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Adelaide
09-18-2017, 09:17 AM
The moderation team is about to introduce a new format for the VIPs, which will be renamed the Forum Advisors and started from scratch. This change is based on feedback from members in the town hall thread, the moderation/administrative team, and VIP advice.

6 members will be chosen by the moderators and ADMIN, while the remaining 6 positions will be picked by the moderators and ADMIN based on member nominations. The preference for member nominations will be to have 3 liberals and 3 conservatives chosen, which mirrors the choices by the moderators and ADMIN.

The forum advisors chosen by moderation/ADMIN are as follows:
Chris: original member, long-time moderator, a large contributor to previous VIP discussion.
Common: large contributor to the forum.
Crepitus: large contributor to the forum.
Dr. Who: long-time moderator, large contributor to previous VIP discussion.
Green Arrow: large contributor to previous VIP discussion.
Peter: original member, long-time moderator.

Please nominate anyone that you wish to see become a Forum Advisor by private messaging a moderator. These names will be collected for the moderators and ADMIN to determine the remaining 50% of the Forum Advisors. Anyone with a lengthy recent infraction history will be precluded from participating in the Forum Advisors.

A new responsibility for Forum Advisors will be to start a new thread every day or every other day in a sub-forum they will be assigned to. This ensures that members see Forum Advisors actively participating and contributing. Which area each Advisor gets will depend on what they volunteer for and what is available. Additionally, the Advisor for an area will be expected to report rule violations as they see them in order to assist moderation.

Additionally, based on member request, town halls will be held monthly and run by the Forum Advisors. They can also be requested by members at any time.

Captain Obvious
09-18-2017, 11:08 AM
wot...

Cletus
09-18-2017, 11:44 AM
Same old, same old.

Bottom line, the mods and admin are picking the "forum advisors". The change is cosmetic and they think the members are stupid enough to not notice.

Crepitus? Obviously rational thinking is NOT a prerequisite. :grin:

Captain Obvious
09-18-2017, 11:45 AM
Did Standing Wolf get fired?

JVV
09-18-2017, 11:53 AM
Every day? That could be a lot of pressure to come up with quality ideas. I hope if they slip to only a thread or two a week, that won't be held against them assuming they're maintaining all the other standards. :)

AZ Jim
09-18-2017, 11:55 AM
Hate "class" societies.

Adelaide
09-18-2017, 11:58 AM
Same old, same old.

Bottom line, the mods and admin are picking the "forum advisors". The change is cosmetic and they think the members are stupid enough to not notice.

Crepitus? Obviously rational thinking is NOT a prerequisite. :grin:

Thread banned for insults.

Perianne
09-18-2017, 11:58 AM
Every day? That could be a lot of pressure to come up with quality ideas. I hope if they slip to only a thread or two a week, that won't be held against them assuming they're maintaining all the other standards. :)
If you get so appointed, just ask me for ideas. I have many.

AZ Jim
09-18-2017, 12:07 PM
If you get so appointed, just ask me for ideas. I have many.Oh! We know...we know!

Kalkin
09-18-2017, 12:25 PM
I nominate myself.

That would help to rectify the current 4 lefty to 2 righty imbalance.

Captain Obvious
09-18-2017, 12:27 PM
I nominate myself.

You'll go blind

Kalkin
09-18-2017, 12:28 PM
You'll go blind
If I haven't yet, I should be okay... ;)

Chris
09-18-2017, 12:30 PM
Same old, same old.

Bottom line, the mods and admin are picking the "forum advisors". The change is cosmetic and they think the members are stupid enough to not notice.

Crepitus? Obviously rational thinking is NOT a prerequisite. :grin:


I nominated you. Should I retract?

Captain Obvious
09-18-2017, 12:34 PM
I nominated you. Should I retract?

He can't reply, derp

:biglaugh:

Chris
09-18-2017, 12:34 PM
One of the major changes here is VIPs no longer make rules, they serve as Forum Advisors to the Admin Team.

There will be other changes but those will wait for the new Advisor Team to be formed.

Chris
09-18-2017, 12:34 PM
He can't reply, derp

:biglaugh:



Saw that after. He can PM me.

Adelaide
09-18-2017, 12:45 PM
Nominations should be private messaged to a moderator. The more the merrier. If someone gets multiple nominations they may have a better shot than someone who only gets one.

Also, don't forget that a lengthy, recent infraction history would disqualify someone.

Hoosier8
09-18-2017, 02:22 PM
Same old, same old.

Bottom line, the mods and admin are picking the "forum advisors". The change is cosmetic and they think the members are stupid enough to not notice.

Crepitus? Obviously rational thinking is NOT a prerequisite. :grin:
A flamebaiter for VIP? What are they thinking.

Hal Jordan
09-18-2017, 03:14 PM
A flamebaiter for VIP? What are they thinking.
Threadbanned for insults.

Tahuyaman
09-18-2017, 03:19 PM
Crepitus? Obviously rational thinking is NOT a prerequisite. :grin:

That defies a rational explanation.

nic34
09-18-2017, 08:07 PM
Agent zero....

resister
09-18-2017, 08:10 PM
Agent zero....
:rollseyes: Any particular reason why?

Dr. Who
09-18-2017, 11:01 PM
Same old, same old.

Bottom line, the mods and admin are picking the "forum advisors". The change is cosmetic and they think the members are stupid enough to not notice.

Crepitus? Obviously rational thinking is NOT a prerequisite. :grin:

The mods chose 6 of 12. Two are new, one left and one right. The other 6 are for the membership to put up for nomination, subject to behavior history. You are free to nominate your choices.

Refugee
09-19-2017, 01:01 AM
Canít say much cos ya get TBd :) But please, mods, if youíre going to vote on the basis of number of posts, donít you think thatís a recipe for disaster, which youíll later decide didnít work and keep going round in these continuing circles trying to find perfection? Put Ďem up, one at a time, perhaps with a short summary explaining why they themselves should be chosen, a bit like a work application and let the forum vote?

Refugee
09-19-2017, 04:32 AM
Had to rush off, but back from work, now where was I.

I understand the problem the mods have and why you’re continually swopping and changing things around in an effort to try to please everyone, but it never works, does it. I think what most people see is a top down approach, despite all these town halls and ‘we’re listening’, by people who the forum didn’t elect and who once in can’t be elected out either. So why not reverse the process? OK, it might not be popular with those already at the top, but it might seem a fairer way of doing things to those that aren’t, but think they’ll never get a chance either.

First, start from scratch. Anyone interested in these positions puts themselves up for a one year term of office. They write a brief 250 word summary of why they think they would fit the position and together with anyone else that’s interested, put it on the forum and one at a time, let the forum be the recruiters. It seems a lot fairer, it’s not a lifetime position (you’d need to be re-elected after your one year of office) and most importantly, no one can then complain about what you’re doing there. If you under perform, you’re voted out depending how the forum feel after your year in office and replaced.

Forum message – Votes for the moderator election for the News thread will take place on September 14. Voting from 8am to 10pm. Candidates are Chukky Puppy, My Head Hurts and Despondent Squirrel. There applications can be found at ...

Secondly, a mod for each thread yes, but there has to be more to it than left v right. It’s no good having a mod on the tpf book club who doesn’t read books, or one on the political thread who thinks who thinks an anarchist is a kind of vegetable, just to make the political partisan numbers look fair. OK, I exaggerate, but you get the drift.

At the moment, what you have is a play on semantics by declaring a forum run by members. What you’ve actually got is a forum run by a selected few, who chose the other selected few and the forum members themselves get very little say in it. I think that’s why many think it’s not only undemocratic, but rather dictatorial when they analyse it. Hope I don’t get TBd for this outburst of impudence, you know, just sayin’. :)

stjames1_53
09-19-2017, 05:27 AM
That defies a rational explanation.
he is a vengeful person

Cthulhu
09-19-2017, 07:24 AM
This system I assume has an experimental time frame.

However I it seems like a wise upgrade compared to what it was before.

To the forumites: give it a while and then we'll have a town hall about whether or not it was a failure. And whether or not it can/should be improved upon.

