Obamacare Hasn’t Slowed The Growth of Health Care Costs – It’s The Economy, Stupid!

[Chris]

The cost of healthcare has surprisingly gone down. There are false claims going around that Obamacare is the cause. Instead it's the economic slump we're in. Here's Tom Coburn to explain:

Obamacare Hasn’t Slowed The Growth of Health Care Costs – It’s The Economy, Stupid! (http://thefederalist.com/2014/01/09/obamacare-hasnt-slowed-the-growth-of-health-care-costs-its-the-economy-stupid/)


Obama administration advisors and supporters have been arguing that Obamacare and its grand designs to reshape health care have been a primary reason why health care costs have slowed. Yet, the facts and data the real world – rather than the world of unreality in which people can keep their doctors and plans if they like them until they can’t – show that the old James Carville adage is still correct. When it comes to the slowdown in health costs, it’s the economy, stupid.

This week, Jason Furman, head of the President’s council of economic advisers, penned a piece in the Wall Street Journal entitled “Obamacare is slowing health inflation” in which he pointed to an annual report on health care spending from the Office of the Actuary at the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services (CMS) to show that Obamacare has helped slow or reduce health costs.

The problem is the report does not say what Furman suggests it says. In fact, the report actually acknowledged that the main driver of the temporary slowdown in the rate of health care growth was not Obamacare, but an economy shaken by the Great Recession. Since World War II, the historical pattern is that the annual increase in the rate of health care spending slows a bit during periods of economic turmoil or recession, as consumers lose their health coverage or have fewer dollars to spend on care.

In a comprehensive study on this phenomenon, the Kaiser Family Foundation used statistical analysis to examine 50 years of health spending and economic trends. The study found that the economy produces a major but delayed effect on the nation’s health spending, and attributes 77 percent of the slowdown due to poor economic conditions. In other words, the economy is not a factor, but the factor.

The CMS report itself underscored that the slower-than-average annual growth in health care spending was attributable to a weak economy....

...Moreover, the claim that the ACA will kill jobs is not mere rhetoric. The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office found that, thanks to the ACA, if you like your job, there’s no guarantee you can keep it. CBO found the health care law will reduce the workforce by 800,000 jobs over a decade. And because the CBO does not conduct industry-specific assessments of potential job losses, the job loss tally could grow far higher.

Plus, headlines for months have warned of companies reducing workers’ hours and choosing not to hire new employees because of the law’s overly restrictive regulatory definition of a full-time employee as anyone who works 30 hours....

...But the big data point that has been missed is that last fall, the actuary’s office at CMS explained the ACA will actually increase health care costs moving forward. They noted, “In 2014 the implementation of provisions of the [law] related to major coverage expansions are expected to accelerate health spending growth.”

The CBO also projects that under Obamacare, the annual Medicaid spending will grow at a rate of eight percent. By 2022, annual Medicaid spending will approach three-quarters of a trillion dollars. The total cost of the insurance coverage expansion under the law is $1.3 trillion dollars over the coming decade....

[lynn]

Not only that but the big insurance companies have stated that there will be big increases in rates in 2014.

[The Xl]

When you're forced to buy a private product, they can, and will, jack up prices.

The wonders of the merger of the state and corporate America.

[Cigar]

:)

Dont Forget, Papa John is going to have to layoff people. :)

[Chris]

:)

Dont Forget, Papa John is going to have to layoff people. :)


And that has what to do with whether the cause of dropping healthcare costs is Obamacare or recession?

[Cigar]

And that has what to do with whether the cause of dropping healthcare costs is Obamacare or recession?

Just another line of wrong ObamaCare predictions made by the right.

When will you get tired of being wrong?

[Ransom]

Not only that but the big insurance companies have stated that there will be big increases in rates in 2014.

Many employer provided plans have already seen huge cost increases.

[The Xl]

Just another line of wrong ObamaCare predictions made by the right.

When will you get tired of being wrong?
When will you admit that the bill is a flawed piece of corporatist legislation?

