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Chris
10-25-2017, 02:48 PM
So what effect will this have on defeating Trump next election?

Bernie betrays Democrats, announces reelection run as an independent (https://www.salon.com/2017/10/24/sanders-betrays-democrats-announces-reelection-run-as-an-independent/)


There is no excuse for the Democratic National Committee's efforts to undermine Sen. Bernie Sanders' 2016 presidential campaign. This doesn't mean, however, that the DNC was wrong for distrusting Sanders' sincerity when he claimed to be a Democrat.

The fact that Sanders has just announced he will run for reelection in 2018 as an independent underscores that point.

"I am an independent and I have always run in Vermont as an independent, while I caucus with the Democrats in the United States Senate. That’s what I’ve been doing for a long time and that’s what I’ll continue to do," Sanders told a Fox News reporter on Sunday, during a trip to New Hampshire.


Granted, as the article goes on, he has also said he'd run as a Democrat. But former DNC chairwoman Debbie Wasserman-Schultz screwed him over last time.

AZ Jim
10-25-2017, 02:51 PM
Nothing new here. He has always been an Independent who caucused with the Democrats. There is no betrayal of Democrats.

The Xl
10-25-2017, 02:53 PM
Nice. Good going Bernie, F the Dems.

Captain Obvious
10-25-2017, 02:56 PM
Bernie might be the new Ross Perot

AZ Jim
10-25-2017, 03:15 PM
Nice. Good going Bernie, F the Dems.Repeat, nothing any different than it's been for years.

Chris
10-25-2017, 03:58 PM
Nothing new here. He has always been an Independent who caucused with the Democrats. There is no betrayal of Democrats.

But he's run on the Dem ticket for President. Splitting off could do as much damage libertarians to the Reps.

Chris
10-25-2017, 04:04 PM
Bernie might be the new Ross Perot



https://i.snag.gy/bJd07A.jpg

Common
10-25-2017, 04:26 PM
Repeat, nothing any different than it's been for years.
Huge difference, running as a dem means he has to compete in a primary as an independent he does not.
As a democrat it would be him against trump, as an independent its fundamentally 2 democrats against trump

Crepitus
10-25-2017, 04:56 PM
If he runs as an independent he has removed himself from relevancy.

Green Arrow
10-25-2017, 05:21 PM
If he runs as an independent healthcare as removed himself from relevancy.
Rephrase?

gamewell45
10-25-2017, 05:25 PM
So what effect will this have on defeating Trump next election?

Bernie betrays Democrats, announces reelection run as an independent (https://www.salon.com/2017/10/24/sanders-betrays-democrats-announces-reelection-run-as-an-independent/)




Granted, as the article goes on, he has also said he'd run as a Democrat. But former DNC chairwoman Debbie Wasserman-Schultz screwed him over last time.
I understand he still intends to caucus with the democrats, so that could possibly lessen the negative impact.

Crepitus
10-25-2017, 05:25 PM
If he runs as an independent he has removed himself from relevancy.


Rephrase?

Fixed.

Stupid predictive text thingy.

nic34
10-25-2017, 05:30 PM
But he's run on the Dem ticket for President. Splitting off could do as much damage libertarians to the Reps.

Not if he wins the primary, which is the ultimate goal....something that lib-tarians don't get

Green Arrow
10-25-2017, 05:42 PM
Fixed.

Stupid predictive text thingy.

Cool. How is that the case, when he’s run as an independent his entire career?

Chris
10-25-2017, 05:45 PM
I understand he still intends to caucus with the democrats, so that could possibly lessen the negative impact.

Right, I think that's how he explained it. He's an Independent who caucuses with the Dems.

Chris
10-25-2017, 05:46 PM
Not if he wins the primary, which is the ultimate goal....something that lib-tarians don't get

What if he runs as an independent on an Independent ticket like the Lib-tarians do? Then he will pull votes away from the Dem candidate.

Chris
10-25-2017, 05:48 PM
If he runs as an independent he has removed himself from relevancy.

That's what Reps say about Lib-tarians.

AZ Jim
10-25-2017, 05:51 PM
We have a two party system. Third party efforts are futile. They can only be spoilers.

Green Arrow
10-25-2017, 05:54 PM
We have a two party system. Third party efforts are futile.

Why are you happy with a two-party dictatorship?

AZ Jim
10-25-2017, 05:55 PM
Why are you happy with a two-party dictatorship?Who said I was happy? I just understand the facts.

Green Arrow
10-25-2017, 05:57 PM
Who said I was happy? I just understand the facts.

I understand the facts too. I also work to fix it instead of just dealing with it.

Chris
10-25-2017, 06:01 PM
We have a two party system. Third party efforts are futile. They can only be spoilers.

And a vote for a third party is a vote for the other guy, right, Abe?

Crepitus
10-25-2017, 06:17 PM
Cool. How is that the case, when he’s run as an independent his entire career?

For president is a different story imho.

Green Arrow
10-25-2017, 06:20 PM
For president is a different story imho.

As I understood it the article was referring to his Senate re-election.

Crepitus
10-25-2017, 06:20 PM
That's what Reps say about Lib-tarians.

Lib-tarians = what?

Tahuyaman
10-25-2017, 06:22 PM
Sanders is a cheap opportunist. If its beneficial to be a Democrat, he's a Democrat. If it's beneficial to be an independent, he's an independent. The bottom line, he's a hard line socialist no matter how he tries to fool or deceive people.

Dangermouse
10-25-2017, 06:26 PM
I can agree with the "opportunist" part, but "hard line socialist" is simply funny to European eyes, where he'd fit straight into the "social democrat" slot, no worries.

