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Thread: Is Russia preparing to invade the Ukraine?

  1. #51
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    pragmatic's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alyosha View Post
    It would appear Russia, would it not? In the early 2000's there was a huge tide of Ukrainians and individuals from the FSRs who ran to Moscow and St. Petersburg for work when western nations saw them as VISA flight risks and refused to let them escape the poverty of their state.
    Not seeing a situation resulting in a major flight if refugees from Ukraine...


    //

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    Beevee's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Max Rockatansky View Post
    A huge distortion. Amusing in a twisted way, but still wrong.

    What is sad is how few of those on the Left are willing to go to those wars compared to how many of them are willing to send our soldiers to war. Let's not forget that Bush couldn't have invaded Iraq without the significant support of the Democrats.

    I don't doubt your figures.

    Anyone would think I am a supporter or the Democrats as much as I am an opponent of the GOP. Not strictly true.

    I'm a supporter of 'leave everyone to do their own thing within the law' but that has taken a backseat in practically every country in the world.

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    Alyosha's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by pragmatic View Post
    Not seeing a situation resulting in a major flight if refugees from Ukraine...


    //

    I'm sure that you don't since you don't or have never lived there. Think of it like Mexico and the US. Years ago Mexicans wanted to come here, now many are voluntarily going home. They may return if things get stupid in Mexico.

    People migrate for economic reasons.
    And if we should die tonight
    Then we should all die together
    Raise a glass of wine for the last time
    Calling out father, prepare as we will
    Watch the flames burn auburn on the mountain side
    Desolation comes upon the sky..

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    pragmatic (02-26-2014)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beevee View Post
    I don't doubt your figures.

    Anyone would think I am a supporter or the Democrats as much as I am an opponent of the GOP. Not strictly true.

    I'm a supporter of 'leave everyone to do their own thing within the law' but that has taken a backseat in practically every country in the world.
    I, too, favor a "live and let live" philosophy but the history of the world is that not every one agrees. Until they do, it's on our own best interests to be proactive rather than reactive.

    The good news is that the world is a lot more peaceful these days than it was in past years and has been going that way for several decades.


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    Ransom's Avatar Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Max Rockatansky View Post
    I, too, favor a "live and let live" philosophy but the history of the world is that not every one agrees. Until they do, it's on our own best interests to be proactive rather than reactive.

    The good news is that the world is a lot more peaceful these days than it was in past years and has been going that way for several decades.
    Calm before the storm?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alyosha View Post
    Russia will not invade the Ukraine without an invite, which I am sure they are getting behind the scenes. I am doubtful this will happen based only on what is written in the Russian papers and the Russian people's less than enthusiastic desire to have Ukrainians pour back in.
    Putin put some troops on alert but he does not claim he will try to get into that mess.

    The Ukraine cops or troops as the case may be were able to kill people who resisted them.

    In reading up on the Ukraine which was part of the Soviet Union for many years, the Crimea, now part of Ukraine was the most recent addition to Ukraine. So, there is not that super bond between those in the Crimea who are mostly Russians vs the part of the Ukraine where Kiev is located. Those in that area wish to join the EU. Those in the Crimea do not want to join. Makes it hard to have peace when one group persists on being with Russia and the other part wants to be part of Europe. The booted out president wanted to be part of Europe. As to the EU rather than part of any other country, is what I mean.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Max Rockatansky View Post
    I, too, favor a "live and let live" philosophy but the history of the world is that not every one agrees. Until they do, it's on our own best interests to be proactive rather than reactive.

    The good news is that the world is a lot more peaceful these days than it was in past years and has been going that way for several decades.
    Probably more to the fact that the USSR no longer exists as an entity and genocide is by far reduced.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ransom View Post
    Calm before the storm?
    No. The trend. Of course a storm can come in the form of something like an impact event or super volcano. A nuke hidden in a box of hammers shipped to LA or NY? Not a storm. Just a little rainshower. Most of us will live.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Beevee View Post
    Probably more to the fact that the USSR no longer exists as an entity and genocide is by far reduced.
    China has changed too. It's a lot different today than in Mao's "Cultural Revolution" days. We don't have the fascism aspect as happened in Germany, Japan and Italy in the earlier half of the 20th Century.


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    Fyodor Lukyanov, the editor of Russia in Global Affairs magazine and head of the Council for Foreign and Defence Policies, said that for the Kremlin the key indicators would be the action by the new government regarding the Black Sea Fleet's presence in Ukraine and authorities' pledges to stay away from military blocs.
    He said that if Moscow sees Kyiv reneging on these issues, it would set off alarms in the Kremlin as a possible signal of Ukraine joining NATO."Ukraine in NATO has been a red line," Lukyanov said. "If that happens, various options will come under consideration, including appeal to certain parts of Ukraine, including the Crimea."
    He warned that a violent confrontation between pro-Moscow protesters and demonstrators supporting the new Ukrainian authorities could force Russia to act."If clashes occur in the Crimea, Russia will start by issuing harsh statements and put the Black Sea Fleet on high alert," Lukyanov said. "Russia couldn't ignore it. There are all kinds of risks."

    Read more: http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/putin-s-...#ixzz2uTplwaZP
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