One of the better Golbal Warming Debates, if you are interested and not in the tank

[texan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AgZU5uvM5Ok

I think Joe Bastardi is correct and I think it is proving to be correct.

[Cigar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2K2s2EjsXJI&feature=player_embedded

New interviews from climate scientists at last month's American Geophysical Union Fall meeting in San Francisco.
There is an emerging consensus on extremes, and it sheds light on our current weather in the (eastern) US.

[jillian]

New interviews from climate scientists at last month's American Geophysical Union Fall meeting in San Francisco.
There is an emerging consensus on extremes, and it sheds light on our current weather in the (eastern) US.

science bad....

[texan]

Jillian I am beginning to question your posts. If you watched the first debate it was full of balanced science from both sides. Why do you think one side has science and the other doesn't? Here is a hint for you they are all scientists.

Cigar, don't they pretty much have to CYA on what's happening because it is starting to not look so good. They will be taking some readings in the next two years that are trending down. Then the "Lucy the scientists" will have some splaining to do...............Climate always changes, its going from 35 to 60 this week in Dallas.

[undine]

I had to put my heater on last night. Therefore global warming is a lie.

[Cigar]

Jillian I am beginning to question your posts. If you watched the first debate it was full of balanced science from both sides. Why do you think one side has science and the other doesn't? Here is a hint for you they are all scientists. Cigar, don't they pretty much have to CYA on what's happening because it is starting to not look so good. They will be taking some readings in the next two years that are trending down. Then the "Lucy the scientists" will have some splaining to do...............Climate always changes, its going from 35 to 60 this week in Dallas.

So ... exactly what did the say is penning not true? Exactly

No one is talking about sort memory data points ... you don't measure climate change between Sunday and Saturday :rollseyes:

Forget it, who care how long you stay dumb ...

[texan]

So ... exactly what did the say is penning not true? Exactly .......Did you watch the debate? You are posting like you didn't. The last slide he put up.

No one is talking about sort memory data points ... you don't measure climate change between Sunday and Saturday :rollseyes: We'll sorry if the humoristic pun didn't tickle your fancy.

Forget it, who care how long you stay dumb ... I never claimed to be smart. In fact, I think I may not be smart at all. But one thing I am pretty good at is sniffing out the bologna. First off this is not settled "science" by any means, just because you and others say it doesn't make it the least bit settled. But it is a nice marketing catch phrase.

Here I will do work so Jillian doesn't have to question the science:


Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2013/04/26/climate-scientists-come-to-terms-with-the-lack-of-global-warming/#ixzz2pkrv7A25

Sample:
Despite the heated rhetoric from the Obama administration and environmental groups about the urgency of global warming, climate scientists have begun to come to terms with the lack of evidence of catastrophic global warming over the last decade.

“While some climate scientists continue to resist the obvious that the climate system is more complex than they assumed, others are starting to accept that the multi-decadal climate projections provide very incomplete simulations has to how the real climate system works,” Roger Pielke, Sr., Senior Research Scientist at CIRES at the University of Colorado at Boulder, told The Daily Caller News Foundation.

Establishment media outlets have been reporting (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/04/09/climate-change-skeptics-seize-on-reports-showing-temperatures-leveling/) about the unexpected stabilizing global surface temperatures over at least the last decade, and even former NASA scientist and environmental activist James Hansen has recognized the decade-long lull.


This article just shows you the yellers (who are millionaires now) of global warming are premature. They are learning it is not as simple as they tried to make it.........................Now I will say from one dumb guy to a smart guy. Don't let some marketing hacks feed you BS with a funnel and send you into the world. I have confidence you are smarter.

[texan]

Does anyone pay the fee to erase your carbon footprint when you buy a rent car.

[Chloe]

I like Bill Nye. I think they are both right in many respects but the difference, in my opinion, is that Joe Bastardi is making a point for current weather and current temperature whereas Bill Nye is showing trends through time up until today and giving the overall story. Bastardi is in the moment and micro focused whereas Nye is more macro I guess you could say and seeing the big picture. They both make good arguments for their point of view but I don't think either will convince their opposition. Anyway that's my opinion. Good debate though.

5255

[texan]

Thanks for the thoughtful post. It sounded to me that Bastardi is using standard measurements that we have used over the years. Especially the last slide. I am will to kick this around and listen, in no way is this "settled science" because people yell that tag line. I am interested in understanding better and I am not an expert. I won't let some political wedge issue set by a party make my opinion. I also think the article I posted above shows the flaws in what Nye is trying to make a fact.

