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Conley
07-26-2011, 09:54 AM
Interesting stuff:

* Hong Kong: $121.9 billion (0.9 percent)
* Caribbean banking centers: $148.3 (1 percent)
* Taiwan: $153.4 billion (1.1 percent)
* Brazil: $211.4 billion (1.5 percent)
* Oil exporting countries: $229.8 billion (1.6 percent)
* Mutual funds: $300.5 billion (2 percent)
* Commercial banks: $301.8 billion (2.1 percent)
* State, local and federal retirement funds: $320.9 billion (2.2 percent)
* Money market mutual funds: $337.7 billion (2.4 percent)
* United Kingdom: $346.5 billion (2.4 percent)
* Private pension funds: $504.7 billion (3.5 percent)
* State and local governments: $506.1 billion (3.5 percent)
* Japan: $912.4 billion (6.4 percent)
* U.S. households: $959.4 billion (6.6 percent)
* China: $1.16 trillion (8 percent)
* The U.S. Treasury: $1.63 trillion (11.3 percent)
* Social Security trust fund: $2.67 trillion (19 percent)

So America owes foreigners about $4.5 trillion in debt. But America owes America $9.8 trillion.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatches/globalpost-blogs/macro/u.s.-debt-ceiling-china

MMC
07-27-2011, 12:13 AM
Interesting stuff:

* Hong Kong: $121.9 billion (0.9 percent)
* Caribbean banking centers: $148.3 (1 percent)
* Taiwan: $153.4 billion (1.1 percent)
* Brazil: $211.4 billion (1.5 percent)
* Oil exporting countries: $229.8 billion (1.6 percent)
* Mutual funds: $300.5 billion (2 percent)
* Commercial banks: $301.8 billion (2.1 percent)
* State, local and federal retirement funds: $320.9 billion (2.2 percent)
* Money market mutual funds: $337.7 billion (2.4 percent)
* United Kingdom: $346.5 billion (2.4 percent)
* Private pension funds: $504.7 billion (3.5 percent)
* State and local governments: $506.1 billion (3.5 percent)
* Japan: $912.4 billion (6.4 percent)
* U.S. households: $959.4 billion (6.6 percent)
* China: $1.16 trillion (8 percent)
* The U.S. Treasury: $1.63 trillion (11.3 percent)
* Social Security trust fund: $2.67 trillion (19 percent)

So America owes foreigners about $4.5 trillion in debt. But America owes America $9.8 trillion.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatches/globalpost-blogs/macro/u.s.-debt-ceiling-china


Did ya add in the interests CL? :-\

Captain Obvious
07-27-2011, 08:47 PM
Most of Greece's debt is owed to itself - social security interests and the like.

Note that the O'bama softly threatened that our social security checks are at risk if the debt ceiling isn't passed because is us (ie: social security) that we owe the most money to.

MMC
07-28-2011, 07:47 PM
What I don't like is the Dems put forward no plans.....and are out openly saying that these cuts will affect Vets and paying for Troops.....as if implying thats what they are willing to give up to the Repubs. >:(

Anyone else thinking these Tea Party peeps are screwing up the Repubs plans.? :-\

waltky
10-23-2012, 12:29 AM
Granny says she ain't payin' it, she didn't spend it so she ain't payin' it - `sides dat she didn't even get dat 2nd stimulus check...
:angry:
U.S. Government's Foreign Debt Now $47,495 Per Household
October 22, 2012 - The debt that the U.S. government owes to foreign interests now equals approximately $47,495 for each household in the United States, according to the latest data released by the U.S. Treasury and the Census Bureau.


The portion of the U.S. government’s foreign debt now owed to interests in Mainland China is about $10,090 per household. At the end of August, the latest period reported by the U.S. Treasury, foreign interests held a total of $5,430,000,000,000 in U.S. government debt. According to the Census Bureau’s latest estimate (which was for June 2012) there were 114,328,000 households in the United States. Therefore, the total U.S. government debt held by foreign interests was about $47,494.93 per household.

