Netanyahu's harsh criticism of U.S. on Iran is a political boomerang

[shaarona]

Netanyahu's harsh criticism of U.S. on Iran is a political boomerang


http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/1.557144


Netanyahu's harsh criticism of U.S. on Iran is a political boomerang

Netanyahu can disagree with the American conception of how to best thwart Iran’s aspirations, but boasting of Israel’s ability to thumb its nose at the international diplomatic process is a dangerous threat in itself.

Haaretz | Nov. 9, 2013 | 8:00 PM | 8


There is an obstacle in the path of the relations between Israel and the United States; one that could crack, if not smash, those relations.

The harshest manifestation of the deep dispute between the two governments was Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s unbridled response to U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry’s efforts vis-à-vis Iran on the nuclear issue. With the parties on the threshold of signing a groundbreaking agreement in Geneva, which could pave the way to a reduction of Iran’s nuclear threat, Netanyahu continues to view the very diplomatic move itself as an existential threat, because it will leave Iran with a nuclear capability that could be transformed within a short period into bomb-making capability. “Israel is not obliged by this agreement” Netanyahu said, nudging Israel toward the status of a country that is threatening the international consensus.

This consensus could indeed be mistaken. There is still no assurance that Iran does not seek to attain a nuclear weapon; it is possible that agreements achieved in Geneva, at least in the first phase, will leave Iran quite a bit of room to continue enriching uranium, while weakening the sanctions against it.

And yet, it would be a historic mistake to seal the diplomatic channel in a way that does not allow full exploration of an end to the crisis without resorting to a military option, the chances and implications of which are impossible to predict.

Netanyahu can chalk up an impressive and important achievement in that he has placed the Iranian threat at the top of the world’s agenda. The threats of attack by Israel were even lauded by the American administration, which saw them as one reason for Iran’s willingness to move forward on diplomatic negotiations.

However, Israel’s strength depends on American and international backing. Without it, Israel cannot deal with either the Iranian threat or the other, closer, regional threats, especially when the United States has Israel's back against the demand to examine and neutralize Israel’s nuclear potential.

Netanyahu can disagree with the American conception of how to best thwart Iran’s aspirations, but boasting of Israel’s ability to thumb its nose at the international diplomatic process is a dangerous threat in itself. It is a political boomerang, making its way directly back to Israel’s head.

Netanyahu should grit his teeth, curb statements that only widen the rift between Israel and the United States and let the talks with Iran pass the experimental phase. Meanwhile, he should harness his rhetorical abilities and his concerns in progressing the diplomatic process with the Palestinians.

[jillian]

not really. it's ok to have different voices.

[shaarona]

not really. it's ok to have different voices.

It makes peace impossible... while Bibi builds more settlements and takes more land. They are stuck in the problem..

[Captain Obvious]

He's right about Iran.

[shaarona]

He's right about Iran.


http://forward.com/articles/133961/israel-doesn-t-need-the-west-bank-to-be-secure/

Iran will never bomb Israel.. but there will be a proliferation of nuclear weapons in the ME.

[Dr. Who]

I've never been a fan of Netanyahu and the hard liners. The last real hope of peace died with Rabin, who was a reasonable man. Without a willingness to compromise there will be no end to the conflict and the US cannot afford to keep expending so many resources endlessly trying to broker peace between actors who are unwilling to bend. Worse still when Israel would seem to take American support for granted.

[shaarona]

I've never been a fan of Netanyahu and the hard liners. The last real hope of peace died with Rabin, who was a reasonable man. Without a willingness to compromise there will be no end to the conflict and the US cannot afford to keep expending so many resources endlessly trying to broker peace between actors who are unwilling to bend. Worse still when Israel would seem to take American support for granted.

They have thwarted every single US president.. Time to put them on ignore.

[Mister D]

I've never been a fan of Netanyahu and the hard liners. The last real hope of peace died with Rabin, who was a reasonable man. Without a willingness to compromise there will be no end to the conflict and the US cannot afford to keep expending so many resources endlessly trying to broker peace between actors who are unwilling to bend. Worse still when Israel would seem to take American support for granted.

The Israel lobby is well funded and highly influential.

[Dr. Who]

The Israel lobby is well funded and highly influential.Good. They can send their contributions directly. The American cupboard is bare.

[Peter1469]

I am not sure if this is real or not (http://www.iransview.com/iranian-tv-airs-simulation-counter-attack-israel-video/1422/).


While the new round of nuclear talks (http://www.iransview.com/iranian-nuclear-talks-suggest-progress/1400/)between Iran and the P5+1 – five permanent members of the UN Security Council and Germany – begins in the Geneva on Thursday, Iranian state TV aired a documentary about Iran’s missile capabilities in confronting external threats and responding to any strikes against its soil. The one hour long documentary includes a video simulation of Iranian respond to an airstrike by Israel against Iran’s nuclear facilities.

[ptif219]

Netanyahu's harsh criticism of U.S. on Iran is a political boomerang


http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/1.557144


Netanyahu's harsh criticism of U.S. on Iran is a political boomerang

Netanyahu can disagree with the American conception of how to best thwart Iran’s aspirations, but boasting of Israel’s ability to thumb its nose at the international diplomatic process is a dangerous threat in itself.

