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Thread: Missouri Senate Passes Bill That Would Ban Abortions After 8 Weeks

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    Missouri Senate Passes Bill That Would Ban Abortions After 8 Weeks

    Not to detract from Alabama but Missouri Senate Passes Bill That Would Ban Abortions After 8 Weeks

    Missouri's Senate has passed a bill that would ban abortions at eight weeks of pregnancy or later, except in cases of medical emergency. There are no exceptions for rape or incest.

    It's the latest in a series of sweeping abortion restrictions passed by Republican-controlled state Legislatures aimed at pushing abortion challenges to the U.S. Supreme Court.

    The measure, which saw a series of changes before passage, will now return to the state House. If approved there, it would head to the desk of Republican Gov. Mike Parson.

    "Thanks to the leaders in the House and Senate, we have the opportunity to be one of the strongest pro-life states in the country," Parson said on Wednesday....

    This is why I say elsewhere the Supreme Court will make incremental changes to Roe and, hopefully, eventually, return the abortion question to the states.


    I will note that personally I think the medical exxceotion is good but there should be exceptions for rape and incest but 8 weeks might be enough time to deal with that.
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    Beat me to it.....and like with Alabama, the Rape and incest issues can be implemented by the state.
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    Incremental is neither good enough nor Constitutional.

    The Constitution is explicit that persons cannot be deprived of life without a trial based upon and indictment, etc, as due process.

    Murder Is never a medical choice.

    The only acceptable incremental ism would be for the court to acknowledge the authority of the Tenth Amendment and throw the matter back to states, where it should have stayed.

    And then the Fifth Amendment arguments could come up against NY and CA, etc.

    When you explain why a baby should be murdered because his mother was raped, be sure to address the following:

    Was the baby alive when the rape occured?

    If you incorrectly say yes, to what degree did the baby share the intent of the rapist?

    How are the courts to decide...not the doctor, an abortion is a criminal proceeding against a person who faces capital punishment...if the rape was in fact, rape? Address the Rodents' treatment of Juanita Broderick and other true victims of Rodents in your answer. But assume Bill Clinton was actually able to sire children, something not historically established.

    What is the panty for rape in this country? Are rapists routinely executed? If the Rapist has other children, are they executed for their father's crime? Why not? Do those children have more or less shared guilt for their father's crime than the child who did not exist when the father raped?

    Since it is manifestly unfair to the accused to be executed before the trial, what logic is there in executing a baby innocent of the crime charged to his father before it has been proven, by due process, that the father is guilty? Trials can take years, can't they? Look at Bill Cosby.

    Having trying to explain why "raoe" should be grounds for infanticide.

    If a woman charges rape, gets the baby murdered, and then the accused is acquitted, should not the woman who murdered the child under false pretenses spend an extended time in prison for both falsely accusing a man of a heinous crime, but also for murder? If not, why not. Emotion is not an answer.

    What if the DNA of the murdered baby does not match the DNA of the accused rapist? Since the murdered child was thus not the product of rape, should not the accusing and murdering female be put on trial, immediately?
    Last edited by Sergeant Gleed; 05-16-2019 at 03:24 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    I will note that personally I think the medical exxceotion is good but there should be exceptions for rape and incest but 8 weeks might be enough time to deal with that.
    Traditionally, the so-called "hard cases" that make for exceptions are rape, incest, and the life of the mother.

    The last one is an easy call, I think. But the other two...well, not so much.

    It is quite difficult for me to say that a victim of either of these--especially rape--should be forced to carry the baby for nine months, against her will.

    On the other hand, the unborn child certainly did nothing wrong. To declare, therefore, that he (or she) may be killed, seems like an enormous leap of logic.

    I guess the fancy term for this is cognitive dissonance...

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    Quote Originally Posted by pjohns View Post
    Traditionally, the so-called "hard cases" that make for exceptions are rape, incest, and the life of the mother.

    The last one is an easy call, I think. But the other two...well, not so much.

    It is quite difficult for me to say that a victim of either of these--especially rape--should be forced to carry the baby for nine months, against her will.

    On the other hand, the unborn child certainly did nothing wrong. To declare, therefore, that he (or she) may be killed, seems like an enormous leap of logic.

    I guess the fancy term for this is cognitive dissonance...

    That is very true, none of it is an easy decision to make except in abstraction for social context. And why I think abortion should actually be removed from the government altogether and left to society to figure out what is justifies and what it condemns, and that may be different across the country. Once society has made a determination, the states can represent society in legislation. Ditto other social issues. The government shouldn't push any agendas here.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pjohns View Post
    Traditionally, the so-called "hard cases" that make for exceptions are rape, incest, and the life of the mother.

    The last one is an easy call, I think. But the other two...well, not so much.

    It is quite difficult for me to say that a victim of either of these--especially rape--should be forced to carry the baby for nine months, against her will.

    On the other hand, the unborn child certainly did nothing wrong. To declare, therefore, that he (or she) may be killed, seems like an enormous leap of logic.

    I guess the fancy term for this is cognitive dissonance...



    WALSH: Three Reasons Why The ‘Rape And Incest’ Argument For Abortion Is Misleading, Disingenuous, And Wrong.....


