Terrorism: How do we stop it

[Common]

With the latest attack on France and threats, its natural for many to be dead set against refugee migration. Its just as natural for some to defend them.

I understand both sides of this issue, Ive been on both sides in the sense for the longest time I believed it was just a few and most were victims. Now I sit on the side of theres too damn many of them and enough is enough.

I read posts from those that continuously blame the USA for the terrorism in the middle east. ok we certainly exacerbated it with the first and second invasion of iraq and then afghanistan but that was then this is now. We cant change history we have to deal with today. HOW DO WE FIX THIS PROBLEM. Heres what we do know, negotiations with terrorists wont work and reasoning with them is an impossiblity. Whats left ?

Are we obligated to take thousands up thousands of refugees, I say emphatically NO and we should not. We cant identify good ones from bad muslims. 911 should have taught us that. The perpetrators of 911 trained for it in Flight Schools in florida.

Europe is a mess of their own making for taking refugees and they have put their own citizens not only at risk for violence but for Violent Crime, rape murder, robbery. Should we do the same thing ? HELL NO.

The UN is made up of the lionshare of countries that will never take a refugee but are insisting Europe and the USA do ? Screw the UN.

We need to put heads together to fix this problem, by containing it or defeating it. Not allowing it to spread even further around the world.

Im tired of hearing the old song and dance its our Fault that the USA did this. Ok im not arguing that point except to say I dont want to hear it anymore. What I want to hear is, ok we have a terrorist problem today in 2015 how do we fix it. Fixing it is not kissing their ass and allowing them to invade other countries by the hundreds of thousands.

[SemiteArt]

There is nothing to solve terrorism problem for certain. Anyone who want to commit a crime can do that easily. We should not allow any Muslims in non-Muslim countries and we should ban Islam religion. This is the only way we will stop asking questions when a terrorism action happen in a non-Muslim country. Both side is bored of this theater.

[Crepitus]

Gonna hafta get of the western aversion to collateral damage. It's the only way.

[Common]

I wish there was a peaceful solution to all this. Us having boots in the middle east hasnt solved a thing. I think we need to isolate and contain them not allow them to spread all over the world and make it worse

[Gypsy]

There will always be someone that hates someone for some reason. We haven't been able to stop hate groups in this country. The Klan is still around and they've morphed into the Aryan nation. Al Queda morphed into ISIS.
Terrorism can be interrupted. Individual acts may be stopped But as long as there is hate, travel and technology in this world, terrorism cannot be stopped.

[Common]

There will always be someone that hates someone for some reason. We haven't been able to stop hate groups in this country. The Klan is still around and they've morphed into the Aryan nation. Al Queda morphed into ISIS.
Terrorism can be interrupted. Individual acts may be stopped But as long as there is hate, travel and technology in this world, terrorism cannot be stopped.

I agree gypsy but while we change the mentality of klan members we can easily contain them. No such luck with thousands of refugees.

It goes back to ok we can have americans do it SO WHAT that doesnt mean we should allow arabs to do it too or make it more of a risk of happening.

[Common Sense]

What's difficult about fighting terrorism is that sometimes the more heavy handed we are, the more terrorists we create.

There is no easy solution. What would help is help some of these countries develop to the point that they become a more consumer based society. It sounds silly, but I'd rather people become materialistic and wanting stuff, rather than being religious zealots wanting to blow people up.

The west would have been better off dropping iPads and designer jeans rather than bombs.

[Common]

What's difficult about fighting terrorism is that sometimes the more heavy handed we are, the more terrorists we create.

There is no easy solution. What would help is help some of these countries develop to the point that they become a more consumer based society. It sounds silly, but I'd rather people become materialistic and wanting stuff, rather than being religious zealots wanting to blow people up.

The west would have been better off dropping iPads and designer jeans rather than bombs.

I dont see that working one bit just costing us billions.

[Gypsy]

One of my best friends is a muslim. He's probably not a good candidate for ISIS because he served with the 81st at Bragg, eats pork and isn't hoping for virgins in the afterlife. He's just as outraged over the Paris murders as any other American.

My point being, not all muslims are radicalized, that includes the refugees. If one member here is correct that there are 20 known training camps in the US, there are probably more than 20. Our biggest risk is from US citizens that are sympathetic to ISIS.

[Common]

One of my best friends is a muslim. He's probably not a good candidate for ISIS because he served with the 81st at Bragg, eats pork and isn't hoping for virgins in the afterlife. He's just as outraged over the Paris murders as any other American.

My point being, not all muslims are radicalized, that includes the refugees. If one member here is correct that there are 20 known training camps in the US, there are probably more than 20. Our biggest risk is from US citizens that are sympathetic to ISIS.

Still comes right back to this simple statement. You do not ADD to the risk because a risk already exists

[Common Sense]

I dont see that working one bit just costing us billions.

How has the bombing been working?

My post was hyperbole, I don't advocate actually dropping iPads. My point is that economically successful societies are less prone to terrorism.

It's easy to recruit someone with no job prospects who's family was killed by an airstrike.

[Matty]

How has the bombing been working?

My post was hyperbole, I don't advocate actually dropping iPads. My point is that economically successful societies are less prone to terrorism.

It's easy to recruit someone with no job prospects who's family was killed by an airstrike.



Better get your memo off to France. I think Hollande has a pair and has declared war.

[Gypsy]

I just feel that refusing all because of the actions of some goes against who we are. We have always opened our doors to the persecuted. That is what has made this country what it is.

[Matty]

I just feel that refusing all because of the actions of some goes against who we are. We have always opened our doors to the persecuted. That is what has made this country what it is.



I wonder why Obama denies refugee status to ME Christians but will take all the Muslims?



http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/09/30/iraqi-christians-denied-asylum-in-us-facing-looming-expulsion/




you realize that soon there will be no Christians left alive in the ME? Because they are being slaughtered like dogs? I do not blame Americans one bit for being upset. Do you trust Obama's judgement? I do not.

[suds00]

the west has to identify them.find a way to isolate them.and then strike.it's a daunting task.this is not warfare as we know it.something must work.

[Gypsy]

I wonder why Obama denies refugee status to ME Christians but will take all the Muslims?



http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/09/30/iraqi-christians-denied-asylum-in-us-facing-looming-expulsion/




you realize that soon there will be no Christians left alive in the ME? Because they are being slaughtered like dogs? I do not blame Americans one bit for being upset. Do you trust Obama's judgement? I do not.

Fox didn't provide a link to this claim. Do you know of one?

[Matty]

Fox didn't provide a link to this claim. Do you know of one?


Look up Holly McKay, the author.

[Gypsy]

Look up Holly McKay, the author.

Nah. If you want to provide it, I will read it.

[The Xl]

Gonna hafta get of the western aversion to collateral damage. It's the only way.

Collateral damage literally makes the problem worse. It breeds more terrorists. The way we see the France incident, they see us firebombing hospitals the same way. It compels many to take up arms, and rightfully so.

We need to get out of the Middle East for good, period. Considering the situation, we should also not accept refugees.

[The Xl]

I wish there was a peaceful solution to all this. Us having boots in the middle east hasnt solved a thing. I think we need to isolate and contain them not allow them to spread all over the world and make it worse

There is a peaceful solution, it's called go the fuck home. Our intervention never works, it creates more problems, Isis exists at this level because of what the US did to Iraq, Syria, and Libya, it has also driven up recruits by slaying innocents over there. Just leave, problem solved. Let Russia and Europe figure out what to do with Isis.

[Matty]

Nah. If you want to provide it, I will read it.



Lol. Or not. News organizations do not provide links. They just tell you who wrote the article. So there you go. The question still stands though.

[Gypsy]

Maybe your news sources don't.

[ThaiBoxer]

Stop waging war on their countries and interfering in their political affairs. It's our fault all of this is happening. American foreign policy is stupid

[Matty]

Maybe your news sources don't.


Show me!

[Gypsy]

It's not hard. Go to any source that isn't Fox.

[Cigar]

Pack out Sh!t and come home ...

Let all the Politicians and their Families fight the Wars in the Sand.

[Tahuyaman]

What's difficult about fighting terrorism is that sometimes the more heavy handed we are, the more terrorists we create.

There is no easy solution. What would help is help some of these countries develop to the point that they become a more consumer based society. It sounds silly, but I'd rather people become materialistic and wanting stuff, rather than being religious zealots wanting to blow people up.

The west would have been better off dropping iPads and designer jeans rather than bombs.

this is an example of the mentality which assures Islamic terrorism will continue to grow.

[Common Sense]

this is an example of the mentality which assures Islamic terrorism will continue to grow.

...because bombing them and creating more every day has been working so darned well.

[Tahuyaman]

the west has to identify them.find a way to isolate them.and then strike.it's a daunting task.this is not warfare as we know it.something must work.

the only solution is to kill them in such numbers that they no longer have the ability to recruit new members.

[Tahuyaman]

...because bombing them and creating more every day has been working so darned well.

Obama's strategy of using a tack hammer to drive a spike is not working.

your non solution type solution creates more. In fact your solution assists them.

[Private Pickle]

...because bombing them and creating more every day has been working so darned well.

When other countries start doing it regularly it won't matter.

[Common Sense]

Obama's strategy of using a tack hammer to drive a spike is not working.

Let me guess, you'd like to carpet bomb them?

[The Sage of Main Street]

Gonna hafta get of the western aversion to collateral damage. It's the only way. It shouldn't be called "collateral," it should be called "extra credit." Did we care about that in World War II? A war we won, by the way.

[Tahuyaman]

Let me guess, you'd like to carpet bomb them?


First, there's no recognized military term as " carpet bombing". That's a media creation.

My solution is to kill as many as humanly possible in as short of a time as humanly possible. Demonstrate to their recruiting pool that they will die a violent death very quickly upon joining their ranks.



Period.

[Tahuyaman]

The strategy of telling these terrorists when and where we will drop a couple of bombs is not going to accomplish anything.

Telling them that we will not do certain things when engaging them is not working, nor can it work

[Common Sense]

First, there's no recognized military term as " carpet bombing". That's a media creation.

My my solution is to kill as many as humanly possible in as short of a time as humanly possible. Demonstrate to their recruiting pool that they will die a violent death very quickly upon joining their ranks.

Period.

