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Captain Obvious
10-02-2016, 12:07 AM
Racially fueled and class driven (the ultra-wealthy class vs. the handout class that drives the political system)?

Are there too many opposites that are heading to a melting point?

It could happen this decade, in 50 or in 100 years, but will it happen?

Bethere
10-02-2016, 12:40 AM
Racially fueled and class driven (the ultra-wealthy class vs. the handout class that drives the political system)?

Are there too many opposites that are heading to a melting point?

It could happen this decade, in 50 or in 100 years, but will it happen?

No. Instead the republican party will cease to be a national factor. Party's like the green and the libertarian, will remain unready for prime time. So, the us will revert to basically a one party system just as it did after reconstruction.

Dr. Who
10-02-2016, 12:59 AM
It may lead to isolated melting points, but I don't think that with over 300M people, there will be country-wide meltdown unless there is a drastic economic collapse and food shortages.

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 01:07 AM
Racially fueled and class driven (the ultra-wealthy class vs. the handout class that drives the political system)?

Are there too many opposites that are heading to a melting point?

It could happen this decade, in 50 or in 100 years, but will it happen?

I think it's pretty clear that it's happening within a decade. If either major party is a major player in 20 years, I will be shocked.

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 01:08 AM
No. Instead the republican party will cease to be a national factor. Party's like the green and the libertarian, will remain unready for prime time. So, the us will revert to basically a one party system just as it did after reconstruction.

You say no, but your description is a yes. Make up your mind.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 02:44 AM
I think it's pretty clear that it's happening within a decade. If either major party is a major player in 20 years, I will be shocked.

Being shocked is nothing new for the superior class of clueless libertarian/non partisan globalists that operate this forum

Getting them to admit they were ever wrong about anything is whats rare

surprisingly I think bethere had the best response so far

If trump does not win this election we are heading toward a one-party system where the democrat party controls everything.

think of the old soviet union and the communist party for an example of what to expect.

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 02:52 AM
Being shocked is nothing new for the superior class of clueless libertarian/non partisan globalists that operate this forum

Getting them to admit they were ever wrong about anything is whats rare

surprisingly I think bethere had the best response so far

If trump does not win this election we are heading toward a one-party system where the democrat party controls everything.

think of the old soviet union and the communist party for an example of what to expect.

I haven't been shocked yet, so yes, it would really be something new. Check back with me in 20 years, and we'll see who's right.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 02:57 AM
I haven't been shocked yet, so yes, it would really be something new. Check back with me in 20 years, and we'll see who's right.

Since you cleverly gave yourself 20 years before having to put up or shut up its safe to say no one will ever hold you accountable.

but thats how the tweeners operate

backseat drivers to the bitter end

Tahuyaman
10-02-2016, 03:00 AM
Are we heading toward a political revolution?


No. Just a realignment of one or both major political parties.

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 03:02 AM
Since you cleverly gave yourself 20 years before having to put up or shut up its safe to say no one will ever hold you accountable.

but thats how the tweeners operate

backseat drivers to the bitter end

I haven't given myself any amount of time. However, I did predict the fall of the Berlin Wall.

What do the tweeners have to do with anything?

Are you too chickenshit to go against me on this? Maybe you know your side is too broken to last too long.

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 03:03 AM
Are we heading toward a political revolution?


No. Just a realignment of one or many both major political parties.

Both have destroyed themselves too much in this election.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 03:06 AM
I haven't given myself any amount of time. However, I did predict the fall of the Berlin Wall.

What do the tweeners have to do with anything?

Are you too chicken$#@! to go against me on this? Maybe you know your side is too broken to last too long.

Tweeners like those of you on this forum have nuthin to do with nuthin because you have shirked your duty to make any positive effort to decide.

Trump and hillary are not identical.

if they seem that way to you then you need to wake up and look again

Tahuyaman
10-02-2016, 03:08 AM
Both have destroyed themselves too much in this election.

The destruction happened before this election season even started.

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 03:14 AM
Tweeners like those of you on this forum have nuthin to do with nuthin because you have shirked your duty to make any positive effort to decide.

Trump and hillary are not identical.

if they seem that way to you then you need to wake up and look again

Again, what do tweeners have to do with anything? It's been some time since anyone could consider me a tweener.

I never said they were identical, they're just both terrible for the country. Are you proud to campaign for shit?

Seriously, I've put forth more effort toward changing the status quo than you have into politics in your life. You're barely a blip on the radar. Put some effort in.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 03:14 AM
The destruction happened before this election season even started.

And yet either hillary or trump will win.

the non partisans know that and are comfortable letting the rest of decide for them

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 03:15 AM
The destruction happened before this election season even started.

The destruction has been going on for a while. This election has increased it exponentially, though.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 03:16 AM
Again, what do tweeners have to do with anything?

It's been some time since anyone could consider me a tweener.

I never said they were identical, they're just both terrible for the country. Are you proud to campaign for $#@!?

Seriously, I've put forth more effort toward changing the status quo than you have into politics in your life. You're barely a blip on the radar. Put some effort in.

You dont.

thats the point.

you are just sitting on the fence making no effort to improve anything

and its been that way for 40 years as the non partisan wimps complain about the outcome but never get involved in the process

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 03:20 AM
And yet either hillary or trump will win.

the non partisans know that and are comfortable letting the rest of decide for them

Not true in the slightest. Non-partisans are dedicated to changing things. I know it's uncomfortable for you that things are changing, but they are. As I've said before, in 20 years (it may be sooner), both Republicans and Democrats will be done. I'd be surprised if one of the two were elected in 2020, much less 2046.

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 03:24 AM
You dont.

thats the point.

you are just sitting on the fence making no effort to improve anything
and its been that way for 40 years as the non partisan wimps complain about the outcome but never get involved in the process


Okay, let's break this down a bit. What the fuck do tweeners have to do with me?

You have absolutely no idea what effort I have put forth. However, it's obvious that you're a slave to the system. You wouldn't know effort if it bit you on the ass.

Hal Jordan
10-02-2016, 03:25 AM
And yet either hillary or trump will win.

the non partisans know that and are comfortable letting the rest of decide for them

They might. Those with even the slightest sense of morality won't vote for either of them, though.

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 04:13 AM
No. Instead the republican party will cease to be a national factor. Party's like the green and the libertarian, will remain unready for prime time. So, the us will revert to basically a one party system just as it did after reconstruction.

The GOP and Dems are already a one party system.

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 04:14 AM
It may lead to isolated melting points, but I don't think that with over 300M people, there will be country-wide meltdown unless there is a drastic economic collapse and food shortages.

We are at $20T in debt and the world is moving away from the USD as the reserve currency. Prepare for a collapse. Now.

As it gets closer, if you have savings you can short the system and get rich on the collapse. But be careful with timing.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 04:18 AM
They might. Those with even the slightest sense of morality won't vote for either of them, though.

Your alleged morality is actually political cowardness.

you are afraid to make a choice because then you can no longer deny responsibility for your decision

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 04:19 AM
The GOP and Dems are already a one party system.

Thanks in part to political dropouts like you who abandoned the struggle to keep the republicans honest

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 04:22 AM
Being shocked is nothing new for the superior class of clueless libertarian/non partisan globalists that operate this forum

Getting them to admit they were ever wrong about anything is whats rare

surprisingly I think bethere had the best response so far

If trump does not win this election we are heading toward a one-party system where the democrat party controls everything.

think of the old soviet union and the communist party for an example of what to expect.Hint- the establishment part of the dems and gop already are one party. You are on board with it, although you don't realize it.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 04:23 AM
Not true in the slightest.

Non-partisans are dedicated to changing things.

I know it's uncomfortable for you that things are changing, but they are. As I've said before, in 20 years (it may be sooner), both Republicans and Democrats will be done. I'd be surprised if one of the two were elected in 2020, much less 2046.

You change nothing.

depers and dreamers like johnson and stein are no closer to getting elected than they were 30 years ago.

you are just dropping out and counting your toes while the partisans deal with the real problems of the day

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 04:24 AM
Since you cleverly gave yourself 20 years before having to put up or shut up its safe to say no one will ever hold you accountable.

but thats how the tweeners operate

backseat drivers to the bitter end

Actually it isn't. It is realistic.

