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donttread
11-20-2014, 05:27 PM
I mean good grief
1) We don't have enough people to fill all the countries good jobs
2) Our government runs a perennial surplus
3) Our government owes no debt to anyone
4) Our country is clearly under populated
5) Our urban areas don't have enough poor people.

Oh wait , the opposite of all that is true? Well they why in God's name would we offer amnesty to 11,000,000 illegal aliens? That would be bat shit crazy!

Calypso Jones
11-20-2014, 05:28 PM
It will be good for blacks.

Matty
11-20-2014, 05:31 PM
I mean good grief
1) We don't have enough people to fill all the countries good jobs
2) Our government runs a perennial surplus
3) Our government owes no debt to anyone
4) Our country is clearly under populated
5) Our urban areas don't have enough poor people.

Oh wait , the opposite of all that is true? Well they why in God's name would we offer amnesty to 11,000,000 illegal aliens? That would be bat $#@! crazy!



Demo crats are bat shit crazy, it is as simple as that.

Calypso Jones
11-20-2014, 05:32 PM
They act like they don't live in this country and it's not going to affect them. Just wait till their kids get killed on the road, raped, they get knocked out of a job, robbed, assaulted. It will be republicans fault. LOL

Matty
11-20-2014, 05:35 PM
They act like they don't live in this country and it's not going to affect them. Just wait till their kids get killed on the road, raped, they get knocked out of a job, robbed, assaulted. It will be republicans fault. LOL


Everything is Republican's fault! :)

donttread
11-20-2014, 05:37 PM
It will be good for blacks.

No , poor inner city blacks tend to get out competed by well every immigrant group to ever show up

Mac-7
11-20-2014, 05:45 PM
Obama voters are lazy and would really rather lounge around on welfare while illegal aliens do the work.

Paperback Writer
11-20-2014, 05:48 PM
They act like they don't live in this country and it's not going to affect them. Just wait till their kids get killed on the road, raped, they get knocked out of a job, robbed, assaulted. It will be republicans fault. LOL

Gads, what hysteria! Not all illegals are violent anymore than your other citizens are. They broke the law, true, most-likely so that their children would have a more prosperous economic future.

Mac-7
11-20-2014, 05:53 PM
Gads, what hysteria! Not all illegals are violent anymore than your other citizens are. They broke the law, true, most-likely so that their children would have a more prosperous economic future.

Not all illegals are honest either.

many are violent, abusive, alcoholic.

Matty
11-20-2014, 05:54 PM
Gads, what hysteria! Not all illegals are violent anymore than your other citizens are. They broke the law, true, most-likely so that their children would have a more prosperous economic future.


Yes, and ours won't. We will pay the illegals way and deprive our own. A drunken illegal just a week or so ago killed two teen girls. Those parents don't have children anymore, the illegals still have theirs.

Ethereal
11-20-2014, 06:07 PM
I just see them as immigrants, most of whom only want to work (also known as being productive). I think that's a good thing. For some reason, the Republican Party has this idea that black and brown people, especially ones who immigrated here, aren't interested in capitalism and just want a handout, but every time I see someone from South America in this country, they are almost always working or looking for work. These people are great capitalists from what I've observed generally. It's the Americans who are born here that have a sense of entitlement and a distaste for capitalism. They want to be coddled with welfare and protectionist policies. They only like competition when it's someone else being forced to compete.

Ethereal
11-20-2014, 06:13 PM
When people immigrate from California to Texas, conservatives use it as example of how great capitalism is. People gravitate towards successful jurisdictions and they grow stronger as a result. But when people immigrate from Mexico to Texas, they see it as an existential threat the American way of life. You really can't make this stuff up.

Paperback Writer
11-20-2014, 06:15 PM
When people immigrate from California to Texas, conservatives use it as example of how great capitalism is. People gravitate towards successful jurisdictions and they grow stronger as a result. But when people immigrate from Mexico to Texas, they see it as an existential threat the American way of life. You really can't make this stuff up.

In theory I concur, in the reality of my weekly cheque I will note how much of it goes to pay for our immigrants who haven't put a single quid into the system to use our services.

I used to be so much nicer before my pay rise.

Mac-7
11-20-2014, 07:14 PM
I just see them as immigrants, most of whom only want to work (also known as being productive). I think that's a good thing. For some reason, the Republican Party has this idea that black and brown people, especially ones who immigrated here, aren't interested in capitalism and just want a handout, but every time I see someone from South America in this country, they are almost always working or looking for work. These people are great capitalists from what I've observed generally. It's the Americans who are born here that have a sense of entitlement and a distaste for capitalism. They want to be coddled with welfare and protectionist policies. They only like competition when it's someone else being forced to compete.

You sound as if you think we have zero poverty and zero unemployment when we have many millions of poor unemployed Americans already.

it makes no sense to import more.

Mister D
11-20-2014, 07:16 PM
I just see them as immigrants, most of whom only want to work (also known as being productive). I think that's a good thing. For some reason, the Republican Party has this idea that black and brown people, especially ones who immigrated here, aren't interested in capitalism and just want a handout, but every time I see someone from South America in this country, they are almost always working or looking for work. These people are great capitalists from what I've observed generally. It's the Americans who are born here that have a sense of entitlement and a distaste for capitalism. They want to be coddled with welfare and protectionist policies. They only like competition when it's someone else being forced to compete.

I'm not sure how you reconcile this with a lily white philosophy like libertarianism. The browner the country gets the more marginal you will become. Is that what you want? The older generation (e.g. Rothbard, Murray, Hoppe) understood this.

Mister D
11-20-2014, 07:18 PM
When people immigrate from California to Texas, conservatives use it as example of how great capitalism is. People gravitate towards successful jurisdictions and they grow stronger as a result. But when people immigrate from Mexico to Texas, they see it as an existential threat the American way of life. You really can't make this stuff up.

Yes, I agree here. The American conservative does not realize that capitalism destroys everything he seeks to conserve.

Bob
11-20-2014, 07:22 PM
Gads, what hysteria! Not all illegals are violent anymore than your other citizens are. They broke the law, true, most-likely so that their children would have a more prosperous economic future.

How are you Beatles doing in England with your illegal aliens?

Mac-7
11-20-2014, 07:24 PM
How are you Beatles doing in England with your illegal aliens?

They all turned out to be model future citizens.

Redrose
11-20-2014, 07:30 PM
I mean good grief
1) We don't have enough people to fill all the countries good jobs
2) Our government runs a perennial surplus
3) Our government owes no debt to anyone
4) Our country is clearly under populated
5) Our urban areas don't have enough poor people.

