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Cigar
10-30-2013, 07:06 AM
For all the low information people whining about their health insurance going up or getting canceled, here’s some elementary math to pacify the crybabies.

80% of the population gets Health Insurance from their Employer … you aren’t getting dropped. You can shop or stay.

15% of the population has no Health Insurance … Hallelujah, you can thank ObamaCare.

5% of the population pays for their own Health Insurance out of pocket; why? Because they can, that's why.

If you current Health Insurance Providers policy doesn’t meet the National Policy Standards (your shitty policy), your provider will drop that package and provide you an Insurance Package that meets the National Premium Standards. If that new policy package isn’t to your liking, go shopping for one that you do like. Don’t be surprised if better coverage cost more for people who are capable of paying for their own Health Insurance out of pocket, but have been paying for substandard Health Care. For those who are NOT capable of paying for their own Health Insurance out of pocket, there’s a Federal Standards for Insurer Subsidies.

No one is getting dropped, Policies for Substandard Insurance is getting Dropped and replaced with really good Health Care.

:rollseyes: Have fun watching the Hearing Today.

zelmo1234
10-30-2013, 07:36 AM
You keep telling yourself that!

Because you know the reason that they gave the employers a waiver, because if they did not there would be millions of people loosing their employer sponsored insurance too!

They are just trying to put that off until after 2014

Cigar
10-30-2013, 07:38 AM
You keep telling yourself that!

Because you know the reason that they gave the employers a waiver, because if they did not there would be millions of people loosing their employer sponsored insurance too!

They are just trying to put that off until after 2014

Please provide a Link to your Facts ... I'll wait :laugh:

zelmo1234
10-30-2013, 07:43 AM
Please provide a Link to your Facts ... I'll wait :laugh:

I think it is funny that you would keep asking me of a link. Because it is always easy to find.

And So far everything that those that oppose the plan, (Which includes more and more democrats every day) Is coming true?

http://blog.heritage.org/2013/02/27/3-years-of-obamacare-millions-lose-their-current-coverage/

So how long will you continue to run cover for the Chosen one?

Cigar
10-30-2013, 07:46 AM
I think it is funny that you would keep asking me of a link. Because it is always easy to find.

And So far everything that those that oppose the plan, (Which includes more and more democrats every day) Is coming true?

http://blog.heritage.org/2013/02/27/3-years-of-obamacare-millions-lose-their-current-coverage/

So how long will you continue to run cover for the Chosen one?



Link Date: February 27, 2013 at 3:30 pm :roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::rofl mao::roflmao::roflmao:

Nice try ... :biglaugh:

zelmo1234
10-30-2013, 07:52 AM
Link Date: February 27, 2013 at 3:30 pm :roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::rofl mao::roflmao::roflmao:

Nice try ... :biglaugh:

So is their anything in the link that has not come to pass?

This is not rocker science? Employers are going to have to pay 3% more in taxes when the waiver expires, the cost of insurance, especially if they can't convince the young to pay tens of thousand a year for insurance that they will not use? Is going to more than double

That is going to effect the bottom line and they are going to drop insurance coverage for their employee's and pay the fine!

Has anything come to pass that Obama promised? NO! it is not less expensive, the coverage unless you gold or platinum is not that great and those are over 20K per year

It will not insure more people but less people will actually get insurance, and Hospitals and providers are not excepting Medicare/ Medicaid because the idiots in the Obama administration cut the payments and expected that the medical industry would be happy to loose money?

What has not come to pass that the people that did not want this said would happen?

Cigar
10-30-2013, 07:55 AM
You're dismissed ... :studying: Next :wink:

zelmo1234
10-30-2013, 07:57 AM
You're dismissed ... :studying: Next :wink:

Thought so! Ran out of deflection and had not hard answers?

So when are you going to stop running cover and admit the facts?

You of all people should be pissed!!!!! The first black president is turning out to be such a d fuck-up that it may be 200 more years before the people will elect another one!

Captain Obvious
10-30-2013, 08:15 AM
"You can keep your doctor, period"

Barack Hussein Obama

nathanbforrest45
10-30-2013, 08:15 AM
People are being dropped by their current insurance on a daily basis, or is the news media lying to us on this as well as everything else they are lying about?

Its a sham and a con that "bad insurance is being replaced with good insurance that will do more" That "good insurance" will cost more and have higher deductibles. For those people who can't pay the premiums they might get a subsidy to help. Who is going to pay for that subsidy? Who is going to decide they are entitled to that subsidy?

This has been a cluster fuck from the word go. Your fascist leader has taken a highly tuned and workable health insurance structure and turned it into a big pile of festering shit. Businesses, if left unfettered, will always look for a way to outsell their competitors. If there were ways to decrease the cost of insurance some one would have developed plans. And the fact is there were low cost plans that were designed to keep people from catastrophic loss in the event of an illness. But that is not what people want, they want to be taken care of cradle to grave and that cost money. The government promises them something for nothing and like the sheep they are they fall for it every time.

Well, sheep, its time to get sheared and possibly butchered.

strollingbonez
10-30-2013, 08:25 AM
i am still curious why i need maternity benefits? i have been unable to register for obamacare but will keep trying....

Codename Section
10-30-2013, 08:25 AM
i am still curious why i need maternity benefits? i have been unable to register for obamacare but will keep trying....

