View Full Version : Who Is Really Pro Choice, Left Or Right?
Philly Rabbit
06-13-2014, 11:06 AM
If liberals are always supposed to be about choices for everybody, why then are they so fascistic and totalitarian towards anyone who disagrees with their positions?
On abortion: Now this is the mainstay all important issue of the liberal establishment and the first thing you'll notice about it is how liberals are so completely intolerant of anyone who comes down on the pro life side of the argument. Liberal politicians like Barbara Boxer out in California in fact, are so obsessed with abortion, they can never seem to discuss any other topic at length without reverting back to it. One becomes sick to death and reviled to a point of disgust hearing liberals go on and on about the sacred abortion on demand mantra, government sponsored abortion, international abortion programs, NARAL, (National Abortion Rights Action League) Planned Parenthood, and the National Organization of (Aborted) Women that would make one begin to wonder how anyone is left living in the world at this point with everyone aborted before birth, during birth, and in some cases even after birth. To liberals, pregnancy is a disease and a pregnant woman has a tumor that must be medically removed.
On religion: This is another topic that secular liberals are completely intolerant over, the choice between believing or not believing in God or a creator. If you want to get secular liberals fired up, just tell them you believe in God and liberals will immediately assign you to a cave while your arms suddenly grow to a length where your hands (paws) touch the ground. And if you really want to get liberals foaming at the mouth, mention to them that their hero Charles Darwin and his theories are obsolete and outdated. These types of liberals will begin throwing insults at you as though you just insulted their (pro choice) planned mothers while violating all laws of nature (More on this in a moment)at the same time. The fact is that secular liberals are not atheists or agnostics as advertised but rather anti theists and there is no room for choice over believing in providence or not believing in providence because believing relegates you to what these liberals would describe as neanderthal status.
Multiculturalism and political correctness: I put these two together because that is where they both belong, together forever as the battering ram destroying western civilization in all intent and purposes. Liberals will demand that all cultures are equal and no culture is above another in terms of human progress or intelligence providing technological advancement. If you point out to them that the United States which derived from a white European culture and it's ideas of classic liberal thought, private property ownership and free enterprise all came from the minds of westerners, liberals will immediately play the race card on you to shut you up or else you will end up on Al Sharpton's lynch wish list if you don't obey. The same can be said for the liberal's value system of political correctness which has another definition called insanity. Dare to challenge liberals on this set of PC liberal values that is near and so dear to them and challenge them using common sense, and again out come the race cards, the sexist cards, and the bigot cards like magic from the pockets of liberals.
Global warming: Now here's something liberals are really tolerant about, choosing to believe that private industry in america is destroying the planet or not believing it is. Of course liberals, thanks to that great scientist Al Gore will accuse you of wanting to wipe out mankind while turning the entire planet into a land fill if you even hint a semblance of a doubt over Professor Gore's Bible of the left: An Inconvenient Liberal. It's noteworthy to point out that this nonsense about how western private industry is destroying the planet and everything on it has been called in recent years climate change instead of global warming in order to include those natural hard freezes that occur from time to time around the globe. The global warming crowd wanted to cover all their bases with the name switch.
Support of traditional marriage: Well this one is always a hot button issue for liberals and there is no room for the traditional marriage set vs. the so called politically correct term, the "gay marriage" club because anyone who supports this traditional dying institution will immediately get the homophobia card played against them. Liberals will tell you that a person who turns homo is coming out of the closet but it is absolutely, scientifically impossible for anyone to go from being a homosexual to becoming a heterosexual and anyone who dares has been brainwashed by religious fanatics and they're not being allowed to be truthful about themselves on account of it.
Liberals think they can control everything about you, your very nature in fact except when it comes to sex which to liberals is entirely uncontrollable. And there's nothing tolerable about them and very little in the matter of choices about them once you realize it after examining all the facts.
Captain Obvious
06-13-2014, 11:08 AM
I do not support the inhuman slaughter of the innocent unborn.
kilgram
06-13-2014, 11:19 AM
I do not support the ignorance of the abortion.
All those who say support the family. Are they going to provide all the helps possible for the families to take of that children? Are they going to suppor policies to make easier to have to be parents like parental permissions of the work...
Ah no, all those things are communist.
I am tired of the nonsense of the unborn. But later those who defend those "unborn" they don't care for the born, or better said the born leave to exist. In words to Rothbard, the parents don't have the right to kill their children, but they can leave them to die of starvation. I suppose that is their thinking. But hey, someone is going to abort something that is not human, yet. Abomination. That is the worst thing, ever.
Religion: Are you trying to impose your religion through political means? Yes, then don't expect that people will respect that. The problem is that you don't get what means secularism. Secularism is no religion in the public side, in the things of all. Religion is something private. There is no intolerance against religion.
Support of traditional marriage: LOL. Seriously? And yes, there are 0 proves about turning an homosexual into heterosexual. 0. And every homosexual that goes out of the closet he already was homosexual, just he didn't tell it openly. There is no conversion, there si no mutation. He was what he is.
And yes, the "therapies" to convert an homosexual into heterosexual are in the same way as a therapy to convert a left handed guy in a right handed.
The intolerance is not giving freedom to the people to choose what they want to be or what relationship they want to have or with who they want to marry.
Conservative are pretty anti-choice. Our choice or nothing. There is no openness to other options.
Matty
06-13-2014, 11:21 AM
They give you the choice of killing the unborn but not the choice in buying health insurance. They're fucking hypocrites.
