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View Full Version : Former German Leader Calls For a United States of Europe.....



MMC
09-06-2011, 08:27 AM
http://news.yahoo.com/former-german-leader-calls-united-states-europe-152550361.html

BERLIN (Reuters) - Former German chancellor Gerhard Schroeder on Sunday called for the creation of a "United States of Europe," saying the bloc needed a common government to avoid future economic crises.

"The current crisis makes it relentlessly clear that we cannot have a common currency zone without a common fiscal, economic and social policy," Schroeder said.

He added: "We will have to give up national sovereignty."

"From the European Commission, we should make a government which would be supervised by the European Parliament. And that means the United States of Europe.".....snip~

:o "Say What".....maybe we just tell them to take a number as to what state they would like to be. 51 or 55. US of Europe my azz! >:(

Mister D
09-06-2011, 08:31 AM
A civilizational bloc of sorts is probably what is needed but the current form is a bad thing and I think many if not most europeans agree. Some kind of federal system with a great deal of regional autonomy is the best bet.

Mister D
09-06-2011, 08:33 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.

MMC
09-06-2011, 08:46 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D

Mister D
09-06-2011, 08:53 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D


I think that's not actually the suggested name. It's just a description.

MMC
09-06-2011, 08:56 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D


I think that's not actually the suggested name. It's just a description.


Well we don't need libs running around yelling out that shit. Plus you know how MSM is. Then new terminology and half these kids not knowing History. I say we let it be known now. >:D

Mister D
09-06-2011, 09:02 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D


I think that's not actually the suggested name. It's just a description.


Well we don't need libs running around yelling out that shit. Plus you know how MSM is. Then new terminology and half these kids not knowing History. I say we let it be known now. >:D


With the current political and cultural establishment I don't think it's good for Western Civilization but with real leadership and real values it would be a good thing. It will probably remain the "European Union" but with major modifiocations.

MMC
09-06-2011, 09:24 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D


I think that's not actually the suggested name. It's just a description.


Well we don't need libs running around yelling out that shit. Plus you know how MSM is. Then new terminology and half these kids not knowing History. I say we let it be known now. >:D


With the current political and cultural establishment I don't think it's good for Western Civilization but with real leadership and real values it would be a good thing. It will probably remain the "European Union" but with major modifiocations.


Well truthfully I think you are right.....they need to be centralized. I just don't see it happening anytime soon. Wonder how that would affect markets and then that question as to who is going to be the Wolrd's Reserve Currency.

Mister D
09-06-2011, 09:29 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D


I think that's not actually the suggested name. It's just a description.


Well we don't need libs running around yelling out that shit. Plus you know how MSM is. Then new terminology and half these kids not knowing History. I say we let it be known now. >:D


With the current political and cultural establishment I don't think it's good for Western Civilization but with real leadership and real values it would be a good thing. It will probably remain the "European Union" but with major modifiocations.


Well truthfully I think you are right.....they need to be centralized. I just don't see it happening anytime soon. Wonder how that would affect markets and then that question as to who is going to be the Wolrd's Reserve Currency.


Economics and trade isn't my forte but it will take a fundamental change in leadership to get an E.U. I'd like to see.

Conley
09-06-2011, 09:34 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D


:D

Hilarious...

On a serious note, given the EU's failures, is likely that more of a unification will lead to a better result?

I also think it's naive to think you can bring so many varied people and cultures together under one government and expect them all to be loyal on their own. It's not quite the diversity of the former USSR but then they needed force to keep everyone in alignment. I just don't see it working for Europe.

MMC
09-06-2011, 09:38 AM
There would be no way that they could be a Super Power.....as the practically have no Defenses. Basically Nil. >:D

Conley
09-06-2011, 09:43 AM
There would be no way that they could be a Super Power.....as the practically have no Defenses. Basically Nil. >:D


:D

Nah, haven't you heard? They have the United States Military to protect them. That's all they need. ::)

Mister D
09-06-2011, 09:51 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D


:D

Hilarious...

On a serious note, given the EU's failures, is likely that more of a unification will lead to a better result?

I also think it's naive to think you can bring so many varied people and cultures together under one government and expect them all to be loyal on their own. It's not quite the diversity of the former USSR but then they needed force to keep everyone in alignment. I just don't see it working for Europe.


Strengthening the current concept would probably be a bad idea considering how awkward and unpopular it is.

That's why I think some kind of federal system with sunstantial regional autonomy might work. Unification is probably inevitable at some point.

Conley
09-06-2011, 09:58 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D


:D

Hilarious...

On a serious note, given the EU's failures, is likely that more of a unification will lead to a better result?

I also think it's naive to think you can bring so many varied people and cultures together under one government and expect them all to be loyal on their own. It's not quite the diversity of the former USSR but then they needed force to keep everyone in alignment. I just don't see it working for Europe.


Strengthening the current concept would probably be a bad idea considering how awkward and unpopular it is.

That's why I think some kind of federal system with sunstantial regional autonomy might work. Unification is probably inevitable at some point.


Yup, we had exactly that for many years -- a federal system with substantial regional autonomy -- and those were great days for our country. It would be nice if we could get back to that again!