[Cigar]

When will you admit that the bill is a flawed piece of corporatist legislation?

After its Repealed :)

[jillian]

When will you admit that the bill is a flawed piece of corporatist legislation?

it is flawed. they should never have tried to satisfy the right by adapting the heritage foundation plan.

but it's certainly better than anything the GOP is putting forth today.

perhaps if they made good faith suggestions instead of their obama-deranged nonsense?

[Cigar]

Many employer provided plans have already seen huge cost increases.

Wow, that's never happened. :)

[The Xl]

After its Repealed :)

You're the king of deflection and strawmen. Why not address the question? Does it not force you to pay into a private company? Has it not resulted in people getting dropped from their plans? Has it not resulted in costs raising?

Be honest, for once, and attempt something resembling serious debate. Give it a shot.

[Chris]

When will you admit that the bill is a flawed piece of corporatist legislation?

Never, because the intent is good!

[Cigar]

You're the king of deflection and strawmen. Why not address the question? Does it not force you to pay into a private company? Has it not resulted in people getting dropped from their plans? Has it not resulted in costs raising?

Be honest, for once, and attempt something resembling serious debate. Give it a shot.

Screw the question; you lost, it's Law.

Deal with it or Repeal it.

[Cigar]

Never, because the intent is good!

Then make it better

[The Xl]

Screw the question; you lost, it's Law.

Deal with it or Repeal it.

Is the question too hard for you? If I'm wrong, prove it.

[jillian]

Not only that but the big insurance companies have stated that there will be big increases in rates in 2014.

because they've never raised rates before…. right?

at least the profits are limited to a percentage of revenue now… and they actually have to pay benefits.

[jillian]

When you're forced to buy a private product, they can, and will, jack up prices.

The wonders of the merger of the state and corporate America.

they weren't talking about insurance oats. the o/p is addressing the COST of health care. that wasn't supposed to be addressed by the ACA.

it SHOULD be the issue that's addressed next. but fat chance getting the do-nothings in the house to actually address it.

[Cigar]

Is the question too hard for you? If I'm wrong, prove it.

Is losing too hard on you?

If I'm wrong, stop whining and make the Law better or deal with it as it is.

[Chris]

because they've never raised rates before…. right?

at least the profits are limited to a percentage of revenue now… and they actually have to pay benefits.



You're forgetting the good intent and the claims of the Obamacare administration that would not happen.


And anyone who knows any economics knows the result of price fixing.

[Cigar]

they weren't talking about insurance oats. the o/p is addressing the COST of health care. that wasn't supposed to be addressed by the ACA.

it SHOULD be the issue that's addressed next. but fat chance getting the do-nothings in the house to actually address it.


I thought they liked private enterprises.

If they don't like the price tag, talk to the provider.

[Chris]

they weren't talking about insurance oats. the o/p is addressing the COST of health care. that wasn't supposed to be addressed by the ACA.

it SHOULD be the issue that's addressed next. but fat chance getting the do-nothings in the house to actually address it.



If you'd bothered to actually read the op you'd see it was a counter to Obama administration claims Obamacare was responsible for the lower cost for healthcare. How you read the OP and managed to leave that out, well...

[Cthulhu]

Then make it better

You can't polish a turd Cigar. It is what it is.

[Cigar]

You're forgetting the good intent and the claims of the Obamacare administration that would not happen.


And anyone who knows any economics knows the result of price fixing.

ObamaCare started in October, people are enrolled, it's reality.

American isn't going back, it's going forward with, or without you.

[Chris]

ObamaCare started in October, people are enrolled, it's reality.

American isn't going back, it's going forward with, or without you.


Exactly, so it could not possibly be responsible for dropping costs. You can't prove your own BS, but you just proved the OP.

[Cigar]

You can't polish a turd Cigar. It is what it is.

So what are YOU doing to do; other than bitch and cry everyday on Internet Forums?