I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes.

And if you have a beef with your candidate not getting selected...maybe you should pick a better candidate without a laundry list of infections and loathsome behavior.

Just sayin'. Forum advisors are in theory going to be examples and advisors to the mod staff. Let the experiment run. File your suggestions and complaints for the town hall about it.

In the meantime, try to act like adults.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

Adelaide
09-19-2017, 07:28 AM
Keep the nominations coming...

Adelaide
09-19-2017, 08:02 AM
That defies a rational explanation.

Thread banned.


This thread is not for members to attack other members or members chosen by the moderation/ADMIN team.

Refugee
09-19-2017, 08:10 AM
Good heavens, time to get off this thread!

Adelaide
09-19-2017, 08:20 AM
Can’t say much cos ya get TBd :) But please, mods, if you’re going to vote on the basis of number of posts, don’t you think that’s a recipe for disaster, which you’ll later decide didn’t work and keep going round in these continuing circles trying to find perfection? Put ‘em up, one at a time, perhaps with a short summary explaining why they themselves should be chosen, a bit like a work application and let the forum vote?

It has very little to do with the amount of posts. We do want active VIPs who will post new threads and try to stimulate discussions. The last 6 VIPs will be determined by nominations, a lack of recent infractions, and meeting the 3 liberals-3 conservatives requirement.

Cthulhu
09-19-2017, 08:58 AM
It has very little to do with the amount of posts. We do want active VIPs who will post new threads and try to stimulate discussions. The last 6 VIPs will be determined by nominations, a lack of recent infractions, and meeting the 3 liberals-3 conservatives requirement.So, one can be excluded for not being left or right?

Seems rather crabbed. I understand why, but still, rather crabbed.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

Chris
09-19-2017, 09:08 AM
So, one can be excluded for not being left or right?

Seems rather crabbed. I understand why, but still, rather crabbed.

Sent from my evil cell phone.



To me it's very loose. I consider myself politically libertarian, neither left nor right, but because I tend to be socially conservative, I'm put in that slot, which is, well, ok.

Adelaide
09-19-2017, 09:26 AM
So, one can be excluded for not being left or right?

Seems rather crabbed. I understand why, but still, rather crabbed.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

We have to attempt equal representation. That was a complaint from the town hall held on the topic of the VIPs.

Perianne
09-19-2017, 09:31 AM
We have to attempt equal representation. That was a complaint from the town hall held on the topic of the VIPs. Adelaide, will these VIPs/representatives (or whatever they are called) have power over me?

Adelaide
09-19-2017, 10:07 AM
@Adelaide (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=473), will these VIPs/representatives (or whatever they are called) have power over me?
No. They will assist with rules and forum issues.

hanger4
09-19-2017, 10:19 AM
Adelaide, will these VIPs/representatives (or whatever they are called) have power over me?

Perianne, the ultimate power belongs to you, to be or not to be (here).

MisterVeritis
09-19-2017, 10:20 AM
Nominations should be private messaged to a moderator. The more the merrier. If someone gets multiple nominations they may have a better shot than someone who only gets one.

Also, don't forget that a lengthy, recent infraction history would disqualify someone.
If nominated I will not run. If selected I will not serve.

Captain Obvious
09-19-2017, 10:22 AM
Adelaide, will these VIPs/representatives (or whatever they are called) have power over me?

Sing once again with me a sweet duet. My power over you grows stronger yet...

Chris
09-19-2017, 10:23 AM
Adelaide, will these VIPs/representatives (or whatever they are called) have power over me?



https://s26.postimg.org/m6w6yg4y1/a_OVm_f-maxage-0.gif

Cthulhu
09-19-2017, 10:24 AM
Sing once again with me a sweet duet. My power over you grows stronger yet...Yeah but it's cooler with a ski mask.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

Cthulhu
09-19-2017, 10:25 AM
To me it's very loose. I consider myself politically libertarian, neither left nor right, but because I tend to be socially conservative, I'm put in that slot, which is, well, ok.I guess everybody needs to fit somewhere in the box.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

Cthulhu
09-19-2017, 10:27 AM
We have to attempt equal representation. That was a complaint from the town hall held on the topic of the VIPs.Well the problem comes back then. Inevitably you'll have a shortage of one or the other and then you'll not have pepper representation.

Might I suggest not trying to represent any political persuasion, but rather an example of the rules being followed regardless of personal politics?

Sent from my evil cell phone.

Cthulhu
09-19-2017, 10:28 AM
Well the problem comes back then. Inevitably you'll have a shortage of one or the other and then you'll not have pepper representation.

Might I suggest not trying to represent any political persuasion, but rather an example of the rules being followed regardless of personal politics?

Sent from my evil cell phone.... perhaps in version 2.0 I think.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

resister
09-19-2017, 10:29 AM
@Adelaide (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=473), will these VIPs/representatives (or whatever they are called) have power over me?
Look deeply into Rasputin's eyes, Rasputin looks deeply into you!20068

Adelaide
09-19-2017, 10:29 AM
Well the problem comes back then. Inevitably you'll have a shortage of one or the other and then you'll not have pepper representation.

Might I suggest not trying to represent any political persuasion, but rather an example of the rules being followed regardless of personal politics?

Sent from my evil cell phone.

We should be able to meet the request. We have gotten a lot of nominations.

But there will always be some people that aren't happy for one reason or another. It's inevitable.

Refugee
09-19-2017, 10:48 AM
It has very little to do with the amount of posts. We do want active VIPs who will post new threads and try to stimulate discussions. The last 6 VIPs will be determined by nominations, a lack of recent infractions, and meeting the 3 liberals-3 conservatives requirement.

Of course it has to do with the amount of posts, youíve already mentioned Ďlarge contributorí in your op several times as a criteria for selection. Yes I agree that active participation would be welcome, but it has to be more than Con v Lib. Doesnít there also have to be some intelligence and knowledge involved and not just partisanship?


My point is, why pretend and try to disguise it with Town Halls and nominations? Just say that the moderators will determine the nominations and you can end the pretence. Come on Adelaide, itís a name change from VIPs to advisors and thatís all. You canít have it both ways, because I guarantee a couple of months down the line there will be more changes. You either say we are Mods in our unelected ivory towers and we will decide, or you introduce democracy and allow people to vote representatives in or out in a public vote that is seen and not done behind closed doors. The forum members are not allowed to elect by public vote, nor are they allowed to UN-elect either.

The Mods who the forum members never got to vote for, will decide which of the advisors no one publicly voted for will win. It reminds me of the European Union elections :)

OK, thatís fine, but why not just say that instead of tying to mislead the forum that itís some kind of democracy at work and thereís choice involved. Not being honest with people is where the backlash always comes from with these types of threads. Three TBd and counting ...

Chris
09-19-2017, 10:53 AM
I guess everybody needs to fit somewhere in the box.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

People categorize, it's natural.

I don't disagree with you that lib v con is not the best but, as Adelaide explains, there are those who will complain loudly about who's winning and who's losing, libs or cons.

Adelaide
09-19-2017, 11:05 AM
Of course it has to do with the amount of posts, you’ve already mentioned ‘large contributor’ in your op several times as a criteria for selection. Yes I agree that active participation would be welcome, but it has to be more than Con v Lib. Doesn’t there also have to be some intelligence and knowledge involved and not just partisanship?


My point is, why pretend and try to disguise it with Town Halls and nominations? Just say that the moderators will determine the nominations and you can end the pretence. Come on Adelaide, it’s a name change from VIPs to advisors and that’s all. You can’t have it both ways, because I guarantee a couple of months down the line there will be more changes. You either say we are Mods in our unelected ivory towers and we will decide, or you introduce democracy and allow people to vote representatives in or out in a public vote that is seen and not done behind closed doors. The forum members are not allowed to elect by public vote, nor are they allowed to UN-elect either.

The Mods who the forum members never got to vote for, will decide which of the advisors no one publicly voted for will win. It reminds me of the European Union elections :)

OK, that’s fine, but why not just say that instead of tying to mislead the forum that it’s some kind of democracy at work and there’s choice involved. Not being honest with people is where the backlash always comes from with these types of threads. Three TBd and counting ...

Being a large contributor is not about post counts. It's about people who put effort into their posts and post meaningful comments, which contribute to discussion rather than taking away from it.

AZ Jim
09-19-2017, 11:23 AM
After reading this thread I would not serve if selected.

Chloe
09-19-2017, 11:40 AM
After reading this thread I would not serve if selected.
There's an age limit anyway so you don't have to worry.











j/k

pragmatic
09-19-2017, 11:42 AM
After reading this thread I would not serve if selected.


How about if there was free beer and dancing girls in the Mod Lounge??

Bet we could sway you then, eh....??



Plus i'd like to second the nomination for Kalkin. (he's just a big ol' teddy bear when you get to know him....)

MisterVeritis
09-19-2017, 11:46 AM
How about if there was free beer and dancing girls in the Mod Lounge??
Bet we could sway you then, eh....??
Plus i'd like to second the nomination for Kalkin. (he's just a big ol' teddy bear when you get to know him....)
Hmmm. Can we make it free wine instead?

Chloe
09-19-2017, 11:47 AM
I would say to everybody to please give this new process a chance, however, please also know that in my opinion as long as you are genuine and not breaking obvious and known rules then you don't need a title or a nomination to give sincere advice about something you care about about to any moderator. Just be cool, just be nice.

AZ Jim
09-19-2017, 11:48 AM
How about if there was free beer and dancing girls in the Mod Lounge??

Bet we could sway you then, eh....??



Plus i'd like to second the nomination for Kalkin. (he's just a big ol' teddy bear when you get to know him....)Meanwhile dodging bullets daily on the board? No thanks!

AZ Jim
09-19-2017, 11:50 AM
I would say to everybody to please give this new process a chance, however, please also know that in my opinion as long as you are genuine and not breaking obvious and known rules then you don't need a title or a nomination to give sincere advice about something you care about about to any moderator. Just be cool, just be nice.Remember Missy, you'll get there too if you're lucky. :smiley:

Chloe
09-19-2017, 11:51 AM
Remember Missy, you'll get there too if you're lucky. :smiley:
I've already climbed that mountain and summited. I'm enjoying base camp now.

stjames1_53
09-19-2017, 12:04 PM
I have one very serious question. How do the members deal with bad moderation? Who do we call?

Green Arrow
09-19-2017, 12:06 PM
I have one very serious question. How do the members deal with bad moderation? Who do we call?
PM a moderator or ADMIN.

AZ Jim
09-19-2017, 12:11 PM
I've already climbed that mountain and summited. I'm enjoying base camp now.You just think you have, youngster.

jimmyz
09-19-2017, 12:12 PM
Is there a target date for selections announced?

Ethereal
09-19-2017, 12:25 PM
I'll get thread banned, obviously, but Crepitus? Really? You couldn't find someone else? This is a guy who keeps going around trying to blame me, and only me, for the removal of the flawed and worthless reputation system, despite the fact that the MODS themselves told him otherwise. That's the kind of guy you want advising you? A moron and a liar? Wow.

Ethereal
09-19-2017, 12:32 PM
Before I get thread banned, I still cannot figure out why we have these positions in the first place. I don't think anyone actually values them except for a small minority of members with a disproportionate amount of influence over the forum. Why do we need to take certain members and set them apart from the rest of the community? Why can't we just have MODS and an ADMIN like every other political forum out there?

Don
09-19-2017, 01:10 PM
Well the problem comes back then. Inevitably you'll have a shortage of one or the other and then you'll not have pepper representation.

Might I suggest not trying to represent any political persuasion, but rather an example of the rules being followed regardless of personal politics?

Sent from my evil cell phone.

DGUtley
09-19-2017, 04:52 PM
I'll get thread banned, obviously, but Crepitus? Really? You couldn't find someone else? This is a guy who keeps going around trying to blame me, and only me, for the removal of the flawed and worthless reputation system, despite the fact that the MODS themselves told him otherwise. That's the kind of guy you want advising you? A moron and a liar? Wow.

NOTICE -- Ethereal TB'd for insults.

pragmatic
09-19-2017, 04:52 PM
Meanwhile dodging bullets daily on the board? No thanks!


(how about if the dancing girls are nekkid??)

AZ Jim
09-19-2017, 04:56 PM
(how about if the dancing girls are nekkid??)At my age I've seen many many naked girls. It's no mystery now.

Docthehun
09-19-2017, 05:14 PM
Good thing you have to be left or right. I'm automatically disqualified. I don't talk to anyone like many of you "type" to each other. To write or read such comments is a waste of my precious time. If you get to be to my age in my shape; hopefully you'll understand. I'll take on all the good conversation and discussions and be a regular participant, but only if the civility improves. It's simply not worth it to me to have to filter through much of it to find the thoughtful posts. I'm not trying to be arrogant, I just don't need any more unwarranted hate this close to dusk.

Refugee
09-19-2017, 05:21 PM
Being a large contributor is not about post counts. It's about people who put effort into their posts and post meaningful comments, which contribute to discussion rather than taking away from it.
In which case, look again at your nomination choices and equate them with the term ‘meaningful comments’ :) 4 TBd and counting ...

MisterVeritis
09-19-2017, 06:14 PM
I come here just to see if I have been thread banned yet.

Green Arrow
09-19-2017, 06:27 PM
I come here just to see if I have been thread banned yet.

Why would you be? So far you've not violated the request of the mods that things be kept civil.

MisterVeritis
09-19-2017, 06:41 PM
Why would you be? So far you've not violated the request of the mods that things be kept civil.
Anyone with an opinion is booted.

AZ Jim
09-19-2017, 06:48 PM
Anyone with an opinion is booted.If you are selected, I'll be leaving.

jimmyz
09-19-2017, 06:55 PM
Will my nominations for members that are outside the Left Right paradigm be discounted out of hand?

Crepitus
09-19-2017, 06:57 PM
Will my nominations for members that are outside the Left Right paradigm be discounted out of hand?

Of course not. Look at some of the people selected already like Chris. He's an anarchist.

jimmyz
09-19-2017, 07:01 PM
Of course not. Look at some of the people selected already like Chris. He's an anarchist.

:tongue:

Refugee
09-19-2017, 07:05 PM
I come here just to see if I have been thread banned yet.
Don't be bad mannered. You stand in the queue and wait your turn like everyone else :)

silvereyes
09-19-2017, 07:16 PM
Don't be bad mannered. You stand in the queue and wait your turn like everyone else :)

:biglaugh:

Green Arrow
09-19-2017, 07:29 PM
Anyone with an opinion is booted.

No, anyone who chooses to violate moderator requests gets booted. Plenty of opinions haven't been booted.

If you can't present your ideas without insulting someone, the problem is you.

Refugee
09-19-2017, 08:00 PM
There are no Ďrequestsí here GA, there are announcements and orders. Get yourselves some democracy, or come out and admit it and at least be transparent about the process. Itís that lack of transparency behind closed doors that riles so many and the reason why these sort of threads are so popular. No one on the forum elects anyone here. Itís decided by an unelected few, confirmed by the same few, who canít be UN-elected either. Needs a grass roots Tea Party methinks. :smiley:

Donít worry, Iím just in one of my anarchist Bolshie moods today and busy plotting your overthrow in the hole with the rest of my dispossessed and marginalised comrades. :laugh:

Green Arrow
09-19-2017, 08:20 PM
There are no ‘requests’ here GA, there are announcements and orders. Get yourselves some democracy, or come out and admit it and at least be transparent about the process. It’s that lack of transparency behind closed doors that riles so many and the reason why these sort of threads are so popular. No one on the forum elects anyone here. It’s decided by an unelected few, confirmed by the same few, who can’t be UN-elected either. Needs a grass roots Tea Party methinks. :smiley:

Don’t worry, I’m just in one of my anarchist Bolshie moods today and busy plotting your overthrow in the hole with the rest of my dispossessed and marginalised comrades. :laugh:
Best of luck.

Bethere
09-19-2017, 08:26 PM
I see it as a good faith attempt to make things fair. I'm not in love with the "run by its members" language, but I'll keep an open mind.

Bethere
09-19-2017, 08:42 PM
Certainly I am a big fan of my friend Crepitus.

resister
09-19-2017, 08:45 PM
Certainly I am a big fan of my friend @Crepitus (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1345).
How do you feel about abusing the mention function? Like 8 times in a day? (not fooling anyone by making the mention in, tiny white letters at the far bottom of a post, either, BTW:rollseyes:

Refugee
09-19-2017, 08:46 PM
Best of luck.
Thank you :) Further thoughts of Chairman Refugee.


Democracy is not putting up names, allowing extra nominations and then deciding amongst an unelected clique who will be chosen. I’m free to put up a name now and explain why, but I couldn’t criticise those already put up, because that’s already been decided behind closed doors and there’s to be no further discussion about that. I just think some of you have been in your positions too long and as you’re UN-electable, it’s developed into a benevolent dictatorship.

Listen to people and especially those who are being banned, because those are simply views you won’t allow to be heard, but if they were allowed, this thread would erupt like you wouldn’t believe and you know it. It’s why you’re keeping a tight lid on it and glossing it over with all this ‘Ooh lookee people, you can choose what we’ve already decided’ nonsense. They’re not as stupid as you believe (well, a few :)); the forumites can see through all this charade and it’s why you’re having to TB many.

I’ll say it again, Orwell’s ‘Animal Farm’ springs to mind. Why not give the forum a public vote on this? Because you’re afraid that if this took off, you unelected few might eventually get voted out as well and that isn’t going to happen, is it. Conversely, who cares, get on with it, I come and go, but just so you know you’re fooling very few here. :)

Crepitus
09-19-2017, 08:46 PM
Certainly I am a big fan of my friend Crepitus.

I have lotsa fans, just read the thread!

lol

Crepitus
09-19-2017, 08:49 PM
Thank you :) Further thoughts of Chairman Refugee.


Democracy is not putting up names, allowing extra nominations and then deciding amongst an unelected clique who will be chosen. I’m free to put up a name now and explain why, but I couldn’t criticise those already put up, because that’s already been decided behind closed doors and there’s to be no further discussion about that. I just think some of you have been in your positions too long and as you’re UN-electable, it’s developed into a benevolent dictatorship.

Listen to people and especially those who are being banned, because those are simply views you won’t allow to be heard, but if they were allowed, this thread would erupt like you wouldn’t believe and you know it. It’s why you’re keeping a tight lid on it and glossing it over with all this ‘Ooh lookee people, you can choose what we’ve already decided’ nonsense. They’re not as stupid as you believe (well, a few :)); the forumites can see through all this charade and it’s why you’re having to TB many.

I’ll say it again, Orwell’s ‘Animal Farm’ springs to mind. Why not give the forum a public vote on this? Because you’re afraid that if this took off, you unelected few might eventually get voted out as well and that isn’t going to happen, is it. Conversely, who cares, get on with it, I come and go, but just so you know you’re fooling very few here. :)

Question : don't you, by your own choice, currently reside in a communist country?

Refugee
09-19-2017, 09:01 PM
How do you feel about abusing the mention function? Like 8 times in a day? (not fooling anyone by making the mention in, tiny white letters at the far bottom of a post, either, BTW:rollseyes:
I was just too polite to mention it, but as you spotted it as well ... :laugh:

Refugee
09-19-2017, 09:04 PM
Question : don't you, by your own choice, currently reside in a communist country?

Woah! Is there a TB coming here for personal comments? Moderators anyone?

No I don’t reside in a communist country, I work in one. And what’s that got to do with you?

resister
09-19-2017, 09:05 PM
I was just too polite to mention it, but as you spotted it as well ... :laugh:
Call BS when you see it, he also ninja posts.

Post an infraction worthy post and delete it in a few moments, I delight in quoting them before the ninja move!

Crepitus
09-19-2017, 09:07 PM
Woah! Is there a TB coming here for personal comments? Moderators anyone?

No I don’t reside in a communist country, I work in one. And what’s that got to do with you?



So You commute to China to work.

Chris
09-19-2017, 09:10 PM
Certainly I am a big fan of my friend Crepitus.


Bethere be happy, everybody be happy!

https://s26.postimg.org/wkl2ryhah/giphy_1.gif

Refugee
09-19-2017, 09:20 PM
Call BS when you see it, he also ninja posts.

Post an infraction worthy post and delete it in a few moments, I delight in quoting them before the ninja move!

Itís all good fun as we try to keep a straight face, tip toe over egg shells and join in with the PC. :)

Refugee
09-19-2017, 09:22 PM
So You commute to China to work.

Are you intentionally looking for a TB? You already know where I am and have made derogatory comments about this in previous threads. There was a personal insinuation behind it and I’m just wondering if you’re going to state it on a thread where so many have been TBd already for personal comments. Let's see if the report function works :)

Your comment above is why moderators should be very careful who they select.

hanger4
09-19-2017, 09:30 PM
Thank you :) Further thoughts of Chairman Refugee.


Democracy is not putting up names, allowing extra nominations and then deciding amongst an unelected clique who will be chosen. I’m free to put up a name now and explain why, but I couldn’t criticise those already put up, because that’s already been decided behind closed doors and there’s to be no further discussion about that. I just think some of you have been in your positions too long and as you’re UN-electable, it’s developed into a benevolent dictatorship.

Listen to people and especially those who are being banned, because those are simply views you won’t allow to be heard, but if they were allowed, this thread would erupt like you wouldn’t believe and you know it. It’s why you’re keeping a tight lid on it and glossing it over with all this ‘Ooh lookee people, you can choose what we’ve already decided’ nonsense. They’re not as stupid as you believe (well, a few :)); the forumites can see through all this charade and it’s why you’re having to TB many.

I’ll say it again, Orwell’s ‘Animal Farm’ springs to mind. Why not give the forum a public vote on this? Because you’re afraid that if this took off, you unelected few might eventually get voted out as well and that isn’t going to happen, is it. Conversely, who cares, get on with it, I come and go, but just so you know you’re fooling very few here. :)

"Because youíre afraid that if this took off, you unelected few might eventually get voted out as well and that isnít going to happen"

Actually that's not quite true, the former VIPs voted themselves out of their VIPedness.

Refugee
09-19-2017, 09:34 PM
"Because you’re afraid that if this took off, you unelected few might eventually get voted out as well and that isn’t going to happen"

Actually that's not quite true, the former VIPs voted themselves out of their VIPedness.
'If this thing took off ...', I was talking about the moderators.

Green Arrow
09-19-2017, 10:17 PM
'If this thing took off ...', I was talking about the moderators.

The moderators serve at the pleasure of ADMIN and no one else. That will never change.

Crepitus
09-19-2017, 10:31 PM
Are you intentionally looking for a TB? You already know where I am and have made derogatory comments about this in previous threads. There was a personal insinuation behind it and I’m just wondering if you’re going to state it on a thread where so many have been TBd already for personal comments. Let's see if the report function works :)

Your comment above is why moderators should be very careful who they select.

So why are you unwilling to admit it?

Refugee
09-19-2017, 10:33 PM
The moderators serve at the pleasure of ADMIN and no one else. That will never change.
Spot on GA. So why all the pretence of democracy and choice? I’m glad you’ve finally said it. That’s been the whole point of my posts and the other VIPs and mods will be queuing up to give you a like for that. :)

Refugee
09-19-2017, 10:34 PM
So why are you unwilling to admit it?
Oh well, an hour later and you’re still here. I suppose there must be a fast track system for those who previously got TBd or the report system is out of action, So go on, what other personal details about me do you want to know … future advisor?

Ravens Fan
09-19-2017, 10:54 PM
Spot on GA. So why all the pretence of democracy and choice? I’m glad you’ve finally said it. That’s been the whole point of my posts and the other VIPs and mods will be queuing up to give you a like for that. :)

There has been no pretense. We never offered democracy either. We are implementing a program that was designed with the various suggestions and feedback we received in the last townhall in mind. We tried to make something that had a more democratic process to it, but not a direct democracy.