Mister D
09-06-2011, 10:11 AM
I am very sympathetic to the nationalism but I have become more open to the idea of a federal system. Granted, I'm not a resident of europe.


Well I think someone better remind them.....THE FUCKING NAME HAS BEEN TAKEN ALREADY. :D :D ;D

Maybe they can call themselves the CONFEDERATION! >:D


:D

Hilarious...

On a serious note, given the EU's failures, is likely that more of a unification will lead to a better result?

I also think it's naive to think you can bring so many varied people and cultures together under one government and expect them all to be loyal on their own. It's not quite the diversity of the former USSR but then they needed force to keep everyone in alignment. I just don't see it working for Europe.


Strengthening the current concept would probably be a bad idea considering how awkward and unpopular it is.

That's why I think some kind of federal system with sunstantial regional autonomy might work. Unification is probably inevitable at some point.


Yup, we had exactly that for many years -- a federal system with substantial regional autonomy -- and those were great days for our country. It would be nice if we could get back to that again!


Sure would!

Mister D
09-06-2011, 10:12 AM
There would be no way that they could be a Super Power.....as the practically have no Defenses. Basically Nil. >:D


That's another major decision Europeans will have to make. At this point, Europe is irrelevant in certain respects.

MMC
09-06-2011, 10:28 AM
There would be no way that they could be a Super Power.....as the practically have no Defenses. Basically Nil. >:D


That's another major decision Europeans will have to make. At this point, Europe is irrelevant in certain respects.


Well someone needs to tell them they are big boys now. So get their grubby mitts off our wallet. >:(

Mister D
09-06-2011, 10:39 AM
There would be no way that they could be a Super Power.....as the practically have no Defenses. Basically Nil. >:D


That's another major decision Europeans will have to make. At this point, Europe is irrelevant in certain respects.


Well someone needs to tell them they are big boys now. So get their grubby mitts off our wallet. >:(


After two of the worst wars in human history I guess their pacifism is understandable if not realisitic particularly when one acknowledges it has largely been bankrolled by the US. Europeans will have to ask themselves if they truly want to matter. I'm not sure what the answer to that will be.

MMC
09-06-2011, 10:45 AM
There would be no way that they could be a Super Power.....as the practically have no Defenses. Basically Nil. >:D


That's another major decision Europeans will have to make. At this point, Europe is irrelevant in certain respects.


Well someone needs to tell them they are big boys now. So get their grubby mitts off our wallet. >:(


After two of the worst wars in human history I guess their pacifism is understandable if not realisitic particularly when one acknowledges it has largely been bankrolled by the US. Europeans will have to ask themselves if they truly want to matter. I'm not sure what the answer to that will be.


Liberal Elites are in communication with each other no matter what countries they are in. This is where that Citizen of the World philosphy comes in. The NWO.

Mister D
09-06-2011, 10:46 AM
There would be no way that they could be a Super Power.....as the practically have no Defenses. Basically Nil. >:D


That's another major decision Europeans will have to make. At this point, Europe is irrelevant in certain respects.


Well someone needs to tell them they are big boys now. So get their grubby mitts off our wallet. >:(


After two of the worst wars in human history I guess their pacifism is understandable if not realisitic particularly when one acknowledges it has largely been bankrolled by the US. Europeans will have to ask themselves if they truly want to matter. I'm not sure what the answer to that will be.


Liberal Elites are in communication with each other no matter what countries they are in. This is where that Citizen of the World philosphy comes in. The NWO.


To a certain extent, yes, that's true.

Pendragon
09-06-2011, 10:57 AM
You can either fight progress or embrace it.

The world is getting smaller.

Borders are becoming blurred.

Also I can assure you Germany and the rest of Europe are very relevant. Additionally they do not wish to be associated at all with the United States of America given the negative connotations of that name, so rest assured that they will settle on a different moniker.

Mister D
09-06-2011, 11:02 AM
You can either fight progress or embrace it.

The world is getting smaller.

Borders are becoming blurred.

Also I can assure you Germany and the rest of Europe are very relevant. Additionally they do not wish to be associated at all with the United States of America given the negative connotations of that name, so rest assured that they will settle on a different moniker.


That's a non-sequiter.

Yes, the world is getting smaller and most of humanity isn;t particularly pleased.

Europe is irrelevant.

Pendragon
09-06-2011, 11:06 AM
Europe is irrelevant?

You make yourself appear ignorant with statements like that.

Irrelevant how?

Mister D
09-06-2011, 11:09 AM
Europe is irrelevant?

You make yourself appear ignorant with statements like that.

Irrelevant how?


You don't prove negatives, Pen. How does Europe matter? Be specific.

Pendragon
09-06-2011, 11:30 AM
Europe is irrelevant?

You make yourself appear ignorant with statements like that.

Irrelevant how?


You don't prove negatives, Pen. How does Europe matter? Be specific.


Of course you do.

How is Europe irrelevant? Be specific.

How does Europe matter? Oh, I don't know. Let us see. It is the home to hundreds of millions of people, massive economies, it is a continent.

Really?

