My plan for determining the appropriate minimum wage

[Captain Obvious]

There is a concept in healthcare although it may be used in other industries but I'm most familiar with the healthcare version, it's WRVU's or work relative value units.

Using primary care docs as an example, their compensation & bonus formula may include WRVU's which are basically value units assigned to billable services. For example, a family practitioner may see a patient, routine office visit. Typical healthy male let's say, 15 minute visit. The WRVU assigned to this visit may be .5 for example and if this family practitioner sees 4 patients an hour the accumulated WRVU's for that hour are 2. The compensation assigned to this formula may be $250/WRVU let's say so this doc earned $500 for this hours work.

Now let's take an internal medicine doc who may see sicker primary care patients because he's more of a specialist than a family practitioner. So this internist sees an older male who smokes, has diabetes, is overweight and has a heart condition and is on narcotics. This office visit may take a half hour and the assigned WRVU for this higher acuity visit may be 1.0. So the internist may see 2 of these patients in an hour and generate the same WRVU's and compensation as the family practitioner who sees 4 patients in an hours.

And reimbursement from Medicare or whoever will be higher for the internist because he's seeing sicker patients.

The concept here is that even though the internist is seeing less patients, he's getting paid the same because he's doing more work per patient.

Now apply that concept to minimum wage. You would have to divide up job classes into at least 4 categories - unskilled, semi-skilled, skilled and professional with probably subdivision sets down to individual jobs. Each job skill set would be assigned a WRVU weighted based on the skill level needed to perform that job and maybe some other qualifiers like supply and demand which would weigh high demand labor higher.

Working forward and backward you can calculate what a real "market" demand for labor is based on job skills and demand for that labor and you'll also get a true minimum wage number that is appropriate for unskilled labor.

And yes, I understand - it's really not much different from allowing the free market to dictate what wages are for each job, this method simply quantifies and defines the process.

[midcan5]

Interesting but too complex. Anyone who has worked in corporate America long enough knows the unskilled are often in high positions, can we then say give back that ridiculous salary cause you are a clown? I know you are Daddy Warbucks' cousin. I've heard the sub-prime nonsense is back only this time with cars - is stupid and greedy the same as unskilled or is unskilled only applied at the more menial levels of work, a place we all have been at one time or another in life. In some ways drudgery type jobs are more difficult, boring, than certain so called skilled jobs such as marketing or sales. America's employees are losing because America's anti-union meme is too powerful. We seem to have buried deep in our economic psyche the idea that some deserve less - I'll let the reader determine the whys and the who(s).

[Captain Obvious]

Interesting but too complex. Anyone who has worked in corporate America long enough knows the unskilled are often in high positions, can we then say give back that ridiculous salary cause you are a clown? I know you are Daddy Warbucks' cousin. I've heard the sub-prime nonsense is back only this time with cars - is stupid and greedy the same as unskilled or is unskilled only applied at the more menial levels of work, a place we all have been at one time or another in life. In some ways drudgery type jobs are more difficult, boring, than certain so called skilled jobs such as marketing or sales. America's employees are losing because America's anti-union meme is too powerful. We seem to have buried deep in our economic psyche the idea that some deserve less - I'll let the reader determine the whys and the who(s).

It really isn't that complicated to be honest.

[Stoney]

Why not allow markets to find the proper level of wages?

[Captain Obvious]

Why not allow markets to find the proper level of wages?


And yes, I understand - it's really not much different from allowing the free market to dictate what wages are for each job, this method simply quantifies and defines the process.

[Chris]

Why not allow markets to find the proper level of wages?

Agree, that would allow a lot more factors to determine wages more naturally.

Still what I like about it, if I understand correctly, is it seems to allow for raising and lowering the minimum wage not just raising it.

[Captain Obvious]

Agree, that would allow a lot more factors to determine wages more naturally.

Still what I like about it, if I understand correctly, is it seems to allow for raising and lowering the minimum wage not just raising it.

Correct.

It defines what a work unit is - ie: what labor is really worth, how much skill and work it takes to accomplish a task.