They already said you had to use the phone or go to the office.

strollingbonez
10-30-2013, 08:25 AM
o so much for that...system is currently down.....

Captain Obvious
10-30-2013, 08:32 AM
o so much for that...system is currently down.....

Imagine that.

Cigar
10-30-2013, 08:47 AM
"You can keep your doctor, period"

Barack Hussein Obama

... and have you not kept your Doctor?

Cigar
10-30-2013, 08:49 AM
o so much for that...system is currently down.....

Are you capable of Buying a Car without a Website? :rollseyes:

WTF ... it's October 30th ... January 1st is a ways away. :laugh:

Cigar
10-30-2013, 08:52 AM
People are being dropped by their current insurance on a daily basis, or is the news media lying to us on this as well as everything else they are lying about?

Its a sham and a con that "bad insurance is being replaced with good insurance that will do more" That "good insurance" will cost more and have higher deductibles. For those people who can't pay the premiums they might get a subsidy to help. Who is going to pay for that subsidy? Who is going to decide they are entitled to that subsidy?

This has been a cluster fuck from the word go. Your fascist leader has taken a highly tuned and workable health insurance structure and turned it into a big pile of festering shit. Businesses, if left unfettered, will always look for a way to outsell their competitors. If there were ways to decrease the cost of insurance some one would have developed plans. And the fact is there were low cost plans that were designed to keep people from catastrophic loss in the event of an illness. But that is not what people want, they want to be taken care of cradle to grave and that cost money. The government promises them something for nothing and like the sheep they are they fall for it every time.

Well, sheep, its time to get sheared and possibly butchered.


Policies are being Dropped that don't meet the LAW ... New Policies are offered.

If you get better Health Care Options ... you may have to pay more ... Wow ... imagine that.

If you can't afford it ... YOU Qualify for for other options, but Mommy isn't going to hold your hand for you.

keymanjim
10-30-2013, 08:52 AM
Are you capable of Buying a Car without a Website? :rollseyes:

WTF ... it's October 30th ... January 1st is a ways away. :laugh:
My disdain for car salesmen has been overshadowed by my disdain for obamacare navigators.

Haven't you had your ass handed to you enough on this forum already today?

nic34
10-30-2013, 08:56 AM
My disdain for car salesmen has been overshadowed by my disdain for obamacare navigators.

Haven't you had your ass handed to you enough on this forum already today?

So then have you guys proved that the healthcare system we had before ACA was all so much better?

Pleeeese.... talk about one's ass being handed....

Codename Section
10-30-2013, 09:00 AM
So then have you guys proved that the healthcare system we had before ACA was all so much better?

Pleeeese.... talk about one's ass being handed....

It is the same system. It is still private insurance based with deductibles. Only now everyone has to have it, deductibles are higher, and premiums are going up. The pre-existing conditions people had healthcare under their jobs so this improves the condition of only a handful of those who were independent buys with pre-existing conditions.

I am not an anti-health care person but this whole thing stinks.

We should have scrapped the DEA, NSA, and some other rogue agencies and just gone to a national health system. This one sucks major ass.

keymanjim
10-30-2013, 09:04 AM
So then have you guys proved that the healthcare system we had before ACA was all so much better?

Pleeeese.... talk about one's ass being handed....
Oh please, educate us how the A(ino)CA is so much better, oh great master.

nathanbforrest45
10-30-2013, 09:09 AM
Its better uh, because uh, well uh, because Obamalini says its better.

That's all ye know and all ye need to know.

Captain Obvious
10-30-2013, 09:15 AM
So then have you guys proved that the healthcare system we had before ACA was all so much better?

Pleeeese.... talk about one's ass being handed....

a) Same insurance

b) Nobody still knows how the "new" program really works, what it does to costs, coverage

Objective much?

killianr1
10-30-2013, 09:22 AM
For all the low information people whining about their health insurance going up or getting canceled, here’s some elementary math to pacify the crybabies.


No matter how we reform health care, we will keep this promise to the American people: If you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor. Period. If you like your health care plan, you will be able to keep your health care plan. Period. No one will take it away. No matter what. My view is that health-care reform should be guided by a simple principle: Fix what’s broken and build on what works.” Barrack Obama

I think the point is someone lied.


For those who are NOT capable of paying for their own Health Insurance out of pocket, there’s a Federal Standards for Insurer Subsidies.

Like the Congress and the Senate for instance.


Well, plenty of people seem to want to keep their substandard health insurance. Florida Blue, a major health care provider in the sunshine state, is dropping the plans of 300,000 (http://miami.cbslocal.com/2013/10/24/florida-blue-dropping-300k-policy-holders/) Floridians that aren't compatible with the higher standards of Obamacare, including the GoBlue 91 limited liability plan of 56-year-old Dianne Barrette. CBS News (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505263_162-57609534/policy-cancellations-higher-premiums-add-to-frustration-over-obamacare/) profiled her this morning. "When I got this bill, I was outraged," Barrette said. Technically she didn't get a bill — last month Florida Blue wrote to let her know that her old plan was being discontinued and she'd be offered a new, more expensive but more comprehensive plan, in its place. Currently she pays $54 a month. The new plan will cost $591 a month. "What I have right now is what I'm happy with, and I just wanna know why I can't keep what I have," Barrette asked
http://www.theatlanticwire.com/politics/2013/10/white-house-admits-some-will-lose-insurance-heres-why/71010/


And I think the point here is that some people "low information or not" resent being told they have the ability to make their own decision and then finding they were lied too. It doesn't help when the elitist left come back and tell them how they don't know what they're doing.

nic34
10-30-2013, 09:32 AM
a) Same insurance

b) Nobody still knows how the "new" program really works, what it does to costs, coverage

Objective much?