Haaretz | Nov. 9, 2013 | 8:00 PM | 8


There is an obstacle in the path of the relations between Israel and the United States; one that could crack, if not smash, those relations.

The harshest manifestation of the deep dispute between the two governments was Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s unbridled response to U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry’s efforts vis-à-vis Iran on the nuclear issue. With the parties on the threshold of signing a groundbreaking agreement in Geneva, which could pave the way to a reduction of Iran’s nuclear threat, Netanyahu continues to view the very diplomatic move itself as an existential threat, because it will leave Iran with a nuclear capability that could be transformed within a short period into bomb-making capability. “Israel is not obliged by this agreement” Netanyahu said, nudging Israel toward the status of a country that is threatening the international consensus.

This consensus could indeed be mistaken. There is still no assurance that Iran does not seek to attain a nuclear weapon; it is possible that agreements achieved in Geneva, at least in the first phase, will leave Iran quite a bit of room to continue enriching uranium, while weakening the sanctions against it.

And yet, it would be a historic mistake to seal the diplomatic channel in a way that does not allow full exploration of an end to the crisis without resorting to a military option, the chances and implications of which are impossible to predict.

Netanyahu can chalk up an impressive and important achievement in that he has placed the Iranian threat at the top of the world’s agenda. The threats of attack by Israel were even lauded by the American administration, which saw them as one reason for Iran’s willingness to move forward on diplomatic negotiations.

However, Israel’s strength depends on American and international backing. Without it, Israel cannot deal with either the Iranian threat or the other, closer, regional threats, especially when the United States has Israel's back against the demand to examine and neutralize Israel’s nuclear potential.

Netanyahu can disagree with the American conception of how to best thwart Iran’s aspirations, but boasting of Israel’s ability to thumb its nose at the international diplomatic process is a dangerous threat in itself. It is a political boomerang, making its way directly back to Israel’s head.

Netanyahu should grit his teeth, curb statements that only widen the rift between Israel and the United States and let the talks with Iran pass the experimental phase. Meanwhile, he should harness his rhetorical abilities and his concerns in progressing the diplomatic process with the Palestinians.


What do you expect when Obama refuses to meet with Netanyahu. Or did you forget about how Obama has acted.

http://thehill.com/blogs/global-affairs/middle-east-north-africa/248807-obama-wont-meet-with-israels-netanyahu-during-us-visit

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Columnists/Candidly-Speaking-No-illusions-concerning-the-Obama-administration-331185

[ptif219]

Netanyahu's harsh criticism of U.S. on Iran is a political boomerang


http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/1.557144


Netanyahu's harsh criticism of U.S. on Iran is a political boomerang

Netanyahu can disagree with the American conception of how to best thwart Iran’s aspirations, but boasting of Israel’s ability to thumb its nose at the international diplomatic process is a dangerous threat in itself.

Haaretz | Nov. 9, 2013 | 8:00 PM | 8


There is an obstacle in the path of the relations between Israel and the United States; one that could crack, if not smash, those relations.

The harshest manifestation of the deep dispute between the two governments was Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s unbridled response to U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry’s efforts vis-à-vis Iran on the nuclear issue. With the parties on the threshold of signing a groundbreaking agreement in Geneva, which could pave the way to a reduction of Iran’s nuclear threat, Netanyahu continues to view the very diplomatic move itself as an existential threat, because it will leave Iran with a nuclear capability that could be transformed within a short period into bomb-making capability. “Israel is not obliged by this agreement” Netanyahu said, nudging Israel toward the status of a country that is threatening the international consensus.

This consensus could indeed be mistaken. There is still no assurance that Iran does not seek to attain a nuclear weapon; it is possible that agreements achieved in Geneva, at least in the first phase, will leave Iran quite a bit of room to continue enriching uranium, while weakening the sanctions against it.

And yet, it would be a historic mistake to seal the diplomatic channel in a way that does not allow full exploration of an end to the crisis without resorting to a military option, the chances and implications of which are impossible to predict.

Netanyahu can chalk up an impressive and important achievement in that he has placed the Iranian threat at the top of the world’s agenda. The threats of attack by Israel were even lauded by the American administration, which saw them as one reason for Iran’s willingness to move forward on diplomatic negotiations.

However, Israel’s strength depends on American and international backing. Without it, Israel cannot deal with either the Iranian threat or the other, closer, regional threats, especially when the United States has Israel's back against the demand to examine and neutralize Israel’s nuclear potential.

Netanyahu can disagree with the American conception of how to best thwart Iran’s aspirations, but boasting of Israel’s ability to thumb its nose at the international diplomatic process is a dangerous threat in itself. It is a political boomerang, making its way directly back to Israel’s head.

Netanyahu should grit his teeth, curb statements that only widen the rift between Israel and the United States and let the talks with Iran pass the experimental phase. Meanwhile, he should harness his rhetorical abilities and his concerns in progressing the diplomatic process with the Palestinians.


What do you expect when Obama refuses to meet with Netanyahu. Or did you forget about how Obama has acted.

http://thehill.com/blogs/global-affairs/middle-east-north-africa/248807-obama-wont-meet-with-israels-netanyahu-during-us-visit

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Columnists/Candidly-Speaking-No-illusions-concerning-the-Obama-administration-331185

[ptif219]

It makes peace impossible... while Bibi builds more settlements and takes more land. They are stuck in the problem..

