US had all the information it needed before 911 to stop it?

[Paperback Writer]

And your Patriot Act was unnecessary?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEv1-4hFa4I&feature=youtu.be

[zelmo1234]

We already knew this. the pieces were never put together! After all it was government agencies that had the information and we all know what a cracker jack job they do!

[Paperback Writer]

We already knew this. the pieces were never put together! After all it was government agencies that had the information and we all know what a cracker jack job they do!

Watch. That's not quite what he's saying. It's rather unfortunate.

[Spectre]

This dweeb is a spy and a traitor.

Whatever 'good' might have come out of what his work has been overwhelmed by the evil he's done by compromising national security and his appalling hypocrisy by cuddling up to real dictators and seeking their protection and patronage.

Put this self-important motherfucker who thinks HE knows best right up there with Kim Philby.

[Paperback Writer]

This dweeb is a spy and a traitor.

Whatever 'good' might have come out of what his work has been overwhelmed by the evil he's done by compromising national security and his appalling hypocrisy by cuddling up to real dictators and seeking their protection and patronage.

Put this self-important motherfucker who thinks HE knows best right up there with Kim Philby.

Oh sod off, ya loon. What sort of person wants to remain uninformed about what's happening to you? Only a bloody idiot, that's who!

[Spectre]

Oh sod off, ya loon. What sort of person wants to remain uninformed about what's happening to you? Only a bloody idiot, that's who!

Hit a nerve, did I?

Why were the Chinese and Russians so eager to have access to him and his stuff? Because they care so much, these champions of human rights, about American 'spying' on citizens?

How considerate of them.:cool2:

[Cthulhu]

This dweeb is a spy and a traitor.

Hero actually, but hey, whatever.



Whatever 'good' might have come out of what his work has been overwhelmed by the evil he's done by compromising national security and his appalling hypocrisy by cuddling up to real dictators and seeking their protection and patronage.

Blarg. And really, where is the guy supposed to go to when his home country's government wants his head on a pike?

Don't blame the guy one bit.



Put this self-important motherfucker who thinks HE knows best right up there with Kim Philby.

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BhZGu1nCcAEHnb5.jpg:medium

[Ethereal]

This dweeb is a spy and a traitor.

Whatever 'good' might have come out of what his work has been overwhelmed by the evil he's done by compromising national security and his appalling hypocrisy by cuddling up to real dictators and seeking their protection and patronage.

Put this self-important motherfucker who thinks HE knows best right up there with Kim Philby.

Do you have anything to say about the actual substance of Snowden's comments? He's absolutely correct that the intelligence communities had actionable intelligence on the 9/11 attacks and failed to act on it.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZdPpdu8OGDQ

[Paperback Writer]

Hit a nerve, did I?

Lad, you could never unnerve me. I just think you're full of bollocks, is all. What sort of ignoramus wishes to be uninformed of the machinations of its government?




Why were the Chinese and Russians so eager to have access to him and his stuff? Because they care so much, these champions of human rights, about American 'spying' on citizens?

How considerate of them.:cool2:

What has that got to do with the day's mail? We all know they're assisting as a way of saying "piss off, Yanks". I'd do it, as well. :D

[lynn]

People that view Snowden a traitor are also the same people that insist our government works in the best interest of its citizens. As long as they believe these lies, there is no action by them that needs to be done to stop the corruption going on in our government.

Snowden is a brave person to reveal the truth and it is too bad that the majority of the public do not take his lead and demand accountability for our government's action in our lives. They had all the information prior to 9/11 and the marathon bombing but those two still happened. So at what point does this program of invading our privacy for the sole reason of protecting us from terroism tell you that it is not working?

[KC]

There was lack of effective communication between agencies. Of course the PATRIOT Act was unnecessary.

[Spectre]

I have very qualified and cautious support for some version of the Patriot Act, but there should have been sunset provisions within it.

[Ethereal]

Even the author of the Patriot Act thinks the NSA is abusing its power.

