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Thread: Did the United States "lose" the Vietnam War?

  1. #21
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    Lummy's Avatar Senior Member
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    Lost? Lost what, far-flung empire improbable to keep?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Captdon View Post
    We lost the Vietnam War:

    1. Our troops were not allowed to cross the DMZ

    2. Our troops were not allowed to close the Ho Chi Minh Trail.

    3.Our planes were not allowed to bomb the supply routes out of China.

    4. Our planes were not allowed to bomb the dikes.

    5. Our Navy wasn't allowed to close the Hai Phong port.

    6. LBJ would decide where we could bomb instead of the military.

    Strong enough? How do you think we could have won under those restrictions?
    The war was fought not by experienced military commanders but by pandering politicians who were afraid of their own shadows. We never should have become involved at all, we had nothing to gain from driving the Viet Cong and the North Vietnamese from the South. But, if you are going to risk people at least have the appearance of wanting to be victorious. The political leaders of this country were not so inclined.

    So, my contention was that we did not lose the war as much as we just virtue signaled with the lives of 55,000 Americans

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  4. #23
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    BTW, one of the reasons we did not bomb North Vietnamese harbors was because of the Russian ships in those ports. We did not want to risk bombing a Russian ship and bringing them directly into the war (although they had always been behind the scenes).

    We did do some naval bombardment up and down the cost north of the DMZ but it was mostly supply trails along the Ho Chi Minh trail.

    I do take exception to the claim we were not allowed to close the trail, we did bombard both the trail and along the DMZ. One day we sank over 300 Wiblicks (WBLC _ Water Borne Logistic Craft) trying to cross the DMZ into South Vietnam.

    I will admit this was done by naval bombardment and not by direct troop action which would have stopped more movement up and down the trail.
    Last edited by nathanbforrest45; 05-14-2019 at 09:45 AM.

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    Captdon's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by nathanbforrest45 View Post
    BTW, one of the reasons we did not bomb North Vietnamese harbors was because of the Russian ships in those ports. We did not want to risk bombing a Russian ship and bringing them directly into the war (although they had always been behind the scenes).

    We did do some naval bombardment up and down the cost north of the DMZ but it was mostly supply trails along the Ho Chi Minh trail.

    I do take exception to the claim we were not allowed to close the trail, we did bombard both the trail and along the DMZ. One day we sank over 300 Wiblicks (WBLC _ Water Borne Logistic Craft) trying to cross the DMZ into South Vietnam.

    I will admit this was done by naval bombardment and not by direct troop action which would have stopped more movement up and down the trail.
    Bombing the Trail stopped nothing. They were walking or cycling. They'd see the bombers and go a safe distance and go back. Nixon did close it for a while with troops but it was too late by then.

    Nixon did mine the harbor but, again, too late.
    Last edited by Captdon; 05-14-2019 at 09:56 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captdon View Post
    Bombing the Trail stopped nothing. They were walking or cycling. They'd see the bombers and go a safe distance and go back. Nixon did close it for a while with troops but it was too late by then.

    In true military parlance the entire war was just one big cluster$#@!.

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    Democrat LBJ's war (it was never Nixon's war except that Democrats took a great big, stinkin' $#@! on him and he drowned in it, just as they did with their deplorable lies and fake election results that got JFK "elected" when it was Nixon who would have won) was concocted in the mental hubris of a deplorable liar who faked the story about circumstances that got him the Silver Star in WW2 (a deplorable lie 100% democrat from political scheming to cover-up) that he proudly wore on his lapel during his entire career in congress.
    Last edited by Lummy; 05-14-2019 at 10:02 AM.

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    Another issue was we were supposed to win the hearts and minds of the people. If we didn't have that going in perhaps we were fighting for the wrong side!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lummy View Post
    Democrat LBJ's war (it was never Nixon's war except that Democrats took a great big, stinkin' $#@! on him and he drowned in it, just as they did with their deplorable lies and fake election results that got JFK "elected" when it was Nixon who would have won) was concocted in the mental hubris of a deplorable liar who faked the story about circumstances that got him the Silver Star, a deplorable lie 100% democrat from political scheming to cover-up) he proudly wore on his lapel during his entire career in congress.
    He also lied about the Tonkin Gulf affair, the lie that did escalate our involvement from "observers" to full out combatants.

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    I think it was Sun Tsu maybe who said that to win a war you have to be 100% truthful about it. Something like that.

    That we love to heed Asian advice is a big ol' clue, right there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nathanbforrest45 View Post
    In true military parlance the entire war was just one big cluster$#@!.
    No. It wasn't.
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