We don't live in a true "free market" clearly and this method gives us an opportunity to quantify the appropriate wage and yes, increased or decreased.

[Stoney]

If we take that much control wouldn't we stifle supply and demand to the point that we would need to monitor and anticipate labor needs and have a bureaucracy for that?

[The Sage of Main Street]

There is a concept in healthcare although it may be used in other industries but I'm most familiar with the healthcare version, it's WRVU's or work relative value units.

Using primary care docs as an example, their compensation & bonus formula may include WRVU's which are basically value units assigned to billable services. For example, a family practitioner may see a patient, routine office visit. Typical healthy male let's say, 15 minute visit. The WRVU assigned to this visit may be .5 for example and if this family practitioner sees 4 patients an hour the accumulated WRVU's for that hour are 2. The compensation assigned to this formula may be $250/WRVU let's say so this doc earned $500 for this hours work.

Now let's take an internal medicine doc who may see sicker primary care patients because he's more of a specialist than a family practitioner. So this internist sees an older male who smokes, has diabetes, is overweight and has a heart condition and is on narcotics. This office visit may take a half hour and the assigned WRVU for this higher acuity visit may be 1.0. So the internist may see 2 of these patients in an hour and generate the same WRVU's and compensation as the family practitioner who sees 4 patients in an hours.

And reimbursement from Medicare or whoever will be higher for the internist because he's seeing sicker patients.

The concept here is that even though the internist is seeing less patients, he's getting paid the same because he's doing more work per patient.

Now apply that concept to minimum wage. You would have to divide up job classes into at least 4 categories - unskilled, semi-skilled, skilled and professional with probably subdivision sets down to individual jobs. Each job skill set would be assigned a WRVU weighted based on the skill level needed to perform that job and maybe some other qualifiers like supply and demand which would weigh high demand labor higher.

Working forward and backward you can calculate what a real "market" demand for labor is based on job skills and demand for that labor and you'll also get a true minimum wage number that is appropriate for unskilled labor.

. The skilled have their Daddies buy them their jobs, so they shouldn't be in a higher category. Until people are paid in job training, they are amateurs. "Working your way through school" implies that schoolwork is not work. If that's the way they feel about it, why should we respect their training?

A doctor is just a Mama's Boy who didn't earn a living until he was 26 years old because he was afraid to grow up. Because of that, he becomes bitter, vindictive, and dishonest.

[Chris]

If we take that much control wouldn't we stifle supply and demand to the point that we would need to monitor and anticipate labor needs and have a bureaucracy for that?


Perhaps I need to reread or reassess the intent behind the OP. I had assumed it was a recommended guideline for companies to calculate their own wages not for some central planners to decide for companies. The latter would never work but only reduce the demand for unskilled labor.

[Stoney]

And maybe I am just cynical.

[Chris]

And maybe I am just cynical.

Welcome to the club.

At least, as Mencken said, "The cynics are right nine times out of ten."

[Captain Obvious]

Perhaps I need to reread or reassess the intent behind the OP. I had assumed it was a recommended guideline for companies to calculate their own wages not for some central planners to decide for companies. The latter would never work but only reduce the demand for unskilled labor.

How so?

The current system of just increasing the minimum wage by leaps and bounds is doing just that along with increasing costs passed on to the consumer.

Did you see that McDonalds is rolling out a $2 value menu now? I'm guessing it's going to phase out the $1 menu.

The process I described, if done correctly should more or less mimic free market wage pricing.

[Polecat]

Eliminate the middleman or facilitators as they like to be thought of. They draw a lion's share of the profit for just including themselves in the process.

[Chris]

How so?

The current system of just increasing the minimum wage by leaps and bounds is doing just that along with increasing costs passed on to the consumer.

Did you see that McDonalds is rolling out a $2 value menu now? I'm guessing it's going to phase out the $1 menu.

The process I described, if done correctly should more or less mimic free market wage pricing.


The current system does do just that, reduces the demand for low skill workers.

Central planning is not capable of mimicking free market prices. The Russians tried it an failed. Why? Because no central planner(s) can possibly know what is distributed and dynamic.

This is not to say that companies might not successfully use it in determining the wages they offer.