Most Americans think that if a problem can't be solved in one hour, which includes 24 minutes for commercial breaks, it is a long term issue. Sitcom historians.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 04:27 AM
Hint- the establishment part of the dems and gop already are one party. You are on board with it, although you don't realize it.

Thanks in part to you.

as a fallen republican you abandoned the party to the republican hacks in washington

you and Hal claim to be so superior to the rest of us

but you bugged out over the hill and left the people you consider inferiors to face the enemy alone

and yes, the paid professionals in washington are the enemy as much as the democrats or muslim jihadis.

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 04:29 AM
Thanks in part to political dropouts like you who abandoned the struggle to keep the republicans honest

Or saw the truth and refused to participate. I expect that you will too at some point in the future.

People can't take being used once they figure it out.

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 04:30 AM
Thanks in part to you.

as a fallen republican you abandoned the party to the republican hacks in washington

you and Hal claim to be so superior to the rest of us

but you bugged out over the hill and left the people you consider inferiors to face the enemy alone

and yes, the paid professionals in washington are the enemy as much as the democrats or muslim jihadis.

I didn't fall. I woke up. And I am prepared for the future crash that the GOP / Dem establishment is creating. Are you?

Bethere
10-02-2016, 05:52 AM
Thanks in part to political dropouts like you who abandoned the struggle to keep the republicans honest

Nice post.

But Pete's not a drop out. Behind the curtain on the first Tuesday after the first Tuesday every November he is the same partisan hack he ever was.

If you persist with your claims you will make him cry.

Remind me to buy you a beer.

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 06:10 AM
Nice post.

But Pete's not a drop out. Behind the curtain on the first Tuesday after the first Tuesday every November he is the same partisan hack he ever was.

If you persist with your claims you will make him cry.

Remind me to buy you a beer.

We don't have curtains or booths in Virginia. At least not in my district. We have tables with card board separating seating areas.

I find it amusing that you claim to know who I will vote for. The only thing that anyone could say with intelligence on this forum is that I would not vote for Hillary if a gun was to my head. Any other guess is either dishonest or stupid.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 06:11 AM
Nice post.

But Pete's not a drop out. Behind the curtain on the first Tuesday after the first Tuesday every November he is the same partisan hack he ever was.

If you persist with your claims you will make him cry.

Remind me to buy you a beer.

I don't know who any of them are voting for

We certainly can't go by what they say since they spend most of their time complaining about trump and Hillary without really trying to promote either of the 3rd party candidates

I think they are happy as long as they can continue to attack others while not having to defend anything of theirs

Bethere
10-02-2016, 06:12 AM
I think they are happy as long as they can continue to attack others while not having to defend anything of theirs

Absolutely.

16311

Ethereal
10-02-2016, 06:50 AM
Mac is just upset because Trump is probably going to lose.

For some reason, he expects libertarians to help Trump, even though Trump is hostile to libertarian ideology.

It is amazing that someone would actually think libertarians would help someone who wants to kick millions of people out of America, invade businesses with mandatory e-verify, thinks Snowden is a traitor, hates free trade, and thinks "Islam" is at war with America.

Ethereal
10-02-2016, 06:53 AM
Your alleged morality is actually political cowardness.

you are afraid to make a choice because then you can no longer deny responsibility for your decision

Political cowardice would be kowtowing to your constant harangues and voting for a petulant jackass who is hostile to libertarian ideology.

The politically courageous thing to do is to stick to our principles until the bitter end, which is exactly what we're going to do.

As I've told you before, our goal is to defeat people who think like Trump. Libertarians are not interested in Trump's America. We don't want it. We don't want to work with you. You are not on our side. I don't know how else to make it any clearer.

Bethere
10-02-2016, 07:07 AM
Political cowardice would be kowtowing to your constant harangues and voting for a petulant jackass who is hostile to libertarian ideology.

The politically courageous thing to do is to stick to our principles until the bitter end, which is exactly what we're going to do.

As I've told you before, our goal is to defeat people who think like Trump. Libertarians are not interested in Trump's America. We don't want it. We don't want to work with you. You are not on our side. I don't know how else to make it any clearer.

Think of it as the triumph of dialectical materialism. The gop in reconstruction stood alone as the thesis. The hopelessly regional Democrats morphed into the antithesis over a 50 year period.

The two forces struggled.

After 100 years the gop dies and the Democrats are the synthesis.

After a few decades an opposition will emerge to start the cycle anew.

It's a pattern we've seen since the beginning of time.

But everyone on this forum except for maybe William will be dead before something will emerge as the new antithesis. Get used to a period of one party government.

History takes its good old time. If I were you I'd get a copy of Roberts rules and learn how to function in the Democratic party. Your options are limited.

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 07:15 AM
Mac is just upset because Trump is probably going to lose.

For some reason, he expects libertarians to help Trump, even though Trump is hostile to libertarian ideology.

It is amazing that someone would actually think libertarians would help someone who wants to kick millions of people out of America, invade businesses with mandatory e-verify, thinks Snowden is a traitor, hates free trade, and thinks "Islam" is at war with America.

Trump is certainly going to lose if he insists on following around Hillary's yarn string like a cat.

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 07:16 AM
Think of it as the triumph of dialectical materialism. The gop in reconstruction stood alone as the thesis. The hopelessly regional Democrats morphed into the antithesis over a 50 year period.

The two forces struggled.

After 100 years the gop dies and the Democrats are the synthesis.

After a few decades an opposition will emerge to start the cycle anew.

It's a pattern we've seen since the beginning of time.

But everyone on this forum except for maybe William will be dead before something will emerge as the new antithesis. Get used to a period of one party government.

History takes its good old time. If I were you I'd get a copy of Roberts rules and learn how to function in the Democratic party. Your options are limited.

The establishment GOP and Dems are one. Rewrite your post to reflect that reality.

Bethere
10-02-2016, 07:23 AM
The establishment GOP and Dems are one. Rewrite your post to reflect that reality.

Why? We don't agree, because you are wrong. The gop is eventually going to get assimilated by the Democrats. It's inevitable. Resistance is futile.

The dialectical process is incomplete. There are big differences between the parties. But this election cycle will go a long way towards straightening that out.

It'll be decades before a functional opposition can organize to oppose the synthesis.

Your efforts are largely windmill tilting, but very entertaining.

If you could wave your arms around a bit whilst thou cry?

Good times.

Bethere
10-02-2016, 07:26 AM
Trump is certainly going to lose if he insists on following around Hillary's yarn string like a cat.

Yep.

From one troll to another, pete, trump is an easy mark.

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 07:27 AM
Why? We don't agree, because you are wrong. The gop is eventually going to get assimilated by the Democrats. It's inevitable. Resistance is futile.

But the dialectical process is incomplete. There are big differences between the parties. But this election cycle will go along way towards straightening that out.

It'll be decades before a functional opposition can organize to oppose the synthesis.

Your efforts are largely windmill tilting, but very entertaining.

If you could wave your arms around a bit whilst thou cry?

Good times.


I have no interesting in the Establishment. You do.

The is your party (D) (R)
https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.teamsquatchinusa.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2014%2F08%2F03%2Four-divorcing-friends-in-bigfootdom%2FCoin.jpg&f=1

Bethere
10-02-2016, 07:34 AM
I have no interesting in the Establishment. You do.

The is your party (D) (R)



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ub_a2t0ZfTs

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 07:35 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5xaZB8AgAQ

Common
10-02-2016, 08:22 AM
Racially fueled and class driven (the ultra-wealthy class vs. the handout class that drives the political system)?

Are there too many opposites that are heading to a melting point?

It could happen this decade, in 50 or in 100 years, but will it happen?

nah no revolution, 8 yrs of obama proved to me that americans will fall for anything. Its over cap, until a generation or 4 down the road they realize just what theyve allowed to be done to themselves and the country

Newpublius
10-02-2016, 08:50 AM
Racially fueled and class driven (the ultra-wealthy class vs. the handout class that drives the political system)?