Perianne
06-13-2014, 11:22 AM
Are they going to provide all the helps possible for the families to take of that children?
Ya'll always say that like it is MY responsibility to provide for other people's children. I provided for my own.
Kalkin
06-13-2014, 11:51 AM
Liberals always try that intellectually bankrupt false dichotomy of "let them kill their unborn (on your dime) or you're responsible for their care when born". How about "if you fuck, you might have a kid and have to give up your selfish liberal lifestyle and take care of it".
Matty
06-13-2014, 11:56 AM
Liberals always try that intellectually bankrupt false dichotomy of "let them kill their unborn (on your dime) or you're responsible for their care when born". How about "if you fuck, you might have a kid and have to give up your selfish liberal lifestyle and take care of it".
Didn't the flukes fight for and win free birth control? Now, they need instructions on how to use it?
kilgram
06-13-2014, 11:59 AM
Liberals always try that intellectually bankrupt false dichotomy of "let them kill their unborn (on your dime) or you're responsible for their care when born". How about "if you fuck, you might have a kid and have to give up your selfish liberal lifestyle and take care of it".
You know that the ones that practice more abortions are the conservative. Just saying ;)
Kalkin
06-13-2014, 12:00 PM
Didn't the flukes fight for and win free birth control? Now, they need instructions on how to use it?
They can fuck and fuck and fuck and you will either fund their abortion or pay child support.
Matty
06-13-2014, 12:01 PM
You know that the ones that practice more abortions are the conservative. Just saying ;)
Your stats? Link them!
Matty
06-13-2014, 12:02 PM
They can fuck and fuck and fuck and you will either fund their abortion or pay child support.
Abortion is the cheapest. It kills generations. More bang for the buck.
Kalkin
06-13-2014, 12:12 PM
You know that the ones that practice more abortions are the conservative. Just saying ;)
You know that the ones that practice more child molestation are the liberals. Just saying ;)
See what I did there?
Matty
06-13-2014, 12:14 PM
You know that the ones that practice more child molestation are the liberals. Just saying ;)
See what I did there?
Wait, he'll give us his stats at any moment, I just know he will.
kilgram
06-13-2014, 12:19 PM
Well, I made a mistake with the assertion. It happens when I go to the memory of things that you've read diagonally. Conservative states have highest rates of pregnancy and divorce. And with abortions there are some conservative with high and other blue states with high ones.
Whoever the unwanted pregnancies are most common in afro-americans and latino. As always, the poorest.
Polecat
06-13-2014, 12:22 PM
Well, I made a mistake with the assertion. It happens when I go to the memory of things that you've read diagonally. Conservative states have highest rates of pregnancy and divorce. And with abortions there are some conservative with high and other blue states with high ones.
Whoever the unwanted pregnancies are most common in afro-americans and latino. As always, the poorest.
It is a pity your mother did not have an abortion.
kilgram
06-13-2014, 12:24 PM
It is a pity your mother did not have an abortion.
Why? Seriously?
Kalkin
06-13-2014, 12:24 PM
The real question is whose responsibility is it when two people fuck and a child is conceived, those who fucked or everyone else?
kilgram
06-13-2014, 12:33 PM
The real question is whose responsibility is it when two people fuck and a child is conceived, those who fucked or everyone else?
If we live in a society, it is responsibility of the society to make the lives of their members easier. But the responsibility to take care of the children in first instance is of the parents.
darroll
06-13-2014, 01:09 PM
All girls should be pro choice.
Philly Rabbit
06-13-2014, 01:57 PM
It is a pity your mother did not have an abortion.
Ah come on now, this is over the line. Keep immediate family out of it. You're talking about his / her's mom.
Please generalize at all times, thank you.
1751_Texan
06-13-2014, 02:24 PM
Have an abortion... don't have an abortion. That is your choice.
Liberals have never advocated forced abortion. What do you want? Do you want abortion outlawed?
Who is pro-choice? The person that wants to criminalize abortion or the one that does not?
Choose to be anti-abortion. Hate abortions and everyone that advocates for them...that is your right...but dont be an ignorant retard and claim that is pro-choice.
PolWatch
06-13-2014, 02:26 PM
Anyone here ever heard of unintended consequences? No? Well, as someone who was of childbearing years before Rowe/Wade, let me explain what I mean. In 1966 I was pregnant (and very happy about it), but experienced problems. After about 5 months I was told that they could now schedule the D&C. "Why?" I asked...it seemed that the doctor was aware that I would not be having a baby because it had been a mass of cells that kept decaying and they were only waiting for a negative pregnancy test. You see, no doctor wanted to go through the hoops needed to do a D&C because it would be counted as an abortion (under the law forbidding them). They were able to proceed because they finally got an 'uncertain' pregnancy test. What am I complaining for? I had 6 more pregnancies before I was able to have 1 child...including 1 stillborn I had to carry (dead) for 6 weeks until natural labor started. That is what anti-choice laws create...preachers/politicians have no place in medical/personal decisions. If it ain't YOUR womb...it ain't YOUR business. Those who insist that a mass of cells is a child from the instant of conception are wrong...it has the potential of becoming a child, if all goes well. If that early mass of cells were actually a child, then the disposal of those cells when expelled (either naturally or induced) from the womb are treated as medical waste and disposed of accordingly...not as a child requiring a funeral, etc as a late term stillborn. To say otherwise would mean that the removal any cells in a womb with the potential of becoming a baby is murder, than anyone who practices any type of birth control is a murderer.