[Green Arrow]

I think we ought to just tie the minimum wage to inflation. That will give pro-business types in both parties incentive to abolish the Federal Reserve (thus lowering inflation).

[Captain Obvious]

I think we ought to just tie the minimum wage to inflation. That will give pro-business types in both parties incentive to abolish the Federal Reserve (thus lowering inflation).

That's been introduced by the GOP already, couple times.

This issue like most things gets politicized, for political reasons.

[Green Arrow]

That's been introduced by the GOP already, couple times.

This issue like most things gets politicized, for political reasons.

The GOP introduced it? Since when? Last I heard they were opposed.

[Captain Obvious]

The current system does do just that, reduces the demand for low skill workers.

Central planning is not capable of mimicking free market prices. The Russians tried it an failed. Why? Because no central planner(s) can possibly know what is distributed and dynamic.

This is not to say that companies might not successfully use it in determining the wages they offer.

WRVU's aren't really designed in the sense that I use them to determine a fair wage, they're in practice used more to incent providers to be productive and be compensated for said productivity. Most productivity models are RVU based.

I'm extending this concept to the minimum wage in order to logically quantify it as opposed to the current system of just saying "fuck it, raise it a couple bucks this year and a couple bucks next year".

[Captain Obvious]

The GOP introduced it? Since when? Last I heard they were opposed.

I can't cite the instance but I heard it on one of those RushBeck shows where legislation was introduced by the GOP to attach the minimum wage to the CPI.

Maybe it was bullshit, if so my apologies.

[Blackrook]

I can't cite the instance but I heard it on one of those RushBeck shows where legislation was introduced by the GOP to attach the minimum wage to the CPI.

Maybe it was bullshit, if so my apologies.
If you bothered to check sources before flapping your gums, you wouldn't be caught with your pants down so often.

I did the Google search for you and found out that Romney proposed this idea while he was running for President, however, he was out of step with other Republicans:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/11/mitt-romney-south-carolina-minimum-wage_n_1200418.html

[Captain Obvious]

If you bothered to check sources before flapping your gums, you wouldn't be caught with your pants down so often.

I did the Google search for you and found out that Romney proposed this idea while he was running for President, however, he was out of step with other Republicans:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/11/mitt-romney-south-carolina-minimum-wage_n_1200418.html

Thank you.

Consider your life's purpose served.

[The Xl]

Tree fiddy

[Newpublius]

WRVU's or work relative value units.

This exists, its called money.


you can calculate what a real "market" demand for labor is

or anything based on what people are actually willing to pay for it (directly hiring somebody, or indirectly by buying the products of that labor)


you'll also get a true minimum wage number that is appropriate for unskilled labor.

Just like the article today on truckers showing how the wages paid to truckers is apparently insufficient to naturally draw people to that industry, there's no need, the minimum wage is really that point when people say, "I'm not willing to do that for that amount of money"

[Blackrook]

We should just put it in the Constitution that the government has no authority to set wages and prices. The Roman Empire went down that road, and it led to feudalism.

http://www.heritage.org/research/commentary/2001/07/the-folly-of-price-controls

[Captain Obvious]

This exists, its called money.



or anything based on what people are actually willing to pay for it (directly hiring somebody, or indirectly by buying the products of that labor)



Just like the article today on truckers showing how the wages paid to truckers is apparently insufficient to naturally draw people to that industry, there's no need, the minimum wage is really that point when people say, "I'm not willing to do that for that amount of money"

Again - no arguments on any of those points from me, other than our minimum wage standard is NOT currently market driven.

[Stoney]

A modest minimum wage increase occasionally only causes inflation and in the long causes the recipients to fall right back where they started as far as buying power. Its nothing but a harmless scam used by politicians to make those in poverty think the 50 year old War on Poverty to help them is still going on. It only changes the value of money. It retains the effects on supply and demand that are needed to help keep types of labor at the required levels. I don't think we should be doing it or that the federal government has that power under our Constitution.

The OP suggests a system that would give bureaucrats something to corrupt and build and would require constant monitoring to determine value as value is always changing. Why not just keep it simple and let the markets work it all out.