Are there too many opposites that are heading to a melting point?

It could happen this decade, in 50 or in 100 years, but will it happen?

The key is the economy. The only thing really keeping the country together is the spectacularly successful free trade zone.

Right now US debt is such that a rise to historical interst rates places a severe fiscal burden on the US, the alternative of course is inflation.

Right now the US is a leveraged entity and it possesses many of the risk factors businesses possess when they leverage

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 09:10 AM
The key is the economy. The only thing really keeping the country together is the spectacularly successful free trade zone.

Right now US debt is such that a rise to historical interst rates places a severe fiscal burden on the US, the alternative of course is inflation.

Right now the US is a leveraged entity and it possesses many of the risk factors businesses possess when they leverage

Most voters eyes just glazed over reading that. And they will vote for more government handouts next election.

Prepare for the coming crash while there is time.

Newpublius
10-02-2016, 09:18 AM
Most voters eyes just glazed over reading that. And they will vote for more government handouts next election.

Prepare for the coming crash while there is time.

One thing to note is that as much as different cultures within the US, urban/rural, north/south, native/immigrant there is also the fact that many families have members separated by state lines. So if it actually were to happen, if the US unravels it could only be with a supermajority that feels unequivocally that it should go. In other words, what is inconceivable today -- and of course why its not happening today, would have to becone the self-evident tomorrow and given our families locations, that tells you just how calamitous things will need to be for the US to unravel politically and I'd suggest that event woyld necessarily be economic.

Green Arrow
10-02-2016, 09:36 AM
Not until 20% or more of the voters choose something other than D or R consistently.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 09:47 AM
Mac is just upset because Trump is probably going to lose.

For some reason, he expects libertarians to help Trump, even though Trump is hostile to libertarian ideology.

It is amazing that someone would actually think libertarians would help someone who wants to kick millions of people out of America, invade businesses with mandatory e-verify, thinks Snowden is a traitor, hates free trade, and thinks "Islam" is at war with America.

I do t expect the most libertarians with the views you mentioned to vote for trump

They are so warped as to be beyond hope

But many others are proud to say "I used to be a republican BUT..."

They are with trump on many issues

In some cases they are with trump most of the way

Certainly more than they are with Hillary

They people with a streak of sanity left in them who dream of destroying the Republican Party because they think something better will rise from its ashes

But they are wrong

All they will accomplish it to make the democrats supreme rulers of the country

And the holier-than-thou 3rd party wackos will be even more on the fringe than they are now

And even more powerless

Tahuyaman
10-02-2016, 10:05 AM
The destruction has been going on for a while. This election has increased it exponentially, though.

I agree.

Captain Obvious
10-02-2016, 10:46 AM
No. Instead the republican party will cease to be a national factor. Party's like the green and the libertarian, will remain unready for prime time. So, the us will revert to basically a one party system just as it did after reconstruction.

You are petty and idiotic.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 10:49 AM
You are petty and idiotic.

He is correct

If the repub party falls apart nothing will take its place

Chris
10-02-2016, 10:58 AM
The key is the economy. The only thing really keeping the country together is the spectacularly successful free trade zone.

Right now US debt is such that a rise to historical interst rates places a severe fiscal burden on the US, the alternative of course is inflation.

Right now the US is a leveraged entity and it possesses many of the risk factors businesses possess when they leverage



Agree. And we're facing a time when all the low hanging fruit have been picked. Enlightenment-based innovation is over. Today's innovations, like the Internet of Things, while important, consists of small, minor innovations coupled together. Manufacturing is moving to the third world where it is affordable. Without innovation and manufacturing there's not enough wealth to fund an ever increasing taxing and regulating distributive state. The government can't keep up with the great promises of the past, which we see in the rejection of establishment politics, Reps perhaps more than Dems, and the rise of third party popularity--people are dissatisfied, frustrated. But there won't be a revolution because too many are too dependent on the government. There can only be collapse. No state lasts forever.

Chris
10-02-2016, 11:13 AM
Think of it as the triumph of dialectical materialism. The gop in reconstruction stood alone as the thesis. The hopelessly regional Democrats morphed into the antithesis over a 50 year period.

The two forces struggled.

After 100 years the gop dies and the Democrats are the synthesis.

After a few decades an opposition will emerge to start the cycle anew.

It's a pattern we've seen since the beginning of time.

But everyone on this forum except for maybe William will be dead before something will emerge as the new antithesis. Get used to a period of one party government.

History takes its good old time. If I were you I'd get a copy of Roberts rules and learn how to function in the Democratic party. Your options are limited.


Sorry, that's not what Hegelian dialects/dialectal materialism is. It consists of a thesis, say the Reps, OK so far, and then an anti-theis, say the Dems, OK so far, and finally a synthesis of the two as one. The anti-thesis doesn't replace the thesis. That's more akin to Schumpeter's creative-destruction--but that's not cyclical any more than Hegelian dialectics is.

Standing Wolf
10-02-2016, 11:17 AM
The GOP and Dems are already a one party system.

I hear that a lot - and in some respects the statement may have some validity, but certainly not in all. I see Republicans bending over backward to accommodate corporate interests to the detriment and harm of the American people. I see Republicans seemingly determined to keep the legal system beholden to, and a reflection of, the doctrines and dogma of the Christian church.

On the other hand, I also see Republicans defending the Second Amendment and the natural right to defense of self and family, and I see them opposing racial preferences by public institutions as just another form of unfair and immoral discrimination.

I see both bad and good tendencies in policies favored by Democrats, as well. There are definitely important differences between the two Parties - differences that people care about. They are very far from being the same.

Chris
10-02-2016, 11:28 AM
I hear that a lot - and in some respects the statement may have some validity, but certainly not in all. I see Republicans bending over backward to accommodate corporate interests to the detriment and harm of the American people. I see Republicans seemingly determined to keep the legal system beholden to, and a reflection of, the doctrines and dogma of the Christian church.

On the other hand, I also see Republicans defending the Second Amendment and the natural right to defense of self and family, and I see them opposing racial preferences by public institutions as just another form of unfair and immoral discrimination.

I see both bad and good tendencies in policies favored by Democrats, as well. There are definitely important differences between the two Parties - differences that people care about. They are very far from being the same.


On a left v right view of politics what you say is somewhat true, though both Trump and Clinton defy much of that perception.

On an authoritarian v libertarian view both parties are authoritarian.

"The Democrats are the party that says government will make you smarter, taller, richer, and remove the crabgrass on your lawn. The Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work and then they get elected and prove it." -- P. J. O'Rourke

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 11:47 AM
On a left v right view of politics what you say is somewhat true, though both Trump and Clinton defy much of that perception.

On an authoritarian v libertarian view both parties are authoritarian.

"The Democrats are the party that says government will make you smarter, taller, richer, and remove the crabgrass on your lawn. The Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work and then they get elected and prove it." -- P. J. O'Rourke

As I pointed out to peter the problem of the major parties is caused by lack of participation by all of you libs who think you are too superior to get involved and leave it those of us you call political hacks

The political system is only as good as libs allow it to be

Chris
10-02-2016, 12:10 PM
As I pointed out to peter the problem of the major parties is caused by lack of participation by all of you libs who think you are too superior to get involved and leave it those of us you call political hacks

The political system is only as good as libs allow it to be

Is that your superior opinion?

Are we back to libs, libs, libs?

I just don't want to get caught underfoot...

https://i.snag.gy/fWri8.jpg

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 12:41 PM
Are we back to libs, libs, libs?



It never stopped being about libs

It's liberals, libertarians and libertines who are the cause of most of the nation's problems

Peter1469
10-02-2016, 12:42 PM
It never stopped being about libs

It's liberals, libertarians and libertines who are the cause of most of the nation's problems

Very different groups acting together in your mind?

Dr. Who
10-02-2016, 12:49 PM
Yep.

From one troll to another, pete, trump is an easy mark.
Please do not discuss other members or name call.

Mac-7
10-02-2016, 12:56 PM
Very different groups acting together in your mind?

