How Are You Going To Pay Your Bills?

[URF8]

How do you leftists intend to pay the bills for the welfare state? Show me the numbers please. You plan to borrow $1.2 Trillion dollars year after year after year? That can't be sustained and you folks know it. How are you going to pay your bills?

[Captain Obvious]

How do you leftists intend to pay the bills for the welfare state? Show me the numbers please. You plan to borrow $1.2 Trillion dollars year after year after year? That can't be sustained and you folks know it. How are you going to pay your bills?

You will.

That's their plan.

[Peter1469]

Their plan is that they will sit on the street and demand that the gov'ment give them everything. And they will starve to death.

[URF8]

You will.

That's their plan.

If that's the case they are in trouble. There simply is no way to sustain the level of spending the left demands. Besides, ten thousand baby boomers retire every day and insist on medicare and social security for the next twenty five years. There isn't sufficient money on earth to pay all of these bills.

Where are the leftists? Why won't they come out and articulate their ideas? I want to wrestle with them.

[URF8]

Their plan is that they will sit on the street and demand that the gov'ment give them everything. And they will starve to death.

The leftists just don't realize that their policies will result in the death of the established blue political order in this country. Look at what's happening to California as an example. The state is dying.

[Captain Obvious]

If that's the case they are in trouble. There simply is no way to sustain the level of spending the left demands. Besides, ten thousand baby boomers retire every day and insist on medicare and social security for the next twenty five years. There isn't sufficient money on earth to pay all of these bills.

Where are the leftists? Why won't they come out and articulate their ideas? I want to wrestle with them.

Cigar works the day shift, maybe he'll chime in tomorrow.

Make sure you've emptied your bladder before engaging his responses. Might save you a dry cleaning bill.

[URF8]

Cigar works the day shift, maybe he'll chime in tomorrow.

Make sure you've emptied your bladder before engaging his responses. Might save you a dry cleaning bill.

Tell Cigar that Albert Di Salvo wears a colostomy bag...switching bags is no problem.

[Carygrant]

How do you leftists intend to pay the bills for the welfare state? Show me the numbers please. You plan to borrow $1.2 Trillion dollars year after year after year? That can't be sustained and you folks know it. How are you going to pay your bills?


I guess they will conserve energy by blocking out all the hot air and BS escaping from certain areas and separately reduce defence spending by 91.54% .
Get American GIs home to do real man's work instead of subsidising the Body Bag industry.
Erect a fifty foot high electric fence completely round the borders -- North , South, East and West to keep Americans at home and therefore reducing world conflict by 76.84%.
Move Hollywood to Djakarta and dump Fox and CNN -- contracting to BBC
Next question please .

[URF8]

I guess they will conserve energy by blocking out all the hot air and BS escaping from certain areas and separately reduce defence spending by 91.54% .
Get American GIs home to do real man's work instead of subsidising the Body Bag industry.
Erect a fifty foot high electric fence completely round the borders -- North , South, East and West to keep Americans at home and therefore reducing world conflict by 76.84%.
Move Hollywood to Djakarta and dump Fox and CNN -- contracting to BBC
Next question please .

Nice try.

[URF8]

Can anyone name any polity in all of history that has survived a protracted period of financial instability?

[Mainecoons]

The leftists on this board can't even face that decidedly non-partisan and very graphic analysis of the budget by the accountant fellow on the thread I started. I assume most of you watched it, I sure hope you did. Bottom line: The ENTIRE discretionary part of the government INCLUDING DEFENSE could be zeroed out and the budget would STILL be in the red. That's how out of control the entitlement side of things is. In order to close the deficit, taxes would have to be raised FIFTY PERCENT. Of course that assumes no economic contraction in the face of such an increase, which is of course nonsense.

That particularly analysis makes it absolutely plain how STUPID Cigar, GOP and Blad are with their class warfare and soak the rich. The fact is that this budget is so far out of whack you couldn't even pay one year's deficit if you CONFISCATED every nickel over $1 million in wealth. Rescinding ALL the "Bush" tax cuts gets you about 25 percent of the dificit. Just rescinding the "tax cuts to the rich" part won't even pay TEN PERCENT of this deficit.

Naturally, the liberals are going to run and hide from this reality.

Here's the link again. It is short and very much to the point and most assuredly he does not favor either the Republicrats or the Demicans:

http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/EW5IdwltaAc?rel=0

[URF8]

The left's inability to comprehend approaching fiscal disaster is like a man who thinks that the law of gravity doesn't apply to him. External reality will impose its will upon American leftists. They have no one but themselves to blame.

[Peter1469]

Can anyone name any polity in all of history that has survived a protracted period of financial instability?