The Dictionary of Military Terms disagrees with you.

https://books.google.ca/books?id=WA3SBgAAQBAJ&pg=PA40&lpg=PA40&dq=military+terms+carpet+bombing&source=bl&ots=9EM2rTKvjz&sig=_9LdK2uFhnD4-jJeqH2MSstJfDg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CFUQ6AEwDWoVChMI64zts5GYyQIVwV0eCh3YCw_k#v=on epage&q=military%20terms%20carpet%20bombing&f=false

How are you going to kill as many as possible without creating more terrorists?

[Private Pickle]

First, there's no recognized military term as " carpet bombing". That's a media creation.

My solution is to kill as many as humanly possible in as short of a time as humanly possible. Demonstrate to their recruiting pool that they will die a violent death very quickly upon joining their ranks.



Period.

Right. The military called it "Obliteration Bombing".

[Tahuyaman]

The Dictionary of Military Terms disagrees with you.

https://books.google.ca/books?id=WA3SBgAAQBAJ&pg=PA40&lpg=PA40&dq=military+terms+carpet+bombing&source=bl&ots=9EM2rTKvjz&sig=_9LdK2uFhnD4-jJeqH2MSstJfDg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CFUQ6AEwDWoVChMI64zts5GYyQIVwV0eCh3YCw_k#v=on epage&q=military terms carpet bombing&f=false

How are you going to kill as many as possible without creating more terrorists?

you aren't going to be able to kill a significant number of Muslim terrorists by bombing them. You are going to need to use ground forces to go to the places they live and kill as many as humanly possible.

Thats the only solution. If you are not willing to do that, you are going to need to accept the the terrorist acts will continue.

[Tahuyaman]

Right. The military called it "Obliteration Bombing".


The term "carpet bombing" was not coined or created by the military. It was a creation of the media and people who know nothing about military doctrine.

[Common Sense]

you aren't going to be able to kill a significant number of Muslim terrorists by bombing them. You are going to need to use ground forces to go to the places they live and kill as many as humanly possible.

Thats the only solution. If you are not willing to do that, you are going to need to accept the the terrorist acts will continue.

So full scale ground invasion of ISIS held territory is what you advocate?

How do you curtail the extremism that might help foster in Muslims outside of the Levant?

[Tahuyaman]

How are you going to kill as many as possible without creating more terrorists?

Apologizing and justifying Muslim terrorism isn't going to help eradicate it. Trying to persuade them that we want to include them into our society isn't going to stop them.

[Common Sense]

The term "carpet bombing" was not coined or created by the military. It was a creation of the media and people who know nothing about military doctrine.

Yet there it is in the DoD Dictionary of Military Terms.

http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDIQFjAEahUKEwiPusGYlZjJAhXLFx4KHd8eB44&url=http%3A%2F%2Fjitc.fhu.disa.mil%2Fjitc_dri%2Fpd fs%2Fjp1_02.pdf&usg=AFQjCNFn4WLAzg7BG08Zz8n1E2KFSe_mfA&sig2=Gtwjuvrrwpj1q7NTs1JuEg

[Common Sense]

Apologizing and justifying Muslim terrorism isn't going to help eradicate it. Trying to persuade them that we want to include them into our society isn't going to stop them.

But bombing and invading their fellow Muslims will?

Again, how has that been working out?

[Tahuyaman]

So full scale ground invasion of ISIS held territory is what you advocate?

How do you curtail the extremism that might help foster in Muslims outside of the Levant?

I'm telling you that a full scale military invasion and killing as many of them as humanly possible is the only solution.

If you are not willing to do that, you will need to accept Islamic terrorism as a fact of life forever.

[Common Sense]

I'm telling you that a full scale military invasion a d killing as many of them as humanly possible is the only solution.

If you are not willing to do that, you will need to accept Islamic terrism as a fact of life forever.

...but you can't see how that might just create more extremists?

[Tahuyaman]

But bombing and invading their fellow Muslims will?

Again, how has that been working out?


We haven't ever tried to solve the problem. We keep doing it your stupid way.

[Common Sense]

We haven't ever tried to solve the problem. We keep doing it your stupid way.

Um, actually we keep doing it your stupid way.

[Tahuyaman]

...but you can't see how that might just create more extremists?

They can't create more if they are dead.

Akmed the the dead terrorist is a fictional character.

[Tahuyaman]

Um, actually we keep doing it your stupid way.


Weve never tried it. We keep doing it your way.

give me your solution. Reason with them? Try education, understanding and tolerance?

[Common Sense]

They can't create more if they are dead.

Akmed the the dead terrorist is a fictional character.

Again, what about the Muslims who are radicalized outside of the Levant (or wherever you plan on invading)? The Muslims in Yemen, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Lebanon, England, Germany, The US who see these invasions and bombings as unjustified and become radicalized?

You do understand that the more terrorists you kill and the collateral damage that is associated, typically does create more radicals, do you not?

[Common Sense]

Weve never tried it. We keep doing it your way.

Really? We dropped iPads and jeans on Syria while trying to improve its economy?

[Tahuyaman]

Maybe a campfire and singing kum-ba-ya?

[Common Sense]

Maybe a campfire and singing kum-ba-ya?

That's hyperbole.

Look, I think we have the same goals. To eradicate terrorism and extremists.

We just might have different approaches. None of which include signing campfire songs.

[Cletus]

The only way to end terrorism is to make those engaging in the activity experience pain beyond anything they thought possible. You don't do this by attacking broad targets, you do it by being very specific.

If Achmed engages in an act of terrorism, as soon as he is identified, you find and kill Achmed's mother, father, sisters, brothers, wife children, dog, goats... anyone and anything he has ever cared about. You do this BEFORE you kill Achmed, himself. You leave his neighbors alone. You don't destroy his village. You don't invade his country. You retaliate against him and him alone.

Do this a few times and it will soon become clear to wannabe terrorists that they are going to lose far more than they can ever gain by their actions.

[Common Sense]

The only way to end terrorism is to make those engaging in the activity experience pain beyond anything they thought possible. You don't do this by attacking broad targets, you do it by being very specific.

If Achmed engages in an act of terrorism, as soon as he is identified, you find and kill Achmed's mother, father, sisters, brothers, wife children, dog, goats... anyone and anything he has ever cared about. You do this BEFORE you kill Achmed, himself. You leave his neighbors alone. You don't destroy his village. You don't invade his country. You retaliate against him and him alone.

Do this a few times and it will soon become clear to wannabe terrorists that they are going to lose far more than they can ever gain by their actions.

You kill women and children? What happens when we loose the moral high ground?

[Chloe]

The only way to end terrorism is to make those engaging in the activity experience pain beyond anything they thought possible. You don't do this by attacking broad targets, you do it by being very specific.

If Achmed engages in an act of terrorism, as soon as he is identified, you find and kill Achmed's mother, father, sisters, brothers, wife children, dog, goats... anyone and anything he has ever cared about. You do this BEFORE you kill Achmed, himself. You leave his neighbors alone. You don't destroy his village. You don't invade his country. You retaliate against him and him alone.

Do this a few times and it will soon become clear to wannabe terrorists that they are going to lose far more than they can ever gain by their actions.

If a foreign power came to your hometown and killed the family and friends of an American soldier for fighting for a cause that you agreed with would it infuriate you to the point of rage or would it make you change your point of view in favor of that foreign power because of the fear? You'd be totally pissed and would want revenge.

[Cletus]

You kill women and children? What happens when we loose the moral high ground?

You asked how to stop terrorism. I told you how.

The only way to do it is to make it too painful to engage in it.

What makes you think that would be surrendering the "moral high ground" or that doing so would even be relevant?

[nathanbforrest45]

How has the bombing been working?

My post was hyperbole, I don't advocate actually dropping iPads. My point is that economically successful societies are less prone to terrorism.

It's easy to recruit someone with no job prospects who's family was killed by an airstrike.


Yes, but how do you deal with a culture that is not materialistic in any meaningful way. They are extremely religious and fanatical. They are fighting against the very thing you think would put a stop to terrorism. Westernizing them. It won't work.

What I see is simply total annihilation of either us or them, and I think its going to be us.

[The Xl]

One side wants to continue the policies that created ISIS. The other side wants to let refugees in at a large bulk largely unscreened.

Bunch of dolts. The country is screwed.

[The Xl]

You asked how to stop terrorism. I told you how.

The only way to do it is to make it too painful to engage in it.

What makes you think that would be surrendering the "moral high ground" or that doing so would even be relevant?

Go that far and you'll have the majority of Muslims ready to wage war, rightfully so, and a decent amount of non Muslim suppoters. You be created thousands of terrorists by the second.

Good luck.

[The Xl]

If a foreign power came to your hometown and killed the family and friends of an American soldier for fighting for a cause that you agreed with would it infuriate you to the point of rage or would it make you change your point of view in favor of that foreign power because of the fear? You'd be totally pissed and would want revenge.

Speaking logic and sense to these people is a waste of time.

[nathanbforrest45]

So full scale ground invasion of ISIS held territory is what you advocate?

How do you curtail the extremism that might help foster in Muslims outside of the Levant?


I think we should buy them all lollipops and puppy dogs. Think that will work?

[Common Sense]

I think we should buy them all lollipops and puppy dogs. Think that will work?

More retarded hyperbole.

[Private Pickle]

The term "carpet bombing" was not coined or created by the military. It was a creation of the media and people who know nothing about military doctrine.

Right. The military called it "Obliteration Bombing".

[Private Pickle]

If a foreign power came to your hometown and killed the family and friends of an American soldier for fighting for a cause that you agreed with would it infuriate you to the point of rage or would it make you change your point of view in favor of that foreign power because of the fear? You'd be totally pissed and would want revenge.

Once they targeted civilians its on. And if you don't want your family and friends to be bombed, don't house terrorists...

[Chloe]

Once they targeted civilians its on. And if you don't want your family and friends to be bombed, don't house terrorists...

Thats not the point

[The Xl]

Once they targeted civilians its on. And if you don't want your family and friends to be bombed, don't house terrorists...
What we do is barely any different. It's all semantics.

[nathanbforrest45]

But bombing and invading their fellow Muslims will?

Again, how has that been working out?