"Acting together" is your idea not mine

I have different weeds in my yard that are undesirable

If left to do their thing the result is not good

But that does not mean it's a coordinated effort on their part

Don
10-02-2016, 01:12 PM
Or saw the truth and refused to participate. I expect that you will too at some point in the future.

People can't take being used once they figure it out.

You are right. The "revolution" already happened. It brought us here.......


"The argument that the two parties should represent opposed ideals and policies, one, perhaps, of the Right and the other of the Left, is a foolish idea acceptable only to doctrinaire and academic thinkers. Instead, the two parties should be almost identical, so that the American people can throw the rascals out at any election without leading to any profound or extensive shifts in policy. Then it should be possible to replace it, every four years if necessary, by the other party, which will be none of these things but will still pursue, with new vigor, approximately the same basic policies." - Professor Carrol Quigley

The counter revolution is now in progress to turn away from the evil consolidation of the establishment party. Its going to be an ugly fight.

(Professor Carrol Quigley was someone Bill Clinton admired, he even referenced him in one of his major speeches)

Chris
10-02-2016, 01:26 PM
And so it goes, both parties the same, and so it grows.

MisterVeritis
10-02-2016, 03:51 PM
Racially fueled and class driven (the ultra-wealthy class vs. the handout class that drives the political system)?

Are there too many opposites that are heading to a melting point?

It could happen this decade, in 50 or in 100 years, but will it happen?
We experienced a coup. We are no longer protected by a Constitution and most do not care.

It will not be a political revolution. It will be real. Or the people will accept their chains and their serfdom.

Bethere
10-02-2016, 03:54 PM
Sorry, that's not what Hegelian dialects/dialectal materialism is. It consists of a thesis, say the Reps, OK so far, and then an anti-theis, say the Dems, OK so far, and finally a synthesis of the two as one. The anti-thesis doesn't replace the thesis. That's more akin to Schumpeter's creative-destruction--but that's not cyclical any more than Hegelian dialectics is.

You are such a sophist, but it is hard to understand what you are saying with Peter's slippers hanging from your mouth.

Chris
10-02-2016, 03:58 PM
Don, above speaks of a counter revolution, MisterVeritas a coup, but to me the counter-revolutionary coup was the Constitution.

Bethere
10-02-2016, 03:59 PM
We experienced a coup. We are no longer protected by a Constitution and most do not care.

It will not be a political revolution. It will be real. Or the people will accept their chains and their serfdom.

When you and pete are asked to turn in your guns you will stack them up neatly.

Safety
10-02-2016, 04:34 PM
You are such a sophist, but it is hard to understand what you are saying with Peter's slippers hanging from your mouth.

Threadbanned for refusing to heed earlier warning

MisterVeritis
10-02-2016, 05:07 PM
When you and pete are asked to turn in your guns you will stack them up neatly.
The shooting will begin long before that moment.

Standing Wolf
10-02-2016, 05:14 PM
The shooting will begin long before that moment.

Here we go again. :rollseyes:

https://spiritofthething.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/red-dawn-wolverines.jpg

WOLVERINES!

Dangermouse
10-02-2016, 05:30 PM
A white candidate just told his white supporters to go out and intimidate black voters at the polls!..................................... crickets.....

MisterVeritis
10-02-2016, 05:46 PM
Here we go again. :rollseyes:

I am not surprised you are confused. A revolution will begin with assassinations of judges and politicians. It will not occur after an invasion by an outside force. It will begin on a day much like today. You might not even notice.

Chris
10-02-2016, 08:05 PM
Revolutions merely replace regimes.

MisterVeritis
10-02-2016, 08:21 PM
Revolutions merely replace regimes.
White true it is also irrelevant.

Chris
10-02-2016, 08:34 PM
White true it is also irrelevant.

If true then there's no point to revolution.

Standing Wolf
10-02-2016, 10:36 PM
I am not surprised you are confused. A revolution will begin with assassinations of judges and politicians. It will not occur after an invasion by an outside force. It will begin on a day much like today. You might not even notice.

Your ideological compadres have already begun the job you envision and quite obviously relish the thought of...just a short time ago, in Dallas. Now, tell us how different it is. Executing public officials as "payback", or because you can't get what you want politically, either as quickly or as completely as you want, is not noble - nor is it the work of freedom fighters or "rebels" in the admirable sense. People who daydream about such things are cowards, and morally bankrupt.

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 12:48 AM
Your alleged morality is actually political cowardness.

you are afraid to make a choice because then you can no longer deny responsibility for your decision

It's funny that you would say that, since, out of the two of us, I'm the one actually making a choice. You just follow the party line, kinda like another political system, comrade.

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 12:50 AM
Thanks in part to political dropouts like you who abandoned the struggle to keep the republicans honest

A struggle you refuse to join.

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 12:51 AM
You change nothing.

depers and dreamers like johnson and stein are no closer to getting elected than they were 30 years ago.

you are just dropping out and counting your toes while the partisans deal with the real problems of the day

I've changed much more than you could dream of doing, coward.

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 12:53 AM
Thanks in part to you.

as a fallen republican you abandoned the party to the republican hacks in washington

you and Hal claim to be so superior to the rest of us

but you bugged out over the hill and left the people you consider inferiors to face the enemy alone

and yes, the paid professionals in washington are the enemy as much as the democrats or muslim jihadis.

Whereas you actually joined the hacks. Talk about cowardice, comrade.

You don't face the enemy, you support them.

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 01:12 AM
Why? We don't agree, because you are wrong. The gop is eventually going to get assimilated by the Democrats. It's inevitable. Resistance is futile.

The dialectical process is incomplete. There are big differences between the parties. But this election cycle will go a long way towards straightening that out.

It'll be decades before a functional opposition can organize to oppose the synthesis.

Your efforts are largely windmill tilting, but very entertaining.

If you could wave your arms around a bit whilst thou cry?

Good times.

The differences are only nominal. In reality, they are the same party.

The opposition has been organizing for decades.

Good times indeed. Funny that you say that when you're so blind to it.

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 01:15 AM
Not until 20% or more of the voters choose something other than D or R consistently.

Not long now...

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 01:16 AM
I do t expect the most libertarians with the views you mentioned to vote for trump

They are so warped as to be beyond hope

But many others are proud to say "I used to be a republican BUT..."

They are with trump on many issues

In some cases they are with trump most of the way

Certainly more than they are with Hillary

They people with a streak of sanity left in them who dream of destroying the Republican Party because they think something better will rise from its ashes

But they are wrong

All they will accomplish it to make the democrats supreme rulers of the country

And the holier-than-thou 3rd party wackos will be even more on the fringe than they are now

And even more powerless

You'll eventually see how wrong you are.

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 01:18 AM
He is correct

If the repub party falls apart nothing will take its place

The Republican and Democrat parties are both falling apart. Are you blind enough to not see that?

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 01:22 AM
I hear that a lot - and in some respects the statement may have some validity, but certainly not in all. I see Republicans bending over backward to accommodate corporate interests to the detriment and harm of the American people. I see Republicans seemingly determined to keep the legal system beholden to, and a reflection of, the doctrines and dogma of the Christian church.

On the other hand, I also see Republicans defending the Second Amendment and the natural right to defense of self and family, and I see them opposing racial preferences by public institutions as just another form of unfair and immoral discrimination.

I see both bad and good tendencies in policies favored by Democrats, as well. There are definitely important differences between the two Parties - differences that people care about. They are very far from being the same.

You see what they want you to see. In reality, the policies aren't that different. What has Obama accomplished that was against what Bush did? Hint: The answer is absolutely nothing.

Hal Jordan
10-03-2016, 01:25 AM
It never stopped being about libs

It's liberals, libertarians and libertines who are the cause of most of the nation's problems

Thanks for showcasing your blindness.

Mac-7
10-03-2016, 05:40 AM
Thanks for showcasing your blindness.

As an American citizen you have a right to help hillary become the next president.

There is no reason for you to be so upset just because I refuse to respect your choice.