It is Kerry and Obama making peace impossible

[ptif219]

http://forward.com/articles/133961/israel-doesn-t-need-the-west-bank-to-be-secure/

Iran will never bomb Israel.. but there will be a proliferation of nuclear weapons in the ME.

Don't bet on it

[shaarona]

What do you expect when Obama refuses to meet with Netanyahu. Or did you forget about how Obama has acted.

http://thehill.com/blogs/global-affairs/middle-east-north-africa/248807-obama-wont-meet-with-israels-netanyahu-during-us-visit

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Columnists/Candidly-Speaking-No-illusions-concerning-the-Obama-administration-331185

For God's sake.. Israel has poked every US president in the eye since Eisenhower.

[shaarona]

It is Kerry and Obama making peace impossible

Iran will not kill other Muslims or destroy the places of the Patriarchs. You have been completely hoodooed.

[ptif219]

For God's sake.. Israel has poked every US president in the eye since Eisenhower.

That is crap. I think you are part of the antisemitism movement

[ptif219]

Iran will not kill other Muslims or destroy the places of the Patriarchs. You have been completely hoodooed.

How many Iraqi's did Iran kill during the war

It is about Shiite's killing Sunni's or vice versa. Look at Syria and Iran is helping Syria kill muslims

[Peter1469]

Iran's Quds Force was operating in Iraq during the war. For the most part they targeted Sunnis, but they did attack Americans and also provided the Iraqi Shiites the explosive formed penetrator IED. They also were directly responsible for raiding a coalition base and killing most of the US soldiers.


Journalist Bill Roggio has suggested that the attackers may have intended to transfer the captured Americans over the border to Iran.[16] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karbala_provincial_headquarters_raid#cite_note-roggio-16)


“
This raid required specific intelligence, in depth training for the agents to pass as American troops, resources to provide for weapons, vehicles, uniforms, identification, radios and other items needed to successfully carry out the mission. Hezbollah’s Imad Mugniyah executed a similar attack against Israeli forces on the Lebanese border, which initiated the Hezbollah-Israeli war during the summer of 2006… Mahawil (where abandoned vehicles & the victim’s bodies were found) is in Babil province, about 27 miles directly east of Karbala. While it is impossible to prove, the attackers may have been making a bee-line towards the Iranian border.
The Karbala raid makes sense in light of the U.S. raids on the Iranian diplomatic missions in Baghdad and Irbil, where Iranian Qods Force agents were captured, along with documentation that divulged Iran’s involvement with and support of Shia death squads and al-Qaeda in Iraq. Five Iranians from the Irbil raid are still in U.S. custody, and captured U.S. soldiers would provide for excellent bargaining chips.
IF [sic] it is confirmed that Iran’s Qods Force was responsible, the news that the United States has authorized the death or captured [sic] of Iranian agents inside Iraq, as well as in Afghanistan and Lebanon makes all the more sense.

”


On July 2, 2007, the U.S. military said that information from captured Hezbollah (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hezbollah) fighter Ali Moussa Dakdouk established a link between Quds Force and the Karbala raid. Dakdouk worked as a liaison between Quds force and the Shia group that carried out the raid. According to the United States, Dakdouk said that the Shia group "could not have conducted this complex operation without the support and direction of the Quds force."

[The Wash]

It is Kerry and Obama making peace impossible

Jesus, Moses, and Muhammad could not make peace possible there.

[shaarona]

That is crap. I think you are part of the antisemitism movement

Nope I am not an anti-Semite.. I am just sick of Israel's long standing land grab. I have been watching this since the early 1950s.

[shaarona]

How many Iraqi's did Iran kill during the war

It is about Shiite's killing Sunni's or vice versa. Look at Syria and Iran is helping Syria kill muslims


In many place .. including Iraq Shia and Sunni intermarry and have extended family and tribal relations.

[ptif219]

Nope I am not an anti-Semite.. I am just sick of Israel's long standing land grab. I have been watching this since the early 1950s.

BS you are a Jew hater

[shaarona]

BS you are a Jew hater

Funny .... I have Jews in my family and they are pretty swell.

[ptif219]

In many place .. including Iraq Shia and Sunni intermarry and have extended family and tribal relations.

You talk crap. Iraq was Sunni against Shiite as is Syria as is Egypt. The list goes on they hate each other

[ptif219]

Kerry is now blaming Iran

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iran/10440753/Kerry-Iran-walked-away-from-nuclear-deal.html

[shaarona]

You talk crap. Iraq was Sunni against Shiite as is Syria as is Egypt. The list goes on they hate each other

And you know this because you live in Floriduh??

[Dr. Who]

BS you are a Jew haterYou can disagree with Israel's policies without being anti-Semitic. Many Israelis disagree with Israel's policies - the ones who don't support Netanyahu - what does that make them? Rabin didn't agree with Netanyahu and the hard liners and wanted to make peace. He was unfortunately assassinated by a hard liner.

