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Thread: Nathan Bedford Forrest's bust

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    Nathan Bedford Forrest's bust

    In Nashville (near where I reside), there is now a debate about what to do--if anything--with a bust of Nathan Bedford Forrest, that is currently in the state capitol building.

    Some want it removed entirely--and, at best, given a new home (perhaps in a museum).

    Others want it to remain exactly where it now is.

    And I can see both sides of this debate.

    On the plus side, he was an absolutely brilliant military tactician--more so than even Robert E. Lee, in my opinion.

    On the minus side, the man was a slave trader (prior to the Civil War) and the first Grand Wizard of the KKK (following the Civil War). And he even presided over (and encouraged) the massacre of black soldiers at Fort Pillow in 1864, after they had already surrendered. (Note: In all fairness, the man subsequently denounced the KKK, when it became especially violent. Even so, he was certainly a virulent racist--even by the standards of that time.)

    So this is really not an easy call, in my opinion.

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    Two things...

    1. A man should be judged according to the mores of his time, not the societal standards of today.

    2. A man should be judged based on his totality, not just some single incident or short period of his life. Shakespeare wrote "The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones". That is way too often true.

    Leave the bust. When teaching someone about General Forrest, teach them about the total man, not just the negatives.
    “Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice. Moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue.” - Barry Goldwater

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cletus View Post
    Two things...

    1. A man should be judged according to the mores of his time, not the societal standards of today.

    2. A man should be judged based on his totality, not just some single incident or short period of his life. Shakespeare wrote "The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones". That is way too often true.

    Leave the bust. When teaching someone about General Forrest, teach them about the total man, not just the negatives.
    The total man was all negative. I don't care about the statue or bust or what happens to it. You can't make him out to be anything but a terrible excuse for a human being. The only good thing he ever did was die.
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    I once lived in Richmond, VA and I wonder what they are going to do about Monument Avenue that has a major confederate officer's statue at every major intersection.

    Being originally from the north I called them second place trophies but that is beside the point.

    It is the core of the city because it was the capital of the South. I am a history buff so I hate to see the snowflakes destroy it in their intolerance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Captdon View Post
    The total man was all negative. I don't care about the statue or bust or what happens to it. You can't make him out to be anything but a terrible excuse for a human being. The only good thing he ever did was die.
    There are those who would say that about Lee or Longstreet and Rommel and Rundstedt. The fact that someone was in an opposing army doesn't make him evil or a terrible excuse for a human being.
    “Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice. Moderation in pursuit of justice is no virtue.” - Barry Goldwater

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    The Nashville Building Commission has just now voted, 5-2, to remove the bust of Nathan Bedford Forrest from the state Capitol Building, and relocate it to a museum.

    If this is turns out to be end the story, I will be entirely indifferent to the matter.

    What disturbs me, however, is the possibility that it will not stop here.

    Within recent months, statues of Thomas Jefferson, George Washington, Francis Scott Key--even Ulysses S. Grant--have been vandalized or torn down.

    And, of course, other statues have suffered the same fate.

    It is certainly true that only a diehard Confederate loyalist could detest the removal of the bust of Nathan Bedford Forrest from its previous place of honor, at the state Capitol Building.

    And I am not such a person.

    I just hope that other erasures of our history will not follow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cletus View Post
    There are those who would say that about Lee or Longstreet and Rommel and Rundstedt. The fact that someone was in an opposing army doesn't make him evil or a terrible excuse for a human being.
    I don't care about them. Forrest allowed Black soldiers to be massacred. Lee allowed nothing close to that nor did Longstreet. I didn't say a word about him being in an opposing army. Forrest allowing a massacre makes him evil.
    Last edited by Captdon; 07-22-2021 at 08:05 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pjohns View Post
    The Nashville Building Commission has just now voted, 5-2, to remove the bust of Nathan Bedford Forrest from the state Capitol Building, and relocate it to a museum.

    If this is turns out to be end the story, I will be entirely indifferent to the matter.

    What disturbs me, however, is the possibility that it will not stop here.

    Within recent months, statues of Thomas Jefferson, George Washington, Francis Scott Key--even Ulysses S. Grant--have been vandalized or torn down.

    And, of course, other statues have suffered the same fate.

    It is certainly true that only a diehard Confederate loyalist could detest the removal of the bust of Nathan Bedford Forrest from its previous place of honor, at the state Capitol Building.

    And I am not such a person.

    I just hope that other erasures of our history will not follow.
    It won’t stop there.
    Any time you give a man something he doesn't earn, you cheapen him. Our kids earn what they get, and that includes respect. -- Woody Hayes​

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    Quote Originally Posted by Captdon View Post
    I don't care about them. Forrest allowed Black soldiers to be massacred. Lee allowed nothing close to that nor did Longstreet. I didn't say a word about him being in an opposing army. Forrest allowing a massacre makes him evil.
    Like Joachim Peiper.
    Any time you give a man something he doesn't earn, you cheapen him. Our kids earn what they get, and that includes respect. -- Woody Hayes​

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    Quote Originally Posted by DGUtley View Post
    Like Joachim Peiper.
    There were a lot of problems with the Malmedy story. Exposing the forced confessions and other shenanigans is how Joseph McCarthy first made a name for himself.
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