Back in January 2009, foreign interests held a total of $3,071,700,000,000 in U.S. government debt. That month, according to the Census Bureau, there were 111,079,000 households in the United States. Therefore the total U.S. government debt held by foreign interests was about $27,653.29 per household. Since January 2009, the total U.S. government debt held by foreign interests has climbed from approximately $27,653.29 per household to approximately $47,494.93 per household—an increase of about $19,841.64 per household.

Among foreign interests, those in Mainland China hold the largest share of the U.S. government’s debt. The Mainland Chinese, according to the Treasury, owned $1,153,600,000,000 in U.S. Treasury securities as of the end of August. Back in January 2009, interests in Mainland China held only $739.6 billion in U.S. government debt. That month, the U.S. government owed about $6,658 per American household to interests in China. As of the end of August, the U.S. government owed about $10,090 per American household to interests in China—an increase since January 2009 of about $3,432 per household.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/us-governments-foreign-debt-now-47495-household

coolwalker
10-23-2012, 12:54 PM
Interesting stuff:

* Hong Kong: $121.9 billion (0.9 percent)
* Caribbean banking centers: $148.3 (1 percent)
* Taiwan: $153.4 billion (1.1 percent)
* Brazil: $211.4 billion (1.5 percent)
* Oil exporting countries: $229.8 billion (1.6 percent)
* Mutual funds: $300.5 billion (2 percent)
* Commercial banks: $301.8 billion (2.1 percent)
* State, local and federal retirement funds: $320.9 billion (2.2 percent)
* Money market mutual funds: $337.7 billion (2.4 percent)
* United Kingdom: $346.5 billion (2.4 percent)
* Private pension funds: $504.7 billion (3.5 percent)
* State and local governments: $506.1 billion (3.5 percent)
* Japan: $912.4 billion (6.4 percent)
* U.S. households: $959.4 billion (6.6 percent)
* China: $1.16 trillion (8 percent)
* The U.S. Treasury: $1.63 trillion (11.3 percent)
* Social Security trust fund: $2.67 trillion (19 percent)

So America owes foreigners about $4.5 trillion in debt. But America owes America $9.8 trillion.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatches/globalpost-blogs/macro/u.s.-debt-ceiling-china

So we default on ourselves, take a loss and move on. Good idea.

Peter1469
10-23-2012, 04:49 PM
I have suggested that before. If we cancel the debt owned by the Federal Reserve, I doubt that the credit companies would bat an eye.

waltky
06-30-2017, 11:26 PM
Debt climbs faster than tax revenue to pay for it...
http://www.politicalwrinkles.com/images/smilies/eek.gif
CBO: Income Taxes Up 9.5% Next Year; But Debt Climbs More Than $1 Trillion
June 29, 2017 - Unless current laws are changed, federal individual income tax collections will increase by 9.5 percent in fiscal 2018, which begins on Oct. 1, according to data released today by the Congressional Budget Office.


At the same time, however, the federal debt will increase by more than $1 trillion. In fiscal 2017, which ends on Sept. 30, the federal government will collect $3.315 trillion in total taxes, according to the projections the CBO released with its "Update to the Budget and Economic Outlook: 2017 to 2027." That $3.315 trillion in total taxes will include $1.574 trillion in individual income taxes; $1,164 trillion in payroll taxes; $310 billion in corporate income taxes; and $267 billion in other taxes.



http://www.cnsnews.com/s3/files/styles/content_100p/s3/federal_taxes-cbo_chart.jpg?itok=83rTxaW5


In fiscal 2018, according to CBO’s projections, total taxes will climb by to $3.531 trillion. That will include $1.724 trillion in individual income taxes; $1.195 trillion in payroll taxes; $324 billion in corporate income taxes; and $289 billion in other taxes. The $1.724 trillion in individual income taxes CBO projects the federal government will collect in fiscal 2018 is $150 billion—or 9.5 percent—more than the $1.574 trillion CBO projects it will collect this fiscal year.



