Overthinking DACA

[hotair]

I cannot say that I am surprised by how many people who are over thinking all of this.


http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/analysis-in-daca-decision-trump-chooses-his-base/ar-AArlYu2?li=AA5a8k&ocid=spartandhp



Dumping DACA on Congress is really a stroke of genius. Rather unusual for this administration.

If Congress can do its job, and finally fix this mess, then the GOP candidates in the 2016 mid-terms will get hammered from the right for collaborating with the enemy. (Without the tea baggers (since they are totally dead set against any of this) on board, then the only way that anything can get done with this is for the GOP to work with the Democrats.)

If Congress can not get even this right, the GOP candidates will get their heads handed to them from the left in the 2016 mid-terms.

Either way it will be a near death-blow to the Republican party.

Trump & the tea baggers get some measure of revenge against the Republican party, for their refusal to just bend over and take it!!!

[Trish]

I guess I can see your point but President Trump has once again offset his own message by tweeting that if Congress can't get it done by the deadline then he'll revisit it. This is a confusing message and counterproductive to the purpose of a deadline. To be blunt, this is not leadership. It's throwing noodles against the wall to see it they stick. You're right to point out this may have clear implications for representatives down the road.

[Common]

Its not being overthought, does not matter what this administration does the left will rage and call it racist and nazi and any other hateful thing they can think of

[Common]

I guess I can see your point but President Trump has once again offset his own message by tweeting that if Congress can't get it done by the deadline then he'll revisit it. This is a confusing message and counterproductive to the purpose of a deadline. To be blunt, this is not leadership. It's throwing noodles against the wall to see it they stick. You're right to point out this may have clear implications for representatives down the road.

Thats called putting pressure on a do nothing congress

[Trish]

Thats called putting pressure on a do nothing congress

I agree. It was actually a good idea but he can't seem to stick to his own directives. He's already let them off the hook before they even had to break a sweat.

[stjames1_53]

here's the deal. What and how Obama did it was unconstitutional. That cannot be defended with nothing other than it feels good....
What Trump is saying is that since Obie went around it the wrong way, he wants it fixed, properly, through legislation, not through dictatorial power.
So he's doing the thing the right way, the way it should have been done.
Obama didn't seek the good will of all Americans to do this, He pandered specifically to a small group. This is how you create division. You promote small minority groups over the will of the rest of Americans, then send that bill to people you haven't asked to support the plan.
He put the onus on a very large group of people without asking or by rightfully enacting legislation, properly. That's dictatorial.
He had no authority to change law as a president. His EO creating DACA was unconstitutional and illegal, it was to be Congress' job, not his.
So, for all of your blustering and crying against Trump, get a hold of your federal representatives and tell them to pass the damned act, correctly. He's just forcing them to do it right and given them a time limit to do so. IF it doesn't get done, then it's Congress' fault.
TANSTAAFL
That's how we do it in ALL of America.

[Trish]

O.........kay

[stjames1_53]

I agree. It was actually a good idea but he can't seem to stick to his own directives. He's already let them off the hook before they even had to break a sweat.
it is up to you to contact your fed reps to get this done. You seem to support dem lawlessness.
Shouldn't this be done by the book instead of taking illegal action?

[DGUtley]

It was unconstitutional. Period. End of story. I personally agree with the 'ends' but I can't agree with the 'means'. We are supposed to be a nation of laws; but I now understand that my liberal friends are 'ok' with the notion that a President can just decree something that he/she wants done if Congress won't do it. It's the end of our checks and balance system; but if that's the way the left wants it, so be it.

[Crepitus]

I cannot say that I am surprised by how many people who are over thinking all of this.


http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/analysis-in-daca-decision-trump-chooses-his-base/ar-AArlYu2?li=AA5a8k&ocid=spartandhp



Dumping DACA on Congress is really a stroke of genius. Rather unusual for this administration.

If Congress can do its job, and finally fix this mess, then the GOP candidates in the 2016 mid-terms will get hammered from the right for collaborating with the enemy. (Without the tea baggers (since they are totally dead set against any of this) on board, then the only way that anything can get done with this is for the GOP to work with the Democrats.)

If Congress can not get even this right, the GOP candidates will get their heads handed to them from the left in the 2016 mid-terms.

Either way it will be a near death-blow to the Republican party.

Trump & the tea baggers get some measure of revenge against the Republican party, for their refusal to just bend over and take it!!!