Oh wait , the opposite of all that is true? Well they why in God's name would we offer amnesty to 11,000,000 illegal aliens? That would be bat shit crazy!


The sole purpose, let me repeat, the sole purpose is to establish another Democratic voting block. They won't bite the hand that feeds them. The dishonest Democratic politicians who care about their own skin before the welfare of the nation will tell them how to vote to keep their checks coming in. Obummer is stacking the deck to ensure the Dems keep the voting edge. This country is done.

They are 11 million foreigners who don't know shit about the USA, and they don't give a shit either. All they know and care to know is someone is paying their way, us the middle class and not just the GOP middle class but the Democratic middle class too, but they're too dumb to understand the policies they are supporting are killing them too. The 11 million don't speak English, they can't read English, they ignore our laws, they wave the Mexican flag, they want to tell us who should be elected and they take their welfare loot and send it to family back in Mexico. They want all of the bennies but none of the effort.

We have become the dumbest country on the face of the earth, thanks to that imposter in the WH.

Bob
11-20-2014, 07:34 PM
When people immigrate from California to Texas, conservatives use it as example of how great capitalism is. People gravitate towards successful jurisdictions and they grow stronger as a result. But when people immigrate from Mexico to Texas, they see it as an existential threat the American way of life. You really can't make this stuff up.

There is a huge difference when citizens from other lands are controlled and perform per laws.

Take Germany when I served there.

It was then well known that the Germans had way more jobs than workers. Germany deliberately recruited workers from Greece. Maybe one other country. Anyway, Germans believed the Greeks made outstanding workers on electronics assembly lines. But when the wall fell at Berlin, suddenly Germany had more German workers than jobs. While in the West, Jobs were plentful, in East Germany too many jobs were for the Government and not for the general public.

We do not need illegal aliens or the Feds would put up signs asking for them to come into the USA. Obama loves to brag he gets rid of them. Well, try harder Herr Obama. Don't make it worse by approving of it.

Mac-7
11-20-2014, 07:35 PM
When people immigrate from California to Texas, conservatives use it as example of how great capitalism is.....................But when people immigrate from Mexico to Texas, they see it as an existential threat the American way of life.

I guess I'm just one of those old fashioned conservatives who sees a difference between Americans and Mexicans.

Silly me, huh?

Bob
11-20-2014, 07:45 PM
The sole purpose, let me repeat, the sole purpose is to establish another Democratic voting block. They won't bite the hand that feeds them. The dishonest Democratic politicians who care about their own skin before the welfare of the nation will tell them how to vote to keep their checks coming in. Obummer is stacking the deck to ensure the Dems keep the voting edge. This country is done.

They are 11 million foreigners who don't know shit about the USA, and they don't give a shit either. All they know and care to know is someone is paying their way, us the middle class and not just the GOP middle class but the Democratic middle class too, but they're too dumb to understand the policies they are supporting are killing them too. The 11 million don't speak English, they can't read English, they ignore our laws, they wave the Mexican flag, they want to tell us who should be elected and they take their welfare loot and send it to family back in Mexico. They want all of the bennies but none of the effort.

We have become the dumbest country on the face of the earth, thanks to that imposter in the WH.

They came for one reason.

MONEY

We must stop thinking they love us. They send MONEY to Mexico. This is natural. We would do the same thing. We would move to Mexico to make Peso's that we could send to our family in the USA. This is no mystery. (If Mexico had the best economy)

The only mystery is why Obama facilitates it happening to Americans.

He is supposed to protect Americans, not Mexicans.

Bob
11-20-2014, 07:48 PM
Yes, I agree here. The American conservative does not realize that capitalism destroys everything he seeks to conserve.

When I worked for a corporation, and I worked for a fair number of them doing various types of work, I wanted the pay. They needed my hands and brains and I needed the better life.

When I worked, it was my part of capitalism. When they let me work and paid me, it was their part in capitalism.

Capitalism saved America.

http://www.amazon.com/How-Capitalism-Saved-America-Pilgrims/dp/1400083311

Mister D
11-20-2014, 07:52 PM
When I worked for a corporation, and I worked for a fair number of them doing various types of work, I wanted the pay. They needed my hands and brains and I needed the better life.

When I worked, it was my part of capitalism. When they let me work and paid me, it was their part in capitalism.

Capitalism saved America.

http://www.amazon.com/How-Capitalism-Saved-America-Pilgrims/dp/1400083311

Saved it from what? lol

Redrose
11-20-2014, 08:00 PM
They came for one reason.

MONEY

We must stop thinking they love us. They send MONEY to Mexico. This is natural. We would do the same thing. We would move to Mexico to make Peso's that we could send to our family in the USA. This is no mystery. (If Mexico had the best economy)

The only mystery is why Obama facilitates it happening to Americans.

He is supposed to protect Americans, not Mexicans.


He is not an American by any stretch of the imagination. Everything he does hurts us.

Bob
11-20-2014, 08:33 PM
http://thepoliticalforums.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Bob http://thepoliticalforums.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://thepoliticalforums.com/showthread.php?p=846961#post846961)
When I worked for a corporation, and I worked for a fair number of them doing various types of work, I wanted the pay. They needed my hands and brains and I needed the better life.

When I worked, it was my part of capitalism. When they let me work and paid me, it was their part in capitalism.

Capitalism saved America.

http://www.amazon.com/How-Capitalism.../dp/1400083311 (http://www.amazon.com/How-Capitalism-Saved-America-Pilgrims/dp/1400083311)


Saved it from what? lol

To head off that question, I offered you reference. You might even locate the book at the library.

Calypso Jones
11-20-2014, 08:37 PM
Gads, what hysteria! Not all illegals are violent anymore than your other citizens are. They broke the law, true, most-likely so that their children would have a more prosperous economic future.

key phrase...'broke the law'. Great way to start your citizenship.

Bob
11-20-2014, 08:38 PM
They came for one reason.

MONEY

We must stop thinking they love us. They send MONEY to Mexico. This is natural. We would do the same thing. We would move to Mexico to make Peso's that we could send to our family in the USA. This is no mystery. (If Mexico had the best economy)

The only mystery is why Obama facilitates it happening to Americans.

He is supposed to protect Americans, not Mexicans.


He is not an American by any stretch of the imagination. Everything he does hurts us.

I would be completely pissed off were i living in Mexico.

Obama makes Mexico look like cheap plop.

That is his intention, to make our southern neighbor look terrible. Supposedly here in America Mexicans can find happiness but not where they live.