http://www.cnsnews.com/s3/files/styles/content_100p/s3/tax_chart-2018-2.jpg?itok=cj4uMSFl


The $3.531 trillion in total taxes the federal government will collect in fiscal 2018, according to CBO’s projections, is $216 billion—or 6.5 percent more—than the $3.315 trillion CBO projects it will collect this year. Despite these projected increases in federal tax collections from this year to next, the CBO also sees a massive increase in the federal government’s debt next year. According to CBO’s projections, the gross federal debt will rise from $20.188 trillion at the end of fiscal 2017 to $21.221 trillion at the end of fiscal 2018. That is an increase of $1.034 trillion.



http://cdn.cnsnews.com/federal_debt-cbo_chart.jpg


http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/terence-p-jeffrey/cbo-income-taxes-95-next-year-debt-climbs-more-1-trillion

katzgar
07-09-2017, 09:15 AM
What I don't like is the Dems put forward no plans.....and are out openly saying that these cuts will affect Vets and paying for Troops.....as if implying thats what they are willing to give up to the Repubs. >:(

Anyone else thinking these Tea Party peeps are screwing up the Repubs plans.? :-\

why would the dems put up a plan when the repubs own the WH, senate and house? doesnt make sense. Not liking the repubs not getting anything done makes more sense.

katzgar
07-09-2017, 09:17 AM
I have suggested that before. If we cancel the debt owned by the Federal Reserve, I doubt that the credit companies would bat an eye.

the credit companies screwed up badly at the start of the recession and survived.

Peter1469
07-09-2017, 01:24 PM
the credit companies screwed up badly at the start of the recession and survived.


OK. But if you quote something you should respond to it. Unless you make it clear what you are doing. Like, good post and I will add....

Hal Jordan
07-09-2017, 01:29 PM
why would the dems put up a plan when the repubs own the WH, senate and house? doesnt make sense. Not liking the repubs not getting anything done makes more sense.

Because the post you're quoting was made in 2011. Makes much more sense when you realize that.

The Xl
07-09-2017, 01:30 PM
The debt based fractional reserve system is a fraud, the debt is a fraud.

Peter1469
07-09-2017, 01:32 PM
The debt based fractional reserve system is a fraud, the debt is a fraud.

I disagree. We do, however, need to limit the amont of leverage. If not abused, the fractional reserve system allows for much greater economic activity than were we to only allow a pay-as-you-go system.

And most Americans would not own their homes. They would be renters.

The Xl
07-09-2017, 01:35 PM
I disagree. We do, however, need to limit the amont of leverage. If not abused, the fractional reserve system allows for much greater economic activity than were we to only allow a pay-as-you-go system.

And most Americans would not own their homes. They would be renters.

How so? It's the definition of fraud and counterfeit. The volume of currency could be regulated debt free by government, we don't need private bankers charging and profiting off fraudulent interest.

Peter1469
07-09-2017, 02:53 PM
How so? It's the definition of fraud and counterfeit. The volume of currency could be regulated debt free by government, we don't need private bankers charging and profiting off fraudulent interest.
It isn't fraud becaue it is the known method of banking. It is public. Out in the open. Anyone who believes it is fraud can easily avoid it and pay in cash for what they want.

My condo was $300K in 2004. (Less now). I didn't have $300K then. (I do now- much more). But I bought it anyway by using the fractional resreve system.

The Xl
07-09-2017, 02:54 PM
It isn't fraud becaue it is the known method of banking. It is public. Out in the open.

My condo was $300K in 2004. (Less now). I didn't have $300K then. (I do now- much more). But I bought it anyway by using the fractional resreve system.

Many people aren't aware that our banking practice is basically legal counterfeit. They actually think that the bank owns all the cash it lends.

