PDA

View Full Version : Pakistan Shows Downed US Stealth Chopper to the Chinese



Conley
08-14-2011, 07:42 PM
(Reuters) - Pakistan gave China access to the previously unknown U.S. "stealth" helicopter that crashed during the commando raid that killed Osama bin Laden in May despite explicit requests from the CIA not to, the Financial Times reported on Sunday.

The disclosure, if confirmed, is likely to further shake the U.S.-Pakistan relationship, which has been improving slightly after hitting its lowest point in decades following the killing of bin Laden.

During the raid, one of two modified Blackhawk helicopters, believed to employ unknown stealth capability, malfunctioned and crashed, forcing the commandos to abandon it.

"The U.S. now has information that Pakistan, particularly the ISI, gave access to the Chinese military to the downed helicopter in Abbottabad," the paper quoted a person "in intelligence circles" as saying on its website.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/14/us-pakistan-china-usa-idUSTRE77D2BT20110814

Wow, these Pakistanis just don't know when to shut up. Have fun as we pull out and your barbaric country reverts to a level approaching that of Afghanistan.

Mister D
08-14-2011, 07:53 PM
Weren't they talking about this within hours of the mission's end? I guess maybe it wasn't confirmed but I thought everyone knew they were going to do that if they hadn't already.

I concur with your sentiments. It's a barbaric and dirty country. Since India doesn't see eye to eye with China I wouldn't be surprised if the Pakis strengthen their ties with China.

Conley
08-14-2011, 08:07 PM
Yes, it always made more sense for the U.S. and India to ally and Pakistan to align with China. I think that's how it was actually, for many years. Pakistan played it smart by pretending to be a friend but obviously their true colors show through time and again.

Conley
08-14-2011, 08:07 PM
Weren't they talking about this within hours of the mission's end? I guess maybe it wasn't confirmed but I thought everyone knew they were going to do that if they hadn't already.

I concur with your sentiments. It's a barbaric and dirty country. Since India doesn't see eye to eye with China I wouldn't be surprised if the Pakis strengthen their ties with China.


I think the hope was that since they had screwed the pooch with OBL so badly, either intentionally or through their ineptitude, that they would at least make an effort to appear cooperative. Apparently that was too much to expect.

Mister D
08-14-2011, 08:16 PM
Yes, it always made more sense for the U.S. and India to ally and Pakistan to align with China. I think that's how it was actually, for many years. Pakistan played it smart by pretending to be a friend but obviously their true colors show through time and again.


Granted, I understand that the military government is in a tricky situation. They are hard pressed by Islamist elements and they can't appear to be mere puppets of US interests. That said, this outrage over the OBL mission seems petty and I think it's obvious that the Paki government has been hedging its bets for a long time now. IMO, they seem to have reached some kind of mutual understanding with the Islamists and Afghan insurgents. Otherwise, I don't understand why the OBL mission would have ticked them off so much.

Mister D
08-14-2011, 08:19 PM
Weren't they talking about this within hours of the mission's end? I guess maybe it wasn't confirmed but I thought everyone knew they were going to do that if they hadn't already.

I concur with your sentiments. It's a barbaric and dirty country. Since India doesn't see eye to eye with China I wouldn't be surprised if the Pakis strengthen their ties with China.


I think the hope was that since they had screwed the pooch with OBL so badly, either intentionally or through their ineptitude, that they would at least make an effort to appear cooperative. Apparently that was too much to expect.


The thign is we don;t know what's going on behind the scenes. I suspect that some of these regimes (Syria comes to mind) make a public stink about the US but secretly allow us to do what we please.

Mister D
08-14-2011, 08:19 PM
Tied at 125 and -2! :o ;D

Conley
08-14-2011, 08:31 PM
Tied at 125 and -2! :o ;D


Thanks in no small part to me! :D

I was wondering if you'd notice that...still want to abolish Karma or do you like it better now? ;D

Conley
08-14-2011, 08:38 PM
Weren't they talking about this within hours of the mission's end? I guess maybe it wasn't confirmed but I thought everyone knew they were going to do that if they hadn't already.