Ya'll always say that like it is MY responsibility to provide for other people's children. I provided for my own.
Do you remember the day some left winger told you they will gladly take money from their own bank and hand it to you for your kids?
They want no part of that. They want it done by the state and in many cases, by the Feds.
Redrose
06-13-2014, 02:51 PM
A desperate young woman delivers a baby, either alive or still born, and leaves the baby in a dumpster. If caught she will be arrested, prosecuted, ridiculed, jailed as a bad person, life and reputation ruined. If they prove the baby was born breathing she will be charged with a crime.
But, if a young woman decides in the last weeks or days of her pregnancy that she wants to abort, she is lauded as a woman expressing her freedom of choice. Viable babies are cruelly killed in the name of late term abortion.
In both situations the baby ends up dead. One situation is legal the other is not. The difference? Just a few days in some cases.
Our legal system considers the baby a person when a pregnant woman is murdered. The killer is charged with two counts of murder, i.e. Scott Peterson/Lacy Peterson case. A pregnant woman will face additional charges if she is caught using drugs. Women have had their newborn taken from them because of reckless acts, i.e. Drugs, alcohol abuse while pregnant.
So why then doesn't the legal system recognize the baby in the mother's womb as a person when she is aborting?
Which way is it? They can't have it both ways. It's either a person before and after birth or it isn't.
I'm against abortion, but I think the legal system should only allow an abortion in the very, very earliest weeks in cases of rape, incest and to save the life of the mother.
My third daughter was born at 31 weeks. Today she is in school studying to be a dentist.
How many doctors, scientists, physicists, scholars, generals, artists, have we lost because of overly abused abortions?
Redrose
06-13-2014, 02:59 PM
Anyone here ever heard of unintended consequences? No? Well, as someone who was of childbearing years before Rowe/Wade, let me explain what I mean. In 1966 I was pregnant (and very happy about it), but experienced problems. After about 5 months I was told that they could now schedule the D&C. "Why?" I asked...it seemed that the doctor was aware that I would not be having a baby because it had been a mass of cells that kept decaying and they were only waiting for a negative pregnancy test. You see, no doctor wanted to go through the hoops needed to do a D&C because it would be counted as an abortion (under the law forbidding them). They were able to proceed because they finally got an 'uncertain' pregnancy test. What am I complaining for? I had 6 more pregnancies before I was able to have 1 child...including 1 stillborn I had to carry (dead) for 6 weeks until natural labor started. That is what anti-choice laws create...preachers/politicians have no place in medical/personal decisions. If it ain't YOUR womb...it ain't YOUR business. Those who insist that a mass of cells is a child from the instant of conception are wrong...it has the potential of becoming a child, if all goes well. If that early mass of cells were actually a child, then the disposal of those cells when expelled (either naturally or induced) from the womb are treated as medical waste and disposed of accordingly...not as a child requiring a funeral, etc as a late term stillborn. To say otherwise would mean that the removal any cells in a womb with the potential of becoming a baby is murder, than anyone who practices any type of birth control is a murderer.
I sympathize with you. I had difficult pregnancies and a miscarriage. A very bad time. I'm Catholic and we are supposed to be against abortion at all cost. I can't commit to that. If the dr told me my pregnancy was not "normal" I would have aborted. I cannot approve though, women getting abortions just because it's an inconvenience, especially late term. Having my baby in NICU for 63 days was horrible, but amazing when I finally got to bring her home.
Private Pickle
06-13-2014, 03:04 PM
Pro-Choice
PolWatch
06-13-2014, 03:22 PM
I'm proud to say that Alabama developed a program called Secret, Safe Places, where newborns can be dropped off for adoption with no pressure or legal problems. It was started because of several cases of babies being abandoned and dying. Like you, I can't say I agree with abortion being used as a tool of convenience, but because of my history, feel strongly that it should be a private, personal decision involving the individuals and medical providers. Forcing someone to be a parent doesn't produce a good parent.Even though we now have programs like SSP, some women would do anything to avoid their personal lives become public. I do know a very few women who have had abortions and every one of them made the decision after a lot of thought & prayer...it was not something they did easily. I know there are some who could make the decision easier, but that is not my experience. It may be hard to understand because of my support of choice for women, but I believe that babies should be cherished by those who want them...not forced on those who don't want them.
Kalkin
06-13-2014, 05:17 PM
If we live in a society, it is responsibility of the society to make the lives of their members easier.
No, it isn't. That's silly liberal justification for enslaving others.
Redrose
06-13-2014, 05:23 PM
Pro-Choice
Pro-choice sounds great. Terminating a potential human life is not great. I am very Conservative in my views, but I am able to understand certain situations where an abortion would be warranted. As I stated before, in rape cases, incest cases, pregnant child, and to save the mother's life and for some mothers, knowing the fetus is unhealthy or deformed. All these cases can be addressed in the first trimester. I am 100% opposed to any abortion in the later months. Three of my daughters have had early abortions. One was because the fetus was not growing properly, the other two were due to bad timing. They both regret that decision. It saddens me to see their pain.
Very few Tea Parties and conservatives want to stop all abortions, it's the abortion on demand and late term that must stop. Even many Catholics, like myself, break with the Church on that point. But for that I must answer to God one day.