Peter1469
07-09-2017, 02:56 PM
Many people aren't aware that our banking practice is basically legal counterfeit. They actually think that the bank owns all the cash it lends.

It is public knowledge. Just as the US Constitution is. (Wait, you got me there! :smiley:

Anyway, the system, if not abused helps everyone.

The Xl
07-09-2017, 03:11 PM
It is public knowledge. Just as the US Constitution is. (Wait, you got me there! :smiley:

Anyway, the system, if not abused helps everyone.

Why should banks be able to control and manipulate the volume of currency in the country, and profit off basically nothing? I don't think that works for the general public, I believe this predatory and fraudulent practice hurts us if anything. Inflation and deflation could be controlled more easily, not to mention, we wouldn't have to pay a nonsensical debt, if the government just printed the money debt free.

katzgar
07-09-2017, 03:58 PM
Because the post you're quoting was made in 2011. Makes much more sense when you realize that.

holy crap, didnt realize these forums are so unpopular

Hal Jordan
07-09-2017, 05:36 PM
holy crap, didnt realize these forums are so unpopular

How did you get that? It was an old post that got brought back. That doesn't say anything about popularity or unpopularity.

Peter1469
07-09-2017, 05:46 PM
OK. I said up front that I disagree.

I am glad to own my condo though. And not be a renter.


Why should banks be able to control and manipulate the volume of currency in the country, and profit off basically nothing? I don't think that works for the general public, I believe this predatory and fraudulent practice hurts us if anything. Inflation and deflation could be controlled more easily, not to mention, we wouldn't have to pay a nonsensical debt, if the government just printed the money debt free.

Tahuyaman
07-09-2017, 05:50 PM
I have suggested that before. If we cancel the debt owned by the Federal Reserve, I doubt that the credit companies would bat an eye.


But that would devalue the dollar and cause interest rates and inflation to rise.

Peter1469
07-09-2017, 05:52 PM
But that would devalue the dollar and cause interest rates and inflation to rise.

Yes, that would happen. But when we "print" money the value of the dollar decreases. That is essentially a default.

Tahuyaman
07-09-2017, 05:54 PM
OK. I said up front that I disagree.

I am glad to own my condo though. And not be a renter.

I have considered selling my home and buying a condo, but I still love to change the landscape in my yard and I gave an awesome vegetable garden. I can't have that freedom in a condo.


I have my family condo in Mexico during the winter months, but when I'm there gardening and landscaping is the last thing on my mind.

Tahuyaman
07-09-2017, 05:56 PM
Yes, that would happen. But when we "print" money the value of the dollar decreases. That is essentially a default.

I believe that way could or would lead to a Weimar Republic situation.

Peter1469
07-09-2017, 06:02 PM
I believe that way could or would lead to a Weimar Republic situation.

Yes. And Rome did it too by takeing gold coins and slowly mixing other metals in until at some point there was so little gold in those coins that even the barbarins wouldn't accept them for payment. There was a good article years ago that traces that devaluation of the gold coin with the fall of Rome.

Tahuyaman
07-09-2017, 06:09 PM
That's not the way to handle our debt.

katzgar
07-09-2017, 09:18 PM
I have considered selling my home and buying a condo, but I still love to change the landscape in my yard and I gave an awesome vegetable garden. I can't have that freedom in a condo.


I have my family condo in Mexico during the winter months, but when I'm there gardening and landscaping is the last thing on my mind.

http://www.ci.bremerton.wa.us/1007/Blueberry-Park-P-Patch-Garden

Tahuyaman
07-09-2017, 09:29 PM
http://www.ci.bremerton.wa.us/1007/Blueberry-Park-P-Patch-Garden

Bremerton is a small city. I know everything going on here.

katzgar
07-10-2017, 08:47 AM
Bremerton is a small city. I know everything going on here.

you are welcome