We have been quite half assed about our invasions to be honest. An invasion should not be a simple slap on the wrist. It should be total and complete devastation that if it does not break their will it will certainly destroy any ability to continue waging war. If ISIS is a renegade group that does not mirror Muslim goals then other Muslims will turn against them rather than see their homelands destroyed. Or they will attempt to flee if they are the cowards I believe them to be. Either way you get them out of the way and kill anyone who is left. God told the Israelites to destroy their enemy, kill every last living creature including the beast of the field, salt the fields so nothing would grow and completely eliminate them. The Israelites did not do this and so we have the problems we have today. Unless we finish the job given the Israelites we will become strangers in our own lands and will be studying Arabic.

[Common Sense]

Oh lord...

[nathanbforrest45]

You kill women and children? What happens when we loose the moral high ground?


We survive and they don't. What good is the moral high ground when you are dead or enslaved?

[Common Sense]

We survive and they don't. What good is the moral high ground when you are dead or enslaved?

Do you really think that ISIS is going to destroy the US or enslave the US???

[nathanbforrest45]

If a foreign power came to your hometown and killed the family and friends of an American soldier for fighting for a cause that you agreed with would it infuriate you to the point of rage or would it make you change your point of view in favor of that foreign power because of the fear? You'd be totally pissed and would want revenge.

And then you would die along with your family and goats, and everyone who decided upon revenge would also die.

I disagree with this method actually although I think it has merit. I'm all for just killing every man jack of them period. Yes, Common Sense, I would nuke them until they glow and not lose a minutes sleep over it.

[Common Sense]

And then you would die along with your family and goats, and everyone who decided upon revenge would also die.

I disagree with this method actually although I think it has merit. I'm all for just killing every man jack of them period. Yes, Common Sense, I would nuke them until they glow and not lose a minutes sleep over it.

You do realize that would just create more terrorists, right?

Or is the plan to just kill all Muslims?

[The Xl]

Holy shit, and these people vote.

[nathanbforrest45]

Thats not the point

What is the point?

[nathanbforrest45]

Oh lord...


Yes, because they really want to be our friends and live in peace and harmony with us right? The most ridiculous bumper sticker I have ever seen is the one that has all the various religious symbols spelling out Co Exist, like that is even remotely possible.

[Chloe]

What is the point?

My response was to Cletus' post. The point I was making to him is that going and killing the family and friends of terrorists will not make like minded people afraid to fight us. They would react the same way we would as a society if a foreign enemy did that to people we agreed with. It wouldn't make them scared it would make them mad.

[nathanbforrest45]

Do you really think that ISIS is going to destroy the US or enslave the US???


Eventually, yes I do. Maybe not in my lifetime but eventually. I think you are extremely naive if you don't see that is their end game, world domination, the true one world government.

[Matty]

Yes, because they really want to be our friends and live in peace and harmony with us right? The most ridiculous bumper sticker I have ever seen is the one that has all the various religious symbols spelling out Co Exist, like that is even remotely possible.



We can send them fruitcake for Christmas.

[nathanbforrest45]

You do realize that would just create more terrorists, right?

Or is the plan to just kill all Muslims?

You got it finally. Its the only way. Just like you would kill all cockroaches because leaving just two alive would insure a reinvestation eventually we must eliminate this scourge of the earth before it eliminates us.

[nathanbforrest45]

My response was to Cletus' post. The point I was making to him is that going and killing the family and friends of terrorists will not make like minded people afraid to fight us. They would react the same way we would as a society if a foreign enemy did that to people we agreed with. It wouldn't make them scared it would make them mad.

Until they were all dead.

[nathanbforrest45]

We can send them fruitcake for Christmas.

The rum soaked kind?

[Boris The Animal]

I wish there was a peaceful solution to all this. Us having boots in the middle east hasnt solved a thing. I think we need to isolate and contain them not allow them to spread all over the world and make it worseContain? That's laughable. We need to do more than merely "contain" them. A couple of well aimed 50 MT warheads would do the trick.

[Common Sense]

Eventually, yes I do. Maybe not in my lifetime but eventually. I think you are extremely naive if you don't see that is their end game, world domination, the true one world government.

OK, now I'm having a hard time taking you seriously.

[nathanbforrest45]

Here's a thought. We could just drop birth control vectors throughout the entire region instead of bombs. They would then simply stop reproducing and eventually just become extinct as a race of murderous savages.

[Chloe]

Until they were all dead.

ok but realistically, and I think you know this, you can't kill them all because a lot of what "they" are is an idealology. It's the same reason there are still sympathizers today of evil ideologies that have been "defeated."

[nathanbforrest45]

OK, now I'm having a hard time taking you seriously.

Well, that's your failure, not mine.

I would suspect the Jews in Germany thought the same as you do. "Hiram, what can they do to us, we are millions and they need our money"

[Common Sense]

Well, that's your failure, not mine.

I would suspect the Jews in Germany thought the same as you do. "Hiram, what can they do to us, we are millions and they need our money"

Using your logic, the only way to stop Nazi's in the second world war would be to kill all Germans.

[nathanbforrest45]

ok but realistically, and I think you know this, you can't kill them all because a lot of what "they" are is an ideal. It's the same reason there are still sympathizers today of evil ideals that have been "defeated."


Perhaps, but enough of the Nazi's for example were eliminated that those who remained were quite toothless. and easy to spot.

[nathanbforrest45]

Using your logic, the only way to stop Nazi's in the second world war would be to kill all Germans.


If the German people were as fanatical as the Muslims appear to be then yes, that would have been the solution.

[Common Sense]

Perhaps, but enough of the Nazi's for example were eliminated that those who remained were quite toothless. and easy to spot.

Your analogy is flawed because just as all Germans weren't Nazis, not all Muslims are terrorists (regardless of your assertions).

[Boris The Animal]

Your analogy is flawed because just as all Germans weren't Nazis, not all Muslims are terrorists (regardless of your assertions).
Does not matter. Diplomacy failed, surgical strikes failed. We need to nuke that region back to the stone age.

[The Xl]

Neocons are stupid as fuck.

[Common Sense]

These are the "grown ups".

[Crepitus]

Collateral damage literally makes the problem worse. It breeds more terrorists. The way we see the France incident, they see us firebombing hospitals the same way. It compels many to take up arms, and rightfully so.

We need to get out of the Middle East for good, period. Considering the situation, we should also not accept refugees.
I'm probably talking about a lot more collateral damage than you are.

[nathanbforrest45]

These are the "grown ups".

I'm glad you recognize that.

[Cletus]

Go that far and you'll have the majority of Muslims ready to wage war, rightfully so, and a decent amount of non Muslim suppoters. You be created thousands of terrorists by the second.

Good luck.

Not even close.

What you would have is a bunch terrorist wannabes who would understand that actions have consequences and sometimes, those consequences can be pretty horrific. You would also have people distancing themselves from the Terrorists, and in many cases, actively working against them.

[nathanbforrest45]

Lets assume you are correct and killing all of them is not the answer. What would you do specifically to insure the spread of Islam is halted? Or do you think that is not a bad thing if we are all Muslims 100 years down the road?

Do you not believe the goal of ISIS is in fact world domination and the spread of Islam to every corner of the earth? Do you think they will simply stop their 1000 year march if we just get out of the Middle East?

[Cletus]

If a foreign power came to your hometown and killed the family and friends of an American soldier for fighting for a cause that you agreed with would it infuriate you to the point of rage or would it make you change your point of view in favor of that foreign power because of the fear? You'd be totally pissed and would want revenge.

It is not even close to being the same thing.

[Cletus]

Speaking logic and sense to these people is a waste of time.

How would you know?

You very rarely speak logically or sensibly.

[GRUMPY]

war is hell ladies, send them ALL to hell....

[Cletus]

My response was to Cletus' post. The point I was making to him is that going and killing the family and friends of terrorists will not make like minded people afraid to fight us. They would react the same way we would as a society if a foreign enemy did that to people we agreed with. It wouldn't make them scared it would make them mad.

You were wrong.

[Cletus]

Using your logic, the only way to stop Nazi's in the second world war would be to kill all Germans.

You don't need to kill all your enemies. You need to destroy their will to fight.

That's all.

[nathanbforrest45]

You don't need to kill all your enemies. You need to destroy their will to fight.

That's all.


Except, like cockroaches, they will just sit back for a 100 years and then try again. Better to after their will to fight is ended just to kill them all.

[Peter1469]

You need to identify your foes. We did a good job picking apart the al Qaeda leadership. The Islamic State has territory it holds and governs. That requires different tactics.

[Truth Detector]

With the latest attack on France and threats, its natural for many to be dead set against refugee migration. Its just as natural for some to defend them.

I understand both sides of this issue, Ive been on both sides in the sense for the longest time I believed it was just a few and most were victims. Now I sit on the side of theres too damn many of them and enough is enough.

I read posts from those that continuously blame the USA for the terrorism in the middle east. ok we certainly exacerbated it with the first and second invasion of iraq and then afghanistan but that was then this is now. We cant change history we have to deal with today. HOW DO WE FIX THIS PROBLEM. Heres what we do know, negotiations with terrorists wont work and reasoning with them is an impossiblity. Whats left ?

Are we obligated to take thousands up thousands of refugees, I say emphatically NO and we should not. We cant identify good ones from bad muslims. 911 should have taught us that. The perpetrators of 911 trained for it in Flight Schools in florida.

Europe is a mess of their own making for taking refugees and they have put their own citizens not only at risk for violence but for Violent Crime, rape murder, robbery. Should we do the same thing ? HELL NO.

The UN is made up of the lionshare of countries that will never take a refugee but are insisting Europe and the USA do ? Screw the UN.

We need to put heads together to fix this problem, by containing it or defeating it. Not allowing it to spread even further around the world.

Im tired of hearing the old song and dance its our Fault that the USA did this. Ok im not arguing that point except to say I dont want to hear it anymore. What I want to hear is, ok we have a terrorist problem today in 2015 how do we fix it. Fixing it is not kissing their ass and allowing them to invade other countries by the hundreds of thousands.

Well; first off you don't stop it by impugning the coalition that went into Iraq or George Bush for actually enforcing UN sanctions against Saddam. Second, you don't do it by unilaterally yanking our troops out of Iraq for political reasons against the advice of your generals and the previous inhabitant of the White House. Next, you don’t do it by drawing red lines in the sand only to back down like a fool.

We had a chance to do something about it when Bush went into Afghanistan and Iraq. But Liberals in this country using it for political opportunism along with EuroTards who were desperate to save their oil imports, all attacked him and the troops who went in.

