Magic as hard science.

[Peter1469]

Define magic.

What type? Aly knows about a lot of it. You can ask her.

[Alyosha]

Manipulation of someone's mind and body through suggestion and the like is not magic, it's the placebo effect and is easily explained by science. No need to conjure up supernatural or paranormal entities when biochemistry already has the answers.

Why don't you explain the placebo effect insofar as it is able to cure leprosy, cancer, and other life-threatening diseases spontaneously? If this is such a scientific explanation why don't we understand it to a repeatable effect so that we can live drug free?

[Cthulhu]

You are my favorite stick in the mud. I don't comprehend how she tolerates it.

We will find something to convince you of the paranormal.

Showing someone the devil's existence can usually convince them there is a God.

Sent from my evil cell phone.

[Ethereal]

Thank you for correcting my typo. So you believe that Jesus was a fraud then?

It's possible that he was, though I don't think so. It's more likely that his followers were the frauds.

[Ethereal]

What type? Aly knows about a lot of it. You can ask her.

The general definition of magic. If you want to define subtypes of magic, then go ahead, but you have to define magic generally beforehand.

[Alyosha]

Define love, define God, define any number of terms that are perception oriented and you'll have as many answers as people.

[Brett Nortje]

I do believe in the placebo effect, but, who was Jesus's first patient? why did they believe him?

Do you know what sonar is? this 'effect' is electromagnetic, and, bats and dolphins have it, so it works above and below water.

Echolocation, also called bio sonar, is the biological sonar used by several kinds of animals. Echolocating animals emit calls out to the environment and listen to the echoes of those calls that return from various objects near them. They use these echoes to locate and identify the objects. Echolocation is used for navigation and for foraging (or hunting) in various environments. Some blind humans have learned to find their way using clicks produced by a device or by mouth.
Echolocating animals include some mammals and a few birds; most notably microchiropteranbats and odontocetes (toothed whales and dolphins), but also in simpler form in other groups such as shrews, one genus of megachiropteran bats (Rousettus) and two cave dwelling bird groups, the so-called cave swiftlets in the genus Aerodramus (formerly Collocalia) and the unrelatedOilbirdSteatornis caripensis.^[1]

Which is why the 'witching hour' is after dark. now, people light candles to help them see, yes? if you light a candle in the daylight, you will be creating a little 'star,' okay? this flame has no mass, but it does emit photons. the actual flame is the focal point of the spells, as it emits energy, the same way a bat does, the same way a blind human does, okay?

Now, if we emit these 'waves,' then they can carry a charge, like a lightning bolt. would you like to see a lightning bolt come out of my hands? how do you think stories of Jesus healing people began? how do you think stories of fireballs began?

[Ethereal]

Why don't you explain the placebo effect insofar as it is able to cure leprosy, cancer, and other life-threatening diseases spontaneously?

Nice loaded question. Why do I have to accept your premise that the placebo effect (or "magic" as some like to call it) has cured anything "spontaneously"? Because you say so? But let's assume for one second that there have been so-called "spontaneous" cures of these diseases, they are explained by the psychosomatic relation between body and mind. In other words, by manipulating someone's psyche, you can induce biochemical responses in their body, which may manifest themselves as a seemingly "spontaneous" cure.

If this is such a scientific explanation why don't we understand it to a repeatable effect so that we can live drug free?

Because there isn't much money in using the placebo effect, coupled with exercise, good diet, and sunshine, to cure diseases.

[Ethereal]

Showing someone the devil's existence can usually convince them there is a God.

I would love for someone to show me that. I welcome the opportunity to observe evidence for the existence of any supernatural entity, be it God or the Devil, so-called. Let me know when you want to set up a controlled experiment whereby we are able to ascertain such evidence.

[Ethereal]

Define love, define God, define any number of terms that are perception oriented and you'll have as many answers as people.

In other words, none of you can provide an operational definition for "magic". It's just an ad hoc term you apply to phenomena you cannot explain using science.