How the ultra wealthy are not happer than the poor

[Just AnotherPerson]

In the course of my life I have known some very wealthy people personally. I will share some of what life is like in their shoes. I know that most of them do not have the glorious life that the people of the world get to see, some people wish to be wealthy like them. That is because they do not know the truth. The ultra wealthy are some of the most miserable lonely people on the earth. They cannot have real relationships and it's almost impossible for them to find love because someone always only wants them for what they have. And they never really know who loves them and who does not. Even if someone does genuinely love them they will suspect that they don't really love them, so real relationships are almost impossible.

These people are often so lonely and have such a hard time living with themselves that they drink themselves to sleep every night. In order to build their empires or fortunes they have to do many unethical things because being unethical is the only way to get to that degree of wealth. They can barley live with themselves and barley make it through the day. They crack the bottle at night and drink it till they fall from their chair.

Conspiracy theories pale in comparison to what really goes on in the lives of the ultra wealthy. They have beliefs and practices you wouldn't even imagine. You would be called crazy if you said it out loud. But these ultra wealthy are the builders of our society, they are responsible for building society according to their beliefs and goals. They are venerated by the politicians and invited to dinner with the politicians and treated as family. This gives them pride and the feeling of being a better person than others in the world. They feel as though they are builders, and are very important in shaping society. In return for this recognition and glory, they give mega donations to the politicians of their choosing, and they get to help decide what legislations will be passed. In order that the donations are tax free they give the donations in multiples of small amounts.

These moments of feeling important help them for a day or two and make them feel like they are doing some good in the world. But then a few days later reality sets in again and they see day in and day out the unethical things they have to do to stay at the top. The face they show to society is the proud face, and that helps them to be seen as good people. They donate to charities to help themselves to feel better. But it does not help because the weight on their conscious is so heavy that they can barley breathe.

They are alone and afraid and miserable. They loath the lower class people of society looking upon them as less. But at the same time live off of the backs of those lower people, but without the lower class the higher up class would not exist. Most of the ultra wealthy have the saddest lives of all living beings. It is better to be poor living in a hut with a dirt floor and have someone you love and a good meal now and then. A true "so called" upper class person, knows that the life in the hut is far more superior. How sad is the life of the ultra wealthy. I have never seen such a sorrow as the burden of the man who owns an empire or great fortune.

It is even more sad if they get sick, because they are used to getting all of the things they want, but their money can only buy so much when it comes to health and life. They find out that all the money in the world cant save them. It is then that the great equalizer shows them that they are the same as everyone else. It is pretty harsh.

The real thing is not someone who gets to sit among the books in bliss. It is a person who spends time in loneliness with the weight of a the world on his back and the weight of his deeds that he must commit in order that his fortune does not run out. His fortune can only exist because of others misfortune.

What he does not know or realize is that all beings are equal, and what we have, is not what defines us, but it is what is in our hearts, and if we have comfort, and a roof over our head, if we are a decent human being who cares for others, and does not make life hard for others, and helps another when he can. Our actions in this life are what define us.

The poor already have true happiness, some just don't know it. But the wealthy man does know that wealth cannot buy happiness. Even if we have what we would consider as being nothing, if we can see what we do have, and count our blessings, we will see that we already have everything we could ever want. Number one on the list for true joy is health. If we do not have health then all of it is for not. If we are sick then we can still find joy in looking at what is not wrong. For instance if I have a bad back I can realize I still have a good heart that functions normally. This is the greatest gift we can ever have is health.

To have two good eyes to see the beauty of the world is the greatest gift. Even if we only have one eye. To see is a gift. This world is so beautiful. To be able to have these senses to be able to feel it is wonderous.

There is nothing more important than health, with out that everything is thrown out the window. So it is not money that can buy us true happiness it realizing what we already have.

The second condition for happiness is food, and the third is shelter. So if health, food, and shelter are there then you have all you need to have true joy. How much more so if you have people in your life who you love and cherish. There is nothing more important in the whole world.

If you have ever had a loved one who was sick or close to death or did pass away. You will recall that in that moment, nothing in the whole world mattered. You may have cried to the heavens begging for the life of that person to be spared vowing that you would give anything in return. You would give it all if that person could get well or live. It is because when death comes to the door we see that things do not matter at all. We see that the only thing that matters is life.

True joy is here and now in this precious moment.

[Common]

Having money brings less stress, not having to worry about the bills or when your next meal will come from. It brings peace of mind knowing you are financially secure, it brings temporary happiness being able to do what you want and go where you want on a whim.

IT DOES NOT BRING TRUE HAPPINESS. Happiness comes through love, close strong family, children and having a guiltfree life. Money cant buy any of those things

[barb012]

You cannot measure happiness by your income level. People are more lonelier and isolated then ever before in history because lying and no accountability has become the norm in society. Society's behavior social structure is in deep trouble and sadly many of us will have no quality of life with the people we have relationships with.

[Just AnotherPerson]

Having money brings less stress, not having to worry about the bills or when your next meal will come from. It brings peace of mind knowing you are financially secure, it brings temporary happiness being able to do what you want and go where you want on a whim.

IT DOES NOT BRING TRUE HAPPINESS. Happiness comes through love, close strong family, children and having a guiltfree life. Money cant buy any of those things

Absolutely right on. We do need enough money to have basic comforts. You said it right, Well said!

[MisterVeritis]

Money might not be able to buy one happiness but it sure does allow one to rent some. Thosee of you who chimed in, how many of you have a net worth of at least one million dollars?

[Just AnotherPerson]

Money might not be able to buy one happiness but it sure does allow one to rent some. Thosee of you who chimed in, how many of you have a net worth of at least one million dollars?

Mr V I know exactly what it is like to have millions and millions of dollars. I do not have to have it to know what it is like. What I know is that the rented happiness will never satisfy there will always be the longing for the next satisfaction, and there is always an emptiness attached to the things you call rented happiness. Because when you have to buy joy it never lasts and does not satisfy the soul. One moment of true joy and happiness can make up for an entire lifetime of sorrow. True happiness cannot be purchased. It is found in this moment realizing that you are still alive, and that the ones who you love are still alive, and that you have a home and food to eat, and all of your basic comforts met.

It is not that a wealthy person cannot be happy. But Many of the most ultra wealthy are not. I have seen it time and time again.

You have the chance now to sit on your deck enjoying the birds. That is truly wonderful MR V. I am glad for that truly I am. That is not bought happiness. Because any poor person can also go outside and experience the same joy. They can go to a park if they do not have a yard of their own and they can also sit and watch the birds with a cup of coffee in their hand.

The one sad thing is that the people who work very hard at low paying jobs often do not get to enjoy life as often. Life is stolen from them in order that the people at the top can enjoy their leisure time. It is a sort of trading of lives. The poor give up what they have in order that the wealthy may have it all. It is not a fair system MR V. It is not just about who works the hardest can have the most. The game is set so that failure is near certainty. The wealthy need the poor. It is the poor that support the wealthy not the other way around.

It is all set up this way on purpose because if the poor did not exist then who would the slaves be?

I have enjoyed our conversations Mr V and once again, I really do think you are a good person. I am pretty sure goodness is your basic nature. I will give you a break now MR V, today will be my last day. Yes I know for many of you that will be a godsend no more JAP. But even when you say bad things MR V I don't think you mean them. I think you are a good person. Hope that didn't offend you. =)

[MisterVeritis]

Mr V I know exactly what it is like to have millions and millions of dollars. I do not have to have it to know what it is like. What I know is that the rented happiness will never satisfy there will always be the longing for the next satisfaction, and there is always an emptiness attached to the things you call rented happiness. Because when you have to buy joy it never lasts and does not satisfy the soul. One moment of true joy and happiness can make up for an entire lifetime of sorrow. True happiness cannot be purchased. It is found in this moment realizing that you are still alive, and that the ones who you love are still alive, and that you have a home and food to eat, and all of your basic comforts met.