Mexicans here illegally that spoke to me said they do it FOR Mexico, to ship money to Mexico. They don't want their family here forever. They use us.

The feds have laws to stop companies from hiring them. Is Obama going to kill those laws?

Matty
11-20-2014, 08:45 PM
They came for one reason.

MONEY

We must stop thinking they love us. They send MONEY to Mexico. This is natural. We would do the same thing. We would move to Mexico to make Peso's that we could send to our family in the USA. This is no mystery. (If Mexico had the best economy)

The only mystery is why Obama facilitates it happening to Americans.

He is supposed to protect Americans, not Mexicans.


He is not an American by any stretch of the imagination. Everything he does hurts us.
He is a cheap Gutierrez ass kissing lying piece of sharpton shit!

Bob
11-20-2014, 09:03 PM
http://thepoliticalforums.com/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Paperback Writer http://thepoliticalforums.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://thepoliticalforums.com/showthread.php?p=846784#post846784)
Gads, what hysteria! Not all illegals are violent anymore than your other citizens are. They broke the law, true, most-likely so that their children would have a more prosperous economic future.


If you were a father, would you carry your kids thousands of miles across desert into the USA desert if you cared about those kids?

Give it up. They ship cash to Mexico. They do it for Mexico.

They can own a much better home in Mexico than in much of America for cheaper prices.

It's money.

Nothing fancy about that.

Same reason your muslims come to Britain. To take your jobs and money.

Dark Mistress
11-20-2014, 09:15 PM
They came for one reason.

MONEY

We must stop thinking they love us. They send MONEY to Mexico. This is natural. We would do the same thing. We would move to Mexico to make Peso's that we could send to our family in the USA. This is no mystery. (If Mexico had the best economy)

The only mystery is why Obama facilitates it happening to Americans.

He is supposed to protect Americans, not Mexicans.

I contest this. I used to run in these circles-the latino circles. The "Mexican" circles. There is a reason my son is half Mexican. I loved these people and their culture. There are things that I still like about it, but my biggest issue is the men. I won't get into that here because it is off topic.

They want to be here because they want a better life than they lead in Mexico/El Salvador/etc. There are greater opportunities here. There are better schools and better job opportunities. They can work their way up the ladder instead of stay stuck on that bottom rung for the rest of their lives. Yes, they can get on welfare, but of all the latinos I know they don't want to stay on welfare their whole lives. They want to make more money. They want the fancier vehicle and the bigger house eventually.

They send money to their families, yes. And more often than not they eventually bring their families here. There is more for their families to have here. Again, better schools for their kids and heck, they will learn English while they are at it. Their kids will anyways. The latinos are a family oriented people and they do care about their kids and their futures and livelihoods.

My sister's in laws live in Mexico in the Mormon Colonies. They are white Americans, but they teach at a private school funded by the LDS church. When I hear stories about what life is like there for those families and kids I understand why they come here. If I were a hispanic living in Mexico I would try to come to the states too. It's not easy to do it legally from what I hear although it can be done.

Redrose
11-20-2014, 09:27 PM
I contest this. I used to run in these circles-the latino circles. The "Mexican" circles. There is a reason my son is half Mexican. I loved these people and their culture. There are things that I still like about it, but my biggest issue is the men. I won't get into that here because it is off topic.

They want to be here because they want a better life than they lead in Mexico/El Salvador/etc. There are greater opportunities here. There are better schools and better job opportunities. They can work their way up the ladder instead of stay stuck on that bottom rung for the rest of their lives. Yes, they can get on welfare, but of all the latinos I know they don't want to stay on welfare their whole lives. They want to make more money. They want the fancier vehicle and the bigger house eventually.

They send money to their families, yes. And more often than not they eventually bring their families here. There is more for their families to have here. Again, better schools for their kids and heck, they will learn English while they are at it. Their kids will anyways. The latinos are a family oriented people and they do care about their kids and their futures and livelihoods.

My sister's in laws live in Mexico in the Mormon Colonies. They are white Americans, but they teach at a private school funded by the LDS church. When I hear stories about what life is like there for those families and kids I understand why they come here. If I were a hispanic living in Mexico I would try to come to the states too. It's not easy to do it legally from what I hear although it can be done.

I have no issues with Mexicans, Hondurans et al, my son-in-law is Spanish, my granddaughter is married to a Cuban my SIL is from Peru, legally with a college degree. My grandparents were immigrants from Italy in 1888, as you say looking for a better life in the new world, they came here legally, without their parents and family who never did make it here. My mom immigrated from England...legally. None of them ever took a dime from the government.

I do not want the 11 million here if they got in the country illegally....period. I don't care how nice they are and what their hopes are. We have immigration laws and we have a soverign border, they have thumbed their nose at that and expect us to respect their desires. Dreamers. Baloney. My dream is to have a secured border and our laws enforced.....and Obama gone.

Dark Mistress
11-20-2014, 09:32 PM
I have no issues with Mexicans, Hondurans et al, my son-in-law is Spanish, my granddaughter is married to a Cuban my SIL is from Peru, legally with a college degree. My grandparents were immigrants from Italy in 1888, as you say looking for a better life in the new world, they came here legally, without their parents and family who never did make it here. My mom immigrated from England...legally. None of them ever took a dime from the government.

I do not want the 11 million here if they got in the country illegally....period. I don't care how nice they are and what their hopes are. We have immigration laws and we have a soverign border, they have thumbed their nose at that and expect us to respect their desires. Dreamers. Baloney. My dream is to have a secured border and our laws enforced.....and Obama gone.

What is the process of coming here legally entail? Is it the same as it was before?

Honestly, I don't know.

I do know that most of my "friends" eventually get citizenship. I understand it is easier to get citizenship once you are already here, but I also hear getting a green card is difficult...

This is just what I do. I put myself in someone else's shoes. What if I were them? What would I do? I can't fully answer that because I was born into the land of plenty and opportunity.

A lot of foreign exchange students I have know (dated some- I always had a thing for foreigners) came here in an effort to get scholarships (academic or athletic) so they could go to college and their families could afford to send them.

We have taken plenty from the gov't- pell grants for college. I have asked if that makes us less as humans, but financially we qualified. Welfare is a bit different from that I will say, but we took what we qualified for with tuition assistance. VA has paid for the rest of our schooling as well...

Cigar
11-20-2014, 11:19 PM
I mean good grief
1) We don't have enough people to fill all the countries good jobs
2) Our government runs a perennial surplus
3) Our government owes no debt to anyone
4) Our country is clearly under populated
5) Our urban areas don't have enough poor people.