[The Xl]

That is crap. I think you are part of the antisemitism movement

Haha, whenever anyone dares step to the mighty Israel, even with legitimate criticism, cons cry antisemitism just as quick as liberals cry racism.

Go ahead, elaborate on how that statement was antisemitic.

[ptif219]

And you know this because you live in Floriduh??

It is fact but then facts do not matter to you

[ptif219]

You can disagree with Israel's policies without being anti-Semitic. Many Israelis disagree with Israel's policies - the ones who don't support Netanyahu - what does that make them? Rabin didn't agree with Netanyahu and the hard liners and wanted to make peace. He was unfortunately assassinated by a hard liner.

Sorry but that is more than just disagreement

[ptif219]

Haha, whenever anyone dares step to the mighty Israel, even with legitimate criticism, cons cry antisemitism just as quick as liberals cry racism.

Go ahead, elaborate on how that statement was antisemitic.

Show proof and facts all I hear is opinions and attacks

[The Xl]

Show proof and facts all I hear is opinions and attacks

Facts? That's on you. You made the baseless assertion of antisemitism.

[nathanbforrest45]

I remember Shaarona from AWE where she posted under a variety of names held a variety of occupations, lived in a variety of places and knew all there was to know about the Middle East and its oil. She is a Muslim Shill which you will learn soon enough.

[ptif219]

Facts? That's on you. You made the baseless assertion of antisemitism.

The facts are on the one that made the useless opinionated attack against Israel

[Codename Section]

It is required that everyone like Israel.

[nathanbforrest45]

I like Israel a lot more than I do Iran or Syria.

[Codename Section]

I like Israel a lot more than I do Iran or Syria.

I like Peru more than I like all of them. Canada too. I also like Lichtenstein.

[Mister D]

The devotion of American evangelicals toward Israel amazes me.

[Mister D]

I like Peru more than I like all of them. Canada too. I also like Lichtenstein.

How can you not like Lichtenstein?

[shaarona]

I remember Shaarona from AWE where she posted under a variety of names held a variety of occupations, lived in a variety of places and knew all there was to know about the Middle East and its oil. She is a Muslim Shill which you will learn soon enough.

What is AWE? I never heard of it before.

[Mister D]

I used to be a strong supporter of Israel.

[nathanbforrest45]

I like Peru more than I like all of them. Canada too. I also like Lichtenstein.


Not real fond of Peru. Its a highly socialized, unstable country. Of all the places I have ever been, other than the United States I am rather fond of Australia. I have never been to England but I think I would have like the place in the 1930's

[The Xl]

I like Israel a lot more than I do Iran or Syria.

Israels creation really started this shit in the first place, so they should get shit for that.

I dislike them all. They're savages fighting over land cause of a fairy tale book.

[Codename Section]

Not real fond of Peru. Its a highly socialized, unstable country. Of all the places I have ever been, other than the United States I am rather fond of Australia. I have never been to England but I think I would have like the place in the 1930's

It's a beautiful country (Peru). Very green. Not a lot of laws actually. I've looked there for my escape when we go full on Big Brother.

[Mister D]

Not real fond of Peru. Its a highly socialized, unstable country. Of all the places I have ever been, other than the United States I am rather fond of Australia. I have never been to England but I think I would have like the place in the 1930's

Why the 30s? England was in a steady decline by then.

[nathanbforrest45]

What is AWE? I never heard of it before.
Your nose is growing and is about to poke through the screen.

You will give yourself away eventually. Every time you changed your screen name in AWE you quickly gave yourself away. This time it was your laughable claim that you hired doctors which is a claim you made before.

Have fun but I know who you are.

[Mister D]

Israels creation really started this shit in the first place, so they should get shit for that.

I dislike them all. They're savages fighting over land cause of a fairy tale book.

It's a racial/ethnic conflict. Israel is perceived as a European colony. It may have religious overtones but the near constant references to colonialism and South Africa betray the real basis of conflict.

[The Xl]

It's a racial/ethnic conflict. Israel is perceived as a European colony. It may have religious overtones but the near constant references to colonialism and South Africa betray the real basis of conflict.

The fact that jewish people, European nations, and America thought the creation of Israel was a good idea was beyond retarded.

[shaarona]

Your nose is growing and is about to poke through the screen.

You will give yourself away eventually. Every time you changed your screen name in AWE you quickly gave yourself away. This time it was your laughable claim that you hired doctors which is a claim you made before.

Have fun but I know who you are.

So what is AWE?

[Mister D]

The fact that jewish people, European nations, and America thought the creation of Israel was a good idea was beyond retarded.

Yeah, I tend to agree with that. The problem is that Israel exists and has for 60 years or so. Fait accompli. They really need to sort this shit out themselves. I'm tired of this relatively unimportant conflict getting so much air time. You could have 100s of African children raped and disembowelled but we'll hear more about a suicide bomber in Tel Aviv.

[The Xl]

Yeah, I tend to agree with that. The problem is that Israel exists and has for 60 years or so. Fait accompli. They really need to sort this shit out themselves. I'm tired of this relatively unimportant conflict getting so much air time. You could have 100s of African children raped and disembowelled but we'll hear more about a suicide bomber in Tel Aviv.

Agreed on all counts.