[Captain Obvious]

A modest minimum wage increase occasionally only causes inflation and in the long causes the recipients to fall right back where they started as far as buying power. Its nothing but a harmless scam used by politicians to make those in poverty think the 50 year old War on Poverty to help them is still going on. It only changes the value of money. It retains the effects on supply and demand that are needed to help keep types of labor at the required levels. I don't think we should be doing it or that the federal government has that power under our Constitution.

The OP suggests a system that would give bureaucrats something to corrupt and build and would require constant monitoring to determine value as value is always changing. Why not just keep it simple and let the markets work it all out.

Excellent and unargued point, at least from me.

Bureaucrats would no doubt cluster fuck it up to epic proportions, my suggestion clearly is pie-in-the-sky mental masturbation. And as stated a few times now, the current system is NOT market driven.

For discussion purposes only.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Eliminate the middleman or facilitators as they like to be thought of. They draw a lion's share of the profit for just including themselves in the process. That's all investors are, too. Living off other people's work, they don't earn money; they only collect it.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Again - no arguments on any of those points from me, other than our minimum wage standard is NOT currently market driven. Don't you consider unions to be a market force? Make them mandatory and it never would have taken this long to raise the lowest wage people would be working at. When working people were tricked into letting government handle the wage issue instead of unions, all hopes for economic democracy went down the drain.

[Captain Obvious]

Don't you consider unions to be a market force? Make them mandatory and it never would have taken this long to raise the lowest wage people would be working at. When working people were tricked into letting government handle the wage issue instead of unions, all hopes for economic democracy went down the drain.

I do but they're counter to the market.

Union wages are artificially inflated and out of synch with market expectations.

[Chris]

A modest minimum wage increase occasionally only causes inflation and in the long causes the recipients to fall right back where they started as far as buying power. Its nothing but a harmless scam used by politicians to make those in poverty think the 50 year old War on Poverty to help them is still going on. It only changes the value of money. It retains the effects on supply and demand that are needed to help keep types of labor at the required levels. I don't think we should be doing it or that the federal government has that power under our Constitution.

The OP suggests a system that would give bureaucrats something to corrupt and build and would require constant monitoring to determine value as value is always changing. Why not just keep it simple and let the markets work it all out.


There's also the side effect of diminishing demand for min-wage earners because the cost rises.

[The Sage of Main Street]

A modest minimum wage increase occasionally only causes inflation and in the long causes the recipients to fall right back where they started as far as buying power. It only changes the value of money. It retains the effects on supply and demand that are needed to help keep types of labor at the required levels. I don't think we should be doing it or that the federal government has that power under our Constitution.

Why not just keep it simple and let the markets work it all out. A free market would eliminate the 1%, or whatever tiny elite controls the market now. Economic oligarchy could not survive if those who outnumber it 99 to 1 were free to act. Your scare stories about the futility of wage increases only come true if the Capitalist parasites are able to refuse to take a cut in their unearned profit margins.

[Polecat]

Pay increase based on years of service is a big sparkly pink unicorn. It confuses me that people expect this. I don't want to pay an ever increasing price for a six pack of beer just because it has been available the last 40 years. An 18 year old kid knocking holes in widgets for one week is doing the same work as the soon to retire guy knocking holes in widgets on the same line. Where is the ROI paying the old timer 3 times more than the kid? Gaining skill and experience is a logical reason to increase pay but if you are still doing the exact same task the exact same way you did on your first day 30 some years later then you are no better than the kid off the street.

[Captain Obvious]

Pay increase based on years of service is a big sparkly pink unicorn. It confuses me that people expect this. I don't want to pay an ever increasing price for a six pack of beer just because it has been available the last 40 years. An 18 year old kid knocking holes in widgets for one week is doing the same work as the soon to retire guy knocking holes in widgets on the same line. Where is the ROI paying the old timer 3 times more than the kid? Gaining skill and experience is a logical reason to increase pay but if you are still doing the exact same task the exact same way you did on your first day 30 some years later then you are no better than the kid off the street.