I concur with your sentiments. It's a barbaric and dirty country. Since India doesn't see eye to eye with China I wouldn't be surprised if the Pakis strengthen their ties with China.


I think the hope was that since they had screwed the pooch with OBL so badly, either intentionally or through their ineptitude, that they would at least make an effort to appear cooperative. Apparently that was too much to expect.


The thign is we don;t know what's going on behind the scenes. I suspect that some of these regimes (Syria comes to mind) make a public stink about the US but secretly allow us to do what we please.


That's true, no doubt. The governments also like keeping the U.S. around because it allows them to distract the people from their real problems by demonizing America.

Mister D
08-14-2011, 08:45 PM
Tied at 125 and -2! :o ;D


Thanks in no small part to me! :D

I was wondering if you'd notice that...still want to abolish Karma or do you like it better now? ;D


:D It can go and if the recent flareups are any indication good riddance.

Mister D
08-14-2011, 08:47 PM
Weren't they talking about this within hours of the mission's end? I guess maybe it wasn't confirmed but I thought everyone knew they were going to do that if they hadn't already.

I concur with your sentiments. It's a barbaric and dirty country. Since India doesn't see eye to eye with China I wouldn't be surprised if the Pakis strengthen their ties with China.


I think the hope was that since they had screwed the pooch with OBL so badly, either intentionally or through their ineptitude, that they would at least make an effort to appear cooperative. Apparently that was too much to expect.


The thign is we don;t know what's going on behind the scenes. I suspect that some of these regimes (Syria comes to mind) make a public stink about the US but secretly allow us to do what we please.


That's true, no doubt. The governments also like keeping the U.S. around because it allows them to distract the people from their real problems by demonizing America.


Israel too. Why would the Arab regimes want a resolution to the Arab-Israeli conflict?

Conley
08-14-2011, 08:58 PM
Agree 100%. Seems all the governments including our own rely on a shell game to distract the people from their own corruption and incompetence.

MMC
08-15-2011, 11:49 AM
This shit will lead to something with Pakistan.....but I think Petraeus will str-8 en out these dealing with Pakistan when it comes to Intel. We cannot trust anything they have to say anymore. Obama should be pulling all aid to Pakistan.

Mister D
08-15-2011, 11:52 AM
This shit will lead to something with Pakistan.....but I think Petraeus will str-8 en out these dealing with Pakistan when it comes to Intel. We cannot trust anything they have to say anymore. Obama should be pulling all aid to Pakistan.


As if the ISI didn't know OBL was there... ::)

MMC
08-15-2011, 12:03 PM
It's like 3 strikes and you are out.....no more chances. Time to play gangsta with them.

Mister D
08-15-2011, 12:06 PM
It's like 3 strikes and you are out.....no more chances. Time to play gangsta with them.


Once we are out of Afghanistan we can cut some of our ties to them.

Conley
08-15-2011, 05:00 PM
There is no way we should be giving money to either Pakistan or Egypt right now. None.

Mister D
08-15-2011, 06:32 PM
There is no way we should be giving money to either Pakistan or Egypt right now. None.


We could probably get rid of our deficit overnight if we called in all our "loans".

Conley
08-15-2011, 06:34 PM
There is no way we should be giving money to either Pakistan or Egypt right now. None.


We could probably get rid of our deficit overnight if we called in all our "loans".


Yep, but we have about as much of a chance of collecting as the banks do on all those houses that are late on their mortgage payments. Just the act of trying to collect would probably cause yet another financial meltdown.

Mister D
08-15-2011, 06:39 PM
There is no way we should be giving money to either Pakistan or Egypt right now. None.


We could probably get rid of our deficit overnight if we called in all our "loans".