Trump is not perfect

but for everyone except the far left he is much better for the country than hillary.

Captain Obvious
10-03-2016, 12:50 PM
He is correct

If the repub party falls apart nothing will take its place

Disagree.

We have conservative tea parties and libertarian parties for a reason. The GOP is failing conservative voters and I hope it collapses. I left thr GOP 6 years ago for this reason.

bethere is not correct, this is just petty snark on his part. There isn't anything intelligent or constructive with this guy, he's a troll basically.

Peter1469
10-03-2016, 01:05 PM
Disagree.

We have conservative tea parties and libertarian parties for a reason. The GOP is failing conservative voters and I hope it collapses. I left thr GOP 6 years ago for this reason.

bethere is not correct, this is just petty snark on his part. There isn't anything intelligent or constructive with this guy, he's a troll basically.


Warning: discuss the topic, not each other. Thank you.

Mac-7
10-03-2016, 01:06 PM
The Republican and Democrat parties are both falling apart. Are you blind enough to not see that?

Is that another of your 20 year predictions that no one will remember was wrong 21 years from now when you tell them how smart you are?

Mac-7
10-03-2016, 01:10 PM
Disagree.

We have conservative tea parties and libertarian parties for a reason. The GOP is failing conservative voters and I hope it collapses. I left thr GOP 6 years ago for this reason.

bethere is not correct, this is just petty snark on his part. There isn't anything intelligent or constructive with this guy, he's a troll basically.

The GOP may fall apart but I dont think a new or more pristine conservative party will rise from the rubble.

Its more likely that the democrat party will just become more dominant.

Peter1469
10-03-2016, 01:33 PM
The GOP may fall apart but I dont think a new or more pristine conservative party will rise from the rubble.

Its more likely that the democrat party will just become more dominant.

The working class people who are harmed by globalism are going to abandon the democrats.

Politics is realigning in the US.

Mac-7
10-03-2016, 02:52 PM
The working class people who are harmed by globalism are going to abandon the democrats.

Politics is realigning in the US.

Sure.

but every Yuppie spilling out of the lib colleges and all of the new illegal alien citizens who no speakee no good Engleash will vote for the Party of The Free Ride.

and where will the globalist establishment republicans go if not to the globalist democrats who hold all the power in washington?

DGUtley
10-03-2016, 02:56 PM
Are the Sheeple awakening?

Hal Jordan
10-04-2016, 12:25 AM
As an American citizen you have a right to help hillary become the next president.

There is no reason for you to be so upset just because I refuse to respect your choice.

Trump is not perfect

but for everyone except the far left he is much better for the country than hillary.

Except I'm not. I wouldn't vote for either under the threat of death. I would far rather die than support either.

For all your supposed hatred of libs, you're supporting a major one, comrade.

Hal Jordan
10-04-2016, 12:27 AM
Is that another of your 20 year predictions that no one will remember was wrong 21 years from now when you tell them how smart you are?

You'll see. It won't take 20 years, either. Don't worry. I'll save this, so you can admit how wrong you were.

Hal Jordan
10-04-2016, 12:29 AM
The GOP may fall apart but I dont think a new or more pristine conservative party will rise from the rubble.

Its more likely that the democrat party will just become more dominant.

Since the Republican party is far from conservative, it's hard to imagine that a replacement would be less conservative.

Hal Jordan
10-04-2016, 12:31 AM
Are the Sheeple awakening?

I believe they're being forced to.

PeoplePower
10-04-2016, 12:36 AM
Hey man,I'm just happy I got the artery on my foot to stop bleeding before I had to go to Wally world and cop Superglue with a blood red sock.
And that's where I stand.
A good question would be :"Where is that knife"?
I'm so mad.I have to mop everything tomorrow...again

Mac-7
10-04-2016, 06:35 AM
Except I'm not. I wouldn't vote for either under the threat of death. I would far rather die than support either.

For all your supposed hatred of libs, you're supporting a major one, comrade.

you blow a lot of smoke to hide your position.

But a vote for anyone except trump is a vote for hillary.

exploited
10-04-2016, 08:39 AM
The conservatives here should be hoping that the "sheeple" don't wake up from their slumber. If they do, they will be left-wing and radical, in pursuit of universal healthcare, tax-funded post-secondary, a guaranteed minimum income, drastic environmental laws intended to combat climate change and many other programs the Conservatives will despise.

Be careful what you wish for.

Chris
10-04-2016, 09:05 AM
I believe they're being forced to.


I don't. I think people are getting frustrated with the politician's inability to keep promises and the government's inability to solve problems, but I think the result will be being blind to politicians' lies and demand for more government.

MisterVeritis
10-04-2016, 09:36 AM
The conservatives here should be hoping that the "sheeple" don't wake up from their slumber. If they do, they will be left-wing and radical, in pursuit of universal healthcare, tax-funded post-secondary, a guaranteed minimum income, drastic environmental laws intended to combat climate change and many other programs the Conservatives will despise.

Be careful what you wish for.
The nation will end.

Mac-7
10-04-2016, 09:42 AM
The nation will end.

Even canadian blind hogs stumble across an acorn sometimes.

and I think he is on to something

the kids in school are ignorant about history, civics, economics and the real world in general.

each generation is worse than the one before

So the dumbasses who lean democrat are gaining on us.

exploited
10-04-2016, 09:55 AM
Even canadian blind hogs stumble across an acorn sometimes.

and I think he is on to something

the kids in school are ignorant about history, civics, economics and the real world in general.

each generation is worse than the one before

So the dumbasses who lean democrat are gaining on us.

Actually, we are now more highly-educated than ever before, the global standard of living is skyrocketing, people are treated more equitably every day, and things are overall improving. In fact, we live in the most peaceful, materially abundant and non-violent time in all of human history. There are problems to be fixed, and they are serious problems, but they will not be addressed by conservatives.

Instead, conservatism will be largely irrelevant within thirty years, as the population becomes younger, more intelligent, more capable and more goal-oriented. All of the things you care about and want to see implemented will instead by placed into the dustbin of history. As time goes on, you will grow increasingly angry and despondent, all while things continue to improve for the average person, largely because you (and people like you) have been relegated to the sidelines by demographics. We can already see this process with Trump - in an act of petulant rage, you have put up the single worst candidate in American history, and it will doom the GOP's chances for holding the Presidency for years and years. This self-destruction is bound to continue as your impotent outrage and extremism grows.

I personally am looking forward to the day when people like you are incapable of voting - the moment we remove the greedheads, sycophants, religious nutbags, conspiracy theorists and right-wing hacks from the national conversation, the better we'll all be. We'll finally be able to address these problems in a meaningful way, instead of dragging you kicking and screaming into the modern age.

Mac-7
10-04-2016, 09:58 AM
Actually, we are now more highly-educated than ever before,

and yet many college freshmen picked at random cant name the first president of the United States.

in America not canada where the ignorance is excuseable.

People stay in school longer than before but Im not sure they are better educated.

Mac-7
10-04-2016, 10:04 AM
I personally am looking forward to the day when people like you are incapable of voting -

You mean canadians like you who cant vote in OUR elections?

I hope that never changes.

exploited
10-04-2016, 10:25 AM
It always amazes me how obsessed people can be with the idea of "personal responsibility," while literally never applying it to themselves. The big problems of today are not because of the actions of the young, they are because of the actions of the old. Guys like Mac-7 have been ruining American national politics, on purpose, for thirty years or more. They elect politicians whose only idea of governance is sabotaging government programs, then complain the government doesn't work. They support blathering morons like Trump, and then talk about how people are less educated today. They spend and spend and spend on various pet projects, but the moment you propose spending it on keeping people alive, or funding surgeries for children and the poor, it is socialism. Their politicians rage about entitlement programs to people who have enjoyed decades of social security, medicare and the safest food and drug industry on the planet. Even the "liberals" of that age are guilty of the same things, with their NIMBYism and their low-tax populism (where they spend money they refuse to hike taxes up for).

These people, and people like Mac, have done nothing but take and take and take, for their entire lives. Their children and grandchildren will pay for their immaturity and selfishness. But that's okay, we don't mind cleaning up their mess... It is our responsibility to create a better world for our kids, a feeling that is alien to some of the older generations.