Free preventative care for women
Free mammograms and colonoscopies
Insurance company rebates
Staying on your parents' plan
Pre-existing conditions covered
Does away with annual and life-time limits on coverage

http://obamacarefacts.com/howdoes-obamacare-work.php

Obtuse much?

Captain Obvious
10-30-2013, 09:35 AM
Free preventative care for women
Free mammograms and colonoscopies
Insurance company rebates
Staying on your parents' plan
Pre-existing conditions covered
Does away with annual and life-time limits on coverage

http://obamacarefacts.com/howdoes-obamacare-work.php

Obtuse much?

There's a reason why nobody takes you seriously here. It's because you're an idiot.

keymanjim
10-30-2013, 09:35 AM
Free preventative care for women
Free mammograms and colonoscopies

So, the doctors aren't getting paid to do these?

Codename Section
10-30-2013, 09:35 AM
Free preventative care for women
Free mammograms and colonoscopies
Insurance company rebates
Staying on your parents' plan
Pre-existing conditions covered
Does away with annual and life-time limits on coverage

http://obamacarefacts.com/howdoes-obamacare-work.php

Obtuse much?

At a higher cost which is what most people care about during an economic recession. All of those things are great if they're "free" but they are not, they are stuffed into plans so they can raise the premiums.

Captain Obvious
10-30-2013, 09:35 AM
So, the doctors aren't getting paid to do these?

nic is a total space cadet.

Waste of keystrokes.

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 09:39 AM
No one is a waste of keystrokes. Most people have good intentions. People truly believe there is a difference in the politicians that are in Washington because their personal party politics are different.

The intentions are always to serve business. This is the dance they all do and the only thing you can count on.

Does anyone remember when Senator Obama was going to not take corporate donations? I was routing for him then. The moment he did I realized that he would be no different than Bush.

There is no system that allows corporate donations that is "for the people". Those who believe that should go unicorn hunting this weekend.

Getting money out of politics is another fairy tale. Sorry.

nic34
10-30-2013, 10:00 AM
There's a reason why nobody takes you seriously here. It's because you're an idiot.

Really? Which one of those things listed are not true?

And don't change the subject by asking who pays for it. That's another thread....

keymanjim
10-30-2013, 10:02 AM
Really? Which one of those things listed are not true?

The part where you said it was free.

WHO PAYS FOR IT?

nic34
10-30-2013, 10:03 AM
nic is a total space cadet.

Waste of keystrokes.

Excuse me, did I offend you somehow?

Or are you simply unable to participate in a debate with those you don't agree with?

nic34
10-30-2013, 10:04 AM
The part where you said it was free.

WHO PAYS FOR IT?


Oh, so it DOES do those things..... thanks!

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 10:05 AM
Oh, so it DOES do those things..... thanks!

It does do those things which is why premium prices are higher.

keymanjim
10-30-2013, 10:05 AM
Oh, so it DOES do those things..... thanks!
Who pays for it?

The question wont go away just because you want it to.

nathanbforrest45
10-30-2013, 10:05 AM
No, actually it should be part of this thread because it directly relates to the cost of the new unhealthy care. If my premiums go up $500.00 a year and I get a $500.00 subsidy you would say my premiums did not increase. However, when you factor in the $500.00 increase in my taxes then those premiums did in fact increase.

TANSTAAFL

Ravi
10-30-2013, 10:06 AM
The part where you said it was free.

WHO PAYS FOR IT?
He should have said no out of pocket costs.

If only you nits had had congressional hearings on the botched Iraq war.

keymanjim
10-30-2013, 10:07 AM
He should have said no out of pocket costs.

That still doesn't answer the question.

Who pays for it?

nathanbforrest45
10-30-2013, 10:08 AM
He should have said no out of pocket costs.

If only you nits had had congressional hearings on the botched Iraq war.


Where does the money come from for the increased "not out of pocket" cost?

It comes out of somebody's pocket sooner or later

TANSTAAFL

nathanbforrest45
10-30-2013, 10:12 AM
I firmly believe Democrats can only comprehend the here and now, the very instant. Yesterday's gone and tomorrow isn't here yet so neither of them have any meaning. The only thing that does mean anything is RIGHT NOW THIS VERY INSTANT. So, if you don't have to write a check for the medical cost when they occur why they simply don't cost you anything. The taxes you pay in a month are taxes and completely disconnected from any medical cost.

Codename Section
10-30-2013, 10:20 AM
And Republicans only care about wasteful spending when it's a social program. ((shrugs))

Ravi
10-30-2013, 11:03 AM
Where does the money come from for the increased "not out of pocket" cost?

It comes out of somebody's pocket sooner or later

TANSTAAFL
Everyone pays for it. And preventative care is cheaper in the long run than treatment. Win/win.

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 11:04 AM
Everyone pays for it. And preventative care is cheaper in the long run than treatment. Win/win.

Technically-speaking not everyone pays for it.

Agravan
10-30-2013, 11:11 AM
Technically-speaking not everyone pays for it.