The Moderation team is not the subject of this thread.

Green Arrow
09-19-2017, 10:58 PM
Spot on GA. So why all the pretence of democracy and choice? Iím glad youíve finally said it. Thatís been the whole point of my posts and the other VIPs and mods will be queuing up to give you a like for that. :)

The moderators have never suggested anything about democratic elections for moderators.

Perianne
09-19-2017, 11:00 PM
I have no opinion. I don't care who does what. I follow the rules and am nice to everyone, so I don't fear what they decide.

If this is what ADMIN wants, then so be it. He pays the bills. We are his guests.

I will say this: whoever made the decision to automatically change badwords into @#$%, I am grateful.

Dr. Who
09-19-2017, 11:05 PM
I have no opinion. I don't care who does what. I follow the rules and am nice to everyone, so I don't fear what they decide.

If this is what ADMIN wants, then so be it. He pays the bills. We are his guests.

I will say this: whoever made the decision to automatically change badwords into @#$%, I am grateful.
We introduced the software a couple of years back. It was better than trying to police all of the language.

Safety
09-19-2017, 11:09 PM
Well the problem comes back then. Inevitably you'll have a shortage of one or the other and then you'll not have pepper representation.

Might I suggest not trying to represent any political persuasion, but rather an example of the rules being followed regardless of personal politics?

Sent from my evil cell phone.

That's an impossible feat on a political board, especially when it comes to recognizing and attempting to moderate trolling.

Crepitus
09-19-2017, 11:15 PM
Oh well, an hour later and you’re still here. I suppose there must be a fast track system for those who previously got TBd or the report system is out of action, So go on, what other personal details about me do you want to know … future advisor?

What is it that you think I did that was ban-worthy?

AZ Jim
09-19-2017, 11:25 PM
I believe that VIP'S and Advisors serve to divide us more than anything else.

Captain Obvious
09-19-2017, 11:55 PM
I believe that VIP'S and Advisors serve to divide us more than anything else.

Why?

Refugee
09-20-2017, 12:25 AM
There has been no pretense. We never offered democracy either. We are implementing a program that was designed with the various suggestions and feedback we received in the last townhall in mind. We tried to make something that had a more democratic process to it, but not a direct democracy.

The Moderation team is not the subject of this thread.
You certainly made it sound like democracy. Nominations, Town Halls, advisors? I’ve already told you I couldn’t give a toss, it just took GA to admit it and now I’m happy :) You tried to make it democratic, but not democratic? Yes, OK. Your’re right about it not being about Mods as well (taboo subject) and neither is it about my whereabouts and what I’m doing here by someone else, but we’ll ignore that shall we?

I’m a bit too wise to be drawn in by baiting about my location and circumstances. After 11 pages I leave this thread voluntarily, having had my say and getting the truth from GA, which is all I came for. No hard feelings and good luck with it all. :)

Common
09-20-2017, 02:16 AM
There are no Ďrequestsí here GA, there are announcements and orders. Get yourselves some democracy, or come out and admit it and at least be transparent about the process. Itís that lack of transparency behind closed doors that riles so many and the reason why these sort of threads are so popular. No one on the forum elects anyone here. Itís decided by an unelected few, confirmed by the same few, who canít be UN-elected either. Needs a grass roots Tea Party methinks. :smiley:

Donít worry, Iím just in one of my anarchist Bolshie moods today and busy plotting your overthrow in the hole with the rest of my dispossessed and marginalised comrades. :laugh:

Could you name a forum or 2 where the membership is allowed to unelect a moderator ?

Adelaide
09-20-2017, 05:52 AM
Will my nominations for members that are outside the Left Right paradigm be discounted out of hand?

No. The 3 liberals/left and 3 conservatives/right doesn't really account for libertarians or moderates but that doesn't mean they will be disqualified. We basically just wanted to make it clear we would aim for equal representation.

Adelaide
09-20-2017, 07:09 AM
Is there a target date for selections announced? jimmyz - I think we will probably close it on Friday. Hopefully, people keep making nominations. It's helpful to see who gets nominated multiple times.

Chris
09-20-2017, 07:11 AM
Spot on GA. So why all the pretence of democracy and choice? Iím glad youíve finally said it. Thatís been the whole point of my posts and the other VIPs and mods will be queuing up to give you a like for that. :)

Because we always have tried to find ways to get input and feedback from the members.

The pretence of democracy, the OP says nothing about democracy. This is not a government but a business.

Sometimes I think people just like to hear themselves complain.

hanger4
09-20-2017, 07:13 AM
jimmyz - I think we will probably close it on Friday. Hopefully, people keep making nominations. It's helpful to see who gets nominated multiple times.

Are y'all getting enough/plenty of nominations ??

Adelaide
09-20-2017, 07:21 AM
Are y'all getting enough/plenty of nominations ??

Yeah - we have gotten quite the response. There are a few people that I hope make nominations that have not yet.

Cthulhu
09-20-2017, 07:22 AM
That's an impossible feat on a political board, especially when it comes to recognizing and attempting to moderate trolling.And then Safety swoops on... Takes my Rose tinted mirror shades... And breaks them.

I know what you mean. It just seems silly to me is all.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

stjames1_53
09-20-2017, 07:29 AM
tell me again why we even need VIP, please

Chris
09-20-2017, 07:34 AM
tell me again why we even need VIP, please

To discuss member input and feedback and thereby provide input and feedback to the admin team. That's basically it right now. There are other ideas for what our role will be that will be discussed once the team is assembled.

hanger4
09-20-2017, 07:37 AM
tell me again why we even need VIP, please

You, we, the site doesn't. A member input/advice site is what Admin/owner/s wanted for their forum model, always have to my knowledge.

stjames1_53
09-20-2017, 07:43 AM
To discuss member input and feedback and thereby provide input and feedback to the admin team. That's basically it right now. There are other ideas for what our role will be that will be discussed once the team is assembled.

so, in other words, we have to pass it before we can read it

Chris
09-20-2017, 07:49 AM
so, in other words, we have to pass it before we can read it

No, the new VIPs will discuss it and decide whether to take on other responsibilities. That will be reviewed by the admin team. And then announced.

Chris
09-20-2017, 07:53 AM
Let me add that that's what happened here. VIPs spent a good long time discussing a VIP reset, including nuking it, because the old way wasn't really working anymore. In the middle of that, we decided to hold another town hall to see what you all were thinking, and that was added to the discussion. In the end, we decided to reset per the OP and let the new team carry on from there.

Safety
09-20-2017, 08:07 AM
And then Safety swoops on... Takes my Rose tinted mirror shades... And breaks them.

I know what you mean. It just seems silly to me is all.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

Well, I didn't eat any villagers...this time.

MisterVeritis
09-20-2017, 10:58 AM
In my opinion, the best change is that the advisors will play a significant role in building membership. If the thread starts are good ones this board will attract new members.

Bethere
09-20-2017, 01:12 PM
No, the new VIPs will discuss it and decide whether to take on other responsibilities. That will be reviewed by the admin team. And then announced.

Your collective language doesn't help matters. They're vips! They're not vips! They have power! They don't have power!

Our readership is easily confused as it is. Add in weak ass communications and we shouldn't be surprised that most are, in fact, confused.

Thanks for listening.

Chris
09-20-2017, 01:16 PM
Your collective language doesn't help matters. They're vips! They're not vips! They have power! They don't have power!

Our readership is easily confused as it is. Add in weak ass communications and we shouldn't be surprised that most are, in fact, confused.

Thanks for listening.


I don't understand what you're saying. It is a team. They have the power to influence the admin team.

The new Advisors need to communicate. The old VIPs failed at that.