Mac-7
10-04-2016, 10:36 AM
It always amazes me how obsessed people can be with the idea of "personal responsibility," while literally never applying it to themselves. The big problems of today are not because of the actions of the young, they are because of the actions of the old. Guys like Mac-7 have been ruining American national politics, on purpose, for thirty years or more. They elect politicians whose only idea of governance is sabotaging government programs, then complain the government doesn't work. They support blathering morons like Trump, and then talk about how people are less educated today. They spend and spend and spend on various pet projects, but the moment you propose spending it on keeping people alive, or funding surgeries for children and the poor, it is socialism. Their politicians rage about entitlement programs to people who have enjoyed decades of social security, medicare and the safest food and drug industry on the planet. Even the "liberals" of that age are guilty of the same things, with their NIMBYism and their low-tax populism (where they spend money they refuse to hike taxes up for).

These people, and people like Mac, have done nothing but take and take and take, for their entire lives. Their children and grandchildren will pay for their immaturity and selfishness. But that's okay, we don't mind cleaning up their mess... It is our responsibility to create a better world for our kids, a feeling that is alien to some of the older generations.

Naturally as a conservative who has voted for the most conservative republicans available I share some of the blame when republicans screw up.

I accept that

although not from Canadians who have no damn business mettling in American politics.

But in my opinion liberals have done as much or more harm to America and are far from blameless.

MisterVeritis
10-04-2016, 11:12 AM
Even canadian blind hogs stumble across an acorn sometimes.

and I think he is on to something

the kids in school are ignorant about history, civics, economics and the real world in general.

each generation is worse than the one before

So the dumbasses who lean democrat are gaining on us.
It may be too late. If Crooked Illary wins this will be the last national election.

MisterVeritis
10-04-2016, 11:24 AM
Actually, we are now more highly-educated than ever before, the global standard of living is skyrocketing, people are treated more equitably every day, and things are overall improving. In fact, we live in the most peaceful, materially abundant and non-violent time in all of human history. There are problems to be fixed, and they are serious problems, but they will not be addressed by conservatives.
You have an interesting perspective. When the choice is tyranny versus liberty you eagerly choose tyranny. Is it because you believe you are among the anointed who will receive the cream whipped out of the people.


Instead, conservatism will be largely irrelevant within thirty years, as the population becomes younger, more intelligent, more capable and more goal-oriented.
When you claim the population is becoming more intelligent what do you mean? Have IQs been increasing over the years?

Will conservatism be irrelevant because of the surveillance state we live in? Are you choosing state authoritarianism as the natural state of man?


All of the things you care about and want to see implemented will instead by placed into the dustbin of history.
Liberty? Once again you eagerly choose tyranny over liberty.


As time goes on, you will grow increasingly angry and despondent, all while things continue to improve for the average person, largely because you (and people like you) have been relegated to the sidelines by demographics.
Yes. The Democratic Party defeated the people with the simple measure of changing immigration law. Democrats knew that time was on their side if they could only bring in a million poor, dumb, black and brown people from third world dictatorships each year for 50 years. You waged war against the best nation that ever existed and you won.


We can already see this process with Trump - in an act of petulant rage, you have put up the single worst candidate in American history, and it will doom the GOP's chances for holding the Presidency for years and years. This self-destruction is bound to continue as your impotent outrage and extremism grows.
Trump is going to win.

Oh, if your erection continues you might want to go see a doctor.


I personally am looking forward to the day when people like you are incapable of voting - the moment we remove the greedheads, sycophants, religious nutbags, conspiracy theorists and right-wing hacks from the national conversation, the better we'll all be. We'll finally be able to address these problems in a meaningful way, instead of dragging you kicking and screaming into the modern age.
The tyrant in you is peeking out from under your disguise.

Subdermal
10-04-2016, 12:10 PM
You say no, but your description is a yes. Make up your mind.

Totalitarians don't have to make up their mind. They simply look to make up yours.

exploited
10-04-2016, 12:19 PM
You have an interesting perspective. When the choice is tyranny versus liberty you eagerly choose tyranny. Is it because you believe you are among the anointed who will receive the cream whipped out of the people.


When you claim the population is becoming more intelligent what do you mean? Have IQs been increasing over the years?

Will conservatism be irrelevant because of the surveillance state we live in? Are you choosing state authoritarianism as the natural state of man?


Liberty? Once again you eagerly choose tyranny over liberty.


Yes. The Democratic Party defeated the people with the simple measure of changing immigration law. Democrats knew that time was on their side if they could only bring in a million poor, dumb, black and brown people from third world dictatorships each year for 50 years. You waged war against the best nation that ever existed and you won.


Trump is going to win.

Oh, if your erection continues you might want to go see a doctor.


The tyrant in you is peeking out from under your disguise.

You can say "tyrant" and "tyranny" until you're blue in the face, it doesn't make your argument any more sound. The simple fact is that conservatism, as a viable political force, is done. It has been killed off by a group of conspiracy theorists and anti-intellectuals who embarrass themselves as a sort of spectator sport. I am totally cool with this.

People such as Subdermal and yourself are doing me and the liberal world a whole bunch of favors and I don't want you to stop. Keep on going. Get more extreme. Say more insane things, like calling for the deaths of political candidates and threatening violence because you had to pay land fees. Make more threats, put up more idiots for President, alienate more moderates. This is perhaps the only thing you've ever done to benefit your nations politics.

I relish your slow and certain political irrelevancy.

Boris The Animal
10-04-2016, 01:52 PM
No. Instead the republican party will cease to be a national factor. Party's like the green and the libertarian, will remain unready for prime time. So, the us will revert to basically a one party system just as it did after reconstruction.Is that what you want, Communist?

Chloe
10-04-2016, 01:59 PM
Is that what you want, Communist?

on average how many times per day do you think of communism? They say most guys think about sex like every 10 seconds so your mind must be constantly at war between sex and communism.

Boris The Animal
10-04-2016, 02:01 PM
on average how many times per day do you think of communism? They say most guys think about sex like every 10 seconds so your mind must be constantly at war between sex and communism.Communism is at the root of all Leftist ideology and needs to be destroyed.

Chloe
10-04-2016, 02:02 PM
Communism is at the root of all Leftist ideology and needs to be destroyed.

Riiiight

exploited
10-04-2016, 02:07 PM
Is that what you want, Communist?

Ideally, the American electorate would have a choice of four or five different parties, which would be forced to work together through coalitions.

Unfortunately, systemic design problems has resulted in a two-party system that is tremendously difficult to break.

Equally as unfortunate is the fact that today's American conservative movement is one of the most insane, uneducated and illogical groups on the planet. They need to be alienated from all national institutions of powers, isolated in their ability to set policy, and generally ignored for the next half-century or so. That should give rational people of all political persuasions enough time to fix the system, working through the auspices of the Democrat Party. It is really sad that this is what it has to come too, but it is people like you who brought it about, and now you must pay.

Boris The Animal
10-04-2016, 02:10 PM
Ideally, the American electorate would have a choice of four or five different parties, which would be forced to work together through coalitions.

Unfortunately, systemic design problems has resulted in a two-party system that is tremendously difficult to break.

Equally as unfortunate is the fact that today's American conservative movement is one of the most insane, uneducated and illogical groups on the planet. They need to be alienated from all national institutions of powers, isolated in their ability to set policy, and generally ignored for the next half-century or so. That should give rational people of all political persuasions enough time to fix the system, working through the auspices of the Democrat Party. It is really sad that this is what it has to come too, but it is people like you who brought it about, and now you must pay.
So you do support one party Communist rule in the US with zero Conservative representation, even though whacked out Libs like yoou represent less than 20% of the population

exploited
10-04-2016, 02:17 PM
So you do support one party Communist rule in the US with zero Conservative representation, even though whacked out Libs like yoou represent less than 20% of the population

My support is largely irrelevant. If the conservative movement were to return to a sensible mix of fiscal conservatism and social liberalism, they could be incredibly successful. Unfortunately they have a large subset of total nutjobs that has hijacked their main party, and so they must be isolated before they do anymore damage to the electorate and the country. The best part is that I don't even have to do anything to make this happen - you guys are digging your own grave, just by being totally insane.

