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MMC
02-19-2017, 01:55 PM
Save $100 billion a year by cutting welfare to illegal immigrants, sponsors of aliens legally in the US to pay for them rather than let them claim welfare, new standards to determine if a legal alien is likely to go on welfare and if so, deny them entry and stopping birth tourism.


It's about time.




Two draft executive orders being circulated among Trump administration officials, both of which relate to immigration.
Trump administration circulates more draft immigration restrictions, focusing on protecting U.S. jobs. (https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/trump-administration-circulates-more-draft-immigration-restrictions-focusing-on-protecting-us-jobs/2017/01/31/38529236-e741-11e6-80c2-30e57e57e05d_story.html?utm_term=.3e732d5b79c3) .....snip~


http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/documents/national/draft-executive-orders-on-immigration/2315/

Croft
02-19-2017, 01:58 PM
I love Trump, no homo.

MMC
02-19-2017, 02:02 PM
I love Trump, no homo.

The illiberals don't......and they will have the leftness all up in arms about his new EO's. Maybe they can find a way to tie it to the Russians. :laugh:

Captain Obvious
02-19-2017, 02:28 PM
Good!

MMC
02-19-2017, 02:37 PM
Good!
Yeah, I like that part about the sponsors.....having them to pay for the alien rather than letting them get on welfare.

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 02:38 PM
Where does the constitution give the president the power to make these determinations via executive order?

Bethere
02-19-2017, 02:40 PM
Where does the constitution give the president the power to make these determinations via executive order?

Our friends no longer seem to care. Their anger was fake and unjustified.

MMC
02-19-2017, 02:43 PM
Where does the constitution give the president the power to make these determinations via executive order?
Read page 3, where he says by the Power of the Constitution invested in him the President of the US.

Captain Obvious
02-19-2017, 02:46 PM
Our friends no longer seem to care. Their anger was fake and unjustified.

Can you say "nuclear option"

:biglaugh:

Karma... it's what's for dinner

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 02:46 PM
Read page 3, where he says by the Power of the Constitution invested in him the President of the US.

He says the constitution gives him that power, he doesn't say how. That's what I'm asking - where and how does the constitution delegate this power to the president?

Bethere
02-19-2017, 02:47 PM
Read page 3, where he says by the Power of the Constitution invested in him the President of the US.

Vested.

Bethere
02-19-2017, 02:48 PM
Can you say "nuclear option"

:biglaugh:

Karma... it's what's for dinner

You can't yank my chain. You waste your time.

Captain Obvious
02-19-2017, 02:49 PM
You can't yank my chain. You waste your time.

Too late

Bethere
02-19-2017, 02:50 PM
Too late

Good times.

MMC
02-19-2017, 02:58 PM
He says the constitution gives him that power, he doesn't say how. That's what I'm asking - where and how does the constitution delegate this power to the president?
Read the Draft order.....he is directing the SOS, DHS, the AG, The Director of the Census Bureau and the Director of the Budgetary Affairs to follow the Law on 8USC 1101.

From the WAPO link, it can't copy.

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 02:59 PM
Read the Draft order.....he is directing the SOS, DHS, the AG, The Director of the Census Bureau and the Director of the Budgetary Affairs to follow the Law on 8USC 1101.

From the WAPO link, it can't copy.

I'm reading it, I don't see where it shows the constitutional delegation of this power to the president. If it's a constitutional action it should be pretty easy to cite, don't you think?

MMC
02-19-2017, 03:06 PM
I'm reading it, I don't see where it shows the constitutional delegation of this power to the president. If it's a constitutional action it should be pretty easy to cite, don't you think?

[PDF]Page 15 TITLE 8—ALIENS AND NATIONALITY §1101 - GPO (http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2011-title8/pdf/USCODE-2011-title8-chap12-subchapI-sec1101.pdf)www.gpo.gov/.../pdf/USCODE-2011-title8-chap12-subchapI-sec1101.pdf
ployee of the United States designated under regulations prescribed under authority ... by the President or by ... the Secretary §1101 TITLE 8—ALIENS AND ...

Tahuyaman
02-19-2017, 03:09 PM
Do some people really oppose withholding welfare benefits from people who are citizens of another country, but in the US illegally?

MMC
02-19-2017, 03:21 PM
Do some people really oppose withholding welfare benefits from people who are citizens of another country, but in the US illegally?
Apparently......the left leaning.