She means everyone that is currently paying taxes pays for it, not the 47% that don't pay taxes or will get "subsidized". It will still be "free" for them.

Ravi
10-30-2013, 11:20 AM
She means everyone that is currently paying taxes pays for it, not the 47% that don't pay taxes or will get "subsidized". It will still be "free" for them.
Good point. It's free for Mitt Romney types and the elderly and the working poor. Though I'd say the elderly and the working poor pay sales tax, etc.

Agravan
10-30-2013, 11:21 AM
Good point. It's free for Mitt Romney types and the elderly and the working poor. Though I'd say the elderly and the working poor pay sales tax, etc.
Really? Sales tax is 20-40% of your income?

Cigar
10-30-2013, 11:24 AM
So when did Personal Responsibility become Free? :laugh:

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 11:29 AM
Good point. It's free for Mitt Romney types and the elderly and the working poor. Though I'd say the elderly and the working poor pay sales tax, etc.

Actually I'm pretty sure Mitt Romney is buying insurance, and I'm also certain I know which pot of money sales taxes go into. Do you?


Not everyone is paying for Obamacare. That is not a bad thing to admit. I don't think someone who is working every day and making $20k a year should have to spend money they don't have on insurance.

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 11:30 AM
So when did Personal Responsibility become Free? :laugh:

1970

Agravan
10-30-2013, 11:31 AM
So when did Personal Responsibility become Free? :laugh:

It's never free, but it IS a choice. Which you idiots have taken away.

Ravi
10-30-2013, 11:33 AM
Actually I'm pretty sure Mitt Romney is buying insurance, and I'm also certain I know which pot of money sales taxes go into. Do you?


Not everyone is paying for Obamacare. That is not a bad thing to admit. I don't think someone who is working every day and making $20k a year should have to spend money they don't have on insurance.
Many hospitals benefit from receiving sales tax. Mitten is one of the 47% that don't pay income tax.

Agravan
10-30-2013, 11:35 AM
Many hospitals benefit from receiving sales tax. Mitten is one of the 47% that don't pay income tax.

You actually believe that? Link, please.

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 11:37 AM
Many hospitals benefit from receiving sales tax. Mitten is one of the 47% that don't pay income tax.

1. Many hospitals is not all and still doesn't explain how it is relative to "paying for Obamacare"
2. Mitt Romney is paying for insurance.
3. Mitt Romney pays capital gains taxes. If you're going to cite sales taxes as going towards Obamacare (which they don't) then understand also that capital gains taxes go into the same pot of money that Obamacare subsidies do come out of.

Does no one here understand how our taxation system works or finance?

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 11:39 AM
You actually believe that? Link, please.

Mitt Romney like most wealthy fucks doesn't pay himself a salary and uses dividends and other measures at a lower taxable rate. She's right that he pays no income tax. Dead wrong that capital gains don't go into the federal money pots.

She's also wrong about sales taxes people pay supporting Obamacare insurance.

That's just crazy talk.

Ravi
10-30-2013, 11:40 AM
1. Many hospitals is not all and still doesn't explain how it is relative to "paying for Obamacare"
2. Mitt Romney is paying for insurance.
3. Mitt Romney pays capital gains taxes. If you're going to cite sales taxes as going towards Obamacare (which they don't) then understand also that capital gains taxes go into the same pot of money that Obamacare subsidies do come out of.

Does no one here understand how our taxation system works or finance?

The dude's whine was that the 47% don't pay income taxes. He was trying to make a point that 47% don't or won't pay for health care. Romney is one of the 47%.

Ravi
10-30-2013, 11:41 AM
Mitt Romney like most wealthy fucks doesn't pay himself a salary and uses dividends and other measures at a lower taxable rate. She's right that he pays no income tax. Dead wrong that capital gains don't go into the federal money pots.

She's also wrong about sales taxes people pay supporting Obamacare insurance.

That's just crazy talk.

I didn't say sales tax supports Obamacare. I said it supports many hospitals. You know, the caregivers. The poor pay sales tax therefore they are not getting a free ride.

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 11:51 AM
I didn't say sales tax supports Obamacare. I said it supports many hospitals. You know, the caregivers. The poor pay sales tax therefore they are not getting a free ride.

You said:

Everyone pays for it. And preventative care is cheaper in the long run than treatment. Win/win.


I said, no, not everyone pays for it. You were wrong. It is no sin to admit you were wrong, but it is a childish move to obfuscate and throw straw men at me.

The poor pay sales tax which goes to things like roads, public schools, etc. Some hospitals, depending on the state, may receive state subsidies, but in general they do not.

Cigar
10-30-2013, 11:52 AM
Call Your Congressman - It's The Law,

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 11:56 AM
The dude's whine was that the 47% don't pay income taxes. He was trying to make a point that 47% don't or won't pay for health care. Romney is one of the 47%.

So you agree that capital gains taxes pay for Obamacare?

Cigar
10-30-2013, 12:00 PM
Elizabeth Cohen (CNN) just said something that has is totally Bull Shit. She stated that a woman in Arizona with breast cancer is frantic to get on the exchange because her insurance runs out in December. Went on to say that the woman spends hours and hours on the computer trying to get in and sign up for insurance, but to no avail.

WTF, so they have Internet Connectivity in Arizona, but no Land-Lines or Cellular Towers or Roads.