Boris The Animal
10-04-2016, 02:23 PM
My support is largely irrelevant. If the conservative movement were to return to a sensible mix of fiscal conservatism and social liberalism, they could be incredibly successful. Unfortunately they have a large subset of total nutjobs that has hijacked their main party, and so they must be isolated before they do anymore damage to the electorate and the country. The best part is that I don't even have to do anything to make this happen - you guys are digging your own grave, just by being totally insane.Only problem for you, Bolshevik, is that there are still Conservatives like myself who hold to the sanctity of human life and defend traditional marriage. social liberalism is a copout for sinful behaviors.

Chris
10-04-2016, 02:23 PM
My support is largely irrelevant. If the conservative movement were to return to a sensible mix of fiscal conservatism and social liberalism, they could be incredibly successful. Unfortunately they have a large subset of total nutjobs that has hijacked their main party, and so they must be isolated before they do anymore damage to the electorate and the country. The best part is that I don't even have to do anything to make this happen - you guys are digging your own grave, just by being totally insane.

LOL. "sensible mix of fiscal conservatism and social liberalism" is libertarianism which you also argue against when you're not telling us you are one.

exploited
10-04-2016, 02:27 PM
LOL. "sensible mix of fiscal conservatism and social liberalism" is libertarianism which you also argue against when you're not telling us you are one.

The key word here is "sensible." You are an ideological extremist, and not the least bit sensible. Next?

Boris The Animal
10-04-2016, 02:32 PM
The key word here is "sensible." You are an ideological extremist, and not the least bit sensible. Next?
"Sensible" according to exploited and the rest of the whacked out Left, means Conservatives agree with them on everything. Hey newsflash. The idea of an opposition is to oppose at all costs! Not rubberstamp a Liberal agenda.

exploited
10-04-2016, 02:55 PM
"Sensible" according to exploited and the rest of the whacked out Left, means Conservatives agree with them on everything. Hey newsflash. The idea of an opposition is to oppose at all costs! Not rubberstamp a Liberal agenda.

Nah. I have no problem with people who disagree with me and can tell me why, at least when they don't resort to absurd and demeaning conspiracy theories, mass generalizations, etc. Unfortunately, the modern conservative cannot seem to do that, at least the ones who post on message boards.

For instance, one such conservative is so insane that they would posit that all Democrats are communists or idiots. That kind of irrationality cannot be reasoned with, it can only be contained and ignored. Luckily national politics is a pretty Darwinian process, and the crazies who have hijacked the GOP are paying the price. They will not be able to elect a President for decades, and as their voting base gets older and dwindles, they will not be able to elect representatives either. I relish this process, even as I wish it never came to this. You and your ilk are desperation incarnate, and I'm not above taking pleasure from your tears.

Chris
10-04-2016, 03:13 PM
Problem is, if conservatism is failing, so is liberalism.

Liberalism Has Lost Its Soul (http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/liberalism-has-lost-its-soul/)


Hillary Clinton’s nomination was contested by young liberals who rejected her marriage of corporatism and imperialism. But instead of appealing to the disenfranchised Bernie Sanders voters, she’s courting neoconservatives and crony capitalists.

Is American liberalism losing its soul?

Every four years, the left has said you should vote for them because the GOP are a bunch of racists, misogynists, and religious fundamentalists—and they maintained this message even when Republicans nominated relatively center-right candidates. If for years the GOP accused every Democratic candidate of being a new George McGovern, the Democrats argued that every Republican was the new George Wallace. Yet beyond social liberalism, the Democratic Party hasn’t offered much to the left recently. Hillary’s hawkish foreign policy and crony capitalism don’t have many supporters in the base of the party, but she gets a pass by using the Democrats’ old trick—telling people that Republicans are worse.

The fact that a socialist [sic] in his 70s was able to be a real challenger to the Clinton establishment shows that third-way liberalism doesn’t sell like in the old days. While some describe Sanders as an unreconstructed New Deal Democrat, for a lot of his life he was an independent and third-party guy. His ideals were closer to the romantic vision of the socialist revolution than to the incremental reforms that liberals always promise.

But this is hardly a new dynamic....

MisterVeritis
10-04-2016, 04:19 PM
You can say "tyrant" and "tyranny" until you're blue in the face, it doesn't make your argument any more sound. The simple fact is that conservatism, as a viable political force, is done. It has been killed off by a group of conspiracy theorists and anti-intellectuals who embarrass themselves as a sort of spectator sport. I am totally cool with this.

People such as Subdermal and yourself are doing me and the liberal world a whole bunch of favors and I don't want you to stop. Keep on going. Get more extreme. Say more insane things, like calling for the deaths of political candidates and threatening violence because you had to pay land fees. Make more threats, put up more idiots for President, alienate more moderates. This is perhaps the only thing you've ever done to benefit your nations politics.

I relish your slow and certain political irrelevancy.
You are going to be surprised. Liberalism brings despoilation and death. It is tyrannical as your post reveals. As far as violence is concerned you shall reap what you have sown.

Whose death have I called for? Do you refer to Crooked Illary? Yes. The nation ought to indict, try, convict, and execute her based on the exceptionally grave damage she did to us. That is a call for justice. You might not be familiar with the concept.

The Federal government owns and controls land unconstitutionally. It is time for the federal government to sell off the lands it unconstitutionally holds.

MisterVeritis
10-04-2016, 04:21 PM
Ideally, the American electorate would have a choice of four or five different parties, which would be forced to work together through coalitions.

Unfortunately, systemic design problems has resulted in a two-party system that is tremendously difficult to break.

Equally as unfortunate is the fact that today's American conservative movement is one of the most insane, uneducated and illogical groups on the planet. They need to be alienated from all national institutions of powers, isolated in their ability to set policy, and generally ignored for the next half-century or so. That should give rational people of all political persuasions enough time to fix the system, working through the auspices of the Democrat Party. It is really sad that this is what it has to come too, but it is people like you who brought it about, and now you must pay.
Do you see how readily the left slips into tyranny? It is your undoing.

MisterVeritis
10-04-2016, 04:23 PM
For instance, one such conservative is so insane that they would posit that all Democrats are communists or idiots.
Even if it is not true that is the way to bet.

Newpublius
10-04-2016, 04:28 PM
Do you see how readily the left slips into tyranny? It is your undoing.

I know really and I love this:

"Equally as unfortunate is the fact that today's American conservative movement is one of the most insane, uneducated and illogical groups on the planet. They need to be alienated from all national institutions of powers, isolated in their ability to set policy, and generally ignored for the next half-century or so. "

The liberal hubris knows no bounds.

It must be a shame for them we own the factory.

Chris
10-04-2016, 04:34 PM
Meh, politics is failing us, democracy has run its course.

exploited
10-04-2016, 04:36 PM
Do you see how readily the left slips into tyranny? It is your undoing.

There is nothing tyrannical about letting you guys elect morons while talking yourself out of any influence you have.

Boris The Animal
10-04-2016, 04:38 PM
There is nothing tyrannical about letting you guys elect morons while talking yourself out of any influence you have.Sure it is when you start discriminating and oppressing political opponents. That is the legacy of Leftist rule. You want this kind of rule? MOVE TO NORTH KOREA!!!

exploited
10-04-2016, 04:39 PM
Sure it is when you start discriminating and oppressing political opponents. That is the legacy of Leftist rule. You want this kind of rule? MOVE TO NORTH KOREA!!!

Again, it isn't oppressive of me to let you guys elect morons and lose influence. That is your doing, not mine.

MisterVeritis
10-04-2016, 04:42 PM
There is nothing tyrannical about letting you guys elect morons while talking yourself out of any influence you have.
You cannot slip away from your tyrannical heart.

Newpublius
10-04-2016, 04:46 PM
There is nothing tyrannical about letting you guys elect morons while talking yourself out of any influence you have.