[nathanbforrest45]

It's a beautiful country (Peru). Very green. Not a lot of laws actually. I've looked there for my escape when we go full on Big Brother.

I once had an employee (a computer programmer) who decided he could work for me from Peru just as easily as he could from the room next to me. I let him go for awhile but every time we were on the phone service went out. The internet connection was down half of the time. There were other personal issues with the guy and eventually I had to cut him loose. I paid his health insurance for a year (which I don't understand why that was necessary since Peru was supposed to have this wonderful free health care system). The last I heard he was back in the States and I wish him well but that is my experience with Peru.

[nathanbforrest45]

Why the 30s? England was in a steady decline by then.

I think the culture, at least what was shown to us in America, was really cool. Also they made some of the finest motorcycles in the world!

[Mister D]

I think the culture, at least what was shown to us in America, was really cool. Also they made some of the finest motorcycles in the world!

I'm more of a fan of Victorian England. Sherlock Holmes, Jack the Ripper and all that.

[Mister D]

Agreed on all counts.

Jewish organizations in the US manipulate public opinion in favor of Israel while the progressive left envisions this as a struggle between oppressed brown people and their white oppressors. That pushes all their buttons. Thus it becomes our business. Sigh...

[nathanbforrest45]

The fact that jewish people, European nations, and America thought the creation of Israel was a good idea was beyond retarded.

Israel was theirs, it was promised to them by God. God also promised to help any country that helped his people. It may all be a fairy tale to some but to the majority of the worlds people the concept of a supreme being is far from a myth.

[The Xl]

Israel was theirs, it was promised to them by God. God also promised to help any country that helped his people. It may all be a fairy tale to some but to the majority of the worlds people the concept of a supreme being is far from a myth.

So they had a right to that land because a fiction book said so? Gtfo of here with that nonsense.

Oh yeah, and God told me the other day that all of gold in the world belongs to me, it's my birthright. Cereal. Now hand it over, everyone.

[nathanbforrest45]

I'm more of a fan of Victorian England. Sherlock Holmes, Jack the Ripper and all that.
Agatha Christie and Hercule Poirot

Maybe I need to step it back about 15 years.

[Dr. Who]

I'm more of a fan of Victorian England. Sherlock Holmes, Jack the Ripper and all that.A bit romanticized. Think work houses, child labor and debtors prisons.

[Mister D]

A bit romanticized. Think work houses, child labor and debtors prisons.

Totally romanticized. I plead guilty.

[Mister D]

Agatha Christie and Hercule Poirot

Maybe I need to step it back about 15 years.

Poirot is cool. I liked the TV series as well.

[shaarona]

Israel was theirs, it was promised to them by God. God also promised to help any country that helped his people. It may all be a fairy tale to some but to the majority of the worlds people the concept of a supreme being is far from a myth.

Oh BS.. they wrote the book.

[nathanbforrest45]

No, not a fiction book, the Word of God. There is a difference. Since you are obviously a non believer there is nothing I can say to you on this subject but it is the reason behind all this.

[The Xl]

No, not a fiction book, the Word of God. There is a difference. Since you are obviously a non believer there is nothing I can say to you on this subject but it is the reason behind all this.

Can you prove it? No? Then it's mere conjecture.

I realize you don't have the firepower necessary to debate your insane position, so I don't blame you for backing out now. It would be wise before you look even more ridiculous.

By the way, God said you need to give me your home. Sorry brah, it's the word of God. Leave by next Monday, if you would.

Christ.

[nathanbforrest45]

How can you not like Lichtenstein?


Lichtenstein? I thought that was Frankinstein's older brother

[Mister D]

Lichtenstein? I thought that was Frankinstein's older brother

I don't know...there's just something Medieval about it. It's like a little principality of the Holy Roman Empire. :smiley:

[shaarona]

No, not a fiction book, the Word of God. There is a difference. Since you are obviously a non believer there is nothing I can say to you on this subject but it is the reason behind all this.

I am a believer.. I just know I don't need signs and miracles.. The writings of the Bible are a compendium .. and a book of didactic literature. Its also very political.

[nathanbforrest45]

Can you prove it? No? Then it's mere conjecture.

I realize you don't have the firepower necessary to debate your insane position, so I don't blame you for backing out now. It would be wise before you look even more ridiculous.

By the way, God said you need to give me your home. Sorry brah, it's the word of God. Leave by next Monday, if you would.

Christ.


Well, now we know. Although you sometimes seem quite intelligent you are very given to stupid post.

Be of good cheer and I will pray for you

[nic34]

Oh BS.. they wrote the book.


:laugh:

Written in how many languages, revised how many times, not to mention certain texts not included ....?

[The Xl]

Well, now we know. Although you sometimes seem quite intelligent you are very given to stupid post.

Be of good cheer and I will pray for you

What, exactly, was stupid about my post? Explain in detail. This should be good.

[Codename Section]

Israel was theirs, it was promised to them by God. God also promised to help any country that helped his people. It may all be a fairy tale to some but to the majority of the worlds people the concept of a supreme being is far from a myth.

Moses wrote the Bible right? At least the OT....

[Dr. Who]

No, not a fiction book, the Word of God. There is a difference. Since you are obviously a non believer there is nothing I can say to you on this subject but it is the reason behind all this.