Define polity; lots of nations have crashed their currencies are are still around today.

[Goldie Locks]

The left's inability to comprehend approaching fiscal disaster is like a man who thinks that the law of gravity doesn't apply to him. External reality will impose its will upon American leftists. They have no one but themselves to blame.

They'll blame Bushy or anyone but themselves and the liberal agenda.

[URF8]

Define polity; lots of nations have crashed their currencies are are still around today.

Regime.

Germany still exists, but the Wiemar Republic was replaced by the Third Reich.

France still exists, but the Bourbon Dynasty was replaced by the Reign of Terror.

China still exists, but the Qing Dynasty was ultimatiely replaced by the Chinese Communist Party.

[Peter1469]

Regime.

Germany still exists, but the Wiemar Republic was replaced by the Third Reich.

France still exists, but the Bourbon Dynasty was replaced by the Reign of Terror.

China still exists, but the Qing Dynasty was ultimatiely replaced by the Chinese Communist Party.

Got it. Understood.

[patrickt]

Their plan is that they will sit on the street and demand that the gov'ment give them everything. And they will starve to death.

Don't be silly. They won't starve to death. The liberals will keep milking the cows until the last one has died and then the liberals will start eating their own. I can see the last supper. "Mr. President, we've eaten the last homeless guy. What do we do now?" "I'm on it, Eric. I've invited Michael Moore to our grand buffet weekend."

[Goldie Locks]

Don't be silly. They won't starve to death. The liberals will keep milking the cows until the last one has died and then the liberals will start eating their own. I can see the last supper. "Mr. President, we've eaten the last homeless guy. What do we do now?" "I'm on it, Eric. I've invited Michael Moore to our grand buffet weekend."

That visual is horrifying...but not as bad as Ubama eating puppies.

[URF8]

I believe that the American left is experiencing what can be called Cognitive Dissonance. This is what David Solway thinks as well. He puts the matter more succinctly than I can:


"...Cognitive dissonance was defined by Leon Festinger, the coiner of the phrase, as the discomfort caused by holding irreconcilable beliefs, although the term has been popularly extended to signify as well the discontinuity between fact and opinion in which people wilfully invest. In When Prophecy Fails (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1617202800/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=pjmedia-20&linkCode=as2&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=1617202800), Festinger pointed out that one of the ways to diminish the sense of cognitive dissonance is to obfuscate or “reduce the importance of those cognitions that are in a dissonant relationship.” This is plainly what is now happening. Moreover, the harbingers of confusion and mystification enjoy wide public support. Festinger noted that if the attempt to disregard the obvious is to be successful, it must “meet with support from either the physical or the social environment.” In the various cases under consideration, since the physical environment actually disconfirms habitual assumptions, it is the social milieu that reinforces the deception and the self-deception. “If more people can be persuaded that the system of belief is correct, then clearly it must, after all, be correct.” In effect, it becomes “less painful to tolerate the dissonance than to discard the belief.”

http://pjmedia.com/blog/cognitive-dissonance/?singlepage=true

Liberals and leftists seem to think they can make the American economy less efficient and competitive and that it will nevertheless produce the excess wealth necessary to achieve their utopian objectives in the realm of social justice.

The evidence is everywhere that their magical thinking is failing, but they refuse to accept the disconnect between their beliefs and external reality. This will be the undoing of the established order in this country. The collapse of infrastructure in California is undeniable, but leftists and liberals here have no remedy. They are like the Roman Senators who denied that Rome was in danger until they saw Barbarian warriors wandering unmolested through the streets of Rome carrying away booty.

[Mainecoons]

BTW, anyone notice how Blat and Cigar hide from threads like this?

:rofl:

[URF8]

BTW, anyone notice how Blat and Cigar hide from threads like this?

:rofl:

I noticed. :)

[Cigar]

How do you leftists intend to pay the bills for the welfare state? Show me the numbers please. You plan to borrow $1.2 Trillion dollars year after year after year? That can't be sustained and you folks know it. How are you going to pay your bills?

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b137/chasc5/Figure84.png

[Mainecoons]

And your point is?

Posting pictures is not participating. Make your point and support it.

BTW, you do realize that Obama's deficits are so large that this entire pie could be tossed and the budget still wouldn't balance because of "entitlements?"

Well you would realize it if you had the balls to watch that analysis done by the accountant.

So, Cigar, how are you going to pay your bills? A fifty percent tax increase?

[Peter1469]

A 50% tax increase might get close to covering the deficit, assuming that static models actually work..., they don't.

[Cigar]

And your point is?

Posting pictures is not participating. Make your point and support it.