“While some climate scientists continue to resist the obvious that the climate system is more complex than they assumed, others are starting to accept that the multi-decadal climate projections provide very incomplete simulations has to how the real climate system works,” Roger Pielke, Sr., Senior Research Scientist at CIRES at the University of Colorado at Boulder, told The Daily Caller News Foundation.

Establishment media outlets have been reporting (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/04/09/climate-change-skeptics-seize-on-reports-showing-temperatures-leveling/) about the unexpected stabilizing global surface temperatures over at least the last decade, and even former NASA scientist and environmental activist James Hansen has recognized the decade-long lull.

[texan]

What history has taught us;

1. Life on the planet does far better in warming periods and far poorer in cooling periods. This has actually happened many times. We know this.

2. Humans tend to put large populations on or near coastlines and always have. As global temps change that coast line recedes in colder times and goes underwater in warmer times. Plenty of under water cities from our "second" of civilized history.

3. Human input as to greenhouse gases is miniscule in comparison to naturally occurring on planet.

4. For 4.6 billion years Earth has been steadily cooling and we know an ice cube is our distant future.

5. The predictions of the warmists have completely been off base. Go back and read Al's book, or ipcc or any of the other scientific warmist predictions as to water levels, storms, ice caps ext............ They are all way off to flat out been opposite of predictions. People still vacation in Maldives. Should be well underwater based on any of those former scientific predictions.

6. The ultimate give up. Manmade C02 driven global warming be change to climate change. I predict climate change too. Is easy. It always does, but with no specific direction not real meaningful.

I'm an environmentalist and do plenty personally in that effort, as well as mentoring others, and promoting clean earth projects, but none of that has a thing to do with the theory that the earth is warming due to manmade C02 burn. WHY?

Not near enough of a times slice. The data is not remotely standardized by time, place, or gathering methodology. Politics and desire for more funding has clouded even the questionable data we are aware of.

[Contrails]

I think Joe Bastardi is correct and I think it is proving to be correct.
I think Joe Bastardi is ignoring 98% of the planet. Who opens a debate on GLOBAL warming with a weather map of the US?


What history has taught us;

1. Life on the planet does far better in warming periods and far poorer in cooling periods. This has actually happened many times. We know this.
It's not the magnitude of the temperature that is the problem, but rather how quickly temperature is changing.


2. Humans tend to put large populations on or near coastlines and always have. As global temps change that coast line recedes in colder times and goes underwater in warmer times. Plenty of under water cities from our "second" of civilized history.
So warmer weather is bad for people living near the coast.


3. Human input as to greenhouse gases is miniscule in comparison to naturally occurring on planet.
While nature produces far more greenhouse gasses than humans, it also absorbs more than it produces. That means all of the increased CO2 is due to humans.


4. For 4.6 billion years Earth has been steadily cooling and we know an ice cube is our distant future.
Human civilization has only existed since the end of the last ice age when global mean temperature has been relatively stable. Again, it's not the temperature but how fast it is changing that is the problem.


5. The predictions of the warmists have completely been off base. Go back and read Al's book, or ipcc or any of the other scientific warmist predictions as to water levels, storms, ice caps ext............ They are all way off to flat out been opposite of predictions. People still vacation in Maldives. Should be well underwater based on any of those former scientific predictions.
Back in 1981 Jim Hansen projected a warming trend of 0.15°C per decade which is only 6% above the measured rate of 0.17°C per decade. That's far more accurate than any of the "skeptics".


6. The ultimate give up. Manmade C02 driven global warming be change to climate change. I predict climate change too. Is easy. It always does, but with no specific direction not real meaningful.
Scientists have always used the terms "global warming" and "climate change" because, while related, they have different meanings. The only person who ever suggested changing "global warming" to "climate change" was a "skeptic" (http://www.skepticalscience.com/climate-change-global-warming.htm).


I'm an environmentalist and do plenty personally in that effort, as well as mentoring others, and promoting clean earth projects, but none of that has a thing to do with the theory that the earth is warming due to manmade C02 burn. WHY?
Better question, why not?


Not near enough of a times slice. The data is not remotely standardized by time, place, or gathering methodology. Politics and desire for more funding has clouded even the questionable data we are aware of.
It would be nice if scientists could go back in time and change how data is collected, but that is not possible and scientists have to work with the data they have. And when an organization funded by skeptics with a goal of exposing flaws in the science comes to the conclusion that the warming trend is real (http://www.berkeleyearth.org/), how can you say that the data is questionable?