Pro-choice was necessary, Roe v Wade stopped back ally abortions and deaths. In 1962 Sherry Finkbine was carrying a badly deformed baby due to the drug thalidomide. Abortion was illegal and she was forced to deliver him, no arms, no legs.
But, over the years abortion was allowed to morph into a farce, a political tool, a procedure heavily abused by some women as a backup for failed birth control, or even worse a failed relationship. It needs to be available, but monitored much more closely.
Private Pickle
06-13-2014, 05:38 PM
Pro-choice sounds great. Terminating a potential human life is not great. I am very Conservative in my views, but I am able to understand certain situations where an abortion would be warranted. As I stated before, in rape cases, incest cases, pregnant child, and to save the mother's life and for some mothers, knowing the fetus is unhealthy or deformed. All these cases can be addressed in the first trimester. I am 100% opposed to any abortion in the later months. Three of my daughters have had early abortions. One was because the fetus was not growing properly, the other two were due to bad timing. They both regret that decision. It saddens me to see their pain.
Very few Tea Parties and conservatives want to stop all abortions, it's the abortion on demand and late term that must stop. Even many Catholics, like myself, break with the Church on that point. But for that I must answer to God one day.
Pro-choice was necessary, Roe v Wade stopped back ally abortions and deaths. In 1962 Sherry Finkbine was carrying a badly deformed baby due to the drug thalidomide. Abortion was illegal and she was forced to deliver him, no arms, no legs.
But, over the years abortion was allowed to morph into a farce, a political tool, a procedure heavily abused by some women as a backup for failed birth control, or even worse a failed relationship. It needs to be available, but monitored much more closely.
I'm content with the current regulations. Until someone can quantify consciousness my opinion will remain the same...
Redrose
06-13-2014, 06:37 PM
I'm content with the current regulations. Until someone can quantify consciousness my opinion will remain the same...
That is your right. You might just change your opinion if you ever see an abortion after first trimester. I have, it's truly disturbing and barbaric.
Montoya
06-13-2014, 06:41 PM
That is your right. You might just change your opinion if you ever see an abortion after first trimester. I have, it's truly disturbing and barbaric.
But the fact remains its none of your business.
Private Pickle
06-13-2014, 06:42 PM
That is your right. You might just change your opinion if you ever see an abortion after first trimester. I have, it's truly disturbing and barbaric.
Graphic images do not a political opinion make...at least they shouldn't.
Redrose
06-13-2014, 07:10 PM
Graphic images do not a political opinion make...at least they shouldn't.
They do...look at the emaciated bodies in Dachau, Auschwitz, political opinion turned away from Hitler.
Images of blacks hanging from trees turned opinion away from the KKK and racism.
images of the carnage in Viet Nam turned opinion against the war.
those are just three examples, graphic images do affect public opinion.
Late term is the issue for me.
Montoya, take a cue from your own words.....mind your own business.
Montoya
06-13-2014, 07:15 PM
They do...look at the emaciated bodies in Dachau, Auschwitz, political opinion turned away from Hitler.
Images of blacks hanging from trees turned opinion away from the KKK and racism.
images of the carnage in Viet Nam turned opinion against the war.
those are just three examples, graphic images do affect public opinion.
Late term is the issue for me.
Montoya, take a cue from your own words.....mind your own business.
I do, you don't see me forcing my way into a woman's private life. Unlike you and your "kind".
Private Pickle
06-13-2014, 07:15 PM
They do...look at the emaciated bodies in Dachau, Auschwitz, political opinion turned away from Hitler.
He was already dead when those pictures came out..
Images of blacks hanging from trees turned opinion away from the KKK and racism.
Not really...many of those pictures were used as recruiting tools...
images of the carnage in Viet Nam turned opinion against the war.
True...but not the people that started the war.?
those are just three examples, graphic images do affect public opinion.
Late term is the issue for me.
Montoya, take a cue from your own words.....mind your own business.
I said graphic images "shouldn't" a political opinion make. It's extremely short-sighted.
Correct me if I'm wrong but voluntary late term abortion is illegal...
Redrose
06-13-2014, 07:47 PM
[QUOTE=Montoya;650558]I do, you don't see me forcing my way into a woman's private life. Unlike you and your "kind".[/QUOTE
You use the term "my kind" very often. You show your ignorance and intolerance when you make a blanket statement like that. My posts on abortion are not hard line right wing, if your reading comprehension is up to middle school level you should have picked up on that. I'm fairly liberal on that topic for my political view. My personal view is quite different. I would only have an abortion if the fetus was unhealthy. My political opinion is more liberal. But having said that, late term should offend all women. It shouldn't take 35 weeks to decide you don't want the baby. That far along, just deliver and put the child up for adoption. There are many couples, heterosexual and same sex, who would eagerly bring a child home to love.
You are painting too many people with a broad brush. That is foolish.
Redrose
06-13-2014, 08:00 PM
He was already dead when those pictures came out..
Not really...many of those pictures were used as recruiting tools...
True...but not the people that started the war.?
I said graphic images "shouldn't" a political opinion make. It's extremely short-sighted.
Correct me if I'm wrong but voluntary late term abortion is illegal...
Right now in our country, a woman can obtain an abortion up to 40 weeks....on demand for any reason. I'm comfortable with that statement because my nephew is a doctor and is very involved in the cause to end late term abortion. We have had numerous discussion on this topic.