Scrounger
02-19-2017, 03:35 PM
According to CNN:

"Undocumented immigrants do not qualify for welfare, food stamps, Medicaid, and most other public benefits. Most of these programs require proof of legal immigration status and under the 1996 welfare law, even legal immigrants cannot receive these benefits until they have been in the United States for more than five years."

http://money.cnn.com/2014/11/20/news/economy/immigration-myths/

Snopes tackled the talking points:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/taxes.asp

Factcheck.org looked at the stats that have been provided:

http://www.factcheck.org/2009/04/cost-of-illegal-immigrants/

The New Republic questions the anti-immigrant claims:

https://newrepublic.com/article/122714/immigrants-dont-drain-welfare-they-fund-it

Republican Marco Rubio disputes the anti-immigrant claims:

https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/press-releases?ID=217B4707-52E8-4ABA-9DF5-A02E739BE1B0

We need to just create a guest of Guest Workers that are not eligible for citizenship, and consequently, not eligible to access the benefits and privileges of citizenship.

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 03:35 PM
[PDF]Page 15 TITLE 8—ALIENS AND NATIONALITY §1101 - GPO (http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2011-title8/pdf/USCODE-2011-title8-chap12-subchapI-sec1101.pdf)

www.gpo.gov (http://www.gpo.gov)/.../pdf/USCODE-2011-title8-chap12-subchapI-sec1101.pdf
ployee of the United States designated under regulations prescribed under authority ... by the President or by ... the Secretary §1101 TITLE 8—ALIENS AND ...

That's a law passed by Congress, not the constitution.

Tahuyaman
02-19-2017, 03:35 PM
Do some people really oppose withholding welfare benefits from people who are citizens of another country, but in the US illegally?


Apparently......the left leaning.

Incredible. Why not just pay them the benefits and make them stay in their country in order to maintain the benefits?

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 03:35 PM
Do some people really oppose withholding welfare benefits from people who are citizens of another country, but in the US illegally?

Who does? Point them out.

Tahuyaman
02-19-2017, 03:37 PM
That's a law passed by Congress, not the constitution.. Is that law unconstitutional?

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 03:38 PM
. Is that law unconstitutional?

I don't know. There are probably parts that might be. Overall it's probably good. We would have to look into it.

MMC
02-19-2017, 03:43 PM
That's a law passed by Congress, not the constitution.

And the President or the SOS has the Authority.



Immigration and Nationality Act
The Immigration and Nationality Act, or INA, was created in 1952. Before the INA, a variety of statutes governed immigration law but were not organized in one location. The McCarran-Walter bill of 1952, Public Law No. 82-414, collected and codified many existing provisions and reorganized the structure of immigration law. The Act has been amended many times over the years, but is still the basic body of immigration law.
The INA is divided into titles, chapters, and sections. Although it stands alone as a body of law, the Act is also contained in the United States Code (U.S.C.). The code is a collection of all the laws of the United States. It is arranged in fifty subject titles by general alphabetic order. Title 8 of the U.S. Code is but one of the fifty titles and deals with "Aliens and Nationality". When browsing the INA or other statutes you will often see reference to the U.S. Code citation. For example, Section 208 of the INA deals with asylum, and is also contained in 8 U.S.C. 1158. Although it is correct to refer to a specific section by either its INA citation or its U.S. code, the INA citation is more commonly used......snip~


https://www.uscis.gov/laws/immigration-and-nationality-act



So now that Trump has the Authority.....what other excuse can you come up with. Since the one you tried didn't work.

Tahuyaman
02-19-2017, 03:44 PM
Do some people really oppose withholding welfare benefits from people who are citizens of another country, but in the US illegally?


Who does? Point them out.. I asked a question. Are you answering my question or posing another question?

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 03:51 PM
And the President or the SOS has the Authority.



Immigration and Nationality Act
The Immigration and Nationality Act, or INA, was created in 1952. Before the INA, a variety of statutes governed immigration law but were not organized in one location. The McCarran-Walter bill of 1952, Public Law No. 82-414, collected and codified many existing provisions and reorganized the structure of immigration law. The Act has been amended many times over the years, but is still the basic body of immigration law.
The INA is divided into titles, chapters, and sections. Although it stands alone as a body of law, the Act is also contained in the United States Code (U.S.C.). The code is a collection of all the laws of the United States. It is arranged in fifty subject titles by general alphabetic order. Title 8 of the U.S. Code is but one of the fifty titles and deals with "Aliens and Nationality". When browsing the INA or other statutes you will often see reference to the U.S. Code citation. For example, Section 208 of the INA deals with asylum, and is also contained in 8 U.S.C. 1158. Although it is correct to refer to a specific section by either its INA citation or its U.S. code, the INA citation is more commonly used......snip~


https://www.uscis.gov/laws/immigration-and-nationality-act



So now that Trump has the Authority.....what other excuse can you come up with. Since the one you tried didn't work.