That bed has been made; and with a White House punk named Obama who never lets a moment pass without being a partisan asshole, don’t expect change to come very soon.

Lastly, you can’t do it from airplanes bombing from 30,000 feet either. It takes boots on the ground, hard work and sacrifice on THEIR turf, not our own, in order to root out this disease and end it once and for all.

Westerners who are too comfortable in their own homes have no stomach for that; therefore, it will NEVER happen until perhaps a nuke is set off in a major western city.

Apparently, 9-11 was not enough of a wakeup call to end the partisan bullshit that resulted in Bush being castigated as the most hated man on the planet.

[Crepitus]

@Cletus (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1708) is correct. What he describes is exactly how the dictators over there have maintained their power for centuries.

If Ahmed does something against the regime, you kill Ahmed. Then you kill everyone who might be motivated to avenge him. His father, his uncles, his brothers, his cousins, his sons, and so on. Historically they would then enslave the women. If possible you capture Ahmed rather than kill him and make him watch before he dies.

It's what they would do to us if the situation was reversed.

Ahmed's entire family is gone, who is around to avenge him? You think his neighbors are going to risk that happening to their families?

[Tahuyaman]

You need to identify your foes. We did a good job picking apart the al Qaeda leadership. The Islamic State has territory it holds and governs. That requires different tactics.




the solution is clear. It's just a matter of whether or not everyone has the will to do it.

[Tahuyaman]

If a foreign power came to your hometown and killed the family and friends of an American soldier for fighting for a cause that you agreed with would it infuriate you to the point of rage or would it make you change your point of view in favor of that foreign power because of the fear? You'd be totally pissed and would want revenge.


OK. How about you and Common Sense tell us how you would eliminate the world wide problem of Muslim terrorism?

[nathanbforrest45]

@Cletus (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1708) is correct. What he describes is exactly how the dictators over there have maintained their power for centuries.

If Ahmed does something against the regime, you kill Ahmed. Then you kill everyone who might be motivated to avenge him. His father, his uncles, his brothers, his cousins, his sons, and so on. Historically they would then enslave the women. If possible you capture Ahmed rather than kill him and make him watch before he dies.

It's what they would do to us if the situation was reversed.

Ahmed's entire family is gone, who is around to avenge him? You think his neighbors are going to risk that happening to their families?


sounds like the Mafia.

[Tahuyaman]

Using your logic, the only way to stop Nazi's in the second world war would be to kill all Germans.


I dont believe one can compare the average German of that era to the average Muslim today. Germans are a rational people. Muslims.... Not so rational.

[Crepitus]

sounds like the Mafia.
Same basic idea yes.

[Common]

@Cletus (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1708) is correct. What he describes is exactly how the dictators over there have maintained their power for centuries.

If Ahmed does something against the regime, you kill Ahmed. Then you kill everyone who might be motivated to avenge him. His father, his uncles, his brothers, his cousins, his sons, and so on. Historically they would then enslave the women. If possible you capture Ahmed rather than kill him and make him watch before he dies.

It's what they would do to us if the situation was reversed.

Ahmed's entire family is gone, who is around to avenge him? You think his neighbors are going to risk that happening to their families?

arabs kill more arabs than the rest of the world combined. Saddam and his sons killed thousands and thousands of Iraqui and Shiites and tortured them in torture chambers.

Throughout the middleeast they show what animals they are regularly. Mass beheadings and burning alive their own people. Burying women up to their necks and stoning them to death BECAUSE THEY WERE RAPED. GTFO a group of chimps in the jungle have more decency towards their own than muslims.

Anyone else find it peculiar that the UN isnt whining that Saudi Arabia has to take refugees and dubai and kuwait and Iran and Iraq. Where is the outrage those fucks arent taking syrians.

Its always the west that has to pay through the nose for everyone else. Time to STOP that bullshit

[Tahuyaman]

This thread is supposed to be a discussion about how Muslim sponsored terrorism can be eliminated. As of yet, not one left wing type has addressed that question.

[Crepitus]

This thread is supposed to be a discussion about how Muslim sponsored terrorism can be eliminated. As of yet, not one left wing type has addressed that question.
I did.


@Cletus (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1708) is correct. What he describes is exactly how the dictators over there have maintained their power for centuries.

If Ahmed does something against the regime, you kill Ahmed. Then you kill everyone who might be motivated to avenge him. His father, his uncles, his brothers, his cousins, his sons, and so on. Historically they would then enslave the women. If possible you capture Ahmed rather than kill him and make him watch before he dies.

It's what they would do to us if the situation was reversed.

Ahmed's entire family is gone, who is around to avenge him? You think his neighbors are going to risk that happening to their families?

I'm not your typical leftist though.

[Private Pickle]

What we do is barely any different. It's all semantics.

What we do is light years from what they do.

[Tahuyaman]

What we do is barely any different. It's all semantics.


If you can't see the differences between us and them, you are beyond hope. Seriously.

[Tahuyaman]

I did.



I'm not your typical leftist though.


OK. I stand corrected. Are there any leftists who agree with you?

[Crepitus]

OK. I stand corrected. Are there any leftists who agree with you?
Probably not many on this forum, no.

[Common]

I made my sentiments quite clear but I am a true full centrist middle of the roader who gets called a lib and a rightwinger depending on which issue were talking about

[GRUMPY]

how about the west just straight up declare war on islam and send them to hell where they belong....

[Matty]

I made my sentiments quite clear but I am a true full centrist middle of the roader who gets called a lib and a rightwinger depending on which issue were talking about



Oh lord.

[Tahuyaman]

how about the west just straight up declare war on islam and send them to hell where they belong....


The only way to either eliminate or even minimize Muslim terrorism is to kill as many millions as we can as quickly as we can.

[Common]

Oh lord.

he nor anyone or anything else can help you

[Truth Detector]

Stop waging war on their countries and interfering in their political affairs. It's our fault all of this is happening. American foreign policy is stupid

We don't wage war on other countries that haven't already waged war on us or our allies. Claims like this are repugnant in their stupidity.

[Truth Detector]

...because bombing them and creating more every day has been working so darned well.

So you don't like the Liberal solution eh?

[Truth Detector]

You kill women and children? What happens when we loose the moral high ground?

LMAO @ moral high ground when combating terrorism and fighting wars.

[Truth Detector]

One side wants to continue the policies that created ISIS. The other side wants to let refugees in at a large bulk largely unscreened.

Bunch of dolts. The country is screwed.

ISIS was created by the vacuum left when Obama lied to the American people claiming that Iraq was strong enough to defend itself and then claimed ISIS was JV when they filled that vacuum.

[Truth Detector]

What we do is barely any different. It's all semantics.

That's just a bunch of dumb nonsense spouted in a vacuum of reality, the facts or the truth. You're quite full of that.

[Peter1469]

ISIS was created by the vacuum left when Obama lied to the American people claiming that Iraq was strong enough to defend itself and then claimed ISIS was JV when they filled that vacuum.

ISIL isn't much of a military power. The problem was the Iraqi military running away. For several reasons not having anything to do with being ought fought.

[Truth Detector]

ISIL isn't much of a military power. The problem was the Iraqi military running away. For several reasons not having anything to do with being ought fought.

My response was to a claim that our invasion of Iraq created ISIS; that's a pile of BS.

Iraq was abandoned by Obama to satiate the idiots who constitute his constiuency; that created the vacuum for ISIS. We know the Iraqi's can't fight; but that wasn't the point. The point was we abandoned them based on an Obama lie.

How many more lies will the left ignore before he leaves in 2017?

[Matty]

My response was to a claim that our invasion of Iraq created ISIS; that's a pile of BS.

Iraq was abandoned by Obama to satiate the idiots who constitute his constiuency; that created the vacuum for ISIS. We know the Iraqi's can't fight; but that wasn't the point. The point was we abandoned them based on an Obama lie.

How many more lies will the left ignore before he leaves in 2017?


I think Obama had a private meeting with Code Pink. Decisions were made then.

[Tahuyaman]

So you don't like the Liberal solution eh?


What is the liberal's solution?

[Crepitus]

ISIL isn't much of a military power. The problem was the Iraqi military running away. For several reasons not having anything to do with being ought fought.
That's actually a big part of the problem. They are to dispersed throughout their territory. Hard to find concentrations worthy of a $20,000 bomb.

[Common]

That's actually a big part of the problem. They are to dispersed throughout their territory. Hard to find concentrations worthy of a $20,000 bomb.

Thats always the problem, identifying who is the enemy, the punks hide amongst innocents making collateral dmg impossible to avoid.
Then for fun they behead some of them or burn them alive.. At will they break into homes and just take daughters and wives and rape them.

Going to come to a point where collateral dmg is going to be less worriesome to get to them

[Dr. Who]

Eventually, yes I do. Maybe not in my lifetime but eventually. I think you are extremely naive if you don't see that is their end game, world domination, the true one world government.There are 1.57 billion Muslims in the world - roughly 1B are in south and south east Asia -not the ME. 321,869,000 live in the ME. What do you suppose would be the reaction of Muslims in the world if you "nuke" the ME, the birthplace of Islam? You would start a religious war on a scale that the world has never seen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_by_country

[Boris The Animal]

There are 1.57 billion Muslims in the world - roughly 1B are in south and south east Asia -not the ME. 321,869,000 live in the ME. What do you suppose would be the reaction of Muslims in the world if you "nuke" the ME, the birthplace of Islam? You would start a religious war on a scale that the world has never seen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_by_countrySo? Bring it on. The Allied forces would do exactly the same thing to these scumbags as we did to the Germans and Japanese during WWII

[Captain Obvious]

So? Bring it on. The Allied forces would do exactly the same thing to these scumbags as we did to the Germans and Japanese during WWII

http://img.memecdn.com/murica_o_262670.jpg

[Mini Me]

Pack out Sh!t and come home ...

Let all the Politicians and their Families fight the Wars in the Sand.

Bu..bu...but! The neocon war profiteers would hate that!
And PEACE might break out all over!

[Mac-7]

There are 1.57 billion Muslims in the world - roughly 1B are in south and south east Asia -not the ME. 321,869,000 live in the ME. What do you suppose would be the reaction of Muslims in the world if you "nuke" the ME, the birthplace of Islam? You would start a religious war on a scale that the world has never seen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_by_country

Everyone knows nukes are bad.

except obama who buys into the Hate America thinking that iran needs nuclear weapons to protect itself from us.