Well, if she were really that frantic (if she even exists) she could just pick up the phone and enroll the old, tried and true way.


I smell Bull Shit and CNN Bias!

WTW ... coverage doesn't start until after January 1st :laugh:

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 12:04 PM
Elizabeth Cohen (CNN) just said something that has is totally Bull Shit. She stated that a woman in Arizona with breast cancer is frantic to get on the exchange because her insurance runs out in December. Went on to say that the woman spends hours and hours on the computer trying to get in and sign up for insurance, but to no avail.

WTF, so they have Internet Connectivity in Arizona, but no Land-Lines or Cellular Towers or Roads.

That shows not a deep level of sympathy on your part for someone who may be dying. Why are you for Obamacare? To help people or because Republicans hate it. If the former, then you ought to be kinder and more generous towards this woman.




Well, if she were really that frantic (if she even exists) she could just pick up the phone and enroll the old, tried and true way.


Have you tried it over the phone? I know people that have. 1.45 hours and then click.




I smell Bull Shit and CNN Bias!


Doubtful you smell that.



WTW ... coverage doesn't start until after January 1st :laugh:

Perhaps she didn't know that? Everything the government says has been slippery and untruthful. I would not be surprised if people felt it was instant enrollment like any insurance policy.

Ravi
10-30-2013, 12:20 PM
You said:

Everyone pays for it. And preventative care is cheaper in the long run than treatment. Win/win.


I said, no, not everyone pays for it. You were wrong. It is no sin to admit you were wrong, but it is a childish move to obfuscate and throw straw men at me.

The poor pay sales tax which goes to things like roads, public schools, etc. Some hospitals, depending on the state, may receive state subsidies, but in general they do not.
It is clear to me now that you didn't follow the thread.

Who pays for "free" preventative care? Everyone.

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 12:29 PM
It is clear to me now that you didn't follow the thread.

Who pays for "free" preventative care? Everyone.

It is clear to me that you don't understand "free" or the thread.

Unless a doctor is working in a "pro bono" fashion it is not "free". Furthermore, everyone doesn't pay into the ACA system or even to health care systems. Some people utilize them without paying for services or contributing to the pool that subsidizes their services.

It is perfectly acceptable and even honorable to admit when you are wrong.

There is no judgment on the five year old who needs to see a doctor or the working mother who makes $8.50 an hour who uses credits. To accept the truth of how Obamacare works does not mean that you either do not wish to see these people receive health care or that you do.

It is just acceptance of reality.

Ravi
10-30-2013, 12:30 PM
:rolleyes:

Cigar
10-30-2013, 12:31 PM
That shows not a deep level of sympathy on your part for someone who may be dying. Why are you for Obamacare? To help people or because Republicans hate it. If the former, then you ought to be kinder and more generous towards this woman.



Have you tried it over the phone? I know people that have. 1.45 hours and then click.



Doubtful you smell that.



Perhaps she didn't know that? Everything the government says has been slippery and untruthful. I would not be surprised if people felt it was instant enrollment like any insurance policy.

Not if you're in a State that Gives a Shit

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 12:32 PM
Not if you're in a State that Gives a Shit

I'm not sure how this is a response.

lynn
10-30-2013, 12:56 PM
Free preventative care for women
Free mammograms and colonoscopies
Insurance company rebates
Staying on your parents' plan
Pre-existing conditions covered
Does away with annual and life-time limits on coverage

http://obamacarefacts.com/howdoes-obamacare-work.php

Obtuse much?


All those services you mentioned are not "free" your insurance company will be billed, however what they meant when they said it was "free" is their is no co-pay, co-insurance, not applied to your deductible to the consumer.

Agravan
10-30-2013, 02:47 PM
The dude's whine was that the 47% don't pay income taxes. He was trying to make a point that 47% don't or won't pay for health care. Romney is one of the 47%.
But he pays a lot in dividend and capital gains taxes, loon.

Ravi
10-30-2013, 02:50 PM
But he pays a lot in dividend and capital gains taxes, loon.Link?

Agravan
10-30-2013, 02:52 PM
Link?

He earns dividend and Capital Gains, does he not? hence, he pays taxes on them.

Ravi
10-30-2013, 02:56 PM
He earns dividend and Capital Gains, does he not? hence, he pays taxes on them.Link?

Agravan
10-30-2013, 03:06 PM
Link?

So I ask you for a link, but you fail to provide it. no you demand that I provide a link? You first.

Codename Section
10-30-2013, 03:11 PM
So I ask you for a link, but you fail to provide it. no you demand that I provide a link? You first.

Thank you. I'm still waiting on the link about most Republicans being pedophiles. I refuse to provide another link until she puts up or apologizes.

AmazonTania
10-30-2013, 05:49 PM
1. Many hospitals is not all and still doesn't explain how it is relative to "paying for Obamacare"
2. Mitt Romney is paying for insurance.
3. Mitt Romney pays capital gains taxes. If you're going to cite sales taxes as going towards Obamacare (which they don't) then understand also that capital gains taxes go into the same pot of money that Obamacare subsidies do come out of.

Does no one here understand how our taxation system works or finance?


NO!

AmazonTania
10-30-2013, 06:00 PM
Mitt Romney like most wealthy fucks doesn't pay himself a salary and uses dividends and other measures at a lower taxable rate. She's right that he pays no income tax. Dead wrong that capital gains don't go into the federal money pots.