Patriot Act Author Says NSA Is Abusing Spy Law (http://www.wired.com/2013/09/nsa-abusing-patriot-act/)

[Bob]

Snowdon said they had the haystack. Having the haystack does not mean they found the needle.

Go to the west coast and east coast flight schools. Notice how many foreigners are training to be a pilot or improve piloting skills.

Those who flew were Arabs. Arabs are not blocked from flight training.

One may ask why train in America.

Because as a foreign student I trained with who came here from Pakistan I believe, (this was 1980) said were he came from he did not have suitabhle airplanes or facilities to fly from. It cost him a lot of money to come all the way to CA to fly. But he wanted to be a commercial pilot and needed to be trained.

In short it is common for foreign pilots to be in the USA training to fly.

This is why they never stirred up suspicions on the part of the authorities.

[Bob]

The patriot act is not the problem.

If the law is being incorrectly applied and abused, that is the problem. Did Obama issue a presidential order to NSA?

Bush did. Bush instructed in clear terms it was to catch terrorists.

[Paperback Writer]

Did you watch the interview? The whole interview cos most of it ended up on the chopping block on the telly side and can only be found online now.

[darroll]

All Snowden is trying to do is get on the good side of some dumb Americans.
He want's to come back home. Send his ass to Leavenworth like the papers we agreed to sigh to get security clearances.

[Negative1]

c'mon man. info to stop it?
They created it. The buildings were built to be brought down. These people work on long-term plans.

First consider all of the predictive programming for decades about 9/11 in the movies, etc.

Then realize, GW Bush graduated from Yale (skull&bones gay sex fraternity) in 1968, the same year that 9-1-1 was made the emergency dialing code, the same year the WTCs construction began.

The WTCs lasted 33 years until they were brought down. Little Bush was hatched from a test-tube egg on 7/6/1946 = 33. They did a 33 night Tribute of Light ceremony for the towers.

2001: A Space Odyssey was released by Stanly Kubrick in 1968 as well. He was from the same hood as Mel Brooks, the director of the Get Smart tv series. They were small time back then and often low-level movie directors/producers were funded by the mob (in their heyday at the time). The mob also essentially controlled the Port Authority who approved the WTC project.

Mel Brooks made a Get Smart (1967) episode about a construction company who kept claiming insurance on buildings that would fall down soon after they were constructed. Suspicious of this, the Get Smart detectives focused on a building being constructed called "The Odyssey" which was to house NASA. Whereby, they busted the company for intentionally bringing down their own buildings to claim the insurance.

Shortly after this episode, Kubrick changed the name of his film from Voyage Into Space to "2001: A Space Odyssey"


And if you think any or all of that is a coincidence, then you probably don't know that the whole world is a stage.

[Perianne]

Hypothetical, political, lyrical, miracle whip.

@Negative1 (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=884), why build the buildings only to destroy them? Perhaps I see a little of what you are revealing, but the underlying question is "for what purpose?"

[Negative1]

Hypothetical, political, lyrical, miracle whip.
@Negative1 (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=884), why build the buildings only to destroy them? Perhaps I see a little of what you are revealing, but the underlying question is for what purpose?

Have you seen what has come of the event? A never-ending war on terror allowing them to intervene in any and every conflict around the globe,and an excuse to setup a Nazi police state in America, for your safety of course.

But I know I can't chalk all of that from 1968 up to coincidence. It is all beyond any probability, so I can only speculate as to why they did it, but they did.

And my thoughts about that are only backed up by all of the fakery I've discovered about 9/11. Obama just chose Welles and his mother Alison Crowther with her memories about Welles' red handkerchief as his heroes for the 9/11 museum a few weeks ago.

Orson Welles and Aleister Crowley. His heroes are fakes.

[Negative1]

Maybe the Elder Bush with his thousand points of light and his coining of the phrase "New World Order" had something to do with it.