Oh wait , the opposite of all that is true? Well they why in God's name would we offer amnesty to 11,000,000 illegal aliens? That would be bat $#@! crazy!

http://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af108/PumpkinAle2371/10516680_788268807874269_580808551848028644_n_zps7 aebcf38.jpg

Redrose
11-20-2014, 11:36 PM
What is the process of coming here legally entail? Is it the same as it was before?

Honestly, I don't know.

I do know that most of my "friends" eventually get citizenship. I understand it is easier to get citizenship once you are already here, but I also hear getting a green card is difficult...

This is just what I do. I put myself in someone else's shoes. What if I were them? What would I do? I can't fully answer that because I was born into the land of plenty and opportunity.

A lot of foreign exchange students I have know (dated some- I always had a thing for foreigners) came here in an effort to get scholarships (academic or athletic) so they could go to college and their families could afford to send them.

We have taken plenty from the gov't- pell grants for college. I have asked if that makes us less as humans, but financially we qualified. Welfare is a bit different from that I will say, but we took what we qualified for with tuition assistance. VA has paid for the rest of our schooling as well...

Dark Mistress there is nothing wrong with feeling compassion for those less fortunate than ourselves. We would be heartless if we didn't. But we must be intelligent and practical and legal in how we deal with immigration. My SIL took 6 years to get citizenship. She came here from Peru on a work visa. She was an attorney in Peru, her dad is a doctor. She did it the proper way. She studied, took a test, learned the language waited on the list. She is now a well paid bilingual attorney in South Carolina.

There are 8 billion people in the world. We can't be expected to bring them all here for the American Dream. If that ever happens, the American Dream will decay into the American nightmare. We will just become another 3rd world country.

An analogy that was used in a discussion group recently; You own a nice home, own a nice car, have nice things, big screen TV's, computers, boat, etc. You live there with your spouse and two kids. You work, pay your bills, and pay your taxes. Now some poor folks like what you have. They want to have the same life as you do. Are you un-Christian if you don't open your door to them, allow them to move in and share all your possessions?

That is how the poor of the world sees us. We have too much and they want it. They don't want to wait for it and go on the waiting line, they sneak in the back door and expect it.

I'm sorry, as I see it it's wrong. Immigration laws work. We need to enforce them, do it the right way.
Unless you are a Native America, we are all children of immigrants. Immigrants built this nation. We need immigration, but we must do it legally, within our immigration system.

If you overload a lifeboat, everybody drowns.

Cigar
11-20-2014, 11:49 PM
@Dark Mistress (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1083) there is nothing wrong with feeling compassion for those less fortunate than ourselves. We would be heartless if we didn't. But we must be intelligent and practical and legal in how we deal with immigration. My SIL took 6 years to get citizenship. She came here from Peru on a work visa. She was an attorney in Peru, her dad is a doctor. She did it the proper way. She studied, took a test, learned the language waited on the list. She is now a well paid bilingual attorney in South Carolina.

There are 8 billion people in the world. We can't be expected to bring them all here for the American Dream. If that ever happens, the American Dream will decay into the American nightmare. We will just become another 3rd world country.

An analogy that was used in a discussion group recently; You own a nice home, own a nice car, have nice things, big screen TV's, computers, boat, etc. You live there with your spouse and two kids. You work, pay your bills, and pay your taxes. Now some poor folks like what you have. They want to have the same life as you do. Are you un-Christian if you don't open your door to them, allow them to move in and share all your possessions?

That is how the poor of the world sees us. We have too much and they want it. They don't want to wait for it and go on the waiting line, they sneak in the back door and expect it.

I'm sorry, as I see it it's wrong. Immigration laws work. We need to enforce them, do it the right way.
Unless you are a Native America, we are all children of immigrants. Immigrants built this nation. We need immigration, but we must do it legally, within our immigration system.

If you overload a lifeboat, everybody drowns.

Time to toss out the Old Dinosaurs and make room :laugh:

After all ... they can use their own Boats they used to enslave people.

What goes around comes around

Redrose
11-20-2014, 11:54 PM
Cigar

Who are you tossing out to make room? I'd like to hear your plan.

Matty
11-21-2014, 12:05 AM
@Cigar (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=294)

Who are you tossing out to make room? I'd like to hear your plan.
He thinks the slave owners are still around. That's a little weird even for a racist democrat!

momsapplepie
11-21-2014, 12:43 AM
Gads, what hysteria! Not all illegals are violent anymore than your other citizens are. They broke the law, true, most-likely so that their children would have a more prosperous economic future.
PW, until you have lived here, YOU HAVE NO IDEA. Your country is now at the mercy of MUSLIM law. Talk to me when you defend the hundreds of girls that have suffered rape, and abuse from IMMIGRANTS. Yeah, your country buried that shit didn't it, in the name of political correctness. Talk to us when a woman can walk freely, un-accosted in one of your English muslim neighborhoods. Don't judge our country based on your country's surrender to fucked up immigration. Go suck your own eggs before you judge Americans. Obama poked the sleeping bear, and he will end up feeling the full five claw wrath.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 01:04 AM
In theory I concur, in the reality of my weekly cheque I will note how much of it goes to pay for our immigrants who haven't put a single quid into the system to use our services.

I used to be so much nicer before my pay rise.

Well, if they're legalized, then they can start paying the same taxes as everyone (almost everyone) else (they already pay sales tax).

The Immigrant ‘Welfare Queen’ Myth (http://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/immigrant-welfare-queen-myth)

Cthulhu
11-21-2014, 01:07 AM
http://i998.photobucket.com/albums/af108/PumpkinAle2371/10516680_788268807874269_580808551848028644_n_zps7 aebcf38.jpg
I'm going to take a play from your book:

They lost, get over it. You can't stop change.


Sent from my evil cell phone.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 01:10 AM
You sound as if you think we have zero poverty and zero unemployment when we have many millions of poor unemployed Americans already.

it makes no sense to import more.

Aren't neocons always telling everyone that poor and unemployed Americans are all lazy bums who need to get off taxpayer-funded welfare? Where did you suddenly find your compassion for loafers who refuse to work for a market rate? There are plenty of "jobs" to do, it's just that many Americans simply don't want to do them, as they generally feel such work is beneath them. I say thank goodness for hard-working immigrants who are here to cheaply clean up after our disgusting rich asses. Without them, we'd have to do it ourselves or pay oligopoly prices.

momsapplepie
11-21-2014, 01:19 AM
Well, if they're legalized, then they can start paying the same taxes as everyone (almost everyone) else (they already pay sales tax).

