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Green Arrow
10-11-2013, 02:02 PM
Ever since I came back to Virginia on August 4, I've been giving the gubernatorial race a lot of thought. Virginia has always been my state, since the first time I came here in 2010. I love it to death, and want it to continue to be a leader in the U.S.

Unfortunately, I never saw Cuccinelli or McAuliffe as the person to do that. Both men are opportunists. Both are corporatist. Both change their positions on a whim to help them win elections. I watch them, and I don't see honesty, or character. I see false faces, masks.

So, I've decided I'm going to vote for Robert Sarvis, the Libertarian Party candidate. Normally, I'd vote Green over Libertarian, but in this race, only Cuccinelli, McAuliffe, and Sarvis are on the ballot.

So, Sarvis it is.

http://o2.aolcdn.com/dims-shared/dims3/PATCH/format/jpg/quality/82/resize/458x243/http://hss-prod.hss.aol.com/hss/storage/patch/4ea461b857a008216946e64f49caf22d

jillian
10-11-2013, 02:40 PM
he believes in parental notification and parental consent for an abortion.

no one should have to beg a judge for the right to terminate a pregnancy caused by abuse

Green Arrow
10-11-2013, 02:44 PM
he believes in parental notification and parental consent for an abortion.

no one should have to beg a judge for the right to terminate a pregnancy caused by abuse

I don't agree with anybody 100%, but I'm not seeing where he says he'll pursue that policy as governor. He may hold to that position, but if he's not going to put that into place as governor, what's the beef?

jillian
10-11-2013, 02:46 PM
I don't agree with anybody 100%, but I'm not seeing where he says he'll pursue that policy as governor. He may hold to that position, but if he's not going to put that into place as governor, what's the beef?

it doesn't matter particularly what he will pursue. i assume that if a bill were placed on his desk with those terms, he would sign it.

a libertarian should be a libertarian, imo. though he's better than most on those types of issues.

Green Arrow
10-11-2013, 02:48 PM
it doesn't matter particularly what he will pursue. i assume that if a bill were placed on his desk with those terms, he would sign it.

Except not if he's a libertarian who doesn't believe that is his authority, which is the case, from what I'm seeing.


a libertarian should be a libertarian, imo. though he's better than most on those types of issues.

I agree. Like I said, I don't agree with anyone 100%. But he gets a lot closer than either Cooch or Tiny Terry.

jillian
10-11-2013, 02:51 PM
I hope he uses his voice. But he won't be governor of Virginia any time soon, Green Arrow


A new survey of the Virginia governor’s race (http://wapo.st/105ZNsw) has good news for Democrat Terry McAuliffe, giving him an eight-point lead over Republican Ken Cuccinelli II amid strong opposition to the federal government shutdown.
It also has bad news for Libertarian Robert Sarvis, who now looks unlikely to participate in the final debate of the contest on Oct. 24, at Virginia Tech.

The Quinnipiac University poll (http://www.quinnipiac.edu/institutes-and-centers/polling-institute/virginia/release-detail?ReleaseID=1964) shows McAuliffe at 47 percent, Cuccinelli at 39 percent and Sarvis at 8 percent among likely voters. The survey is at least the 11th public poll in a row to show McAuliffe maintaining a lead of between five and nine points.

Under an agreement negotiated by Cuccinelli, McAuliffe and the Virginia Tech debate’s sponsor — WDBJ (Channel 7) in Roanoke — Sarvis needed to be polling (http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/will-sarvis-be-in-last-debate-of-va-governors-race-itll-come-down-to-math-lobbying/2013/10/08/7cda74fe-3025-11e3-bbed-a8a60c601153_story.html) at 10 percent or above as of Thursday to be given a spot on stage. His inclusion will “rely heavily” on the average of polls from the past three weeks on the RealClearPolitics Web site (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/welcomead/?ref=http://www.realclearpolitics.com/). Before the Quinnipiac survey, that average stood at 9.1 percent (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2013/governor/va/virginia_governor_cuccinelli_vs_mcauliffe_vs_sarvi s-4111.html#polls).

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/new-poll-has-mcauliffe-maintaining-va-lead-makes-it-unlikely-sarvis-will-be-in-last-debate/2013/10/10/863f33d8-3195-11e3-89ae-16e186e117d8_story.html

jillian
10-11-2013, 02:53 PM
Except not if he's a libertarian who doesn't believe that is his authority, which is the case, from what I'm seeing.

but he believes in parental notification and parental consent. why wouldn't he sign such a bill?

http://votesmart.org/candidate/political-courage-test/134537/robert-sarvis/



I agree. Like I said, I don't agree with anyone 100%. But he gets a lot closer than either Cooch or Tiny Terry.

yeah, but there are certain deal breakers for everyone. it just depends on what they are.

and mcauliffe looks to be the next governor by quite a large margin... which is much better for your state than cuccinelli would ever be.

KC
10-11-2013, 04:15 PM
it doesn't matter particularly what he will pursue. i assume that if a bill were placed on his desk with those terms, he would sign it.

a libertarian should be a libertarian, imo. though he's better than most on those types of issues.

So the world is only black and white, huh? No shades of gray allowed?

KC
10-11-2013, 04:18 PM
Ever since I came back to Virginia on August 4, I've been giving the gubernatorial race a lot of thought. Virginia has always been my state, since the first time I came here in 2010. I love it to death, and want it to continue to be a leader in the U.S.

Unfortunately, I never saw Cuccinelli or McAuliffe as the person to do that. Both men are opportunists. Both are corporatist. Both change their positions on a whim to help them win elections. I watch them, and I don't see honesty, or character. I see false faces, masks.

So, I've decided I'm going to vote for Robert Sarvis, the Libertarian Party candidate. Normally, I'd vote Green over Libertarian, but in this race, only Cuccinelli, McAuliffe, and Sarvis are on the ballot.

So, Sarvis it is.

http://o2.aolcdn.com/dims-shared/dims3/PATCH/format/jpg/quality/82/resize/458x243/http://hss-prod.hss.aol.com/hss/storage/patch/4ea461b857a008216946e64f49caf22d

In my short time voting, my support has gone to one Democrat, a Green and a few Libertarians. As a rule I vote third party or anti-incumbent, whichever applies to the election.

Green Arrow
10-11-2013, 04:32 PM
I hope he uses his voice. But he won't be governor of Virginia any time soon, @Green Arrow (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=868)



http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/new-poll-has-mcauliffe-maintaining-va-lead-makes-it-unlikely-sarvis-will-be-in-last-debate/2013/10/10/863f33d8-3195-11e3-89ae-16e186e117d8_story.html

Oh, I never expected him to be governor. Still going to vote for him though. I can't in good conscience vote for the other two.

Green Arrow
10-11-2013, 04:37 PM
In my short time voting, my support has gone to one Democrat, a Green and a few Libertarians. As a rule I vote third party or anti-incumbent, whichever applies to the election.

I agree with this. My first election was in California back in 2010. I could only vote for the local elections since I checked "decline to state" for party affiliation, but all of the people I voted for had no party identification. 2012 was my next election, and I voted for Jill Stein (G) for President, Mary Headrick (D) for U.S. House, Shaun Crowell (L) for Senate, and a Republican for both my state Senate and state House elections.

So I'm a true Independent :tongue:

jillian
10-11-2013, 05:05 PM
So the world is only black and white, huh? No shades of gray allowed?

there are many shades of gray. but on certain issues, i don't think it's government's place to insert itself. to have a young girl who may have become pregnant by an abusive parent or step parent have to beg a judge for permission to have an abortion is inappropriate. so on that issue, i don't really think there's much room for discussion.

there are many others where there are.

but i certainly wouldn't give him my vote and allow cuccinelli to be elected in any event.... which, for the time being, is what happens with third-party candidates. and yes, i know you think the parties are the same...

but they aren't on things that matter to me.

Green Arrow
10-11-2013, 05:09 PM
there are many shades of gray. but on certain issues, i don't think it's government's place to insert itself. to have a young girl who may have become pregnant by an abusive parent or step parent have to beg a judge for permission to have an abortion is inappropriate. so on that issue, i don't really think there's much room for discussion.

there are many others where there are.

but i certainly wouldn't give him my vote and allow cuccinelli to be elected in any event.... which, for the time being, is what happens with third-party candidates. and yes, i know you think the parties are the same...

but they aren't on things that matter to me.

Thing is, that's not necessarily true. Libertarians tend to pull from both camps, so if Sarvis wasn't in the race, his 8% (or whatever it is after the election) could be Democrats, Republicans, or his voters could vote for another third party candidate. Or they may not even vote.

KC
10-11-2013, 05:26 PM
there are many shades of gray. but on certain issues, i don't think it's government's place to insert itself. to have a young girl who may have become pregnant by an abusive parent or step parent have to beg a judge for permission to have an abortion is inappropriate. so on that issue, i don't really think there's much room for discussion.

there are many others where there are.

but i certainly wouldn't give him my vote and allow cuccinelli to be elected in any event.... which, for the time being, is what happens with third-party candidates. and yes, i know you think the parties are the same...

but they aren't on things that matter to me.

The parties are the same in every way that really matters. The rest is just out there to create the illusion of choice.

I happen to be pro choice, but I do not think it's inconsistent for a libertarian to be pro life. It is for an anarcho capitalist libertarian, but libertarian is a label that can define more than one nuanced position.

Green Arrow
10-11-2013, 05:28 PM
The parties are the same in every way that really matters. The rest is just out there to create the illusion of choice.

I happen to be pro choice, but I do not think it's inconsistent for a libertarian to be pro life. It is for an anarcho capitalist libertarian, but libertarian is a label that can define more than one nuanced position.

I've tried to explain before that abortion is not a political issue. There are pro-life Democrats and pro-choice Republicans. There are pro-life and pro-choice libertarians. It's a philosophical issue, not political.

KC
10-11-2013, 05:33 PM
I've tried to explain before that abortion is not a political issue. There are pro-life Democrats and pro-choice Republicans. There are pro-life and pro-choice libertarians. It's a philosophical issue, not political.

Politics is just a more narrow branch of philosophy for me. Every political issue is a philosophical issue, but not vice versa.

Green Arrow
10-11-2013, 05:34 PM
Politics is just a more narrow branch of philosophy for me. Every political issue is a philosophical issue, but not vice versa.

I would agree with that.