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Ethereal
08-25-2016, 08:23 PM
Why Did the Saudi Regime and Other Gulf Tyrannies Donate Millions to the Clinton Foundation? (https://theintercept.com/2016/08/25/why-did-the-saudi-regime-and-other-gulf-tyrannies-donate-millions-to-the-clinton-foundation/)

Glenn Greenwald
Aug. 25 2016, 9:42 a.m.

AS THE NUMEROUS and obvious ethical conflicts surrounding the Clinton Foundation receive more media scrutiny, the tactic of Clinton-loyal journalists is to highlight the charitable work done by the foundation, and then insinuate — or even outright state — that anyone raising these questions is opposed to its charity. James Carville announced that those who criticize the foundation are “going to hell.” Other Clinton loyalists insinuated that Clinton Foundation critics are indifferent to the lives of HIV-positive babies or are anti-gay bigots.

That the Clinton Foundation has done some good work is beyond dispute. But that fact has exactly nothing to do with the profound ethical problems and corruption threats raised by the way its funds have been raised. Hillary Clinton was America’s chief diplomat, and tyrannical regimes such as the Saudis and Qataris jointly donated tens of millions of dollars to an organization run by her family and operated in its name, one whose works has been a prominent feature of her public persona. That extremely valuable opportunity to curry favor with the Clintons, and to secure access to them, continues as she runs for president.

The claim that this is all just about trying to help people in need should not even pass a laugh test, let alone rational scrutiny. To see how true that is, just look at who some of the biggest donors are. Although it did not give while she was secretary of state, the Saudi regime by itself has donated between $10 million and $25 million to the Clinton Foundation, with donations coming as late as 2014, as she prepared her presidential run. A group called “Friends of Saudi Arabia,” co-founded “by a Saudi Prince,” gave an additional amount between $1 million and $5 million. The Clinton Foundation says that between $1 million and $5 million was also donated by “the State of Qatar,” the United Arab Emirates, and the government of Brunei. “The State of Kuwait” has donated between $5 million and $10 million.

Theoretically, one could say that these regimes — among the most repressive and regressive in the world — are donating because they deeply believe in the charitable work of the Clinton Foundation and want to help those in need. Is there a single person on the planet who actually believes this? Is Clinton loyalty really so strong that people are going to argue with a straight face that the reason the Saudi, Qatari, Kuwaiti and Emirates regimes donated large amounts of money to the Clinton Foundation is because those regimes simply want to help the foundation achieve its magnanimous goals?

...

Clinton apologists expect people to believe two equally absurd propositions.

One, that gulf state tyrannies like Saudi Arabia, Qatar, the UAE, Kuwait, and Brunei donated money to the Clinton Foundation, not because they were looking for favors, but because these regressive regimes were motivated by genuine humanitarian impulses. That is laughable on its face and doesn't even deserve a serious response.

The second proposition, somewhat less laughable, is that, yes, these regressive tyrants were expecting favors, but Clinton never followed through on it, and no one can prove that there was any quid pro quo.

As the author of this article notes, that is the exact same argument that opponents of campaign finance reform have been using for years, i.e., you cannot prove that massive donations to politicians and government officials are having an undue influence on their behavior.

In other words, what most Democrats used to consider a dishonest and absurd argument is now being used as their main defense of Clinton, proving yet again how utterly unprincipled and opportunistic these people are underneath it all.

So while Clinton apologists make laughable arguments and contradict themselves, reasonable people look at this situation and rightly conclude that "The Clinton Foundation" is nothing more than a bribery racket being run by the monumentally corrupt Clinton family.

Peter1469
08-25-2016, 08:25 PM
Pay to play.

Ethereal
08-25-2016, 08:33 PM
Pay to play.

They will just claim that you cannot prove these massive donations are having an undue influence on Clinton's behavior.

But that is the same argument that was used to justify the Citizens United ruling which many Democrats once considered the worst thing ever.

Now it's their go-to argument.

Newpublius
08-25-2016, 08:50 PM
But that is the same argument that was used to justify the Citizens United ruling which many Democrats once considered the worst thing ever.

Well then you can argue that anytime anybody states a political opinion in favor of something or against something that the politician aligned for/against will be unduly influenced to support your special interest. In this case people are giving funds directly to a Clinton controlled entity. In Citizens United's case, that entity spent money to criticize Hillary Clinton. At the time, she was embroiled in a fight with Obama for the Democratic nomination, maybe Obama was unduly influences and is now doing Citizen United's bidding?

