Video argues that the US military is not large enough

[Peter1469]

Video argues that the US military is not large enough (http://dailysignal.com/2015/10/29/is-the-u-s-military-strong-enough-as-we-fight-terrorism-our-military-isnt-what-it-was-in-the-cold-war/)

Brought to you by the Heritage Foundation; our resident warmongers should love the video at the link.

Rational people will have some questions.


It stands to reason then that people should know whether the military we have is up to the task. How big should it be? What are key factors that should shape its size, capabilities, and use? Just how ready is our force to do what it is tasked to do?

This brief video provides answers to these questions and a framework for understanding the current condition of our military and the many challenges confronting it and our nation.

[donttread]

Of course it's not large enough. Some of our very own board members want to take over the world at knifepoint so they can all live "free"

[Tahuyaman]

Of course it's not large enough. Some of our very own board members want to take over the world at knifepoint so they can all live "free"

comments like that are why potentially good threads swerve into irrational insult contests.

[Tahuyaman]

Video argues that the US military is not large enough (http://dailysignal.com/2015/10/29/is-the-u-s-military-strong-enough-as-we-fight-terrorism-our-military-isnt-what-it-was-in-the-cold-war/)

Brought to you by the Heritage Foundation; our resident warmongers should love the video at the link.

Rational people will have some questions.

The video does bring up some valid points. Not just a numbers issue, but one of strength, modernization and combat readiness. Also how future downsizing will be impacting national security and readiness.

In spite of the view of some that if we were less involved overseas we would be safer here at home, that view doesn't reflect reality.

I would like to hear the candid analysis of that video by real military leaders today. What would their view be if they did not need to be concerned about the political fallout?

[Peter1469]

The video does bring up some valid points. Not just a numbers issue, but one of strength, modernization and combat readiness. Also how future downsizing will be impacting national security and readiness.

In spite of the view of some that if we were less involved overseas we would be safer here at home, that view doesn't reflect reality.

I would like to hear the candid analysis of that video by real military leaders today. What would their view be if they did not need to be concerned about the political fallout?

I am not sure we need to be able to fight two full wars at the same time. After our fracking revolution, the importance of the Middle East to the US dropped way low. Despite how frightened many people are, there is really nothing going on in the world today that would require the US to get involved in a full general war, on WWII scale. It is more like the Indian Wars of the 1800s.

[Tahuyaman]

I see your point on the " two war" concept. That should not be used as an excuse to lapse into Carter era type mediocrity.

[Kurmugeon]

We do not have the money for a larger military.

If we brought them all home, we would have more than enough troops for the tasks within our own borders.

Without a Commander-in-Chief who has goals with American Interests foremost, a bigger Military only Hurts our Country.

Without clear goals, and Rules-of-Engagement which allows our troops to defend themselves, and achieve victory, a Bigger Military only provides our enemies with more targets.

We have allot of other things to sort out, before we need a larger Military.

We need a new President First!

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[Tahuyaman]

We do not have the money for a larger military.

If we brought them all home, we would have more than enough troops for the tasks within our own borders.

Without a Commander-in-Chief who has goals with American Interests foremost, a bigger Military only Hurts our Country.

Without clear goals, and Rules-of-Engagement which allows our troops to defend themselves, and achieve victory, a Bigger Military only provides our enemies with more targets.

We have allot of other things to sort out, before we need a larger Military.

We need a new President First!

-

What tasks within our borders should our military conduct? Policing? What?

[Peter1469]

I see your point on the " two war" concept. That should not be used as an excuse to lapse into Carter era type mediocrity.

Agreed. I don't advocate gutting our forces.

[Tahuyaman]

Agreed. I don't advocate gutting our forces.

Some could present a credible argument that "gutting" the military is exactly what's happening.

I believe those people also think that if we have a smaller military presence throughout the world, our enemies will eventually disappear.

Our military should continually be kept up to speed with modern technology.

[Peter1469]

Some could present a credible argument that "gutting" the military is exactly what's happening.

I believe those people also think that if we have a smaller military presence throughout the world, our enemies will eventually disappear.

Our military should continually be kept up to speed with modern technology.

I don't think that what is going on now is "gutting" the military.