That doctor who went to jail for doing late term abortions was actually killing the baby if it survived the abortion. That's murder plain and simple. You must agree that has to end.
Some say mind your own business. Well OK. But do you mind your own business if you see a person harming a baby or child? No I don't think so. So why would any decent person with an ounce of compassion turn a blind eye to late term abortions?
It's a difficult topic, a passionate subject. But it is being abused. The abuse needs to end.
Dr. Who
06-13-2014, 09:07 PM
If liberals are always supposed to be about choices for everybody, why then are they so fascistic and totalitarian towards anyone who disagrees with their positions?
They aren't.
On abortion: Now this is the mainstay all important issue of the liberal establishment and the first thing you'll notice about it is how liberals are so completely intolerant of anyone who comes down on the pro life side of the argument. Liberal politicians like Barbara Boxer out in California in fact, are so obsessed with abortion, they can never seem to discuss any other topic at length without reverting back to it. One becomes sick to death and reviled to a point of disgust hearing liberals go on and on about the sacred abortion on demand mantra, government sponsored abortion, international abortion programs, NARAL, (National Abortion Rights Action League) Planned Parenthood, and the National Organization of (Aborted) Women that would make one begin to wonder how anyone is left living in the world at this point with everyone aborted before birth, during birth, and in some cases even after birth. To liberals, pregnancy is a disease and a pregnant woman has a tumor that must be medically removed.
Most people who reject abortion also make a big fuss about supporting welfare. Better that the child forever suffer for the error of the parents.
On religion: This is another topic that secular liberals are completely intolerant over, the choice between believing or not believing in God or a creator. If you want to get secular liberals fired up, just tell them you believe in God and liberals will immediately assign you to a cave while your arms suddenly grow to a length where your hands (paws) touch the ground. And if you really want to get liberals foaming at the mouth, mention to them that their hero Charles Darwin and his theories are obsolete and outdated. These types of liberals will begin throwing insults at you as though you just insulted their (pro choice) planned mothers while violating all laws of nature (More on this in a moment)at the same time. The fact is that secular liberals are not atheists or agnostics as advertised but rather anti theists and there is no room for choice over believing in providence or not believing in providence because believing relegates you to what these liberals would describe as neanderthal status.
There may be fringe groups that foam at the mouth, but basically most libs believe in secular law. This allows everyone to worship as they prefer and doesn't impose religious law on anyone else. Darwin was a renowned scientist. His discoveries have value. Most libs that I know are Christians, not atheists or anti-theists, just reasonable people who don't prefer to push Christian dogma in public schools.
Multiculturalism and political correctness: I put these two together because that is where they both belong, together forever as the battering ram destroying western civilization in all intent and purposes. Liberals will demand that all cultures are equal and no culture is above another in terms of human progress or intelligence providing technological advancement. If you point out to them that the United States which derived from a white European culture and it's ideas of classic liberal thought, private property ownership and free enterprise all came from the minds of westerners, liberals will immediately play the race card on you to shut you up or else you will end up on Al Sharpton's lynch wish list if you don't obey. The same can be said for the liberal's value system of political correctness which has another definition called insanity. Dare to challenge liberals on this set of PC liberal values that is near and so dear to them and challenge them using common sense, and again out come the race cards, the sexist cards, and the bigot cards like magic from the pockets of liberals.
White European culture was not and is not all the same. Different languages, different celebrations, different foods and different religions. The main commonality was color. They did not historically all get along. Europe was and is still rife with festering resentments and people immigrated with those resentments. It all seems fine now, but not so harmonious during the great waves of immigration at the turn of the century or even later in the 50's. If there is an issue with immigration now, it's about bringing in people who will displace the blue collar workers and work for far less. It's not the liberals who are benefiting from that situation, it's the wealthy elite and big business.
What is being PC - not insulting people by generalizing the behavior of the few to the many. Why do people want to generalize this way? You take some minority group, look at the most dysfunctional representatives of that group and assume that all such people are the same. Fine - so all white Americans are uneducated yahoos living in trailer parks and the like. All kin of Honey Boo Boo. I could see people objecting to that characterization. Or is it being restrained from using racial, ethnic or sexist slurs? People should be flattered by insults?
Global warming: Now here's something liberals are really tolerant about, choosing to believe that private industry in america is destroying the planet or not believing it is. Of course liberals, thanks to that great scientist Al Gore will accuse you of wanting to wipe out mankind while turning the entire planet into a land fill if you even hint a semblance of a doubt over Professor Gore's Bible of the left: An Inconvenient Liberal. It's noteworthy to point out that this nonsense about how western private industry is destroying the planet and everything on it has been called in recent years climate change instead of global warming in order to include those natural hard freezes that occur from time to time around the globe. The global warming crowd wanted to cover all their bases with the name switch.
I don't know whether global warming is or is not a fact, but I do know that industry has cost the government and insurers trillions of dollars in toxic waste clean-up, never mind whatever damage they have done to the air quality. Those costs have been passed on to every policy holder everywhere, so you can thank them for your high homeowner's premiums and any other premiums you may be paying.
Support of traditional marriage: Well this one is always a hot button issue for liberals and there is no room for the traditional marriage set vs. the so called politically correct term, the "gay marriage" club because anyone who supports this traditional dying institution will immediately get the homophobia card played against them. Liberals will tell you that a person who turns homo is coming out of the closet but it is absolutely, scientifically impossible for anyone to go from being a homosexual to becoming a heterosexual and anyone who dares has been brainwashed by religious fanatics and they're not being allowed to be truthful about themselves on account of it.
