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AZ Jim
02-03-2017, 04:56 PM
So now the opposition to the wall (trumps wet dream) is not favored by of all people, wait for it, .........Republican senators! Don't ya just love this cluster fuck?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/03/politics/border-wall-republicans/index.html

Peter1469
02-03-2017, 05:19 PM
Elections have consequences
- B. Obama

Private Pickle
02-03-2017, 05:41 PM
Elections have consequences
- B. Obama
/thread

Docthehun
02-03-2017, 05:42 PM
"It'll work, the Chinese built their wall 2,000 years ago and I don't think you'll find many Mexicans there."


Just sayin'

Cthulhu
02-03-2017, 06:40 PM
"It'll work, the Chinese built their wall 2,000 years ago and I don't think you'll find many Mexicans there."


Just sayin'
I have been telling people I know that if we do build a wall, it has better be something that makes the Great Wall of China look silly.

Let's make another Wonder.

Besides, think of how many Mexicans it will employ!

Who do you really think is going to wind up building it?

Fear profits a man nothing.

Crepitus
02-03-2017, 07:04 PM
I have been telling people I know that if we do build a wall, it has better be something that makes the Great Wall of China look silly.

Let's make another Wonder.

Besides, think of how many Mexicans it will employ!

Who do you really think is going to wind up building it?

Fear profits a man nothing.

Hey, since they're gonna pay for it why not?

waltky
02-09-2017, 08:47 PM
Granny says, "Dat's okay - Mexico gonna pay fer it...
http://www.politicalforum.com/images/smilies/icon_grandma.gif
Trump border 'wall' to cost $21.6 billion, take 3.5 years to build: internal report
Thu Feb 9, 2017 | President Donald Trump’s “wall” along the U.S.-Mexico border would be a series of fences and walls that would cost as much as $21.6 billion, and take more than three years to construct, based on a U.S. Department of Homeland Security internal report seen by Reuters on Thursday.


The report’s estimated price-tag is much higher than a $12-billion figure cited by Trump in his campaign and estimates as high as $15 billion from Republican House Speaker Paul Ryan and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. The report is expected to be presented to Department of Homeland Security (DHS) Secretary John Kelly in coming days, although the administration will not necessarily take actions it recommends. The plan lays out what it would take to seal the border in three phases of construction of fences and walls covering just over 1,250 miles (2,000 km) by the end of 2020.

With 654 miles (1,046 km) of the border already fortified, the new construction would extend almost the length of the entire border. Many cost estimates and timelines have been floated since Trump campaigned on the promise of building a wall. The report seen by Reuters is the work of a group commissioned by Kelly as a final step before moving forward with requesting U.S. taxpayer funds from Congress and getting started on construction. A DHS spokeswoman said the department does "not comment on or confirm the potential existence of pre-decisional, deliberative documents." A White House spokeswoman said it would be “premature” to comment on a report that has not officially been presented to the president.


http://s3.reutersmedia.net/resources/r/?m=02&d=20170209&t=2&i=1172091052&w=640&fh=&fw=&ll=&pl=&sq=&r=LYNXMPED181NK
Three men from India jump the fence from Mexico and give themselves up to U.S. border patrol agents in Calexico, California

The report said the first phase would be the smallest, targeting sections covering 26 miles (42 km) near San Diego, California; El Paso, Texas; and in Texas's Rio Grande Valley. The report assumes DHS would get funding from Congress by April or May, giving the department sufficient time to secure contractors and begin construction by September. Trump has said Congress should fund the wall upfront, but that Mexico will reimburse U.S. taxpayers. Mexico has said it will not pay. Several U.S. congressional delegations are visiting the border this month to assess funding needs, according to several people familiar with the travel plans.

The report shows the U.S. government has begun seeking waivers to address environmental laws on building in some areas. It also shows the government has begun working with existing contractors and planning steel purchases for the project. Trump told law enforcement officials on Wednesday, "The wall is getting designed right now." The report accounted for the time and cost of acquiring private land, one reason for its steep price increase compared to estimates from Trump and members of Congress.

Bernstein Research, an investment research group that tracks material costs, has said that uncertainties around the project could drive its cost up to as much as $25 billion. The second phase of construction proposed in the report would cover 151 miles (242 km) of border in and around the Rio Grande Valley; Laredo, Texas; Tucson, Arizona; El Paso, Texas and Big Bend, Texas. The third phase would cover an unspecified 1,080 miles (1,728 km), essentially sealing off the entire U.S.-Mexico border.