She's also wrong about sales taxes people pay supporting Obamacare insurance.

That's just crazy talk.

Capital Gains are consider income.

Mitt Romney pays an income tax.

Wages and Salaries are just taxed differently from Capital Gains.

Mr. Freeze
10-30-2013, 07:28 PM
Capital Gains are consider income.

Mitt Romney pays an income tax.

Wages and Salaries are just taxed differently from Capital Gains.

Capital gains are "income" but long term capital gains are not subject to the "income tax". Mitt Romney (based off his returns submitted) was not using short term capital gains, but long term capital gains which are subject to a much lower tax rate (15%). Most people who have "wealth" as opposed to making a lot of money are able to structure their "payments" to themselves so that they are looking at 15% off their sales.

I'm sure you know this, however. I just like talking about it. :)

Ravi
10-31-2013, 04:35 AM
So I ask you for a link, but you fail to provide it. no you demand that I provide a link? You first.

No worries. Everyone knows Mitten hid all his tax returns.

Ravi
10-31-2013, 04:36 AM
Thank you. I'm still waiting on the link about most Republicans being pedophiles. I refuse to provide another link until she puts up or apologizes.

I didn't say that. What is up with the lie, it seems so mean.

Ravi
10-31-2013, 04:37 AM
Capital Gains are consider income.

Mitt Romney pays an income tax.

Wages and Salaries are just taxed differently from Capital Gains.Thank you captain obvious. Which puts Mitten squarely with the 47% that pay no income tax.

zelmo1234
10-31-2013, 04:41 AM
No worries. Everyone knows Mitten hid all his tax returns.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2012/09/21/mitt-romney-is-paying-too-much-in-taxes/

That would be why he paid more in taxes than required!

Do you ever base anything in reality, or just enjoy living in lefty loon land?

zelmo1234
10-31-2013, 04:43 AM
Thank you captain obvious. Which puts Mitten squarely with the 47% that pay no income tax.

Right, and still he paid more into the government that Obama has ever made in a year!

So just what is his fair share? Do you want to tax Capital gains at say 50% and gut people that have retired and are living on their investments, incomes in half?

Just how much should we take from those that earned money and give it to You I am sure

Ravi
10-31-2013, 04:46 AM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2012/09/21/mitt-romney-is-paying-too-much-in-taxes/

That would be why he paid more in taxes than required!

Do you ever base anything in reality, or just enjoy living in lefty loon land?

And no doubt after he cravenly tried to convince the American people he was suffering by paying more one year, he amended his return the next year and got a refund.

zelmo1234
10-31-2013, 05:00 AM
And no doubt after he cravenly tried to convince the American people he was suffering by paying more one year, he amended his return the next year and got a refund.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/mitt-romney-made-42-million-paid-14-percent/story?id=15423615

So he pays Capital gains which is legal.

So Clinton gave a huge tax cut on capital gains! And raised taxes on the middle class!

He paid between 2.5 million to 8 million in taxes! How much do you think that he should pay!

Captain Obvious
10-31-2013, 06:43 AM
Up next: birth certificates!

lynn
10-31-2013, 09:39 AM
Mitt Romney like most wealthy fucks doesn't pay himself a salary and uses dividends and other measures at a lower taxable rate. She's right that he pays no income tax. Dead wrong that capital gains don't go into the federal money pots.

She's also wrong about sales taxes people pay supporting Obamacare insurance.

That's just crazy talk.


Most if not all states use the cigarette tax to pay for their percentage of their Medicaid population for healthcare. They also use other state taxes to support this program. Anyway it doesn't matter which fund they are using since it is all paid by tax payers and consumers of tobacco.

Mr. Freeze
10-31-2013, 11:26 AM
Most if not all states use the cigarette tax to pay for their percentage of their Medicaid population for healthcare. They also use other state taxes to support this program. Anyway it doesn't matter which fund they are using since it is all paid by tax payers and consumers of tobacco.

Not everyone who requires or uses Medicaid smokes, nor everyone that smokes uses Medicaid, thus returning to my point that it is inappropriate to use words or phrases such as "everbody pays into it" in respect to health care.

And again for the individual who doesn't understand where money goes, long term capital gains may pay a lower tax rate than the US income tax, but they still pay a tax. Those tax dollars go into the same pool of money alongside everyone else. Moreover, even if Mitt Romney's tax liability for a given year is negative or zero as Dick Cheney's once was, he is still paying for insurance because not even rich people want to pay out of pocket for medical costs if they don't have to.

Knowing where and how to save money is the key to staying rich.

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 09:09 AM
Thank you captain obvious. Which puts Mitten squarely with the 47% that pay no income tax.

Capital Gains is taxed differently than Wages and Salaries. It is still individual income tax.

If you wanted to be an accountant, maybe you should have buckled down a little more in high school.

Ravi
11-01-2013, 09:26 AM
Capital Gains is taxed differently than Wages and Salaries. It is still individual income tax.

If you wanted to be an accountant, maybe you should have buckled down a little more in high school.Mitt Romney said that 47% don't pay income taxes. He is one of the 47% that don't pay income taxes. You can claim he pays capital gains taxes all you want but you might want to tell Mitten he's an idiot as he included himself in the 47% that don't pay income tax.

Have a cookie.

