Oct 03, 1993

[Cletus]

Task Force Ranger engaged the Habr Gedr Clan and thousands of Somali militia in the Battle of the Olympic Hotel, which went into the books as the First Battle of Mogadishu.

Most sources estimate the enemy dead at between 800 and 1,000 with possibly as many as 1,500 to 3,000 wounded. TF Ranger suffered 16 KIA, 73 wounded, and 01 captured by the enemy. 10th Mountain Division suffered 2 KIA in the rescue attempt. 1 member of TF Ranger was killed 2 days later in a mortar attack after surviving the battle itself.

All mission objectives were accomplished, but US media and politicians painted the battle as a disaster. Shortly thereafter, President Clinton ordered the withdrawal of US Forces from Somalia.

[Peter1469]

The Somalis got their asses kicked pretty hard.

[Major Lambda]

Even with Task Force Ranger ; the large force being the US Army 75 Ranger Regiment and US Army Delta Force, US Forces was greatly outnumbered.

On top of command and control problems, US Forces committed to a large firefight in a enemy held and controlled area , without means of resupply. Simply put, US Forces were outnumbered in a firefight where they had no way of replenishing ammo.

To make matters worse, a Blackhawk helicopter was shot down. Now on top of a firefight, a rescue mission had to happen.

A firefight turned into a total cluster screw. So much for a perfect conflict legacy that President Clinton thought would go well. No perfect mission for the President to brag about. What most likely could have been a perfect covert snatch mission, turned out to be a embarrassing debacle for the White House. Low flying Blackhawks over a conflict zone, what was expected?. Not enough US manpower in a war zone - a civil war zone, where drug and gun lords run the show ; and control thousands upon thousands of armed militia / soldiers , soldiers well armed with rifles, belt fed / crew served weapons , rockets / RPGs. Soldiers / militia protecting drug and gun money. Soldiers / militia, who have unlimited resources of weapons.

It is a shame at the casualties of US Military personnel lost.

A hush / quiet / covert grab mission , that could have most likely been accomplished by Delta Force ; was a White House planned parade. Lives were gambled, and unnecessarily put in high risk.

No bragging rights for President Clinton after, matter of fact the incident was hush- hush for the longest. William Jefferson Clinton had Somalia ; Hillary had Benghazi. Hah , history repeats itself.

Thank you Bill Clinton.




M-L

[Major Lambda]

The Somalis got their asses kicked pretty hard.

As did US Forces. As did US Forces.

We lost way more than we should have. The idea of a conflict or war, is to make the enemy suffer human casualties ; and lost monies in replacing equipment , while US Forces remain unscathed.

Death and equipment loss has a certain amount of psychological effect. That derragatory effect, is supposed to be felt by the enemy, not US Forces.



M-L

[Major Lambda]

Task Force Ranger engaged the Habr Gedr Clan and thousands of Somali militia in the Battle of the Olympic Hotel, which went into the books as the First Battle of Mogadishu.

Most sources estimate the enemy dead at between 800 and 1,000 with possibly as many as 1,500 to 3,000 wounded. TF Ranger suffered 16 KIA, 73 wounded, and 01 captured by the enemy. 10th Mountain Division suffered 2 KIA in the rescue attempt. 1 member of TF Ranger was killed 2 days later in a mortar attack after surviving the battle itself.

All mission objectives were accomplished, but US media and politicians painted the battle as a disaster. Shortly thereafter, President Clinton ordered the withdrawal of US Forces from Somalia.

Point being is to never ever underestimate an enemy force.



M-L

[Cletus]

As did US Forces. As did US Forces.

We lost way more than we should have. The idea of a conflict or war, is to make the enemy suffer human casualties ; and lost monies in replacing equipment , while US Forces remain unscathed.

Death and equipment loss has a certain amount of psychological effect. That derragatory effect, is supposed to be felt by the enemy, not US Forces.



M-L

I am not even sure what any of that means. TF Ranger got stung a little, but they were certainly not beaten psychologically. They lost two out of 19 helicopters and a bunch of their wheeled vehicles were pretty shot up, but they only went in with 9 Humvees and 3 5 ton trucks. Most of them were still rolling. Most of their wounded were walking wounded and would have been back in the fight in a week if they had been allowed to. One company of Rangers (that is all there was), a Delta Squadron, a few SEALs and the aircrews from TF160.

There were only 160 men total involved in the operation. The ratio of enemy dead to US KIA was almost 50 to 1.

[Cletus]

Point being is to never ever underestimate an enemy force.

Garrison Garrison didn't underestimate the enemy. He had requested AC-130 and light armor support, but was turned down. That decision was made by Secretary of Defense Aspin, who was concerned about how it would look to the public to have Spectre raining Hell down on a populated area where the mission was ostensibly to provide humanitarian relief.

Garrison knew he was going into a $#@! storm. He just had to bank on getting in and out in 30 minutes, before the militias could mobilize. It didn't work out that way because some Somali got a lucky shot off with an RPG.

[Peter1469]

When I was a JAG I actually did some work for then LTC Steele (commander of the ranger company of Task Force ranger). I prosecuted 5 of his guys- I forgot why, I was not his trial counsel. His regular lawyer must not have been up to it.

He is a huge guy and his office was beyond Spartan. He was cool with me but I have no idea what his troops thought of him. I knew his trial counsel who deployed to Iraq with him. He got himself into hot water and was forced to resign. He was an impulsive and very aggressive commander- just the sort we need in war. It is a shame he was forced out by the pencil neck geeks at the Pentagon.

[Peter1469]

Garrison Garrison didn't underestimate the enemy. He had requested AC-130 and light armor support, but was turned down. That decision was made by Secretary of Defense Aspin, who was concerned about how it would look to the public to have Spectre raining Hell down on a populated area where the mission was ostensibly to provide humanitarian relief.

Garrison knew he was going into a $#@! storm. He just had to bank on getting in and out in 30 minutes, before the militias could mobilize. It didn't work out that way because some Somali got a lucky shot off with an RPG.

They should have gotten the AC 130 and armor.

[Major Lambda]

They should have gotten the AC 130 and armor.

Politics got good men killed.

But, you can't court martial a politician. Derelection of duty when a politician does it, is a foreign policy decision. Derelection of duty , committed by a GI ; is a court martial offense.

Ultimately, the White House is responsible. It was a Pentagon and SecDef goof, but the White House is responsible for those deaths. Needless deaths. Chain of Command failure, failure to support ground personnel. The Ground Commander , General Garrison ; should have got all he asked for to save lives, prevent tragedy , and senseless loss of American serviceman lives.

Hell no. Politics has a say so.




Major Lambda