The Guardian: Mike Brown's Law is a start, but police body-cams are no panacea for vi

[Cthulhu]

The Guardian: Mike Brown's Law is a start, but police body-cams are no panacea for violence. http://google.com/newsstand/s/CBIw8s_R6x8

I don't know the whole scope of the late Mr. Brown's case.

But. If his demise the initiates a nation wide requirement for law enforcement to wear cameras during their encounters with the citizenry, I am okay with that.

Interesting read.

[Green Arrow]

I support this, but it can't be the only step. The police protocols themselves and the culture of our communities has to change.

[pjohns]

The Guardian: Mike Brown's Law is a start, but police body-cams are no panacea for violence. http://google.com/newsstand/s/CBIw8s_R6x8

I don't know the whole scope of the late Mr. Brown's case.

But. If his demise the initiates a nation wide requirement for law enforcement to wear cameras during their encounters with the citizenry, I am okay with that.

Interesting read.

I am in favor of cameras on the police. (In fact, former New York mayor Rudy Giuliani has recently stated that his position on this matter has changed: He, too, is now in favor of such cameras.) They tend to accomplish very much the same thing as DNA evidence does: They exonerate the innocent and convict the guilty.

That said, however, in the Michael Brown case, I believe that justice was done by the grand jury's refusal to return an indictment. Many who made (apparently) damning statements, as concerning Officer Wilson, back in August, have either changed those statements or altogether retracted them--or they have been contradicted by the irrefutable physical evidence.

(Well, perhaps not complete justice: Officer Wilson's police career is now over; he has officially resigned from the Ferguson police force. And he may have to hire an attorney to protect him against civil litigation--even though that may be rather expensive; and he is, presumably, not a wealthy man...)

[Common]

Police I know dont mind one bit wearing body cams and theyve already had positive results for police with the ones that are already wearing them.
You can never fix the human factors that cause police shootings. You can make all the rules and write all the laws you want but you cant stop Human Error and thats what most all questionable police shootings are. Fear, misperceptions, poor sight, misjudgements all those mistakes that humans make. Police mistakes are with other humans and cause great grief.
I submit that what some believe is absolutely false and that is that some police go hunting to kill someone or relish it when they do.

[Cigar]

I support this, but it can't be the only step. The police protocols themselves and the culture of our communities has to change.

Still won't help reduce the "Fear" in a "Serve & Protect"

[PolWatch]

Police I know dont mind one bit wearing body cams and theyve already had positive results for police with the ones that are already wearing them.
You can never fix the human factors that cause police shootings. You can make all the rules and write all the laws you want but you cant stop Human Error and thats what most all questionable police shootings are. Fear, misperceptions, poor sight, misjudgements all those mistakes that humans make. Police mistakes are with other humans and cause great grief.
I submit that what some believe is absolutely false and that is that some police go hunting to kill someone or relish it when they do.

I don't believe anyone sane thinks most cops go hunting to kill for fun. I also think most cops are decent people, doing a rough job. However, I do know that the rules regarding training and psychological suitability need to be tightened up! There is something wrong with a society that can watch a video of a 12 year old being shot in 1.5 seconds and find excuses for the shooter.

[Cigar]

I don't believe anyone sane thinks most cops go hunting to kill for fun. I also think most cops are decent people, doing a rough job. However, I do know that the rules regarding training and psychological suitability need to be tightened up! There is something wrong with a society that can watch a video of a 12 year old being shot in 1.5 seconds and find excuses for the shooter.

It's the First Step: Deny :wink:

[lynn]

30 years ago, I believed most cops were good cops. Today, I believe their are more bad cops then there are good cops. They don't serve and protect the public, they serve and protect themselves. Perhaps it is due to the moral breakdown in society where now lying and manipulation has become an epidemic in all levels of government behavior.

[Alyosha]

I have to find the video where the cops were harassing this person and remembered that the dash cam was on and they were like "Oh shit, I forgot to turn it off".

So basically, I think it's a good first step but I still think it will be abused. I think we need to change the protocols and the culture. I keep harping on my sheriff but he has a great attitude about enforcement and this is a man that goes into houses or talks to people in an area where every single person pretty much has a rifle in their vehicle.