Based on Genesis:
The Land of Canaan, which was renamed Israel, was given by God to Abraham (formerly Abram) and his descendants as an everlasting possession.
Genesis 12:7a "The Lord appeared to Abram and said, 'To your descendants I will give this land.'"

In Genesis 13:15, He repeated His promise when He said, "for all the land which you see, I will give it to you and to your descendants forever." He said the same thing in Genesis 15:18, "To your descendants I have given this land."

Genesis 17:7-8 states: "And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you throughout their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and to your descendants after you. And I will give to you and to your descendants after you, the land of your sojourning, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God."

Who was Abraham's first son? Ishmael. Islamic traditions consider Ishmael to be the ancestor of the Arab people. So if the descendants of Abraham have a God given right to that land, that also includes the descendants of Ishmael.

[nic34]

Moses wrote the Bible right? At least the OT....

It is said Moses was the writer and editor of the Pentateuch... the first 5 books.

[The Xl]

Based on Genesis:
The Land of Canaan, which was renamed Israel, was given by God to Abraham (formerly Abram) and his descendants as an everlasting possession.
Genesis 12:7a "The Lord appeared to Abram and said, 'To your descendants I will give this land.'"

In Genesis 13:15, He repeated His promise when He said, "for all the land which you see, I will give it to you and to your descendants forever." He said the same thing in Genesis 15:18, "To your descendants I have given this land."

Genesis 17:7-8 states: "And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you throughout their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and to your descendants after you. And I will give to you and to your descendants after you, the land of your sojourning, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God."

Who was Abraham's first son? Ishmael. Islamic traditions consider Ishmael to be the ancestor of the Arab people. So if the descendants of Abraham have a God given right to that land, that also includes the descendants of Ishmael.

Instead of arguing who promised what to whom, we should be talking about the insanity of the fact that some people think a particular land is their birthright because of a book that cannot be proven to be fact said so.

[The Xl]

God promised me Eva Mendez, Jennifer Lopez, Beyonce, and Mila Kunis, all at once. He told me so. They are disobeying the word of the lord right now.

This some bullshit.

[nic34]

:laugh:

[shaarona]

moses wrote the bible right? At least the ot....

lolol

[shaarona]

It is said Moses was the writer and editor of the Pentateuch... the first 5 books.

And Moses wrote pot mortem.

[The Sage of Main Street]

For God's sake.. Israel has poked every US president in the eye since Eisenhower.

Ike blew it over Suez, which was British property and never would have been built by the backward Egyptians. He appeased the savages so they wouldn't ally with the Russians, which they did anyway. These bandit tribes see not poking them in the eye as a sign of weakness. Another unrealistic reason behind handcuffing Israel, the British, and the French was that Europe was dependent on Arab oil. Again, that oil belongs to the West by the right of intellectual property. And still again, giving these fugitives from evolution a freebie didn't make them grateful. They proceeded to first gouge us for dozens of times what "their" oil is worth. When that didn't get a manly response, it signaled that the time was ripe for another jihad.

[shaarona]

Ike blew it over Suez, which was British property and never would have been built by the backward Egyptians. He appeased the savages so they wouldn't ally with the Russians, which they did anyway. These bandit tribes see not poking them in the eye as a sign of weakness. Another unrealistic reason behind handcuffing Israel, the British, and the French was that Europe was dependent on Arab oil. Again, that oil belongs to the West by the right of intellectual property. And still again, giving these fugitives from evolution a freebie didn't make them grateful. They proceeded to first gouge us for dozens of times what "their" oil is worth. When that didn't get a manly response, it signaled that the time was ripe for another jihad.

No Ike blew it over the Aswan Dam and the Lavon affair. The Suez Canal was constructed in 1869.

[nathanbforrest45]

Based on Genesis:
The Land of Canaan, which was renamed Israel, was given by God to Abraham (formerly Abram) and his descendants as an everlasting possession.
Genesis 12:7a "The Lord appeared to Abram and said, 'To your descendants I will give this land.'"

In Genesis 13:15, He repeated His promise when He said, "for all the land which you see, I will give it to you and to your descendants forever." He said the same thing in Genesis 15:18, "To your descendants I have given this land."

Genesis 17:7-8 states: "And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you throughout their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and to your descendants after you. And I will give to you and to your descendants after you, the land of your sojourning, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God."

Who was Abraham's first son? Ishmael. Islamic traditions consider Ishmael to be the ancestor of the Arab people. So if the descendants of Abraham have a God given right to that land, that also includes the descendants of Ishmael.


Ishmael was the illegitimate son of Abraham and Sarah's handmaiden. God told Abraham that he would give him a son through Sarah but neither of them believed that because she was so old so Abraham mated with Hagar. Ishmael should never have existed and God did not intend for him to do so. Issac is the legitimate heir to God's promise, not Ishmael.

[shaarona]

Ishmael was the illegitimate son of Abraham and Sarah's handmaiden. God told Abraham that he would give him a son through Sarah but neither of them believed that because she was so old so Abraham mated with Hagar. Ishmael should never have existed and God did not intend for him to do so. Issac is the legitimate heir to God's promise, not Ishmael.