Mr. Freeze
11-01-2013, 09:34 AM
Mitt Romney said that 47% don't pay income taxes. He is one of the 47% that don't pay income taxes. You can claim he pays capital gains taxes all you want but you might want to tell Mitten he's an idiot as he included himself in the 47% that don't pay income tax.

Have a cookie.

He produced several tax returns that showed he payed a tax on his long term capital gains.

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 10:05 AM
For whatever reason, she still cannot understand that Capital Gains Taxes are Income Taxes. This is really the type of cognitive dissonance I deal with when I log on here...

http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc400.html

Mr. Freeze
11-01-2013, 10:19 AM
For whatever reason, she still cannot understand that Capital Gains Taxes are Income Taxes. This is really the type of cognitive dissonance I deal with when I log on here...

http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc400.html
AmazonTania

They are a tax on income, but they are not "the income tax", so she's playing with the common vernacular. In my line of work we do disociate capital tax from standard income tax so that we can dole out work accordingly among new accountants and accountants who have been in the game a minute.

I'll say specifically he's got long term capital gains or short term capital gains.

junie
11-01-2013, 10:35 AM
For whatever reason, she still cannot understand that Capital Gains Taxes are Income Taxes. This is really the type of cognitive dissonance I deal with when I log on here...

http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc400.html


there's earned income and then there's capital gains income, which was obviously what she was referring to.



your egotistical need to claim knowledge of what others supposedly don't understand rings hollow...

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 10:38 AM
there's earned income and then there's capital gains income, which was obviously what she was referring to.



your obvious need to claim knowledge of what others don't understand rings hollow...

Let's pretend for a moment that this excuse makes sense. Why is it even relevant? It isn't what Mitt Romney was referring to at all.

Captain Obvious
11-01-2013, 10:43 AM
Capital gains <> earned income

Captain Obvious
11-01-2013, 10:44 AM
Capital gains taxes <> EIT

Not even close.

Ravi
11-01-2013, 10:45 AM
Let's pretend for a moment that this excuse makes sense. Why is it even relevant? It isn't what Mitt Romney was referring to at all.
It was exactly what he was referring to, as well as those that don't earn enough to pay income tax: the elderly, the working poor, etc.

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 10:58 AM
It was exactly what he was referring to, as well as those that don't earn enough to pay income tax: the elderly, the working poor, etc.

I'm sure that makes you feel better to rationalise it in this fashion, but that's not what he was referring to at all.


"There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. All right, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. ... My job is not to worry about those people. I'll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives." -Mitt Romney, in leaked comments from a fundraiser in May 2012

Mr. Freeze
11-01-2013, 11:01 AM
Mitt Romney didn't exclude himself from the tax. If you think he did please point to which part of that speech that you feel he is referring to himself not paying taxes. He said "the income tax".

Capital gains taxes are income taxes, they are not commonly referred to in tax preparation as "the income tax" nor is it what anyone else (outside of a political forum where people quibble on terms) would refer to as the income tax. In fact, most people complain about the capital gains taxes because they are unlike the income tax that they pay.

Capital gains are claimed in your income taxes, they are a type of tax on your income, but they are not what the federal government removes from a salaried persons tax and called "the income tax".

Cigar
11-01-2013, 11:02 AM
It was exactly what he was referring to, as well as those that don't earn enough to pay income tax: the elderly, the working poor, etc.

Notice how quickly they ran away from the other Treads that smacked their BS Down

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 11:06 AM
Notice how quickly they ran away from the other Treads that smacked their BS Down

Yeah, we ran away, which is why I'm still awaiting a response.

Cigar
11-01-2013, 11:08 AM
Yeah, we ran away, which is why I'm still awaiting a response.

You were answered.

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 11:16 AM
You were answered.

You did? Sorry. Couldn't tell with your attention being diverted to the creation of more meaningless threads.

Ravi
11-01-2013, 11:34 AM
I'm sure that makes you feel better to rationalise it in this fashion, but that's not what he was referring to at all.

It's interesting that you left out the part where he said that 47% pay no income tax.


These are people who pay no income tax. Forty-seven percent of Americans pay no income tax. So our message of low taxes doesn't connect. And he'll be out there talking about tax cuts for the rich. I mean that's what they sell every four years. And so my job is not to worry about those people—I'll never convince them that they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives. ~Mitten Romney

The irony is delish.

Mr. Freeze
11-01-2013, 11:36 AM
It's interesting that you left out the part where he said that 47% pay no income tax.
~Mitten Romney

The irony is delish.

Where does that say he paid no taxes, which is what you implied that he said?

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 11:39 AM
It's interesting that you left out the part where he said that 47% pay no income tax.
~Mitten Romney

The irony is delish.