It is not that a wealthy person cannot be happy. But Many of the most ultra wealthy are not. I have seen it time and time again.

You have the chance now to sit on your deck enjoying the birds. That is truly wonderful MR V. I am glad for that truly I am. That is not bought happiness. Because any poor person can also go outside and experience the same joy. They can go to a park if they do not have a yard of their own and they can also sit and watch the birds with a cup of coffee in their hand.

The one sad thing is that the people who work very hard at low paying jobs often do not get to enjoy life as often. Life is stolen from them in order that the people at the top can enjoy their leisure time. It is a sort of trading of lives. The poor give up what they have in order that the wealthy may have it all. It is not a fair system MR V. It is not just about who works the hardest can have the most. The game is set so that failure is near certainty. The wealthy need the poor. It is the poor that support the wealthy not the other way around.

It is all set up this way on purpose because if the poor did not exist then who would the slaves be?

I have enjoyed our conversations Mr V and once again, I really do think you are a good person. I am pretty sure goodness is your basic nature. I will give you a break now MR V, today will be my last day. Yes I know for many of you that will be a godsend no more JAP. But even when you say bad things MR V I don't think you mean them. I think you are a good person. Hope that didn't offend you. =)
It helps if you actually have wealth.

[DGUtley]

Wealth is defined in many ways.

[Just AnotherPerson]

It helps if you actually have wealth.

You do not know what I have or do not have and I am not telling MR V.

[jimmyz]

I would love to be in a situation where I could do random acts of giving large amounts money to good causes. That alone would give me solace in that some good was coming of my wealth. As of now, the $10-$20 gift to the dregs on the street will suffice.

I live a humble life and live below my means because shiny things and putting on a show doesn't appeal to me. I'll take standing in the surf fishing with a dog by my side over a yacht any day.

[jimmyz]

You do not know what I have or do not have and I am not telling MR V.

You've already stated, "I've had millions and millions" in your previous post.

[MisterVeritis]

You do not know what I have or do not have and I am not telling MR V.
You do not speak as someone who has wealth.

[MisterVeritis]

Wealth is defined in many ways.
Ultimately, it is measured in dollars.

[Just AnotherPerson]

You've already stated, "I've had millions and millions" in your previous post.

Read it again

[MisterVeritis]

Wealth is defined in many ways.
I suspect you have more wealth than I do. But you speak as someone accustomed to wealth. Most people here do not.

[Just AnotherPerson]

I suspect you have more wealth than I do. But you speak as someone accustomed to wealth. Most people here do not.

MR V I rescind the words I said to you, the ones where I said I believe you are a good person. Perhaps your basic nature is not goodness. Perhaps I was wrong.

[DGUtley]

Ultimately, it is measured in dollars.

I don’t know. I get your point but I had less stress in my life when I had nothing. When we got married and moved into the ghetto, we bought the cheapest everything. We were proud to just have something/ anything. Now, she stresses over all the selections. Then, it was easier — cheapest.

[MisterVeritis]

MR V I rescind the words I said to you, the ones where I said I believe you are a good person. Perhaps your basic nature is not goodness. Perhaps I was wrong.
LOL. It is okay.

[MisterVeritis]

I don’t know. I get your point but I had less stress in my life when I had nothing. When we got married and moved into the ghetto, we bought the cheapest everything. We were proud to just have something/ anything. Now, she stresses over all the selections. Then, it was easier — cheapest.
Those are choices. You (and I) never have to choose between one necessity and another.

Besides, distance allows nostalgia.

[jimmyz]

Read it again

Your quote from your post# 6, "Mr V I know exactly what it is like to have millions and millions of dollars". I assume that means you have "millions and millions".

[MisterVeritis]

Your quote from your post# 6, "Mr V I know exactly what it is like to have millions and millions of dollars". I assume that means you have "millions and millions".
Perhaps she watched "Millionaire Housewives of ISIS".

[Abby08]

People are responsible for their own happiness, whether they are rich or poor.

Rich people can be happy or sad... poor people can be happy or sad... depending on who they are, as human beings.

I've known rich people with lousy attitudes, I've known poor people with great attitudes...and vice versa.

[Captdon]

I have never had a million dollars but I have never been poor. I am retired and living exactly what I wanted to live when i was young.

I live very nicely. i don't have a mansion but I have a good house. I have everything I need and most of what I want.

I also have the wife I married 51 years ago; two successful, good people as children. My friends know they can depend on me. The only real stress is my health but it has never been good so the stress isn't that bad.

[Just AnotherPerson]

Your quote from your post# 6, "Mr V I know exactly what it is like to have millions and millions of dollars". I assume that means you have "millions and millions".
Here is a quote not taken out of context, "
Mr V I know exactly what it is like to have millions and millions of dollars. I do not have to have it to know what it is like."

That clarifies it a bit more don't you think?

[Just AnotherPerson]

Perhaps she watched "Millionaire Housewives of ISIS".


Now now pretend MR Rotschilds. You don't know what I am talking about in my op because you are not telling the truth. If you were a real wealthy person you would know exactly what I am talking about in the OP.

[MisterVeritis]

Now now pretend MR Rotschilds. You don't know what I am talking about in my op because you are not telling the truth. If you were a real wealthy person you would know exactly what I am talking about in the OP.
My worth is a bit less than two millions.

[MisterVeritis]

Now now pretend MR Rotschilds. You don't know what I am talking about in my op because you are not telling the truth. If you were a real wealthy person you would know exactly what I am talking about in the OP.
You err. Did I mention you sound like any other person who does not yet have wealth?

[Just AnotherPerson]

You err. Did I mention you sound like any other person who does not yet have wealth?

I have a different kind of wealth that is not measured by numbers. Any material thing that I do have I do not consider it to be wealth. None of this is ours. I just have only what I need to live in comfort and nothing more. Anything more is a waste. I measure wealth in health joy comfort and basic needs. Having been a person who almost died because of environmental pollution from the Hanford Nuclear facility, and then almost died from the pharmaceutical company whos kill pill I took to try to help cure what Hanford did. I know now for sure 100% that life itself is the most important thing in life. Without life nothing else matters. Without life you cant have any thing. Life is the greatest gift of all. It is enough alone for anyone to find true happiness.

I also measure real happiness in having those I love. It is a real gift beyond measure. I am aware with my whole being that any day could be our last. I appreciate every breath and every moment with all of my heart. I don't take one second for granted. We do not know if we will be here tomorrow or in the next second anything can happen, all we can do is appreciate life to its fullest.

You can measure your wealth how you choose. But you do not have the right to treat others as though they are worthless because they have less things than you or less fake numbers in a digital cloud than you. You are one solar flare away from not even having zero's in your account, better get some of that in assets or gold. But You are going to have to come up with one hell of a magic spell if you want to take that with you when you cross over.

[Dr. Who]

You err. Did I mention you sound like any other person who does not yet have wealth?

Oh good heavens MV, the economy could totally collapse and your investments could end up being worthless. Then what? If everything that you have is the only thing that defines you, if you end up with nothing, you are lost.

[donttread]

Ultimately, it is measured in dollars.

Dollars are means to an ends, not a idol to be worshiped.

[jimmyz]

Here is a quote not taken out of context, "
Mr V I know exactly what it is like to have millions and millions of dollars. I do not have to have it to know what it is like."

That clarifies it a bit more don't you think?



Yep. I see your point. I dont know haw you could know how it feels but ok

[Just AnotherPerson]

Yep. I see your point. I dont know haw you could know how it feels but ok

Well I already told MR V in another thread that I have had the strange luck to be involved in peoples lives who were millionaires from small time millionaires to mega millionaires. I cant really say anything about it though. But didn't think it's necessary. But I do have first hand knowledge. I will say some of them are relatives. The others were through work. I really didn't want to share that information but I don't want to seem un-genuine. But I was at times involved in their lives and got to see what things were really like. It's nothing to admire.

