Gun Nut Logic

[Cigar]

http://upload.democraticunderground.com/imgs/2015/151207-gun-nut-logic.jpg

Man accidentally shoots friend at Phoenix gun show shortly after buying handgun (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/man-accidentally-shoots-friend-phoenix-gun-show-article-1.2456913) :lipsrsealed20:

[zelmo1234]

The sign does not refer to concealed carry but weapons being brought to buy, sell or get appraised.

And it was not a accidental shooting it was a Negligent shooting.

I would change the sign to say all guns in the show are loaded! That would set the proper mind set

[Cigar]

The sign does not refer to concealed carry but weapons being brought to buy, sell or get appraised.

And it was not a accidental shooting it was a Negligent shooting.

I would change the sign to say all guns in the show are loaded! That would set the proper mind set

... and eliminate a lot of issues, the old fashioned way.

[zelmo1234]

... and eliminate a lot of issues, the old fashioned way.

???????

Are you sure you own a Gun?

[Cigar]

???????

Are you sure you own a Gun?

Yep, haven't accidentally shot anyone

[Chris]

The sign does not refer to concealed carry but weapons being brought to buy, sell or get appraised.

And it was not a accidental shooting it was a Negligent shooting.

I would change the sign to say all guns in the show are loaded! That would set the proper mind set



So "No Loaded Guns in the Show" means none of the guns on sale are loaded.

[Cletus]

The rule of "No loaded guns" at gun shows is a reasonable one. There is simply too much handling of firearms going on by people of varying skill and gun handling knowledge to assume that everyone who picks a firearm up to look at it is going to clear it. I have a policy of no ammunition at all in my classroom when I am teaching a defensive shooting class. I don't care about your experience level, if we keep it physically out of the classroom, we don't have to worry about loaded magazine making its way into a firearm.

It is the same principle at a gun show. Most of the people there are going to be very conscientious and handle the available firearms safely, but it only takes a moment's inattention to cause a tragedy.

[Cletus]

On a side note, since Obama took office, Americans have purchased over 100 million new guns. :cool2:

[Cigar]

On a side note, since Obama took office, Americans have purchased over 100 million new guns. :cool2:

Good, then they should not be so afraid :laugh:

[zelmo1234]

So "No Loaded Guns in the Show" means none of the guns on sale are loaded.

Correct Concealed Carry is usually permitted in Gun show's unless the venue will hold more than 25,000 people

And advertising that Guns are not loaded is dangerous. I am of the Col. Jeff Cooper School All Guns are Always loaded,

Why would they not be, as they are useless if they are not loaded. This keeps peoples minds in the right place.

[zelmo1234]

The rule of "No loaded guns" at gun shows is a reasonable one. There is simply too much handling of firearms going on by people of varying skill and gun handling knowledge to assume that everyone who picks a firearm up to look at it is going to clear it. I have a policy of no ammunition at all in my classroom when I am teaching a defensive shooting class. I don't care about your experience level, if we keep it physically out of the classroom, we don't have to worry about loaded magazine making its way into a firearm.

It is the same principle at a gun show. Most of the people there are going to be very conscientious and handle the available firearms safely, but it only takes a moment's inattention to cause a tragedy.

May I suggest that you turn to air soft and training (blue) guns. We do not allow guns in our training classrooms. the range is a totally different story of course. The initial investment is a bit hard to swallow, but airsoft and do almost anything that the real deal can do

[zelmo1234]

The rule of "No loaded guns" at gun shows is a reasonable one. There is simply too much handling of firearms going on by people of varying skill and gun handling knowledge to assume that everyone who picks a firearm up to look at it is going to clear it. I have a policy of no ammunition at all in my classroom when I am teaching a defensive shooting class. I don't care about your experience level, if we keep it physically out of the classroom, we don't have to worry about loaded magazine making its way into a firearm.

It is the same principle at a gun show. Most of the people there are going to be very conscientious and handle the available firearms safely, but it only takes a moment's inattention to cause a tragedy.

That is why the sign should read all guns are always loaded, Get the people in the habit of checking each and every firearm that they have in their hands

[zelmo1234]

Yep, haven't accidentally shot anyone

You are correct it is impossible to accidentally shoot anyone. you can Negligently shoot someone though

[Cletus]

May I suggest that you turn to air soft and training (blue) guns. We do not allow guns in our training classrooms. the range is a totally different story of course. The initial investment is a bit hard to swallow, but airsoft and do almost anything that the real deal can do

Airsoft and Blue guns have their place, but they are not a valid substitute for a real gun. There are of course, things you would not want to do in training with an actual firearm, but for the most part, it is best to make sure your people are intimately familiar with the firearms they carry. I want them to handle them, to work with them, to manipulate them, to clear them, to load them (with dummy rounds), to do tactical reloads, combat (speed) reloads, to clear malfunctions, and I want them to do them with the gun they are carrying.

I do a lot of demonstrating using a Blue Gun, but that is because I don;t want to worry about crossing someone with the muzzle of an actual firearm. For practicing the use of cover and concealment, an airsoft gun is a great training tool, but nothing will get you as familiar with the firearm you are going to carry and depend on to save your life as handling the firearm you are going to carry and depend on to save your life.

[zelmo1234]

Airsoft and Blue guns have their place, but they are not a valid substitute for a real gun. There are of course, things you would not want to do in training with an actual firearm, but for the most part, it is best to make sure your people are intimately familiar with the firearms they carry. I want them to handle them, to work with them, to manipulate them, to clear them, to load them (with dummy rounds), to do tactical reloads, combat (speed) reloads, to clear malfunctions, and I want them to do them with the gun they are carrying.

I do a lot of demonstrating using a Blue Gun, but that is because I don;t want to worry about crossing someone with the muzzle of an actual firearm. For practicing the use of cover and concealment, an airsoft gun is a great training tool, but nothing will get you as familiar with the firearm you are going to carry and depend on to save your life as handling the firearm you are going to carry and depend on to save your life.

I take it you don't have much range time in your classes.

Nearly everything on your list can be taught with an airsoft. we do let them bring in Mags and practice with snap cap rounds. But we are a 50/50 class with most being 12 hours of class room and 12 hours of range time.

I would not sit through one of your classes. too dangerous to have that many firearms in that situation.

I do have one leaded barrel gun that we use so people can tell if their is a round in the gun. But even that one is painted orange.

Now if you don't have access to that kind of range time. I understand, but it would suck,

[Cletus]

I take it you don't have much range time in your classes.

You assume incorrectly.


Nearly everything on your list can be taught with an airsoft. we do let them bring in Mags and practice with snap cap rounds. But we are a 50/50 class with most being 12 hours of class room and 12 hours of range time.


I would not sit through one of your classes. too dangerous to have that many firearms in that situation.

Really? You are supposedly training people to carry loaded guns on the street, but you are afraid to have those same guns in the controlled environment of a classroom? I have trained everyone from housewives who have never fired a gun in their lives to SWAT operators. I have never had an AD in the classroom or on the range. We do things on the range that would probably make most junior league firearms instructors cringe, but at the end of day, we turn out people who are actually ready to use their firearms in a defensive situation, not people who received just enough training to make them dangerous to themselves and those around them. Maybe you are just not ready to train on that level.

I always make a point of telling people though, that I do not have them long enough to turn them into Pistoleros, but when they leave here, they leave with a good solid foundation and just as importantly, a good knowledge of where they need to direct their training to take it to an even higher level. It is because of the way I train, and the fact that I can back it with practical, real world experience, that most of my referrals are actually from Law Enforcement.

If I ever decide to teach a "First Steps" program, I will consider your advice regarding guns on the classroom, but I train defensive shooters... gunfighters. There is a big difference. If they can't be trusted in a classroom, I sure don't want them carrying a gun on the street.


I do have one leaded barrel gun that we use so people can tell if their is a round in the gun. But even that one is painted orange.

I am not even going to pretend to know what you mean by that.


