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pjohns
10-09-2013, 09:18 AM
I believe Dick Morris is right on target as regarding President Obama's attempt to frame the issue of the government shutdown in a way that is most favorable to his own position, by using weasel words in place of the unvarnished truth:


As his battle with the Republicans focuses more on the debt limit and less on ObamaCare, the president has invented a new vocabulary to suit his political needs.
"Seeking to raise the debt limit" is out. "Preventing an economic shutdown" is in.

"Debt" is never mentioned. The word is "obligations". ...

The words "debt" and "borrowing" and "spending" are politically anathema. So Obama has to invent new words to describe his position. ...

All of these word games are designed to camouflage how unattractive the president's position really is. Every American understands that before your raise your credit limit on your cards, you had better limit your spending and change your ways.

Here is the link: http://web.mail.comcast.net/zimbra/h/search?si=1&so=0&sc=4115&st=message&id=176440&xim=1&action=view

Alyosha
10-09-2013, 09:44 AM
Sure but it doesn't take a genius to figure that out. Dick Morris is a slimey piece of shit who should eat camel dung for breakfast if we lived in a just world.

nic34
10-09-2013, 09:47 AM
You mean the Dick Morris that was dead certain that Rmoney was going to win....? :laugh:

pjohns
10-09-2013, 09:57 AM
You mean the Dick Morris that was dead certain that Rmoney was going to win....? :laugh:

I mean I prefer to deal with serious people; which is to say, people who are willing to deal with the topic at hand, rather than try to score a few cheap points with mere deflection...

Cigar
10-09-2013, 10:36 AM
Sure but it doesn't take a genius to figure that out. Dick Morris is a slimey piece of shit who should eat camel dung for breakfast if we lived in a just world.


My My ... you talk dirty also ... :laugh:

Cigar
10-09-2013, 10:37 AM
You mean the Dick Morris that was dead certain that Rmoney was going to win....? :laugh:

That or his twin ... :grin:

Mainecoons
10-09-2013, 10:39 AM
You mean the Dick Morris that was dead certain that Rmoney was going to win....? :laugh:

You mean the Nic who can't address what the man specifically said and has to resort to his usual ad hom?

Oh, that genius. Yeah, par for the course with Nic.

Chris
10-09-2013, 11:03 AM
Example of the use of another weasel word: "We can't make extortion routine as part of our democracy". Obama is such a troll. :grin:

Cigar
10-09-2013, 11:04 AM
Example of the use of another weasel word: "We can't make extortion routine as part of our democracy". Obama is such a troll. :grin:

But guess who's his bitch ... Johnny

Alyosha
10-09-2013, 11:10 AM
But guess who's his bitch ... Johnny

Naw, Obama is more the girl in the relationship. He's very slender and delicate.

Chris
10-09-2013, 11:19 AM
But guess who's his bitch ... Johnny


Obama has a bitch?

Alyosha
10-09-2013, 11:27 AM
Obama has a bitch?

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-L5VPnqb9Jek/UYMwGKdVHWI/AAAAAAAAV0Q/b-ObyBjSrMo/s1600/389004_10151659939130087_589940525_n-890.jpg


Not exactly an alpha male.

Chris
10-09-2013, 11:50 AM
"Oh my."

http://i.snag.gy/3Grnq.jpg

Cigar
10-09-2013, 11:54 AM
Obama has a bitch?

It must be painful for you to sleep at night knowing there nothing you can do about ... twice ... ever. :grin:

http://www.northafricapost.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/president-obama.jpg#obama%20president%20616x400

Chris
10-09-2013, 11:56 AM
It must be painful for you to sleep at night knowing there nothing you can do about ... twice ... ever. :grin:

http://www.northafricapost.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/president-obama.jpg#obama%20president%20616x400



Yea, I'm losing sleep over you saying Obama has a bitch.

OMG, I hope you weren't talking about Michelle?

Cigar
10-09-2013, 12:03 PM
Yea, I'm losing sleep over you saying Obama has a bitch.

OMG, I hope you weren't talking about Michelle?

http://madmikesamerica.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/boehner-crying.png

zelmo1234
10-09-2013, 12:18 PM
But guess who's his bitch ... Johnny

Really? what new policies has Obama been able to get though in the past 3 years?

Mainecoons
10-09-2013, 12:22 PM
Nice job of disrupting and trivializing a thread, Cigar.

Moderators flunk again.

Cigar
10-09-2013, 12:26 PM
Nice job of disrupting and trivializing a thread, Cigar.