BTW, you do realize that Obama's deficits are so large that this entire pie could be tossed and the budget still wouldn't balance because of "entitlements?"

Well you would realize it if you had the balls to watch that analysis done by the accountant.

So, Cigar, how are you going to pay your bills? A fifty percent tax increase?



The day I have a problem paying my bills ... I'll let you know. :wink:

[Peter1469]

The day I have a problem paying my bills ... I'll let you know. :wink:

The topic is the federal budget. So get real, you have a problem paying the bills. We all do.

[patrickt]

The day I have a problem paying my bills ... I'll let you know. :wink:

Sorry, but a socialist should know that our bills are your bills. You don't just pay your bills. Hell, no. Half the households pay no federal income tax. Some citizens pay a absolutely no taxes. Your bills are your bills and our bills are your bills, too, Cigar. And, Cigar, I emt some guys from the homeless shelter who wish you'd buy them better cell phones than the ones you've already bought them.

[Cigar]

The topic is the federal budget. So get real, you have a problem paying the bills. We all do.

Obviously you didn't read what I typed ... I answered the question asked of me.

BTW ... I pay my Bills by charging the appropriate fee for services rendered.

[Captain Obvious]

BTW ... I pay my Bills by charging the appropriate fee for services rendered.

... he said with a grin as he wiped off his chin.

[Cigar]

Sorry, but a socialist should know that our bills are your bills. You don't just pay your bills. Hell, no. Half the households pay no federal income tax. Some citizens pay a absolutely no taxes. Your bills are your bills and our bills are your bills, too, Cigar. And, Cigar, I emt some guys from the homeless shelter who wish you'd buy them better cell phones than the ones you've already bought them.

Then make them pay them federal Taxes ... problem solved.

Simple ... if you've identified the problem ... fix it.

BTW .. if a Homeless person ask you to buy them a Cell Phone ... don't!

[Mainecoons]

The day I have a problem paying my bills ... I'll let you know. :wink:

Try to make a grown up argument, eh?

Let's try again. The deficit is so large that the entire discretionary part of the budget, your pie, could be zeroed out and there would still be a deficit due to entitlements. The deficit is so large that it would require a 50 percent tax increase to close it.

What will you do to pay your bill for your progressivism?

[Cigar]

Try to make a grown up argument, eh?

Let's try again. The deficit is so large that the entire discretionary part of the budget, your pie, could be zeroed out and there would still be a deficit due to entitlements. The deficit is so large that it would require a 50 percent tax increase to close it.

What will you do to pay your bill for your progressivism?

Raise my fees :)

[Mainecoons]

In other words, you can't make an argument or provide any real ideas as to how to pay the bill for your progressive programs.

It's really sad. You've been so reduced here in your arguments that all you have left is juvenile one liners.

[Cigar]

In other words, you can't make an argument or provide any real ideas as to how to pay the bill for your progressive programs.

It's really sad. You've been so reduced here in your arguments that all you have left is juvenile one liners.

Happy to please you ... sport :)

[wingrider]

I think I will just get some Obama money from Obamas stash and pay my bills with it.

[Cigar]

I think I will just get some Obama money from Obamas stash and pay my bills with it.

Sounds like a good idea ... :icon_biggrin:

[Peter1469]

Obviously you didn't read what I typed ... I answered the question asked of me.

BTW ... I pay my Bills by charging the appropriate fee for services rendered.

No- you saw the pie chart and knew what the question referred to, comrade.

[Goldie Locks]

Raise my fees :)

Raise your fees, sure go ahead, no one will have any money to pay you...raise em' up!!! Do you think anything through to it's logical conclusion???...oh that's right you're a lefty, so the answer is NO.

[Mainecoons]

Happy to please you ... sport :)


Believe it or not, it doesn't please me to look at you and realize why we are in this mess--because there are millions and millions out there like you, narcissisistic, mal-educated fools who hide from reality and take all they can get with no thought of the future of the country or the world.

You don't please me, you sadden me. We've gone from the greatest generation to the smallest-minded generation and a 40 percent deficit, which you haven't a clue how to pay for, and Barack Obama are the result.

[Cigar]

Believe it or not, it doesn't please me to look at you and realize why we are in this mess--because there are millions and millions out there like you, narcissisistic, mal-educated fools who hide from reality and take all they can get with no thought of the future of the country or the world.

You don't please me, you sadden me. We've gone from the greatest generation to the smallest-minded generation and a 40 percent deficit, which you haven't a clue how to pay for, and Barack Obama are the result.

Stop your crying ... you only lost an Election to a Black Man :)

[Mainecoons]

No, we lost a country to a bunch of fools like yourself.