He has the legal authority. That's not what I've asked. I've asked you if he has the constitutional authority and, if so, where the constitution gives him that authority. You can deflect and move the goal posts all you like, my question remains unanswered.

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 03:56 PM
. I asked a question. Are you answering my question or posing another question?

I don't know of any examples of what you're talking about. I have never read anyone suggesting illegal immigrants should have welfare benefits. So I suppose my answer would be no. You seem to disagree.

Don
02-19-2017, 04:04 PM
We need to address the problem of birth tourism and non citizens giving birth to get citizenship in this country. I'd like to see the supreme court readdress it and clarify it. I don't think the constitution allows for it. Its been misinterpreted.

Newpublius
02-19-2017, 04:06 PM
I don't know of any examples of what you're talking about. I have never read anyone suggesting illegal immigrants should have welfare benefits. So I suppose my answer would be no. You seem to disagree.

Well, they can place their non-citizen children in public schools without being challenged at all.

What happens when people get sick, dial 911.....Do you think we let them die in the streets. Who do you think is paying for that?

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 04:06 PM
We need to address the problem of birth tourism and non citizens giving birth to get citizenship in this country. I'd like to see the supreme court readdress it and clarify it. I don't think the constitution allows for it. Its been misinterpreted.

The only way the SCOTUS can readdress it is if someone challenges it in court and that challenge makes it to the SCOTUS.

Green Arrow
02-19-2017, 04:07 PM
Well, they can place their non-citizen children in public schools without being challenged at all.

What happens when people get sick, dial 911.....Do you think we let them die in the streets. Who do you think is paying for that?

That's not social welfare, at least not in the sense that is being talked about.

MMC
02-19-2017, 04:15 PM
He has the legal authority. That's not what I've asked. I've asked you if he has the constitutional authority and, if so, where the constitution gives him that authority. You can deflect and move the goal posts all you like, my question remains unanswered.


:rollseyes:

The Constitutional Authority for Executive Orders on Immigration Is Clear.....
Critics of the plan the president is reported to be considering argue that the Constitution obliges him to “take care that the laws be faithfully executed,” an obligation that seems to give the lawmaker, Congress, the primary authority to set policy. They say that refusing to enforce immigration law against millions of illegal immigrants violates that constitutional duty.


Yet the Constitution also gives the president “executive power,” (http://www.newrepublic.com/article/118951/obamas-immigration-policy-lawful-he-can-enforce-what-he-wants) which has always been understood to include the discretionary power to allocate resources among enforcement efforts. The significance of this power has grown over the last century, as Congress has created vast regulatory agencies and given the president control over them

Congress typically appropriates money for regulators, gives the president some vague guidelines and enacts far more laws than he could possibly enforce, and then allows him to set enforcement priorities as he sees fit. That’s why different administrations can pursue such different policies from each other without getting Congress’s permission first.....snip~

http://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebate/2014/11/18/constitutional-limits-of-presidential-action-on-immigration-12/the-constitutional-authority-for-executive-orders-on-immigration-is-clear




The Constitution gave him executive power while preventing Congress from compelling the president to act except by issuing the extreme and usually non-credible threat of impeachment. This is the separation of powers.

The founders gave the president independence from Congress because they feared legislative tyranny. The president could push back if Congress passed laws that violated the Constitution.


Douthat goes awry by sweeping aside this complex debate and asserting a constitutional principle that presidents have broad powers abroad and narrow powers at home. It’s also worth recognizing that immigration policy implicates both foreign and domestic policy, so it does not naturally fall into one category or the other......snip~

https://newrepublic.com/article/118951/obamas-immigration-policy-lawful-he-can-enforce-what-he-wants




Article II of the Constitution vests the powers of the executive branch in the President of the United States and details the powers of that office. In short, the executive branch is responsible for carrying into effect the laws as passed by the legislative branch and making sure that the laws are observed.

Presidential Powers (National Paralegal College) (http://nationalparalegal.edu/conLawCrimProc_Public/Federalism/PresidentialPowers.asp)



Your question answered. That is all that is needed and whats commonly known.



NEXT!