Nah, Hitler said it before him.

[Peter1469]

He is absolutely correct.


And your Patriot Act was unnecessary?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEv1-4hFa4I&feature=youtu.be

[Green Arrow]

The patriot act is not the problem.

You're right, the PATRIOT Act is not the problem. The PATRIOT Act is merely a symptom of a greater disease.

However, it is A problem. If you believe it isn't a problem just because the President allegedly told them only to target terrorists, well, I have some swampland in Louisiana to sell you.

[Codename Section]

The patriot act is not the problem.

If the law is being incorrectly applied and abused, that is the problem. Did Obama issue a presidential order to NSA?

Bush did. Bush instructed in clear terms it was to catch terrorists.

It is a huge problem. You don't need a Patriot Act when you have concerned and prepared citizens. Everybody gave Mark Wahlberg shit for saying this, but how do you take over a plane with box cutters? He said a plane full of Southies from Boston would have jacked them up.

We are pussies. We are so used to the government nursing us that we're weak. Why didn't Flight 93 hit the White House? Because they cared.

You can never be 100% safe. Never. Let's all accept that, move on and do our part. Giving away all our rights to the wolf to protect us from foxes doesn't seem like a good plan.

[zelmo1234]

Watch. That's not quite what he's saying. It's rather unfortunate.

While I am grateful for the service that Mr. Snowden preformed in blowing the whistle! I also know that he has motives that are no longer pure.

Can't say why or how, but he is not spot on!

[Green Arrow]

While I am grateful for the service that Mr. Snowden preformed in blowing the whistle! I also know that he has motives that are no longer pure.

Really? How do you "know" this?

[zelmo1234]

Have you seen what has come of the event? A never-ending war on terror allowing them to intervene in any and every conflict around the globe,and an excuse to setup a Nazi police state in America, for your safety of course.

But I know I can't chalk all of that from 1968 up to coincidence. It is all beyond any probability, so I can only speculate as to why they did it, but they did.

And my thoughts about that are only backed up by all of the fakery I've discovered about 9/11. Obama just chose Welles and his mother Alison Crowther with her memories about Welles' red handkerchief as his heroes for the 9/11 museum a few weeks ago.

Orson Welles and Aleister Crowley. His heroes are fakes.

If this was a plan since 1968? It was the biggest disaster that has ever happened!

If you think about this, there is no person or industry or nations that has a long term benefit from 911 or the actions that followed.

Even the Military contractors are facing hard times as the massive debt is causing cutbacks

Someone powerful enough to plan such an event is powerful enough to eliminate those that failed to execute it to their benifit

[zelmo1234]

It is a huge problem. You don't need a Patriot Act when you have concerned and prepared citizens. Everybody gave Mark Wahlberg shit for saying this, but how do you take over a plane with box cutters? He said a plane full of Southies from Boston would have jacked them up.

We are pussies. We are so used to the government nursing us that we're weak. Why didn't Flight 93 hit the White House? Because they cared.

You can never be 100% safe. Never. Let's all accept that, move on and do our part. Giving away all our rights to the wolf to protect us from foxes doesn't seem like a good plan.

It is the everybody gets a trophy mentality

[Codename Section]

While I am grateful for the service that Mr. Snowden preformed in blowing the whistle! I also know that he has motives that are no longer pure.

Can't say why or how, but he is not spot on!

Could be possibly because we fucked him over by charging him with treason for exposing an out of control government.

That might piss me off, too. I'm not an angel, though. Ohhhh, no. After last night doubt anyone could say that.

[Green Arrow]

Could be possibly because we fucked him over by charging him with treason for exposing an out of control government.

That might piss me off, too. I'm not an angel, though. Ohhhh, no. After last night doubt anyone could say that.

What happened last night?

[Codename Section]

What happened last night?

Big hole in the wall.

[Codename Section]

Love Judge Napolitano



“There have been times throughout American history where what is right is not the same as what is legal. Sometimes to do the right thing you have to break the law,” Snowden told Brian Williams.