The Immigrant ‘Welfare Queen’ Myth (http://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/immigrant-welfare-queen-myth)


Sure, just like they pay for auto insurance as required by state law. Can anyone else tell me what it's like to have three cars totaled by drunken immigrants with no license, no insurance, no ID? Because I never got a fucking thing beyond increases in car insurance and screwed by the car lien holders/insurance. It's called pay out of your pocket for someone that our government says is not responsible. Do people not understand that? Guess what Y'all's got coming to you now? LOL!

momsapplepie
11-21-2014, 01:20 AM
Taxes? Well, we'll just see the demonicrat way....

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 01:25 AM
I'm not sure how you reconcile this with a lily white philosophy like libertarianism. The browner the country gets the more marginal you will become. Is that what you want? The older generation (e.g. Rothbard, Murray, Hoppe) understood this.

I don't see libertarian philosophy through a racial lens. All it takes is for one "black" or "brown" person to embrace libertarian philosophy and it disproves the categorical prejudice. As for Rothbard and Hoppe, I haven't looked too deeply into their racial views or agendas, though I've heard some things about Rothbard. Whatever those views may be, they do not define libertarianism or change its ability to be disseminated regardless of skin color. And though Rothbard has some excellent historical economics books, he's perhaps not the moral paragon that libertarians typically turn to when they're looking for archetypal figures. For that, I would go to Lysander Spooner.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 01:35 AM
I guess I'm just one of those old fashioned conservatives who sees a difference between Americans and Mexicans.

Silly me, huh?

Yea, the difference is that the Mexicans work hard for a market wage and the people from California sit around collecting welfare and vying for positions within the bloated machinery of the state.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 01:38 AM
key phrase...'broke the law'. Great way to start your citizenship.

The legal process to become a citizen is incredibly bureaucratic and inefficient, so they have little choice but to come here illegally.

momsapplepie
11-21-2014, 01:49 AM
The legal process to become a citizen is incredibly bureaucratic and inefficient, so they have little choice but to come here illegally.

It's not like their own countries immigration system aren't incredibly bureaucratic and inefficient. They do have a choice. They can stay in their own country and build up their own government. What would happen to an American who jumped their border? Far worse that what illegals can expect here.
What the heck ever happened to reciprocal agreements?

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 02:02 AM
Well, if they're legalized, then they can start paying the same taxes as everyone (almost everyone) else (they already pay sales tax).

The Immigrant ‘Welfare Queen’ Myth (http://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/immigrant-welfare-queen-myth)



You mean they can start drawing welfare just like everyone else.

the US does not generate enough new jobs to fully employ Americans and you want to bring in 40 to 100 million more poor people for the government to support?

thats insane.

Redrose
11-21-2014, 03:06 AM
The legal process to become a citizen is incredibly bureaucratic and inefficient, so they have little choice but to come here illegally.


OK then, with that logic, mortgage applcations are too complicated and time consuming, so I'll just become a squatter and move into the house and basically acquire it illegally. Laws, rules, who cares. We're now a nation of anarchists, we can do whatever the hell we want, laws, rules, civility be damned. I want it, so I'm going to take it, any way I can.

Captain Obvious
11-21-2014, 08:24 AM
The legal process to become a citizen is incredibly bureaucratic and inefficient, so they have little choice but to come here illegally.

Our origins were that we were the place immigrants came to for a better life.

At some point the parking lot gets full and we have to become a homogeneous nation, we can't sustain mass immigration forever.

Matty
11-21-2014, 08:29 AM
It's not like their own countries immigration system aren't incredibly bureaucratic and inefficient. They do have a choice. They can stay in their own country and build up their own government. What would happen to an American who jumped their border? Far worse that what illegals can expect here.
What the heck ever happened to reciprocal agreements?
Questions like this one will be ignored.

Calypso Jones
11-21-2014, 08:47 AM
All this love of lawless immigrants is bogus. They are not here for any empathy on the part of the left. They're not here because the left is so tolerant. They're here for what they are expected to do for the democrats. THAT. IS. ALL.

donttread
11-21-2014, 09:10 AM
I just see them as immigrants, most of whom only want to work (also known as being productive). I think that's a good thing. For some reason, the Republican Party has this idea that black and brown people, especially ones who immigrated here, aren't interested in capitalism and just want a handout, but every time I see someone from South America in this country, they are almost always working or looking for work. These people are great capitalists from what I've observed generally. It's the Americans who are born here that have a sense of entitlement and a distaste for capitalism. They want to be coddled with welfare and protectionist policies. They only like competition when it's someone else being forced to compete.

It's nothing against the immigrants , many of them are just trying to make a better life. However, we simply do not have the resources to feed the world. Our economy is in the shitter as it is. I'd love to rent every homeless person in NYC a room on cold nights, but I lack the resources so I cannot do that.

donttread
11-21-2014, 09:15 AM
I have to admit that I am saddened by the responses to this thread and how political and emotional they are and the near ( not complete) but near total lack of reasoning this out as an economic issue?
We cannot feed the world! Plain and simple. If you want to create charities to help Mexicans create their own strong local economies great. But in case you haven't noticed we have millions of our own citizens living in the streets. We can care for no more strays!

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 09:17 AM
It's nothing against the immigrants , many of them are just trying to make a better life. However, we simply do not have the resources to feed the world. Our economy is in the $#@!ter as it is. I'd love to rent every homeless person in NYC a room on cold nights, but I lack the resources so I cannot do that.

Ethereal praises illegal aliens as if they are working class saints who are far superior to Americans.

What bullshit.

They are here illegally so they can't park their asses on welfare like Obama voters are able to do.

But make illegal aliens citizens and we will see the welfare rolls inflate like a birthday balloon.

Mister D
11-21-2014, 10:04 AM
I don't see libertarian philosophy through a racial lens. All it takes is for one "black" or "brown" person to embrace libertarian philosophy and it disproves the categorical prejudice. As for Rothbard and Hoppe, I haven't looked too deeply into their racial views or agendas, though I've heard some things about Rothbard. Whatever those views may be, they do not define libertarianism or change its ability to be disseminated regardless of skin color. And though Rothbard has some excellent historical economics books, he's perhaps not the moral paragon that libertarians typically turn to when they're looking for archetypal figures. For that, I would go to Lysander Spooner.