[Cigar]

No, we lost a country to a bunch of fools like yourself.



Oh well ... :)

[wingrider]

Stop your crying ... you only lost an Election to a Black Man :)
actually we lost the election to an incompetent community organizer who doesn't have a single clue how to govern a country as diverse as America is.

[Cigar]

actually we lost the election to an incompetent community organizer who doesn't have a single clue how to govern a country as diverse as America is.

... and that made your Candidate ... what? :roflmao:

[wingrider]

... and that made your Candidate ... what? :roflmao: my candidate is Mitt Romney.

I am not fool enough to hire back an idiot and expect a differrent result,
that is the definition of insanity,

[Cigar]

my candidate is Mitt Romney.

I am not fool enough to hire back an idiot and expect a differrent result,
that is the definition of insanity,

... and where does Mitt stand .... toady. :)

[wingrider]

... and where does Mitt stand .... toady. :)
in the winner circle where else?

[Cigar]

in the winner circle where else?

Yea ... care show a link to prove that?

[Mainecoons]

When you tell us how you're going to pay for your ideas??

[Cigar]

When you tell us how you're going to pay for your ideas??

Return the to Clinton Taxes.

[Mainecoons]

Go right ahead. That's $300 billion, genius, most of which comes out of the middle class. And the rest, 700 to 900 billion depending on whose estimate you use?

[wingrider]

Yea ... care show a link to prove that?
wait for it... Nov 6th

[Cigar]

wait for it... Nov 6th

That will be Mitt's last run for Public office.

[Mainecoons]

Go right ahead. That's $300 billion, genius, most of which comes out of the middle class. And the rest, 700 to 900 billion depending on whose estimate you use?

Stick with the topic, Cigar. Would you like a 50 percent tax increase with that crow you're eating once again?

[Cigar]

Stick with the topic, Cigar. Would you like a 50 percent tax increase with that crow you're eating once again?

No but 2 or 3 % won't hurt me. :)

[Mainecoons]

And it won't pay for your ideas either.

NEXT math failure!

[Cigar]

And it won't pay for your ideas either.

NEXT math failure!


Are you saying 10 years of Bush Tax Breaks didn't work?

[Mainecoons]

I'm saying that you can't explain how you're going to pay for your ideas going forward. And you keep proving me right. Thank you.

[URF8]

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b137/chasc5/Figure84.png

C'mon man, articulate your thoughts about how the Blue Model of Govt. can pay its bills over the next ten years?

[URF8]

The day I have a problem paying my bills ... I'll let you know. :wink:

This isn't about you as an individual. The thread is about how the Blue Model of Govt. and Society is going to pay its bills.

How much money will new taxes on those with incomes in excess of $250,000 per year raise? Will this cover the upcoming $1.2 Trillion budget deficit, or paydown/service the almost $16 Trillion National Debt?

[URF8]

Obviously you didn't read what I typed ... I answered the question asked of me.

BTW ... I pay my Bills by charging the appropriate fee for services rendered.

No you didn't answer the question. Instead you posted a visual of HOW the Blue Govt. intends to spend revenue, not about raising revenues.

[URF8]

Then make them pay them federal Taxes ... problem solved.

...

Would you please quantify the numbers referred to in your declarative sentence?

[URF8]

... and where does Mitt stand .... toady. :)

Focus on the subject of this thread please.

[URF8]

Return the to Clinton Taxes.

Good. Now please tell us how much revenue will be raised to pay for how much spending. This is the crux of the issue.

[URF8]

Here are the numbers for fiscal 2012:




Total revenue
$2.627 trillion (requested)
$2.469 trillion (enacted)


Total expenditures
$3.729 trillion (requested)
$3.796 trillion (enacted)


Deficit (http://thepoliticalforums.com/wiki/Government_budget_deficit)
$1.101 trillion (requested)
$1.327 trillion (enacted)


Website
Government Printing Office

[Peter1469]

Believe it or not, it doesn't please me to look at you and realize why we are in this mess--because there are millions and millions out there like you, narcissisistic, mal-educated fools who hide from reality and take all they can get with no thought of the future of the country or the world.

You don't please me, you sadden me. We've gone from the greatest generation to the smallest-minded generation and a 40 percent deficit, which you haven't a clue how to pay for, and Barack Obama are the result.

And so goes civilizations. Those who deflect criticism to a color issue are racists of the most vile sort.....

[URF8]

The inability of the Democrats and other leftists to grasp mathematics and fiscal matters leads to what I call "magical thinking" among them. They think there is no such thing as external reality. That's why external reality is their enemy.