I simply don't understand the issue. What possible impact does it have on you if two men or two women get married? How does it impugn your own religious values? I have yet to meet a homosexual who was ever straight, although I have met some who pretended to be straight for an inordinate portion of their life out of fear. I must admit I have known a couple of lesbians who became that way because of rape and sexual abuse by males.
Liberals think they can control everything about you, your very nature in fact except when it comes to sex which to liberals is entirely uncontrollable. And there's nothing tolerable about them and very little in the matter of choices about them once you realize it after examining all the facts.
There are probably the same proportion of libs and cons that think it is their life's work to impose their personal ideology on others. People make the mistake of generalizing that these squeaky wheels are representative of the whole, simply because they get all the press.
Philly Rabbit
06-14-2014, 07:18 AM
Have an abortion... don't have an abortion. That is your choice.
Liberals have never advocated forced abortion. What do you want? Do you want abortion outlawed?
Who is pro-choice? The person that wants to criminalize abortion or the one that does not?
Choose to be anti-abortion. Hate abortions and everyone that advocates for them...that is your right...but dont be an ignorant retard and claim that is pro-choice.
This belongs to the states, not the fed.
Philly Rabbit
06-14-2014, 07:24 AM
They aren't.
Most people who reject abortion also make a big fuss about supporting welfare. Better that the child forever suffer for the error of the parents.
There may be fringe groups that foam at the mouth, but basically most libs believe in secular law. This allows everyone to worship as they prefer and doesn't impose religious law on anyone else. Darwin was a renowned scientist. His discoveries have value. Most libs that I know are Christians, not atheists or anti-theists, just reasonable people who don't prefer to push Christian dogma in public schools.
White European culture was not and is not all the same. Different languages, different celebrations, different foods and different religions. The main commonality was color. They did not historically all get along. Europe was and is still rife with festering resentments and people immigrated with those resentments. It all seems fine now, but not so harmonious during the great waves of immigration at the turn of the century or even later in the 50's. If there is an issue with immigration now, it's about bringing in people who will displace the blue collar workers and work for far less. It's not the liberals who are benefiting from that situation, it's the wealthy elite and big business.
What is being PC - not insulting people by generalizing the behavior of the few to the many. Why do people want to generalize this way? You take some minority group, look at the most dysfunctional representatives of that group and assume that all such people are the same. Fine - so all white Americans are uneducated yahoos living in trailer parks and the like. All kin of Honey Boo Boo. I could see people objecting to that characterization. Or is it being restrained from using racial, ethnic or sexist slurs? People should be flattered by insults?
I don't know whether global warming is or is not a fact, but I do know that industry has cost the government and insurers trillions of dollars in toxic waste clean-up, never mind whatever damage they have done to the air quality. Those costs have been passed on to every policy holder everywhere, so you can thank them for your high homeowner's premiums and any other premiums you may be paying.
I simply don't understand the issue. What possible impact does it have on you if two men or two women get married? How does it impugn your own religious values? I have yet to meet a homosexual who was ever straight, although I have met some who pretended to be straight for an inordinate portion of their life out of fear. I must admit I have known a couple of lesbians who became that way because of rape and sexual abuse by males.
There are probably the same proportion of libs and cons that think it is their life's work to impose their personal ideology on others. People make the mistake of generalizing that these squeaky wheels are representative of the whole, simply because they get all the press.
It's a states issue. That's where it always belonged in the first place.
PolWatch
06-14-2014, 09:26 AM
Saying it belongs to the state it sounds good.. until you think about the 50's when most of the southern states would have been just fine with keeping the Jim Crowe laws legal. Some would and did argue for slavery because it was 'justified' in the Bible. Some decisions are too important to be left to the individual states. Just because something is acceptable in one region, doesn't mean its right at all in any place. Allowing the individual states to decide such things would be the same as saying that religious persecution of some sects in the Middle East is acceptable behavior. Saddam was right to use poison gas against some citizens because their religion was different from his and they were in the minority...is this what America wants here?
Philly Rabbit
06-14-2014, 11:58 AM
Saying it belongs to the state it sounds good.. until you think about the 50's when most of the southern states would have been just fine with keeping the Jim Crowe laws legal. Some would and did argue for slavery because it was 'justified' in the Bible. Some decisions are too important to be left to the individual states. Just because something is acceptable in one region, doesn't mean its right at all in any place. Allowing the individual states to decide such things would be the same as saying that religious persecution of some sects in the Middle East is acceptable behavior. Saddam was right to use poison gas against some citizens because their religion was different from his and they were in the minority...is this what America wants here?
You believe that the government is sovereign, I believe that the people are sovereign.
Leave it to the states.
countryboy
06-14-2014, 12:29 PM
Well, I made a mistake with the assertion. It happens when I go to the memory of things that you've read diagonally. Conservative states have highest rates of pregnancy and divorce. And with abortions there are some conservative with high and other blue states with high ones.
Whoever the unwanted pregnancies are most common in afro-americans and latino. As always, the poorest.
Good grief dude, you're all over the map. Try using facts and statistics instead of making shit up as you go. :wink:
Montoya
06-14-2014, 04:55 PM
You believe that the government is sovereign, I believe that the people are sovereign.
Leave it to the states.