It's not a matter of racial views, a racial lens, or a racial agenda. or morality for that matter. It's the demographic reality of libertarianism. You can acknowledge that reality or not. I have no dog in that fight.

Calypso Jones
11-21-2014, 11:33 AM
After thinking about it for abit...this is more fuel for the US devolving into a race war. Blacks, Hispanics, non blacks/Hispanics. Where is the Obama administration in all this.

momsapplepie
11-21-2014, 11:35 AM
I can tell you where obambi is, he's partying in Vegas now that has screwed millions of Americans.

Matty
11-21-2014, 11:36 AM
I can tell you where obambi is, he's partying in Vegas now that has screwed millions of Americans.
Fuck Americans his priorities be illegals!

nic34
11-21-2014, 11:38 AM
so that their children would have a more prosperous economic future.

Why should they have what the rest of us don't have? :grin:

nic34
11-21-2014, 11:52 AM
@Dark Mistress (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1083) there is nothing wrong with feeling compassion for those less fortunate than ourselves. We would be heartless if we didn't. But we must be intelligent and practical and legal in how we deal with immigration. My SIL took 6 years to get citizenship. She came here from Peru on a work visa. She was an attorney in Peru, her dad is a doctor. She did it the proper way. She studied, took a test, learned the language waited on the list. She is now a well paid bilingual attorney in South Carolina.

There are 8 billion people in the world. We can't be expected to bring them all here for the American Dream. If that ever happens, the American Dream will decay into the American nightmare. We will just become another 3rd world country.

An analogy that was used in a discussion group recently; You own a nice home, own a nice car, have nice things, big screen TV's, computers, boat, etc. You live there with your spouse and two kids. You work, pay your bills, and pay your taxes. Now some poor folks like what you have. They want to have the same life as you do. Are you un-Christian if you don't open your door to them, allow them to move in and share all your possessions?

That is how the poor of the world sees us. We have too much and they want it. They don't want to wait for it and go on the waiting line, they sneak in the back door and expect it.

I'm sorry, as I see it it's wrong. Immigration laws work. We need to enforce them, do it the right way.
Unless you are a Native America, we are all children of immigrants. Immigrants built this nation. We need immigration, but we must do it legally, within our immigration system.

If you overload a lifeboat, everybody drowns.

Why do you think we have immigration laws in the US? So immigrants can become legal.

So why are the laws being broken? Because the laws are not intelligible and are outdated.

Congress is the entity that is being lax here, not Obama and certainly not the immigrants in the shadows wanting to come out if there was some legal way to do so.


And we still have plenty of room for more on our lifeboat if we make the laws practical.

http://lh4.ggpht.com/-m21Xoim5hbo/UlQhEk8939I/AAAAAAAAXD0/OdI7OBIfCTw/P1050995_thumb.jpg?imgmax=800

momsapplepie
11-21-2014, 11:55 AM
ok, round them up and send them to the desert, they can make a living there.

Captain Obvious
11-21-2014, 11:56 AM
http://troll.me/images/liberal-douche-garofalo/immigration-restrictions-are-racist-high-unemployment-is-unacceptable.jpg

Mister D
11-21-2014, 12:07 PM
http://troll.me/images/liberal-douche-garofalo/immigration-restrictions-are-racist-high-unemployment-is-unacceptable.jpg

Sounds like nic

Bo-4
11-21-2014, 01:24 PM
I just see them as immigrants, most of whom only want to work (also known as being productive). I think that's a good thing. For some reason, the Republican Party has this idea that black and brown people, especially ones who immigrated here, aren't interested in capitalism and just want a handout, but every time I see someone from South America in this country, they are almost always working or looking for work. These people are great capitalists from what I've observed generally. It's the Americans who are born here that have a sense of entitlement and a distaste for capitalism. They want to be coddled with welfare and protectionist policies. They only like competition when it's someone else being forced to compete.

I don't get it either @Etherial - Republicans should know by now that they won't win another election if they continue to do nothing. Instead of cock-blocking, filing lawsuits and endless blubbering, pass the damned Senate bill!

Bo-4
11-21-2014, 01:28 PM
You sound as if you think we have zero poverty and zero unemployment when we have many millions of poor unemployed Americans already.

it makes no sense to import more.

We don't need to "import" them Mac.. they're already here!

So why not bring them out of the shadows, get them paying fines/ taxes, learn English -- and stop tearing families apart.

You guys USED to be for "family values" or was that just a happy, meaningless little buzz phrase?

momsapplepie
11-21-2014, 01:28 PM
No. The senate bill is just as bad if not worse than what odumbo just did.

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 01:30 PM
I don't get it either @Etherial - Republicans should know by now that they won't win another election if they continue to do nothing. Instead of $#@!-blocking, filing lawsuits and endless blubbering, pass the $#@!ed Senate bill!

Creating millions of new Democrat voters is going to help repub candidates win elections?

You have a vivid up imagination.

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 01:32 PM
We don't need to "import" them Mac.. they're already here!

So why not bring them out of the shadows, get them paying fines/ taxes, learn English -- and stop tearing families apart.

You guys USED to be for "family values" or was that just a happy, meaningless little buzz phrase?

We have an open border and immigration laws that bring in many new immigrants for every illegal alien who gets amnesty and citizenship.

Bo-4
11-21-2014, 02:17 PM
We have an open border and immigration laws that bring in many new immigrants for every illegal alien who gets amnesty and citizenship.

No we do not have an open border. Crossings are now at an all time low.

Bo-4
11-21-2014, 02:19 PM
Creating millions of new Democrat voters is going to help repub candidates win elections?

You have a vivid up imagination.

You should listen to Rand Paul's new charm offensive. He knows you could actually increase your Hispanic vote by ten points or so with Republican led immigration reform.

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 02:19 PM
No we do not have an open border. Crossings are now at an all time low.

Anyone can cross the border from Mexico if they want to.

Redrose
11-21-2014, 02:29 PM
Why do you think we have immigration laws in the US? So immigrants can become legal.

So why are the laws being broken? Because the laws are not intelligible and are outdated.

Congress is the entity that is being lax here, not Obama and certainly not the immigrants in the shadows wanting to come out if there was some legal way to do so.


And we still have plenty of room for more on our lifeboat if we make the laws practical.

http://lh4.ggpht.com/-m21Xoim5hbo/UlQhEk8939I/AAAAAAAAXD0/OdI7OBIfCTw/P1050995_thumb.jpg?imgmax=800


Ah....do you see any roads? Ah...no. Do you see any Hospitals? Ah...no. Do you see any schools, stores, businesses, churches, water, sewers, electricity, emergency facilities? No. All that costs money. They have no money, but we do, we the middle class, the backbone of the tax revenue structure.