So how will the wacky world of islam react to a nuclear exchange beyween iran and Israel?

[zelmo1234]

I wish there was a peaceful solution to all this. Us having boots in the middle east hasnt solved a thing. I think we need to isolate and contain them not allow them to spread all over the world and make it worse

It has not solved a thing because they have not been allowed to do their jobs.

Like it or not the Islamic male populations is going to have to be reduced, greatly reduced. The Mosques that are preaching hate are going to need to be destroyed., and the price for an attack on the west will need to be paid for in the lives of the terrorist. 1000 to one should be about the right ratio.

Only when they think that Allah, is not as strong as other Gods will it stop.

[Ransom]

Why ask how to stop it, isn't it repeated here daily? Withdraw. Shrink. Do not confront. This isn't any of our business. Do not tangle yourself in foreign affairs. The 'west' created these terrorists and response just enrages them further. Come home. Bring all western militaries home as well.

Act like a sniveling Democrat Presidential candidate, show how weak and unassertive you are...... they'll leave you alone.

[Tahuyaman]

Why ask how to stop it, isn't it repeated here daily? Withdraw. Shrink. Do not confront. This isn't any of our business. Do not tangle yourself in foreign affairs. The 'west' created these terrorists and response just enrages them further. Come home. Bring all western militaries home as well.

Act like a sniveling Democrat Presidential candidate, show how weak and unassertive you are...... they'll leave you alone.


That has always proven to work, hasn't it?

[Truth Detector]

What is the liberal's solution?

Retreat, blame AmeriKa, withdraw, wring hands, think that one can talk to despots, tyrants and dictators and then lie about how safe Iraq is.

[Truth Detector]

Why ask how to stop it, isn't it repeated here daily? Withdraw. Shrink. Do not confront. This isn't any of our business. Do not tangle yourself in foreign affairs. The 'west' created these terrorists and response just enrages them further. Come home. Bring all western militaries home as well.

Act like a sniveling Democrat Presidential candidate, show how weak and unassertive you are...... they'll leave you alone.

^Spot on.

[Tahuyaman]

Retreat, blame AmeriKa, withdraw, wring hands, think that one can talk to despots, tyrants and dictators and then lie about how safe Iraq is.


That does appear to be the left's solution to eliminate Muslim terrorism.

[Common Sense]

I'm starting to come to the conclusion that many of you are some of the dumbest people I've encountered in my 42 years.

Hopefully it's just internet bravado.

Please don't procreate.

[Tahuyaman]

I'm starting to come to the conclusion that many of you are some of the dumbest people I've encountered in my 42 years.

Hopefully it's just internet bravado.

Please don't procreate.


Maybe you'll be smarter when you are 52? Not likely, but it is possible.

[The Xl]

Maybe you'll be smarter when you are 52? Not likely, but it is possible.

I don't think that's a perfect science. It certainly hasn't worked for the lot of you.

[Ethereal]

I'm starting to come to the conclusion that many of you are some of the dumbest people I've encountered in my 42 years.

Hopefully it's just internet bravado.

Please don't procreate.

No, it's the typical neo-con mental disease. Refuse to take responsibility for your actions, blame everyone else for your failures, act tough, base your views on bigotry and hatred, wash, rinse, repeat.

[Ethereal]

I don't think that's a perfect science. It certainly hasn't worked for the lot of you.

If anything, neo-cons get dumber as they get older.

[The Xl]

No, it's the typical neo-con mental disease. Refuse to take responsibility for your actions, blame everyone else for your failures, act tough, base your views on bigotry and hatred, wash, rinse, repeat.

You must hate Murica'

Kik, neocons are among the dumbest and most dangerous people on the planet

[Tahuyaman]

Maybe you'll be smarter when you are 52? Not likely, but it is possible.


I don't think that's a perfect science. It certainly hasn't worked for the lot of you.


I agree, as I said "not likely but it is possible".

[Tahuyaman]

It's starting to look like the term "neocon" is defined as ...... Someone I disagree with on any issue.

[Ethereal]

You must hate Murica'

Kik, neocons are among the dumbest and most dangerous people on the planet

They're modern-day Nazis. They would mass murder every man, woman, and child on the planet who looked at them funny if people of conscience weren't standing in their way. They're full of fear, hatred, and bigotry and will stay that way until the day they die.

[Tahuyaman]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fwj6ZGMF_uA

[Tahuyaman]

I guess if Mick Jagger says so......

[Tahuyaman]

They're modern-day Nazis. They would mass murder every man, woman, and child on the planet who looked at them funny if people of conscience weren't standing in their way. They're full of fear, hatred, and bigotry and will stay that way until the day they die.

So, neo-con's are American leftists?

[Peter1469]

So, neo-con's are American leftists?

They are certainly big government.

[Tahuyaman]

It just doesn't seem to make sense. I've heard people say that Obama, Hillary Clinton and George Bush are all new cons. They don't have much in common. I've even seen some guy claim Reagan was a new con.

So, if people with completely opposing political views can be neo cons, what exactly is a new con?

[Peter1469]

I never heard of new cons.

Reagan was nothing like a neocon. He was a realist regarding foreign affairs.

[Tahuyaman]

I never heard of new cons.

Reagan was nothing like a neocon. He was a realist regarding foreign affairs.

OK, I made a typo. Sheesh

I'm still wondering what a neo-con actually is. It is a fact that people here have called Reagan, Obama, GW Bush and Hillary each a neo-con. Seeing that people with such differing political views can be called a neo-con, that tells me the term is used just to describe someone with whom the accuser disagrees.

[Peter1469]

OK, I made a typo. Sheesh

I'm still wondering what a neo-con actually is. It is a fact that people here have called Reagan, Obama, GW Bush and Hillary each a neo-con. Seeing that people with such differing political views can be called a neo-con, that tells me the term is used just to describe someone with whom the accuser disagrees.

Many people probably do misuse the term. It does have a meaning (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism)however.


Neoconservatism (commonly shortened to neocon) is a political movement born in the United States during the 1960s among Democrats who became disenchanted with the party's domestic and especially foreign policy. Many of its adherents became politically famous during the Republican presidential administrations of the 1970s, 1980s, 1990s and 2000s. Neoconservatives peaked in influence during the administrations of George W. Bush (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_W._Bush), George H W Bush (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_H_W_Bush) and Tony Blair (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Blair), when they played a major role in promoting and planning the 2003 invasion of Iraq (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_invasion_of_Iraq).[1] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-1)Prominent neoconservatives in the Bush administration included Paul Wolfowitz (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Wolfowitz), John Bolton (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_R._Bolton), Elliott Abrams (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elliott_Abrams),Richard Perle (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Perle), and Paul Bremer (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Bremer). Senior officials Vice President Dick Cheney (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Cheney) and Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Rumsfeld), while not identifying themselves as neoconservatives, listened closely to neoconservative advisers regarding foreign policy, especially the defense of Israel, the promotion of democracy in the Middle East, and the buildup of American military forces to achieve these goals. The neocons have influence in the Obama White House, and neoconservatism remains a staple in both Partys arsenal.[2] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-abstract-2)[3]
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-Robert_Singh_2014_pp_29-40-3)The term "neoconservative" refers to those who made the ideological journey from New Deal liberalism to the camp of American conservatism (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_conservatism).[4] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-4) Neoconservatives typically advocate the promotion of democracy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy) and promotion of American national interest (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_interest) in international affairs (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_relations), including by means of military force, and are known for espousing disdain for communism and for political radicalism (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_radicalism).[5] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-britannica-5)[6] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-merriam-webster-6) Many early neoconservative thinkers were Zionist and published articles in Commentary (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commentary_(magazine)), published by the American Jewish Committee.[7] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-7)[8] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-8) They spoke out against the New Left (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Left), and in that way helped define the movement.[9] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-9)[10] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-10) C. Bradley Thompson, a professor at Clemson University, claims that most influential neoconservatives refer explicitly to the theoretical ideas in the philosophy of Leo Strauss (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leo_Strauss) (1899–1973),[11] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism#cite_note-11)though in doing so they may draw upon meaning that Strauss himself did not endorse (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leo_Strauss#Response_to_criticisms).

[Tahuyaman]

There's only one way to stop Islamic terrorism. Eliminate all Muslims.

No Muslims, no Islamic terrorism.

As long as Muslims are roaming big earth, there will be Muslims committing acts of terrorism.

[William]

Lol - and there I was, thinking this is a board full of sensible grown-ups! :laugh:

The only way to stop terrorism is to kill every Muslim on earth? Like for starters - only Muslims commit and have committed terror acts! Or is the only way to kill everyone who doesn't think like we do? :rollseyes:

Terrorism of one sort or another has been around since there were one lot of humans who were more powerful - had more big stones, trebuchets, castles, or nuclear bombs - than another group. It is the weapon of choice of those with no other power, and who see no chance of justice.

No one, not even total nutters like Islamic State, become terrorists cos it's a wet Sunday and there's nothing on the box. We might think it crazy (and it often is, from our POV,) but they all have reasons or something they want, or something they want us to stop doing.

So we kill those of them who are trying to kill us, or our families, but we don't wipe out whole religious or national groups cos some murderers belong to those groups. And if we have any brains, we try and find out as well what the terrorists want, or what they want us to stop doing.

The IRA terrorised my grandad's generation for like 20 years, and the Royal Army kicking down doors in Belfast only created more IRA followers. Until through a long and slow process we talked to them, and 'negotiated with terrorists'. And guess what? No more bombs in Harrods or the Palace at Westminster! We didn't give them everything they want but we gave them something.

Of course, we could have just nuked the Republic, and New York (where the IRA money and support came from,) but what would that have done - other than a war?

So I guess there's no quick and easy way to stop terrorism, but it can be done. But not if we just want to keep doing what we are doing cos we like all that oil and money and bossing brown people around so much. :shocked:

[Peter1469]

Yes, no serious person says kill all Muslims. That is like the nuts who think Dominionism is taking over. It is silly. Don't get distracted by it.

[Gypsy]

There's only one way to stop Islamic terrorism. Eliminate all Muslims.

No Muslims, no Islamic terrorism.