    Here are some things to keep in mind as the Left panics and the media fear-monger:


    (1) Abortions due to rape are very rare. The vast majority of abortions have nothing at all to do with rape. The pro-abortion Guttmacher Institute surveyed post-abortion women and found that the top six reasons for getting an abortion, accounting for over 85% of all cases, were: "Not ready for a child," "can't afford a baby," "have completed my childbearing," "don't want to be a single mother," "don't feel mature enough," and "would interfere with education or career plans." In other words, most women get abortions for lifestyle reasons. They are getting rid of the baby because the baby would interfere with the kind of lives they want to live. Less than one percent of respondents said they were rape victims.


    https://www.dailywire.com/news/47227...ent-matt-walsh
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    That is very true, none of it is an easy decision to make except in abstraction for social context. And why I think abortion should actually be removed from the government altogether and left to society to figure out what is justifies and what it condemns, and that may be different across the country. Once society has made a determination, the states can represent society in legislation. Ditto other social issues. The government shouldn't push any agendas here.
    What's hard about it?

    The baby is not guilty of a crime, why should he be murdered?

    Rape is a $#@!. So she has to live with HER CHILD for nine months.

    Good thing the rapist didn't cut her right arm off at the shoulder. She'd have to live with that forever.

    The fact that the rape victim has to live with a child inside her for nine months makes the crime of rape thst much more painful. But does not make the baby less innocent.

    Here's a plan...if the child really is the product of rape...something fairly rare...if the mother let's the child to live, the Rapist gets an extra 18 years in prison. DNA testing would be required.

    Oh, and the way modern societies work things out, when crimes of violence are concerned, is by law.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergeant Gleed View Post
    What's hard about it?

    The baby is not guilty of a crime, why should he be murdered?

    Rape is a $#@!. So she has to live with HER CHILD for nine months.

    Good thing the rapist didn't cut her right arm off at the shoulder. She'd have to live with that forever.

    The fact that the rape victim has to live with a child inside her for nine months makes the crime of rape thst much more painful. But does not make the baby less innocent.

    Here's a plan...if the child really is the product of rape...something fairly rare...if the mother let's the child to live, the Rapist gets an extra 18 years in prison. DNA testing would be required.

    Oh, and the way modern societies work things out, when crimes of violence are concerned, is by law.

    Like I said, it's easy abstracted out of context, context that is social and personal. You're just a liberal dealing with abstractions and looking to government law and jumping to conclusions for other you have no business deciding for them. Let society decide. You can be a part of that, just not the decider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sergeant Gleed View Post
    What's hard about it?

    The baby is not guilty of a crime, why should he be murdered?

    Rape is a $#@!. So she has to live with HER CHILD for nine months.

    Good thing the rapist didn't cut her right arm off at the shoulder. She'd have to live with that forever.

    The fact that the rape victim has to live with a child inside her for nine months makes the crime of rape thst much more painful. But does not make the baby less innocent.

    Here's a plan...if the child really is the product of rape...something fairly rare...if the mother let's the child to live, the Rapist gets an extra 18 years in prison. DNA testing would be required.

    Oh, and the way modern societies work things out, when crimes of violence are concerned, is by law.
    So let's say you have a daughter, Let's say she gets raped by an illegal alien. Would you force her to go to term with a pregnancy? Would you be against here taking a morning after pill?

    How can you be protective of unborn children's rights but care nothing about the rights of children who are already born, if they are a Muslim, or an Arab, or a Mexican? Or a baby in the middle east dying from the bombs you promote?

    This is not a pro-abortion argument I am making, but one of sheer hypocrisy!
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    I can't argue with putting a time limit on abortion. I feel strongly that it is a crime for abortion clinics to make a person wait until they can have an abortion just so the baby will be more developed. They get more money for this. This is a great crime that is being committed by abortion practitioners. I think people who have sex should take caution as to not get pregnant. If they do, and they want an abortion there is no reason they cannot do it at a few weeks of pregnancy. Waiting is a crime. It is tough though because we don't know peoples personal circumstances. There are lots of people who if they had children would abuse those children in awful ways. A life lived in abuse would be far worse than the abortion. These issues are sad and they are hard to discuss.

    There should be exceptions for medical emergencies, the health of the mother, and rape or incest. But even 8 weeks in my opinion is too long to wait. But there are certain circumstances, as in a young child being raped and not knowing that they were pregnant, because they are not old enough to understand.

    This topic is complicated and very tough to discuss. But since this thread is on abortion, I will state my views. I am accused every day of being pro-abortion every day and I don't even talk about abortion. People are just making things up.

    I am not pro-abortion. I just understand that we cant always know what circumstances that some people are in and in many cases it is really tough. You will not have to endure a child's lifetime of abuse and suffering if a negligent parent is forced to have a child that they didn't want and will hate and abuse for life. Abortion is not a cut and dry subject.

    I do think it is a crime if a person has repeat abortions. I think it is awful. If it happens to you once, it should be something that you never do again. I do not condone it as a form of birth control.

    I will not argue about it, there will be no winning, but I am putting my thoughts down. They are just my personal opinions. You will not force me to see it your way.

    I am not Pro-abortion, for me personally I would never ever do that. I think it is a terrible sad thing. But we cant know other peoples situations, and we will not be the ones to take care of those kids. We will not suffer for them. This subject is tough.

    I used to live near a catholic church who put hundreds of crosses on the lawn. They had a big sign about abortion and how each cross represented so many children. I used to think, those crosses could also represent children who were raped by catholic priests, and their lives destroyed forever having to live as though dead, and wishing they could die every day. The priests are not going to take care of those kids. But they would force a parent to have a child. But there is a ton of hypocrisy in this world. Things are not cut and dry.
    We are all brothers and sisters in humanity. We are all made from the same dust of stars. We cannot be separated because all life is interconnected.

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