[Common]

I don't believe anyone sane thinks most cops go hunting to kill for fun. I also think most cops are decent people, doing a rough job. However, I do know that the rules regarding training and psychological suitability need to be tightened up! There is something wrong with a society that can watch a video of a 12 year old being shot in 1.5 seconds and find excuses for the shooter.

Pol police are afraid that everyone they approach has a gun now, in 1.5 seconds, the cop drove up saw the kid saw the gun and fired. Im just as bummed out as everyone else a child died. Alot of the blame for how police are responding has more to do with society today than anything else.

Your belief that the causation is training and psychological eligibility is wrong. They are trained better today than ever before and the psychological testing is far more involved than it was when I went through it.

One of the big problems is guns and the amount of Police officers being murdered and shot at and the sheer number of guns they are finding in stops and frisks of all kinds.

I made a statement once that im sure would make "some" working police officers bristle. At one time cops were bigger stronger and in better physical condition when they were hired. That gave confidence, when an individual has confidence in themselves emotions dont have as big a role in decisions.

Im not excusing with the police officer has done. I DONT KNOW what he did or didnt do and I dont have all the facts. I am saying that a very real mistake can be made in 1.5 seconds and that the officer can be a very good officer that thought he did the right thing in that 1.5 secs as he did it.

[Common]

It's the First Step: Deny :wink:

Condemn with no facts and absolutely no knowledge is your only step

[Don]

Cams are a great idea but please lets don't call it the Michael Brown law.

[Green Arrow]

Cams are a great idea but please lets don't call it the Michael Brown law.

If they have to name it after a person, calling it the "Tamir Rice Law," "Eric Garner Law," or "Dillon Taylor Law" would be better.

[Don]

If we're passing laws lets make one that gives citizens the right to videotape any and all encounters with police. Its legal in some areas but in others people get arrested for it. The only exception would be where a person is actually interfering with the police doing their legal duty. By that I mean getting in their way. I get a bit miffed when someone is standing across the street or on their own property and get threatened or arrested for videotaping police.

[Max Rockatansky]

The Guardian: Mike Brown's Law is a start, but police body-cams are no panacea for violence. http://google.com/newsstand/s/CBIw8s_R6x8

I don't know the whole scope of the late Mr. Brown's case.

But. If his demise the initiates a nation wide requirement for law enforcement to wear cameras during their encounters with the citizenry, I am okay with that.

Interesting read.

I fully support laws requiring police to not only wear body cams (and have car cams) but also carry non-lethal weapons in addition to their regular weaponry.

If the public had been able to see the violence at which Brown attacked Wilson and his run, then his charge back at Wilson, we probably wouldn't be having this conversation.

[Max Rockatansky]

If we're passing laws lets make one that gives citizens the right to videotape any and all encounters with police. Its legal in some areas but in others people get arrested for it. The only exception would be where a person is actually interfering with the police doing their legal duty. By that I mean getting in their way. I get a bit miffed when someone is standing across the street or on their own property and get threatened or arrested for videotaping police.Agreed here too.

[Peter1469]

The initial attack with Brown on Wilson through the window of the car- that was a legitimate case of kill Big Mike. But Wilson only winged Big Mike in the hand. When Big Mike was charging like a bull, Officer Wilson should have been trained enough to wrap him up without using his firearm. Sorry. Wilson is a P-word.
I fully support laws requiring police to not only wear body cams (and have car cams) but also carry non-lethal weapons in addition to their regular weaponry.

If the public had been able to see the violence at which Brown attacked Wilson and his run, then his charge back at Wilson, we probably wouldn't be having this conversation.

[Max Rockatansky]

The initial attack with Brown on Wilson through the window of the car- that was a legitimate case of kill Big Mike. But Wilson only winged Big Mike in the hand. When Big Mike was charging like a bull, Officer Wilson should have been trained enough to wrap him up without using his firearm. Sorry. Wilson is a P-word.
If Wilson had a body cam and a cruiser cam, there'd be a lot more certainty about this incident and a whole lot less conjecture.

[Peter1469]

If Wilson had a body cam and a cruiser cam, there'd be a lot more certainty about this incident and a whole lot less conjecture.

True.