For sure, the Republicans would generally have appreciated the criticism of their political rival, but nothing was given to any of their campaigns.

The right of any group to produce content, in this case a movie, criticizing, not only a candidate for public office, but a seated Senator, is the one of the most important reasons we have freedom of the press. It would clearly not be constitutional for the government to prohibit or otherwise punish the dissemination of such comment by media corporations like Fox or MSNBC or Dog Eat Dog, Inc which had released Fahrenheit 9/11 in the previous election cycle. Therefore it follows that it can't be constitutional prohibit the content from being distributed by a non-media corporation like Citizens United was unless you concede to the government to pick and choose who is and who is not in the media. Freedom of the press is not so confined. The Citizens United decision was unequivocally correct. Nobody disputes that large corporations, like the NY Times or MSNBC (General Electric), can editorialize during an election, and other groups performing press functions must necessarily have the same right, even if they are not part of the traditional news media industry.

Peter1469
08-25-2016, 08:56 PM
They will just claim that you cannot prove these massive donations are having an undue influence on Clinton's behavior.

But that is the same argument that was used to justify the Citizens United ruling which many Democrats once considered the worst thing ever.

Now it's their go-to argument.

Of course not....

When Hillary is no longer in power watch the Clinton Foundation go broke.

Common Sense
08-25-2016, 09:00 PM
I'm sure part of it is pay to play. It happens in all governments at all levels.

However to suggest that all people in leadership and of wealth in the Gulf States are somehow monsters who would never want to give to the many causes the foundation supports is probably not accurate. As much as many of these regimes are oppressive, these people are after all people. They have families and probably want to see the a better world for them and for others. I'm sure they could be called hypocrites for not doing more to help their own countries, but so could a lot of people.

MisterVeritis
08-25-2016, 09:04 PM
I'm sure part of it is pay to play. It happens in all governments at all levels.

However to suggest that all people in leadership and of wealth in the Gulf States are somehow monsters who would never want to give to the many causes the foundation supports is probably not accurate. As much as many of these regimes are oppressive, these people are after all people. They have families and probably want to see the a better world for them and for others. I'm sure they could be called hypocrites for not doing more to help their own countries, but so could a lot of people.
This indicates a lack of Common Sense.

Peter1469
08-25-2016, 09:05 PM
I'm sure part of it is pay to play. It happens in all governments at all levels.

However to suggest that all people in leadership and of wealth in the Gulf States are somehow monsters who would never want to give to the many causes the foundation supports is probably not accurate. As much as many of these regimes are oppressive, these people are after all people. They have families and probably want to see the a better world for them and for others. I'm sure they could be called hypocrites for not doing more to help their own countries, but so could a lot of people.

It becomes illegal when there is a quid pro quo.

But Americans are also fed up with business as usual. Well, except for the Fans.

Ethereal
08-25-2016, 09:17 PM
I'm sure part of it is pay to play. It happens in all governments at all levels.

However to suggest that all people in leadership and of wealth in the Gulf States are somehow monsters who would never want to give to the many causes the foundation supports is probably not accurate. As much as many of these regimes are oppressive, these people are after all people. They have families and probably want to see the a better world for them and for others. I'm sure they could be called hypocrites for not doing more to help their own countries, but so could a lot of people.

Did you read the article before commenting?

Peter1469
08-26-2016, 04:44 AM
I am sure more information on this and other pay for play examples in the next few months.

Bethere
08-26-2016, 06:06 AM
Pay to play.

McConnell v United States.

Access is not quid pro quo.

Common
08-26-2016, 06:14 AM
McConnell v United States.

Access is not quid pro quo.

Address the thread which has nothing to do with McConnell

Common
08-26-2016, 06:14 AM
The saudis paid for access, the clinton foundation is a criminal organization

donttread
08-26-2016, 01:19 PM
Clinton apologists expect people to believe two equally absurd propositions.

One, that gulf state tyrannies like Saudi Arabia, Qatar, the UAE, Kuwait, and Brunei donated money to the Clinton Foundation, not because they were looking for favors, but because these regressive regimes were motivated by genuine humanitarian impulses. That is laughable on its face and doesn't even deserve a serious response.

The second proposition, somewhat less laughable, is that, yes, these regressive tyrants were expecting favors, but Clinton never followed through on it, and no one can prove that there was any quid pro quo.

As the author of this article notes, that is the exact same argument that opponents of campaign finance reform have been using for years, i.e., you cannot prove that massive donations to politicians and government officials are having an undue influence on their behavior.