Of course the patriots and their successful revolution were brought up,and Killmeade, who was interviewing The Judge, brought up the 'societal' issue : 'what sort of society do you get if everyone simply "breaks laws that they did not feel were right'.

"When you do that and you succeed, you're considered a hero and you're a patriot. When you do that and you fail, you end up in the gallows or in jail," said Napolitano.

Higher law is to be obeyed when it is undermined by lesser law. (ie: the First Amendment trumps Obamacare, the NSA is trumped by the Fourth.....) Snowden is right, "Some Things are worth dying for." Indeed.
Read more at http://libertycrier.com/judge-nap-reacts-snowden-says-things... (http://libertycrier.com/judge-nap-reacts-snowden-says-things-worth-dying/#L2YhU0y8aqhxOUvX.99)

[zelmo1234]

Big hole in the wall.

Well they should have taught you that you jar heads can't hit anything with those rock hard heads of your!

Good think home depot sells drywall repair kits

[Green Arrow]

Big hole in the wall.

I've had one of those. Surprised the shit out of me. Also sprained my wrist. But it was worth it

[Codename Section]

I've had one of those. Surprised the shit out of me. Also sprained my wrist. But it was worth it

In my case I scared a few people. Not worth it.

[zelmo1234]

In my case I scared a few people. Not worth it.

Stop! Dang! you don't get hints do you :)

[Green Arrow]

In my case I scared a few people. Not worth it.

Well, you're also a beefy gentle giant who has seen the horrors of war. I'm a chubby little hobbit who would rather be farming or reading. Growing up, I got in trouble for READING instead of doing my homework, and my punishment was no extra-curricular reading. My idea of hardcore rebellion was reading anyway.

:tongue:

[Codename Section]

Stop! Dang! you don't get hints do you :)

I rarely lose my temper. When I do I scare myself. I may go hiking today after we take PBW to the airport. Something.

[Green Arrow]

I rarely lose my temper. When I do I scare myself. I may go hiking today after we take PBW to the airport. Something.

Hiking is awesome, especially in places like Tennessee and Virginia. Good plan.

[lynn]

While I am grateful for the service that Mr. Snowden preformed in blowing the whistle! I also know that he has motives that are no longer pure.

Can't say why or how, but he is not spot on!

I would imagine that Mr. Snowden believed that the American public would fight this injustice. What he did not understand is you can't turn sheep (the public) into wolves (fighters for their freedom). If he did, he would have realized that he wouldn't be able to make a stand alone because the consequences is too great to bear for him personally from those in power.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Hypothetical, political, lyrical, miracle whip.

@Negative1 (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=884), why build the buildings only to destroy them? Perhaps I see a little of what you are revealing, but the underlying question is "for what purpose?" The buildings were constructed off-center to create more office space, sacrificing a margin of safety for an increased profit margin. But they were unstable under stress factors that other buildings could withstand.

Another instance of greed enabling this mass murder was that the airlines were too cheap to install secure doors into the pilot's area:

On February 23, 1973 Israel revealed they had discovered the Arabs' plan to hijack a civilian airliner and use it as a bomb against a heavily populated building. This was the Israelis' explanation for why they shot down a Libyan civilian flight that had wandered offcourse into their territory. Come to think of it, that may have actually been a jihadist probe to test what Israel would do about it. Regardless, that preview was ignored by our totally incompetent CIA. Americans must pay for accepting a system that promotes self-sacrificing ambitious imbeciles and guarantees putting inferior people in superior positions.

September 11, 1683 was the peak of the previous jihad, when it was in its best position ever to conquer Christianity. But the Turkish general in charge of it was more interested in making as much money as possible than in fulfilling his religious commitment. It fit bin Laden's attitude to a T to want to go back to that opportunity and win the world for Allah.