Mister D
09-06-2011, 11:36 AM
Europe is irrelevant?

You make yourself appear ignorant with statements like that.

Irrelevant how?


You don't prove negatives, Pen. How does Europe matter? Be specific.


Of course you do.

How is Europe irrelevant? Be specific.

How does Europe matter? Oh, I don't know. Let us see. It is the home to hundreds of millions of people, massive economies, it is a continent.

Really?


:D Yes, we know it's a continent albeit one with a shrinking population. That said, how is it relevant? Simply because it exists? You don't know? Neither do I. So there we are. :)

MMC
09-06-2011, 11:42 AM
::) Uhm that would be massive economies that are failing. Not capable of defending themselves and Unable to Win conflicts on their own. Just sayin! Now you know why they want to leach off the rest of the world.

Maybe if they weren't afraid of a little hard work. How many Holidays do they have over there? What it got dark, time to close up shop?

Mister D
09-06-2011, 11:46 AM
Pen, like many American liberals, appears to be under the same spell as far too many Europeans. If only we're really nice and understanding things will work out. :-\ The world laughs at Europe and no one takes their values seriously.

Pendragon
09-06-2011, 11:51 AM
The economies of the European countries are doing far better than we are.

The enjoy a much higher standard of living. You are correct to point out their shorter work weeks. They also have better health care, better social services, cleaner cities, longer life expectancies, less obesity, and are in a hundred other ways vastly superior to this American society.

Compare the debt here, the unemployment, the minimum wage such as it is. Do you really want to argue that America is better off than Europe?

Once our we no longer have the money to pay for our bombs, and that time is fast approaching, the United States will be the one who falls into irrelevancy.

Mister D
09-06-2011, 11:56 AM
The economies of the European countries are doing far better than we are.

The enjoy a much higher standard of living. You are correct to point out their shorter work weeks. They also have better health care, better social services, cleaner cities, longer life expectancies, less obesity, and are in a hundred other ways vastly superior to this American society.

Compare the debt here, the unemployment, the minimum wage such as it is. Do you really want to argue that America is better off than Europe?

Once our we no longer have the money to pay for our bombs, and that time is fast approaching, the United States will be the one who falls into irrelevancy.


No, Europeans do not enjoy a much higher standard of living. That's nonsense. Secondly, why do you have such disdain for your own country. This appears to be common among liberals.

In any case, at least now you realize that no one takes Europe or its new values seriously.

Pendragon
09-06-2011, 12:02 PM
Au contraire it is you who is not taken seriously.

I love the United States of America, I simply know that Europe is still very much relevant and no amount of American bravado and hubris will change that.

If at any point you care to supply some facts to support your assertions then by all means George, let them loose!

Would you like to see the standard of living measures?

Educate thyself, American ignoramus!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_inequality-adjusted_HDI

Mister D
09-06-2011, 12:08 PM
Au contraire it is you who is not taken seriously.

I love the United States of America, I simply know that Europe is still very much relevant and no amount of American bravado and hubris will change that.

If at any point you care to supply some facts to support your assertions then by all means George, let them loose!

Would you like to see the standard of living measures?

Educate thyself, American ignoramus!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_inequality-adjusted_HDI


Not only is this chart irrelevant (much like Europe) the US ranks #12! :roflmao: Hey, if you'd like less inequality perhaps you might want to rethink your position on Latin American migration. Guess what happens when you import millions of uneducated and unskilled poor people.

Secondly, commenting on Europe's irrelevance has nothing to do with the US. On the other hand, I see that it always comes back to how much you hate your own country.

MMC
09-06-2011, 12:27 PM
The economies of the European countries are doing far better than we are.

The enjoy a much higher standard of living. You are correct to point out their shorter work weeks. They also have better health care, better social services, cleaner cities, longer life expectancies, less obesity, and are in a hundred other ways vastly superior to this American society.

Compare the debt here, the unemployment, the minimum wage such as it is. Do you really want to argue that America is better off than Europe?

Once our we no longer have the money to pay for our bombs, and that time is fast approaching, the United States will be the one who falls into irrelevancy.


Thats crazy the UK is into hyper-inflation, all the P.I.G.S. have taken the IMF bailout. The FIBS are next. That leaves Germany who paid off their WWII reparations. Norway and Switzerland. The rest can't even compare. Their economies are doing far better. ??? No our economists need to quit listening to European Economists who are looking for growth everywhere else except in their own countries. Course we're back to that Global Economy thing that just doesnt exist as well. >:(

Juggernaut
09-08-2011, 05:33 AM
Europe has 2 classes, rich and everyone else. The powerbase in Germany and France tend to rule movement talks away against and for the status quo. They can't work our currency issues because they loot the system for themselves while propping up the nationalist structure. What people want is lower taxes and property rights just to name a few but too many cling to gov services. Exactly what the USA is trying to avoid, or at least 80% of us are. Merkel wants lower taxes for Germany, the left wants her gone.

If Germany could shift the nationalist structure then they'd have a chance but as is the only way it could gain momentum would be to unify as one country with Germany as the center. When libs took power, they'd reverse and go back to entitlements, which is why they'd never unify in the first place.