In other words, what most Democrats used to consider a dishonest and absurd argument is now being used as their main defense of Clinton, proving yet again how utterly unprincipled and opportunistic these people are underneath it all.

So while Clinton apologists make laughable arguments and contradict themselves, reasonable people look at this situation and rightly conclude that "The Clinton Foundation" is nothing more than a bribery racket being run by the monumentally corrupt Clinton family.

The Saudis were our collaborators in imperializing the ME and we constantly kiss their ass for it. For example 15/19 hijackers and the 9/11 master mind were Saudi's so we invaded Iraq and Afghanistan and started fucking with Iran

Peter1469
08-26-2016, 05:04 PM
McConnell v United States.

Access is not quid pro quo.

Correct. I said that before.

Peter1469
08-26-2016, 05:06 PM
Address the thread which has nothing to do with McConnell

You have to show more than access. A governmental favor.

I mentioned this elsewhere. Americans don't like the paying for access- but that is legal. It becomes illegal when someone pays for access in order to get, and does get a government action that benefits them. Like the Russians, Clinton Foundation, and uranium.

Peter1469
08-26-2016, 05:09 PM
The Saudis were our collaborators in imperializing the ME and we constantly kiss their ass for it. For example 15/19 hijackers and the 9/11 master mind were Saudi's so we invaded Iraq and Afghanistan and started fucking with Iran

The House of Saud was put in power by the West after Sykes Picot when it was determined that the West was going to have to leave and let local rulers take over.

Bethere
08-27-2016, 12:09 AM
Address the thread which has nothing to do with McConnell

Of course it does.

Bethere
08-27-2016, 12:11 AM
Correct. I said that before.

And you are also aware that the donations happened long before she ever knew she would be secretary of state.

So we rate your claim as false.

Peter1469
08-27-2016, 05:55 AM
And you are also aware that the donations happened long before she ever knew she would be secretary of state.

So we rate your claim as false.

Not relevant to the donations and speaking fees that occurred while she was Sec State. And where government action followed.

It is criminal.

We can't know this- but I suspect that once Hillary is out of politics the donations to the Clinton foundation will dry up. It is not a charity. It is a pay to play scheme.

Bethere
08-27-2016, 10:38 PM
Not relevant to the donations and speaking fees that occurred while she was Sec State. And where government action followed.

It is criminal.

We can't know this- but I suspect that once Hillary is out of politics the donations to the Clinton foundation will dry up. It is not a charity. It is a pay to play scheme.

nah, what it is is a desperate manufactured non-story because the republican party is bereft of ideas and opportunities.

Peter1469
08-27-2016, 10:39 PM
nah, what it is is a desperate manufactured non-story because the republican party is bereft of ideas and opportunities.


Untrue. It is a real story. The GOP has nothing whatsoever to do with it.

Bethere
08-28-2016, 12:12 AM
Untrue. It is a real story. The GOP has nothing whatsoever to do with it.

Nah, it's a desperate linkage of uncorrelated dots on a scatter plot.

Ethereal
08-28-2016, 01:12 AM
Nah, it's a desperate linkage of uncorrelated dots on a scatter plot.

That's what Democrats keep saying. But reasonable people are able to see right through their self-serving propaganda.

Common
08-28-2016, 01:19 AM
Untrue. It is a real story. The GOP has nothing whatsoever to do with it.

Peter you are trying to discuss reality with a professional excuse maker. No matter what you say or fact you provide, you will get a sassy dodge in response.

Common
08-28-2016, 01:19 AM
Nah, it's a desperate linkage of uncorrelated dots on a scatter plot.

Why did those muslim countries single out and choose the clinton foundation to donate too. Can you explain that

Bethere
08-28-2016, 01:23 AM
Why did those muslim countries single out and choose the clinton foundation to donate too. Can you explain that

That's because the prophet taught compassion and the clinton foundation is very very good.

Common
08-28-2016, 01:28 AM
That's because the prophet taught compassion and the clinton foundation is very very good.

lol ok that made me laugh

Bethere
08-28-2016, 01:48 AM
lol ok that made me laugh

15978

Ethereal
08-28-2016, 07:32 AM
That's because the prophet taught compassion and the clinton foundation is very very good.

Thanks. I needed a good laugh to start my day.

Peter1469
08-28-2016, 07:37 AM
Nah, it's a desperate linkage of uncorrelated dots on a scatter plot.

lol, ok :shocked: