History WILL repeat itself if you let it

[Chris]

Quite honestly, this naive faith in progress seems more absurd to me than young Earth Creationism. That said, it seems like he is just using progress as a synonym for change. That is, his contribution here consisted in telling us that the world is not the same as it was in 1950?

His message could have been that simplistic. But I think his progress is Progressive.

[Mister D]

His message could have been that simplistic. But I think his progress is Progressive.

I would think so. The wording was made his point seem simplistic though.

[Refugee]

There’s always been progress, things move on, times change . . . but what is happening now is a complete destruction of previous values and morality to be replaced by a ‘do your own thing’ society. You vote in a Marxist and complain you get socialised medical health. You complain about the mass welfare queues and vote in Pelosi who says it’s good for the economy. You demand McJunk food and then wonder why one third of your population is so obese they have to be moved around in electric wheel chairs . . . Methinks this new found freedom isn’t as good as it was supposed to be?

[Chris]

To me progress implies deliberate reasoned design to move society in a given direction, or, in the case of, say, Marxists, prediction what they reason from history is inevitable as progress.

One problem with that, as I pointed out earlier, is that things change and are unpredictable, the future is unknown.

Refugee, I agree with your point as well, if I understand it correctly, that because the architects of progress ignore if not discard the part, it's traditions and institutions, progress is doomed because for them also the past is unknown.

[Refugee]

To me progress implies deliberate reasoned design to move society in a given direction, or, in the case of, say, Marxists, prediction what they reason from history is inevitable as progress.

One problem with that, as I pointed out earlier, is that things change and are unpredictable, the future is unknown.

Refugee, I agree with your point as well, if I understand it correctly, that because the architects of progress ignore if not discard the part, it's traditions and institutions, progress is doomed because for them also the past is unknown.

I’d say that ‘progress’ means an improvement on what it replaces and not just simply a change of direction. Every political party that takes office changes direction, but sometimes not for the best. Ideologies don’t dissapear, they simply adapt themselves to specific periods and emerge again with added bells and whistles which appeal to a specific generation. A landowner will never again throw you and your family out into the street, but a banker will. America will never vote in communism, but they’ll vote in a communist presented to them as a Democrat . . .

In that respect the future is entirely predictable; I think that Americans haven’t quite learned to strip away the razamatazz and separate fact from fiction. Europeans were warning you about Obama before he was elected, but he sounded so cool and hip and radical . . . Everything that is happening now was predictable.