[jillian]

Exactly, so it could not possibly be responsible for dropping costs. You can't prove your own BS, but you just proved the OP.

where did anyone ever say the ACA would drop the cost of MEDICAL CARE (which is the premise of your o/p).

you seem to be intentionally conflating the two issues.

[Cigar]

Exactly, so it could not possibly be responsible for dropping costs. You can't prove your own BS, but you just proved the OP.

I don't need to prove anything.

ObamaCare is The Law.

Let me know when it's no longer Law.

[The Xl]

Is losing too hard on you?

If I'm wrong, stop whining and make the Law better or deal with it as it is.

What does any of this have to do with whether or not the bill is any good?

It's corporatist piece of garbage. The fact that you can't defend it speaks volumes, both to the bill, and to the type of person you are.

[Cigar]

What does any of this have to do with whether or not the bill is any good?

It's corporatist piece of garbage. The fact that you can't defend it speaks volumes, both to the bill, and to the type of person you are.

Pace yourself, you have 36 more months :)

[The Xl]

Pace yourself, you have 36 more months :)

Cigar, the king of strawmen and deflection. Can't even defend his favorite piece of legislation.

Would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.

[Cigar]

Cigar, the king of strawmen and deflection. Can't even defend his favorite piece of legislation.

Would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.

Ok, here's my Defence!

2 presidential elections
1 SCOTUS ruling

That's 3 wins for me; Zero for you.

Defend that sport.

[patrickt]

Nothing to defend, Cigar. Your childish banter is pointless. It is good you realize defending the nitwit in the White House is an impossible task. Of course, actually commenting on the topic is impossible for you.

Here's a softball. Cigar, health care costs are going up because....

[Mainecoons]

Summary of a Cigar post on any topic that is over his head, mainly most of them here:

WE WON, WE WON, NA NA NA NA, WE WON WE WON, ETC.

:grin:

[Ransom]

Told your premiums would decrease, told you could keep both doctor and plan...it was all a lie.

[Cigar]

Told your premiums would decrease, told you could keep both doctor and plan...it was all a lie.

So wha-Cha going to do about it?

[jillian]

Told your premiums would decrease, told you could keep both doctor and plan...it was all a lie.

actually, what they said was as YOUNG, HEALTHY people sign up, the marketplace would allow prices to drop as companies had to compete with each other.

tree are now 6 million people signed up. there will be more.

insurance companies change your plan and doctors all the time. he SHOULD have said the LAW would not require any changes.

oops.

[jillian]

Cigar, the king of strawmen and deflection. Can't even defend his favorite piece of legislation.

Would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.

that's all very good. but to address the imperfections in the law (and there are many) the right would have to stop being obama deranged loons.

until then, there's really nothing to discuss because you aren't offering improvements. you are simply belly-aching.

and you can continue to whine all you want, but the inquiry isn't "why isn't it perfect"? the inquiry SHOULD BE "is it better than before" and for the vast majority of people, the answer is yes or, like most people who already had insurance, the answer is there has been zero change.

[The Xl]

Ok, here's my Defence!

2 presidential elections
1 SCOTUS ruling

That's 3 wins for me; Zero for you.

Defend that sport.

So, basically, you can't defend why this piece of legislation is any good?

Got it. Good to know.

[The Xl]

So wha-Cha going to do about it?

Yeah, fuck all those people suffering because of this legislation. Lord Obama said it's okay, so it's okay.

[Mainecoons]

that's all very good. but to address the imperfections in the law (and there are many) the right would have to stop being obama deranged loons.

until then, there's really nothing to discuss because you aren't offering improvements. you are simply belly-aching.

and you can continue to whine all you want, but the inquiry isn't "why isn't it perfect"? the inquiry SHOULD BE "is it better than before" and for the vast majority of people, the answer is yes or, like most people who already had insurance, the answer is there has been zero change.

This law is so defective it simply needs to be repealed and only deranged loons are pretending otherwise these days.

If the shoe fits, wear it.

:grin:

[Cigar]

So, basically, you can't defend why this piece of legislation is any good?

Got it. Good to know.