I didn't leave anything out. Here (http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/09/full-transcript-mitt-romney-secret-video#47percent) is the full transcript by Mother Jones which is, for whatever reason, is completely different from wherever quote your copied from.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/09/full-transcript-mitt-romney-secret-video#47percent

Ravi
11-01-2013, 11:39 AM
Where does that say he paid no taxes, which is what you implied that he said?He said 47% of Americans pay no income tax. He is one of the 47%. Not to mention that he gets special treatment by being allowed to only pay 13%

Ravi
11-01-2013, 11:41 AM
I didn't leave anything out. Here (http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/09/full-transcript-mitt-romney-secret-video#47percent) is the full transcript by Mother Jones which is, for whatever reason, is completely different from wherever quote your copied from.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/09/full-transcript-mitt-romney-secret-video#47percent
Uh, no. It is exactly the same. You left out the part I posted. I believe it is called creative editing.

jillian
11-01-2013, 11:42 AM
He said 47% of Americans pay no income tax. He is one of the 47%. Not to mention that he gets special treatment by being allowed to only pay 13%

from the transcript


there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe that government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you name it. That that's an entitlement. And the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what. And I mean, the president starts off with 48, 49, 48—he starts off with a huge number. These are people who pay no income tax

so where were you wrong again? *shrug*

it was retarded when he said it. it's still retarded. and it's retarded to defend his saying it... because the implication was that only people who don't pay taxes vote for democrats... which was a lie.

or maybe they think deployed military and social security recipients all vote democrat and should be paying taxes. (kind of belies their argument that military vote GOP)+

Ravi
11-01-2013, 11:45 AM
from the transcript



so where were you wrong again? *shrug*

it was retarded when he said it. it's still retarded. and it's retarded to defend his saying it... because the implication was that only people who don't pay taxes vote for democrats... which was a lie.

or maybe they think deployed military and social security recipients all vote democrat and should be paying taxes. (kind of belies their argument that military vote GOP)+

AT. When she isn't plagiarizing she is trying to alter reality.

Ravi
11-01-2013, 11:45 AM
Hey, I just found out that Mitten made quote of the year with that idiocy. He's so awesome. :)

jillian
11-01-2013, 11:47 AM
AT. When she isn't plagiarizing she is trying to alter reality.

i know.

but whatchagonnado?

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 11:48 AM
Uh, no. It is exactly the same. You left out the part I posted. I believe it is called creative editing.

According to you, I left out a particular quote from the transcript. Whatever you have posted is not in the transcript. At all.

It would be easier if you'd stop making things up.

Ravi
11-01-2013, 11:50 AM
According to you, I left out a particular quote from the transcript. Whatever you have posted is not in the transcript. At all.

It would be easier if you'd stop making things up.You should read the link you posted.

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 11:52 AM
AT. When she isn't plagiarizing she is trying to alter reality.

Says the person who can't correctly cite a source.

Don't worry. No one will ever accuse you of attending school.

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 11:55 AM
You should read the link you posted.

Maybe you should source your information correctly. It really isn't my job to keep educating you.

Speaking of which, you were suppose to be displaying your accounting brilliance in determining who capital gains taxes were not the same as income taxes.

That should be a laugh.

Ravi
11-01-2013, 11:57 AM
Maybe you should source your information correctly. It really isn't my job to keep educating you.

Speaking of which, you were suppose to be displaying your accounting brilliance in determining who capital gains taxes were not the same as income taxes.

That should be a laugh.

What I posted is in the link you posted from Mother Jones. You didn't even read your own link, did you? More irony. Tasty.

Mr. Freeze
11-01-2013, 12:01 PM
He said 47% of Americans pay no income tax. He is one of the 47%. Not to mention that he gets special treatment by being allowed to only pay 13%

He pays taxes on his income, but not the individual income tax. And as I have said to you earlier, he still buys insurance.

Mitt Romney was one clueless fuck. I have no idea how he can come across as a huge airhead and yet still do good in business. Either he had help or he was an idiot savant.

Ravi
11-01-2013, 12:03 PM
He pays taxes on his income, but not the individual income tax. And as I have said to you earlier, he still buys insurance.

Mitt Romney was one clueless fuck. I have no idea how he can come across as a huge airhead and yet still do good in business. Either he had help or he was an idiot savant.
Right. He doesn't pay the individual income tax, therefore he is part of the 47% he flushed down the toilet.

As to his success in business, IMO it is mostly luck and name recognition. Remember his father was a governor and Mitten was born with a silver spoon. He is able to use his name to make deals but you can be sure that he is merely the front man. Kind of like Bush/Cheney.

Ravi
11-01-2013, 12:09 PM
btw, I'm not so sure Romney pays for his insurance. He is eligible for medicare after all.

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 12:11 PM
Right. He doesn't pay the individual income tax, therefore he is part of the 47% he flushed down the toilet.



There are not 47% Americans in the country going without paying individual incomes taxes. Sorry, but you really cannot expect anyone with half of a brain to except that rationalisation.

The 47% is accurate for all forms of income, not just individual incomes taxes.

Ravi
11-01-2013, 12:18 PM
There are not 47% Americans in the country going without paying individual incomes taxes. Sorry, but you really cannot expect anyone with half of a brain to except that rationalisation.

The 47% is accurate for all forms of income, not just individual incomes taxes.
Maybe you should stick to British politics. Just a thought.

AmazonTania
11-01-2013, 12:25 PM
Maybe you should stick to British politics. Just a thought.

Maybe you should keep your thoughts to yourself. Keeps people from reading how ignorant you are.

But I'm sure that won't stop you from having another 'opinion.'

Ravi
11-01-2013, 12:28 PM
Maybe you should keep your thoughts to yourself. Keeps people from reading how ignorant you are.

But I'm sure that won't stop you from having another 'opinion.'Next time look beyond About.com for actual quotes. Merely looking far enough to confirm your bias is rather silly.

Mr. Freeze
11-01-2013, 12:28 PM
Right. He doesn't pay the individual income tax, therefore he is part of the 47% he flushed down the toilet.

That he swept into his inaccurate statement.