in fact, I see the both of them as being polar opposites. If you had to choose between one or the other in which to fuel an economy...which one would you choose and why?

Big government is not socialism, lol. You are so ridiculous.