[Don]

The problem with less than lethal force is the same as with it. Lethal force is OK when there is no alternative. That's why they invented bean bag shotguns, tasers and pepper spray. They are supposed to be used as alternatives to lethal force. Too damn many cops use them for the wrong reasons. You get stopped in traffic and ask why you were stopped. You are told to shut up. Shocked, you ask why and you get tazed or pepper sprayed and then arrested for resisting to justify their wrongful actions. It happens way too much. Hell, you can see that just by watching shows like COPS. Cameras for them and for us keeps all of us honest. The trouble makers don't get away with any crap and bad cops get busted or at least stifled. They don't want to get caught either. The police could even post their cam shots on YouTube to show the public that they do have to put up with a raft of BS from a lot of troublemakers.

[Dark Mistress]

Example of body camera fail:

http://benswann.com/albuquerque-police-chief-fires-cop-who-fatally-shot-woman-for-refusing-to-turn-on-body-camera/


The Albuquerque, NM Police Department has fired Officer Jeremy Dear for multiple incidents in which his body camera was found to be disabled during encounters with citizens that involved controversial uses of force, including one that ended in Dear fatally shooting 19-year-old Mary Hawkes.

[Dr. Who]

Police I know dont mind one bit wearing body cams and theyve already had positive results for police with the ones that are already wearing them.
You can never fix the human factors that cause police shootings. You can make all the rules and write all the laws you want but you cant stop Human Error and thats what most all questionable police shootings are. Fear, misperceptions, poor sight, misjudgements all those mistakes that humans make. Police mistakes are with other humans and cause great grief.
I submit that what some believe is absolutely false and that is that some police go hunting to kill someone or relish it when they do.
You are probably correct in most instances, but I'm not entirely sure that this is true in some cases. I also think that there is an increasing level of paranoia on the part of police in black neighborhoods, resulting in a greater tendency to resort to a precipitous use of lethal force. There is in turn a sense on the part of black observers that blacks, unlike whites, have no rights to question or even hesitate to immediately obey police, without perhaps forfeiting their lives. (This is based on conversations with black friends.) In general I see an overall increase in the level of paranoia on the part of police officers in general, and almost an assumption that anyone that they stop is armed and dangerous and an increasing tendency to magnify danger. When an officer stopping a car assumes that a cane is a rifle, or that a pen or a penknife in the hands of a schizophrenic or someone with dementia is a lethal weapon, or a stapler in the hands of a mentally ill man requires excessive use of a taser, there is a problem. Often several officers are present and yet they still react like they are taking down a dangerous offender, when often the person has no record of violence. The common denominator is not violent behavior on the part of the person killed or injured, but an inability on the part of that person to respond immediately, freeze like a statue and keep quiet.

I seems to me that police officers are losing sight of human psychology or are untrained in human behavior and expect robotic compliance. If that's true and this continues to afflict newer officers, the police will lose the confidence of the public.

[PolWatch]

Example of body camera fail:

http://benswann.com/albuquerque-police-chief-fires-cop-who-fatally-shot-woman-for-refusing-to-turn-on-body-camera/

The information on that police force is shocking...and it looks like the cops just decided to defy the chief and not wear the cameras! Since the killing of the camper was on video, it looks like they just decided to make sure the rest of their actions were not recorded!

'500,000 person city has suffered 41 officer-involved shootings, 27 of which were fatal, over the past four years alone, including a highly-publicized caught-on-video incident in which officers fatally shot homeless camper James Boyd (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/29/james-boyd-shooting-lawsuit-albuquerque-police_n_5541105.html), who appeared to pose no threat to police at the time.' from the OP link

[Max Rockatansky]

Example of body camera fail:

http://benswann.com/albuquerque-police-chief-fires-cop-who-fatally-shot-woman-for-refusing-to-turn-on-body-camera/
Looks like a body cam win to me. This police officer refused to turn on his cam and is involved in several incidents prior to the fatal shooting of 19 year old Mary Hawkes.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/albuquerque-police-fatally-shoot-19-year-old-woman/
The APD, which serves a city of roughly 555,000, has faced criticism for 37 shootings by officers since 2010 - more than 20 of them fatal. The DOJ launched its investigation in November 2012 following complaints by local advocacy groups.

"All I heard was the three gunshots and it turned quiet," Alberto Lopez, who lives nearby, told the station. "I didn't hear no yelling, no nothing. I just heard a lot of cop cars coming."
http://lintvkrqe.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/hawke.jpg