At least that is how I see it. I am sure there are others who would disagree with me. I know lots of people who would rather be rich and miserable than to be poor. But I have found a real treasure in just being alive.

But I really did like your comment that you said here. I feel the same way. You said it well.

[Just AnotherPerson]

I don’t know. I get your point but I had less stress in my life when I had nothing. When we got married and moved into the ghetto, we bought the cheapest everything. We were proud to just have something/ anything. Now, she stresses over all the selections. Then, it was easier — cheapest.

This is exactly right. I used to be in a small apartment when I was younger dirt poor. I had such big wishes. I thought if I could just have a house even a small one with a little piece of land I would be so happy. I didn't realize that back then, I had it all. Later in life when I had a bit more, life was more stressful and more serious. I was in my large house with a yard, and was just looking back admiring the better times when I had what I considered to be nothing. If I had only knew back then that I had it all. I wouldn't have wasted all those dollars on the lotto, and wasted all that time wishing. How silly that was. Back then I was younger had better health, I should have appreciated it better. But I appreciate it all now. Maybe it is a stage we have to go through in order to understand it who knows.

Like when you are really young the older people say wow if only I had that kind of energy, and as a youngster you cant even understand what they mean by that, till you get old. When you are young you just live your life and don't even think about what it is to be young and healthy. But as you get older then you finally realize what you had at the younger age. But while you have it you just live it I guess.

[roadmaster]

Coming from a small farm we were taught the difference between wants and needs and I guess that is why I have never been materialistic. At my age yes I do own two homes and no mortgage anymore, no credit card debt, no vehicle payments. Just regular bills, taxes ect. I am not rich but I do have things to hand down when I die to my kids. We worked hard and it feels good not to owe a bank for anything. I have seen many poor and medium people happy and content with what they have. I have known a lot of rich people who were not.

[donttread]

I don’t know. I get your point but I had less stress in my life when I had nothing. When we got married and moved into the ghetto, we bought the cheapest everything. We were proud to just have something/ anything. Now, she stresses over all the selections. Then, it was easier — cheapest.

Same here. Part of it no doubt had to do with being young, having a young wife ready to help me "de-stress" more often young kids to raise , play with and love. and in finacial terms having nothing meant nothing to worry about losing. I also knew there was a future where we would have something .
But I often miss those days. Grocery shopping on a weekly budget, telling the landlord we'd be a day or two late with the rent and all.

[DGUtley]

Same here. Part of it no doubt had to do with being young, having a young wife ready to help me "de-stress" more often young kids to raise , play with and love. and in finacial terms having nothing meant nothing to worry about losing. I also knew there was a future where we would have something .
But I often miss those days. Grocery shopping on a weekly budget, telling the landlord we'd be a day or two late with the rent and all.

Oh yes, I agree. When I got out of law school up to debt to my ears, we bought a house in the inner city of Cleveland. We paid $16,000 but I was paying nearly $700 in law school loans per month. We went to buy a stove, a washer and dryer -- to the scratch and dent corner at Handy Andy. Everything we bought was beat to Pelosi. We were so happy just to have that stuff. The stove slid between cabinets so it didn't show in the kitchen, the washer and dryer went in the basement. Our very first microwave -- the old man I worked for walked in one day and gave us $500 cash OMG WE WERE THRILLED. We bought a microwave, one of those new-fangled things.

Happy times.

[MisterVeritis]

I have a different kind of wealth that is not measured by numbers. Any material thing that I do have I do not consider it to be wealth. None of this is ours. I just have only what I need to live in comfort and nothing more. Anything more is a waste. I measure wealth in health joy comfort and basic needs. Having been a person who almost died because of environmental pollution from the Hanford Nuclear facility, and then almost died from the pharmaceutical company whos kill pill I took to try to help cure what Hanford did. I know now for sure 100% that life itself is the most important thing in life. Without life nothing else matters. Without life you cant have any thing. Life is the greatest gift of all. It is enough alone for anyone to find true happiness.

I also measure real happiness in having those I love. It is a real gift beyond measure. I am aware with my whole being that any day could be our last. I appreciate every breath and every moment with all of my heart. I don't take one second for granted. We do not know if we will be here tomorrow or in the next second anything can happen, all we can do is appreciate life to its fullest.

You can measure your wealth how you choose. But you do not have the right to treat others as though they are worthless because they have less things than you or less fake numbers in a digital cloud than you. You are one solar flare away from not even having zero's in your account, better get some of that in assets or gold. But You are going to have to come up with one hell of a magic spell if you want to take that with you when you cross over.
You chose to engage by pretending to have insights into the happiness or unhappiness of those who have more than you. Now that it is clear you don't know what you are talking about you have changed the nature of the subject.

You might just as effectively said that happy people are happier than unhappy people.

[MisterVeritis]

Oh good heavens MV, the economy could totally collapse and your investments could end up being worthless. Then what? If everything that you have is the only thing that defines you, if you end up with nothing, you are lost.
And the sun could explode tomorrow.

I enjoy what-if games. But they are for children more than for adults.

[MisterVeritis]

Dollars are means to an ends, not a idol to be worshiped.
You are complaining about a means of measurement.

This fascinates me. What measure would you use?

[MisterVeritis]

This is exactly right. I used to be in a small apartment when I was younger dirt poor. I had such big wishes. I thought if I could just have a house even a small one with a little piece of land I would be so happy. I didn't realize that back then, I had it all. Later in life when I had a bit more, life was more stressful and more serious. I was in my large house with a yard, and was just looking back admiring the better times when I had what I considered to be nothing. If I had only knew back then that I had it all. I wouldn't have wasted all those dollars on the lotto, and wasted all that time wishing. How silly that was. Back then I was younger had better health, I should have appreciated it better. But I appreciate it all now. Maybe it is a stage we have to go through in order to understand it who knows.

Like when you are really young the older people say wow if only I had that kind of energy, and as a youngster you cant even understand what they mean by that, till you get old. When you are young you just live your life and don't even think about what it is to be young and healthy. But as you get older then you finally realize what you had at the younger age. But while you have it you just live it I guess.
Do you believe the life of someone who is poor is more stressful or less stressful than the life of someone who is wealthy?

Why work at all? If being poor is the road to happiness why not live on the streets begging for just enough to buy your next meal?

[MisterVeritis]

Oh yes, I agree. When I got out of law school up to debt to my ears, we bought a house in the inner city of Cleveland. We paid $16,000 but I was paying nearly $700 in law school loans per month. We went to buy a stove, a washer and dryer -- to the scratch and dent corner at Handy Andy. Everything we bought was beat to Pelosi. We were so happy just to have that stuff. The stove slid between cabinets so it didn't show in the kitchen, the washer and dryer went in the basement. Our very first microwave -- the old man I worked for walked in one day and gave us $500 cash OMG WE WERE THRILLED. We bought a microwave, one of those new-fangled things.

Happy times.
If you really believed your tale you know there is a way to return to those thrilling days of yesteryear. Stop doing the job you are paid to do. In a few months you will be unemployed. Become a bagger at a local grocery store. Then you can once again be happy as a poor person.

But you don't really believe your tale. It is a nice fiction based on nostalgia.

[DGUtley]

If you really believed your tale you know there is a way to return to those thrilling days of yesteryear. Stop doing the job you are paid to do. In a few months you will be unemployed. Become a bagger at a local grocery store. Then you can once again be happy as a poor person. But you don't really believe your tale. It is a nice fiction based on nostalgia.

That's not true, maybe. I think there's different kinds of happiness. In 1987 there was happiness in simple pleasures. I had a lot less stress, with a lot less issues. They were very happy times because our options were limited. Our friends were poor, we were poor and though we knew it, we really didn't know it. Now, I run my own law firm, have lots of employees, make whatever I make, have whatever I have, and remember fondly those days when I wasn't the decisionmaker. Maybe it is nostalgia as I age, but things were simpler when our choices were fewer and we were truly grateful for any little thing we got.

[MisterVeritis]

That's not true, maybe. I think there's different kinds of happiness. In 1987 there was happiness in simple pleasures. I had a lot less stress, with a lot less issues. They were very happy times because our options were limited. Our friends were poor, we were poor and though we knew it, we really didn't know it. Now, I run my own law firm, have lots of employees, make whatever I make, have whatever I have, and remember fondly those days when I wasn't the decisionmaker. Maybe it is nostalgia as I age, but things were simpler when our choices were fewer and we were truly grateful for any little thing we got.
LOL. Pure malarky. Nostalgia.

Tell me you never got a rush from being the decision maker.

[DGUtley]

LOL. Pure malarky. Nostalgia.
Tell me you never got a rush from being the decision maker.

Not from running the firm.
I get a rush from making decisions on cases and they come out right. (They don't always)

[MisterVeritis]

Not from running the firm.
I get a rush from making decisions on cases and they come out right. (They don't always)
You could sell your firm to someone else and simply be another lawyer.

[DGUtley]

You could sell your firm to someone else and simply be another lawyer.

Oh how I wish I could. Clients hire lawyers not firms. Without me, my book of business is of no value to my firm -- until I get the two newbies up and comfortable with the clients.

[Captdon]

Here is a quote not taken out of context, "
Mr V I know exactly what it is like to have millions and millions of dollars. I do not have to have it to know what it is like."

That clarifies it a bit more don't you think?




Yea. You do have to have it to know though.

[Captdon]

Oh good heavens MV, the economy could totally collapse and your investments could end up being worthless. Then what? If everything that you have is the only thing that defines you, if you end up with nothing, you are lost.

Everything I am I would still be if I was poor. I still see no reason to be poor and I never did. I'm not poor because I chose not to be.

[Captdon]

Well I already told MR V in another thread that I have had the strange luck to be involved in peoples lives who were millionaires from small time millionaires to mega millionaires. I cant really say anything about it though. But didn't think it's necessary. But I do have first hand knowledge. I will say some of them are relatives. The others were through work. I really didn't want to share that information but I don't want to seem un-genuine. But I was at times involved in their lives and got to see what things were really like. It's nothing to admire.

At least that is how I see it. I am sure there are others who would disagree with me. I know lots of people who would rather be rich and miserable than to be poor. But I have found a real treasure in just being alive.

But I really did like your comment that you said here. I feel the same way. You said it well.

If you don't admire them when they're rich what would you admire in them if they were poor?

[Captdon]

This is exactly right. I used to be in a small apartment when I was younger dirt poor. I had such big wishes. I thought if I could just have a house even a small one with a little piece of land I would be so happy. I didn't realize that back then, I had it all. Later in life when I had a bit more, life was more stressful and more serious. I was in my large house with a yard, and was just looking back admiring the better times when I had what I considered to be nothing. If I had only knew back then that I had it all. I wouldn't have wasted all those dollars on the lotto, and wasted all that time wishing. How silly that was. Back then I was younger had better health, I should have appreciated it better. But I appreciate it all now. Maybe it is a stage we have to go through in order to understand it who knows.

Like when you are really young the older people say wow if only I had that kind of energy, and as a youngster you cant even understand what they mean by that, till you get old. When you are young you just live your life and don't even think about what it is to be young and healthy. But as you get older then you finally realize what you had at the younger age. But while you have it you just live it I guess.

Living some sort of well off isn't by buying lottery tickets and wishes. It's work, plain and simple.

[Orion Rules]

Posted by MisterVeritis:

LOL. Pure malarky. Nostalgia.
Tell me you never got a rush from being the decision maker.


Not from running the firm.
I get a rush from making decisions on cases and they come out right. (They don't always)

You're interesting. You run a law firm and you get a rush from making decisions on cases that come out right. But then they always don't. So, if a client loses their money for the investment made, if that is the case, are they given a discount? As/or, who will/gets to bear the guilt?

[The Xl]

You need enough to be comfortable and to take care of yourself and your loved ones. Outside of that it's not going to improve your mental health and happiness any further.

[Captdon]

You need enough to be comfortable and to take care of yourself and your loved ones. Outside of that it's not going to improve your mental health and happiness any further.

I don't know that and you don't either.

[The Xl]

I don't know that and you don't either.

I know some pretty wealthy people who have problems that their money doesn't help.

[DGUtley]

You're interesting. You run a law firm and you get a rush from making decisions on cases that come out right. But then they always don't. So, if a client loses their money for the investment made, if that is the case, are they given a discount? As/or, who will/gets to bear the guilt?

Imagine this -- you work for three years on a case. The demands $240,000,000. Your client offers $1,300,000. The other side turns it down. You bunker down, map out a strategy. The other side are hot shot lawyers from DC. Wouldn't wipe you off their shoes b/c you're not good enough. You map it out. You start trying the lawsuit. Things are going well. You make decisions. Lots of them. The case takes 8 days to try. These hot shot lawyers treat you and your client like you are the scum of the earth. It's what the elites do. Things are going well, but you never know. I ask the jury after 8 days to give them $5,000. They ask for $350,000,000. After 20 minutes, the jury comes back. We're standing in the courtroom. These cocky lawyers from DC are so smug, arrogant. My heart is pounding out of my chest. Pound. Pound. Pound. My client's business is on the line. The jury gives them $0.00. You don't think I got a thrill from that? At dinner that night, though, the client representative came over to our table in front of my then teen daughters and gushed at how "great" (his words) a lawyer I was.

I bear the second-guessing and guilt when my decisions don't come out right. I wear them for months, agonize over them. Decisions that go bad gnaw at you for months. Sometimes, it's the right decision that doesn't pan out, sometimes, it's the wrong decision. Discount when I lose?, of course they do. Thanks for finding me interesting, though.

[MisterVeritis]

You need enough to be comfortable and to take care of yourself and your loved ones. Outside of that it's not going to improve your mental health and happiness any further.
I will be comfortable when I have 50 million dollars worth of investments.

[Captdon]

I know some pretty wealthy people who have problems that their money doesn't help.

Some? That's makes you right? I love how knowing a couple of anything makes people like you an expert.

Whatever problems they have that money doesn't help, being poor wouldn't help either.

[jimmyz]

I will be comfortable when I have 50 million dollars worth of investments.

It only takes a Velcro hug from my grandson to make me comfortable. The 50 million would be a great bonus though.

[The Xl]

I will be comfortable when I have 50 million dollars worth of investments.
Whatever makes you happy is what you should aim for.

[The Xl]

Some? That's makes you right? I love how knowing a couple of anything makes people like you an expert.

Whatever problems they have that money doesn't help, being poor wouldn't help either.
And what makes you an expert?

Obviously being poor doesn't help, and being poor can bring about many problems. Which is why I said making enough to be comfortable should make one happy.

[DGUtley]

Springsteen: Poor man wanna be rich, rich man wanna be king and a King ain't satisfied til he rules everything...

[Captdon]

And what makes you an expert?

Obviously being poor doesn't help, and being poor can bring about many problems. Which is why I said making enough to be comfortable should make one happy.

You knowing a couple of wealthy, unhappy people doesn't make you an expert. If you settled for less you are either lazy or stupid. That's common sense.

You can't define comfortable for anyone but you.

[donttread]

Springsteen: Poor man wanna be rich, rich man wanna be king and a King ain't satisfied til he rules everything...

Survival instinct run amuck

[donttread]

You knowing a couple of wealthy, unhappy people doesn't make you an expert. If you settled for less you are either lazy or stupid. That's common sense.<br>
<br>
<br>
You can't define comfortable for anyone but you.<br><br><br><br>




Half of the rich entertainment industry is unhappy.

[Captdon]

<br><br><br><br>




Half of the rich entertainment industry is unhappy.

How do you know that?

[Orion Rules]

Imagine this -- you work for three years on a case. The demands $240,000,000. Your client offers $1,300,000. The other side turns it down. You bunker down, map out a strategy. The other side are hot shot lawyers from DC. Wouldn't wipe you off their shoes b/c you're not good enough. You map it out. You start trying the lawsuit. Things are going well. You make decisions. Lots of them. The case takes 8 days to try. These hot shot lawyers treat you and your client like you are the scum of the earth. It's what the elites do. Things are going well, but you never know. I ask the jury after 8 days to give them $5,000. They ask for $350,000,000. After 20 minutes, the jury comes back. We're standing in the courtroom. These $#@!y lawyers from DC are so smug, arrogant. My heart is pounding out of my chest. Pound. Pound. Pound. My client's business is on the line. The jury gives them $0.00. You don't think I got a thrill from that? At dinner that night, though, the client representative came over to our table in front of my then teen daughters and gushed at how "great" (his words) a lawyer I was.

I bear the second-guessing and guilt when my decisions don't come out right. I wear them for months, agonize over them. Decisions that go bad gnaw at you for months. Sometimes, it's the right decision that doesn't pan out, sometimes, it's the wrong decision. Discount when I lose?, of course they do. Thanks for finding me interesting, though.

Thank you for the reply. It makes perfect sense of how things have been that way. You're just one person that gets called in with your firm to try something. So now you know more about the system. But also remember there will be a day of avenging.

[donttread]

How do you know that?


Drugs, OD's, divorce rates, suicides. Little things like that. Money does not buy happiness

[MisterVeritis]

Drugs, OD's, divorce rates, suicides. Little things like that. Money does not buy happiness
Who has made the claim that money buys happiness? Where is happiness for sale?

Having money makes just about everything easier. Given your lifetime experiences please do continue to believe wealthy people are unhappy people.

[Orion Rules]

I will be comfortable when I have 50 million dollars worth of investments.

You will never be comfortable no matter how much you have, no matter what the circumstances are. It will not matter how much more you have when you already have it. It will not matter one bit, save for what power you believe you may derive from having more. But what matter have you much matter to comforts but never can be you. So that's it. And guess who is the same one who shared just some of that?

You can't enjoy your life now so you must go well out of your way bullying on others, just as you have in this same forum, where it just appears you must be trying to be higher than even the U.S. President. Don't think that gets past. 'Oh, it is not!' Ya, it sure is. Always after something else, that's you, never happy or comfortable enough with what you have. So, that is just the way it is. If you had more, you would feel more comfortless. Have to worry about who else wants it. You think not.

At least a few times seti explained what way too much wealth does to people, and what it does to persons not needing it all! Go ask him, big shot. Sure you know him. He is part of Salem's lot.

[donttread]

You chose to engage by pretending to have insights into the happiness or unhappiness of those who have more than you. Now that it is clear you don't know what you are talking about you have changed the nature of the subject.

You might just as effectively said that happy people are happier than unhappy people.


To what degree do you tie your income and assets to happiness? Your post seldom reflect happiness

[donttread]

Who has made the claim that money buys happiness? Where is happiness for sale?

Having money makes just about everything easier. Given your lifetime experiences please do continue to believe wealthy people are unhappy people.


Rock and Roll Heaven has a hell of a band! If money made everything easier the rich and famous would have less of the ills that befall the middle class and that does not appear to be the case. I will say as Dugley mentioned that having enough to not have to constantly worry and to live in safe neighborhoods, be able to support hobbies etc. does help. But that's because money provides an ends to a means. Those who make money a goal unto itself have missed the mark of life.
Were you ever poor when you were young? Paycheck to paycheck, shopping meal by meal as you went through the grocery store aisle? Those were some of the best times of my life I was young with a young wife, small children and a future. I wouldn't want to be that poor at my age but I'm not. I have enough for all my needs and most of my wants and make good money after paying my dues for years.. But I have never once had to brag about my "net worth" on a forum. The term really should be "net financial worth" anyway.

[MisterVeritis]

I will be comfortable when I have 50 million dollars worth of investments.

You will never be comfortable no matter how much you have, no matter what the circumstances are.
We all make our decisions on how far we are willing to go. For me, comfort sits at 50 million dollars.


It will not matter how much more you have when you already have it. It will not matter one bit, save for what power you believe you may derive from having more. But what matter have you much matter to comforts but never can be you. So that's it. And guess who is the same one who shared just some of that?
We all make our decisions on how far we are willing to go. I am pretty happy moment by moment. The fifty million dollar goal does keep me writing. For example, I am planning my first work of fiction. This morning I developed the biographical sketch for the protagonist of the story. Later today and into tomorrow I will do the same for the three antagonists. Then I will begin to establish the storyline, its major segments, and turning points. I will begin to flesh out the places where the story takes place. Then I will begin to write. In a month I will be done. My editor will have it for a week. Then I will spend a week rewriting it. While working through just these pieces I started to see the second story in the series.

You can't enjoy your life now so you must go well out of your way bullying on others, just as you have in this same forum, where it just appears you must be trying to be higher than even the U.S. President.
I suppose you mean I don't put up with the nonsense. Everyone is welcome to respond and counter-argue. Few do.

[MisterVeritis]

To what degree do you tie your income and assets to happiness? Your post seldom reflect happiness
Wealth makes everything easier. I am generally happy because I am generally happy. For me, this is a contest. It is combat. I come here because I enjoy it.

[MisterVeritis]

Rock and Roll Heaven has a hell of a band! If money made everything easier the rich and famous would have less of the ills that befall the middle class and that does not appear to be the case. I will say as Dugley mentioned that having enough to not have to constantly worry and to live in safe neighborhoods, be able to support hobbies etc. does help. But that's because money provides an ends to a means. Those who make money a goal unto itself have missed the mark of life.
Were you ever poor when you were young? Paycheck to paycheck, shopping meal by meal as you went through the grocery store aisle? Those were some of the best times of my life I was young with a young wife, small children and a future. I wouldn't want to be that poor at my age but I'm not. I have enough for all my needs and most of my wants and make good money after paying my dues for years.. But I have never once had to brag about my "net worth" on a forum. The term really should be "net financial worth" anyway.
Was I poor? Yes. Only I didn't know it. My father was a sergeant in the Army. Six children. We ate lots of hot dogs and bologna.

Nostalgia covers a multitude of problems. It is remarkably easy for any of us to look back and remember only the best parts of an experience long past. But it is not real. You were not happy because you were stupidly poor. You were happy because you were in love.

If you feel no compulsion to brag about your net worth perhaps you have little to brag about. You do not write as someone who has wealth writes. It is a dead giveaway.

[Captdon]

Drugs, OD's, divorce rates, suicides. Little things like that. Money does not buy happiness

Only in Hollywood?

No one said money buys happiness.

[Captdon]

Was I poor? Yes. Only I didn't know it. My father was a sergeant in the Army. Six children. We ate lots of hot dogs and bologna.

Nostalgia covers a multitude of problems. It is remarkably easy for any of us to look back and remember only the best parts of an experience long past. But it is not real. You were not happy because you were stupidly poor. You were happy because you were in love.

If you feel no compulsion to brag about your net worth perhaps you have little to brag about. You do not write as someone who has wealth writes. It is a dead giveaway.

I'm an Army Brat as well. I still don't see any need to go into detail about what I have. I have more than some and less than some. I feel no need to talk about what I have because who cares? I don't care what you have ; I only care about what I have. How does what you have mean to me? I can't use your money.

Having said that I still say having a bit of money beats being poor four ways to Sunday.

I have never been poor but i have lived paycheck to paycheck. It was no joy in that and I don't see how there could be. I got to where i could pay everything easily and give my wife all the money she needed at the first of the month.

I know pay everything at the first of the month and have put a little more away each month. My wife takes a larger amount for her household and saves half of it.

I no longer have to try to find a way to get something fixed or done.

Yea, I'm happier now than 50 years ago. No, I don't want to go back.

[MisterVeritis]

I'm an Army Brat as well. I still don't see any need to go into detail about what I have. I have more than some and less than some. I feel no need to talk about what I have because who cares? I don't care what you have ; I only care about what I have. How does what you have mean to me? I can't use your money.
Having said that I still say having a bit of money beats being poor four ways to Sunday.
I have never been poor but i have lived paycheck to paycheck. It was no joy in that and I don't see how there could be. I got to where i could pay everything easily and give my wife all the money she needed at the first of the month.

I know pay everything at the first of the month and have put a little more away each month. My wife takes a larger amount for her household and saves half of it.
I no longer have to try to find a way to get something fixed or done.
Yea, I'm happier now than 50 years ago. No, I don't want to go back.
So there you go.

[Orion Rules]

Posted by donttread:
Rock and Roll Heaven has a hell of a band! If money made everything easier the rich and famous would have less of the ills that befall the middle class and that does not appear to be the case. I will say as Dugley mentioned that having enough to not have to constantly worry and to live in safe neighborhoods, be able to support hobbies etc. does help. But that's because money provides an ends to a means. Those who make money a goal unto itself have missed the mark of life.
Were you ever poor when you were young? Paycheck to paycheck, shopping meal by meal as you went through the grocery store aisle? Those were some of the best times of my life I was young with a young wife, small children and a future. I wouldn't want to be that poor at my age but I'm not. I have enough for all my needs and most of my wants and make good money after paying my dues for years.. But I have never once had to brag about my "net worth" on a forum. The term really should be "net financial worth" anyway.


Was I poor? Yes. Only I didn't know it...

[...]

If you feel no compulsion to brag about your net worth perhaps you have little to brag about. You do not write as someone who has wealth writes. It is a dead giveaway.

Bet you he is, but you don't know why. You need to show more respect, sly.

[Orion Rules]

So there you go.Ya, you should become a poet. Edgar Allan Poe.

[MisterVeritis]

Bet you he is, but you don't know why. You need to show more respect, sly.
I love your wholly disconnected stream of consciousness texts.

[Peter1469]

As an aside, a lot of the poor in New Orleans have it really good. They live in old shot-gun style houses that were paid off generations ago. So their bills don't include a mortgage. I lived in many parts of the city in college and law school. The majority of the people in those rougher neighborhoods were good people. And they didn't like the hood-rats any more than I did.

[CCitizen]

Scandinavia has done a good job of relieving millionaires, decamillionaires, hectamillionaires, and billionaires of some of their wealth through high taxes. The state has a right to impose taxes, and a duty to help citizens who can not earn for themselves.

[MisterVeritis]

Scandinavia has done a good job of relieving millionaires, decamillionaires, hectamillionaires, and billionaires of some of their wealth through high taxes. The state has a right to impose taxes, and a duty to help citizens who can not earn for themselves.
Every garden variety Marxist writes as you do.

[DGUtley]

Scandinavia has done a good job of relieving millionaires, decamillionaires, hectamillionaires, and billionaires of some of their wealth through high taxes. The state has a right to impose taxes, and a duty to help citizens who can not earn for themselves.

I am in the minority here, but I agree that we have a moral obligation to care for those that cannot take care of themselves. What about those that will not earn for themselves? Does the state have a duty to not help those that will not earn for themselves?

[MisterVeritis]

I am in the minority here, but I agree that we have a moral obligation to care for those that cannot take care of themselves. What about those that will not earn for themselves? Does the state have a duty to not help those that will not earn for themselves?
Moral obligations are not handled through government. Moral obligations are handled individually or through religious institutions. Governments do not know how to handle "moral" obligations.

[CCitizen]

I am in the minority here, but I agree that we have a moral obligation to care for those that cannot take care of themselves. What about those that will not earn for themselves? Does the state have a duty to not help those that will not earn for themselves?

In my opinion, the vast majority of people who will not take care of themselves in reality can not take care of themselves.

[CCitizen]

Governments do not know how to handle "moral" obligations.
Every law is based on morality -- thus ever law legislates morality.

[MisterVeritis]

In my opinion, the vast majority of people who will not take care of themselves in reality can not take care of themselves.

You err.
Let them go hungry.

[MisterVeritis]

Every law is based on morality -- thus ever law legislates morality.
This is untrue on its face.

[DGUtley]

In my opinion, the vast majority of people who will not take care of themselves in reality can not take care of themselves.

So, I'm not sure what your answer is: you do or don't believe that the state has no duty to take care of people that will not take care of themselves?

[CCitizen]

You err.
Let them go hungry.

Theoretically, a Moderately Disabled person can work, but it is an order of magnitude harder for them then for an able person. Their chances of failing are much higher.

[CCitizen]

So, I'm not sure what your answer is: you do or don't believe that the state has no duty to take care of people that will not take care of themselves?
I am not sure there are such people. People who seem to be lazy are frequently depressed.

[MisterVeritis]

Theoretically, a Moderately Disabled person can work, but it is an order of magnitude harder for them then for an able person. Their chances of failing are much higher.
Do. Or do not.

Do not expect me to make up your shortfall in effort or desire.

People who believe as you do are common criminals. Your weapon is the State who is happy to oblige your thefts.

[DGUtley]

I am not sure there are such people. People who seem to be lazy are frequently depressed.

Well, I hate to burst your bubble: There are such people. People that just want to mooch off the system. In 31 years of practicing law, I have met thousands.

You believe that "depression" is a justification for being supported by the government?
Have you ever heard of the saying: Suck it up buttercup?
Have you ever heard that there's nothing that kills the blues like a hard day's work?

[CCitizen]

People who believe as you do are common criminals. Your weapon is the State who is happy to oblige your thefts.
Fortunately, I, personally have material support.

But millions of people have to sell drugs to survive.

[roadmaster]

It's simple a man who can work and refuses to work shouldn't eat. That is Biblical.

[DGUtley]

Fortunately, I, personally have material support. But millions of people have to sell drugs to survive.

I don't know what "material support" means. I say that "I, personally have earnings and savings"

[CCitizen]

Well, I hate to burst your bubble: There are such people. People that just want to mooch off the system. In 31 years of practicing law, I have met thousands.

Thank you for sharing. I have 26 years of being an outpatient -- being prescribed antidepressants.

[MisterVeritis]

Theoretically, a Moderately Disabled person can work, but it is an order of magnitude harder for them then for an able person. Their chances of failing are much higher.
Any moderately disabled person is also moderately able.

Get off your fat ass and figure out life for yourself.

[MisterVeritis]

Thank you for sharing. I have 26 years of being an outpatient -- being prescribed antidepressants.
You have sponged enough. Get to fucking work. Support yourself.

[CCitizen]

Any moderately disabled person is also moderately able.

Which makes competing with fully able people beyond difficult.

[MisterVeritis]

Fortunately, I, personally have material support.

But millions of people have to sell drugs to survive.
People like you are criminals.

[MisterVeritis]

Which makes competing with fully able people beyond difficult.
Did you think life was easy?

Buffoons. Criminals. And sponges.

[CCitizen]

Millions upon millions of people in USA alone are forced to sell drugs in order to survive. Fortunately, I do have support. But millions do not.

[MisterVeritis]

Millions upon millions of people in USA alone are forced to sell drugs in order to survive. Fortunately, I do have support. But millions do not.
Uh-huh. Criminals.

[DGUtley]

Fortunately, I, personally have material support. But millions of people have to sell drugs to survive.


Millions upon millions of people in USA alone are forced to sell drugs in order to survive. Fortunately, I do have support. But millions do not.

That's b.s. Nobody was poorer than I was the way I was raised and I have sold the grand total of 0 drugs. We sucked it up, went without, lived poorly, went without some more and clawed our way out.

[MisterVeritis]

That's b.s. Nobody was poorer than I was the way I was raised and I have sold the grand total of 0 drugs. We sucked it up, went without, lived poorly, went without some more and clawed our way out.
...and in retrospect, were happier for it. We thrive when we must struggle and win.

[DGUtley]

...and in retrospect, were happier for it. We thrive when we must struggle and win.

Without a doubt.

[CCitizen]

That's b.s. Nobody was poorer than I was the way I was raised and I have sold the grand total of 0 drugs. We sucked it up, went without, lived poorly, went without some more and clawed our way out.

Perhaps you have outstanding willpower. But most people have average willpower.

Why does USA have the highest incarceration rate in the World? Why do nations like Canada and Scandinavia have lower crime rate despite having more humane justice system?

[jimmyz]

I'll tell you how poor is poor. When I was a kid, one of five, we ate ketchup and mustard sandwiches. Mom and Dad would never make them but us kids would when we were hungry between meals and the Cotto salami, Bologna and cheese ran out. I taught myself to sew to mend my socks and pants. My bikes were made of found parts. Etc, etc.

I would change nothing. I had a great childhood.

[DGUtley]

Perhaps you have outstanding willpower. But most people have average willpower.

I am average. Not rare. Typical. We were taught and raised to do for ourselves. We still do. You are selling yourself short.


Why does USA have the highest incarceration rate in the World? Why do nations like Canada and Scandinavia have lower crime rate despite having more humane justice system?

We have the highest incarceration rate in the world b/c we imprison more types of offenders, including non-violent and drug offenders and we keep them in prison longer. With the exception of homicide, the US crime rates are comparable to other European countries. High incarceration rates are the result of "truth in sentencing", "mandatory minimum" and "three strikes" laws which have limited judicial discretion in sentencing and parole release. As a result, sentences are now mainly determined by what the prosecutor decides to charge. And prosecutors routinely over-charge defendants in order to encourage plea agreements. We need sentencing reform in these areas but there doesn't seem to be the political will.

[Captdon]

Theoretically, a Moderately Disabled person can work, but it is an order of magnitude harder for them then for an able person. Their chances of failing are much higher.

Moderately disabled? How's this:

Born so crossed eyed that I was legally blind in one eye. Speaking of one, I have hearing in only one ear and partial hearing in the other. What order of magnitude would that be?

I chose to work around it and did.

[Peter1469]

Scandinavia has done a good job of relieving millionaires, decamillionaires, hectamillionaires, and billionaires of some of their wealth through high taxes. The state has a right to impose taxes, and a duty to help citizens who can not earn for themselves.

Why not encourage personal responsibility? And Scandinavian nations pulled themselves out of abject poverty and failure with free market capitalism. Not socialism.

[Peter1469]

In my opinion, the vast majority of people who will not take care of themselves in reality can not take care of themselves.

Don't hang out with losers.

Problem solved.

[Captdon]

I am not sure there are such people. People who seem to be lazy are frequently depressed.

Most poor people are lazy. Except for the mentally or physically disabled what excuse is there? Hard work will always get you away from being poor in this country.

[Peter1469]

Fortunately, I, personally have material support.

But millions of people have to sell drugs to survive.

No they don't.

[Captdon]

Which makes competing with fully able people beyond difficult.

Bullshit. I competed and beat whatever difficulty there was. Life isn't the same for everyone but moderate disability is just a damn excuse to not try if you don't want to work. I had to work a little harder and couldn't get a job or two but I hustled for work and chanced some money on job shops and did just fine.

[Captdon]

Perhaps you have outstanding willpower. But most people have average willpower.

Why does USA have the highest incarceration rate in the World? Why do nations like Canada and Scandinavia have lower crime rate despite having more humane justice system?

Off topic. But, since you ask, it's because we have more crooks.

[Mini Me]

You do not know what I have or do not have and I am not telling MR V.
Don't leave us, J.A.P.! You are an exemplary moral, ethical person, and I enjoy what you say. You give me hope for humanity!

[KathyS]

That's b.s. Nobody was poorer than I was the way I was raised and I have sold the grand total of 0 drugs. We sucked it up, went without, lived poorly, went without some more and clawed our way out.
Or in my case, worked up to 3 jobs at a time to get by.

[Peter1469]

Imagine this -- you work for three years on a case. The demands $240,000,000. Your client offers $1,300,000. The other side turns it down. You bunker down, map out a strategy. The other side are hot shot lawyers from DC. Wouldn't wipe you off their shoes b/c you're not good enough. You map it out. You start trying the lawsuit. Things are going well. You make decisions. Lots of them. The case takes 8 days to try. These hot shot lawyers treat you and your client like you are the scum of the earth. It's what the elites do. Things are going well, but you never know. I ask the jury after 8 days to give them $5,000. They ask for $350,000,000. After 20 minutes, the jury comes back. We're standing in the courtroom. These cocky lawyers from DC are so smug, arrogant. My heart is pounding out of my chest. Pound. Pound. Pound. My client's business is on the line. The jury gives them $0.00. You don't think I got a thrill from that? At dinner that night, though, the client representative came over to our table in front of my then teen daughters and gushed at how "great" (his words) a lawyer I was.

I bear the second-guessing and guilt when my decisions don't come out right. I wear them for months, agonize over them. Decisions that go bad gnaw at you for months. Sometimes, it's the right decision that doesn't pan out, sometimes, it's the wrong decision. Discount when I lose?, of course they do. Thanks for finding me interesting, though.

I do government contact stuff. I have often been in court with me against 4 or more of the hot shots you describe.

[donttread]

I am average. Not rare. Typical. We were taught and raised to do for ourselves. We still do. You are selling yourself short.



We have the highest incarceration rate in the world b/c we imprison more types of offenders, including non-violent and drug offenders and we keep them in prison longer. With the exception of homicide, the US crime rates are comparable to other European countries. High incarceration rates are the result of "truth in sentencing", "mandatory minimum" and "three strikes" laws which have limited judicial discretion in sentencing and parole release. As a result, sentences are now mainly determined by what the prosecutor decides to charge. And prosecutors routinely over-charge defendants in order to encourage plea agreements. We need sentencing reform in these areas but there doesn't seem to be the political will.

But the prison industrial complex grows government and employs people while in incarcerates people likely to raise the unemployment rate.
End prohibition and stop jailing people for consensual sex with people old enough to drive or within 2-3 years of their own age. Then maybe we can be the "Land of the free " again.

[MisterVeritis]

But the prison industrial complex grows government and employs people while in incarcerates people likely to raise the unemployment rate.
End prohibition and stop jailing people for consensual sex with people old enough to drive or within 2-3 years of their own age. Then maybe we can be the "Land of the free " again.
I strongly support our right to self-govern. What are you doing in your state to change laws so they are more to your liking?

[DGUtley]

I do government contact stuff. I have often been in court with me against 4 or more of the hot shots you describe.

I prepped this business defamation case for trial in January. It was the oldest case in my cabinet and had been up to the court of appeals. Another case where my opposition was hot shot attys from the east coast. My client was alleged to have defamed a business online. The demand was $45,000,000. I offered $100,000 but had $1,000,000 in my pocket. These guys wouldn't give me the time of day. Wouldn't call me back, wouldn't respond to emails etc. Just really treated me like the backward-ass country bumpkin that the east coast elites think we all are. So, I cleared December and January and tooled up. I developed a strategy of staying above the fray. The entire case, we'd argued about the tiniest little factual things. I expected them to come in and try to prove the tiniest of little details. My plan was to ignore all of it and stay way above the fray, almost belittling their attention to the crumbs. The insurer signed off on the strategy and we showed up at the courthouse. They walked in with their 2 video screens, projectors, 26 bankers boxes 4 lawyers (1 local) and I had myself a box of exhibits and my associate.

The judge in chambers asked where we were and I told him. He asked if we were ready to go and how long it'd take. They said that they'd take two weeks and they'd be six hours with their client the first day and expected that I'd be 3 hours with him. The judge looked at me and I said "Your honor, I'll be 10 minutes with him, he's a liar, I'll show he's a liar and I'll sit down". They turned white. The judge said let's go. We went in the courtroom and started picking a jury. As we were doing so, the older one said "Judge can we speak with Mr. Utley in the hallway". We broke and went out in the hallway. He said "My guy will take two". I said "I don't know what that means" "Two million" I said, cut the crap, we've started trial. He replied: "he'll take a million". (Remember, I had orders to pay a million if I got the chance) I said: "I can't pay a million, let me make a call". I called the client, offered $500,000 and they took $700,000.

We'd have paid $1.5 two years earlier if they'd only gotten reasonable. Hot shot lawyers out thinking themselves.

[Captdon]

But the prison industrial complex grows government and employs people while in incarcerates people likely to raise the unemployment rate.
End prohibition and stop jailing people for consensual sex with people old enough to drive or within 2-3 years of their own age. Then maybe we can be the "Land of the free " again.

We were having an adult discussion trying to help a lesser person learn the truth.

[Mini Me]

J.A.P. PM me! I tried to PM you, but it said you don't want it. We should keep in touch!I am also a fellow Downwinder.

[donttread]

I strongly support our right to self-govern. What are you doing in your state to change laws so they are more to your liking?

I am on the local "site plan approval board" and have joined some organizations mostly focused on 2nd Amendment protection and started a "Constitutional related FB page which I admittedly don't market " But I live in NYS where the ultra libs are in power simply by pandering to NYC. They have destroyed the Adirondack economy in the process.

[donttread]

We were having an adult discussion trying to help a lesser person learn the truth.



What? Who exactly is the "lesser person"? By who's definition? And how does the truth about our injustice system not qualify as adult?

[donttread]

Uh-huh. Criminals.


Mostly sick people, addicts. Forced to live in the shadows , steal, deal, strip, prostitute themselves because their drug of choice is unfairly and ineffectively illegal. While alcoholics and smokers are every bit as much addicts but they generally get to live longer, more normal lives which means more chances to recover.
Segrams helped put a political family in power, tobacco execs sat on school boards but other dealers even low level dealers trying to support their own habit go to jail.

[MisterVeritis]

I am on the local "site plan approval board" and have joined some organizations mostly focused on 2nd Amendment protection and started a "Constitutional related FB page which I admittedly don't market " But I live in NYS where the ultra libs are in power simply by pandering to NYC. They have destroyed the Adirondack economy in the process.
Cool. It is a very good start. Political power comes from banding together.

[donttread]

Cool. It is a very good start. Political power comes from banding together.


Without selling your soul in the process

[MisterVeritis]

Without selling your soul in the process
That is not a prerequisite.

[donttread]

That is not a prerequisite.

I agree. But I do think it's a prerequisite for the mainstream dem and repub parties.

[MisterVeritis]

I agree. But I do think it's a prerequisite for the mainstream dem and repub parties.
Explain. You confuse me. I am a simple man. In the past, you have routinely and bitterly complained that both parties have sold out. Now you claim not selling out is a prerequisite?

[Mini Me]

J.A.P. you still with us? I pM'ed you yesterday but it didn't go thru. Did it again today, did you get it?

[donttread]

Explain. You confuse me. I am a simple man. In the past, you have routinely and bitterly complained that both parties have sold out. Now you claim not selling out is a prerequisite?

No, I agreed that it is not a prerequisite .What I'm saying is that selling out is necessary to get anywhere nationally in the mainstream structures of the "two major gangs".
However the LP wing like Rand Paul, I see as having their integrity in tact, at least as national politicians go. The Greens probably do to and I think Sanders did to a large extent as well. Trump does not seem like a sell out his career has involved more soul buying.

[Orion Rules]

We were having an adult discussion trying to help a lesser person learn the truth.

So, who is supposed to be the greater person who learns the truth?

[silvereyes]

That's b.s. Nobody was poorer than I was the way I was raised and I have sold the grand total of 0 drugs. We sucked it up, went without, lived poorly, went without some more and clawed our way out.

Same here.

[silvereyes]

I'll tell you how poor is poor. When I was a kid, one of five, we ate ketchup and mustard sandwiches. Mom and Dad would never make them but us kids would when we were hungry between meals and the Cotto salami, Bologna and cheese ran out. I taught myself to sew to mend my socks and pants. My bikes were made of found parts. Etc, etc.

I would change nothing. I had a great childhood.

Did y'all eat butter and sugar sandwiches? We did. Yum! ;)

[DGUtley]

Did y'all eat butter and sugar sandwiches? We did. Yum! ;)

Yes we did!!!

[silvereyes]

Yes we did!!!

People don't understand til they try one. :)

[jimmyz]

Did y'all eat butter and sugar sandwiches? We did. Yum! ;)

I might have tried those but Mom was a margarine person and I couldn't stand its taste.

[jimmyz]

People don't understand til they try one. :)

I've heard that said of salt on watermelon. But I haven't been brave enough to ruin a good piece of watermelon for experimental purposes.

[silvereyes]

I've heard that said of salt on watermelon. But I haven't been brave enough to ruin a good piece of watermelon for experimental purposes.

Yep, folks do that here too.

[donttread]

We were having an adult discussion trying to help a lesser person learn the truth.


Wow. "Lesser person" . Holy shit . Social con much?

[Peter1469]

Did y'all eat butter and sugar sandwiches? We did. Yum! ;)
No grilled cheese (American cheese). But it has lots of butter on it. I still love them.

[zelmo1234]

We always thing that if we only had money we could do those things that we love on a regular basis, and that would make us happy, but what really makes those things enjoyable, is that they are special occasions and we can't do them all of the time.

The wealthy generally fall in to one of 3 catigories.

#1 Play Boy/Girly party people that have never had to work. these are some of the most unhappy and depressed people on the planit they turn to drugs and alcohol because their life has no meaning.

#2 the workaholic, they just keep working and expanding thier business and wealth. these people generally have builty there own life and they are in love with working and that makes their life have meaning. These people ten to have no time to have a life, but are themself fulfilled through their work, there kids are usaually type one.

#3 Those that work hard, play hard, have faith in a high power and are very generous with thier money giving liberally to the causes that they support. These are some of the happiest people that you will ever meet, and they are fulfilled because they love helping others. they generally have an overwhelming love for family.

[jimmyz]

We always thing that if we only had money we could do those things that we love on a regular basis, and that would make us happy, but what really makes those things enjoyable, is that they are special occasions and we can't do them all of the time.

The wealthy generally fall in to one of 3 catigories.

#1 Play Boy/Girly party people that have never had to work. these are some of the most unhappy and depressed people on the planit they turn to drugs and alcohol because their life has no meaning.

#2 the workaholic, they just keep working and expanding thier business and wealth. these people generally have builty there own life and they are in love with working and that makes their life have meaning. These people ten to have no time to have a life, but are themself fulfilled through their work, there kids are usaually type one.

#3 Those that work hard, play hard, have faith in a high power and are very generous with thier money giving liberally to the causes that they support. These are some of the happiest people that you will ever meet, and they are fulfilled because they love helping others. they generally have an overwhelming love for family.
Great points!

[Captdon]

I've heard that said of salt on watermelon. But I haven't been brave enough to ruin a good piece of watermelon for experimental purposes.

Salt on watermelon is the way to go.