How all that will work is yet to be decided.

stjames1_53
09-20-2017, 01:16 PM
Let me add that that's what happened here. VIPs spent a good long time discussing a VIP reset, including nuking it, because the old way wasn't really working anymore. In the middle of that, we decided to hold another town hall to see what you all were thinking, and that was added to the discussion. In the end, we decided to reset per the OP and let the new team carry on from there.
this is similar to insanity. If it didn't work before, you're going to try it again. Sorry @Chris (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=128), I'm not buying it. This is supposed to be a membership driven forum. This takes the steering wheel away from the membership.

Bethere
09-20-2017, 01:18 PM
I don't understand what you're saying. It is a team. They have the power to influence the admin team.

The new Advisors need to communicate. The old VIPs failed at that.

How all that will work is yet to be decided.

You made a start. Stick with the language upon which you agreed. Advisors. Not vips. This supposedly is different even though 10 of 12 named forum leaders were vips previously.

That's a tough sell with inconsistent communications.

Good news. You also lost, "and decide whether to take on other responsibilities."

Sadly, once you introduced that to the discussion few will look upon their existence without suspicion.

Words matter. Considering that the people are largely the same and those same people have the ability, according to you, to access the same power and roles they held previously?

Bethere is skeptical.

Also. Your word "they" is intentionally misleading. The word you are looking for is, "We."

Green Arrow
09-20-2017, 01:20 PM
this is similar to insanity. If it didn't work before, you're going to try it again. Sorry @Chris (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=128), I'm not buying it. This is supposed to be a membership driven forum. This takes the steering wheel away from the membership.

No, it doesn't. We're all members too.

Chris
09-20-2017, 01:24 PM
this is similar to insanity. If it didn't work before, you're going to try it again. Sorry Chris, I'm not buying it. This is supposed to be a membership driven forum. This takes the steering wheel away form the membership.

I don't want to go into all the reasons I think it failed as others have their ideas too. I will say this, as I see it, that for a long--Let me start at the beginning, when there was a VIP team but no Mods and that became a power trip for some, so Admin split out the Mod role. VIPs regrouped and became influential in designing the forum and rules and it worked for a while. But, as I see it, it got to be a power trip again and got dysfunctional, so we decided to reboot. As Advisers we will have no power other than to advise. Personally, I'm a big advocate of involving members as much as possible, thus the announced increase in town halls. I can see Advisors coming up with an idea and running it past members before advising the admin team. --But I emphasize these are my views. Where the Advisor team takes things will be up to a team.

Perianne
09-20-2017, 01:28 PM
I don't want to go into all the reasons I think it failed as others have their ideas too. I will say this, as I see it, that for a long--Let me start at the beginning, when there was a VIP team but no Mods and that became a power trip for some, so Admin split out the Mod role. VIPs regrouped and became influential in designing the forum and rules and it worked for a while. But, as I see it, it got to be a power trip again and got dysfunctional, so we decided to reboot. As Advisers we will have no power other than to advise. Personally, I'm a big advocate of involving members as much as possible, thus the announced increase in town halls. I can see Advisors coming up with an idea and running it past members before advising the admin team. --But I emphasize these are my views. Where the Advisor team takes things will be up to a team.
A power trip? Someone felt power by being VIP?

stjames1_53
09-20-2017, 01:31 PM
I don't want to go into all the reasons I think it failed as others have their ideas too. I will say this, as I see it, that for a long--Let me start at the beginning, when there was a VIP team but no Mods and that became a power trip for some, so Admin split out the Mod role. VIPs regrouped and became influential in designing the forum and rules and it worked for a while. But, as I see it, it got to be a power trip again and got dysfunctional, so we decided to reboot. As Advisers we will have no power other than to advise. Personally, I'm a big advocate of involving members as much as possible, thus the announced increase in town halls. I can see Advisors coming up with an idea and running it past members before advising the admin team. --But I emphasize these are my views. Where the Advisor team takes things will be up to a team.

I do not have a problem with mods or their jobs. I've been on other forums where the mods were totally power hungry AND liberal. It works out just fine for the libs, but for the cons, not so much. An "Advisory Board" is just another roadblock or another "agency" to have to work through.
Ever hear the one about the middleman? Well, we now have a middle man............... It will become a bottleneck.

Chris
09-20-2017, 01:33 PM
You made a start. Stick with the language upon which you agreed. Advisors. Not vips. This supposedly is different.

You also lost, "and decide whether to take on other responsibilities."

Sadly, once you introduced that to the discussion few will look upon their existence without suspicion.

Words matter.

Also. The word "they" is intentionally misleading. The word you are looking for is, "We."



Oh, sorry, habit. Old VIPs, new Advisors.


"and decide whether to take on other responsibilities." OK, at the risk of revealing "secrets" one of the ideas the old VIPs were discussing and the new Advisors will take up because I'll push it, is the Advisors acting as some sort of member representatives or advocates. Say you're having a problem with moderation, even a specific infraction, and getting no where arguing your case in PMs, well, it might be better to approach an Advisor of your choice who can argue your case for you. Doing this would be taking on another responsibility. --But, to be clear, I think this is a good idea, other Advisors might not, so we have to wait and see.

Why that would have been suspicious is beyond me.

Yes, we. And now that those important matters are cleared up, let's move on.

Chris
09-20-2017, 01:34 PM
A power trip? Someone felt power by being VIP?

The power to make rules. I'll leave it at that.

Chris
09-20-2017, 01:35 PM
I do not have a problem with mods or their jobs. I've been on other forums where the mods were totally power hungry AND liberal. It works out just fine for the libs, but for the cons, not so much. An "Advisory Board" is just another roadblock or another "agency" to have to work through.
Ever hear the one about the middleman? Well, we now have a middle man............... It will become a bottleneck.


Right, but the forum is not a government, it's a business.

Perianne
09-20-2017, 01:36 PM
The power to make rules. I'll leave it at that.
Sir, I wasn't doubting that some felt power. It was just astonishment that some would.

stjames1_53
09-20-2017, 01:36 PM
A power trip? Someone felt power by being VIP?

they have their own private meetings about the rest of the members and determine who gets the boot from the island

Green Arrow
09-20-2017, 01:37 PM
they have their own private meetings about the rest of the members and determine who gets the boot from the island

That has never been the case. Only mods determine who gets banned.

Green Arrow
09-20-2017, 01:38 PM
Sir, I wasn't doubting that some felt power. It was just astonishment that some would.

Some people also like to overexaggerate.

Bethere
09-20-2017, 01:39 PM
Oh, sorry, habit. Old VIPs, new Advisors.


"and decide whether to take on other responsibilities." OK, at the risk of revealing "secrets" one of the ideas the old VIPs were discussing and the new Advisors will take up because I'll push it, is the Advisors acting as some sort of member representatives or advocates. Say you're having a problem with moderation, even a specific infraction, and getting no where arguing your case in PMs, well, it might be better to approach an Advisor of your choice who can argue your case for you. Doing this would be taking on another responsibility. --But, to be clear, I think this is a good idea, other Advisors might not, so we have to wait and see.

Why that would have been suspicious is beyond me.

Yes, we. And now that those important matters are cleared up, let's move on.

"Meet the new boss," wrote Peter Townsend. "Same as the old boss. "

I'm done. Thanks for listening.

stjames1_53
09-20-2017, 01:42 PM
That has never been the case. Only mods determine who gets banned.

and now they have to have an advisory board to give them direction...........in other words, a bottleneck

stjames1_53
09-20-2017, 01:43 PM
tis sad, but it's a done deal...5 will get you 20 that it'll blow up

Chris
09-20-2017, 01:58 PM
and now they have to have an advisory board to give them direction...........in other words, a bottleneck

No, we will have no say on moderation decisions.

Well, other than if we take on the additional role of advocates, we could question a mod action, plead your case.

But we have no say in moderation.

What we would advise on is suggesting a new general rule or adding a new forum area.

Chris
09-20-2017, 01:59 PM
"Meet the new boss," wrote Peter Townsend. "Same as the old boss. "

I'm done. Thanks for listening.


The old boss is the new boss, known as ADMIN.

Bethere
09-20-2017, 02:07 PM
The old boss is the new boss, known as ADMIN.