Do whay you say, round 'em all up, put them all in the desert of Arizona or New Mexico give them all tee pees, heck they were good enough for the Native Americans. Let them acquire the American Dream from the bottom up like the immigrants of old who brought their skills here legally and built this great nation.
They came here to build a life not have one handed to them as a freebee.

No habla Englese.....no el checky.

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 02:32 PM
You should listen to Rand Paul's new charm offensive. He knows you could actually increase your Hispanic vote by ten points or so with Republican led immigration reform.

If so he's mistaken about that.

Bo-4
11-21-2014, 03:38 PM
Anyone can cross the border from Mexico if they want to.

Not true, it is enormously risky and the number of border agents and deportations has doubled under Obama.

Cigar
11-21-2014, 03:41 PM
Anyone can cross the border from Mexico if they want to.

I Dare You :grin:

Bo-4
11-21-2014, 03:42 PM
If so he's mistaken about that.

You want to permanently write off the Black and Hispanic vote?

Fine with me, but your "autopsy" after the 2012 election called for NOT doing so.

What, you're not a Rinsed Penis fan? :D

http://dc392.4shared.com/img/y-TZVGur/s7/14157b27070/RNC_Chair_Reince_Priebus_Littl.gif

momsapplepie
11-21-2014, 03:52 PM
It took 150 years but Obama finally got the Democrat party their slaves back

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 03:59 PM
Not true, it is enormously risky and the number of border agents and deportations has doubled under Obama.

Don't be silly.

I doubt if its ever been easier than now.

Redrose
11-21-2014, 04:02 PM
Anyone can cross the border from Mexico if they want to.


The young Marine couldn't.

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 04:08 PM
The young Marine couldn't.

He just picked the wrong spot to cross with weapons.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 04:09 PM
OK then, with that logic, mortgage applcations are too complicated and time consuming, so I'll just become a squatter and move into the house and basically acquire it illegally.

What is the status of the house? Is it being continuously or intermittently occupied by another resident or residents? Because adverse possession (or "squatter's rights) has a firm basis in the canon of western laws, and is still in effect to varying degrees throughout the west. The idea that idle realty could devolve back to the local population after a certain set of conditions were met was law in Rome, France, England, Canada, and America, among others.


Laws, rules, who cares. We're now a nation of anarchists, we can do whatever the hell we want, laws, rules, civility be $#@!ed. I want it, so I'm going to take it, any way I can.

Anarchy doesn't mean "no laws or rules", it just means no rulers. Virtually all anarchists are in agreement on laws against initiatory violence like murder and rape, and the vast majority of them agree on laws against theft of justly owned property. Since immigrating here does not, in and of itself, cause initiatory violence, anarchists do not favor criminalizing or otherwise prohibiting the specific act.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 04:19 PM
Our origins were that we were the place immigrants came to for a better life.

At some point the parking lot gets full and we have to become a homogeneous nation, we can't sustain mass immigration forever.

But the parking lot is not full or even close to being full.

http://www.learnnc.org/lp/media/uploads/2010/03/2k_night.jpg

There is still a lot of room left for our population to grow. We have approximately the same size country as China but with a four times smaller population.

Common Sense
11-21-2014, 04:21 PM
But the parking lot is not full or even close to being full.

http://www.learnnc.org/lp/media/uploads/2010/03/2k_night.jpg

There is still a lot of room left for our population to grow. We have approximately the same size country as China but with a four times smaller population. We have room to grow.


As an aside, when I see maps like that it makes me wonder why people doubt we can have an impact on climate. Look at the physical presence in North America and then realize the atmosphere is only as high as peach fuzz is on a peach.

Wrong thread, I know. Carry on.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 04:25 PM
It's nothing against the immigrants , many of them are just trying to make a better life. However, we simply do not have the resources to feed the world. Our economy is in the $#@!ter as it is. I'd love to rent every homeless person in NYC a room on cold nights, but I lack the resources so I cannot do that.

What do you mean we don't have the resources? This country throws away or wastes around 133 billion pounds of food every year, so there is clearly no shortage of food.

We have an ocean of hydrocarbons under our feet, so plenty of energy.

And there are still vast tracts of livable, workable land throughout the country.

Labor is how we take those idle resources and turn them into products.

Do you also oppose endogenous population growth? It has the same effect as immigration, which is to increase the population.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 04:29 PM
Ethereal praises illegal aliens as if they are working class saints who are far superior to Americans.

What bull$#@!.

They are here illegally so they can't park their asses on welfare like Obama voters are able to do.

But make illegal aliens citizens and we will see the welfare rolls inflate like a birthday balloon.

That's an argument for welfare reform, which I support.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 04:33 PM
It's not a matter of racial views, a racial lens, or a racial agenda. or morality for that matter. It's the demographic reality of libertarianism. You can acknowledge that reality or not. I have no dog in that fight.

I just don't know what is meant by the "demographic reality of libertarianism". If it's supposed to mean that black and brown people will never embrace libertarian philosophy, then I disagree with that "reality".

Mister D
11-21-2014, 04:36 PM
I just don't know what is meant by the "demographic reality of libertarianism". If it's supposed to mean that black and brown people will never embrace libertarian philosophy, then I disagree with that "reality".

It means libertarians are predominantly white and that your ideals obviously appeal to whites much more than non-whites. Hey, it's no skin off my nose. Believe what you will. Race never matters until it does.

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 04:38 PM
That's an argument for welfare reform, which I support.

Welfare reform and closed borders.

we don't have enough jobs for american citizens so we certainly don't need millions of new poor people from Mexico.

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 04:38 PM
I don't get it either @Etherial - Republicans should know by now that they won't win another election if they continue to do nothing. Instead of $#@!-blocking, filing lawsuits and endless blubbering, pass the $#@!ed Senate bill!

I am vehemently opposed to the Senate bill because of its E-Verify provision. The hypocrisy of Republicans making fun of Obama's website failures and government technology trying to force every employer in the country to register with DHS is such insane hypocrisy.

Paperback Writer
11-21-2014, 04:43 PM
I don't get it either @Etherial - Republicans should know by now that they won't win another election if they continue to do nothing. Instead of cock-blocking, filing lawsuits and endless blubbering, pass the damned Senate bill!

If the country cared as much about these issues as you why did they vote for Republicans then and not Dems? Do you really believe it was over ebola?