Sure I can, Millions reasons and Americans signed up and wanted Health Insurance.

Now you just try to take it from them, I dare you :)

[Cigar]

This law is so defective it simply needs to be repealed and only deranged loons are pretending otherwise these days.

If the shoe fits, wear it.

:grin:

A deranged loon try's over 40 times to repeal it, then shut down Governmet an still looses.

Now that's a Deranged Loony Toon for you :)

Loser!

[The Xl]

Sure I can, Millions reasons and Americans signed up and wanted Health Insurance.

Now you just try to take it from them, I dare you :)

It has a sub 50% approval rate. People have been dropped from their insurance, rates are going up.

If this is the line of attack you want to take, you're fighting a losing battle.

[Cigar]

It has a sub 50% approval rate. People have been dropped from their insurance, rates are going up.

If this is the line of attack you want to take, you're fighting a losing battle.

Really dude; 36 more month of this?

[Peter1469]

The GOP can't get legislation to the floor of the senate- they should just sit tight and STFU until Obamacare collapses.


it is flawed. they should never have tried to satisfy the right by adapting the heritage foundation plan.

but it's certainly better than anything the GOP is putting forth today.

perhaps if they made good faith suggestions instead of their obama-deranged nonsense?

[Peter1469]

where did anyone ever say the ACA would drop the cost of MEDICAL CARE (which is the premise of your o/p).

you seem to be intentionally conflating the two issues.

Obama said it. (http://www.whitehouse.gov/economy/reform/deficit-reducing-health-care-reform) Granted, he had know idea what his teleprompter was telling him to say.

[McCool]

:)

Dont Forget, Papa John is going to have to layoff people. :) I find your excitement over other people's misfortune, quite disturbing.

[Cigar]

I'm just dieing to see the day the GOP start trying to take Health Insurance away from Millions of people :)

[Cigar]

I find your excitement over other people's misfortune, quite disturbing.


Well you know us Takers :)

[Chris]

I'm just dieing to see the day the GOP start trying to take Health Insurance away from Millions of people :)


Uh, the ACA is not healthcare. Do the Dem lies ever stop?

[lynn]

There won't be enough young people signing up so rates are going to increase for everyone. States that expanded Medicaid in 3 years will start cutting benefits to those on Medicaid or increase the qualifications that need to apply. The number of people that currently do not have insurance will not be lowered enough to make a difference.

[Chris]

Get ready for even higher healthcare costs.

A new survey of health insurance brokers shows that commercial insurance rates are going to rise “significantly” in 2014.

The research team at investment bank Morgan Stanley surveyed 131 brokers, finding that December 2013 rates are rising in excess of 6% in the small group market, and 9% in the individual market.

The spike in these quarterly-reported rates (for annual premiums charged on renewing contracts) is being attributed to the continued implementation of Obamacare rules, as well as new Obamacare taxes and fees that are being assessed on plans this year.

...

@ New Survey of Health Insurance Brokers: Private Health Plan Premiums Are Spiking. Now, Even The Fed Is Watching These Trends (http://www.forbes.com/sites/scottgottlieb/2014/01/10/new-survey-private-health-insurance-rates-set-to-rise-significantly-in-2014/)

[monty1]

Universal, single payer health care is the only answer but does the right really want that? And as for forcing people to buy insurance, that's pretty simple to understand. If a person (freeloader) gets sick or injured then population has to bear the cost of his medical expenses. Just imagine if health care was refused to the freeloaders!

It appears that Obamacare is at least a step in the right direction for America which was being bankrupted by it's dysfunctional, for profit health care.

Really folks, we in other countries just sit and wonder how long the Koch brothers style of propaganda is going to have the people hoodwinked? When will Americans demand what they deserve to have. For the richest country in the world it's a disgrace.

[Chris]

Universal, single payer health care is the only answer but does the right really want that? And as for forcing people to buy insurance, that's pretty simple to understand. If a person (freeloader) gets sick or injured then population has to bear the cost of his medical expenses. Just imagine if health care was refused to the freeloaders!