But then I don't think we need to pay to maintain a military to fight two major wars at the same time.

Also with the passage of this new budget, the extra cuts won't happen.

[The Xl]

Good Lord

[Peter1469]

Yes? A Question?

[Tahuyaman]

Good Lord


Good lord what?

[The Xl]

Good lord what?

Good Lord at anyone who doesn't think the military is large enough.

[Tahuyaman]

I don't think that what is going on now is "gutting" the military.

But then I don't think we need to pay to maintain a military to fight two major wars at the same time.

Also with the passage of this new budget, the extra cuts won't happen.

Why do you think the cuts won't happen? Defense cuts are usually the only cuts we can count on happening.

I agreed with with you on the two war scenario, but even that could change. Right now we have both Russia and China rattling their saber.

[Kurmugeon]

What tasks within our borders should our military conduct? Policing? What?

First and foremost, border sensor fields, remote cameras, tunneling detection microphones/geophones, and drone deployment, maintenance, and CNC intel ops.

Second, Tactical SWAT teams for response to Drug Cartel heavy armed incursions.

Third, Logistics of tents, food, water, latrines, fencing, and containment security for Illegals being held in remote desert holding camps, for those being gathered and awaiting deportation Transport

Fourth, massive, Deportee Airlift back to countries of origin.

Fifth, truck based prisoner transport from roadside checkpoints to desert camps.

Sixth, Medical personnel&Equipment to treat prisoners, guards, and logistics personel at the remote camps.

Seventh, Taking Mug shots, Biometrics, and personal data base information on prisoners, so we KNOW if they come back again, and can give them several years of harsh, unpaid, hard labor, incarceration before their next deportation.

Eighth, Interrogating Prisoners(without water boarding, unless they're proven armed terrorists) on how they got into the U.S. and making reports to guide efforts to seal the border.

...

Basically all of the same things the Military has been doing in the process of working the Invasion of Kuwait and Later Iraq and Afghanistan. The same military provided things that have been right for those Iraq prisoners, is exactly what should be done with the Invaders coming across our southern border.

Invaders are Invaders, and the Military is good at detecting them, gathering them up, and putting them where they belong!

-

[Tahuyaman]

Good Lord at anyone who doesn't think the military is large enough.

just wondering. Do you have any experience in military affairs, or is your knowledge all based on observations from the outside?

[Tahuyaman]

First and foremost, border sensor fields, remote cameras, tunneling detection microphones/geophones, and drone deployment, maintenance, and CNC intel ops.

Second, Tactical SWAT teams for response to Cartel heavy armed incursions.

Third, Logistics of tents, food, water, latrines, fencing, and containment security for Illegals being held in remote desert holding camps, for those being gathered and awaiting deportation Transport

Fourth, massive, Deportee Airlift back to countries of origin.

Fifth, truck based prisoner transport from roadside checkpoints to desert camps.

Sixth, Medical personnel&Equipment to treat prisoners, guards, and logistics personel at the remote camps.

Seventh, Taking Mug shots, Biometrics, and personal data base information on prisoners, so we KNOW if they come back again, and can give them several years of harsh, unpaid, hard labor, incarceration before their next deportation.

Eighth, Interrogating Prisoners(without water boarding, unless they're proven armed terrorists) on how they got into the U.S. and making reports to guide efforts to seal the border.

...

Basically all of the same things the Military has been doing in the process of working the Invasion of Kuwait and Later Iraq and Afghanistan. The things that right for those prisoners, is exactly what should be done with the Invaders coming across our southern border.

Invaders are Invaders, and the Military is good at detecting them, gathering them up, and putting them where they belong!

-


So, you want the military to take over operations and policing activities which are currently the responsibility of other agencies?

that could be very dangerous.

[Tahuyaman]

There's no way I want to see our military crossing over into policing.

[Peter1469]

Why do you think the cuts won't happen? Defense cuts are usually the only cuts we can count on happening.

I agreed with with you on the two war scenario, but even that could change. Right now we have both Russia and China rattling their saber.

The new budget just passed increases defense spending (http://www.military.com/daily-news/2015/10/27/pentagon-wins-in-budget-deal-with-higher-defense-spending-caps.html).


