PDA

View Full Version : Immigration - It's Over



Scrounger
10-13-2016, 01:19 PM
After many a heated debate I don't address this is much as I should. But, as the next presidential cycle is about to end, it became important to spell out what the real issues are. This is about soul cleansing as well.

In the upcoming election, if Trump stays in, he will be defeated 53 to 41 percent at best. The worse part is, Trump is running against the worst the Democrats have to offer. Adding insult to injury, Trump is going to lose on his signature issue: so – called “illegal immigration.” Now I hate to be an I told you so, but I told you so. And I want to set the record straight.

Both sides have cursed me, threatened me, and I've been stalked, shot at and things done to me you would not believe over this issue. So, in cleansing my soul and washing my hands of this I can express what I think... since not one single swinging soul that criticized me ever had the moral courage to ask me what I think. I only provided the facts. I've only addressed the modern anti-immigrant effort for the last 15 years (involved in the issue since the 1970s.)

On the first point, we live on a finite piece of the world's earth. Australia is a country about the same size of the United States, but we have more than TEN TIMES more people on that same land. So, as personal feeling, I don't understand why any American wants anyone else over here.

With that said, things got complicated. We knew the real problems, but allowed snake oil salesmen to foist upon us that illegal v legal alien crap. Here we are in a state of war, though neither side will declare a war. The United States allows foreigners from enemy countries to come here and take jobs from Americans AND seats in colleges from Americans – all the while everybody saying it's cool since those people came here “legally.” What a fricking crock!

People pour into America and no “vetting” process negates the fact that you cannot trust foreign governments to tell you the truth about their citizenry. In addition, in Muslim countries, people who have engaged in family squabbles do not have a criminal record. In other countries using drugs does not get reported to the authorities. So, the “legal” variety of foreigner has an unfair advantage when it comes to getting a job in a nation that relies on background checks.

The leadership for this recent anti- immigrant fight started with Jim Gilchrist. He was a racist and I told you so. That was proven. I warned people about Chris Simcox and he picked J.T. Ready as his top man. Simcox turned out to be a criminal; J.T. Ready would become a mass shooter, ending his own life in the end. Shawna Forde, the next in line for the leadership of the anti-immigrant lobby ended up getting convicted of murder. Sheriff Arpaio, has alleged racial profiling and anti – immigrant views have landed him in jail with a criminal contempt charge that could end his career. Donald Trump is giving the White House, the House of Representatives, the Senate AND the United States Supreme Court to the left.

In short, the current crop of wannabes complaining about so – called “illegal” immigration gave away their country, accepted defeat at every level, and did not gain a single inch of ground. On the contrary, they helped build a government that, after Hitlery, will be impervious to defeat (at least in our lifetime) – barring the former anti-immigrant lobby reaching out to the constitutional patriots they stabbed in the back.

The anti- immigrant lobby gave us the creation of the Dept. of Homeland (IN) Security, the so – called “Patriot Act,” National ID / REAL ID Act, and drones that put Americans under surveillance 24 / 7 / 365 under the pretext of saving us from so – called :”illegal” aliens. Meanwhile Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, Omar Mateen, and the offspring of “legal” foreigners – Nidal Hasan... not to mention the 9 / 11 hijackers were all of that “legal” variety that got in because that vetting manure isn't worth a plug nickel.

In short, the anti – immigrant lobby lost and most of them will not admit that their strategy failed. They will be too proud and too egotistical to seek out sound counsel and try to figure out what the history was of this AND how they could have avoided this humiliating defeat. It seems so empty on my part, having preceded those people and NOT losing when we had the opportunities. But, after a decade and a half, my only consolation is being able to say I told you so.

The way I see it, if there are those who want to reverse course; if they want to save their culture and their nation, they will look toward those who have a proven record and provided them the answers and accurately predicted this day would arrive given the failed strategies of the current crop of “leaders” they have blindly followed.

If they don't, the fight is over and I tried to keep that from happening.

(bolding is not to be interpreted as yelling, but stressing the importance of what is being said. No offense intended.)

Cigar
10-13-2016, 01:24 PM
Good .. I'm glad I would have to hear any more about it. :rollseyes:

DGUtley
10-13-2016, 01:52 PM
Without a border, what's a country?