States are too inept and too racist to be trusted with anything important. Thats why they aren't. :)
Peter1469
06-14-2014, 05:04 PM
States are too inept and too racist to be trusted with anything important. Thats why they aren't. :)
Amend the constitution then, good luck with that.
Montoya
06-14-2014, 05:07 PM
Amend the constitution then, good luck with that.
No need we already took the appropriate action quelling your precious "states rights". It's done so deal with it.
Peter1469
06-14-2014, 05:09 PM
No need we already took the appropriate action quelling your precious "states rights". It's done so deal with it.
Incorrect. The 9th and 10th Amendments stand.
Montoya
06-14-2014, 05:14 PM
Incorrect. The 9th and 10th Amendments stand.
Yet so does roe v wade lol. Oh and the EPA, DoE, ACA, FDA, FCC, FAA....and of course the CRA of 1964. :D
Cthulhu
06-14-2014, 05:48 PM
Yet so does roe v wade lol. Oh and the EPA, DoE, ACA, FDA, FCC, FAA....and of course the CRA of 1964. :D
Using case law for arguing this is possibly the worst idea given how the SCOTUS changes its mind with the direction of the political wind.
And the alphabet soup is on its way out anyway - budgets and stuff don't last forever for stupid things. :wink:
Also, what the hell does the EPA and the FCC have to do with freedom of choice regarding abortion? Nevermind, just don't answer...
Cthulhu
06-14-2014, 05:50 PM
No need we already took the appropriate action quelling your precious "states rights". It's done so deal with it.
And you're suggesting the feds are any better? Ha! Thanks for the laugh.
If they make abortion illegal, lets see what happens when the government makes the parents of pregnant teenagers raise those children.
Dr. Who
06-14-2014, 08:10 PM
If they make abortion illegal, lets see what happens when the government makes the parents of pregnant teenagers raise those children.
For what it's worth, I don't see that happening anytime soon. There are too many people who support choice and secondly it isn't in the best interest of government who more often than not have to pay for the children of teens.
Mr. Nygma
06-14-2014, 08:16 PM
No need we already took the appropriate action quelling your precious "states rights". It's done so deal with it.
I don't see this to anyone's benefit, especially liberals. You seem to believe that your party will always be in charge. The pendulum swings both ways. Federalism was there to protect people, not hurt them.
Redrose
06-14-2014, 10:12 PM
If they make abortion illegal, lets see what happens when the government makes the parents of pregnant teenagers raise those children.
Lynn I don't think anyone wants abortion totally illegal, not even the Conservative right. The abuses need to be reeled in that's all. An abortion is a big deal for many women. It's not an easy decision. Three of my daughters have had one. It's an emotional nightmare. But some women look at it like having a mole removed...no big deal. That's what we need to stop...those who use abortion as a form of birth control. Roe v Wade was never intended to abused that way. In '58 my cousin had to go out of the country to get an abortion. We can't have that again.
Philly Rabbit
06-15-2014, 07:17 AM
States are too inept and too racist to be trusted with anything important. Thats why they aren't. :)
Translation: THE PEOPLE are too inept and too racist to be trusted to determine their own destinies. That's why the central national authority must do it for them. The people don't have choices, the central authority makes the right choices for them.
Philly Rabbit
06-15-2014, 07:34 AM
If they make abortion illegal, lets see what happens when the government makes the parents of pregnant teenagers raise those children.
Liberals believe that the overwhelming majority of women in the different states want to keep AOD legal and Roe vs. Wade permanent. Are you on board with this? If you are, then you would support a confident vote on it in the states, wouldn't you?
The voter eligible majority in the states are women I believe. So a state by state vote on a referendum on abortion would confirm this liberal belief. Wouldn't a referendum vote on abortion in all the states produce a record voting turnout including millions of women and many who never bother to vote previously?
Don't you agree with me?
Philly Rabbit
06-15-2014, 07:39 AM
For what it's worth, I don't see that happening anytime soon. There are too many people who support choice and secondly it isn't in the best interest of government who more often than not have to pay for the children of teens.
Can you explain to me how leaving the abortion issue to the states is not a pro choice position?
Peter1469
06-15-2014, 07:45 AM
Translation: THE PEOPLE are too inept and too racist to be trusted to determine their own destinies. That's why the central national authority must do it for them. The people don't have choices, the central authority makes the right choices for them.
Sieg Heil says Montoya.
Dr. Who
06-15-2014, 08:53 AM
Can you explain to me how leaving the abortion issue to the states is not a pro choice position?
So far every state that has put it to a vote has rejected making it illegal.
Codename Section
06-15-2014, 09:06 AM
Progressives play both sides. When a state agrees with them or a state they need for an election agrees with them, it's states rights. When they want to shove something down everyone's throats they pretend state's rights is a code word for racism.
It's people like Montoya, no offense even though I know you're a troll, who make me hate Democrats and progressives even though I'm a classical liberal and believe in social liberalism.
They're, in the US anyway, a party of dirty tricks and double standards. Like their interference in the VA governor's race. I hated the Republican candidate but I hate their pumping money in from New York and even donating to libertarians--not because they believe in our values, but to make sure their guy won. It was all legal but just immoral.
Dr. Who
06-15-2014, 09:21 AM
Progressives play both sides. When a state agrees with them or a state they need for an election agrees with them, it's states rights. When they want to shove something down everyone's throats they pretend state's rights is a code word for racism.