The deal would boost the spending restrictions on the base defense budget by $25 billion to $548 billion in fiscal 2016 and by $15 billion to $551 billion in fiscal 2017, according to a summary of the legislation (http://docs.house.gov/meetings/RU/RU00/CPRT-114-RU00-D001.pdf). In addition, it would provide some $59 billion for the war budget in each of the next two fiscal years, resulting in an overall defense budget of $607 billion and $610 billion, respectively.

“They should be popping champagne at the Pentagon with this budget deal, which is better to defense than Ryan-Murray & close to Prez request,” tweeted (https://twitter.com/MEaglen) Mackenzie Eaglen, a national-security analyst at the American Enterprise Institute in Washington, D.C.

[The Xl]

just wondering. Do you have any experience in military affairs, or is your knowledge all based on observations from the outside?

I have access to information and the ability to think rationally.

[Kurmugeon]

So, you want the military to take over operations and policing activities which are currently the responsibility of other agencies?

that could be very dangerous.

Our current path of allowing 10s of Millions of Illegals of unknown background and terrorism potential is DANGEROUS!

The Dept of Homeland security is a boondogle and farce, largely created to allow critical functions of home defense to be placed under the control of new Democratic Party appointed officials, who made sure than the job did NOT get done, unless it was to watch for hordes of non-existence "White Veteran Extremists" while ignoring waves of Illegal Immigrants.

DHS should be dismantled, and its functions placed under the National Guard, FBI and INS.

-

[Kurmugeon]

There's no way I want to see our military crossing over into policing.

What is happening on the Southern Border is NOT police work.

Police work is stopping Prostitution, sweat shops, and child exploitation.

What is happening on our Southern Border is an Invasion of Militant, Anti-American, La Raza, Atzlan, Drug Cartel, Mules, Dealers, Street Enforcers, Squatters, Insurgents and Saboteurs.

It takes a Military to stop an Invasion!

-

[donttread]

comments like that are why potentially good threads swerve into irrational insult contests.

Any thread talking about people who want to increase our military is to quote the Eagles "already gone"

[donttread]

Why do you think the cuts won't happen? Defense cuts are usually the only cuts we can count on happening.

I agreed with with you on the two war scenario, but even that could change. Right now we have both Russia and China rattling their saber.

We are way beyond defense, any cuts would be to offense

[Peter1469]

We are way beyond defense, any cuts would be to offense

Not really.

The US isn't down-sizing to your idea of a right-sized military.

[Tahuyaman]

Originally Posted by Tahuyaman just wondering. Do you have any experience in military affairs, or is your knowledge all based on observations from the outside




I have access to information and the ability to think rationally.

im just asking a valid question so I can view your comments based on the experience used when forming them.

So, do you have any experience in the military arena?

[Tahuyaman]

What is happening on the Southern Border is NOT police work.

Police work is stopping Prostitution, sweat shops, and child exploitation.

What is happening on our Southern Border is an Invasion of Militant, Anti-American, La Raza, Atzlan, Drug Cartel, Mules, Dealers, Street Enforcers, Squatters, Insurgents and Saboteurs.

It takes a Military to stop an Invasion!

-

we don't need to put the military in charge of domestic law enforcement. Even immigration law.

[Peter1469]

[COLOR=#333333]




im just asking a valid question so I can view your comments based on the experience used when forming them.

So, do you have any experience in the military arena?

He is a younger guy. No military experience.

[Tahuyaman]

He is a younger guy. No military experience.

OK, I'll consider that when I read his comments. A person's experience should always be a factor in how comments are viewed.

[Peter1469]

OK, I'll consider that when I read his comments. A person's experience should always be a factor in how comments are viewed.

Civilians are in charge of the military. I wouldn't discount them out of hand.

Of course they have no clue about the day to day life of a Soldier (or semen). :shocked:

[donttread]

Not really.

The US isn't down-sizing to your idea of a right-sized military.

So what are they down sizing to?

[Peter1469]

So what are they down sizing to?

I think the downsizing just stopped.

So what we are currently at.

[donttread]

Some could present a credible argument that "gutting" the military is exactly what's happening.

I believe those people also think that if we have a smaller military presence throughout the world, our enemies will eventually disappear.

Our military should continually be kept up to speed with modern technology.


Why none of the countries you fear so much spend anything close to what we do?

[Tahuyaman]

Why none of the countries you fear so much spend anything close to what we do?


I don't fear anyone, but the spending of other countries is not relevant to our military budget. They operate under very different economic and political situations.

Im still wondering where your "fear" comment originated

[maineman]

I don't fear anyone, but the spending of other countries is not relevant to our military budget. They operate under very different economic and political situations.

Im still wondering where your "fear" comment originated

military budgets are certainly one measure to compare military capabilities. We have the largest military budget on the planet AND we have the most capable military in the solar system.

[donttread]

I don't fear anyone, but the spending of other countries is not relevant to our military budget. They operate under very different economic and political situations.

Im still wondering where your "fear" comment originated

You add to the most expensive military in the world either because you fear someone or someone needs to fear you

[Tahuyaman]

You add to the most expensive military in the world either because you fear someone or someone needs to fear you


Thats a way to divert the discussion.

[Tahuyaman]

You add to the most expensive military in the world either because you fear someone or someone needs to fear you


Or, national security is not cheap.

[The Xl]

[COLOR=#333333]




im just asking a valid question so I can view your comments based on the experience used when forming them.

So, do you have any experience in the military arena?

None at all. Doesn't change the fact that I am correct.

[Tahuyaman]

None at all. Doesn't change the fact that I am correct.

your opinions are just that.... Opinions.

[Kurmugeon]

military budgets are certainly one measure to compare military capabilities. We have the largest military budget on the planet AND we have the most capable military in the solar system.

Have you met the Martian Dragoouls?

Are you sure?

-

[The Xl]

your opinions are just that.... Opinions.
You could say that about nearly everything, and certainly everything on this board and boards like this.

[Tahuyaman]

Just because it's your opinion, that doesn't mean it's correct.

[Captain Obvious]

You could say that about nearly everything, and certainly everything on this board and boards like this.

This guy's a knob that talks a lot but never says anything.

[Tahuyaman]

This guy's a knob that talks a lot but never says anything.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tb2Ct3yyB4g

[Tahuyaman]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dpWmlRNfLck

[donttread]

Thats a way to divert the discussion.

Nope , it's true. Only two reasons to increase military spending when you already outspend the next two countries combined.
1) You are afraid you've finally pissed enough of them off to gang up and attack
2) For more imperialism

[donttread]

Or, national security is not cheap.


LMFAO The actions of our military and CIA over the past 40 years have endangered national security not protected it!

[Tahuyaman]

Nope , it's true. Only two reasons to increase military spending when you already outspend the next two countries combined.
1) You are afraid you've finally pissed enough of them off to gang up and attack
2) For more imperialism

our costs aren't relative to what other nations spend.

[Tahuyaman]

LMFAO The actions of our military and CIA over the past 40 years have endangered national security not protected it!

do you believe we would be more secure by being an isolationist nation?

[Peter1469]

The US will never find out.

[donttread]

do you believe we would be more secure by being an isolationist nation?

Non interventionist? Absolutely. No "Charlie Wilson's war, no 9/11" for one small example. Less dependence on foreign oil for another

[Tahuyaman]

Non interventionist? Absolutely. No "Charlie Wilson's war, no 9/11" for one small example. Less dependence on foreign oil for another


So, you don't favor isolationist principles?

[Tahuyaman]

The US will never find out.


Should we become isolationists as some advocate?

[Kurmugeon]

Should we become isolationists as some advocate?

Until we have a thriving economy, and a balanced budget, so we have a military we can afford to upkeep, supply, and long term care for our wounded?

Until we have a Commander-in-Chief Leader who adheres to the Constitution, Congressional Passed Law, and his Oath of Office?

Absolutely!

Long term, IF we can solve these problems... No.

-

[Peter1469]

Should we become isolationists as some advocate?

Of course not.

[Tahuyaman]

Until we have a thriving economy, and a balanced budget, so we have a military we can afford to upkeep, supply, and long term care for our wounded?

Until we have a Commander-in-Chief Leader who adheres to the Constitution, Congressional Passed Law, and his Oath of Office?