NapRover
10-13-2016, 02:11 PM
Without a border, what's a country?
If immigrants were coming in as republicans, there would be a moat, wall, fence, artillery, snakes, bees, etc. to keep them out. Leftists say it's worth some terror attacks to keep power.

Peter1469
10-13-2016, 02:37 PM
nationalism v globalism

Scrounger
10-13-2016, 03:47 PM
If immigrants were coming in as republicans, there would be a moat, wall, fence, artillery, snakes, bees, etc. to keep them out. Leftists say it's worth some terror attacks to keep power.

The wall idea is and was a bad idea.

1) In this de facto (illegal) Democracy, the majority aren't buying it

2) The only way you build a wall is to build a bigger and more powerful government. That government will become bigger than the people it serves and its tools most likely used to further the agenda of the left

3) The wall you build to keep people out keeps you hemmed in.

I can give you better results without a wall AND turn America around.

NapRover
10-14-2016, 10:40 AM
The wall idea is and was a bad idea.

1) In this de facto (illegal) Democracy, the majority aren't buying it

2) The only way you build a wall is to build a bigger and more powerful government. That government will become bigger than the people it serves and its tools most likely used to further the agenda of the left

3) The wall you build to keep people out keeps you hemmed in.

I can give you better results without a wall AND turn America around.

whatever will go the job of keeping unwanted, illegals from coming and going at will suits me fine. Put up signs that say "go back". If that works, I'm good. I welcome immigrants legally, after extreme vetting.

Scrounger
10-14-2016, 01:39 PM
whatever will go the job of keeping unwanted, illegals from coming and going at will suits me fine. Put up signs that say "go back". If that works, I'm good. I welcome immigrants legally, after extreme vetting.


And I repeat:

"People pour into America and no “vetting” process negates the fact that you cannot trust foreign governments to tell you the truth about their citizenry."

You're going to ask foreign governments to tell us all about their citizens??? Governments that are fighting us??? You're going to ask foreign governments whose citizenry have NOTHING in common with our culture and our interests if they are good people? Really?

Most of the rest of the world does not believe in the values that our country is founded on. Those people will tell you what you want to hear in order to come here, but once they are here... Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, Omar Mateen, etc., etc.

ripmeister
10-14-2016, 02:26 PM
And I repeat:

"People pour into America and no “vetting” process negates the fact that you cannot trust foreign governments to tell you the truth about their citizenry."

You're going to ask foreign governments to tell us all about their citizens??? Governments that are fighting us??? You're going to ask foreign governments whose citizenry have NOTHING in common with our culture and our interests if they are good people? Really?

Most of the rest of the world does not believe in the values that our country is founded on. Those people will tell you what you want to hear in order to come here, but once they are here... Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, Omar Mateen, etc., etc.

I don't necessarily disagree with some of the things you are saying but weren't the examples you cite second generation immigrants? Haven't most of the recent attacks been by second generation citizens of the US? It seems to me this "home grown" threat is much more insidious. Not that, that deals with the concerns you raise but it is an important consideration IMO.

Scrounger
10-14-2016, 04:56 PM
I don't necessarily disagree with some of the things you are saying but weren't the examples you cite second generation immigrants? Haven't most of the recent attacks been by second generation citizens of the US? It seems to me this "home grown" threat is much more insidious. Not that, that deals with the concerns you raise but it is an important consideration IMO.

Immediate immigrants like the Tsarnev brothers or the 9 / 11 attackers or the offspring of radicals like Omar Mateen and Nidal Hasan makes no difference to me. We offer up wholesale citizenship and if you want to let extremists come in and allow their children to be jihadists, that is well within your prerogative, but it is wrong.

Our country was built upon certain foundational principles that are many, many centuries old. For example, I'm finding that many (maybe most) countries do not believe in a Right of self defense. And we all realize that the Muslims believe that if they cannot convert us, they are to kill us.

We have all these people flooding our border with foreign ideologies, religions and creeds. Everybody would like to change us. I'm simply against giving people the bullets to shoot at me with.

The United States has enough people here. We don't need any more immigrants for a while. We don't need them under the pretext of legal or illegal. Our country has no direction. The left wants to change the balance of power and our entire system of jurisprudence by inundating this country with voters that do not share the ideals and values upon which the Republic rests.