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spunkloaf
06-18-2011, 01:51 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110618/ts_nm/us_afghanistan_talks

KABUL (Reuters) – The United States is in contact with the Taliban about a possible settlement to the war in Afghanistan, Afghan President Hamid Karzai said on Saturday, the first official confirmation of U.S. involvement in negotiations.

Karzai said that an Afghan push toward peace talks, after nearly a decade of war, had not yet reached a stage where the government and insurgents were meeting, but their representatives had been in touch.

"Peace talks are going on with the Taliban. The foreign military and especially the United States itself is going ahead with these negotiations," Karzai said in a speech in Kabul.

"The peace negotiations between (the) Afghan government and the Taliban movement are not yet based on a certain agenda or physical (meetings), there are contacts established."

The U.S. Embassy declined to comment directly on Karzai's assertion but said the United States supports Afghan reconciliation and has assisted Afghan government-led reintegration initiatives aimed at the Taliban.

spunkloaf
06-18-2011, 01:53 PM
So...this ought to be interesting.

Mindy
06-18-2011, 02:13 PM
It makes sense to me. It's time to bring our troops home.

What is the end goal there?

What military objectives are left to accomplish?

spunkloaf
06-18-2011, 02:38 PM
If the Taliban can agree to sit down, shut up and stop causing trouble, I'm for negotiating peace and stopping unnecessary bloodshed.

Mindy
06-18-2011, 02:49 PM
I think it's a safe bet that allied military forces have killed a lot more Afghan civilians than the Taliban over the last few years. Opium production is way up since the U.S. got involved, so now their economy should be booming as well. Time for us to go.

Captain Obvious
06-18-2011, 03:11 PM
It makes sense to me. It's time to bring our troops home.

What is the end goal there?

What military objectives are left to accomplish?


What do you think the consequences would be if we suddenly left Iraq and Afghanistan?

Do you think both governments would be able to fend for themselves against Taliban and insurgent forces?

Mindy
06-18-2011, 03:21 PM
It makes sense to me. It's time to bring our troops home.

What is the end goal there?

What military objectives are left to accomplish?


What do you think the consequences would be if we suddenly left Iraq and Afghanistan?

Do you think both governments would be able to fend for themselves against Taliban and insurgent forces?


The consequences would be a huge boost to our national defense, our military readiness, our economy, our moral...

Don't kid yourself, both governments are already riddled with taliban and insurgents, and corruption. Our presence does little to stop that and is only delaying the inevitable. There is no end game, there is no goal to reach for exit. You can't run a war like that, and these enemies are too good at blending in with the background to ever be isolated and killed. They aren't conventional wars and we are dying from a thousand cuts.

Captain Obvious
06-18-2011, 03:26 PM
So hand a strategic area (both oil and political) like Iraq over to insurgents and hand the keys of Afghanistan back to the Taliban?

I don't see that as a responsible option.

I would like to see us put more pressure on other "coalition" countries to expend their assistance. I don't think we need to be the globes policeman, but I don't think we should just cut-and-run on these engagements.

Mindy
06-18-2011, 03:33 PM
The plan was always to have these countries self govern themselves eventually. Iraq will be fine now that Hussein is gone. Afghanistan will be fine too. Just look at how our actions have destabilized Pakistan. Do you really think continuing to play in the mountains is worth fueling an radical Islamic state with nuclear capabilities? You can't look at these countries and engagements in isolation, you need to look at the big picture. We need Pakistan to become more Westernized and instead we have driven them into the hands of radicals. You can't convince me that Afghanistan and the cave dwelling Taliban is a greater threat than Pakistan.

Captain Obvious
06-18-2011, 03:36 PM
I don't consider Pakistan a 'radical islamic state'.

I also think that any semblance of government in place in Afghanistan, as corrupt and weak as it is will crumble into dust if we exit anytime soon.

Iraq - I don't know. I'm not sure they're ready or not ready at this point to be honest.

Mindy
06-18-2011, 03:40 PM
It might not be yet, but it's well on it's way. All that's needed is a few more dominos to fall. Look at how long they harbored Bin Laden in plain sight. In the early 2000s Pakistan was competing with India to be a Western ally and become a respected, industrialized country. Now they're infected with radical islamists who are in key positions of power and growing throughout their military and political structure.