Absolutely!

Long term, IF we can solve these problems... No.

-


How could we have a thriving and growing economy while adhering to isolationist principles?

[Kurmugeon]

How could we have a thriving and growing economy while adhering to isolationist principles?

There is a huge difference between Military "Intervention"/adventurism, and blocking all foreign trade.

China would be described as Isolationist as what you are claiming what I am advocating.

China is not out in the middle east toppling Governments and Bombing for the Muslim Brotherhood/Iran in the name of spreading its preferred and self-chosen form of Government. America HAS been doing just that, under Obama.

China is doing quite well on the Industrial and Economic Stage. There are now more Chinese Billionaires than American Billionaires. http://money.cnn.com/2015/10/15/investing/china-us-billionaires/

China Spends much less of its GDP on its Military than the United States. China has no where near our level of deficit spending.

[Tahuyaman]

There is a huge difference between Military "Intervention"/adventurism, and blocking all foreign trade.

China would be described as Isolationist as what you are claiming what I am advocating....


I did not claim that you are an isolationist. You did.

[Kurmugeon]

I did not claim that you are an isolationist. You did.

Ok, fair enough.

Let's be clear. I want the U.S. to stop increases in ANY form of government spending, including the military.

I believe that our current distribution of military spending category priorities will have to change, and overall spending even decrease slightly, given fiscal realities.

At the same time, I believe our social program spending will have to change, and decrease dramatically! All Foreign Aid should halt immediately!

I believe we should pull ALL of our troops back to U.S. soil from ALL foreign bases including Japan, Germany, England, Iraq, Afghanistan, Kuwait...

It costs allot less to maintain and supply our troops at home, than it does when they are abroad.

When we re-allocate our Military spending, much more will need to be spent on Surveillance drones and remote sensor fields, and have them training/ops deployed on our southern border.

We will need to re-allocate a much larger percentage of our Military spending for the care of our wounded vets.

We will need to re-allocate a much larger percentage of our Military spending to replace consumables/vehicles used up in the last two decades of Middle Eastern Conflict.

We need to revoke the "Use of Force" authorization which was granted to Bush after 911, and is being grossly misused by Obama.

We need to STOP bombing to generate waves of Muslim Refugees!

The American Military is not BAD, but it has been twisted to anti-American and evil purposes.

Later, under new leadership, slowly, as budgets allow, America can resume some of its World Wide Military Responsibilities.

We need a complete Military Reset!


P.S. America need not, and should not have been brought to this low state, but it was allowed to happen, because American Politics are so twisted by the Race Card, we cannot bring ourselves to Limit a lawless Black President!

-

[donttread]

So, you don't favor isolationist principles?

You might consider them isolationist, I call them non - interventventionist. Bring the troops home, stop imperializing that kind of thing

[donttread]

Should we become isolationists as some advocate?

We should become non-interventionist. The majority of our post WW 2 interventions have lead to death, regression and hatred

[donttread]

How could we have a thriving and growing economy while adhering to isolationist principles?

Produce and the stuff we are now buying or stealing from elsewhere

[Tahuyaman]

You might consider them isolationist, I call them non - interventventionist. Bring the troops home, stop imperializing that kind of thing


Once again. Do you favor isolationist principles? Yes, no, maybe, sometimes?

[Tahuyaman]

Produce and the stuff we are now buying or stealing from elsewhere

You believe that our economy could thrive and grow by excluding or shutting out the rest of the world?

[Tahuyaman]

Tahuyaman
Should we become isolationists as some advocate?



We should become non-interventionist. The majority of our post WW 2 interventions have lead to death, regression and hatred

is there a reason you're avoiding answering that specific question?

[donttread]

The talking heads and " wall street wizzards" would have you believe in complex fiscal theories and explanations as to why things have to be the way they are and how growth is infinite.
They even argue among themselves about these theories. But underneath all the fiat money, the virtual elimination of the prudent reserve clause, the fed, quantitative easing, the "benefits of unsecured national debt" etc.
But underneath all that there is a real true economy , am economy based upon goods and services with tangible value. Seven billion people producing goods and services for seven billion people. And that economy does in fact have winners and losers and while growable is far from infinite.