Have a slice of reality pie. Everyone cares about jobs. They care about them having jobs before they care about illegals having "rights". If you haven't gotten that through the old cranium I have no words for you. It's not like they voted in Republicans because they think they're a swell bunch. All your social issues and social programmes don't make jobs for Americans and you'll lose again if you don't grasp that concept.

The same happened in the UK. The economy went south, the immigrants came west, and now we're arse up. For the first time in forever a highly libertarian party now has 1/3 of the country's vote now and that's unheard of if you understand how socially liberal the media and the women here are. :)

Ethereal
11-21-2014, 04:48 PM
Welfare reform and closed borders.

we don't have enough jobs for american citizens so we certainly don't need millions of new poor people from Mexico.

There are plenty of jobs, just not the kind of jobs that Americans want to work. And since when did you get all compassionate about the unemployed? I thought they were lazy democrat supporters collecting welfare.

Peter1469
11-21-2014, 04:52 PM
Adverse possession takes a long time. I guess the theory is that if you didn't bother to check on your property in the last two decades, it isn't yours anymore since someone else put it to good use.
What is the status of the house? Is it being continuously or intermittently occupied by another resident or residents? Because adverse possession (or "squatter's rights) has a firm basis in the canon of western laws, and is still in effect to varying degrees throughout the west. The idea that idle realty could devolve back to the local population after a certain set of conditions were met was law in Rome, France, England, Canada, and America, among others.



Anarchy doesn't mean "no laws or rules", it just means no rulers. Virtually all anarchists are in agreement on laws against initiatory violence like murder and rape, and the vast majority of them agree on laws against theft of justly owned property. Since immigrating here does not, in and of itself, cause initiatory violence, anarchists do not favor criminalizing or otherwise prohibiting the specific act.

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 04:54 PM
There are plenty of jobs, just not the kind of jobs that Americans want to work.

And since when did you get all compassionate about the unemployed?



I have to pay for their welfare.

Open borders lowers the standard of living for the majority of Americans and creates more citizen victims for the welfare office.

nic34
11-21-2014, 05:00 PM
But the parking lot is not full or even close to being full.

http://www.learnnc.org/lp/media/uploads/2010/03/2k_night.jpg

There is still a lot of room left for our population to grow. We have approximately the same size country as China but with a four times smaller population.

Even more room in Canada, eh CS? :wink:

Peter1469
11-21-2014, 05:02 PM
Space is not the issue. Money is.

I would admit all who want to come if they are entitled to zero tax payer dollars.
But in reality they are. We can't afford it. We are insolvent.


Even more room in Canada, eh CS? :wink:

PolWatch
11-21-2014, 05:10 PM
Space is not the issue. Money is.

I would admit all who want to come if they are entitled to zero tax payer dollars.
But in reality they are. We can't afford it. We are insolvent.

Was the insolvent condition completely the fault of illegal immigrants (even those getting welfare, etc)? I don't think you can hang the current situation on those shoulders. We are in this mess because of idiot politicians and their wars & loopholes & general, screw the citizens, I'm taking care of me & my friends (donors). While everyone stares at the border, what's going on in Washington? Who cares? We have found another issue to distract. The only issue that seems to be real here is the concern that the dems might get more votes. Power & money....

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 05:35 PM
Was the insolvent condition completely the fault of illegal immigrants (even those getting welfare, etc)? I don't think you can hang the current situation on those shoulders. .

it does not have to be their fault.

Just being here in the millions and making a bad problem worse is enough to condemn them.

They have no right to be here.

PolWatch
11-21-2014, 05:41 PM
it does not have to be their fault.

Just being here in the millions and make a bad problem worse is enough to condemn them.

They have no right to be here.

any reason you ignored the rest of the post?

Peter1469
11-21-2014, 05:42 PM
If somebody gave you the impression that our ~$18T debt was because of illegals I give you permission to publicly shame them. With that said, my statement above has nothing whatsoever to do putting anything on the shoulders of illegals.

The US is a sovereign nation. Our decisions regarding our immigration laws and policies are within our discretion. The illegals and potential immigrants feelings have nothing to do with the equation.

We need to totally revamp our immigration laws. That is clear.


Was the insolvent condition completely the fault of illegal immigrants (even those getting welfare, etc)? I don't think you can hang the current situation on those shoulders. We are in this mess because of idiot politicians and their wars & loopholes & general, screw the citizens, I'm taking care of me & my friends (donors). While everyone stares at the border, what's going on in Washington? Who cares? We have found another issue to distract. The only issue that seems to be real here is the concern that the dems might get more votes. Power & money....

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 05:47 PM
any reason you ignored the rest of the post?

I try to stick to one topic at a time and the rest of the post was just standard big government bashing.

All the problems in Washington contribute to the problem of illegal aliens but are no excuse for being here illegally.

Bo-4
11-21-2014, 06:22 PM
Don't be silly.

I doubt if its ever been easier than now.

I'll subtract you as a viable interest in RW politics so DO continue!

donttread
11-21-2014, 08:22 PM
Was the insolvent condition completely the fault of illegal immigrants (even those getting welfare, etc)? I don't think you can hang the current situation on those shoulders. We are in this mess because of idiot politicians and their wars & loopholes & general, screw the citizens, I'm taking care of me & my friends (donors). While everyone stares at the border, what's going on in Washington? Who cares? We have found another issue to distract. The only issue that seems to be real here is the concern that the dems might get more votes. Power & money....

No, of course not. the point is that we are broke and in record debt and have not balanced a budget in 15 freakin years. We are not in a position to take them in

Matty
11-21-2014, 08:26 PM
We need to lock down that border. First!

Mac-7
11-21-2014, 08:46 PM
I'll subtract you as a viable interest in RW politics so DO continue!

If you think illegal aliens are not crossing the border at will you are one of those lib voters that Obama and Professor Gruber depend on.

lynn
11-21-2014, 09:01 PM
No we do not have an open border. Crossings are now at an all time low.

Then please explain how over 10 million illegal immigrants manage to cross our borders without getting caught?

donttread
11-22-2014, 10:31 AM
Then please explain how over 10 million illegal immigrants manage to cross our borders without getting caught?

Approximately 3% of the people in this country are here illegally! Higher in the urban cesspools. How is that NOT an open border?

lynn
11-22-2014, 01:04 PM
Then please explain how over 10 million illegal immigrants manage to cross our borders without getting caught?


Correction it is over 22 million that are not citizens

Mac-7
11-22-2014, 01:20 PM
Correction it is over 22 million that are not citizens

Maybe 30 million.

No one really knows.