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View Full Version : Libs keeps claiming Reps offer no alternative to obamacre...



Agravan
07-06-2012, 03:18 PM
For our liberal friends who claim conservatives who want to repeal ObamaCare/ObamaTax have not given us any alternatives.... Conservatives have offered up 219 bills in just 2012 that seek to reform healthcare and make it more affordable for millions of people. Guess how many of these bills the do-nothing Democrats in the Senate have passed?

http://rsc.jordan.house.gov/UploadedFiles/RSC_Policy_Brief-Members_Health_Care_Initiatives.pdf

Trinnity
07-06-2012, 07:29 PM
The R's came up with competition across state lines. IOW, you can buy health ins from a company in another state. That would have increased competition and lowered premiums.

Peter1469
07-06-2012, 07:45 PM
The problem is that health insurance is a state law matter. And all of the states have different regulations for insurance companies. This is one area that my require a Constitutional Amendment to sync the states at least so that insurance companies can operation across state line and open up competition.

Chris
07-06-2012, 08:05 PM
This is one area that my require a Constitutional Amendment to sync the states at least so that insurance companies can operation across state line and open up competition.

So even though you argue it's a state matter, not a federal one, you advocate federal regulation of the states.

Peter1469
07-06-2012, 09:07 PM
So even though you argue it's a state matter, not a federal one, you advocate federal regulation of the states.

What part went over your head? I said that perhaps a Constitutional amendment is needed in order to have insurance cross state lines. How would it occur otherwise?

Chris
07-06-2012, 10:13 PM
What part went over your head? I said that perhaps a Constitutional amendment is needed in order to have insurance cross state lines. How would it occur otherwise?

Peter, you're advocating federal control over states, in practically the same breath you insist it's a state matter. The fact you want it in an amendment doesn't change that. Your own argument go over your head?

roadmaster
07-06-2012, 10:50 PM
Actually, Eisenhower and Nixon attempted to pass a health reform.

Peter1469
07-07-2012, 07:36 AM
Peter, you're advocating federal control over states, in practically the same breath you insist it's a state matter. The fact you want it in an amendment doesn't change that. Your own argument go over your head?


Many people claim that the Constitution is a document suited for 18th century farmers (not you Chris). They advocate for the federal government evolving to adapt to modern times, without considering the constitutional authority to do so. They even claim that the Constitution is a living document.

What I stated above, was that I believe in the area of health insurance, something not on the Founder's radar, has become a national issue and perhaps the federal government should have at least some control so that competition can be pushed up to the federal level, rather than limited to the state level (and many states have relatively little competition in health insurance; in some states, like Louisiana almost every living former Insurance Commissioner is in jail or was in jail for accepting bribes.) Currently the federal government has zero authority in this area (despite J. Roberts' tax penumbra).

But what I did not do is what I describe in the first paragraph above. I searched frantically for something that would respect the Constitution and the intent of the Founders. After years of hard labor I stumbled upon it, the ANSWER:

Who would have thought!

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose amendments to this Constitution, or, on the application of the legislatures of two thirds of the several states, shall call a convention for proposing amendments, which, in either case, shall be valid to all intents and purposes, as part of this Constitution, when ratified by the legislatures of three fourths of the several states, or by conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other mode of ratification may be proposed by the Congress; provided that no amendment which may be made prior to the year one thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any manner affect the first and fourth clauses in the ninth section of the first article; and that no state, without its consent, shall be deprived of its equal suffrage in the Senate.

US Const., Art V

http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/articlev

Those crafty Founders! Listening to liberals, one would have thought that the Constitution was static and stuck in the 18th Century.

So my proposed amendment would simply tack on another enumerated power in Art 1, sec 8.

Unfortunately even proposing this would make liberals go bat-sh!t crazy, because it would force them to admit that the general welfare clause is limited by the enumerated powers.

So my suggestion is dead in the water. It would never pass. But there it is.

Back to addressing Chris directly. I am not a libertarian. I am for government, albeit a government that only acts within established authority. The above is an example of how that authority may grow (or shrink- the process can work in reverse).

bladimz
07-07-2012, 09:48 AM
The problem is that health insurance is a state law matter. And all of the states have different regulations for insurance companies. This is one area that my require a Constitutional Amendment to sync the states at least so that insurance companies can operation across state line and open up competition.Thank you, peter. In order to make the interstate sales idea work, regulations from state to state must be, in effect, federally controlled. Are we talking perhaps about a Federal Insurance Regulatory Commission?

Peter1469
07-07-2012, 10:59 AM
Thank you, peter. In order to make the interstate sales idea work, regulations from state to state must be, in effect, federally controlled. Are we talking perhaps about a Federal Insurance Regulatory Commission?

That can only happen through a Constitutional amendment. I think it would be a wise move. Do I think that it would pass, no.