BARRIERS TO CONSTRUCTION (http://mobile.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSKBN15O2ZN)

MisterVeritis
02-09-2017, 11:06 PM
Granny says, "Dat's okay - Mexico gonna pay fer it...
http://www.politicalforum.com/images/smilies/icon_grandma.gif
Trump border 'wall' to cost $21.6 billion, take 3.5 years to build: internal report
Thu Feb 9, 2017 | President Donald Trump’s “wall” along the U.S.-Mexico border would be a series of fences and walls that would cost as much as $21.6 billion, and take more than three years to construct, based on a U.S. Department of Homeland Security internal report seen by Reuters on Thursday.
Most likely what Reuters saw is an internal first cut "should cost" estimate.

Tahuyaman
02-09-2017, 11:11 PM
Americans overwhelmingly support securing our borders.

Tahuyaman
02-09-2017, 11:13 PM
So now the opposition to the wall (trumps wet dream) is not favored by of all people, wait for it, .........Republican senators! Don't ya just love this cluster $#@!?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/03/politics/border-wall-republicans/index.html

How old were you when you got your first color TV?

maineman
02-09-2017, 11:15 PM
Americans overwhelmingly support securing our borders.

and then there's this:

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/01/06/less-than-half-the-public-views-border-wall-as-an-important-goal-for-u-s-immigration-policy/

Ransom
02-10-2017, 07:40 AM
Losers don't decide though. Winners will make the decision on where, when, how, and why. We'll come to the Left when we need it paid for.

As promised.

Ransom
02-10-2017, 07:42 AM
Americans overwhelmingly support securing our borders.
And a reason Trump was elected

NapRover
02-10-2017, 08:31 AM
"It'll work, the Chinese built their wall 2,000 years ago and I don't think you'll find many Mexicans there."


Just sayin'
If we could just put up signs saying "I'd turn back if I were you", I'd be for that.

maineman
02-10-2017, 09:25 AM
Losers don't decide though. Winners will make the decision on where, when, how, and why. We'll come to the Left when we need it paid for.

As promised.

you'd better hurry and get all your fun stuff paid for by 2018!

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/congressional_job_approval-903.html

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/11/23/poll-despite-trump-victory-voters-support-abortion-oppose-border-wall.html

“Two of President-elect Donald Trump’s signature campaign mantras get hearty thumbs down,” Tim Malloy, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University poll, said. “Voters to Trump: No way on reversing Roe v Wade and not a chance on building that wall.”

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/10/politics/republican-town-halls-obamacare/index.html

Chris
02-10-2017, 10:23 AM
To WALL or not to WALL?

Rather than Hamlet, Midsummer's Night Dream...

I fear my Thisbe’s promise is forgot!—
And thou, O Wall, O sweet, O lovely Wall,
That stand’st between her father’s ground and mine.
Thou Wall, O Wall, O sweet and lovely Wall,
Show me thy chink to blink through with mine eyne!
WALL holds up fingers as chink
Thanks, courteous Wall. Jove shield thee well for this!
But what see I? No Thisbe do I see.
O wicked Wall through whom I see no bliss!
Cursed be thy stones for thus deceiving me!

Don
02-10-2017, 01:25 PM
To WALL or not to WALL?

Rather than Hamlet, Midsummer's Night Dream...

I fear my Thisbe’s promise is forgot!—
And thou, O Wall, O sweet, O lovely Wall,
That stand’st between her father’s ground and mine.
Thou Wall, O Wall, O sweet and lovely Wall,
Show me thy chink to blink through with mine eyne!
WALL holds up fingers as chink
Thanks, courteous Wall. Jove shield thee well for this!
But what see I? No Thisbe do I see.
O wicked Wall through whom I see no bliss!
Cursed be thy stones for thus deceiving me!

That sounds a lot like the wall between the establishment and normal sane people yearning to be left alone.

birddog
02-10-2017, 03:48 PM
you'd better hurry and get all your fun stuff paid for by 2018!

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/congressional_job_approval-903.html

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/11/23/poll-despite-trump-victory-voters-support-abortion-oppose-border-wall.html

“Two of President-elect Donald Trump’s signature campaign mantras get hearty thumbs down,” Tim Malloy, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University poll, said. “Voters to Trump: No way on reversing Roe v Wade and not a chance on building that wall.”

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/10/politics/republican-town-halls-obamacare/index.html

"Oh Ye Of Little Faith,"

The Wall will be built where needed, and the border will be strengthened greatly. Illegals, both people and drugs, will be greatly diminished.