Not in the Arab world.. The children of slaves and concubines have all the rights of other sons.. And after all .. Abraham was from Basra.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Instead of arguing who promised what to whom, we should be talking about the insanity of the fact that some people think a particular land is their birthright because of a book that cannot be proven to be fact said so.

After the Allies terminated a 600-year jihad by the Ottoman Turks, the reward for their bitter sacrifice was control of the Middle East to divide up any way they saw fit. Practically all the countries were given Muslim Supremacy except Jewish Israel and Christian Lebanon. Among other reasons, this was done to see if Muslims could get along with their non-Muslim neighbors. They failed that test and should be kicked out of the family of nations. Self-determination for countries determined to destroy us was a suicidal idea.

[nathanbforrest45]

Not in the Arab world.. The children of slaves and concubines have all the rights of other sons.. And after all .. Abraham was from Basra.
Yep, its you alright. I knew it.

[nathanbforrest45]

Not in the Arab world.. The children of slaves and concubines have all the rights of other sons.. And after all .. Abraham was from Basra.
I suppose you rented him his first tent?

Basra wasn't in existence until the 7th century. He was from Mesopotamia which would include the area Basra is now in but he was not an "arab" and Ishmael did not inherit the lands. That is what the fighting as been about for the last 5000 years.

And you are who I said you were, you might as well admit it unless you are ashamed of it.

[shaarona]

I suppose you rented him his first tent?

Basra wasn't in existence until the 7th century. He was from Mesopotamia which would include the area Basra is now in but he was not an "arab" and Ishmael did not inherit the lands. That is what the fighting as been about for the last 5000 years.

And you are who I said you were, you might as well admit it unless you are ashamed of it.

Abraham was from UR.. near modern day Basra.

http://www.markville.ss.yrdsb.edu.on.ca/projects/classof2008/chong2/ekalambalikis/ur-map.jpg

[nathanbforrest45]

Abraham was from UR.. near modern day Basra.

http://www.markville.ss.yrdsb.edu.on.ca/projects/classof2008/chong2/ekalambalikis/ur-map.jpg


You rented him his first tent so you know exactly where he is from?

Get outta here with that bull.

[Peter1469]

You rented him his first tent so you know exactly where he is from?

Get outta here with that bull.

She is correct. A lot of my buddies got to go see it, I never had the time.

During the Gulf War Saddam placed an anti aircraft battery next to it. The allies decided to not risk hurting the ancient site so they just routed flights around it.

[bladimz]

:laugh:

Written in how many languages, revised how many times, not to mention certain texts not included ....?And we all know what Thomas Jefferson did with his Bible...

4530

[bladimz]

I grew up believing that the Bible was THE Word. I accepted Jesus Christ as my lord and savior when i was 16. I swallowed the bait hook, line and sinker. Religion for sale. Buy your way into Heaven, and all that.

Imagine believing in a higher and purer power that lives in all things, at the same time walking happily away from organized religion, created by people to influence and control other people.

Some people could never imagine that. Those people need to open up.

[Mister D]

I grew up believing that the Bible was THE Word. I accepted Jesus Christ as my lord and savior when i was 16. I swallowed the bait hook, line and sinker. Religion for sale. Buy your way into Heaven, and all that.

Imagine believing in a higher and purer power that lives in all things, at the same time walking happily away from organized religion, created by people to influence and control other people.

Some people could never imagine that. Those people need to open up.

To what?

[ptif219]

It is required that everyone like Israel.

Problem is antisemitism is increasing


http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/08/antisemitism-rise-european-survey

http://www.jpost.com/Jewish-World/Jewish-News/Study-Global-anti-Semitism-rises-by-30-percent-308991

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/20/anti-semitism-reports-increase-state-department-says_n_3307979.html

[ptif219]

The fact that jewish people, European nations, and America thought the creation of Israel was a good idea was beyond retarded.

It was Israel all the way back to King David

[ptif219]

Based on Genesis:
The Land of Canaan, which was renamed Israel, was given by God to Abraham (formerly Abram) and his descendants as an everlasting possession.
Genesis 12:7a "The Lord appeared to Abram and said, 'To your descendants I will give this land.'"

In Genesis 13:15, He repeated His promise when He said, "for all the land which you see, I will give it to you and to your descendants forever." He said the same thing in Genesis 15:18, "To your descendants I have given this land."

Genesis 17:7-8 states: "And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you throughout their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and to your descendants after you. And I will give to you and to your descendants after you, the land of your sojourning, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God."

Who was Abraham's first son? Ishmael. Islamic traditions consider Ishmael to be the ancestor of the Arab people. So if the descendants of Abraham have a God given right to that land, that also includes the descendants of Ishmael.

Not really since Ishmael was rejected and sent away with his Mother

[ptif219]

Not in the Arab world.. The children of slaves and concubines have all the rights of other sons.. And after all .. Abraham was from Basra.

Ishmael was set away he got no birth right

[nathanbforrest45]

Besides, God said the offspring of Abraham and Sarah was to have the Birth Right. Ishmael was the offspring of Abraham and Hagar so was not included in God's plan.

It doesn't matter if you believe this or not, the war between Israel and the Arab world is a result of sibling rivalry and they believe it and that is all that matters.