[The Sage of Main Street]

I've had one of those. Surprised the shit out of me. Also sprained my wrist. But it was worth it

Post tPF Stress Disorder. It's becoming epidemic.

[Peter1469]

The buildings were constructed off-center to create more office space, sacrificing a margin of safety for an increased profit margin. But they were unstable under stress factors that other buildings could withstand.

Another instance of greed enabling this mass murder was that the airlines were too cheap to install secure doors into the pilot's area:

On February 23, 1973 Israel revealed they had discovered the Arabs' plan to hijack a civilian airliner and use it as a bomb against a heavily populated building. This was the Israelis' explanation for why they shot down a Libyan civilian flight that had wandered offcourse into their territory. Come to think of it, that may have actually been a jihadist probe to test what Israel would do about it. Regardless, that preview was ignored by our totally incompetent CIA. Americans must pay for accepting a system that promotes self-sacrificing ambitious imbeciles and guarantees putting inferior people in superior positions.

September 11, 1683 was the peak of the previous jihad, when it was in its best position ever to conquer Christianity. But the Turkish general in charge of it was more interested in making as much money as possible than in fulfilling his religious commitment. It fit bin Laden's attitude to a T to want to go back to that opportunity and win the world for Allah.

You refer to the Battle of Vienna. The combined forces of the Holy Roman Empire and the Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth (my peeps) crushed the Muslims, saving the West from destruction. The Polish king Jan III Sobieski led the largest heavy cavalry charge in history and broke the Muslim line. The rest, as we say, was history.

[Mister D]

You refer to the Battle of Vienna. The combined forces of the Holy Roman Empire and the Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth (my peeps) crushed the Muslims, saving the West from destruction. The Polish king Jan III Sobieski led the largest heavy cavalry charge in history and broke the Muslim line. The rest, as we say, was history.

That was the peak of Polish power.

I thought you were Prussian?

[Peter1469]

That was the peak of Polish power.

I thought you were Prussian?

The Prussians ranged through the entire region. At that time the Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth included much of what would later become Prussia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Prussia).


The Kingdom of Prussia (German (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_language): Königreich Preußen) was a German kingdom (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monarchy) that existed between 1701 and 1918 and included parts of present-day Germany, Poland, Russia, Lithuania, Denmark, Belgium and the Czech Republic. It was the driving force behind the unification of Germany (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unification_of_Germany) in 1871 and the creation of the German Empire (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Empire). Although it took its name from the region called Prussia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prussia_(region)), it was based in Brandenburg (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margraviate_of_Brandenburg), where its capital was Berlin (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin).

[Mister D]

As per Wiki, there were apparently more Germans in the relief force than Poles.

[Peter1469]

As per Wiki, there were apparently more Germans in the relief force than Poles.

right. Some of the army was late.

[lynn]

If this was a plan since 1968? It was the biggest disaster that has ever happened!

If you think about this, there is no person or industry or nations that has a long term benefit from 911 or the actions that followed.

Even the Military contractors are facing hard times as the massive debt is causing cutbacks

Someone powerful enough to plan such an event is powerful enough to eliminate those that failed to execute it to their benifit

The attack on us in 2001 was to damage our economy and it has worked. The housing bubble reversed that damage temporarily until Bush was out of office which resulted in the recession under Obama.

[The Sage of Main Street]

You refer to the Battle of Vienna. The combined forces of the Holy Roman Empire and the Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth (my peeps) crushed the Muslims, saving the West from destruction. The Polish king Jan III Sobieski led the largest heavy cavalry charge in history and broke the Muslim line. The rest, as we say, was history. History interrupted, backdated one day, and continued from September 11, 2001.

[The Sage of Main Street]

The attack on us in 2001 was to damage our economy and it has worked. The housing bubble reversed that damage temporarily until Bush was out of office which resulted in the recession under Obama. The recession was caused by jihadist OPEC raising oil prices to $130 a barrel. That was the tipping point.

"I'm a little teapot...Tip me over and pour me out."