Doublejack
02-10-2017, 05:13 PM
The cost of a wall itself and what i'm assuming would be 24-7 / 365 maintenance + security seems pretty insane when we already have better, cheaper options already.

I'll never understand the lack of support for e-verify.

maineman
02-10-2017, 05:16 PM
"Oh Ye Of Little Faith,"

The Wall will be built where needed, and the border will be strengthened greatly. Illegals, both people and drugs, will be greatly diminished.

and tell me again how a 20% tariff on Mexican goods is having Mexico pay for it like the orange clown promised. Really.... you paying $25 instead of $20 for a bottle of Cuervo is not really costing Mexico.

birddog
02-10-2017, 05:54 PM
and tell me again how a 20% tariff on Mexican goods is having Mexico pay for it like the orange clown promised. Really.... you paying $25 instead of $20 for a bottle of Cuervo is not really costing Mexico.


First of all, I don't buy products made in Mexico. Secondly, I believe that keeping millions of illegals out and getting rid of the ones we don't want will save us many billions, hence indirectly they paid for the wall. The amount we pay for their welfare and medical needs is significant.

maineman
02-10-2017, 05:59 PM
nice tap dance. you'll buy any line of bullshit the orange clown sells, won't ya?

birddog
02-10-2017, 06:02 PM
nice tap dance. you'll buy any line of bullshit the orange clown sells, won't ya?

No, it simply makes sense! If all else fails, THINK!

maineman
02-10-2017, 06:18 PM
His press secretary said that Mexico would "pay" for the wall by our imposition of a 20% tariff on Mexican goods. He's a complete idiot to even say such a moronic thing, and Trumpeters who believe that shit are worthy of nothing more than derisive laughter.

birddog
02-10-2017, 06:34 PM
His press secretary said that Mexico would "pay" for the wall by our imposition of a 20% tariff on Mexican goods. He's a complete idiot to even say such a moronic thing, and Trumpeters who believe that shit are worthy of nothing more than derisive laughter.

Well, that's an option, but I realize costs are passed on to consumers. I have heard my option discussed by Trump or one of his people.

maineman
02-10-2017, 06:45 PM
Well, that's an option, but I realize costs are passed on to consumers.

so....you'll admit that the 20% tariff as a means of getting Mexico to pay for the wall is pure bullshit spewed by Sean Spicer? Are you fine with Trump's press secretary spewing bullshit?

MisterVeritis
02-10-2017, 08:14 PM
His press secretary said that Mexico would "pay" for the wall by our imposition of a 20% tariff on Mexican goods. He's a complete idiot to even say such a moronic thing, and Trumpeters who believe that shit are worthy of nothing more than derisive laughter.
Maine, are you familiar with the "trial balloon" concept?

valley ranch
02-10-2017, 08:37 PM
You live in Mexico, and have a certain fondness for that country, I'm sure most of the time you are if favor of the United States. The hell with Mexico when it comes to dumping and sucking money and industry from our country. They, Mexico can be made to pay and I think the will be. We given Mexico Millions and Millions when their peso wasn't worth an Arswipe! Fair trade, fair everything, America First.

maineman
02-10-2017, 08:51 PM
Maine, are you familiar with the "trial balloon" concept?

like floating two plus two equals five and see how many suckers will believe you?

Any IDIOT knows that a tariff on Mexican goods is paid by the consumer, not the supplier. To even FLOAT such a moronic trial balloon is an insult to the intelligence of most folks.... Trumpeters, obviously not so much.

maineman
02-10-2017, 08:53 PM
They, Mexico can be made to pay and I think the will be.

by putting a 20% tariff on their goods sold in the United States.

We are being governed by economic WIZARDS, I tell you!

Professor Peabody
02-12-2017, 02:18 AM
So now the opposition to the wall (trumps wet dream) is not favored by of all people, wait for it, .........Republican senators! Don't ya just love this cluster $#@!?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/03/politics/border-wall-republicans/index.html

No real need to deport or build a wall. What makes more sense is to make eVerify mandatory for employment and ALL government benefits. Then take away their ability to keep legitimate jobs with phony, underage or stolen social security numbers. The SSA and IRS are all too well aware of multiple people using a single social security number. With modern computer databases, it wouldn't be hard to pluck out all the duplicate, non issued or under age users excepting the original issuee. Then send notices to their employers the duplicate users payments are coming from that there appears to be an error and they must verify the social security number within 30 days or face massive fines and jail time. Then move on to the Individual Taxpayer Identification Number filers, requiring them to provide their valid visa's allowing them to remain legally in the country, no proof, NO REFUND. Compile a list of those failing to provide the valid visa's and investigate if they are in the county legally, if not deport them.