Now if you don't have access to that kind of range time. I understand, but it would suck,

I built my own range on 17 acres about 15 years ago. Probably within the next year or two, I will be moving the range to a piece of property that will let me reach out to 1000 meters for precision rifle students. I have unlimited access to range time.

[HoneyBadger]

I would not sit through one of your classes. too dangerous to have that many firearms in that situation.



I use real unloaded firearms in my classes. At the beginning of class, I check each firearm, lock the slide back or open the cylinder and each student is required to verify that each and every firearm is unloaded. This is an important component in teaching firearms safety. They need to learn how to verify a firearm is safe to handle AND they need to understand an unloaded firearm isn't going to jump off the table, load itself and start firing without human intervention. These students are going to be carrying a firearm on the street, in public. If I can't trust them to manipulate an unloaded gun, how can I recommend that the state license them to carry a loaded weapon?

[Cletus]

If I can't trust them to manipulate an unloaded gun, how can I recommend that the state license them to carry a loaded weapon?

Bingo!

That was worth putting in bold print.

[zelmo1234]

You assume incorrectly.

Really? You are supposedly training people to carry loaded guns on the street, but you are afraid to have those same guns in the controlled environment of a classroom? I have trained everyone from housewives who have never fired a gun in their lives to SWAT operators. I have never had an AD in the classroom or on the range. We do things on the range that would probably make most junior league firearms instructors cringe, but at the end of day, we turn out people who are actually ready to use their firearms in a defensive situation, not people who received just enough training to make them dangerous to themselves and those around them. Maybe you are just not ready to train on that level.

I always make a point of telling people though, that I do not have them long enough to turn them into Pistoleros, but when they leave here, they leave with a good solid foundation and just as importantly, a good knowledge of where they need to direct their training to take it to an even higher level. It is because of the way I train, and the fact that I can back it with practical, real world experience, that most of my referrals are actually from Law Enforcement.

If I ever decide to teach a "First Steps" program, I will consider your advice regarding guns on the classroom, but I train defensive shooters... gunfighters. There is a big difference. If they can't be trusted in a classroom, I sure don't want them carrying a gun on the street.



I am not even going to pretend to know what you mean by that.



I built my own range on 17 acres about 15 years ago. Probably within the next year or two, I will be moving the range to a piece of property that will let me reach out to 1000 meters for precision rifle students. I have unlimited access to range time.

Sorry! I don't think I am going to take up your system. I think you are a tuff guy trainer. if you are doing CPL and CCW classes you are training then to get killed and if you have done it long enough you have been called into court to testify that they are not qualified after the one day courses.

WE donate time to do safety training, CPL programs. We charge for any advanced training including Active shooter Training in which we train SWAT, Homeland. police FBI and SS.

but what do I know.

[zelmo1234]

I use real unloaded firearms in my classes. At the beginning of class, I check each firearm, lock the slide back or open the cylinder and each student is required to verify that each and every firearm is unloaded. This is an important component in teaching firearms safety. They need to learn how to verify a firearm is safe to handle AND they need to understand an unloaded firearm isn't going to jump off the table, load itself and start firing without human intervention. These students are going to be carrying a firearm on the street, in public. If I can't trust them to manipulate an unloaded gun, how can I recommend that the state license them to carry a loaded weapon?

All that is Great, and it is exactly what we do with the 8 or 12 hours of range time, depending on the class.

Si tell me do you do a mental background check on the people that take your classes too?

If you have sufficient range time you are teaching generalities and legal in the class room. where you don't have time to go through every make and model. If you have sufficient staff at the range you can separate the Wheel Gunners from the Auto's and then break down from there.

I do not support the use of potential novices using real weapons in the class room. But here is a test to see how good you are.

buy a bunch of the little dart guns, you know the ones with the little suction cups. Every time you cover one of them with the muzzle of the gun, have them shoot you.

[MisterVeritis]

On a side note, since Obama took office, Americans have purchased over 100 million new guns. :cool2:
Once the crowds thin I will buy either a Glock or a Sig Sauer 9mm.

