New Segregation

[DGUtley]

I'm troubled by the segregation of schools however I'm willing to try it (or almost anything) to save these kids. I'm not an educator so if these professionals think it's a good idea to try the Africentric Schools to try to save these kids, let's try it. I think there's one in Columbus that's been very well received. Let's think outside the box to try to save these kids.

[Chris]

I'm troubled by the segregation of schools however I'm willing to try it (or almost anything) to save these kids. I'm not an educator so if these professionals think it's a good idea to try the Africentric Schools to try to save these kids, let's try it. I think there's one in Columbus that's been very well received. Let's think outside the box to try to save these kids.

I'm fine with it if it helps...and it applies to all so equality before the law is maintained.

[nathanbforrest45]

Toronto has a problem where black students were more likely to fail in every way; more likely to drop out, more like to be suspended/expelled, more likely to fail literacy tests, etc. I suppose it's not just Toronto, but more emphasized in Toronto because it is more diverse. As far as I understand, these Africentric schools do show results in terms of seeing students succeed more.

I still find it uncomfortable to think about. It might work, and those involved (students, parents) might be okay with it, but the principle makes me uncomfortable.

Wait wait wait. I thought Canada was the shining example of racial harmony. Just listen to some of the Canadian posters on this forum telling us red neck Americans how racist we are and how we should all be like the all loving and all inclusive Canadians.

[nathanbforrest45]

Just read a few articles to confirm that they are funded by the school board. There are also pilot programs in regular high schools aimed at black students to provide more education on issues not covered by the regular curriculum and for support so that they can succeed. Half of male black students are behind in some way by grade 10, according to one article. Grade 10 is when we take a literacy test, which may be part of it.

A surprising amount of people fail that test, though - for stupid reasons, too. If you don't stay within the boxes for text or you write your name in the wrong spot, or your writing is not legible enough... the points add up. Most of my class passed it the first go round and the people who failed it were literate but apparently don't read instructions properly. You have to pass this test before you can graduate and they created programs for students who failed so that they could retake it later in the year. I knew of a few people who had to take it like 3 or 4 times and it was not because they couldn't read or write. It's kind of a wonky test.

Our mandatory testing in grades 6, 8 and 9 was similar (math and reading). You would get docked points for the stupidest crap so part of the instruction from teachers was how to properly stay within boxes for answers and stuff.

Yeah, its kind of like having to drive between the lines on the highway or else you can get a ticket. How wonky is that?

[Mister D]

Toronto has a problem where black students were more likely to fail in every way; more likely to drop out, more like to be suspended/expelled, more likely to fail literacy tests, etc. I suppose it's not just Toronto, but more emphasized in Toronto because it is more diverse. As far as I understand, these Africentric schools do show results in terms of seeing students succeed more.

I still find it uncomfortable to think about. It might work, and those involved (students, parents) might be okay with it, but the principle makes me uncomfortable.

Black students are more likely to fail virtually everywhere. That's hardly unique to Toronto regardless of how diverse it might be. Highly diverse cities like NYC, LA and so on have the exact same problem.

Segregation, at least in residential terms, is also the norm in both of our countries. As long as it's voluntary I have no problem with it.

[Mister D]

Wait wait wait. I thought Canada was the shining example of racial harmony. Just listen to some of the Canadian posters on this forum telling us red neck Americans how racist we are and how we should all be like the all loving and all inclusive Canadians.

Clustering (euphemism alert)! is just as prevalent in Canada as it is here.

[Adelaide]

Black students are more likely to fail virtually everywhere. That's hardly unique to Toronto regardless of how diverse it might be. Highly diverse cities like NYC, LA and so on have the exact same problem.

Segregation, at least in residential terms, is also the norm in both of our countries. As long as it's voluntary I have no problem with it.

It's going to be more pronounced in large cities because they tend to have more diversity than smaller towns. I think the statistic I read about Toronto was that 40% of black males (out of 30,000) dropped out. That is much higher than it would be for the city I hail from, which only has 400,000 people.

[Adelaide]

Wait wait wait. I thought Canada was the shining example of racial harmony. Just listen to some of the Canadian posters on this forum telling us red neck Americans how racist we are and how we should all be like the all loving and all inclusive Canadians.

Canada is diverse and most people are proud of our multiculturalism. The biggest issue for "racial harmony" is actually with aboriginal groups. I read a book a few years back that compared racism in the US, Canada, and Australia - both Australia and Canada demonstrate more racism towards aboriginal groups than any other group. Which... that's interesting since both countries put a lot of work into allowing various tribal communities to have as much autonomy as possible (lots of federal and provincial funding, aboriginal communal/courts, so forth). But they are the most discriminated against, and they experience all of the really bad things associated with low socioeconomic status like higher rates of teen pregnancy, higher rates of drug abuse, higher infant mortality rate, higher rates of maternal death, higher rates of diabetes and heart attacks, lower literacy rates, greater statistical chance of being convicted of a crime, and so forth. Generally, racism towards black Canadians is not very apparent, although I thought it was clever that the author called it "polite racism".

[Adelaide]

Yeah, its kind of like having to drive between the lines on the highway or else you can get a ticket. How wonky is that?

That's... fair enough, but it's a literacy test. If someone takes up more space with a response to a long written response question, what is the issue? Getting hit with deductions for technicalities is dumb for that sort of testing.

[Standing Wolf]

So segregation is okay if blacks want it but wrong when whites want it. Got it.

Apparently it goes something like that. But my point was more focused on the writer's references to "white" behavior and "black" behavior. I would be very interested in hearing his - or any other Black person's, really - explanation of what constitutes either one or both of those categories of behavior. He believes that black people need a place where they can feel free to be black; I'm just curious as to what that would mean to him....what he thinks behaving like a black person would look like. I won't even attempt to speculate, because it would be super easy to fall into stereotyping of a possibly racist nature. I have to wonder whether he walks around campus shaking his head in dismay when he sees another black student "acting white".