This is a simple cost effective way to open up approx 5 million existing jobs to the out of work citizens. It will also save Billions in Government benefits going to those who circumvented the legal immigration process and aren't entitled to benefits.

AeonPax
02-12-2017, 04:10 AM
`
`
People in the US (assuming these people are Mexican) send billions of dollars back to Mexico every year. Couldn't that be taxed?

maineman
02-12-2017, 09:59 AM
`
`
People in the US (assuming these people are Mexican) send billions of dollars back to Mexico every year. Couldn't that be taxed?

would you tax all money transfers out of the United States? How would people effectively travel around Europe, let's say, if every time they went to an ATM they paid some sort of tax for the privilege of accessing their own money?

AeonPax
02-12-2017, 10:46 AM
would you tax all money transfers out of the United States? How would people effectively travel around Europe, let's say, if every time they went to an ATM they paid some sort of tax for the privilege of accessing their own money?
`
I'm just talking a general idea....to start with, is such a thing even feasible?

MisterVeritis
02-12-2017, 10:51 AM
like floating two plus two equals five and see how many suckers will believe you?

Any IDIOT knows that a tariff on Mexican goods is paid by the consumer, not the supplier. To even FLOAT such a moronic trial balloon is an insult to the intelligence of most folks.... Trumpeters, obviously not so much.
You should have just said, "Yes, MisterVeritis, I am familiar with trial balloons. However, my leftness prevents me from being reasonable."

MisterVeritis
02-12-2017, 10:52 AM
No real need to deport or build a wall. What makes more sense is to make eVerify mandatory for employment and ALL government benefits. Then take away their ability to keep legitimate jobs with phony, underage or stolen social security numbers. The SSA and IRS are all too well aware of multiple people using a single social security number. With modern computer databases, it wouldn't be hard to pluck out all the duplicate, non issued or under age users excepting the original issuee. Then send notices to their employers the duplicate users payments are coming from that there appears to be an error and they must verify the social security number within 30 days or face massive fines and jail time. Then move on to the Individual Taxpayer Identification Number filers, requiring them to provide their valid visa's allowing them to remain legally in the country, no proof, NO REFUND. Compile a list of those failing to provide the valid visa's and investigate if they are in the county legally, if not deport them.

This is a simple cost effective way to open up approx 5 million existing jobs to the out of work citizens. It will also save Billions in Government benefits going to those who circumvented the legal immigration process and aren't entitled to benefits.
We can do both. And more.

MisterVeritis
02-12-2017, 10:54 AM
`
`
People in the US (assuming these people are Mexican) send billions of dollars back to Mexico every year. Couldn't that be taxed?
Yes. Yes it could.

MisterVeritis
02-12-2017, 10:55 AM
`
I'm just talking a general idea....to start with, is such a thing even feasible?
Yes. Yes it is.

maineman
02-12-2017, 10:59 AM
You should have just said, "Yes, MisterVeritis, I am familiar with trial balloons. However, my leftness prevents me from being reasonable."

It is certainly reasonable of me to expect that Trumpeters will forget how the orange clown promised that Mexico would pay for the wall as they, themselves, pay more for everything that comes from Mexico.

maineman
02-12-2017, 11:01 AM
Yes. Yes it is.

you would tax any withdrawal of money, by the owner of that money, from any ATM outside the USA?

MisterVeritis
02-12-2017, 11:05 AM
It is certainly reasonable of me to expect that Trumpeters will forget how the orange clown promised that Mexico would pay for the wall as they, themselves, pay more for everything that comes from Mexico.
Do you still doubt Mexico will pay? A tariff is one option. It will reduce the amount off goods Mexico can sell in the US. I mentioned several other options. Why are you stuck on the first option floated? It is almost as if you are new to politics.

MisterVeritis
02-12-2017, 11:07 AM
you would tax any withdrawal of money, by the owner of that money, from any ATM outside the USA?
I am sure a variety of methods could be used. Most illegals are not banking their money and using an ATM to withdraw it. It is being wired by firms like Western Union. A ten percent tax would pay for the wall.

AeonPax
02-12-2017, 11:29 AM
I am sure a variety of methods could be used. Most illegals are not banking their money and using an ATM to withdraw it. It is being wired by firms like Western Union. A ten percent tax would pay for the wall.
`
Check cashing places are the closest you'll come to an illegal using a bank.