I have a ton of respect for ADMIN. He gives me almost no relief on infractions and the like--even when he agrees with me. But on the big stuff? My view has mattered.

stjames1_53
09-20-2017, 02:28 PM
I have a ton of respect for @ADMIN (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1). He gives me almost no relief on infractions and the like--even when he agrees with me. But on the big stuff? My view has mattered.

most of your posts are in the hole. anything else is superfluous.
I've never had to go crying to Admin for anything. Not even dealing with you

Captain Obvious
09-20-2017, 03:14 PM
most of your posts are in the hole. anything else is superfluous.
I've never had to go crying to Admin for anything. Not even dealing with you

He will never be anything but a troll and forum vermin that we need to dispose of.

We got rid of less rancid trash.

Chloe
09-20-2017, 03:21 PM
Well this threads pretty much done

Green Arrow
09-20-2017, 03:42 PM
Well this threads pretty much done

I could have told you it would have ended like this before it even started.

Mister D
09-20-2017, 03:48 PM
Give it a chance. We'll see in a couple months.

Close thread.

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 04:41 PM
Are the Adviser's positions going to be up for periodic re-election?

To the detractors in this thread remember, an Advisor may take up your case as your proponent in a discussion and possible infraction discussion with the mods. So they may act on your behalf without you even knowing it. It's not like the Advisers will reside at Zeus' side with thunderbolts aimed at your head. Even your political opposite advisers are likely to act in a responsible manner if they honor their roles.

Chris
09-20-2017, 04:50 PM
Are the Adviser's positions going to be up for periodic re-election?

To the detractors in this thread remember, an Advisor may take up your case as your proponent in a discussion and possible infraction discussion with the mods. So they may act on your behalf without you even knowing it. It's not like the Advisers will reside at Zeus' side with thunderbolts aimed at your head. Even your political opposite advisers are likely to act in a responsible manner if they honor their roles.



Certainly something to consider when the team starts up.

Dr. Who
09-20-2017, 04:52 PM
this is similar to insanity. If it didn't work before, you're going to try it again. Sorry @Chris (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=128), I'm not buying it. This is supposed to be a membership driven forum. This takes the steering wheel away from the membership.
As every mod and forum advisor is a member of the forum, it is driven by its members. There are no paid positions. However it is still private property, thus Admin retains veto power and the ultimate say if he so chooses.

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 05:01 PM
With all the changes I've lost track of who is a Mod. Can someone remind me please. TYIA

Chris
09-20-2017, 05:03 PM
With all the changes I've lost track of who is a Mod. Can someone remind me please. TYIA

http://thepoliticalforums.com/showgroups.php

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 05:05 PM
http://thepoliticalforums.com/showgroups.php

Only four. Hm. TY

Chris
09-20-2017, 05:10 PM
My name is no longer blue! :cry:

https://i.snag.gy/NLOQAK.jpg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcM5gml7yHA

Green Arrow
09-20-2017, 06:02 PM
Are the Adviser's positions going to be up for periodic re-election?

To the detractors in this thread remember, an Advisor may take up your case as your proponent in a discussion and possible infraction discussion with the mods. So they may act on your behalf without you even knowing it. It's not like the Advisers will reside at Zeus' side with thunderbolts aimed at your head. Even your political opposite advisers are likely to act in a responsible manner if they honor their roles.
Some of them certainly should be. I think the ones directly chosen by mods and ADMIN should serve at the pleasure of mods and ADMIN.

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 06:19 PM
Some of them certainly should be. I think the ones directly chosen by mods and ADMIN should serve at the pleasure of mods and ADMIN.

Yes, I was referring to the member-elected Advisers. Thanks.

Dr. Who
09-20-2017, 06:22 PM
My name is no longer blue! :cry:

https://i.snag.gy/NLOQAK.jpg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcM5gml7yHA
Yes, it is. Just a little less blue.

Bethere
09-20-2017, 07:12 PM
Some of them certainly should be. I think the ones directly chosen by mods and ADMIN should serve at the pleasure of mods and ADMIN.

Here we go again . They are ALL directly chosen by the mods and admin. The next poster has visions of elections that will never happen because of lazy word choices. Words matter!


Yes, I was referring to the member-elected Advisers. Thanks. There will be no member elected advisors. Member nominated? Maybe. We'll see. But there's no election planned.

Common
09-20-2017, 07:21 PM
Here we go again . They are ALL directly chosen by the mods and admin. The next poster has visions of elections that will never happen because of lazy word choices. Words matter!

There will be no member elected advisors.

There are 6 chosen by the admin and the mods and 6 nominated by the membership

There are members who would be excluded because of their infraction records and lack of forum activity and their being here a very short time.

Bethere
09-20-2017, 07:25 PM
There are 6 chosen by the admin and the mods and 6 nominated by the membership

There are members who would be excluded because of their infraction records and lack of forum activity and their being here a very short time.

Nominated and elected are two different things entirely.

hanger4
09-20-2017, 07:28 PM
Here we go again . They are ALL directly chosen by the mods and admin. The next poster has visions of elections that will never happen because of lazy word choices. Words matter!

There will be no member elected advisors.

Member nominated Advisors. Before ALL vips were chosen, discussed and voted on by vips. Now at large members nominate 6 Advisors.

Baby steps my friend, baby steps.

hanger4
09-20-2017, 07:31 PM
Nominated and elected are two different things entirely.

And before you had no say (members at large) at all.

Common
09-20-2017, 07:38 PM
Nominated and elected are two different things entirely.

Name another forum that has elections, actually could you name a forum or two that has nominations.

Crepitus
09-20-2017, 07:46 PM
Give it a chance guys, if it doesn't work out I'm sure it won't last long, and it might just turn out to be a good thing.

Chris
09-20-2017, 07:47 PM
Here we go again . They are ALL directly chosen by the mods and admin. The next poster has visions of elections that will never happen because of lazy word choices. Words matter!

There will be no member elected advisors. Member nominated? Maybe. We'll see. But there's no election planned.



Well, then, this discussion is a good thing for clarifying.

In a way the remaining 6 are member selected based on nominations, and I'd guess the number of nominations might be used.

Of course recent infraction history eliminates some.

The old VIPs decided no elections, so blame us for that.

Ravens Fan
09-20-2017, 07:48 PM
He will never be anything but a troll and forum vermin that we need to dispose of.

We got rid of less rancid trash.
@Captain Obvious TB'ed for personal attack against a member.

Chris
09-20-2017, 07:48 PM
Nominated and elected are two different things entirely.

Not entirely.

Crepitus
09-20-2017, 07:51 PM
Nominated and elected are two different things entirely.

Not really. Yes, admin and the mods will have the final say, but members are providing the pool they must come from. And as Chris said, I would guess that the number of nominations someone gets would have at least some bearing on the choice.

Cthulhu
09-20-2017, 07:51 PM
In might be worthwhile to post the list of candidates. Then post the list of those actually in the running.

For the sole reason that some people think it is just whomever the present staff picks.

But people need to get this idea of democracy out of their heads - it isn't. It's a privately run message board and we're all guests. Your "rights"whatever you think they are - are exactly what is listed in the rules and are subject to change, and they aren't to be confused with whatever national charter you subscribe to.

/Rant.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

Common
09-20-2017, 08:04 PM
In might be worthwhile to post the list of candidates. Then post the list of those actually in the running.

For the sole reason that some people think it is just whomever the present staff picks.

But people need to get this idea of democracy out of their heads - it isn't. It's a privately run message board and we're all guests. Your "rights"whatever you think they are - are exactly what is listed in the rules and are subject to change, and they aren't to be confused with whatever national charter you subscribe to.

/Rant.

Sent from my evil cell phone.
The admin bends over backwards to give as much leeway as he can, other forums run like the gestapo and dont have the drama because the choice is you follow the rules or leave, no in betweens.

Bethere
09-20-2017, 08:46 PM
Not really. Yes, admin and the mods will have the final say, but members are providing the pool they must come from. And as Chris said, I would guess that the number of nominations someone gets would have at least some bearing on the choice.