[shaarona]

Besides, God said the offspring of Abraham and Sarah was to have the Birth Right. Ishmael was the offspring of Abraham and Hagar so was not included in God's plan.

It doesn't matter if you believe this or not, the war between Israel and the Arab world is a result of sibling rivalry and they believe it and that is all that matters.

Deuteronomy 21: 15 to 17 :

“Suppose a man has two wives, but he loves one and not the other, and both have given him sons. And suppose the firstborn son is the son of the wife he does not love. When the man divides his inheritance, he may not give the larger inheritance to his younger son, the son of the wife he loves, as if he were the firstborn son.He must recognize the rights of his oldest son, the son of the wife he does not love, by giving him a double portion. He is the first son of his father’s virility, and the rights of the firstborn belong to him.”

[The Sage of Main Street]

Imagine believing in a higher and purer power that lives in all things, at the same time walking happily away from organized religion, created by people to influence and control other people.

.

That's basically what Jesus did. But Peter and Paul entrepreneured it into a mega-corp.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Problem is antisemitism is increasing


http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/08/antisemitism-rise-european-survey

http://www.jpost.com/Jewish-World/Jewish-News/Study-Global-anti-Semitism-rises-by-30-percent-308991

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/20/anti-semitism-reports-increase-state-department-says_n_3307979.html

Anti-Semitism always leaves a yellow stain. For decades, Dhimmis have let themselves get pushed around by OPEC's illegal cartel. To real men, abuse of property rights calls for confiscation. But those who swim in Chamberlain's Chamberbot see anti-Semitism as a lifeboat getting them out of their yellow sea.

[shaarona]

Anti-Semitism always leaves a yellow stain. For decades, Dhimmis have let themselves get pushed around by OPEC's illegal cartel. To real men, abuse of property rights calls for confiscation. But those who swim in Chamberlain's Chamberbot see anti-Semitism as a lifeboat getting them out of their yellow sea.

OPEC's cartel is perfectly legal and has done a lot to stabilize both price and supply.

Without OPEC.. there would be chaos in the market.

Dhimmis? That's theatrical but dishonest.

You have NO property in the oil producing countries.

[jillian]

OPEC's cartel is perfectly legal and has done a lot to stabilize both price and supply.

Without OPEC.. there would be chaos in the market.

Dhimmis? That's theatrical but dishonest.

You have NO property in the oil producing countries.

OPEC is legal, but they're nothing more than a price manipulation entity that holds us hostage because of our need for fossil fuels. stability? meh...

as for the last part of his post, i'm afraid i don't understand what he's talking about.

[nathanbforrest45]

Deuteronomy 21: 15 to 17 :

“Suppose a man has two wives, but he loves one and not the other, and both have given him sons. And suppose the firstborn son is the son of the wife he does not love. When the man divides his inheritance, he may not give the larger inheritance to his younger son, the son of the wife he loves, as if he were the firstborn son.He must recognize the rights of his oldest son, the son of the wife he does not love, by giving him a double portion. He is the first son of his father’s virility, and the rights of the firstborn belong to him.”




God told Abraham he and Sarah would produce a son. He and Sarah. Sarah and him. The birthright went to Issac, not Ishmael.

It was for him and Sarah. Sarah and him.

Should I say this in Arabic so you will understand better?

[shaarona]

OPEC is legal, but they're nothing more than a price manipulation entity that holds us hostage because of our need for fossil fuels. stability? meh...

as for the last part of his post, i'm afraid i don't understand what he's talking about.

If not for OPEC US and Canadian production would go broke.

[shaarona]

God told Abraham he and Sarah would produce a son. He and Sarah. Sarah and him. The birthright went to Issac, not Ishmael.

It was for him and Sarah. Sarah and him.

Should I say this in Arabic so you will understand better?

Read your Bible.. Ishmael was the first son.. and then Abraham had six more with Keturah.. ALL were circumcised... all were subject to the covenant.

The OT is full of stories where the younger son gets over on the first born.

[Ransom]

If not for OPEC US and Canadian production would go broke.

If not for US and Western protection, OPEC countries would be speaking German.

[ptif219]

Read your Bible.. Ishmael was the first son.. and then Abraham had six more with Keturah.. ALL were circumcised... all were subject to the covenant.

The OT is full of stories where the younger son gets over on the first born.

Ishmael was sent away with his mother and got no inheritance.

[The Sage of Main Street]

OPEC's cartel is perfectly legal and has done a lot to stabilize both price and supply.





You have NO property in the oil producing countries.

They are our enemies; enemies have no property rights. Besides, only weakling pushovers let themselves get gouged; we should have confiscated Muslim oil even before the Nazislamis declared war on civilization. OPEC price-gouging finances the jihads. Our trustfundie Treehuggers even admit that, but only to push the false conclusion that we should use less oil.

[shaarona]

They are our enemies; enemies have no property rights. Besides, only weakling pushovers let themselves get gouged; we should have confiscated Muslim oil even before the Nazislamis declared war on civilization. OPEC price-gouging finances the jihads. Our trustfundie Treehuggers even admit that, but only to push the false conclusion that we should use less oil.

Evidently you don't know anything about the oil business, OPEC or the oil producing countries.... What is a trustfundie treehugger?