Moderators flunk again.

There they go ... crying to mama again.

Just make sure all the post are read. :laugh:

jillian
10-09-2013, 12:28 PM
I believe Dick Morris is right on target as regarding President Obama's attempt to frame the issue of the government shutdown in a way that is most favorable to his own position, by using weasel words in place of the unvarnished truth:



Here is the link: http://web.mail.comcast.net/zimbra/h/search?si=1&so=0&sc=4115&st=message&id=176440&xim=1&action=view

dick morris is a compulsive liar....

how are those "unskewed polls" again?

lol...

jillian
10-09-2013, 12:29 PM
Sure but it doesn't take a genius to figure that out. Dick Morris is a slimey piece of shit who should eat camel dung for breakfast if we lived in a just world.

except that morris is lying... as are the rightwingers who have wanted to shut down the government since before the 2010 election.

or do we need to post those idiots' statements?

on morris we agree

Chris
10-09-2013, 12:33 PM
except that morris is lying... as are the rightwingers who have wanted to shut down the government since before the 2010 election.

or do we need to post those idiots' statements?

on morris we agree



But, jillian, having ad homed the hell out of Morris, what about his point, "All of these word games are designed to camouflage how unattractive the president's position really is. Every American understands that before your raise your credit limit on your cards, you had better limit your spending and change your ways," what Alyosha says is obvious--in not addressing that are you giving silent consent?

Paperback Writer
10-09-2013, 12:40 PM
But, jillian, having ad homed the hell out of Morris, what about his point, "All of these word games are designed to camouflage how unattractive the president's position really is. Every American understands that before your raise your credit limit on your cards, you had better limit your spending and change your ways," what Alyosha says is obvious--in not addressing that are you giving silent consent?

I've yet to understand the "fine for thee, not for me" aspect to government. You cannot continue to spend and raise debt ceilings when your own economic predictions are so dire.

Poetic words do not change the fact that there are many ways to pay the debt to China. It does not require raising the debt ceiling, but cutting spending. What this adminstration seems to want, and his Senate with him, is for the US to grow government spending and use their debts as an excuse. Debts in any good budget should be paid first, before bring on additional programmes.

This would be one thing if the government had some outside means of generating income but it comes from debt and taxation at a time when its own middle class appears on the brink of extinction.

Mainecoons
10-09-2013, 12:41 PM
Every American understands that before your raise your credit limit on your cards, you had better limit your spending and change your ways,". . .

Truthfully, Chris, I'm not sure this is so.

Cigar
10-09-2013, 12:45 PM
Does the tea party know that obama cut the deficit in half?

hanger4
10-09-2013, 12:50 PM
Does the tea party know that obama cut the deficit in half?


:roflmao::roflmao:

Mainecoons
10-09-2013, 12:52 PM
You'll have to forgive him, he's a math expert.

:rofl:

hanger4
10-09-2013, 12:53 PM
Does the tea party know that obama cut the deficit in half?

OH please please please post a link to this

..................................

absurdity !!

Contrails
10-09-2013, 12:57 PM
I believe Dick Morris is right on target as regarding President Obama's attempt to frame the issue of the government shutdown in a way that is most favorable to his own position, by using weasel words in place of the unvarnished truth:

Here is the link: http://web.mail.comcast.net/zimbra/h/search?si=1&so=0&sc=4115&st=message&id=176440&xim=1&action=view

I disagree that this is a misrepresentation of the situation. Congress has passed laws which commit the Federal Government to expend a specific ammount of funds over the next 12 months. Through a combination of reasons, the amount of funds the government is taking in do no equal those obligations. Unless those obligations are renegotiated, the only choices are to incure additional debt or default on them. Since Congress has been either unwilling or unable to address the programs behind these obligations, faulting the President for raising the debt ceiling is the real obfuscation.

Contrails
10-09-2013, 01:05 PM
Does the tea party know that obama cut the deficit in half?


OH please please please post a link to this

..................................

absurdity !!
More like a 40% cut since Obama took office in 2009.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/28539403/ns/business-stocks_and_economy/t/cbo-sees-record-trillion-deficit/

http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-money/budget/321105-deficit-reaches-750-billion-for-2013-cbo

Contrails
10-09-2013, 01:17 PM
Every American understands that before your raise your credit limit on your cards, you had better limit your spending and change your ways,"

How many American's have the ability to unilaterally increase their income whenever the circumstances warrant?