There should be some incentive for employee loyalty but it should be marginal and within the range of earnings for their job class.

[Polecat]

There should be some incentive for employee loyalty but it should be marginal and within the range of earnings for their job class.

That is my point. WHY? What does loyalty have to do with this equation? I realize that it used to be a rampant belief and today we see GM retirees with their pants around their ankles wondering how this could have happened to them. It is a foolish policy to imagine that a corporation is a warm flesh & blood person that is capable of extending care and compassion.

[Captain Obvious]

That is my point. WHY? What does loyalty have to do with this equation? I realize that it used to be a rampant belief and today we see GM retirees with their pants around their ankles wondering how this could have happened to them. It is a foolish policy to imagine that a corporation is a warm flesh & blood person that is capable of extending care and compassion.

I never worked in manufacturing so I speak from what I know, hospitals.

I would much rather have an employee with 10 years of experience who knows the systems, politics, structure, people, process, policies of the hospital than some with equal (or greater even) skills and/or education (to a degree) because they will operate more effectively and confidently in familiar surroundings.

I can't imagine manufacturing or any other industry would be materially different.

[Polecat]

I never worked in manufacturing so I speak from what I know, hospitals.

I would much rather have an employee with 10 years of experience who knows the systems, politics, structure, people, process, policies of the hospital than some with equal (or greater even) skills and/or education (to a degree) because they will operate more effectively and confidently in familiar surroundings.

I can't imagine manufacturing or any other industry would be materially different.

There in lies the difference. People that acquire superior skill in their jobs as time goes under the belt are an asset to the employer. This is when upping their compensation makes some sense. The guy that pushes a broom down the corridor peaked after maybe two weeks. But he thinks he should be getting rewarded too? Just because he is stupid enough to push a broom all his working life?

[Stoney]

A free market would eliminate the 1%, or whatever tiny elite controls the market now. Economic oligarchy could not survive if those who outnumber it 99 to 1 were free to act. Your scare stories about the futility of wage increases only come true if the Capitalist parasites are able to refuse to take a cut in their unearned profit margins.
How would the "1%" be eliminated? Even so called Communist Countries have them.

[The Sage of Main Street]

How would the "1%" be eliminated? Even so called Communist Countries have them. Abolishing birth privileges must be the first goal of democracy. The next would be to eliminate the uncompetitive advantages. The way it is now, those who scratch and claw their way to the top don't have to compete once they get up there, unless it is for the luxury of being the biggest parasitic looter. The overwhelming and permanent power at the top is like the NBA champions getting the #1 draft pick.

[Peter1469]

That's all investors are, too. Living off other people's work, they don't earn money; they only collect it.

That is capital and labor. If you are going to be a marxist get your language correct.

[Chris]

How would the "1%" be eliminated? Even so called Communist Countries have them.

The Last Communist City (http://www.city-journal.org/2014/24_2_havana.html)


...I’ve always wanted to visit Cuba—not because I’m nostalgic for a botched utopian fantasy but because I wanted to experience Communism firsthand. When I finally got my chance several months ago, I was startled to discover how much the Cuban reality lines up with Blomkamp’s dystopia. In Cuba, as in Elysium, a small group of economic and political elites live in a rarefied world high above the impoverished masses. Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels, authors of The Communist Manifesto, would be appalled by the misery endured by Cuba’s ordinary citizens and shocked by the relatively luxurious lifestyles of those who keep the poor down by force....

[Stoney]

Abolishing birth privileges must be the first goal of democracy. The next would be to eliminate the uncompetitive advantages. The way it is now, those who scratch and claw their way to the top don't have to compete once they get up there, unless it is for the luxury of being the biggest parasitic looter. The overwhelming and permanent power at the top is like the NBA champions getting the #1 draft pick.
What you seek has been sold to probably more than half the people on earth. People followed the likes of Castro, fought and died for the idea that they would have a better life. Every last one of these followers ended up in conditions so bad that most of us cannot imagine. Yet there are so many who seek a life like they could realize fully in Cuba, China, North Korea. If that's what you want I am sure you could get one of those countries to take you in.