[nic34]

The sign does not refer to concealed carry but weapons being brought to buy, sell or get appraised.

And it was not a accidental shooting it was a Negligent shooting.

I would change the sign to say all guns in the show are loaded! That would set the proper mind set

Negligent shooting

Gun control's best argument.

[zelmo1234]

Once the crowds thin I will buy either a Glock or a Sig Sauer 9mm.

Are you going to carry it , or is it for home protection?

[nic34]

On a side note, since Obama took office, Americans have purchased over 100 million new guns. :cool2:

Guess he isn't grabbing guns fast enough after all.

[zelmo1234]

Negligent shooting

Gun control's best argument.

NO it is not. Because if it is negligent then they have broken the law and should be prosecuted for Felony firearms, which the Obama administration does not do or does very rarely.

You need them to be accidental, because then it could happen to anyone, and thus nobody should own a gun.

Nice try though.

[Ethereal]

Guess he isn't grabbing guns fast enough after all.

Only because we won't let him.

[Cletus]

Once the crowds thin I will buy either a Glock or a Sig Sauer 9mm.

Both excellent guns. My daily carry is a Glock 32, while my duty gun is Glock 31. I just happen to be particularly fond of the .357 Sig cartridge.

Sig makes an excellent handgun. I don't own any personally, but many of my associates do and I have trained a fair amount with them. I am quite fond of the P229, although I can't think of any in the series that isn't top notch.

[AeonPax]

On a side note, since Obama took office, Americans have purchased over 100 million new guns. :cool2:
`
Nothing to brag about, in fact, just the opposite.

[Chris]

On a side note, since Obama took office, Americans have purchased over 100 million new guns. :cool2:

Well, damn, give Obama credit for accomplishing something!

[Matty]

`
Nothing to brag about, in fact, just the opposite.


Jobs jobs jobs.

[Cigar]

Well, damn, give Obama credit for accomplishing something!

He sure knows how to scare the crap out of Conservatives :laugh:

[Ethereal]

`
Nothing to brag about, in fact, just the opposite.

I think it's fantastic. The more guns in the hands of citizens, the more difficult it will be to impose totalitarianism on us.

What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance?
--Thomas Jefferson

[Cletus]

Sorry! I don't think I am going to take up your system. I think you are a tuff guy trainer. if you are doing CPL and CCW classes you are training then to get killed and if you have done it long enough you have been called into court to testify that they are not qualified after the one day courses.

WE donate time to do safety training, CPL programs. We charge for any advanced training including Active shooter Training in which we train SWAT, Homeland. police FBI and SS.

but what do I know.

I think it best we terminate this exchange before I decide to dissect you in front of the entire forum. So, for the sake of civility, I will bow out of this and you will get to keep pretending you know what you are talking about.

[Cigar]

:happy1: Going to get Buck-Wilde up in here? :laugh:

[Cletus]

:happy1: Going to get Buck-Wilde up in here? :laugh:

Nah, he has been dismissed.

[MisterVeritis]

He sure knows how to scare the crap out of Conservatives :laugh:
Obama knows how to scare more weapons and ammunition into our hands.

[MisterVeritis]

Are you going to carry it , or is it for home protection?
Carry. Your thoughts?

[Cigar]

Obama knows how to scare more weapons and ammunition into our hands.

Then discharged to Foot. :laugh:

[MisterVeritis]

Then discharged to Foot. :laugh:
Do you believe the hundred million or so weapons owners are having weapons discharge accidents? I suppose a few will.

[Tahuyaman]

http://upload.democraticunderground.com/imgs/2015/151207-gun-nut-logic.jpg

Man accidentally shoots friend at Phoenix gun show shortly after buying handgun (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/man-accidentally-shoots-friend-phoenix-gun-show-article-1.2456913) :lipsrsealed20:

why do you worry about this? Do you attend gun shows?

[Cigar]

Denver Police Officer Critically Hurt In Traffic Stop ShootingDENVER (CBS4) – A Denver police officer was shot multiple times and in critical condition following a violent confrontation during a traffic stop on Federal Boulevard late Tuesday morning.

The traffic stop happened just after 11:20 a.m. near the intersection of 37th and Federal Boulevard. Multiple shots were exchanged between the officer and the suspect or suspects. One suspect was injured and apprehended. It’s believed two other suspects are at large.

“The officer is currently in critical condition. He is in the operating room,” said Dr. Christopher Colwell of Denver Health Medical Center. “His condition has stabilized for the moment. I’m cautiously optimistic.”

Denver Police Chief Robert White said the officer’s name is not being released while they contact family members.

The officer was wearing a bullet-proof vest.


http://denver.cbslocal.com/2015/12/08/officer-involved-shooting-reported-in-denver/


The Wild Wild West ... Gus for Everyone, because it Stops Bad Guys :rollseyes:

http://ww3.hdnux.com/photos/13/40/72/3018386/3/628x471.jpg

[Tahuyaman]

Do you believe the hundred million or so weapons owners are having weapons discharge accidents? I suppose a few will.


Whats the liberal default response here...... Let's see.

If we can prevent only one needless death, it's worth it. Something like that anyway.

[MisterVeritis]

Whats the liberal default response here...... Let's see.

If we can prevent only one needless death, it's worth it. Something like that anyway.
Defunding Planned Parenthood could save millions of lives.

[Tahuyaman]

Defunding Planned Parenthood could save millions of lives.

to liberals, that's different.

[AeonPax]

I think it's fantastic. The more guns in the hands of citizens, the more difficult it will be to impose totalitarianism on us.What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance?--Thomas Jefferson
`
I'm not particularly enlightened by baby boomers these days and therefore not inclined to trust their judgement skills.

[Mister D]

`
I'm not particularly enlightened by baby boomers these days and therefore not inclined to trust their judgement skills.

He's younger than you, granny.

[AeonPax]

He's younger than you, granny.
`
That's actually worse.....someone under 33 that sounds like they are 68.

[Cigar]

Defunding Planned Parenthood could save millions of lives.

But what if they are from Democratic parents?

That's a lot of Obamacare :grin:

[Ethereal]

`
I'm not particularly enlightened by baby boomers these days and therefore not inclined to trust their judgement skills.

I'm pretty sure baby-boomers are not the only ones buying firearms.

[del]

I think it best we terminate this exchange before I decide to dissect you in front of the entire forum. So, for the sake of civility, I will bow out of this and you will get to keep pretending you know what you are talking about.

:rofl:

battle of the blowhards

[Ethereal]

`
That's actually worse.....someone under 33 that sounds like they are 68.

A love of liberty makes me sound old? Strange logic, especially when one considers how many of the founding fathers were below the age of 35 in 1776.



Andrew Jackson, 9
Thomas Young, 12
Deborah Sampson, 15
James Armistead, 15
Joseph Plumb Martin, 15
Peter Salem, 16*
Peggy Shippen, 16
Marquis de Lafayette, 18
James Monroe, 18
Henry Lee III, 20
Gilbert Stuart, 20
John Trumbull, 20
Aaron Burr, 20
John Marshall, 20
Nathan Hale, 21
Banastre Tarleton, 21
Alexander Hamilton, 21*
Benjamin Tallmadge, 22
Robert Townsend, 22
George Rodgers Clark, 23
David Humphreys, 23
Gouveneur Morris, 24
Betsy Ross, 24
William Washington, 24
James Madison, 25
Henry Knox, 25
John Andre, 26
Thomas Lynch, Jr., 26^
Edward Rutledge, 26^
Abraham Woodhull, 26
Isaiah Thomas, 27
George Walton, 27*^
John Paul Jones, 28
Bernardo de Galvez, 29
Thomas Heyward, Jr., 29^
Robert R. Livingston, 29
John Jay, 30
Tadeusz Kosciuszko, 30
Benjamin Rush, 30^
Abigail Adams, 31
John Barry, 31
Elbridge Gerry, 31^
Casimir Pulaski, 31
Anthony Wayne, 31
Joseph Brant, 33
Nathanael Greene, 33
Thomas Jefferson, 33^
Thomas Stone, 33*^
William Hooper, 34^
Arthur Middleton, 34^
James Wilson, 34*^
Benedict Arnold, 35
Samuel Chase, 35^
Thomas Knowlton, 35
William Paca, 35^
John Penn, 35^

[del]

Defunding Planned Parenthood could save millions of lives.

never going to happen, mostly because the majority of americans don't want it to.

[Captain Obvious]

never going to happen, mostly because the majority of americans don't want it to.

How cute, he thinks popular opinion drives our legislators.

See Virginia, there really is a Santa Clause after all.

:biglaugh:

[Captain Obvious]

So since this is basically a bait thread, I guess I can go ahead and just troll it.

"GUNS... GUNS.... GUNS!!! When will the go away!!!" :grin:

[del]

How cute, he thinks popular opinion drives our legislators.

See Virginia, there really is a Santa Clause after all.

:biglaugh:


it does in an election year, rufus

i just sent the woodchipper in for service-gonna be a busy year turning the unborn *children* into dogfood

[Common Sense]

So since this is basically a bait thread, I guess I can go ahead and just troll it.

"GUNS... GUNS.... GUNS!!! When will the go away!!!" :grin:

Sort of like "why progressives are idiots"? ;)

[del]

Sort of like "why progressives are idiots"? ;)

no, that was a serious quest for enlightenment

[Captain Obvious]

Sort of like "why progressives are idiots"? ;)

I had the good taste to put it in Rants

[Captain Obvious]

no, that was a serious quest for enlightenment

Yes it was, thank you.

It's quite the popular thread too.

[del]

Yes it was, thank you.

It's quite the popular thread too.

it's quite the amalgamation of stupid

i'm sure you're very proud

[Mister D]

`
That's actually worse.....someone under 33 that sounds like they are 68.

Not sure why you'd say he sounds like a Baby Boomer but, quite frankly, I don't think you are either. Maybe you're just getting old. :smiley:

[Mister D]

A love of liberty makes me sound old? Strange logic, especially when one considers how many of the founding fathers were below the age of 35 in 1776.



Andrew Jackson, 9
Thomas Young, 12
Deborah Sampson, 15
James Armistead, 15
Joseph Plumb Martin, 15
Peter Salem, 16*
Peggy Shippen, 16
Marquis de Lafayette, 18
James Monroe, 18
Henry Lee III, 20
Gilbert Stuart, 20
John Trumbull, 20
Aaron Burr, 20
John Marshall, 20
Nathan Hale, 21
Banastre Tarleton, 21
Alexander Hamilton, 21*
Benjamin Tallmadge, 22
Robert Townsend, 22
George Rodgers Clark, 23
David Humphreys, 23
Gouveneur Morris, 24
Betsy Ross, 24
William Washington, 24
James Madison, 25
Henry Knox, 25
John Andre, 26
Thomas Lynch, Jr., 26^
Edward Rutledge, 26^
Abraham Woodhull, 26
Isaiah Thomas, 27
George Walton, 27*^
John Paul Jones, 28
Bernardo de Galvez, 29
Thomas Heyward, Jr., 29^
Robert R. Livingston, 29
John Jay, 30
Tadeusz Kosciuszko, 30
Benjamin Rush, 30^
Abigail Adams, 31
John Barry, 31
Elbridge Gerry, 31^
Casimir Pulaski, 31
Anthony Wayne, 31
Joseph Brant, 33
Nathanael Greene, 33
Thomas Jefferson, 33^
Thomas Stone, 33*^
William Hooper, 34^
Arthur Middleton, 34^
James Wilson, 34*^
Benedict Arnold, 35
Samuel Chase, 35^
Thomas Knowlton, 35
William Paca, 35^
John Penn, 35^



It's bizarre logic. If anything, a passionate defense of...well anything makes one sound young.

[Mister D]

A love of liberty makes me sound old? Strange logic, especially when one considers how many of the founding fathers were below the age of 35 in 1776.



Andrew Jackson, 9
Thomas Young, 12
Deborah Sampson, 15
James Armistead, 15
Joseph Plumb Martin, 15
Peter Salem, 16*
Peggy Shippen, 16
Marquis de Lafayette, 18
James Monroe, 18
Henry Lee III, 20
Gilbert Stuart, 20
John Trumbull, 20
Aaron Burr, 20
John Marshall, 20
Nathan Hale, 21
Banastre Tarleton, 21
Alexander Hamilton, 21*
Benjamin Tallmadge, 22
Robert Townsend, 22
George Rodgers Clark, 23
David Humphreys, 23
Gouveneur Morris, 24
Betsy Ross, 24
William Washington, 24
James Madison, 25
Henry Knox, 25
John Andre, 26
Thomas Lynch, Jr., 26^
Edward Rutledge, 26^
Abraham Woodhull, 26
Isaiah Thomas, 27
George Walton, 27*^
John Paul Jones, 28
Bernardo de Galvez, 29
Thomas Heyward, Jr., 29^
Robert R. Livingston, 29
John Jay, 30
Tadeusz Kosciuszko, 30
Benjamin Rush, 30^
Abigail Adams, 31
John Barry, 31
Elbridge Gerry, 31^
Casimir Pulaski, 31
Anthony Wayne, 31
Joseph Brant, 33
Nathanael Greene, 33
Thomas Jefferson, 33^
Thomas Stone, 33*^
William Hooper, 34^
Arthur Middleton, 34^
James Wilson, 34*^
Benedict Arnold, 35
Samuel Chase, 35^
Thomas Knowlton, 35
William Paca, 35^
John Penn, 35^



BTW, how the heck did Banastre Tarleton make it on a list of founding fathers? He's my kind of people. :grin: Interesting though. I didn't know he was that young when war broke out. Only 22 or 23

[Ethereal]

BTW, how the heck did Banastre Tarleton make it on a list of founding fathers? He's my kind of people. :grin: Interesting though. I didn't know he was that young when war broke out. Only 22 or 23

It was a list of "key participants" in the American revolution. Here is the original link: Founding Teenagers: How Old Were They on July 4, 1776? (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/todd-andrlik/founding-teenagers_b_3751938.html)

[AeonPax]

A love of liberty makes me sound old? Strange logic, especially when one considers how many of the founding fathers were below the age of 35 in 1776.
`
I'm not referring to "Founding Fathers" nor people from 1776. I'm talking about "Baby Boomers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_boomers)".

[Mark III]

On a side note, since Obama took office, Americans have purchased over 100 million new guns. :cool2:

All that does is show us how fucking nuts a lot of people are. How many guns has Obama confiscated ? What confiscation law did he propose ?

People think the 2nd amendment guarantees that there can be no gun regulations, when that is simply not the case and no supreme court has ever ruled that such is the case. Guns can be regulated and will continue to be regulated in various ways, including what types of weapons are allowed.

[Cletus]

All that does is show us how fucking nuts a lot of people are. How many guns has Obama confiscated ? What confiscation law did he propose ?

People think the 2nd amendment guarantees that there can be no gun regulations, when that is simply not the case and no supreme court has ever ruled that such is the case. Guns can be regulated and will continue to be regulated in various ways, including what types of weapons are allowed.

That issue was actually settled during the debates over the Second Amendment at the time it was proposed.

[Mark III]

That issue was actually settled during the debates over the Second Amendment at the time it was proposed.


Whatever that is supposed to mean.

Newsflash for you Cletus - the current Supreme Court always decides what the Constitution and the amendments mean.

[Cletus]

Whatever that is supposed to mean.

If you would study history instead of posting inane comments on internet forums, you would know what it means.

[MisterVeritis]

Whatever that is supposed to mean.

Newsflash for you Cletus - the current Supreme Court always decides what the Constitution and the amendments mean.
Of course that power was not granted in the Constitution. It is time to use an Article V convention of states to clip their wings.

[exotix]

What's the word from Lapierre ?