My point is about misleading word choices. Don't ruin the roll out of this concept with a half dozen well intentioned people making conflicting word choices.

Consider the title of this thread. The new vip system? Really? There is no new vip system.

This roll out didn't even get past the first headline before it inadvertently started to misinform.

I'm ok with the product. I have issues with the way it has been described.

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 08:47 PM
Name another forum that has elections, actually could you name a forum or two that has nominations.

tPF is a trend starter. Copywrite this shit before Trinns site steals it. lol

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 08:49 PM
Not entirely.

Are the nomination numbers the determining metric for selection? Or is the posting history of vote winners also discussed?

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 08:51 PM
In might be worthwhile to post the list of candidates. Then post the list of those actually in the running.

For the sole reason that some people think it is just whomever the present staff picks.

But people need to get this idea of democracy out of their heads - it isn't. It's a privately run message board and we're all guests. Your "rights"whatever you think they are - are exactly what is listed in the rules and are subject to change, and they aren't to be confused with whatever national charter you subscribe to.

/Rant.

Sent from my evil cell phone.
Stop being rational. This is an emotional issue dontcha know. :tongue:

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 08:55 PM
My point is about misleading word choices. Don't ruin the roll out of this concept with a half dozen well intentioned people making conflicting word choices.

Consider the title of this thread. The new vip system? Really? There is no new vip system.

This roll out didn't even get past the first headline before it inadvertently started to misinform.

I'm ok with the product. I have issues with the way it has been described.
WTF. You are reading too many ingredient labels my friend. This is an evolving process meant to improve the site based on a Town Hall thread. How can you be so critical before it is even rolled out. Start a Bethere discussion board and pay for it. Then you can be the Caesar in your own world.

Green Arrow
09-20-2017, 09:03 PM
My point is about misleading word choices. Don't ruin the roll out of this concept with a half dozen well intentioned people making conflicting word choices.

Consider the title of this thread. The new vip system? Really? There is no new vip system.

This roll out didn't even get past the first headline before it inadvertently started to misinform.

I'm ok with the product. I have issues with the way it has been described.

So far you seem to be the only person struggling with words.

Bethere
09-20-2017, 09:09 PM
So far you seem to be the only person struggling with words.
It was constructive criticism. You guys are famous for confusing your readers. So, feel free to disregard my advice and carry on. Thanks.


WTF. You are reading too many ingredient labels my friend. This is an evolving process meant to improve the site based on a Town Hall thread. How can you be so critical before it is even rolled out. Start a @Bethere (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1988) discussion board and pay for it. Then you can be the Caesar in your own world.
I'm ok with the product. I have issues with the way it has been described.

hanger4
09-20-2017, 09:21 PM
It was constructive criticism. You guys are famous for confusing your readers. So, feel free to disregard my advice and carry on. Thanks.


What part of this in the opening post;

"The moderation team is about to introduce a new format for the VIPs, which will be renamed the Forum Advisors and started from scratch."

didn't you understand Bethere ?? Like you said 'words mean things'.

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 09:22 PM
I'm ok with the product. I have issues with the way it has been described.

Preparation H is described as a hemorrhoid cream applied liberally to your anus. But those in the know use it to reduce bags under their eyes. Do ya folla me?

Bethere
09-20-2017, 09:27 PM
Preparation H is described as a hemorrhoid cream applied liberally to your anus. But those in the know use it to reduce bags under their eyes. Do ya folla me?

If the prep h tube just said cream, you'd probably be putting it in your coffee. THAT is my point. Words matter.

Good night.

Chris
09-20-2017, 09:31 PM
Are the nomination numbers the determining metric for selection? Or is the posting history of vote winners also discussed?

I don't know. Read Adelaide's posts, I think they explain better than my speculation.

jimmyz
09-20-2017, 09:38 PM
If the prep h tube just said cream, you'd probably be putting it in your coffee. THAT is my point. Words matter.

Good night.

Meh. Splitting hairs is gnomes work.

Good morning from Australia

Cthulhu
09-20-2017, 11:35 PM
Stop being rational. This is an emotional issue dontcha know. :tongue:My bad. Old habits you know...

Sent from my evil cell phone.

Hal Jordan
09-21-2017, 02:32 AM
Are the nomination numbers the determining metric for selection? Or is the posting history of vote winners also discussed?
The number of nominations will be a metric. Posting history will have to be taken into account. As mentioned before, a lengthy, recent history of infractions would disqualify someone.

Common
09-21-2017, 05:06 AM
I believe Bethere has had more than enough individuals explain the process to him, he should be able to gleen enough words of his choosing to come to an understanding

stjames1_53
09-21-2017, 05:57 AM
I believe Bethere has had more than enough individuals explain the process to him, he should be able to gleen enough words of his choosing to come to an understanding
then, on the other hand, we are talking about BeThere.............

Bethere
09-21-2017, 06:05 AM
I believe Bethere has had more than enough individuals explain the process to him, he should be able to gleen enough words of his choosing to come to an understanding


then, on the other hand, we are talking about BeThere.............

Neither of you is posting in good faith as I always understood what was going on. I came out in favor of it immediately. I am unimpressed by your reading skills.

Smearing me is unfair and counter productive. tPF needs to move past such tactics.


I see it as a good faith attempt to make things fair. I'm not in love with the "run by its members" language, but I'll keep an open mind.

http://thepoliticalforums.com/threads/88401-The-New-VIP-System-Announcement/page9

Common
09-21-2017, 06:16 AM
You may go back to the hole, you wont get any more attention here, everyone has bent over backwards to try to explain to you exactly how the process works, whether you like the way it was worded or not is inconsequential.

stjames1_53
09-21-2017, 06:18 AM
Neither of you is posting in good faith as I always understood what was going on. I came out in favor of it immediately. I am unimpressed by your reading skills.

Smearing me is unfair and counter productive. tPF needs to move past such tactics.



http://thepoliticalforums.com/threads/88401-The-New-VIP-System-Announcement/page9

......it's always someone else's fault.............we got that

Bethere
09-21-2017, 06:26 AM
tell me again why we even need VIP, please
We don't. We got rid of vips. I thought you understood this stuff?

hanger4
09-21-2017, 06:32 AM
We don't. We got rid of vips. I thought you understood this stuff?

^^ I laughed ^^

Bethere
09-21-2017, 06:32 AM
You may go back to the hole, you wont get any more attention here, everyone has bent over backwards to try to explain to you exactly how the process works, whether you like the way it was worded or not is inconsequential.

Even now you are not empowered to give such direction. Your job is to encourage me to post, to set a good example, and perhaps even to be my advocate.

They should have worded that more clearly.

hanger4
09-21-2017, 06:36 AM
Even now you are not empowered to give such directions. Your job is to encourage me to post, perhaps even to be my advocate.

They should have worded that more clearly.

What part of;

"The moderation team is about to introduce a new format for the VIPs, which will be renamed the Forum Advisors and started from scratch."

didn't you understand Bethere ??

Bethere
09-21-2017, 06:39 AM
What part of;

"The moderation team is about to introduce a new format for the VIPs, which will be renamed the Forum Advisors and started from scratch."

didn't you understand @Bethere (http://thepoliticalforums.com/member.php?u=1988) ??

I understand it well enough to know that it has nothing to do with your quoted post.

stjames1_53
09-21-2017, 06:58 AM
I understand it well enough to know that it has nothing to do with your quoted post.

you are not very good at this. You should return to the Hole.
Point: they just renamed VIP to Advisors. they said that. If you have a problem with all of this, you should immediately seek out an advisor of choice and pm him for further clarification.
We know, all of this can be confusing to you, but work with it. If I have to, so do you. Your only other option is to leave the forum and relocate to a place that will put up with you

hanger4
09-21-2017, 07:04 AM
I understand it well enough to know that it has nothing to do with your quoted post.

Your words Bethere;

"They should have worded that more clearly."

Any lack of clarity is all on you.

Adelaide
09-21-2017, 12:02 PM
This thread is going to be closed now. If you wish to make nominations please private message a moderator.