[Newpublius]

Again - no arguments on any of those points from me, other than our minimum wage standard is NOT currently market driven.

That's because its not a market mechanism, its an affirmative price control, a price floor, on an existing market. There shouldn't be any minimum wage at all because it does the very thing price floors invariably do, it prevents the market from 'clearing' -- it will always create excess unemployment.

[The Sage of Main Street]

That is capital and labor. If you are going to be a marxist get your language correct. Communism is state Capitalism. In Communism, the government owns the businesses; in Capitalism, the business-owners own the government.

[The Sage of Main Street]

What you seek has been sold to probably more than half the people on earth. People followed the likes of Castro, fought and died for the idea that they would have a better life. Every last one of these followers ended up in conditions so bad that most of us cannot imagine. How self-serving to preach that everyone who opposes Greedhead and Heirhead tyranny must be in favor of Communist tyranny. Any more false choices you want us to make?

[Peter1469]

Oh boy...:shocked:

[Stoney]

How self-serving to preach that everyone who opposes Greedhead and Heirhead tyranny must be in favor of Communist tyranny. Any more false choices you want us to make?
I have apparently misjudged your posts. But I'm confused by what I read from you. You seem to be for a free market system so long as there is no 1% and people are not allowed to pass down the sweat of their toil. It sounds like government would control at least the most people can make and would own our property after death.

What shall we call this economic system?

[CreepyOldDude]

That's because its not a market mechanism, its an affirmative price control, a price floor, on an existing market. There shouldn't be any minimum wage at all because it does the very thing price floors invariably do, it prevents the market from 'clearing' -- it will always create excess unemployment.

What good is a job if it doesn't pay you enough to feed your family? If we were all willing to work for a dime a day, we'd all have jobs.

[CreepyOldDude]

There in lies the difference. People that acquire superior skill in their jobs as time goes under the belt are an asset to the employer. This is when upping their compensation makes some sense. The guy that pushes a broom down the corridor peaked after maybe two weeks. But he thinks he should be getting rewarded too? Just because he is stupid enough to push a broom all his working life?

That's part of the problem we have in this country right there. What's wrong with pushing a broom? Why is manual labor looked down upon?

[Stoney]

Let's be serious. People in North Korea don't make enough to feed their families. In the USA there are some who work who don't make enough to feed children they shouldn't have until they do make enough.

[The Sage of Main Street]

I have apparently misjudged your posts. But I'm confused by what I read from you. You seem to be for a free market system so long as there is no 1% and people are not allowed to pass down the sweat of their toil. It sounds like government would control at least the most people can make and would own our property after death.

Derek Jeter worked hard in order to lead the Yankees to championships. Does that mean he should given the right to make his son the new Yankee shortstop? Hereditary privileges put inferior people in superior positions; it's not like the spoiled Heirhead will not affect society and spend his time loafing off his unearned Daddy's Money.

These freeloaders must be cut off at age 18. If we have to do it on our own, so must they. Hereditary power is the greatest enemy civilizations have ever had. But you won't hear any of that from their flunkies who tell us what to think.

And don't give me the Bootlickers' misdirection that the Yankees' owner determines who the next shortstop will be, not Jeter. The public owns the playing field, not the winners of the last generation, so we determine what reward system will be in our best interest. These Heirheads should be the main targets of those who are dissatisfied with the results of the present set-up.

[The Sage of Main Street]

That's part of the problem we have in this country right there. What's wrong with pushing a broom? Why is manual labor looked down upon? It also frees someone who produces hundreds of dollars an hour from wasting his time having to clean his office himself.

[Stoney]

Derek Jeter worked hard in order to lead the Yankees to championships. Does that mean he should given the right to make his son the new Yankee shortstop? Hereditary privileges put inferior people in superior positions; it's not like the spoiled Heirhead will not affect society and spend his time loafing off his unearned Daddy's Money.

These freeloaders must be cut off at age 18. If we have to do it on our own, so must they. Hereditary power is the greatest enemy civilizations have ever had. But you won't hear any of that from their flunkies who tell us what to think.