Because you're interposing your judgment fornthe judgment of other. The government's judgment is clearly off and that is self evident by the $19tn in bonds that are outstanding. Limited government should be reimposed. If you don't agree, you're a moron and liberals like you should be extirpated from the reins of government. Nothibg tyranical about removing liberal morons you turkeys elect.

See how that works? You don't monopolize the marketplace of ideas as judge, jury and executioner.

Boris The Animal
10-04-2016, 04:48 PM
Again, it isn't oppressive of me to let you guys elect morons and lose influence. That is your doing, not mine.
Oh no, it is you and your sick ideology that is on the losing end, pal. The Soviet Union and Eastern Bloc are gone, Cuba, Venezuela, North Korea and China are all that's left of your ideal state, Bolshevik. Move there if you want Leftist rule in the country.

exploited
10-04-2016, 04:51 PM
Oh no, it is you and your sick ideology that is on the losing end, pal. The Soviet Union and Eastern Bloc are gone, Cuba, Venezuela, North Korea and China are all that's left of your ideal state, Bolshevik. Move there if you want Leftist rule in the country.

Literally incoherent. Moving on.

exploited
10-04-2016, 04:51 PM
Because you're interposing your judgment fornthe judgment of other. The government's judgment is clearly off and that is self evident by the $19tn in bonds that are outstanding. Limited government should be reimposed. If you don't agree, you're a moron and liberals like you should be extirpated from the reins of government. Nothibg tyranical about removing liberal morons you turkeys elect.

See how that works? You don't monopolize the marketplace of ideas as judge, jury and executioner.

Yes, I see how that works. I encourage all of you to become more extreme in your conservatism, because in doing so, you destroy your own influence. I have no problems with this. Please, carry on.

Chris
10-04-2016, 05:09 PM
Yes, I see how that works. I encourage all of you to become more extreme in your conservatism, because in doing so, you destroy your own influence. I have no problems with this. Please, carry on.

As liberals become more extreme. I have no problem with either of you doing this. Tear each other up for all I care. Society will carry on.

MisterVeritis
10-04-2016, 05:34 PM
Yes, I see how that works. I encourage all of you to become more extreme in your conservatism, because in doing so, you destroy your own influence. I have no problems with this. Please, carry on.
Extremism in support of liberty is no vice. Extremism in support of state tyranny is no virtue.

Newpublius
10-04-2016, 05:48 PM
Yes, I see how that works. I encourage all of you to become more extreme in your conservatism, because in doing so, you destroy your own influence. I have no problems with this. Please, carry on.

Yes, indeed, such extemist beliefs as balancing budgets, decreasing taxes, trading freely with the world and peace. Complete lunatics we are.

Chris
10-04-2016, 06:06 PM
Yes, indeed, such extemist beliefs as balancing budgets, decreasing taxes, trading freely with the world and peace. Complete lunatics we are.

Well you are, to ever expect the government to go that way when it never has. The left can't be beaten when it promises the people largess. The only consolation is it won't last.

Mister D
10-04-2016, 07:46 PM
Meh, politics is failing us, democracy has run its course.

I do find myself increasingly attracted to anti-democratic ideas at least on the macro level and I also agree that democracy (i.e. liberal democracy) has exhausted its potential.

Chris
10-04-2016, 08:09 PM
I do find myself increasingly attracted to anti-democratic ideas at least on the macro level and I also agree that democracy (i.e. liberal democracy) has exhausted its potential.

It works small scale but large scale is a sham.

MisterVeritis
02-15-2024, 01:03 PM
The GOP and Dems are already a one party system.
Agree. The Democrat-communists do have the support of a large number of collaborators in the Republican Party.

MisterVeritis
02-15-2024, 01:06 PM
We are at $20T in debt and the world is moving away from the USD as the reserve currency. Prepare for a collapse. Now.

As it gets closer, if you have savings you can short the system and get rich on the collapse. But be careful with timing.
We are now on the cusp of 35 trillion dollars worth of debt. Our debt is growing at a rate of one new trillion dollars every 100 days. We will be at 50 trillion in 1500 days. That is four years. 2028.

MisterVeritis
02-15-2024, 01:10 PM
The key is the economy. The only thing really keeping the country together is the spectacularly successful free trade zone.

Right now US debt is such that a rise to historical interst rates places a severe fiscal burden on the US, the alternative of course is inflation.

Right now the US is a leveraged entity and it possesses many of the risk factors businesses possess when they leverage
Well, we got both debt and inflation. Thanks Establishment.

donttread
02-15-2024, 01:11 PM
Racially fueled and class driven (the ultra-wealthy class vs. the handout class that drives the political system)?

Are there too many opposites that are heading to a melting point?

It could happen this decade, in 50 or in 100 years, but will it happen?

Our current citizenship in general is far too sift to revolt. Hell they'd surrender in the cell towers and online gaming were jammed for a day

MisterVeritis
02-15-2024, 01:15 PM
We experienced a coup. We are no longer protected by a Constitution and most do not care.

It will not be a political revolution. It will be real. Or the people will accept their chains and their serfdom.
October 2016. We experienced a coup.

Trump won. Obama led a coup against the newly elected President. Those facts have been out for a long time but yesterday the story became real once again. The President, Obama, CIA, and FBI planned, organized, and led a coup against Trump.

That is why Turner started babbling about Jewish space lasers, or Russian nuclear weapons, or something.

MisterVeritis
02-15-2024, 01:17 PM
I am not surprised you are confused. A revolution will begin with assassinations of judges and politicians. It will not occur after an invasion by an outside force. It will begin on a day much like today. You might not even notice.
October 2016.

Revolutionary spirit takes a long time to build. Before it begins we all have to suffer. Thanks Biden.

MisterVeritis
02-15-2024, 01:20 PM
The working class people who are harmed by globalism are going to abandon the democrats.

Politics is realigning in the US.
It took a while, but you were right. Right cause. Right effect.

MisterVeritis
02-15-2024, 01:22 PM
Actually, we are now more highly-educated than ever before, the global standard of living is skyrocketing, people are treated more equitably every day, and things are overall improving. In fact, we live in the most peaceful, materially abundant and non-violent time in all of human history. There are problems to be fixed, and they are serious problems, but they will not be addressed by conservatives.

Instead, conservatism will be largely irrelevant within thirty years, as the population becomes younger, more intelligent, more capable and more goal-oriented. All of the things you care about and want to see implemented will instead by placed into the dustbin of history. As time goes on, you will grow increasingly angry and despondent, all while things continue to improve for the average person, largely because you (and people like you) have been relegated to the sidelines by demographics. We can already see this process with Trump - in an act of petulant rage, you have put up the single worst candidate in American history, and it will doom the GOP's chances for holding the Presidency for years and years. This self-destruction is bound to continue as your impotent outrage and extremism grows.

I personally am looking forward to the day when people like you are incapable of voting - the moment we remove the greedheads, sycophants, religious nutbags, conspiracy theorists and right-wing hacks from the national conversation, the better we'll all be. We'll finally be able to address these problems in a meaningful way, instead of dragging you kicking and screaming into the modern age.
"You will own nothing and you will be happy."

MisterVeritis
02-15-2024, 01:25 PM
You have an interesting perspective. When the choice is tyranny versus liberty you eagerly choose tyranny. Is it because you believe you are among the anointed who will receive the cream whipped out of the people.


When you claim the population is becoming more intelligent what do you mean? Have IQs been increasing over the years?

Will conservatism be irrelevant because of the surveillance state we live in? Are you choosing state authoritarianism as the natural state of man?


Liberty? Once again you eagerly choose tyranny over liberty.


Yes. The Democratic Party defeated the people with the simple measure of changing immigration law. Democrats knew that time was on their side if they could only bring in a million poor, dumb, black and brown people from third world dictatorships each year for 50 years. You waged war against the best nation that ever existed and you won.


Trump is going to win.

Oh, if your erection continues you might want to go see a doctor.


The tyrant in you is peeking out from under your disguise.
I don't know who this guy is but boy is he good!