Yep, but we have about as much of a chance of collecting as the banks do on all those houses that are late on their mortgage payments. Just the act of trying to collect would probably cause yet another financial meltdown.


It's too risky doing it on this PC. :D In your cyber travels this evening could you look up our annual foreign aid budget? I'm not suggesting we simply stop all aid but I wonder how much could be trimmed.

Conley
08-15-2011, 06:42 PM
http://www.state.gov/f/budget/

"Politicians in both parties, he said, "suggest that we can somehow close our entire deficit by eliminating things like foreign aid, even though foreign aid makes up about 1% of our entire budget."

We wondered if foreign aid really makes up such a small portion of federal spending.

In February, PolitiFact checked a claim by Ross Douthat, a columnist at The New York Times. Douthat said Israel and Egypt receive more foreign aid from Uncle Sam than any other nations. We rated that True, noting that if you exclude the spending on Afghanistan and Iraq, where military operations continue, Israel received $2.4 billion in the 2008 fiscal year, while Egypt got $1.5 billion."

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/apr/13/barack-obama/barack-obama-says-foreign-aid-makes-1-percent-us-b/

Mister D
08-15-2011, 06:45 PM
http://www.state.gov/f/budget/

"Politicians in both parties, he said, "suggest that we can somehow close our entire deficit by eliminating things like foreign aid, even though foreign aid makes up about 1% of our entire budget."

We wondered if foreign aid really makes up such a small portion of federal spending.

In February, PolitiFact checked a claim by Ross Douthat, a columnist at The New York Times. Douthat said Israel and Egypt receive more foreign aid from Uncle Sam than any other nations. We rated that True, noting that if you exclude the spending on Afghanistan and Iraq, where military operations continue, Israel received $2.4 billion in the 2008 fiscal year, while Egypt got $1.5 billion."

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/apr/13/barack-obama/barack-obama-says-foreign-aid-makes-1-percent-us-b/


In 2009 it was 47.7 billion. That's not exactly money well spent in some cases but it pales in comparison to unfunded mandates and defense.

Conley
08-15-2011, 06:47 PM
Why were we giving so much to Egypt? Israel is a different ball of way but Egypt?

Mister D
08-15-2011, 06:49 PM
Why were we giving so much to Egypt? Israel is a different ball of way but Egypt?


Our relationship with Egypt changed dramatically after they made peace with Israel. Isn't it great how we turn on the very government we lavished praise on earlier?

Conley
08-15-2011, 06:51 PM
Why were we giving so much to Egypt? Israel is a different ball of way but Egypt?


Our relationship with Egypt changed dramatically after they made peace with Israel. Isn't it great how we turn on the very government we lavished praise on earlier?


I wish praise was all we lavished on them! >:(

Mister D
08-15-2011, 06:54 PM
Why were we giving so much to Egypt? Israel is a different ball of way but Egypt?


Our relationship with Egypt changed dramatically after they made peace with Israel. Isn't it great how we turn on the very government we lavished praise on earlier?


I wish praise was all we lavished on them! >:(


I can understand our Cold War efforts (including warming up to Egypt) but since my mid teens we've not had a coherent foreign policy. Is it just about oil? If so, forget the democracy crap.

Conley
08-15-2011, 06:59 PM
I think Egypt is running out of oil but I guess the strategic importance is still high, and of course the Suez.

http://www.oilprice.com/uploads/AB777.png

Mister D
08-15-2011, 07:42 PM
I think Egypt is running out of oil but I guess the strategic importance is still high, and of course the Suez.

http://www.oilprice.com/uploads/AB777.png


The Suez will likely be a factor some time. Then again, I wonder how much of its importance is directly related to shipping oil? Anyway, the advent of alternative fuels will drive these undiversified economies into the ground.

MMC
08-15-2011, 11:23 PM
Yeah you right there D.....it's all about the Suez now. Egypt doesnt really have anything to export for oil anymore.