And don't give me the Bootlickers' misdirection that the Yankees' owner determines who the next shortstop will be, not Jeter. The public owns the playing field, not the winners of the last generation, so we determine what reward system will be in our best interest. These Heirheads should be the main targets of those who are dissatisfied with the results of the present set-up.
Your example is not. A Jeter's son will not be short stop without earning it the heirhead will not long keep money that is not well managed. But if the money is well managed it will benefit us all in investments in our economy.

It would be better to become wealthy than to knock the wealthy.

[Peter1469]

Sage- take your medication please.

[donttread]

There is a concept in healthcare although it may be used in other industries but I'm most familiar with the healthcare version, it's WRVU's or work relative value units.

Using primary care docs as an example, their compensation & bonus formula may include WRVU's which are basically value units assigned to billable services. For example, a family practitioner may see a patient, routine office visit. Typical healthy male let's say, 15 minute visit. The WRVU assigned to this visit may be .5 for example and if this family practitioner sees 4 patients an hour the accumulated WRVU's for that hour are 2. The compensation assigned to this formula may be $250/WRVU let's say so this doc earned $500 for this hours work.

Now let's take an internal medicine doc who may see sicker primary care patients because he's more of a specialist than a family practitioner. So this internist sees an older male who smokes, has diabetes, is overweight and has a heart condition and is on narcotics. This office visit may take a half hour and the assigned WRVU for this higher acuity visit may be 1.0. So the internist may see 2 of these patients in an hour and generate the same WRVU's and compensation as the family practitioner who sees 4 patients in an hours.

And reimbursement from Medicare or whoever will be higher for the internist because he's seeing sicker patients.

The concept here is that even though the internist is seeing less patients, he's getting paid the same because he's doing more work per patient.

Now apply that concept to minimum wage. You would have to divide up job classes into at least 4 categories - unskilled, semi-skilled, skilled and professional with probably subdivision sets down to individual jobs. Each job skill set would be assigned a WRVU weighted based on the skill level needed to perform that job and maybe some other qualifiers like supply and demand which would weigh high demand labor higher.

Working forward and backward you can calculate what a real "market" demand for labor is based on job skills and demand for that labor and you'll also get a true minimum wage number that is appropriate for unskilled labor.

And yes, I understand - it's really not much different from allowing the free market to dictate what wages are for each job, this method simply quantifies and defines the process.

Interesting concepts , however the main problem is the lack of a free market in labor or anything close to it.

[Captain Obvious]

Interesting concepts , however the main problem is the lack of a free market in labor or anything close to it.

I don't disagree but that thought lends strength to quantifying wages and how they're "earned".

[The Sage of Main Street]

Your example is not. A Jeter's son will not be short stop without earning it the heirhead will not long keep money that is not well managed.

. Heirheads have to be extremely incompetent to come out with less money than their Daddy gave them. It's like someone whose Daddy bribed the judges to start his brat halfway to the finish line. Even if he is slower than average, he will win. He has to be a cripple or extremely lazy to not win. He deprived the naturally talented from achieving the victory they deserved. Society is dependent on having superior people in superior positions. Your system is no better than having lottery winners run everything.

[The Sage of Main Street]

Sage- take your medication please. You want me to take your blue pill? "Blissful ignorance, illusion, and fabricated reality. A slave to external influence." Sorry, Cypher.

[The Sage of Main Street]

the main problem is the lack of a free market in labor or anything close to it. The class-biased market where you buy your job, which includes sacrificing years of full-time income because the economic bullies, whose main purpose is to humiliate future employees, don't want people paid a salary in college or trade school. Why? Only because fat cats love mice.

[Peter1469]

You want me to take your blue pill? "Blissful ignorance, illusion, and fabricated reality. A slave to external influence." Sorry, Cypher. :shocked:

[The Sage of Main Street]

:shocked: Does your blue pill make people look like that emoticon?

[Peter1469]

Does your blue pill make people look like that emoticon?

No need for a blue pill here. :shocked:

[The Sage of Main Street]

No need for a blue pill here. :shocked: So you only need to take one pill and you're set for the day? No wonder it never wears off enough so that you might slip in telling us something you haven't been paid to tell us.