As long as Muslims are roaming big earth, there will be Muslims committing acts of terrorism.

Should we kill all Catholics, Presbyterians and Mormons as well? There have been terrorists in their midst too.

[Tahuyaman]

Should we kill all Catholics, Presbyterians and Mormons as well? There have been terrorists in their midst too.

I've never seen Catholic, Mormon or Presbyterian terrorism spreading across the globe, have you?

[William]

I've never seen Catholic, Mormon or Presbyterian terrorism spreading across the globe, have you?

Not just at the moment - but history is your friend. :grin:

http://images.fineartamerica.com/images-medium-large/5-spanish-inquisition-granger.jpg

https://thetruthorthefight.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/141.gif?w=450

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[Tahuyaman]

The Crudpsades ended almost 1000 years ago.

Northern Ireland's problems didn't infect the entire world, did they?

[William]

The Crudpsades ended almost 1000 years ago.

Northern Ireland's problems didn't infect the entire world, did they?

What are Crudpsades? If you mean the Crusades - I didn't mention them, and they are not an example of terrorism - just religious wars - but the Inquisition was the closest thing to Islamic religious terrorism.

And the IRA certainly affected Ireland, Britain, and America - cos you lot supported and financed it. Terrorism doesn't have to spread across the globe to be bad - one person killed by it is one too many.

[Tahuyaman]

What are Crudpsades? If you mean the Crusades - I didn't mention them, and they are not an example of terrorism - just religious wars - but the Inquisition was the closest thing to Islamic religious terrorism.

And the IRA certainly affected Ireland, Britain, and America - cos you lot supported and financed it. Terrorism doesn't have to spread across the globe to be bad - one person killed by it is one too many.


Yes, I meant crusades. Good Catch.

Terrorism doesn't need to spread globally to be bad, but it has and it's worse than just bad.

The violence surrounding the Northern Ireland situation did not go global as you seem to suggest. And it wasn't because of America.

Why not be more concerned about the things going on in the here and now verses something which happened hundreds of years ago?

[William]

Yes, I meant crusades. Good Catch.

Terrorism doesn't need to spread globally to be bad, but it has and it's worse than just bad.

The violence surrounding the Northern Ireland situation did not go global as you seem to suggest. And it wasn't because of America.

Why not be more concerned about the things going on in the here and now verses something which happened hundreds of years ago?

Are you saying Americans didn't finance the IRA?


Millions of dollars were given to the Provisional IRA by NORAID, an American political group which openly raised money in Boston and other American cities, often playing on people’s ancestral ties to Ireland.

While not everyone in Boston contributed to NORAID, it was done with the blessing and active support of a large proportion of the population including many of the city leaders.

The upper echelons of Boston and other US cities often played host to members of the Provisional IRA such as Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness who travelled to the United States on fund-raising trips.

There is plenty of evidence from the British, Irish and US governments that the money was used to buy weapons including the notorious explosive Semtex which the IRA purchased in large quantities from the Libyan government.

http://www.securitynewsdesk.com/opinion-noraid-supporters-must-examine-their-consciences-over-ira/

The IRA killed about 2,000 (mainly British) civilians.

And of course I worry more about stuff that happens now than in history, but we can't just ignore history cos it's not now. Like have you seen the Holocaust museums around the world? Should we just ignore what was done to those people by Christians?

But you are saying we should just kill all Muslims cos no other religion has killed people across the world, and I'm trying to show you that's wrong.

[Gypsy]

I've never seen Catholic, Mormon or Presbyterian terrorism spreading across the globe, have you?

McVeigh, Rudolph ... is it only terrorism when it's global?

[Tahuyaman]

Are you saying Americans didn't finance the IRA?

http://www.securitynewsdesk.com/opinion-noraid-supporters-must-examine-their-consciences-over-ira/

The IRA killed about 2,000 (mainly British) civilians.

And of course I worry more about stuff that happens now than in history, but we can't just ignore history cos it's not now. Like have you seen the Holocaust museums around the world? Should we just ignore what was done to those people by Christians?

But you are saying we should just kill all Muslims cos no other religion has killed people across the world, and I'm trying to show you that's wrong.

America did not finance the IRA as you suggested. I'm sure some private citizens did just as some help finance current terrorist threats.

You now are claiming now that Hitler conducted the holocaust in the name of Christ? Seriously?

I'm saying that we should try as hard as we can to deplete Islam to the point that they are no longer a threat to modern civilization. And then deplete them even more when and if they look to be reconstituting. They are after all, the greatest evil in the world today.

[Tahuyaman]

McVeigh, Rudolph ... is it only terrorism when it's global?

Tell me you aren't claiming that McVeigh conducted the Oklahoma City bombing in the name of Jesus Christ, or as a religious statement. Are you?

There seems to be this idiotic notion that any act of terrorism not conducted by Muslims is automatically Christian in nature. That is a morally and intellectually bankrupt position to hold.

Some people need to really try hard to find ways to shrug off Islamic terrorism.

[gamewell45]

The UN is made up of the lionshare of countries that will never take a refugee but are insisting Europe and the USA do ? Screw the UN.


I've always felt that the United States should have pulled out of the UN decades ago; They do absolutely nothing to benefit the US, in fact we have been used so many times by the UN to accomplish their often mis-stated aims it is ridiculous. Plus we pay a small fortune in "dues" for membership in this nefarious organization; it's high time we say to them "adios" and cut our losses. Just my opinion.

[Peter1469]

Tell me you aren't claiming that McVeigh conducted the Oklahoma City bombing in the name of Jesus Christ, or as a religious statement. Are you?

There seems to be this idiotic notion that any act of terrorism not conducted by Muslims is automatically Christian in nature. That is a morally and intellectually bankrupt position to hold.

Some people need to really try hard to find ways to shrug off Islamic terrorism.


McVeigh was run by Iraqi intel. He was a tool.

[Tahuyaman]

The UN has outlived its usefulness. I wish the US would end all ties with the UN and send the HQ to some third world shit hole.

[Tahuyaman]

McVeigh was run by Iraqi intel. He was a tool.


He certainly did not committ his terrorist act in the name of Cristianity. It's intellectually bankrupt to even try to make that argument.

[Gypsy]

Tell me you aren't claiming that McVeigh conducted the Oklahoma City bombing in the name of Jesus Christ, or as a religious statement. Are you?

There seems to be this idiotic notion that any act of terrorism not conducted by Muslims is automatically Christian in nature. That is a morally and intellectually bankrupt position to hold.

Some people need to really try hard to find ways to shrug off Islamic terrorism.
McVeigh - Catholic
http://murderpedia.org/male.M/m1/mcveigh-timothy.htm

Rudolph - Catholic
http://murderpedia.org/male.R/r/rudolph-eric.htm

Good Christians don't kill their fellow countrymen, neither do good Muslims.

[Tahuyaman]

McVeigh - Catholic
http://murderpedia.org/male.M/m1/mcveigh-timothy.htm

Rudolph - Catholic
http://murderpedia.org/male.R/r/rudolph-eric.htm

Good Christians don't kill their fellow countrymen, neither do good Muslims.

so, you are saying that McVeigh did his evil deed in the name of Jesus Christ?

[Crepitus]

America did not finance the IRA as you suggested. I'm sure some private citizens did just as some help finance current terrorist threats.

You now are claiming now that Hitler conducted the holocaust in the name of Christ? Seriously?

I'm saying that we should try as hard as we can to deplete Islam to the point that they are no longer a threat to modern civilization. And then deplete them even more when and if they look to be reconstituting. They are after all, the greatest evil in the world today.
“The anti-Semitism of the new movement (Christian Social movement)
was based on religious ideas instead of racial knowledge.”

[Adolf Hitler, “Mein Kampf”, Vol. 1, Chapter 3]

[Gypsy]

so, you are saying that McVeigh did his evil deed in the name of Jesus Christ?

No, I'm saying he was a Catholic that committed mass murder. Do all Catholics do that?

[Tahuyaman]

No, I'm saying he was a Catholic that committed mass murder. Do all Catholics do that?

intellectually bankrupt position.

[Gypsy]

intellectually bankrupt position.

I know it goes against your agenda, but answer the question.

[Tahuyaman]

I know it goes against your agenda, but answer the question.

Was Timothy McVeigh an actual practicing Catholic committing his terrorist act in the name of Jesus Christ?

Was he a Catholic because his mother and father were? Do you believe that he got down on his knees and asked Jesus Christ to guide him?

You see, Christians do not committ terrorist acts in the name of Christ. Evil people exist. There is evil outside of Islam, but Islam is the greatest evil in the world today.

[Tahuyaman]

I know it goes against your agenda, but answer the question.

I asked the question first and you swerved away from it. As usual.

[maineman]

but Islam is the greatest evil in the world today.

bigoted uninformed opinion masquerading as fact.

[maineman]

Christians do not committ terrorist acts in the name of Christ.

others have different perspectives.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_terrorism

[Tahuyaman]

I guess people who want to deceive others and excuse or justify the evils done in the name of Islam will do what they need to do.

The fact is, people don't go to a Christian church and become motivated to destroy a society which differs from theirs. Well, unless you go to the church in Chicago run by Obama's spiritual leader Rev Wright.

[Tahuyaman]

Islam is the greatest evil in the world today.



bigoted uninformed opinion masquerading as fact.

my comment is an absolute fact.

[Tahuyaman]

He certainly did not committ his terrorist act in the name of Cristianity. It's intellectually bankrupt to even try to make that argument.


But the appeasers will continue to try.

[maineman]

my comment is an absolute fact.

no. It is an opinion. The fact that you have no concept concerning the difference between fact and opinion is obvious.

[Green Arrow]

You can't fight an idea with bullets and bombs. You can only fight an idea with better ideas. Terrorism is an ideology, it has no nation state, no borders, no military. Fourteen years of war in Afghanistan haven't ended terrorism in Afghanistan. One hundred years of war in Afghanistan won't defeat terrorism in Afghanistan. As soon as we leave, the Taliban will sweep back through Afghanistan and the last fourteen years of war will have been a waste. They already are a waste.

Until we get this very simple notion through our heads and start fighting the ideology of terrorism with a better ideology, we will continue to lose the war on terror.

[Boris The Animal]

You can't fight an idea with bullets and bombs. You can only fight an idea with better ideas. Terrorism is an ideology, it has no nation state, no borders, no military. Fourteen years of war in Afghanistan haven't ended terrorism in Afghanistan. One hundred years of war in Afghanistan won't defeat terrorism in Afghanistan. As soon as we leave, the Taliban will sweep back through Afghanistan and the last fourteen years of war will have been a waste. They already are a waste.

Until we get this very simple notion through our heads and start fighting the ideology of terrorism with a better ideology, we will continue to lose the war on terror.Only problem with that is that we've already tried that route. It failed. The only thing these jihadis know is death and destruction. So I say to hell with diplomacy, it's time to get real with this region and nuke it out of existence.

[Green Arrow]

Only problem with that is that we've already tried that route. It failed. The only thing these jihadis know is death and destruction. So I say to hell with diplomacy, it's time to get real with this region and nuke it out of existence.

We have never tried that.

[Subdermal]

You can't fight an idea with bullets and bombs. You can only fight an idea with better ideas. Terrorism is an ideology, it has no nation state, no borders, no military. Fourteen years of war in Afghanistan haven't ended terrorism in Afghanistan. One hundred years of war in Afghanistan won't defeat terrorism in Afghanistan. As soon as we leave, the Taliban will sweep back through Afghanistan and the last fourteen years of war will have been a waste. They already are a waste.

Until we get this very simple notion through our heads and start fighting the ideology of terrorism with a better ideology, we will continue to lose the war on terror.

I disagree.

Every war is based upon ''ideas''; it's a mischaracterization to claim that this is any different. This war is characterized differently solely due to political correctness.

Terrorism is not an ideology; it is a means to an end: the establishment of an Islamist Caliphate.

Here is what nearly none of the Left - and any other weak-kneed PC type is unwilling to confront: this is a war between The West and Islam. That means every single last country in which Islam is the primary religion is not our ally. There are varying degrees evident of lifting this veil of deceit (Turkey, for instance, continues to grant lipservice to the West in this fight, but it is merely a strategic positioning for territory, as many Muslim sects have historically battled with one another for dominance).

At the end of the day, however, they are all aligned against the West. That is already apparent to me and others; it will become unavoidably evident in the coming years.

That we have so many like Green Arrow utterly neutered to combat this threat properly and ruthlessly is evidence of the strength of the strategy of Taqiyya and the gullible and weak nature of leftism and political correctness.

We have no Muslim allies. There are no truly useful moderate Muslims...not in this battle, anyway.

https://oneway2day.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/radical-muslim-moderate-muslim.jpg

[Green Arrow]

I disagree.

That's nice, but decades of war against terrorism have not defeated terrorism, they've strengthened it and weakened us in the process. History and current events support what I have said.

And for the record, it's easy to sound like a badass on the internet. It's a lot harder to be one in real life. None of your armchair quarterbacking will defeat the enemy.

[Subdermal]

That's nice, but decades of war against terrorism have not defeated terrorism, they've strengthened it and weakened us in the process. History and current events support what I have said.

No, it doesn't. History doesn't; current events only support that trying to fight a PC war with incredulous ROE weakens us and strengthens the enemy.

Obviously.


And for the record, it's easy to sound like a badass on the internet. It's a lot harder to be one in real life. None of your armchair quarterbacking will defeat the enemy.

This last comment is stupidity.

[pjohns]

We have a longstanding tradition in this country--which is usually for the better--of being tolerant of the religion of another person.

It is for this reason, precisely, that many Americans are reticent to criticize Islam.

The problem, however, is this: Islam wishes to aggressively proselytize others; and "infidels" (including Christians and Jews) who will not convert are to be put to death. Either convert or die!

I find it very difficult to be tolerant of such horrible intolerance!

[del]

No, it doesn't. History doesn't; current events only support that trying to fight a PC war with incredulous ROE weakens us and strengthens the enemy.

Obviously.



This last comment is stupidity.

i applaud your self-awareness

[Subdermal]

i applaud your self-awareness

Stick to eating paint chips, dul.

[Common]

We have a longstanding tradition in this country--which is usually for the better--of being tolerant of the religion of another person.

It is for this reason, precisely, that many Americans are reticent to criticize Islam.

The problem, however, is this: Islam wishes to aggressively proselytize others; and "infidels" (including Christians and Jews) who will not convert are to be put to death. Either convert or die!

I find it very difficult to be tolerant of such horrible intolerance!


I dont think some have any problem degrading christians and islam is certainly a religion that wants to wipe all others out

[SemiteArt]

I dont think some have any problem degrading christians and islam is certainly a religion that wants to wipe all others out




The problem, however, is this: Islam wishes to aggressively proselytize others; and "infidels" (including Christians and Jews) who will not convert are to be put to death. Either convert or die!



I always ask the same question. Why something want to wipe all others is allowed in US ?

[Gypsy]

ISIS has already beat the US. They gave us fear and took away our humanity. A nation of immigrants that wants to refuse safety to the very people who are fleeing ISIS. We kill each other at higher rates than the 911 terrorists, mass shootings and school shootings, every damn year! Where is the outrage over that?

[Brett Nortje]

To stop terrorism, we need to either make them happy with the situation, or make ourselves happy with changes. that is the only way to stop terrorism, but, things like suicide bombings will still happen, because there are people revving others up all the time. in fact, it is not about religion any more, more about being unhappy in life, yes? i mean, someone that is happy with their lives would not seek to blow themselves up, would they?

The thing is, with so much to be unhappy about in today's world, it is hard to make everyone happy. my latest solution is to weigh on one side how much american and western lives and offshore is worth, and giving it to the near east to make most of them happy, yes? i mean, maybe they could sell it short to the near east so that they can stay there with all this cool stuff and no western influence?

As for syria, bring in the tear gas, they do not have enough masks.

[Peter1469]

ISIS has already beat the US. They gave us fear and took away our humanity. A nation of immigrants that wants to refuse safety to the very people who are fleeing ISIS. We kill each other at higher rates than the 911 terrorists, mass shootings and school shootings, every damn year! Where is the outrage over that?

Disagree. What have not been beaten.

[Mac-7]

ISIS has already beat the US. They gave us fear and took away our humanity. A nation of immigrants that wants to refuse safety to the very people who are fleeing ISIS. We kill each other at higher rates than the 911 terrorists, mass shootings and school shootings, every damn year! Where is the outrage over that?

Liberals are really stupid to think that 4 billion poor people can immigrate here to find a better life.

[William]

America did not finance the IRA as you suggested. I'm sure some private citizens did just as some help finance current terrorist threats.

I said Americans funded and supported the IRA, and it was not just a few Americans.


While Libya's donation of arms to the IRA in the 1980s has been the most public sign of where the republican movement has previously turned for support, the reality is that North America has been the most important link of all.

Following the emergence of the modern republican movement in 1969, the Provisional IRA quickly turned to its Irish-American supporters for funds and guns.

More than 30 years later, those support networks still exist, although the nature of the relationship has changed during the long road of the peace process. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/1563119.stm

There's loads of links like this one on the 'net.


You now are claiming now that Hitler conducted the holocaust in the name of Christ? Seriously?

I never did that - do you know what a strawman is?


I'm saying that we should try as hard as we can to deplete Islam to the point that they are no longer a threat to modern civilization. And then deplete them even more when and if they look to be reconstituting. They are after all, the greatest evil in the world today.

Islam is no more a threat to modern civilisation or the greates evil in the world today than Judaism or Buddhism or Christianity is. Terrorism and the causes of terrorism are. But none of that makes the statement that we must kill all Muslims right, or any less loony.

[Peter1469]

One of my favorite bars in the French Quarter funded the IRA. I drank there with IRA fighters often.


I said Americans funded and supported the IRA, and it was not just a few Americans.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/1563119.stm

There's loads of links like this one on the 'net.



I never did that - do you know what a strawman is?



Islam is no more a threat to modern civilisation or the greates evil in the world today than Judaism or Buddhism or Christianity is. Terrorism and the causes of terrorism are. But none of that makes the statement that we must kill all Muslims right, or any less loony.

[William]

One of my favorite bars in the French Quarter funded the IRA. I drank there with IRA fighters often.

That's great Peter. :smiley:

I wonder how most Americans would feel if I was to say that some of my favourite people were supporters of the terrorists who attacked the WTC, and I drink with them often? :rollseyes:

[pjohns]

Islam is no more a threat to modern civilisation or the greates evil in the world today than Judaism or Buddhism or Christianity is.

I am currently unaware of any jihadists who wish to destroy Western civilization in the name of "Judaism or Buddhism or Christianity."

[Gypsy]

Liberals are really stupid to think that 4 billion poor people can immigrate here to find a better life.
4 Billion? Where do you get your information? lol

[Tahuyaman]

I said Americans funded and supported the IRA, and it was not just a few Americans.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/1563119.stm

There's loads of links like this one on the 'net.



I never did that - do you know what a strawman is?



Islam is no more a threat to modern civilisation or the greates evil in the world today than Judaism or Buddhism or Christianity is. Terrorism and the causes of terrorism are. But none of that makes the statement that we must kill all Muslims right, or any less loony.


You said "America" funded the IRA. you did state that the holocaust was executed in the name of Christianity and your final statement in this one is obscene at best.

[Mac-7]

4 Billion? Where do you get your information? lol

The only arguement for bringing the syrians is pure emotionalism because life is hard for them in syria.

That applies to at least 4 billion other people in the world

[Tahuyaman]

One of my favorite bars in the French Quarter funded the IRA. I drank there with IRA fighters often.

In the French quarter? I would have never have suspected anything in the French quarter being sympathetic to the IRA.

[Tahuyaman]

I am currently unaware of any jihadists who wish to destroy Western civilization in the name of "Judaism or Buddhism or Christianity."


Thats because use those elements do not exist.

[Tahuyaman]

That's great Peter. :smiley:

I wonder how most Americans would feel if I was to say that some of my favourite people were supporters of the terrorists who attacked the WTC, and I drink with them often? :rollseyes:

Most of us would say that what you think is immaterial and you are not alone anyway.

we have Americans right here on this forum who love those people who attacked us on 9/11.

[donttread]

The wise man says: "Wannna stop getting stung , quit pokin the bee hive

[Subdermal]

That's great Peter. :smiley:

I wonder how most Americans would feel if I was to say that some of my favourite people were supporters of the terrorists who attacked the WTC, and I drink with them often? :rollseyes:

An 18yr old gets rubbed raw in one sentence.