It's people like Montoya, no offense even though I know you're a troll, who make me hate Democrats and progressives even though I'm a classical liberal and believe in social liberalism.
They're, in the US anyway, a party of dirty tricks and double standards. Like their interference in the VA governor's race. I hated the Republican candidate but I hate their pumping money in from New York and even donating to libertarians--not because they believe in our values, but to make sure their guy won. It was all legal but just immoral.
There is nothing moral about politics.
nic34
06-15-2014, 09:32 AM
Progressives play both sides. When a state agrees with them or a state they need for an election agrees with them, it's states rights. When they want to shove something down everyone's throats they pretend state's rights is a code word for racism.
It's people like Montoya, no offense even though I know you're a troll, who make me hate Democrats and progressives even though I'm a classical liberal and believe in social liberalism.
They're, in the US anyway, a party of dirty tricks and double standards. Like their interference in the VA governor's race. I hated the Republican candidate but I hate their pumping money in from New York and even donating to libertarians--not because they believe in our values, but to make sure their guy won. It was all legal but just immoral.
.... because guys like you left instead of building what you wanted. Because compromise is hard.
What did JFK say about that?
Polecat
06-15-2014, 09:55 AM
Why? Seriously?
Again, sorry for the venom. I was still honked off over the comment in the homeless thread that I didn't recognize as sarcasm. I think I had my tampon in wrong.
texan
06-16-2014, 03:38 PM
Anyone that supports jabbing a kid in the head at 6 months because they are an inconvienence is an ass. Every single on of you.
Montoya
06-16-2014, 04:43 PM
Honestly if my girlfriend and I decide to have 10 abortions thats perfectly legal and perfectly acceptable.
Peter1469
06-16-2014, 04:50 PM
Honestly if my girlfriend and I decide to have 10 abortions thats perfectly legal and perfectly acceptable.
She would probably be infertile before you hit #10.
Cthulhu
06-16-2014, 05:18 PM
Honestly if my girlfriend and I decide to have 10 abortions thats perfectly legal and perfectly acceptable.
Legal? Yes.
Acceptable? Depends on where you go and the company you keep.
Cthulhu
06-16-2014, 05:21 PM
Anyone that supports jabbing a kid in the head at 6 months because they are an inconvienence is an ass. Every single on of you.
Supporting something, and not wanting to have statist legislation that will balloon out of control because of an impossible to enforce mandate are different things.
I'm as pro life as the next bubba. However, I won't write laws on the topic of abortion at a federal level. States can choose just how moral they wish to be. So can the people. At the end of the day it amounts to some people wanting to control others.
I don't jive with that.
Social shaming will do more to alleviate this problem than ill conceived legislation.
Montoya
06-16-2014, 05:47 PM
She would probably be infertile before you hit #10.
And that would be her CHOICE.
Peter1469
06-16-2014, 06:00 PM
And that would be her CHOICE.
Right. I don't give a shit what she does to herself.
Redrose
06-16-2014, 06:32 PM
Honestly if my girlfriend and I decide to have 10 abortions thats perfectly legal and perfectly acceptable.
That statement is the basis for the conservative position. I am against a government making that vile abuse of abortion legal.....and it's acceptable in certain circles only. Those folks should be happy their own mothers were not that whacky liberal with their views and aborted them.
Montoya
06-16-2014, 07:27 PM
That statement is the basis for the conservative position. I am against a government making that vile abuse of abortion legal.....and it's acceptable in certain circles only. Those folks should be happy their own mothers were not that whacky liberal with their views and aborted them.
Get used to it because abortion is here to stay. :)
Dr. Who
06-16-2014, 08:59 PM
Anyone that supports jabbing a kid in the head at 6 months because they are an inconvienence is an ass. Every single on of you.
I agree, unless the mother is in mortal danger, there should be no abortions beyond 3 months. I'd even consider 12 weeks.
Redrose
06-16-2014, 09:15 PM
Get used to it because abortion is here to stay. :)
Yes, you are probably correct. But I've noticed you read other's posts with a very biased eye. Very few want abortion outlawed completely. It's the outrageous abuses that must be stopped. Start comprehending what is being said.
Yes, you are probably correct. But I've noticed you read other's posts with a very biased eye. Very few want abortion outlawed completely. It's the outrageous abuses that must be stopped. Start comprehending what is being said.
Some tell us that to support the baby is against the woman.
They ask us if we will promise to take care of the child.
Actually, this happens a lot as it is. Women toss off the child and welfare picks up the tab.
But let's try this. Will they give up a child so the woman can kill her child?
There is an under 30 year old reporter for a TX Fox affiliate who came close to being aborted. Her mom gave her a reprieve shortly before the scheduled abortion and this wonderful woman was taken care of by a mom that adopted her. She later found the woman that bore her and met her. They talked. The woman that put her up for adoption was in great joy. The daughter she handed over was alive and well.
I met her online only when Clinton was president. She finished high school with top grades. She then went to the University of TX and became a journalist. She married very well to a college graduate and used to tell us how great it is to be alive.
Bless her heart. She votes republican. Seriously, this is no joke.
Blackrook
06-16-2014, 10:58 PM
There are women who have serious psychological problems after an abortion, and some become clinically depressed and suicidal.
Philly Rabbit
06-17-2014, 07:39 AM
Honestly if my girlfriend and I decide to have 10 abortions thats perfectly legal and perfectly acceptable.
You should join the army and volunteer for Afghanistan so you can get some rest.
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