Chris
10-09-2013, 01:25 PM
I've yet to understand the "fine for thee, not for me" aspect to government. You cannot continue to spend and raise debt ceilings when your own economic predictions are so dire.

Poetic words do not change the fact that there are many ways to pay the debt to China. It does not require raising the debt ceiling, but cutting spending. What this adminstration seems to want, and his Senate with him, is for the US to grow government spending and use their debts as an excuse. Debts in any good budget should be paid first, before bring on additional programmes.

This would be one thing if the government had some outside means of generating income but it comes from debt and taxation at a time when its own middle class appears on the brink of extinction.


Debt makes some sense in a prosperous economy as inflation will pay part of it.

Otherwise, and especially during economic crisis, the idea ought to be to shrink government and cut spending.


I though China sold off it US debt holdings?

Chris
10-09-2013, 01:27 PM
Truthfully, Chris, I'm not sure this is so.


[/COLOR]


Probably not since most Americans are in debt. It's just something I don't understand.

Chris
10-09-2013, 01:28 PM
How many American's have the ability to unilaterally increase their income whenever the circumstances warrant?



But they do have the ability to cut their spending.

Peter1469
10-09-2013, 03:37 PM
Nice job of disrupting and trivializing a thread, Cigar.

Moderators flunk again.


The Mods have received one report today and it has been acted on and reported solved.

Peter1469
10-09-2013, 03:46 PM
I disagree that this is a misrepresentation of the situation. Congress has passed laws which commit the Federal Government to expend a specific ammount of funds over the next 12 months. Through a combination of reasons, the amount of funds the government is taking in do no equal those obligations. Unless those obligations are renegotiated, the only choices are to incure additional debt or default on them. Since Congress has been either unwilling or unable to address the programs behind these obligations, faulting the President for raising the debt ceiling is the real obfuscation.

The US Treasury brings in more than enough money per month to service the interest on the debt. Not paying other obligations is not default on the debt. It would however cause the government to pick winners and losers (i.e. alienate voters).

Contrails
10-09-2013, 07:10 PM
The US Treasury brings in more than enough money per month to service the interest on the debt. Not paying other obligations is not default on the debt. It would however cause the government to pick winners and losers (i.e. alienate voters).

On average, that is true, but the Treasury's income and expenses are not evenly distributed throughout the year. There are some big payments coming due between now and November 15th that can't be paid without additional short term borrowing. Like the rest of us, the Treasury must pay bills when they are due, otherwise it is considered a default.

Mainecoons
10-09-2013, 07:21 PM
Not correct. Not paying ones bills is not a default. Not paying interest and principal on borrowings is a default.

When you don't pay your bills, the creditor has to decide whether or not to carry you. Obviously, most firms who supply government are going to carry them because they know that when this nonsense is over, they'll get paid.

If Obama's government decides not to pay interest or principal due on its debt obligations, they will be deliberately defaulting. If they pay those and defer paying other stuff, that is not default.

We've been trying to explain this to you all this entire day. Please spend some time understanding the difference between default, which is a failure to pay on borrowings when due, versus other forms of non payment.

If they don't pay the help, that is not default. If they don't pay the electric bill, that is not default.

If they don't pay the interest on their borrowings when due, THAT is default.

Peter1469
10-09-2013, 07:35 PM
On average, that is true, but the Treasury's income and expenses are not evenly distributed throughout the year. There are some big payments coming due between now and November 15th that can't be paid without additional short term borrowing. Like the rest of us, the Treasury must pay bills when they are due, otherwise it is considered a default.

Default refers to not servicing the debt.

pjohns
10-10-2013, 12:58 AM
I disagree that this is a misrepresentation of the situation. Congress has passed laws which commit the Federal Government to expend a specific ammount of funds over the next 12 months. Through a combination of reasons, the amount of funds the government is taking in do no equal those obligations. Unless those obligations are renegotiated, the only choices are to incure additional debt or default on them. Since Congress has been either unwilling or unable to address the programs behind these obligations, faulting the President for raising the debt ceiling is the real obfuscation.

The correct definition of default is entirely untethered to either the funding of government programs or the funding of government agencies. Rather, default has a specific meaning, viz. the failure to pay the interest on our national debt in a timely manner.

Government programs (e.g . Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid) will continue to be funded, regardless of whether there is any increase in the debt ceiling.

A temporary interruption of funding for government agencies (e.g. the National Endowment for the Arts and the Environmental Protection Agency) would not adversely impact most Americans...