It appears that Obamacare is at least a step in the right direction for America which was being bankrupted by it's dysfunctional, for profit health care.

Really folks, we in other countries just sit and wonder how long the Koch brothers style of propaganda is going to have the people hoodwinked? When will Americans demand what they deserve to have. For the richest country in the world it's a disgrace.


Obamacare doesn't address the free loader problem, only makes it worse.

What is it we deserve to have?

[Cigar]

Universal, single payer health care is the only answer but does the right really want that? And as for forcing people to buy insurance, that's pretty simple to understand. If a person (freeloader) gets sick or injured then population has to bear the cost of his medical expenses. Just imagine if health care was refused to the freeloaders!

It appears that Obamacare is at least a step in the right direction for America which was being bankrupted by it's dysfunctional, for profit health care.

Really folks, we in other countries just sit and wonder how long the Koch brothers style of propaganda is going to have the people hoodwinked? When will Americans demand what they deserve to have. For the richest country in the world it's a disgrace.


Stop it, you're on a Conservitive Political Forum, you are not making any common sence to the Right Wings on this forum. They don't or can't see what you are saying. If you're going to piss in the wind, do it do it to the right and down wind.

:)

[Chris]

Stop it, you're on a Conservitive Political Forum, you are not making any common sence to the Right Wings on this forum. They don't or can't see what you are saying. If you're going to piss in the wind, do it do it to the right and down wind.

:)

Nothing once more to contribute to any discussion. Go troll another thread, will ya.

[monty1]

Obamacare doesn't address the free loader problem, only makes it worse.

What is it we deserve to have?

The ACA certainly was intended to address the freeloader problem and has in fact made it marginally better. We assume that the richest country in the world should deserve affordable health care for all it's citizens.

[Chris]

The ACA certainly was intended to address the freeloader problem and has in fact made it marginally better. We assume that the richest country in the world should deserve affordable health care for all it's citizens.

Some detail to your vague claim please.

Nice liberal dream. Who's going to pay for your dream?

[Codename Section]

Universal, single payer health care is the only answer but does the right really want that? And as for forcing people to buy insurance, that's pretty simple to understand. If a person (freeloader) gets sick or injured then population has to bear the cost of his medical expenses. Just imagine if health care was refused to the freeloaders!

It appears that Obamacare is at least a step in the right direction for America which was being bankrupted by it's dysfunctional, for profit health care.

Really folks, we in other countries just sit and wonder how long the Koch brothers style of propaganda is going to have the people hoodwinked? When will Americans demand what they deserve to have. For the richest country in the world it's a disgrace.

If everyone must buy insurance, how does the price of health care come down? Can you explain that one without using the words "magic" or "Divine intervention"?

Thanks.

[monty1]

If everyone must buy insurance, how does the price of health care come down? Can you explain that one without using the words "magic" or "Divine intervention"?

Thanks.

I can but I won't. I'm above arguing with people for the sake of their egos and their contrariness. Find the answer yourself and if you want to pretend that there is no answer then dont' expect me to entertain you further.

[Ransom]

The ACA certainly was intended to address the freeloader problem and has in fact made it marginally better. We assume that the richest country in the world should deserve affordable health care for all it's citizens.

Marginally better than what?

[Codename Section]

I can but I won't. I'm above arguing with people for the sake of their egos and their contrariness. Find the answer yourself and if you want to pretend that there is no answer then dont' expect me to entertain you further.

I don't think you can. It's not how the market works, but ya know believing in magic does make life less boring.

[Chris]

If everyone must buy insurance, how does the price of health care come down? Can you explain that one without using the words "magic" or "Divine intervention"?

Thanks.

Simple supply and demand. Increasing the demand will raise costs.

[Chris]

I can but I won't. I'm above arguing with people for the sake of their egos and their contrariness. Find the answer yourself and if you want to pretend that there is no answer then dont' expect me to entertain you further.


It's ok, I provided the answer. Protect your ego.