Interesting.

[Truth Detector]

The wise man says: "Wannna stop getting stung , quit pokin the bee hive

A wise man would comprehend that it wasn't "us" that poked them. DUH.

[Subdermal]

I said Americans funded and supported the IRA, and it was not just a few Americans.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/1563119.stm

There's loads of links like this one on the 'net.



I never did that - do you know what a strawman is?



Islam is no more a threat to modern civilisation or the greates evil in the world today than Judaism or Buddhism or Christianity is. Terrorism and the causes of terrorism are. But none of that makes the statement that we must kill all Muslims right, or any less loony.

So the fake persona disappears.

[Mac-7]

So the fake persona disappears.

Are you thinking what I'm thinking?

[donttread]

A wise man would comprehend that it wasn't "us" that poked them. DUH.

Really, how can you possibly make that assertion.

[Truth Detector]

Really, how can you possibly make that assertion.

Do tell how we "poked" them.

[Peter1469]

That's great Peter. :smiley:

I wonder how most Americans would feel if I was to say that some of my favourite people were supporters of the terrorists who attacked the WTC, and I drink with them often? :rollseyes:

Who cares? What does the word Aly mean to you?

[Peter1469]

In the French quarter? I would have never have suspected anything in the French quarter being sympathetic to the IRA.

An Irish Pub. It is no longer there.

[Tahuyaman]

Who cares? What does the word Aly mean to you?Aly who? Aly McGraw?

I doubt he knows what an ally is as well?

[Peter1469]

Aly who? Aly McGraw?

I doubt he knows what an ally is as well?

A different one.

[Tahuyaman]

An Irish Pub. It is no longer there.

I've only been to New Orleans once for a weekend and I don't remember seeing an Irish pub anywhere. But then I'm still laughing about one of you fellow mods in another thread saying that truth serum is a valuable tool in interrogating an Islamic terrorist.

[Peter1469]

I've only been to New Orleans once for a weekend and I don't remember seeing an Irish pub anywhere. But then I'm still laughing about one of you fellow mods in another thread saying that truth serum is a valuable tool in interrogating an Islamic terrorist.

It was off the beaten track.

[donttread]

Do tell how we "poked" them.

CIA in Iran in 79, BEFORE the embassy was taken , the unjustified invasion and occupation of Iraq, kid killing drone strikes in allied territory like Pakistan, "Charlie Wilson's War", arming many of the countries in the region including those who do not care for each other to name but a few pokes. They're crazy bastards and we should stop fucking with the internal politics of virtually every country in the ME.

[donttread]

That's great Peter. :smiley:

I wonder how most Americans would feel if I was to say that some of my favourite people were supporters of the terrorists who attacked the WTC, and I drink with them often? :rollseyes:


Terrorism is a relative term, usually relative to who's committing the terroizing acts. For example, dropping two nukes on Japan= not terrorism but

[Peter1469]

Terrorism is a relative term, usually relative to who's committing the terroizing acts. For example, dropping two nukes on Japan= not terrorism but

Right. We know you don't have a conception of the term sovereign.

[pjohns]

The wise man says: "Wannna stop getting stung , quit pokin the bee hive

This seems to imply that Americans have brought terrorism upon ourselves.

In short, that it is really our own fault...

[Truth Detector]

CIA in Iran in 79, BEFORE the embassy was taken ,

What does the CIA being in Iran have to do with the international scandal of occupying a nations embassy and holding that nations citizens hostage which is an act of war?


the unjustified invasion and occupation of Iraq,

That's a BS claim in that we didn't invade Iraq until after it had invaded Kuwait and defied UN resolutions for more than a decade in a POST 9-11 world.


kid killing drone strikes in allied territory like Pakistan,

So now you are claiming we are targeting kids; you are quite full of the fabricated BS aren't you?


"Charlie Wilson's War",

So we should have just looked the other way when Russia invaded and occupied Afghanistan and pretended there was no cold war?

Why is it you AmeriKa haters always give tyrants and despots a pass while blaming the USA?


arming many of the countries in the region including those who do not care for each other to name but a few pokes.

Another BS claim. The only nation we assisted with arms was Iran because it was a counter act against the massive arming the Soviet Union was doing for Egypt, Iraq and Syria.

Why is it you AmeriKa haters always give tyrants and despots a pass while blaming the USA?


They're crazy $#@!s and we should stop $#@!ing with the internal politics of virtually every country in the ME.

Once again you exhibit complete and utter historical ifgnorance pretending that Imperial Europe and Soviet expansionism didn't create the mess in the ME.

I can't say I am the least surprised. AmeriKa haters are known for their historic ignorance and buffoonish anti-AmeriKa emotional hysterics.

[Truth Detector]

Terrorism is a relative term, usually relative to who's committing the terroizing acts. For example, dropping two nukes on Japan= not terrorism but

Another incredibly stupid claim; you seem quite full of them. So tell me, why do you hate AmeriKa so much? Historical ignorance? Reading too many conspiracy blogs?

[pjohns]

[We "poked" them by the] CIA [being] in Iran in 79, BEFORE the embassy was taken , the unjustified invasion and occupation of Iraq, kid killing drone strikes in allied territory like Pakistan, "Charlie Wilson's War", arming many of the countries in the region including those who do not care for each other to name but a few pokes.

Did the war in Iraq begin prior to 1979?

Oh, and did the war in Afghanistan ("Charlie Wilson's War") begin prior to 1979?

And why should anything the US did in Pakistan be considered moral justification for Iranian terrorism?

[Green Arrow]

What does the CIA being in Iran have to do with the international scandal of occupying a nations embassy and holding that nations citizens hostage which is an act of war?

Is deposing a democratically elected leader of a country an act of war?


That's a BS claim in that we didn't invade Iraq until after it had invaded Kuwait and defied UN resolutions for more than a decade in a POST 9-11 world.

Iraq invaded Kuwait eleven years before 9/11 and we liberated Kuwait from Iraq in 1991, ten years before 9/11.

[donttread]

Right. We know you don't have a conception of the term sovereign.


Is that the word that made child murder OK?

[Tahuyaman]

Terrorism is a relative term, usually relative to who's committing the terroizing acts. For example, dropping two nukes on Japan= not terrorism but

that was engaging in a war.

[Green Arrow]

Is that the word that made child murder OK?

Murder has to have intent, so unless you're arguing that the U.S. government has intentionally targeted children, your claim of "child murder" is just hyper-exaggerated nonsense.

[William]

Who cares? What does the word Aly mean to you?

Well, I know you and some other people here don't think I'm important (and Lol, neither do I,:grin:) but I care that a decent bloke like you should write that you enjoy the company of people who supported terror attacks and killing nearly 2,000 people in my country. Do you know how that feels?

I would find the people who attacked your country, killing nearly 3,000 people, disgusting, and I wouldn't give them a hello, let alone drink with them. And I haven't got the foggiest idea what Aly is supposed to mean. :huh:

[William]

Most of us would say that what you think is immaterial and you are not alone anyway.

we have Americans right here on this forum who love those people who attacked us on 9/11.

Wtf are you talking about - I wouldn't piss on the people who attacked you on 9/11 if they were on fire. Which is why I was shocked that Peter said he drinks with the people who supported the IRA.

And sure, a lot of people on here have made it clear that what I think is not important - so what? Does my face look bothered! :grin:

[Green Arrow]

Wtf are you talking about - I wouldn't piss on the people who attacked you on 9/11 if they were on fire. Which is why I was shocked that Peter said he drinks with the people who supported the IRA.

And sure, a lot of people on here have made it clear that what I think is not important - so what? Does my face look bothered! :grin:

I like your Kahlil Gibran quote.

[zelmo1234]

You can't fight an idea with bullets and bombs. You can only fight an idea with better ideas. Terrorism is an ideology, it has no nation state, no borders, no military. Fourteen years of war in Afghanistan haven't ended terrorism in Afghanistan. One hundred years of war in Afghanistan won't defeat terrorism in Afghanistan. As soon as we leave, the Taliban will sweep back through Afghanistan and the last fourteen years of war will have been a waste. They already are a waste.

Until we get this very simple notion through our heads and start fighting the ideology of terrorism with a better ideology, we will continue to lose the war on terror.

Actually this is Totally and completely false on so many levels.

So lets start with the easy ones. #1 We have not been fighting a war in Afghanistan for 14 years. we have been trying to change ideas with better ones.

Second, in WWII we defeated the ideology of Imperial Japan, which was a ruthless ideology, and Fascism, and we did this with bombs and bullets, and by actually fighting a war.

We did not provide a better idea, we killed them. And that is what is called for as we fight the members of the Islamic Religion, that have decided that killing innocent people and forcing them to convert is a good ideology to have

[Tahuyaman]

Wtf are you talking about - I wouldn't piss on the people who attacked you on 9/11 if they were on fire.

well, there are American liberal's here who are not with you on that one.

[Green Arrow]

Actually this is Totally and completely false on so many levels.

Yet, like others who disagreed with my statement, you probably aren't going to actually prove it.


So lets start with the easy ones. #1 We have not been fighting a war in Afghanistan for 14 years. we have been trying to change ideas with better ones.

Yeah, nice try, but that's bullshit. You can disagree with how we are fighting the war but you cannot deny that it is indeed a war. That's just laughable.


Second, in WWII we defeated the ideology of Imperial Japan, which was a ruthless ideology, and Fascism, and we did this with bombs and bullets, and by actually fighting a war.

Except again, Imperial Japan and the fascist states of Nazi Germany and Italy were nation states with armies. Terrorists are not nation states and have no armies, as I said in my post. You are comparing apples to oranges.

[William]

well, there are American liberal's here who are not with you on that one.

I say this with respect, but I think you might be mistaken. I cannot imagine any sane person supporting the inhuman behaviour of Islamic State or Al Qaeda, let alone approving of killing innocent men, women, and children in terror attacks.

What I have seen here, are Americans who have said this form of terrorism is a great evil, but have also said that it is a complex problem, which we all (not just Americans) have helped to create. I have not seen one person here say that the attacks on the WTC and Washington were justified, or OK in any way.

The fact that your party politics are different from each other, doesn't make one lot better or worse than the other, and I don't believe that any American wants to see other Americans killed by terrorists.