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Thread: Is rationality overrated?

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    Is rationality overrated?

    Reasonableness includes socially conscious choices, rationality discounts that.


    Is rationality overrated?

    ...New research says there’s another way to look at it. What if people often choose to be irrational in cases where doing the rational thing would violate something they value more — like socially conscious behavior? And if that’s the case, should we actually embrace some instances of irrationality rather than discounting it as an embarrassing nuisance?

    ...That’s one of the possibilities raised in an interesting psychology study published last week in Science Advances. Researchers based at the University of Waterloo in Canada wanted to understand what prompts people to use rationality — or deviate from it — in their decision-making. To get at this, they first analyzed reams of text to see what people generally take rationality to mean. Then they conducted 12 experiments, recruiting people from Amazon Mechanical Turk to play classic economic games like the Dictator Game online and answer questions about their behavior.

    The study starts by distinguishing between two terms: there’s rationality, where you focus on maximizing the chance of getting what you want, and there’s reasonableness, where you strike a balance between what you want and social norms.

    Although we might sometimes use rational and reasonable interchangeably, the study shows that people generally associate the former with the cold hard logic of self-interest and the latter with socially conscious traits like kindness or cooperativeness....

    ...But is it better to act rationally or reasonably? The researchers conducted some experiments to understand people’s perceptions, expectations, and behaviors. Here are five key findings:
    • Participants perceived reasonable people as less selfish than rational people.
    • Participants expected that reasonable people would share more than rational people.
    • Their expectation turned out to be correct: People who viewed themselves as reasonable shared significantly more than those who viewed themselves as rational.
    • In a Dictator Game, an experiment where you’re given money and have to decide whether to give some of it away, participants donated 5 percent more money if they were aiming to be reasonable than if they were aiming to be rational.
    • When participants were asked to recall either reasonable or rational actions from their lives, and then to take part in a Dictator Game, it turned out that recalling a reasonable action led to offers that were slightly higher than did recalling a rational action. Plus, whereas 14 percent of participants in the rational condition wanted to donate nothing, only 9.5 percent of those in the reasonable condition said the same (in fact, 71 percent of them donated at least half the money).

    Together, these findings offer us insights that cut against our inherited ways of thinking about what constitutes sound decision-making. Ditching rationality in favor of reasonableness might actually make sense in some contexts, they suggest — especially because we’ve lately defined rationality in such a narrow way that it’s just not always the most useful standard of judgment....
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    waltky's Avatar Senior Member
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    It is if yer a Trump fan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by waltky View Post
    It is if yer a Trump fan.
    Be reasonable.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    Idiots aside, when reason and emotion conflict, emotion almost always wins. It's not a matter of which is better or worse, it's simply a fact. Reason, rational behavior, is superior but will take second place if a strong emotion conflicts with the reason. Reason often takes second place when the is virtually no conflict but the emotion has an appeal.

    A friend of mine was getting married and asked me what I thought. I said, reasonably, "You'll be her third husband, she has three young kids, she's never worked a day in her life and doesn't intend to, she's a religious fanatic, and I think you're making a big mistake."

    He married her and was happy for about a year. Then, emotion cooled and reason came into play. "Pat, why is it when we argue she prays and got not only talks to her but always agrees with her?" Gee, I don't know. My friend adopted her kids to "prove" he loved her.

    When emotion and reason conflict, most people don't have a choice of choosing. They go with emotion until disaster strikes.

    As for the snide remarks about President Trump, you make the case for irrational emotions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by patrickt View Post
    Idiots aside, when reason and emotion conflict, emotion almost always wins. It's not a matter of which is better or worse, it's simply a fact. Reason, rational behavior, is superior but will take second place if a strong emotion conflicts with the reason. Reason often takes second place when the is virtually no conflict but the emotion has an appeal.

    A friend of mine was getting married and asked me what I thought. I said, reasonably, "You'll be her third husband, she has three young kids, she's never worked a day in her life and doesn't intend to, she's a religious fanatic, and I think you're making a big mistake."

    He married her and was happy for about a year. Then, emotion cooled and reason came into play. "Pat, why is it when we argue she prays and got not only talks to her but always agrees with her?" Gee, I don't know. My friend adopted her kids to "prove" he loved her.

    When emotion and reason conflict, most people don't have a choice of choosing. They go with emotion until disaster strikes.

    As for the snide remarks about President Trump, you make the case for irrational emotions.

    I think you're correct. The best you can do is try to be reasonable but emotions rule.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    I think you're correct. The best you can do is try to be reasonable but emotions rule.
    Emotions may rule in the immediate sense, but if a person normally handles things rationally, the emotions only come into play for a very short period of time before being over-ridden.

    Applying logic and rationality will normally come quickly for those who are used to applying it. For those who function on emotions, logic and rationality aren't on their radar....
    "I believe there are more instances of the abridgement of freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments by those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." -- James Madison

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    Being rational can be overrated depending on the circumstance

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    Quote Originally Posted by Collateral Damage View Post
    Emotions may rule in the immediate sense, but if a person normally handles things rationally, the emotions only come into play for a very short period of time before being over-ridden.

    Applying logic and rationality will normally come quickly for those who are used to applying it. For those who function on emotions, logic and rationality aren't on their radar....

    Granted, there are those who just cannot be rational, who go so far as to defend their irrational nonsense. Still, even the most rational person at times lets his guard down and biases and emotions come into play.
    Tradition is not the worship of ashes, but the preservation of fire. ― Gustav Mahler

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    waltky's Avatar Senior Member
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    It is if you're Donald Trump!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    Granted, there are those who just cannot be rational, who go so far as to defend their irrational nonsense. Still, even the most rational person at times lets his guard down and biases and emotions come into play.
    It does seem to have a political divide, as a majority.

    For me, personally, emotion rules when it comes to certain members of my family, others it's logic and rationale. For anyone but, rationale.
    "I believe there are more instances of the abridgement of freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments by those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations." -- James Madison

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