Sorry dude, not buying it.

This is just another spur-of-the-moment decision that was made on a whim and most likely has more to do with the fact that it was President Obama's order than anything else.

Hell he's already backing down, can't stick to his guns for anything.

[AeonPax]

`
I just don't see any overthinking here. One can postulate, which is NOT overthinking, as to the whys and wherefores, but there are obvious clues as to why this issue unfolded as it did.
`



1) The republican rank and file are against DACA. While there are a few republican moderates who offer laissez faire support for DACA, Trumps base is solidly against it.

2) Trump really didn't sell out his promise to kill DACA. True, Trump in effect punted the ball in the congressional court, but the issue has a slim, if non-existent chance of becoming a law in six months. Even if it did pass, Trump can veto it.

3) Whether they like it or not, this has become a major issue with the democrats. The Daily 202: DACA reaction shows how immigration has become a litmus test for Democrats (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/powerpost/paloma/daily-202/2017/09/06/daily-202-daca-reaction-shows-how-immigration-has-become-a-litmus-test-for-democrats/59af142730fb04264c2a1ced/?utm_term=.04075f14cb6d) Even as an executive order, DACA did not have the unanimous approval of the democrats. The democrats must counter this least the Latinos start pulling their support for the democrats

4) The only bill that's still viable before congress involving DACA, is the S.3542 - BRIDGE Act (https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/senate-bill/3542/actions)and that's been languishing since 12/9/2016
`
We'll just have to wait to see where this issue goes.

[Trish]

it is up to you to contact your fed reps to get this done. You seem to support dem lawlessness.
Shouldn't this be done by the book instead of taking illegal action?

That's a disingenuous comment St.James. Can you honestly say that I have blindly supported only democrat arguments on this site? I try really really hard to be objective and thoughtful when I comment. At times I may let my emotion get to me but this is not one of those times. Be nice! :0)

[Abby08]

O.........kay

He's absolutely correct.

[stjames1_53]

That's a disingenuous comment St.James. Can you honestly say that I have blindly supported only democrat arguments on this site? I try really really hard to be objective and thoughtful when I comment. At times I may let my emotion get to me but this is not one of those times. Be nice! :0)

this is the deal...........if you want these programs in place, do it by the book. Doing it any other way constitutes a crisis.
DACA was illegal..........period.
DACA is nothing to defend the way it was done. Your voice, if I understand you correctly, is to denounce Obama and his rule with a pen and a phone.
IN other words, if you are for DACA, then contact your reps and demand such actions. and don't blame Trump for following the rule of law that Obama conveniently forgot about.

[Captdon]

2018

[Captdon]

It is a direct threat to do something or he will enforce the law. great move.

[stjames1_53]

It is a direct threat to do something or he will enforce the law. great move.
capt, you prepared for Irma? Those folks that live on the east coast are going to take another pounding. Stay safe

[Trish]

this is the deal...........if you want these programs in place, do it by the book. Doing it any other way constitutes a crisis.
DACA was illegal..........period.
DACA is nothing to defend the way it was done. Your voice, if I understand you correctly, is to denounce Obama and his rule with a pen and a phone.
IN other words, if you are for DACA, then contact your reps and demand such actions. and don't blame Trump for following the rule of law that Obama conveniently forgot about.

St.James - I think we're talking across each other. I never said I wanted the program in place. I was merely making a comment that President Trump was sabotaging his own efforts. As I was explaining, he demands that the Republicans fix DACA within 6 months (which I said was a good position to take) and then turns around and says that he'll revisit it if it's not fixed. What's the point giving a deadline if you've already dismissed it's importance.

Maybe I'm not explaining myself very well.

[stjames1_53]

St.James - I think we're talking across each other. I never said I wanted the program in place. I was merely making a comment that President Trump was sabotaging his own efforts. As I was explaining, he demands that the Republicans fix DACA within 6 months (which I said was a good position to take) and then turns around and says that he'll revisit it if it's not fixed. What's the point giving a deadline if you've already dismissed it's importance.

Maybe I'm not explaining myself very well.

revisit.......IF he stays the course, he'll hammer the door closed.
Congress needs to fix this mess. They were the ones that actually screwed it up by not stopping Obama when he instituted it.