Green Arrow
10-25-2017, 06:47 PM
Sanders is a cheap opportunist. If its beneficial to be a Democrat, he's a Democrat. If it's beneficial to be an independent, he's an independent. The bottom line, he's a hard line socialist no matter how he tries to fool or deceive people.
Sanders ran as a Democrat once and that was only because third parties aren’t visble. He’s never pretended to be something he’s not and he’s never tried to say he wasn’t a socialist. He’s been open and proud about that fact.

AZ Jim
10-25-2017, 06:48 PM
As I understood it the article was referring to his Senate re-election.It is.

Crepitus
10-25-2017, 07:04 PM
As I understood it the article was referring to his Senate re-election.

Ah, my bad. I just skimmed it and I was under the impression they we re talking about the next presidential election.

Chris
10-25-2017, 07:40 PM
I can agree with the "opportunist" part, but "hard line socialist" is simply funny to European eyes, where he'd fit straight into the "social democrat" slot, no worries.

Agree, he's a soft socialist, even here.

barb012
10-25-2017, 07:44 PM
Has a Independent ever won an election?

Chris
10-25-2017, 07:44 PM
Lib-tarians = what?

I don't know, Nic used it.

I'm guessing it attributes similarity between Libertarians and Democrats. Here for example:


Johnson is the reason for the failure of the party over his Leftist platform.
And people wonder why we cal them LIB-tarians..... :rolleyes:

Gov. Gary Johnson: LIB-ertarian, the LIB-ertarian Party candidate for president, said that he agrees with 73 percent of what Sen. Bernie Sanders (I., Vt.) says, citing that libertarians agree with socialism as long as it’s voluntary.

@ http://conservativepoliticalforum.com/2016-tea-party-candidate-vetting/gary-johnson-i-agree-with-73-of-what-bernie-sanders-says/


Rothbard once courted the New Left, in the 60s, when theRight went neocon against Communism.

Chris
10-25-2017, 07:45 PM
Has a Independent ever won an election?

George Washington? :D

Captain Obvious
10-25-2017, 08:35 PM
Smells like 4 more years of Trump

Green Arrow
10-25-2017, 09:09 PM
Smells like 4 more years of Trump

I don’t think a senate race in Vermont has any impact on Trump unless he’s running for Senate in Vermont.

Captain Obvious
10-25-2017, 09:28 PM
I don’t think a senate race in Vermont has any impact on Trump unless he’s running for Senate in Vermont.

That went without saying but thanks anyway.

Green Arrow
10-25-2017, 09:59 PM
That went without saying but thanks anyway.

If it goes without saying then why did you say it would lead to four more Trump years?

Captain Obvious
10-25-2017, 10:00 PM
If it goes without saying then why did you say it would lead to four more Trump years?

"Smells like" - as in "smells like Bernie is Berning bridges with the DNC"

Do the math after that.

Also... see what I did there?

:p

Crepitus
10-25-2017, 10:00 PM
Smells like 4 more years of Trump

Lol, don't count your chicken just yet, he hasn't even survived one year yet.

Captain Obvious
10-25-2017, 10:01 PM
Lol, don't count your chicken just yet, he hasn't even survived one year yet.

Right, only 7 more to go.

Chris
10-26-2017, 07:28 AM
I don’t think a senate race in Vermont has any impact on Trump unless he’s running for Senate in Vermont.

But it does speak to a major player with a huge following splitting away from the Democrats. And that does affect party unity.

Chris
10-26-2017, 07:29 AM
Lol, don't count your chicken just yet, he hasn't even survived one year yet.

And yet your side lost to this big loser.

Crepitus
10-26-2017, 07:38 AM
And yet your side lost to this big loser.

It's hard to win when the other side has a whole foreign government behind them.

Chris
10-26-2017, 07:42 AM
It's hard to win when the other side has a whole foreign government behind them.

Still looking for evidence on that?

The fact is, the more you denigrate Trump personally, and that is 99% of the criticism, you denigrate your side for losing to a loser.

Crepitus
10-26-2017, 08:21 AM
Still looking for evidence on that?

The fact is, the more you denigrate Trump personally, and that is 99% of the criticism, you denigrate your side for losing to a loser.

You are completely entitled to your own opinion on the matter.

Chris
10-26-2017, 08:30 AM
You are completely entitled to your own opinion on the matter.

As are you. Forums are largely exchanges of political opinions.


I started the thread though to get opinions on Bernie's decision and how that might affect the Dems and the next election, not to just dive into the depths of bashing Trump.

nic34
10-26-2017, 09:00 AM
What if he runs as an independent on an Independent ticket like the Lib-tarians do? Then he will pull votes away from the Dem candidate.

Yes, "what if"?
Don't count on it.

Chris
10-26-2017, 09:24 AM
Yes, "what if"?
Don't count on it.

So no answer. OK.

Tahuyaman
10-26-2017, 11:15 AM
Sanders ran as a Democrat once and that was only because third parties aren’t visble. He’s never pretended to be something he’s not and he’s never tried to say he wasn’t a socialist. He’s been open and proud about that fact.


He ran as a Democrat because it was beneficial or convenient to do so. Ultimately he as phony and corrupt as any politician.

Tahuyaman
10-26-2017, 11:24 AM
I can agree with the "opportunist" part, but "hard line socialist" is simply funny to European eyes, where he'd fit straight into the "social democrat" slot, no worries.

He was a believer in Soviet style communism back in the day. The "democratic socialist" thing is a ruse. He knows that he needs to deceive people.