GRUMPY
06-18-2011, 04:13 PM
negotiating with moderate taliban is nuts.....if we are not all in and by that i mean a committment of at least decades then get out....this prez has demonstrated that he has no goal, no committment beyond perception, clearly the time to leave is now.....

spunkloaf
06-19-2011, 11:29 AM
The recent military occupation is reminiscent of a crusade conducted under the previous administration.

Mister D
06-19-2011, 11:32 AM
Crusade?

GRUMPY
06-19-2011, 11:52 AM
:D :D :D :D :D....

Mister D
06-19-2011, 12:02 PM
The most amusing aspect of Spunk's hyperbole is that he is parroting AQ. :o ;D

Conley
06-19-2011, 12:12 PM
didn't dubya say that god told him to invade iraq? that does sound like a crusade...

Conley
06-19-2011, 12:20 PM
"President George W Bush told Palestinian ministers that God had told him to invade Afghanistan and Iraq"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2005/10_october/06/bush.shtml

spunkloaf
06-19-2011, 12:23 PM
I think it is also funny. Bush used the word, not me.

Mister D
06-19-2011, 12:37 PM
It is a crusade in the sense of "a vigorous and dedicated action or movement in favor of a cause". Kind of like say...the war on poverty. It is not a "crusade" in the sense that Sheik Spunkloaf uses the term (i.e. the wars in the Mid East are not perceived as part our Christian duty). Whatever private views George Bush may have regarding the conflicts in the Mid East (the BBC's suspect source notwithstanding) it is in no way a Christian crusade.

spunkloaf
06-19-2011, 12:57 PM
I think you're reading too much into it, D. I only said crusade. It is what it is, a word. Bush also used the same word to describe his efforts.

Mister D
06-19-2011, 01:08 PM
I think you're reading too much into it, D. I only said crusade. It is what it is, a word. Bush also used the same word to describe his efforts.


OK. If in fact you did not mean to suggest anything negative about the occupation or to suggest that American involvement is motivated by religion then you have my apologies.

spunkloaf
06-19-2011, 01:44 PM
I think you're reading too much into it, D. I only said crusade. It is what it is, a word. Bush also used the same word to describe his efforts.


OK. If in fact you did not mean to suggest anything negative about the occupation or to suggest that American involvement is motivated by religion then you have my apologies.

If I ever mean to suggest such a thing, I will suggest it.

GRUMPY
06-19-2011, 06:37 PM
I think you're reading too much into it, D. I only said crusade. It is what it is, a word. Bush also used the same word to describe his efforts.


OK. If in fact you did not mean to suggest anything negative about the occupation or to suggest that American involvement is motivated by religion then you have my apologies.

If I ever mean to suggest such a thing, I will suggest it.

damn spunk you are so sophisticated, most of just say what we mean and mean what we say....you on the other hand suggest what you mean and mean what you suggest..... ;D ;)

Captain Obvious
06-20-2011, 07:03 PM
"Crusade" is a term used by radical Islamics with the intent to offend, nothing more.

spunkloaf
06-20-2011, 11:05 PM
"Crusade" is a term used by radical Islamics with the intent to offend, nothing more.


If that's your opinion, fine. But I only used the word because Bush did.

blaster
06-16-2016, 05:55 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110618/ts_nm/us_afghanistan_talks (/s/nm/20110618/ts_nm/us_afghanistan_talks) KABUL (Reuters) – The United States is in contact with the Taliban about a possible settlement to the war in Afghanistan, Afghan President Hamid Karzai said on Saturday, the first official confirmation of U.S. involvement in negotiations. Karzai said that an Afghan push toward peace talks, after nearly a decade of war, had not yet reached a stage where the government and insurgents were meeting, but their representatives had been in touch. "Peace talks are going on with the Taliban. The foreign military and especially the United States itself is going ahead with these negotiations," Karzai said in a speech in Kabul. "The peace negotiations between (the) Afghan government and the Taliban movement are not yet based on a certain agenda or physical (meetings), there are contacts established." The U.S. Embassy declined to comment directly on Karzai's assertion but said the United States supports Afghan reconciliation and has assisted Afghan government-led reintegration initiatives aimed at the Taliban. The place to be making contact with the talaban isn't in Afganistan. It is in Pakistan.