[hotair]

St.James - I think we're talking across each other. I never said I wanted the program in place. I was merely making a comment that President Trump was sabotaging his own efforts. As I was explaining, he demands that the Republicans fix DACA within 6 months (which I said was a good position to take) and then turns around and says that he'll revisit it if it's not fixed. What's the point giving a deadline if you've already dismissed it's importance.

Maybe I'm not explaining myself very well.

Well I for one understand you quite clearly. I just do not believe that you are on the right track here.

I do not believe that the two of you are talking across each other. St.James is a broken record, with a serious case of tunnel vision.

As for your point. It is really not all that valid.
1.) It seems to me that you have forgotten why President Obama did it the way that he did. Congress was refusing to address the issues.
2.) It also seems to me that you are not seeing the bigger picture here. Congress is bogged down in a three party standoff. There are three very distinctive parties operating in congress right now. The Democrats, the Republicans, and the Tea Party! As long as the tea-baggers caucus with the GOP, they keep the Democrats out of the leadership positions. Yet the tea-baggers and the GOP have entirely different agendas, and totally different ideas on what to do, and how to get it done.
3.) Trump wants Congress to get this done, and he has set it up to force the GOP to work with the Democrats (cutting out the tea-baggers all together) in order to get it done. His threat the revisit is not a safety net, it is a threat to keep things as they are if Congress continues to refuse to deal with it. Effectively admitting that President Obama did it the only way that it could get done. A lot of people have the erroneous opinion that what President Obama did was done illegally, and they are doing a great deal of crying about it, to include the Republicans. It is now sink or swim time. Leaving the GOP with two options - fix it, or shut the f___ up!!!
4.) It would seem that Trump also wants the Republicans to end the palace revolt of the tea-baggers.
5.) In any event the Republicans really do need to end this palace revolt of the tea-baggers. The Tea Party agenda of just saying no to everything is aimed equally at the Republicans, as well as the Democrats. The tea-baggers are employing a strategy (that Hitler called “The Ten Percent Solution") in the effort to leverage more supporters and thus more seats in the Congress, by suggesting that neither the Republicans, nor the Democrats are able to govern. Ignoring the simple fact that this country did quite well for over two hundred years without the tea-baggers!

[hotair]

revisit.......IF he stays the course, he'll hammer the door closed.
Congress needs to fix this mess. They were the ones that actually screwed it up by not stopping Obama when he instituted it.

You are forgetting that it was congress that forced President Obama to do what he did in the first place. Once done there was nothing that congress could do about it, short of doing their jobs, and deal with it! There was nothing that congress could do to stop it. If the Republicans took it to the courts, and lost, then the entire matter is taken out of their hands.

On another hand. DACA is not a law, it is a policy. A Presidential Policy. As such, under our Constitution, all very legal. The problem is that as long as congress refuses to do their jobs, any Presidential Policy can be reversed by any future President. Simply reversing President Obama’s policy will only force it into the courts. Where there is a very good chance of DACA becoming law, even without Congressional action.

[stjames1_53]

You are forgetting that it was congress that forced President Obama to do what he did in the first place. Once done there was nothing that congress could do about it, short of doing their jobs, and deal with it! There was nothing that congress could do to stop it. If the Republicans took it to the courts, and lost, then the entire matter is taken out of their hands.

On another hand. DACA is not a law, it is a policy. A Presidential Policy. As such, under our Constitution, all very legal. The problem is that as long as congress refuses to do their jobs, any Presidential Policy can be reversed by any future President. Simply reversing President Obama’s policy will only force it into the courts. Where there is a very good chance of DACA becoming law, even without Congressional action.

so, every Congressional body is supposed to agree with everything the president says, right?
That's why we have checks and balances. Presidents cannot alter law or write such laws from that chair. He altered the law. That alone makes it illegal.

the courts will not hear this case because it is policy, as you pointed out.
Funny how you guys think that everything Trump does needs to be challenged in court, but not what previous presidents have done.
get over yourself. Obama is NOT the president.........and you DO want presidents to follow the law, right?

[DGUtley]

On another hand. DACA is not a law, it is a policy. A Presidential Policy. As such, under our Constitution, all very legal. The problem is that as long as congress refuses to do their jobs, any Presidential Policy can be reversed by any future President. Simply reversing President Obama’s policy will only force it into the courts. Where there is a very good chance of DACA becoming law, even without Congressional action.

You are mistaken. DACA was put out as law. It is unconstitutional.